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shaders and world record? could sombody explain what it is?

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The Wizz117	Posted - 2006.01.01 22:05:00 - [1] are shaders like rooms u can enter? like eve has 1 room, all player can contact each other and see each other. but if u have shaders you have like 2 or more difrend rooms, and if u are in room 1 u can not see/contact the ones in room2. what exactly is this shadering?
Dark Shikari	Posted - 2006.01.01 22:07:00 - [2] Its "Sharding." When you log into World of Warcraft, it gives you a choice of about 500 different servers. Every one is totally seperate. The same game, of course, but the servers are totally seperate and you cannot move between them. Each one has a few thousand on at once. EVE has one server (128 actual machines, but one cluster) with 21000 on at once. - Proud member of the [23]. The Tachikomas are DEAD! Click sig for video.
Hoshi	Posted - 2006.01.01 22:13:00 - [3] I think you mean Shard. Shade: 1 a : to shelter or screen by intercepting radiated light or heat b : to cover with a shade Shard: 1 a : a piece or fragment of a brittle substance; broadly : a small piece or part In mmorpgs a shard means a seperate server which is a clone of the gaming world and has no connection to any other server. Each shard is it's own copy of the game, different players that play on different shards can not interact which each other in anyway.
The Wizz117	Posted - 2006.01.01 22:21:00 - [4] but 1 shard in WOW has 30000 to 50000 players at the same time. so the whole eve-shard record is diseafe?
Dark Shikari	Posted - 2006.01.01 22:24:00 - [5] Edited by: Dark Shikari on 01/01/2006 22:24:07 Originally by: The Wizz117 but 1 shard in WOW has 30000 to 50000 players at the same time. so the whole eve-shard record is diseafe? Not online at once, certainly not. Maybe 3000 if you're lucky? Probably less. If you're talking about number of characters, take that number, divide by 8 (max number of characters), and compare to the EVE account number (85000 atm). - Proud member of the [23]. The Tachikomas are DEAD! Click sig for video.
Risk	Posted - 2006.01.01 22:26:00 - [6] Yes, Wow servers probably support at max 5000 players (if lucky), and also you can notice this when the queue hits, queing to enter a game is retarded, its also been said that Wow uses a monolith design to their servers (multiple computers with shared processing to equal one big computer), they have i believe 3 groups of servers per server, a cluster of 2-3 for each continent and a chat server. While Eve is 2100 at once on a single cluster.
Demadred	Posted - 2006.01.01 22:27:00 - [7] Originally by: Dark Shikari Not online at once, certainly not. Maybe 3000 if you're lucky? Probably less. I read somewhere that's about 6000 to 12000. But i've never seen official numbers from blizzard, so it's all guessing.
Spike Firebrand	Posted - 2006.01.01 22:35:00 - [8] Guild wars has one server (split into 3 for euro/us/korean) and easyerly has more players on it then eve has had. So how can they claim to have the most players at once when it does'nt. must be a wow tactic like how they claim to have 5 million users when its not even 10% of that. Sarchasm (n): The gulf between the author of sarcastic wit and the person who doesn't get it. EG The Atlantic ocean :P
Risk	Posted - 2006.01.01 22:35:00 - [9] 12000 cant be right.. they have like 125 servers, that would equal to 1.5 million people playing at all times, while blizzard does indeed claim 5 million subscribed users (1.5 million are from china alone) you have to assume alot of those accounts arent active at once. Or played on a regular basis. I play on one of the more popular servers (with a queue) and definatly 12000 is nowhere near the amount on my server, plus this is confirmed with the use of cosmos, which does a who scan to find the max number of players on at that point, it does take 5 minutes or so to do, but you will find that 4000-5000 is about cap per server.
Laocoon	Posted - 2006.01.01 22:39:00 - [10] Originally by: Spike Firebrand Guild wars has one server (split into 3 for euro/us/korean) and easyerly has more players on it then eve has had. So how can they claim to have the most players at once when it does'nt. must be a wow tactic like how they claim to have 5 million users when its not even 10% of that. it's not one server iirc, it's one per group or something, but i've never played, only read so don't hold me to this. -------------------------------------------- (paint sigs ftl :'( ) i collect heads

Risk	Posted - 2006.01.01 22:41:00 - [11] for one. EVE IS A SEAMLESS GAME, there are no zones, and guildwars has zones, plus guildwars is a joke, and is what? 10% the size of eve in terms of content? and you also said that guildwars splits the servers into 3, so are you disagreeing with yourself? eve is ONE shard, one cluster.
Dark Shikari	Posted - 2006.01.01 22:41:00 - [12] Edited by: Dark Shikari on 01/01/2006 22:42:02 Originally by: Spike Firebrand Guild wars has one server (split into 3 for euro/us/korean) and easyerly has more players on it then eve has had. So how can they claim to have the most players at once when it does'nt. must be a wow tactic like how they claim to have 5 million users when its not even 10% of that. Not at all. Guild Wars doesn't have players "on" the server. It works in the same way as Diablo 2, where the clients themselves host the games, and the server mediates. Should we say that since Battle.net has 3 million players at once that its 100 times that of EVE? Originally by: Risk for one. EVE IS A SEAMLESS GAME, there are no zones, and guildwars has zones, plus guildwars is a joke, and is what? 10% the size of eve in terms of content? and you also said that guildwars splits the servers into 3, so are you disagreeing with yourself? eve is ONE shard, one cluster. No, we have zones, they're called systems - Proud member of the [23]. The Tachikomas are DEAD! Click sig for video.
The Wizz117	Posted - 2006.01.01 22:43:00 - [13] Edited by: The Wizz117 on 01/01/2006 22:44:57 so guild wars is not a real mmorpg? +
Risk	Posted - 2006.01.01 22:45:00 - [14] Edited by: Risk on 01/01/2006 22:46:42 Originally by: Dark Shikari Edited by: Dark Shikari on 01/01/2006 22:42:02 Originally by: Spike Firebrand Guild wars has one server (split into 3 for euro/us/korean) and easyerly has more players on it then eve has had. So how can they claim to have the most players at once when it does'nt. must be a wow tactic like how they claim to have 5 million users when its not even 10% of that. Not at all. Guild Wars doesn't have players "on" the server. It works in the same way as Diablo 2, where the clients themselves host the games, and the server media Should we say that since Battle.net has 3 million players at once that its 100 times that of EVE? Originally by: Risk for one. EVE IS A SEAMLESS GAME, there are no zones, and guildwars has zones, plus guildwars is a joke, and is what? 10% the size of eve in terms of content? and you also said that guildwars splits the servers into 3, so are you disagreeing with yourself? eve is ONE shard, one cluster. No, we have zones, they're called systems The systems are all on the same cluster.. IE: each zone isnt a server, like AO, EQ, etc. Where those games can take down that zone without effecting the rest of the game, far as i know Eve cannot do that, which is why they cant setup jita by itself to restart and block players from the zone until it restarts?
Dark Shikari	Posted - 2006.01.01 22:49:00 - [15] Originally by: Risk Edited by: Risk on 01/01/2006 22:46:42 Originally by: Dark Shikari Edited by: Dark Shikari on 01/01/2006 22:42:02 Originally by: Spike Firebrand Guild wars has one server (split into 3 for euro/us/korean) and easyerly has more players on it then eve has had. So how can they claim to have the most players at once when it does'nt. must be a wow tactic like how they claim to have 5 million users when its not even 10% of that. Not at all. Guild Wars doesn't have players "on" the server. It works in the same way as Diablo 2, where the clients themselves host the games, and the server media Should we say that since Battle.net has 3 million players at once that its 100 times that of EVE? Originally by: Risk for one. EVE IS A SEAMLESS GAME, there are no zones, and guildwars has zones, plus guildwars is a joke, and is what? 10% the size of eve in terms of content? and you also said that guildwars splits the servers into 3, so are you disagreeing with yourself? eve is ONE shard, one cluster. No, we have zones, they're called systems The systems are all on the same cluster.. IE: each zone isnt a server, like AO, EQ, etc. Where those games can take down that zone without effecting the rest of the game, far as i know Eve cannot do that, which is why they cant setup jita by itself to restart and block players from the zone until it restarts? Oh, I thought you meant "zones" like two areas of the game, not zones you have to restart to get to. - Proud member of the [23]. The Tachikomas are DEAD! Click sig for video.
Dark Shikari	Posted - 2006.01.01 22:49:00 - [16] Originally by: The Wizz117 Edited by: The Wizz117 on 01/01/2006 22:44:57 so guild wars is not a real mmorpg? + Nope its not. They even say in their FAQ that it isn't. Its just Diablo 2 with a 3D chat room. - Proud member of the [23]. The Tachikomas are DEAD! Click sig for video.
Saul Thrace	Posted - 2006.01.01 23:40:00 - [17] Quote: No, we have zones, they're called systems I agree (and yes I did read the replies to that post as well). Take that example: I'm being chased by a monster in in a big field with some mountains coming up. I advance to the middle of the field, towards the mountains. Unknown to me, by the time I cross an 'invisible line' in the middle of the field, my requests and actions are handled by a completely different machine than the one I was on previously. Still, I can turn around and see the world from the previous system I was in and see the same monster, still chasing me, now also crossing this invisible boundary seemlessly. Now the above is an example of what people usually imagine when they talk about 'seamless' and 'shardless'. In Eve: 1) each system is basically its own world, and from what I understand its own server (as in 'hardware', its own machine). That it can't be restarted on its own doesn't make it less so - and for a cluster that doesn't sound brilliant either. 2) We all know there's a hard limit as to how many people can realisticly be in a system. If the Eve hardware was really acting as one big machine, then resources (cluster nodes) could be balanced out and made to good use where they are needed. AFAIK that is not the case at the moment. 3) Don't get me started about deadspace. If that's not and instanced environment, then what is? Don't get me wrong, I'm not blasting Eve here - it's the best MMORPG out there as far as I'm concerned. Plus for the record, I don't know of any game that's not using shards, instances and zones. But it's true that the '20k simulateneous players' claims confused me a great deal at first. I was imagining gigantic space battles with one thousand ships on each side. After all, why not, since the hype is about '20k SIMULTANEOUS' players. But we all know that 200 players in a node slows it down, and 400 renders it painful to play on. In fact there's a thread somewhere about unplayable 0.0 systems with only 80 ships on screen. My two cents only, of course :-) -- Saul Thrace
Mantar Mattox	Posted - 2006.01.01 23:47:00 - [18] Quick facts - EVE has actually had 21000 people online at the same time. However CCP doesn't count trials - WOW servers had up to 5000 people at the same time until they changed it due to all the ****ty lag, now it's approx 3000 people - Guild Wars hasn't got a 'server', people host the servers on their machines Just summing it up :P ---My brain is hung like a horse---
Dark Shikari	Posted - 2006.01.01 23:52:00 - [19] Originally by: Saul Thrace 3) Don't get me started about deadspace. If that's not and instanced environment, then what is? No, it actually isn't. If someone else gates into the complex with you, he'll see you and can shoot you. Each system is just as seperate a zone as in any other game. In World of Warcraft, if you keep running one direction, it will do just as you said. In EVE, its exactly the same thing, except using stargates. There's no difference whatsoever. The difference is in EVE, all those players can interact at the same time. They use the same market, the same chat, and fight the same battles. They can influence each other. On different shards, you can't. - Proud member of the [23]. The Tachikomas are DEAD! Click sig for video.
Nyphur	Posted - 2006.01.01 23:58:00 - [20] Originally by: Spike Firebrand Guild wars has one server (split into 3 for euro/us/korean) and easyerly has more players on it then eve has had. So how can they claim to have the most players at once when it does'nt. must be a wow tactic like how they claim to have 5 million users when its not even 10% of that. Guild wars is the most sharded MMO there is. I don't even know if it qualifies as an MMO.

Discorporation	Posted - 2006.01.01 23:59:00 - [21] Guildwars isn't an MMOG [Now with MIND BULLETS!]
Jenny Spitfire	Posted - 2006.01.02 00:02:00 - [22] Originally by: Discorporation Guildwars isn't an MMOG Yep, TBH. Dunno why Guildwars is on MMORPG.com ---------------- RecruitMe@NOINT!
Jenny Spitfire	Posted - 2006.01.02 00:03:00 - [23] Originally by: Mantar Mattox Edited by: Mantar Mattox on 01/01/2006 23:57:14 Quick facts - EVE has actually had 21000 people online at the same time. However CCP doesn't count trials - WOW servers had up to 5000 people at the same time until they changed it due to all the **ty lag, now it's approx 3000 people - Guild Wars hasn't got a 'server', people host the servers on their machines - When the new server comes, EVE will most likely have the single most powerful MMO server to date. Just summing it up :P Hmmmm... I think the optimal for WoW is probably between 1500 to 2000 ppl per server. Think it was much better during the beta though. ---------------- RecruitMe@NOINT!**
Joshua Foiritain	Posted - 2006.01.02 00:04:00 - [24] Edited by: Joshua Foiritain on 02/01/2006 00:05:00 Originally by: The Wizz117 but 1 shard in WOW has 30000 to 50000 players at the same time. so the whole eve-shard record is diseafe? Online at once records for wow lie at +/-10k afaik. Originally by: Risk 12000 cant be right.. It doesnt mean its 12k on every single server, according to my wow whoring class mates theres a few really busy servers which do hang at just over 10k online at once. Of course, these are lag central ------------- [AUCTION] FULLGRADE HALO SET!
Steven Dynahir	Posted - 2006.01.02 08:20:00 - [25] Originally by: Risk for one. EVE IS A SEAMLESS GAME, there are no zones, and guildwars has zones, plus guildwars is a joke, and is what? 10% the size of eve in terms of content? and you also said that guildwars splits the servers into 3, so are you disagreeing with yourself? eve is ONE shard, one cluster. Seamless? Nah.. Last time I checked there were thousands of these litlle instances, where you can move to other instances in certain fixed places. --- Home, sweet home.
Nyphur	Posted - 2006.01.02 08:37:00 - [26] Originally by: Steven Dynahir Originally by: Risk for one. EVE IS A SEAMLESS GAME, there are no zones, and guildwars has zones, plus guildwars is a joke, and is what? 10% the size of eve in terms of content? and you also said that guildwars splits the servers into 3, so are you disagreeing with yourself? eve is ONE shard, one cluster. Seamless? Nah.. Last time I checked there were thousands of these litlle instances, where you can move to other instances in certain fixed places. The idea is that everyone is in the same game world. An instance is when you can have multiple copies of the same area to decrease load. If everquest had one server and a maximum of a single copy of each zone, it would be shardless. If eve were to be instanced, you'd have a Yulai II opening when Yulai got too packed.
Kuolematon	Posted - 2006.01.02 10:27:00 - [27] Back in days when I played AO, they had nifty system where they put you on different instanses on places if they got packed. Like entering popular area, f. ex. newbie area there was like 20 different instanses running just to easy server load and reduce lag but all players were able to interact with each other. Nice system indeed Azuriel Talloth: If it ain't broke, change it so it mildly annoys the playerbase
ildra	Posted - 2006.01.02 10:39:00 - [28] Originally by: The Wizz117 but 1 shard in WOW has 30000 to 50000 players at the same time. so the whole eve-shard record is diseafe? i dont think a WoW server can even handle 3000 players.
skullzer	Posted - 2006.01.02 11:06:00 - [29] Eve is kind of sharded. Your on a different shard in each constellation or sometimes solar systems. It's just that some game elements can be shared across those shards e.g. market and chat and you can move from one shard to another. Stargates shift you around the hundreds of shards. Put 21k players in the Jita shard and see what happens. As we have seen an Eve shard can maybe handle about 300 players before it becomes unplayable.
Skaar Corhaic	Posted - 2006.01.02 13:09:00 - [30] Originally by: skullzer Eve is kind of sharded. Your on a different shard in each constellation or sometimes solar systems. It's just that some game elements can be shared across those shards e.g. market and chat and you can move from one shard to another. Stargates shift you around the hundreds of shards. Put 21k players in the Jita shard and see what happens. As we have seen an Eve shard can maybe handle about 300 players before it becomes unplayable. Yes but I think that meaning of word "shard" associated to MMOG was defined for the first time in Ultima Online so you should use this meaning. And that is completely separated worlds (see UO intro).



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