Am I correct in assuming that CCP condone what i call griefing PVE players in hi-sec - minibumping/suicede ganking

does this also extend to other activities like "giveup 10% loot from mission or be suiced ganked?"

As isk can buy PLEX and PLEX have a $ value it is nothing but a nasty form of shakedown or moneyracket or blackmail etc.

Does this not pose a problem?

Show us on the barge doll where the bad men from the new order touched you.....

does this also extend to other activities like "giveup 10% loot from mission or be suiced ganked?"

Personally, I like think that tears are real and that griefing is real.

If the tears are real, it's not really the supposed griefer that suffers from some kind of questionable behaviourGǪ

If the tears are real, it's not really the supposed griefer that suffers from some kind of questionable behaviourGǪ

Am I correct in assuming that CCP condone what i call griefing PVE players in hi-sec - minibumping/suicede ganking

does this also extend to other activities like "giveup 10% loot from mission or be suiced ganked?"

?

I mine, I do combat mission all in hi-sec. dont have the isk or skill to rumbel in low-0sec.



As isk can buy PLEX and PLEX have a $ value it is nothing but a nasty form of shakedown or moneyracket or blackmail etc.

Does this not pose a problem?

Always amazes me the number of people who expect some degree of RL "common courtesy" or "etiquette" in a virtual environment that simply does not require that sort of thing from anyone.

Am I correct in assuming that CCP condone what i call griefing PVE players in hi-sec - minibumping/suicede ganking

does this also extend to other activities like "giveup 10% loot from mission or be suiced ganked?"

?

I mine, I do combat mission all in hi-sec. dont have the isk or skill to rumbel in low-0sec.



As isk can buy PLEX and PLEX have a $ value it is nothing but a nasty form of shakedown or moneyracket or blackmail etc.

Does this not pose a problem?

You're playing the wrong game... the game is not about chewing rocks in Hisec belts and "running level 4's"...

The way the game is designed... it just so happens to fall into place that you have the ability to do so, but that is not what the game is about...


The game is about... this: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=256142&find=unread

Great wars, 1000's of players fighting, Victory/Defeats & Tears, Alliances, Coalitions, Sovereignty, Trust, Backstabbing, Wealth and Power.


As a Hisec miner chewing spacerocks in your mining frigate while you play WoT and LoL in another window... you're INSIGNIFICANT, you're just an individual with no cause... nobody CARES, CCP doesn't CARE, just shut up and keep mining... or unsubscribe and play something else.

WTB: Hulk plushie doll.

You're playing the wrong game... the game is not about chewing rocks in Hisec belts and "running level 4's"...

The way the game is designed... it just so happens to fall into place that you have the ability to do so, but that is not what the game is about...


The game is about... this: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=256142&find=unread

Great wars, 1000's of players fighting, Victory/Defeats & Tears, Alliances, Coalitions, Sovereignty, Trust, Backstabbing, Wealth and Power.


As a Hisec miner chewing spacerocks in your mining frigate while you play WoT and LoL in another window... you're INSIGNIFICANT, you're just an individual with no cause... nobody CARES, CCP doesn't CARE, just shut up and keep mining... or unsubscribe and play something else.

You're playing the wrong game... the game is not about chewing rocks in Hisec belts and "running level 4's"...

The way the game is designed... it just so happens to fall into place that you have the ability to do so, but that is not what the game is about...


The game is about... this: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=256142&find=unread

Great wars, 1000's of players fighting, Victory/Defeats & Tears, Alliances, Coalitions, Sovereignty, Trust, Backstabbing, Wealth and Power.


As a Hisec miner chewing spacerocks in your mining frigate while you play WoT and LoL in another window... you're INSIGNIFICANT, you're just an individual with no cause... nobody CARES, CCP doesn't CARE, just shut up and keep mining... or unsubscribe and play something else.

Wow. That is the most tardbartastic elistist view I have seen anyone spew in a while.

Just because you don't belong to a null-sec alliance doesn't mean CCP cares less about your money.

Sure, you aren't going to be making gaming news, but people who enjoy playing by themselves and are enjoying it aren't doing anything wrong.

Secondly, I wonder how all those ships the alliances lose on a daily basis were made?

Certainly they didn't call CCP and ask them to put ore in their hangers.

Someone mined it and given that most pvp people don't like to mine, I believe it is safe to say someone who doesn't participate directly in the alliance wars somehow aquired it through shooting rocks in high sec somewhere.

Am I correct in assuming that CCP condone what i call griefing PVE players in hi-sec - minibumping/suicede ganking

does this also extend to other activities like "giveup 10% loot from mission or be suiced ganked?"

?

I mine, I do combat mission all in hi-sec. dont have the isk or skill to rumbel in low-0sec.



As isk can buy PLEX and PLEX have a $ value it is nothing but a nasty form of shakedown or moneyracket or blackmail etc.

Does this not pose a problem?

Alliances have their own resources, in all respects.
Trust me, Alliances do not rely on lone Hisec miners to supply their war efforts.

Wait, what? I thought the current mantra was "Null Sec Industry is broken" and they hate the fact that they have to import everything in jump freighters from Jita.

There have been 40 page threadnaughts of people whining and complaining that Hi-sec industrialists were outperforming Null and that something needs to be done so they don't have to buy from Jita anymore.

Unless you want to argue that they don't and Null Sec industry is fine.

You're playing the wrong game... the game is not about chewing rocks in Hisec belts and "running level 4's"...

The way the game is designed... it just so happens to fall into place that you have the ability to do so, but that is not what the game is about...


The game is about... this: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=256142&find=unread

Great wars, 1000's of players fighting, Victory/Defeats & Tears, Alliances, Coalitions, Sovereignty, Trust, Backstabbing, Wealth and Power.


As a Hisec miner chewing spacerocks in your mining frigate while you play WoT and LoL in another window... you're INSIGNIFICANT, you're just an individual with no cause... nobody CARES, CCP doesn't CARE, just shut up and keep mining... or unsubscribe and play something else.

Alliances have their own resources, in all respects.
Trust me, Alliances do not rely on lone Hisec miners to supply their war efforts.


EVE is one big choice, you can do anything you want.... and that works both ways, if me and my friends want to gank you while you're mining.. WE WILL.

If you want to waste your time in EVE mining in Hisec,, YOU WILL.

But coming to the forum and complaining about the game working exactly how it was intended?...

People like that need to open their eyes, read about the history of the game, what actually takes place in EVE, and the future of EVE.

They will be amazed out the complexity and sheer scale of the potential the game has.
While they're on a 0.9 belt mining atseroids alone... they're not even exposed to 0.00001% of what EVE actually is... how could they possibly come to the forum and claim the game is broken when they do not even know what the game is!?

What you do in low-sec, null-sec has zero impact on my game.

Name one thing - just one thing...that effects my game. LOL!

market prices

Name one thing - just one thing...that effects my game. LOL!

The game itself. Because you don't know the difference between the verb "effect" and "affect."

LMFO! Really...you think that null and low sec effect market prices to the point that it effects "my" game. I guess the people of low and null think they are EVE - huh. LOL!

well we doubled the price of tempest fleet issues and briefly spiked prices of lots of ships

Still waiting for the one thing. I can wait. :)

CCP have a new SRP for people who lose Jump Freighters every time goons decide to burn Jita...

So feel free to fly yours when the time comes... there's nothing like experiencing the fireworks from the top deck of a 6bil isk ship... spectacular!

CCP have a new SRP for people who lose Jump Freighters every time goons decide to burn Jita...

So feel free to fly yours when the time comes... there's nothing like experiencing the fireworks from the top deck of a 6bil isk ship... spectacular!

Didn't "affect" me...hmmm...what might "affect" me....let me try to think of something....*thinking...thinking....thinking....*.....nope, don't recall anything anyone, any corp, or any alliance from null and low sec that had any "affect" on my game.

Well, see, their you again thinking this has any "affect" on my game. You're welcome to keep trying to guess though...this is fun. :)

Did you know there are things that, and get this, you don't know?

nobody really knows nor cares what you do in empire

Khira, please keep posting. I like reading the pure idiocy.

Well, see, their you again thinking this has any "affect" on my game. You're welcome to keep trying to guess though...this is fun. :)

You could extend that to the entire Internet where, up until recently, there were no consequences for acting horribly to someone else. Now there are actual consequences it will be interesting to see if that trickles down to gaming.

You seem to think that null and low sec has this great impact on my game play

It does, it's just that nobody here is willing to take the time to explain the EVE circle of life to you...

Nobody cares what you do in Empire, CCP doesn't even care...

You have your asteroids, you have your missions, now stfu and play nice.


And if you ever do decide to HTFU, I'll get you into Dreddit for 2bil...

Have a nice day

There is no EVE circle of life and if you honestly think there is...are you sure you are playing the same game I am? Maybe in your mind you believe that what happens in null and low sec impacts my game - but that is simply in your own mind.

Name one thing that Null players do that can affect a High-sec player's game? Should be easy, though my list may need tweaking as I've only a couple months of experience here. My research may thus be incomplete or contain a misunderstanding. If so, I'd appreciate any information to correct the flaws. For credentials, I'm a High-sec player, though I do plan on expanding.

1. Mining barges and many other ships above frigate class require the mineral Megacyte to build. Megacyte mainly comes from Null-Sec mining. Wormhole J-space can also provide this mineral, but not in the same volume as Null.

2. Tech II stuff needs Morphite, which is another Null-sec product. They also need moon mining materials, which unlike regular mining needs a base orbiting a moon with certain modules equipped. Moon mining is Low/Null exclusive. Neither High nor J-space can provide "Moon Goo."

3. Null wars cause a bunch of ships to explode out there. This results in needing replacements, creating additional demand for minerals, ship modules, ammunition, and hulls. Whether you mine or mission or hunt NPCs, when you sell the result on the market, it may be a Null player buying it. Also, blue and purple modules, Officer and Dead Space respectively?, come from Null, supplying the High-sec mission runners and miners who want shiny things in their ships.

4. Up until recently Tech II production was under 100% control of a NullSec coalition, Goonswarm if I remember correctly, because they owned every source of a specific Moon Material, Technetium, that was until Odyssey expansion required to make Tech II things.

5. If Ice Mining is your High-sec thing, those moon bases I mentioned need fuel blocks made from the refined materials of ice to even power themselves. Granted, there is ice in Low and Null as well, so they don't need High-sec Ice, but they may still buy the materials or fuel while they're up in Jita buying Tritanium so as to not need to mine Veldspar out there. Also, J-space can't have ice, so they need to import. Since the trade hubs are in High-sec and most likely filled with High-sec ice, that's what wormhole dwellers buy.

6. Speaking of Low/Null and ice, Titans. These massive ships, the biggest in the game, can act as mobile star gates, allowing fleets to bounce around great distances skipping some of the actual star gates along the way. They need something from Ice to work. I think Cynosural field generators also use ice water, and bases, dreadnoughts, and that Rorqual industrial cap use Strontium Castrates to do stuff. More demand for ice.

7. As touched in 5: Null players may buy the minerals acquired by High-sec mining to save time and hassle for the Null miners, so they don't need to mine those same ores and can focus on getting the shiny ones. They could also just send some of there miners to High-sec to mine those same ores themselves, thus increasing competition in the belts and reducing the amount their alliance may need to buy from High-sec markets.

8. In addition to game-mechanic based effects, the Null players can choose to do things to High-sec players, funded by their Null income methods(which are invariably better than High-sec income of the same type). Some examples:
- Hulkageddon, wherein they - Goons I think it was? - call open season on ALL the mining barges, and pay based on the amount destroyed, and I think types, using Null money. These may have also inspired the formation of the Knights of the New Order, who perform a perpetual but smaller scale version of the Hulkageddon on those who don't buy their permits.
- Burn Jita 1 & 2. Goonswarm killed ships flying to and from Jita, which put a dent on High-sec market.
- Miniluv, where Goons (seeing a pattern here? lol) go about killing freighters because they can. This will hit the market.

9. Null Alliance members campaign for CSM along with other players, and those making it into the CSM can guide CCP's development of EVE by representing the player base as a whole. Also, some of CCP's staff have played EVE amongst us prior to hiring, and some of them may have been in Null Alliances.

Well... well well well...

Khira Kitamatsu... good luck

Well, if you think that anything he wrote impacts my game play - you'd be sadly mistaken. But hey, you've been trying all night to figure out a way to show that what happens in null and low sec impacts my game and still haven't done so.

great, nobody cares

Well, if you think that anything he wrote impacts my game play - you'd be sadly mistaken. But hey, you've been trying all night to figure out a way to show that what happens in null and low sec impacts my game and still haven't done so.

If you use any t2 thing then we have impacted you.

Well somebody seems to care or they'd let the topic drop. They desperately want to believe in their mind that something they do in null or low sec might impact my game play - but it doesn't. Never has.

No, you haven't.

excellent, i'm glad you've been playing for 5 years without doing anything interesting in this game

We determined how much T2 items were to build for years because most of the cost was in tech. A resource that we, along with a few other partners, had total control over.

Own a POS? A lot of people do and last year we hurt all of those people with our ice interdictions.

Right now Domi have become rather expensive, I wonder why...

So yea, we impacted you over the years and will continue to do so.

Dude...no you don't...and you never have - ever. Even if tech2 stuff become impossible to get....and you blew up every stinking mining vessel in the game - you'd not make one impact on my game play. ZERO! You might **** a lot of other people off - but not me. LOL!

So you're saying you don't use Tech 2.

Dude...no you don't...and you never have - ever.

Even if tech2 stuff become impossible to get....and you blew up every stinking mining vessel in the game - you'd not make one impact on my game play. ZERO! You might **** a lot of other people off - but not me. LOL!

Oh, so you're either a station trader (Which makes even less sense in the way of how null sec affects you) or a local scammer. I get it now.

Side-note: Erotica1 will always be better than you.

There are thousands and I mean thousands of players that have no interest in null and low sec. Even if, and I do mean if, T2 stuff(much of which is over rated) disappeared off the market - guess what - the game would go on. With or without it. Funny how that works.

You must have been that one person living under a rock for the last few years. Between OTEC we had every tech moon and thus the entire supply of tech in the galaxy and demanded whatever price we wanted.



So you don't ever buy t2 things?

Not necessary to play the game.

Yet everyone still use them.

So yes, what happens in null/low impacts everyone.

No - tell me how what you do or anyone in null or low impacts what I do in game? Please - I am waiting.

1st of mad no. not been a victim of this.

only seen the minebumping as a spectator. and hear the chatter of the rats trying to justify making others hurt.

trying to call it anything else but extortion is just idiocy. why on earth do gangster and pirats feel they have to justefy what they do. Moral? makes me laugh. parasites.

What do you do in game? Let's hear an exact answer? Trade? Contract scam? Mission run? Suicide gank?

Doesn't matter what I do - because there is nothing from null or low sec I need to play EVE.

They do not condone griefing, no. They just have a completely different view of what griefing is.
Taking all your money through any legit means available isn't it.

Extortion is legit, yes.

No. The instant the PLEX comes into existence, it becomes a full in-game asset. You may not trade it, or ISK, for cash (same as for any other in-game item) and you can lose it the same as any other such item. Your ISK is worthless and is, in fact, not even yours but CCP's. Just because you've lost ISK doesn't mean you've lost anything in the real world.

GǪoh, and what does any of this have to do with highsec mining, by the way?

Lets hear what you do and we will tell you how we impact you.

Doesn't matter what I do - because what I said is true - there is absolutely nothing from null sec or low sec that I need to play EVE. Absolutely nothing.

Alliances have their own resources, in all respects.

Trust me, Alliances do not rely on lone Hisec miners to supply their war efforts.

And those "mats" <--- HERE

I stopped reading...

Doesn't matter what I do - because what I said is true - there is absolutely nothing from null sec or low sec that I need to play EVE. Absolutely nothing.

Well so far you dont use any t2 things, anything the involves a tower, anything that involves PI materials, anything that comes out of a wormhole or just about everything on the market.

That doesn't leave much of anything.

nobody CARES, CCP doesn't CARE, just shut up and keep mining... or unsubscribe and play something else.

So what you are saying is that null sec industrialists are really hi-sec industrialists who mine all their ore in null-sec

Also, its not a false dichotomy if one has to be true and one has to be false.

One of these has to be true and the other has to be false.

I'm saying that T2 is not necessary to have fun in this game.

Doesn't matter what I do - because there is nothing from null or low sec I need to play EVE.

Incorrect. What you do matters a lot. So what do you do in the game? You are asking people for information but refuse to give them the basic foundation they need to give it to you. As long as you describe what you do, the only rational answer is that null affects you because that's how the game is designed: it's all interconnected. If you think you've managed to find a way out of that interconnectedness, prove it.

What I do in game doe not matter

so please - tell me - what do I need from null and low sec to play EVE and how is it that what happens in null and low impacts my game in any way

Yes it does. If you claim that null does not affect your gameplay, your gameplay matters.

That depends on what you do. So what is it you do in the game?

Sorry to burst your need to know what I do, but you really do not need to know.

So please - tell me what you think I need from null and low to play EVE and how what happens in null and low affects my game at all.

I do if you want me to answer your question.

That depends on what you do. So what is it you do in the game?

Let's say I collect rat bounties - what do I need from low and null to do that?

The question is how you're affected or impacted by null. If you're ratting, you're competing against other ratters for the availability of those bounties. Those other players will use nullsec-sourced equipment that is much better than what you can field, thus shrinking your income.

Your gameplay is affected because every part of the game affects every other part of the game.

What I do in game does not matter - not for what they are trying to prove. Sorry. And there is nothing, absolutely nothing I need from null or low sec to play EVE - despite you and some others desperate attempt to prove otherwise, which none of you have managed to do...so please - tell me - what do I need from null and low sec to play EVE and how is it that what happens in null and low impacts my game in any way, seriously, if you honestly have an answer - please feel free to give it.

Sorry, doesn't affect me...I play for the fun, it has no other meaning.

Tell me what I need or how what happens in null or low sec affects my EVE game play - at all.

Just like in other games.

What "end-gamers" do in the scheme of things doesn't matter to the rest playing.

GǪand you're still affected. Your not caring doesn't change this fact. Also, moving the goal posts does not change the simple fact that everything in the game affects everything else in the game, because that's how the game is designed.

You've tried to change it from GÇ£not affectedGÇ¥ to GÇ£not impactedGÇ¥ to GÇ£don't need itGÇ¥ to GÇ£have nothing to do withGÇ£ to GÇ£makes impossibleGÇ¥. The PvP-centric nature of the game, on its own, inherently means that every activity is affected by null in some way or another, so you had to alter the question. All of the things you listed are affected by null in one way or another.

That depends on what you do. So what is it you do in the game?

EVE doesn't work like that because EVE is not like other games. For one, there is no end game. For another, what other players do matter a great deal to everyone else because what they do shapes the world around everyone.

Sure EVE is a game, but its like poker. The stakes are real and people get pretty upset when they lose $100 dollar worth of ship.

Especially those who actually paid money to pay for their ships.

Tippia - I am not going to continue this little circle-jerk with you.

Until you can tell me how null and low sec has any affect on my game play at all

Guess what though - I'll play the game - have fun and make ISK and laugh at all the drama that happens in null and low.

That's fine by me. As long as you realise that everything you do in EVE is affected by null in one way or another, because that's just how the game works.

At its heart, EVE is very simple: it's a great engine with the market as its motor, with destruction and production fuelling it, and ISK lubricating it. Short of doing absolutely nothing, anything do you din game touches at least two or three of these components, and you're thereby affected by everything everyone else is pouring into the mix.

If you rat, you are producing ISK and you're doing it in competition with other players since rats are a limited resource. Your ISK has its value changed based on what they do; theirs change based on what you do. The loot you pick up is affected in the same way. The competition you're up against will alter what your time is worth using equipment spat out of from this engine. I already explained to you how you are affected and you can keep denying (or not caring about) this as much as you like, but it doesn't change the fact that you are being affected nonetheless. Everything you've listed is affected in the same way. Let's see if you can spot the patternGǪ

Missions GÇö affected by null through the market and the choice of equipment available to you and your competition.
Mining GÇö affected by null through the market and the choice of equipment available to you and your competition.
Industry GÇö affected by null through the market and the choice of equipment available to you and your competition.
Exploration GÇö affected by null through the market and the choice of equipment available to you and your competition (just to break out from the emerging norm, exploration is particularly affected by null since a lot of the exploration content would be useless without null providing the other pieces of the puzzle).
Trading GÇö affected by null through the market and the choice of equipment available to you and your competition.
Scamming GÇö affected by null through the market and the choice of equipment available to you and your competition.
PvP GÇö affected by null through the market and the choice of equipment available to you and your competition.
Collecting GÇö affected by null through the market and the choice of equipment available to you and your competition.
DJing GÇö really qualifies as doing nothing, but since you picked EVE radio of all places, you're affected by what happens in null since null events tend to show up on the radio reports.

I already did. You failed to dispute it.

GǪand thus be even more affected by it than if you just played the game and made ISK.

That's fine by me. As long as you realise that everything you do in EVE is affected by null in one way or another, because that's just how the game works.

Am I correct in assuming that CCP condone what i call griefing PVE players in hi-sec - minibumping/suicede ganking

does this also extend to other activities like "giveup 10% loot from mission or be suiced ganked?"

?

I mine, I do combat mission all in hi-sec. dont have the isk or skill to rumbel in low-0sec.



As isk can buy PLEX and PLEX have a $ value it is nothing but a nasty form of shakedown or moneyracket or blackmail etc.

Does this not pose a problem?

It's that simple.

Look, I know of one person who is building super's in lowsec for nullsec.

You just wasted a ton of time and proved absolutely nothing.

and some others think, in some weird way, that what happens in low and null affects mine and others game play - when in fact it doesn't.

Null and low sec do not generate the content I use to play EVE - the game does that.

Ah, no it doesn't.

Just like you're wrong about twisting words about "end-game"'

you're wrong that null-sec is even needed for players to play the game.

Much of what happens in EVE is driven by the market. And the market is obviously and HUGELY effected by activities in null. So unless you somehow play EVE without ever interacting with the market or interacting with anyone who interacts with the market, then you cannot claim that null does not impact your play.

"It's that simple."

I'll repeat this one more time.

If null sec and low sec were completely removed from the game - that means gone - doesn't exist. OK we clear on that? Null and low sec are gone. Good. Guess what - the game of EVE

If null sec and low sec were completely removed from the game - that means gone - doesn't exist. OK we clear on that? Null and low sec are gone. Good. Guess what - the game of EVE goes on as if nothing ever happened. They are not needed to play EVE.

The only people that seem to believe the null sec and low sec matters are those that use it.

The only people that seem to believe the null sec and low sec matters are those that use it.

Right now Domi have become rather expensive, I wonder why...

Is this how discussions tend to go with you guys? A couple legitimate counterpoints and you just completely disappear from the thread?

No "Oh, I guess that's a good point," or "Well, I didn't think of it that way. Maybe I was wrong." Nothing? Just act like this discussion never took place?

I figured there was a counterargument after my last point last night, but since I presented a Boolean argument, they either have to accept it or claim logic does not exist.

GǪor go for a third option: show that it's not actually a boolean argument, and that presenting it as such is fallacious.

So no, they don't have to do either of those two, making it yet another false dichotomy.

Out of curiosity, what was the 3rd option?

The alliances do their industry outside of null, where it isn't broken.

Maybe you shouldn't have made a bat based on poor logic and kept readingGǪ?

If null is in high sec building crap and mining crap, it means they no longer are exclusively null sec.

Which means they are the second part of my Boolean argument.

I don't know why I even try to convince someone so obviously refuses to see logic.

Because CCP added a big list of extra materials to the manufacturing costs because they were too cheap.

The sudden spike in the last week has nothing to do with manufacturing cost

Just so that you know. Domi's are selling about -17% below mineral cost. Which means its more profitable to just sell the minerals on the market.

Just so that you know. Domi's are selling about -17% below mineral cost. Which means its more profitable to just sell the minerals on the market.

You are trying to tell me that null sec players are in high sec and don't rely on high sec miners to get their stuff.

And are you telling me that no alliance miners mine by themselves if no one else is on?

Look you can't be a nullseccer if you are in high sec mining for your alliance.

Keep posting. You are making yourself look bad.

Look. You are not comprehending what I am saying.

And if there is at least one, it means your entire argument is false.

Secondly, you can't tell me that some alliances actually don't buy some minerals or resources from Jita.

Tippia is really good at that. LOL!

Yes, and you're the best.

*sigh* Its like arguing with a four legged animal.

If at least one null sec member buys any goods from Jita it means they support lone high sec mining.

Sure this might mean that null sec industry needs fixing, but it doesn't mean that null sec industry is 100% self sufficient.

Answer my question? Do I need null and low sec to play EVE online?

As already explained to you in full, yes. You have yet to dispute or disprove this with anything other than evasions and abuse, which rather suggests that you have no actual counter-argument and that you know full well that it's true.

Bullshit.

Tell me one thing, one thing I need from null or low to play EVE online- just one thing!

Then prove it.
Tell us what it is you do and how you believe it to be completely disconnected to the market, to production, and to destruction.

I've told you a number of things. Maybe you should address them and demonstrate how they aren't needed.

Yep..knew it...you are just trolling and refuse to answering the question.

Because even if null and low sec were removed and no longer existed - guess what I can still play.

Does this not pose a problem?

I agree. It's as if you didn't understand the difference between premise, syllogism and conclusion. It seems you are completely oblivious to the concept of fallacies and which type operates at which level.

Ok. You went off the rails that early this time, huh. Ok let's go back to that original statement yet again:

GÇ£Alliances have their own resources, in all respects.
Trust [Amnesiaa Haze], Alliances do not rely on lone Hisec miners to supply their war efforts.GÇ¥

If at least one null sec member buys any goods from Jita, it means squat for how much alliance relies on highsec mining. Unless they pretty much all do it to a man, the alliance does not rely on those miners.

GǪwhich no-one claimed to begin with. The claim was that Gǣalliances have their own resources, in all respectsGǥ. Alliances. Not nullsec industry. You need to stop making up strawman arguments and claims that were never made. You need to stop with your non-exhaustive categorisation.

You're piling fallacy upon fallacy upon fallacy, and then you complain that no-one agrees with your logic. There's a reason for that: because it's fallacious GÇö it does not hold.

As already explained to you in full, yes. You have yet to dispute or disprove this with anything other than evasions and abuse, which rather suggests that you have no actual counter-argument and that you know full well that it's true.

Do I need null and low sec to play EVE online?

Because even if null and low sec were removed and no longer existed - guess what I can still play

So tell me how null and low sec affect my game. Please, I am listening.

Yes. They are the driving force behind almost all of the game's economy. And the economy is the driving force behind almost everything the highsec focused players do.



World of Warcraft? Because EVE would be shut down within two weeks.



You're not listening. You are pretending to, in an attempt to seem the more reasonable party, but when faced with direct questions or challenges to your "evidence" (which, btw, is thus far nonexistent), you do your best to handwave away anything not fluffing your own twisted opinion.

It's intellectual dishonesty on a level that is incredible even for these forums. With this much brain power diverted toward solipsism, you must struggle to breathe.

[No name me one thing from null sec or low sec that I need to play EVE online.

I play EVE and nothing that happens in null or low will ever affect my game in EVE - ever.

No name me one thing from null sec or low sec that I need to play EVE online. Name me just one thing. Then I'll concede your argument. Until then...I play EVE and nothing that happens in null or low will ever affect my game in EVE - ever. Not once...it has zero impact on my game play. None. Period. End of story.

Market demand.

The majority of good produced in highsec, are one way or another headed to lower security areas, or are being sold by the lowsec and nullsec players' alts.

So, I ask you, what precisely do you do in EVE? There really isn't much that you can do that isn't effected by nullsec or lowsec. Maybe distribution missions.

So, the burden of proof is on you. How is it that your activities are not effected?

Market demand.

The majority of good produced in highsec, are one way or another headed to lower security areas, or are being sold by the lowsec and nullsec players' alts.

So, I ask you, what precisely do you do in EVE? There really isn't much that you can do that isn't effected by nullsec or lowsec. Maybe distribution missions.

So, the burden of proof is on you. How is it that your activities are not effected?

Sorry doesn't effect me...the market can go all nutsy...don't need it. I can get everything I need from running missions. ISK...loot...ammo...fittings...the rest can come from LP stores or mission rewards. So tell me how the market affects my my missioning. Missions are created by the game - not null of low sec. The market can fry for all I care.

The game is about... this: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=256142&find=unread

Great wars, 1000's of players fighting, Victory/Defeats & Tears, Alliances, Coalitions, Sovereignty, Trust, Backstabbing, Wealth and Power.


As a Hisec miner chewing spacerocks in your mining frigate while you play WoT and LoL in another window... you're INSIGNIFICANT, you're just an individual with no cause... nobody CARES, CCP doesn't CARE, just shut up and keep mining... or unsubscribe and play something else.

So... you really think you can live off ammo drops from NPCs?

And what are you going to do with the ISK you get from running missions? Nothing but PLEX your account, hmm?

Also, I would still say you can be effected by nullsec. They can roll into a mission hub and lock it down, interdict the crap out of it, and you cannot mission there anymore. Yes, you could move, but you still would have been effected.

As isk can buy PLEX and PLEX have a $ value it is nothing but a nasty form of shakedown or moneyracket or blackmail etc.

Does this not pose a problem?

There is nothing that is required, has an affect, or necessary from low or null sec to play EVE. If null and low sec were removed right now and no longer existed - guess what - I can sign in and keep playing is if nothing happened. LOL!

And you know what is the best thing about it - it really pisses you guys off that null and low sec aren't really needed to play EVE at all. :)

Still waiting for someone to name me one requirement from null and low sec that is a must have to play EVE - just one item.

Sorry doesn't affect me.

I can get everything I need from running missions.

There is nothing that is required, has an affect, or necessary from low or null sec to play EVE.

For about two weeks. The game would be shut down after that.



No, I find mild amusement in the staggering level of the self inflicted ignorance you are perpetrating. Believing that you can somehow turn this into a single player game, and tunnel vision on without paying heed to the ever shifting world around you, is sheer lunacy.



You've been given numerous examples, and you have discounted them offhandedly. You will never be given an example you do not reject, because that is the game you are playing. It's pretty transparent.

Still waiting for you to name me one item that is required to play EVE that comes from null or low sec...I know you can't...but you seem to think there is so name it. Until then, like Tippia...you are playing a circle-jerk game of trolling. You know I am right and refuse to acknowledge it. I said I would concede the argument if you could name me one required item from null and low sec to play EVE. I'll wait patiently for an answer. :)

Yes it does, because it's what gives everything you do value and meaning, and it's where all your stuff either comes from or ends up.

I put the value on the game. I determine what is fun and has value. Not you.

Not in the amounts you need and not without competing with other players, at which point, guess what? You're being affected by what everyone else does GÇö including those in low and null.


Bullshit - the game generates missions...not players, not null or low sec. The game can generate hundreds of them...and guess what I am not competing for any of them - at all. None.



GǪaside from the many things listed and which you have never been able to address, much less dispute or disprove. Meanwhile, everything you've mentioned so far is affected by low and null through the means of economy, tools, and competition.

Hey, can we get some lowsec guys to track this Khira person down and "effect" them from lowsec, preferably in the middle of a mission?

Pretty sure they'd have to concede the point after that.



So, what you did was move the goalposts after your "I can't be effected by nullsec" statements were broken. So, to make sure you didn't lose the argument, you changed it to "I don't need any items from nullsec".

Once again, you are very transparent.

I do hope that you can somehow self-justify all of this.

Because the rest of us? We think you're pathetic.

Still waiting for you to name me one item that is required to play EVE that comes from null or low sec.

You know I am right

I put the value on the game.

Bullshit

I didn't move anything.

still waiting on what null sec does to my game that affects me in game.

Sorry...name me one item. Last chance.

There is nothing that is required, has an affect, or necessary from low or null sec to play EVE. If null and low sec were removed right now and no longer existed - guess what - I can sign in and keep playing as if nothing happened. LOL!

I love mad themeparker tears.

"As if nothing happened," is a big fat "No," however, because the ISK value of ships and goods on the high sec market is tied inextricably to the wars and destruction that goes on in null and low sec.

Let's see, did a L4 and got about 34mil on salvage, and around 24mil in ISK from all the dead pirates. Not bad for an extremely casual run in a Drake and not even level 5 skills.

Bet that burns PvPers buns, huh?

how long did it take?

The market could crash tomorrow, it wouldn't matter as it's money

GǪthat has suddenly become worthless, useless, and pretty much completely devoid of purpose. Oh wait, that rather makes it matter, doesn't it?

To you.

I'm not dependent on the market, moon goo or the other stuff.

I just need to save.

Why did you run that mission? Why did you collect the salvage?

Why I collect salvage? So not to pay 4mil for rigs.
Why I collect salvage? So I don't have to pay for building mats.

Why I collect salvage? Meta 4 gear (totally free and not dependent on moon goo)

If I don't use it I melt it for something more useful.

Like I said, I'm not depended on null or low-sec....at all.