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Rordan D'Kherr
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
462
|
Posted - 2013.07.01 12:38:00 -
[121] - Quote
DreznicK wrote: Well it sounds like you are getting a reality check, not happy about it are you ? There are rules for living in a society, I am sorry if your parents failed to pass that information on to you.
And yes at times they completely suck, sad part of growing up I guess is you find out things are not what you expected them to be. Probably why teenagers are always mad.
Boy, let me tell you: I live in a free country, I grew up in a dictatorship. I know something about that kind of stuff.
If the case in the topic would be correct law enforcement, the US jails must be filled with comedians etc. Think about it. No more Bill Maher, no more Larry King.
Take a step back and look at the big picture. Reality check etc. _______________________________________ Don't be scared, because being afk is not a crime. |

Bischopt
Arbitrary Repossession
121
|
Posted - 2013.07.01 12:39:00 -
[122] - Quote
Simetraz wrote:Bischopt wrote:Tobias Hareka wrote:Norian Lonark wrote:Seems it was obviously intended as a joke, it may cause offence but lots of people make jokes about things that people would find offensive and do not get put in jail. When was the last time you read newspaper or watched news from TV? This should always be taken seriously. Joke or not. You just can't go to airport, shout you have bomb in your backpack -> "Dude! It was a joke!". That's a pretty extreme example. Airports may actually be a special thing, especially in the states. But I sure as hell can say to someone in real life that I'm gonna shoot up a school, laugh about it and say "just kidding" without the cops coming and locking me up. Freedom of speech. Afraid not you need to look up freedom. Freedom to do something means there will be no repercussions from the government for your actions. If there are repercussions like going to jail or receiving a fine your actions are not free. Example - you can talk about hating your government all you want. (Freedom of speech) Now if you start talking about killing your leader you are no longer talking but now implying a possible action and that can have repercussions. Too many people/companies (especially news agencies) believe freedom gives them the right to be irresponsible it doesn't. Your are responsible for your actions, and can be punished if you cross the line.
Prison.
For words. We just went back in time.
|

Norian Lonark
Black Thorne Corporation The Cursed Few
80
|
Posted - 2013.07.01 12:39:00 -
[123] - Quote
Tobias Hareka wrote:Norian Lonark wrote:Seems it was obviously intended as a joke, it may cause offence but lots of people make jokes about things that people would find offensive and do not get put in jail. When was the last time you read newspaper or watched news from TV? This should always be taken seriously. Joke or not. You just can't go to airport, shout you have bomb in your backpack -> "Dude! It was a joke!".
Whatever happened to common sense. 
|

Gallowmere Rorschach
Quantum Cats Syndicate Samurai Pizza Cats
286
|
Posted - 2013.07.01 12:41:00 -
[124] - Quote
Norian Lonark wrote:Tobias Hareka wrote:Norian Lonark wrote:Seems it was obviously intended as a joke, it may cause offence but lots of people make jokes about things that people would find offensive and do not get put in jail. When was the last time you read newspaper or watched news from TV? This should always be taken seriously. Joke or not. You just can't go to airport, shout you have bomb in your backpack -> "Dude! It was a joke!". Whatever happened to common sense.  The Patriot Act did all kinds of bad things to it, apparently. |

Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
18494
|
Posted - 2013.07.01 12:41:00 -
[125] - Quote
Norian Lonark wrote:Tobias Hareka wrote:Norian Lonark wrote:Seems it was obviously intended as a joke, it may cause offence but lots of people make jokes about things that people would find offensive and do not get put in jail. When was the last time you read newspaper or watched news from TV? This should always be taken seriously. Joke or not. You just can't go to airport, shout you have bomb in your backpack -> "Dude! It was a joke!". Whatever happened to common sense. 
I'll vouch that it died the day OJ Simpson was set free....................... |

Ace Uoweme
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
336
|
Posted - 2013.07.01 12:42:00 -
[126] - Quote
RAW23 wrote:And this isn't really true either. Nobody gets in trouble if their research stacks up. The problem with holocaust denial is that the research never does. That's not to say I agree with these laws but they are far less extreme than you make them sound.
Yes it is.
I couldn't even send my brother (who was an US Army calvary scout) WWII books from the US to Germany in the fear that he'll be fined for receiving them. In the US a book with a swastika on it won't have cops at your door. Germany it can.
They're so one sided on WWII that they'll censor any image of Nazism, despite it's even mainstream views on the subject.
That's going a tad overboard in trying to be PC.
Self-policing sure. But not at the expense of reading history and all aspects of it. Even if you disagree with the *** or the Black Panthers, you should be able to read ALL the content about them -- pro or con -- uncensored. Not having the government ban or burn content...as that is what the ***** in fact did themselves. "In a world of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act." ~George Orwell
|

Evangelina Nolen
Sama Guild
18
|
Posted - 2013.07.01 12:43:00 -
[127] - Quote
Funny thing, if he's a first time offender; he could have gotten less time for (1) **** (2) manslaughter (3) 2nd degree murder (4) armed robbery or (5) drug dealing etc etc all in the state of texas. |

Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
18494
|
Posted - 2013.07.01 12:43:00 -
[128] - Quote
Gallowmere Rorschach wrote:Norian Lonark wrote:Tobias Hareka wrote:Norian Lonark wrote:Seems it was obviously intended as a joke, it may cause offence but lots of people make jokes about things that people would find offensive and do not get put in jail. When was the last time you read newspaper or watched news from TV? This should always be taken seriously. Joke or not. You just can't go to airport, shout you have bomb in your backpack -> "Dude! It was a joke!". Whatever happened to common sense.  The Patriot Act did all kinds of bad things to it, apparently.
A near personal violent attack and verbal threat are not covered under The Patriot Act. Get real with the arguments please. This is the same as the dude who likened it to a George Carlin performance. Sheesh.
|

Anna Karhunen
Inoue INEXP
74
|
Posted - 2013.07.01 12:43:00 -
[129] - Quote
RAW23 wrote:Ace Uoweme wrote:
A German doesn't even see a quarter of the internet as their country will censor even on copyright issues. It's draconian there on copyright and ideas about hate crimes
This is simply not true. Quote:In Germany mention things about ******, or even be a Holocaust denier, and you will face jail time (researchers there are jailed if they don't follow the political line about WWII). And this isn't really true either. Nobody gets in trouble if their research stacks up. The problem with holocaust denial is that the research never does. That's not to say I agree with these laws but they are far less extreme than you make them sound. Fake research does lead to trouble with authorities in other fields as well, not just history. Latest news relating to that can be read in Retraction Watch. Most cases don't get in news. |

Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
18494
|
Posted - 2013.07.01 12:44:00 -
[130] - Quote
Ace Uoweme wrote:
Yes it is.
I couldn't even send my brother (who was an US Army calvary scout) WWII books from the US to Germany in the fear that he'll be fined for receiving them. In the US a book with a swastika on it won't have cops at your door. Germany it can. .
That I absolutely do not believe. The military's APO service would handle his mail, and nothing to do with German censorship would have been involved.
Get real. |
|

Ziphis
Garoun Investment Bank Gallente Federation
25
|
Posted - 2013.07.01 12:45:00 -
[131] - Quote
Anyone else got the feeling now we've expressed our view on it we've all become targets in our own governments eyes?
|

Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
18498
|
Posted - 2013.07.01 12:46:00 -
[132] - Quote
Evangelina Nolen wrote:Funny thing, if he's a first time offender; he could have gotten less time for (1) **** (2) manslaughter (3) 2nd degree murder (4) armed robbery or (5) drug dealing etc etc all in the state of texas.
Well, they are not taking any chances in Texas.
They still do not know why that fertilizer plant blew up........ |

Ace Uoweme
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
336
|
Posted - 2013.07.01 12:47:00 -
[133] - Quote
Anna Karhunen wrote:Fake research does lead to trouble with authorities in other fields as well, not just history. Latest news relating to that can be read in Retraction Watch. Most cases don't get in news.
Yet that's some the public can correct via education.
When you get governments censoring content, it's a slippery slope.
This is why research needs to always be uncensored, even if it's disagreeable to you. "In a world of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act." ~George Orwell
|

Tobias Hareka
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
3
|
Posted - 2013.07.01 12:48:00 -
[134] - Quote
Diesel47 wrote:People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve neither and will lose both.
Also I'm taking notes on the cowards in this thread, I have a feeling you emulate your RL attitudes ingame and would make for some juicy war decs.
Do you like hunting for cloaked covert ops frigates in deep safespots? Well, it's your money... |

Gallowmere Rorschach
Quantum Cats Syndicate Samurai Pizza Cats
287
|
Posted - 2013.07.01 12:48:00 -
[135] - Quote
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:Gallowmere Rorschach wrote:Norian Lonark wrote:Tobias Hareka wrote:Norian Lonark wrote:Seems it was obviously intended as a joke, it may cause offence but lots of people make jokes about things that people would find offensive and do not get put in jail. When was the last time you read newspaper or watched news from TV? This should always be taken seriously. Joke or not. You just can't go to airport, shout you have bomb in your backpack -> "Dude! It was a joke!". Whatever happened to common sense.  The Patriot Act did all kinds of bad things to it, apparently. A near personal violent attack and verbal threat are not covered under The Patriot Act. Get real with the arguments please. This is the same as the dude who likened it to a George Carlin performance. Sheesh. I was more talking about the fact that Americans in general have been skittish tards since 2001. I would know, I am one, and live here.
As for the Carlin comment, that was me as well. Where exactly do you draw the line? Is it because Carlin is getting paid that he's allowed to say whatever he may want? Being a professional comedian grants some extra rights that the rest of us do not have? "Look at the news lately" is a **** poor excuse, and one often used by statist morons when they are looking for an excuse to shut people up. It smacks of "look at us guys, look at what we are doing to keep you safe!" The part they leave off is "from a teenager who actually showed no real evidence of committing violence against anyone." Was he stockpiling weapons and ammunition? I don't know, but something tells me that if he was, it would be known already. It would fit better with the "look at what we are doing to keep you safe" montage. |

War Kitten
Panda McLegion
2246
|
Posted - 2013.07.01 12:50:00 -
[136] - Quote
Gallowmere Rorschach wrote:War Kitten wrote:Confirming that "lol, j/k" is a get out of jail free-card.
If the una-bomber had put it at the end of his manifesto, everyone would've known it was just a big joke.
Freedom of speech is not freedom to be an idiot and make threats in a public forum. Let the system work it out - that's what the system is for.
Mittens learned there was a line not to cross - this kid jumped past the line a bit farther. Both may have been joking, but both actions have consequences. Did you really just compare a known murderer to some kid who made a smart assed comment on the internet? Seriously?
No, I pointed out the idiocy of taking "lol, j/k" as cancelling anything you just said, regardless of how threatening, stupid or ignorant it may have been.
Quote: Edit: Mittens also didn't spend eight years in prison either, smartass.
No, but he felt repercussions for what he said "jokingly" in a public forum. Pay attention. Read critically, not emotionally. This 19 year old "kid" hasn't spent 8 years in prison yet either. That is the maximum potential penalty for the charges he is facing today.
I find that without a good mob to provide one for them, most people would have no mentality at all. |

Ace Uoweme
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
336
|
Posted - 2013.07.01 12:52:00 -
[137] - Quote
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:Ace Uoweme wrote:
Yes it is.
I couldn't even send my brother (who was an US Army calvary scout) WWII books from the US to Germany in the fear that he'll be fined for receiving them. In the US a book with a swastika on it won't have cops at your door. Germany it can. .
That I absolutely do not believe. The military's APO service would handle his mail, and nothing to do with German censorship would have been involved.
Get real.
He lives in Germany (even still, he has family there). Notice (was) in the reply above? He's the one who warned me about it, I could only send him WWII books on the pacific war with Japan, instead (that isn't censored).
So, yes, get real. "In a world of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act." ~George Orwell
|

DreznicK
OORt Cloud Research The OORT Cloud
15
|
Posted - 2013.07.01 12:55:00 -
[138] - Quote
Rordan D'Kherr wrote:DreznicK wrote: Well it sounds like you are getting a reality check, not happy about it are you ? There are rules for living in a society, I am sorry if your parents failed to pass that information on to you.
And yes at times they completely suck, sad part of growing up I guess is you find out things are not what you expected them to be. Probably why teenagers are always mad.
Boy, let me tell you: I live in a free country, I grew up in a dictatorship. I know something about that kind of stuff. If the case in the topic would be correct law enforcement, the US jails must be filled with comedians etc. Think about it. No more Bill Maher, no more Larry King. Take a step back and look at the big picture. Reality check etc.
Nope because people like Bill Maher, and Larry King know what to say and what not to say, which I am sure you learned as well. Keep in mind the law anywhere dictates what the police can and can't do. This person was arrested and is awaiting his time in court, the police have very little they can do, they either give you a fine or throw you in jail for the courts to deal with you.
He could get acquitted and his record scrubbed, but that is not for the police to decide, they don't have that kind of power. And as far as being in a dictator country the only difference is in who makes the rules. One person or lots of people. If you have a good dictator then in some respects you are much better off then with a group of people. But if he/she is bad well there is no checks or balances. Same can be said about a monarchy or any government system it is entirely dependent on who is on power. No system is even close to being perfect, all have good and bad points. |

Ace Uoweme
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
336
|
Posted - 2013.07.01 13:06:00 -
[139] - Quote
DreznicK wrote:Nope because people like Bill Maher, and Larry King know what to say and what not to say, which I am sure you learned as well.
Well, Bill Mahers gets his contracts revoked because of what he says and how he says it. Sometimes I agree with him, sometimes I think he's an ass.
People are free to say what they want in the US (from Bill Mahers to Rush Limbaugh), but people also are allowed to criticize them, too. And that's a fair way to present free speech, both sides are allowed to debate the issues.
It's when third parties interfere and want to censor is the problem. As who is the third party and who is sponsoring them and why? If the public doesn't know, and if they're not squeaky clean, it's trouble. "In a world of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act." ~George Orwell
|

Balkor Wolf
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
38
|
Posted - 2013.07.01 13:07:00 -
[140] - Quote
Ziphis wrote:Balkor Wolf wrote:Some nice freedom you have there America.
Certainly an interesting read though and if I take anything away from this it's that I shouldn't be telling everyone in Jita local about my plans to hotdrop the London Subway and gate camp the ticket barriers.
OH BTW LULZ GUYS THAT WAS SARCASM PLEASE DON'T TRACK ME DOWN AND REPORT ME TO OUR UNDERPAID POLICE FORCE. Lol...nice plan xD
I'm glad at least someone enjoyed it =3 |
|

Bort Malice
VINING ENGINEERING AND SALVAGE TEAM Turing Tested
7
|
Posted - 2013.07.01 13:09:00 -
[141] - Quote
Teenagers should be sent to prison. I don't see the issue here. |

Simetraz
State War Academy Caldari State
777
|
Posted - 2013.07.01 13:09:00 -
[142] - Quote
Bischopt wrote:Simetraz wrote:Bischopt wrote:Tobias Hareka wrote:Norian Lonark wrote:Seems it was obviously intended as a joke, it may cause offence but lots of people make jokes about things that people would find offensive and do not get put in jail. When was the last time you read newspaper or watched news from TV? This should always be taken seriously. Joke or not. You just can't go to airport, shout you have bomb in your backpack -> "Dude! It was a joke!". That's a pretty extreme example. Airports may actually be a special thing, especially in the states. But I sure as hell can say to someone in real life that I'm gonna shoot up a school, laugh about it and say "just kidding" without the cops coming and locking me up. Freedom of speech. Afraid not you need to look up freedom. Freedom to do something means there will be no repercussions from the government for your actions. If there are repercussions like going to jail or receiving a fine your actions are not free. Example - you can talk about hating your government all you want. (Freedom of speech) Now if you start talking about killing your leader you are no longer talking but now implying a possible action and that can have repercussions. Too many people/companies (especially news agencies) believe freedom gives them the right to be irresponsible it doesn't. Your are responsible for your actions, and can be punished if you cross the line. Prison. For words. We just went back in time.
Not back in time, it has never changed. You must dress a certain way when at work. You can't say certain things to your boss or you get fired. You can't do certain things while in public. The list goes on and on. The internet allows people to say things they would never say if they were face to face. Is that a good or bad thing. A little of both perhaps. In this case the kid would have been better off saying it face to face. Keep in mind the written word has always been a binding contract, so saying something out loud does not always have the same consequences as putting it down on paper. And that is the catch 22 so to speak with the internet.
EVERYBODY KNOWS |

Gallowmere Rorschach
Quantum Cats Syndicate Samurai Pizza Cats
288
|
Posted - 2013.07.01 13:14:00 -
[143] - Quote
War Kitten wrote:Gallowmere Rorschach wrote:War Kitten wrote:Confirming that "lol, j/k" is a get out of jail free-card.
If the una-bomber had put it at the end of his manifesto, everyone would've known it was just a big joke.
Freedom of speech is not freedom to be an idiot and make threats in a public forum. Let the system work it out - that's what the system is for.
Mittens learned there was a line not to cross - this kid jumped past the line a bit farther. Both may have been joking, but both actions have consequences. Did you really just compare a known murderer to some kid who made a smart assed comment on the internet? Seriously? No, I pointed out the idiocy of taking "lol, j/k" as cancelling anything you just said, regardless of how threatening, stupid or ignorant it may have been. Quote: Edit: Mittens also didn't spend eight years in prison either, smartass.
No, but he felt repercussions for what he said "jokingly" in a public forum. Pay attention. Read critically, not emotionally. This 19 year old "kid" hasn't spent 8 years in prison yet either. That is the maximum potential penalty for the charges he is facing today. The difference is that the example you used was for a person who DID commit acts of violence. The issue here is a case of someone assuming that another person intends to commit violence. I have been in similar situations to how this all started. Someone makes a comment about me being nuts, and I respond with something like "yeap, you should see the pile of hacked up old lady parts I have in my basement dipshit." Now, if the recipient of this message had gone to the police, and they investigated, I am sure they would be most shocked to find that I don't even have a basement. Then upon searching my apartment, they wouldn't find anything even remotely resembling what I was reported to have. That whole thing about assuming...yeah, it tends to make people look stupid.
As for the Mittens statement, allow me to rephrase then: there was absolutely zero chance of him serving prison time over his joke. |

Ziphis
Garoun Investment Bank Gallente Federation
26
|
Posted - 2013.07.01 13:22:00 -
[144] - Quote
also does this mean all out dreams will come true and LoL will be shut down? |

Gallowmere Rorschach
Quantum Cats Syndicate Samurai Pizza Cats
290
|
Posted - 2013.07.01 13:24:00 -
[145] - Quote
Ziphis wrote:also does this mean all out dreams will come true and LoL will be shut down? I hope not. I need LoL to keep distracting the better PvPers in my corp so I can actually get some kills. |

Bischopt
Arbitrary Repossession
122
|
Posted - 2013.07.01 13:24:00 -
[146] - Quote
Simetraz wrote:
Not back in time, it has never changed. You must dress a certain way when at work. You can't say certain things to your boss or you get fired. You can't do certain things while in public. The list goes on and on. The internet allows people to say things they would never say if they were face to face. Is that a good or bad thing. A little of both perhaps. In this case the kid would have been better off saying it face to face. Keep in mind the written word has always been a binding contract, so saying something out loud does not always have the same consequences as putting it down on paper. And that is the catch 22 so to speak with the internet.
Like I've said, looking into threats can be a good thing. Throwing people into prison for them is not a good thing.
Even if you don't care about the life (or lives) being ruined by bad law(?) enforcement, do you really think as a tax-payer that this is a good idea? If we start putting everyone in prison who has made a violent joke on the internet, all prisons in all the world will see a spike of new inmates every one of which take tax money to keep alive and well.
I agree that actions have consequeces, but is 8 years in prison really the right consequece for this particular action? I think not. I hope you think not as well. Altho I don't really care what you think. |

Hessian Arcturus
S.W.O.R.D. Navy
191
|
Posted - 2013.07.01 13:27:00 -
[147] - Quote
Bischopt wrote:Simetraz wrote:
Not back in time, it has never changed. You must dress a certain way when at work. You can't say certain things to your boss or you get fired. You can't do certain things while in public. The list goes on and on. The internet allows people to say things they would never say if they were face to face. Is that a good or bad thing. A little of both perhaps. In this case the kid would have been better off saying it face to face. Keep in mind the written word has always been a binding contract, so saying something out loud does not always have the same consequences as putting it down on paper. And that is the catch 22 so to speak with the internet.
Like I've said, looking into threats can be a good thing. Throwing people into prison for them is not a good thing. Even if you don't care about the life (or lives) being ruined by bad law(?) enforcement, do you really think as a tax-payer that this is a good idea? If we start putting everyone in prison who has made a violent joke on the internet, all prisons in all the world will see a spike of new inmates every one of which take tax money to keep alive and well. I agree that actions have consequeces, but is 8 years in prison really the right consequece for this particular action? I think not. I hope you think not as well. Altho I don't really care what you think.
Not to mention that prisons (in the UK anyway, unsure about America) are already overcrowded. It's human nature to want to explore. To find your line and go beyond it. The only limit, is the one you set yourself. |

Space Juden
Supermassive Potato Pancake
2
|
Posted - 2013.07.01 13:28:00 -
[148] - Quote
It's a good thing AlphaOmegaSin has video games to help keep him off the meth |

Jarod Garamonde
Action Bastards
283
|
Posted - 2013.07.01 13:31:00 -
[149] - Quote
Hessian Arcturus wrote:This is an absolute joke of a court case. EVE online better watch out because alot of us are always posting similar sh*t in local or somewhere. Apparently sarcasm is dead to the world now. What's your verdict on sarcasm in EVE people? EDIT: If you don't want to watch the youtube vid, links to the news article are in the description. I just find AlphaOmegaSin's reaction brilliant, and it pretty much mirrors my own view on the topic.
This is why you have to say "(in game of course)" after making a threat.
Also, I agree with goatee dude.... this crap is out of control. "you can identify eve players by looking at their cars. Since they don't drive what they can't afford to lose."-á --áBienator II |

Gallowmere Rorschach
Quantum Cats Syndicate Samurai Pizza Cats
292
|
Posted - 2013.07.01 13:31:00 -
[150] - Quote
Hessian Arcturus wrote: Not to mention that prisons (in the UK anyway, unsure about America) are already overcrowded.
I haven't looked much into this particular statistic in a long time, but the US has a proud tradition of incarcerating the highest percentage of it's population of any country in the world. Welp, since the whole economic superpower thing is falling apart, and Australia is now officially more obese than the US, we have to be in first place for something. |
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