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JC Anderson
Noir. Noir. Mercenary Group
965
|
Posted - 2013.11.21 23:35:00 -
[241] - Quote
As a side note, it would be kind of cool as an alternative if there was a new module that only inty's could use that is an interdiction nullifier. That way you would weigh your options on whether to use it or not, and the decision to fit would mean you'd have to remove something else. Much like interdiction nullified t3's. Hell could even reduce your scan res or something. On an inty it would make the decision to fit one or not a big one.
Again, I think they are fine as being nullified across the board as they are now, but at least something like that would be a good compromise. |
Alaekessa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc. Interstellar Murder of Crows
118
|
Posted - 2013.11.21 23:40:00 -
[242] - Quote
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:CCP Fozzie and CCP Rise then went on to talk about features coming out with Rubicon, EvE's winter expansion:
While many of the ideas were pretty nifty, this little gem came out:
Interceptor changes: bubble immunity planned. Interdiction nullified, basically. Dropping average HP a little bit, very small cargo bays.
I'm sorry, but Interdiction Nullified ships are generally a BAD thing (i.e. too safe). Furthermore, giving Nullified to fast aligning interceptors is over-the-line, unless the Nullifier mechanics are revised.
Reason 1:
Interceptors are generally sent ahead of fleet to "catch" targets. This includes purposely warping them into bubbles where enemy "traps are", with the intention of tackling targets before they can run. This has mixed results depending on the inty pilot skills, but by making inties nullified, you prevent using this tactic!!! Reason 2: This is a dumbing down of the game. It allows inty pilots that stupidly warp gate-to-gate when hostiles are in system, rather than using bookmarks and celestials, to move about more safely. Nullsec travel already has covert ops ships, interdiction nullified ships, and MJD-cloak BSs to move around nullsec very safely. Interceptors themselves are currently very adept at navigating unhindered through nullsec, so why would we want to make them even safer? Reason 3: The number one method to gank inties is to surprise the gate-to-gate traveler with a drag bubble. This is a great way to catch scouts for a gang, which is very accessible even to very young solo frigate pilots. At the end of the day, serious gate campers will still use sensor boosted tacklers to catch inties before they warp, so this really won't really change your big gate camps. Instead, you are encouraging carebears to bubble wrap their systems gates, as a cheap inty will get them through the gate if they desire. making travel safer, especially for the "I don't know how to avoid drag bubbles" crowd. helping inties infringe on the covops role, by making it easier for inties to navigate hostile groups. Potential change to the Interdiciton Nullifier System that could balance out interdiction nullified inties: A long time ago, Interdiction Nullified subsystems were "accidentallied" by CCP, such that a nullified cruiser could warp out of a bubble, but if warped to a celestial with a bubble on it, they'd still be affected by the bubbles pull. P.S. Since most people seem to misunderstand my point: This isn't about "wah my bubble camps can be bypassed". This is about WHY ARE WE MAKING NULLSEC TRAVEL SAFER AND EASIER. We already have covops and nullified t3's for the risk adverse carebears. Why add inties to that list?
C'mon CCP, let us suicide gank the high-sec pub matches in Dust..... |
PotatoOverdose
Handsome Millionaire Playboys
657
|
Posted - 2013.11.21 23:41:00 -
[243] - Quote
On the one hand, the interceptor changes are really fun.
On the other hand, a rtarded monkey can now fly across all of null in complete safety in an inty, especially if they fit nanos/inertial stabs/wcs to their inty. Oh and celestial bounces counter the smartbomb argument completely.
Objectively, travel across swathes of null has been dumbed down significantly. But it's fun. The change is probably more good than bad. |
destiny2
Perkone Caldari State
275
|
Posted - 2013.11.21 23:49:00 -
[244] - Quote
new inty changes are ok. i havent had a problem while carrier ratting and a inty comes floating around, i love flying them,. however havein their new abilitys allows camps and fleets to get that 1 juicy kill that always gets away. |
Nyancat Audeles
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
642
|
Posted - 2013.11.21 23:52:00 -
[245] - Quote
Grey Beard wrote:Solution :
Do something other then camping gates.
Quoted for truth
|
Chopper Rollins
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
327
|
Posted - 2013.11.22 00:03:00 -
[246] - Quote
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:...WHY ARE WE MAKING NULLSEC TRAVEL SAFER AND EASIER...
To make nullsec travel safer and easier.
Goggles. Making me look good. Making you look good. |
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed Agony Empire
2913
|
Posted - 2013.11.22 00:16:00 -
[247] - Quote
Chopper Rollins wrote:Gizznitt Malikite wrote:...WHY ARE WE MAKING NULLSEC TRAVEL SAFER AND EASIER... To make nullsec travel safer and easier.
uh huh.... it's certainly made ascertaining Cyno inhibitor BPO's and the like much easier... And I've personally traveled through about 300 hostile systems in the last 3 days, easily avoiding home defense fleets while ganking any and all ratters that take more than 13 seconds to get into warp! |
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed Agony Empire
2913
|
Posted - 2013.11.22 00:20:00 -
[248] - Quote
Alaekessa wrote: CovOps, T3's and now interceptors too are not just for risk adverse carebears.
They're also for people who want to slip your camps and cyno/covert cyno their fleet into your space.
If you ask me, that sounds like the exact opposite of what risk adverse carebears would do.
I find it highly amusing how quickly accusations of being a carebear are thrown around here, one might think that carebears are the only people playing Eve.
I've been flying the hell out of inties the last couple days.... they are fun, and they are the utlimate get-away ships. Our gangs of inties simply bypass home defense fleets as if they never bothered to form up. We engage that which we believe we have a chance to kill, and bypass everything else.
The problem is, it is very easy to avoid any and all fights when flying these ships, which makes them the quintessential ship for the risk adverse! |
Abdullah Bahdoon
Somali Initiative for Dialogue and Posting
5
|
Posted - 2013.11.22 00:37:00 -
[249] - Quote
Well... since you don't like interceptors anyway, can I have your Taranis ? |
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed Agony Empire
2913
|
Posted - 2013.11.22 00:40:00 -
[250] - Quote
Abdullah Bahdoon wrote:Well... since you don't like interceptors anyway, can I have your Taranis ?
I think you misunderstand me.... I ******* LOVE interceptors... I just firmly believe that having them interdiction nullified is too much... |
|
Alaekessa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc. Interstellar Murder of Crows
118
|
Posted - 2013.11.22 00:43:00 -
[251] - Quote
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:Alaekessa wrote: CovOps, T3's and now interceptors too are not just for risk adverse carebears.
They're also for people who want to slip your camps and cyno/covert cyno their fleet into your space.
If you ask me, that sounds like the exact opposite of what risk adverse carebears would do.
I find it highly amusing how quickly accusations of being a carebear are thrown around here, one might think that carebears are the only people playing Eve.
I've been flying the hell out of inties the last couple days.... they are fun, and they are the utlimate get-away ships. Our gangs of inties simply bypass home defense fleets as if they never bothered to form up. We engage that which we believe we have a chance to kill, and bypass everything else. The problem is, it is very easy to avoid any and all fights when flying these ships, which makes them the quintessential ship for the risk adverse! Roving death squads sounds like a lot of fun.
However, I am of the opinion that they will only be the "quintessential ship for the risk adverse" until home defense fleets figure out the appropriate counter (I saw someone suggest smartbombing bubble camps, just need to forget about the bubbles and use appropriately sized ships to maximize bombing profile. C'mon CCP, let us suicide gank the high-sec pub matches in Dust..... |
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed Agony Empire
2913
|
Posted - 2013.11.22 00:47:00 -
[252] - Quote
Alaekessa wrote:Gizznitt Malikite wrote:Alaekessa wrote: CovOps, T3's and now interceptors too are not just for risk adverse carebears.
They're also for people who want to slip your camps and cyno/covert cyno their fleet into your space.
If you ask me, that sounds like the exact opposite of what risk adverse carebears would do.
I find it highly amusing how quickly accusations of being a carebear are thrown around here, one might think that carebears are the only people playing Eve.
I've been flying the hell out of inties the last couple days.... they are fun, and they are the utlimate get-away ships. Our gangs of inties simply bypass home defense fleets as if they never bothered to form up. We engage that which we believe we have a chance to kill, and bypass everything else. The problem is, it is very easy to avoid any and all fights when flying these ships, which makes them the quintessential ship for the risk adverse! Roving death squads sounds like a lot of fun. However, I am of the opinion that they will only be the "quintessential ship for the risk adverse" until home defense fleets figure out the appropriate counter (I saw someone suggest smartbombing bubble camps, just need to forget about the bubbles and use appropriately sized ships to maximize bombing profile.
I've lead more than a few large frigate roams, and generally speaking, smart bombing BS's may get a few kills, after which they die to the rest of the gang they failed to destroy. |
Alaekessa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc. Interstellar Murder of Crows
118
|
Posted - 2013.11.22 00:51:00 -
[253] - Quote
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:Alaekessa wrote:Gizznitt Malikite wrote:Alaekessa wrote: CovOps, T3's and now interceptors too are not just for risk adverse carebears.
They're also for people who want to slip your camps and cyno/covert cyno their fleet into your space.
If you ask me, that sounds like the exact opposite of what risk adverse carebears would do.
I find it highly amusing how quickly accusations of being a carebear are thrown around here, one might think that carebears are the only people playing Eve.
I've been flying the hell out of inties the last couple days.... they are fun, and they are the utlimate get-away ships. Our gangs of inties simply bypass home defense fleets as if they never bothered to form up. We engage that which we believe we have a chance to kill, and bypass everything else. The problem is, it is very easy to avoid any and all fights when flying these ships, which makes them the quintessential ship for the risk adverse! Roving death squads sounds like a lot of fun. However, I am of the opinion that they will only be the "quintessential ship for the risk adverse" until home defense fleets figure out the appropriate counter (I saw someone suggest smartbombing bubble camps, just need to forget about the bubbles and use appropriately sized ships to maximize bombing profile. I've lead more than a few large frigate roams, and generally speaking, smart bombing BS's may get a few kills, after which they die to the rest of the gang they failed to destroy. They obviously haven't been utilizing the appropriate fleet comp then. C'mon CCP, let us suicide gank the high-sec pub matches in Dust..... |
Leigh Akiga
Trickle Down Economics
350
|
Posted - 2013.11.22 01:04:00 -
[254] - Quote
Congratulations on making sure the last remnants of people actually living in 0.0 move out CCP |
Knights Armament
But I p0op from there
112
|
Posted - 2013.11.22 01:21:00 -
[255] - Quote
PotatoOverdose wrote:On the one hand, the interceptor changes are really fun.
On the other hand, a rtarded monkey can now fly across all of null in complete safety in an inty, especially if they fit nanos/inertial stabs/wcs to their inty. Oh and celestial bounces counter the smartbomb argument completely.
Objectively, travel across swathes of null has been dumbed down significantly. But it's fun. The change is probably more good than bad.
This is a good thing, less people in empire, more people in null. https://secure.eveonline.com/trial/?invc=29554516-05f9-4eca-a942-32e1701a6569&action=buddy |
Damsyl
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
7
|
Posted - 2013.11.22 03:56:00 -
[256] - Quote
Leigh Akiga wrote:Congratulations on making sure the last remnants of people actually living in 0.0 move out CCP
Knights Armament wrote:This is a good thing, less people in empire, more people in null.
So these amazing nullified interceptors are responsible for making nullsec residents move out, and empire residents move in to nullsec. I think I get it.
|
Decian Cor
Disconnected. Moon Warriors
50
|
Posted - 2013.11.22 04:49:00 -
[257] - Quote
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:
I've been flying the hell out of inties the last couple days.... they are fun, and they are the utlimate get-away ships. Our gangs of inties simply bypass home defense fleets as if they never bothered to form up. We engage that which we believe we have a chance to kill, and bypass everything else because we are so super amazing. Did I mention my e-peen? It's Huge.
The problem is, it is very easy to avoid any and all fights when flying these ships, which makes them the quintessential ship for the risk adverse!
After the 5th or so time you brought up your awesome death dealing, home defense avoiding, super fast and cool Inty fleet, I determined you would like a cookie.
And nobody really wants to give you a cookie. "There is no good and evil. There is only power, and those too weak to seek it."
Unfiltered for the masses. |
Black Canary Jnr
Kongsberg Vaapenfabrikk Amarr branch. Sev3rance
41
|
Posted - 2013.11.22 05:15:00 -
[258] - Quote
Should inties be nullified? Yes and no.
Against anchorable bubbles? Yes. Why? Because these are primarily used in risk free actions such as bubbling ratting system gates to hell and back and occassionally cloaky/ sniper camping. These actions allow people to avoid engagements if they so please to.
Against dictor bubbles? Hell no. If you are fielding a dictor you are putting a squishy target into the enemies sights, 7k, 8k ehp is not alot. Further more these rely on someone hitting that button at the right time to drag people or bubble a gate. Dictor probes are also relatively small, about 20km ish radius, nothing to an intie. It's not an 'i win' button by any means, it is a way to open a window for engagement with a currently unengageable ship type.
And there is the problem, intie fleets are currently unengageable between their 4k plus speeds and instawarping combined with nullification. There is one counter i can think of and has a low chance of success; cloaky recons around a bait ship. Even after the effort of setting it up inties still have an 8 second window to slip point and warp. It should be noted that this is dependent on them engaging you, which is why i am for non-nullification against dictors, because without it roaming gangs, and most defence gangs, cannot even consider engaging interceptors.
My 2 cents.
Till next time fly safe and fly inty. |
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
3658
|
Posted - 2013.11.22 05:29:00 -
[259] - Quote
People who think inties are OP claiming that they are ganking the crap out of everything with fleets of inties in an attempt at reverse psychology.
As if anybody is going to care about botters and AFK miners in lowsec (all 3 or 4 of them).
Nice try.
|
Cynter DeVries
Spheroidal Projections
688
|
Posted - 2013.11.22 05:41:00 -
[260] - Quote
Tactically Enhanced Acceptably Rebalanced Ships Cynter's Law of feature suggestion: Thou shalt not suggest NPCs do something players could do instead. |
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Karrl Tian
Bourbon Bandits Anarchy.
262
|
Posted - 2013.11.22 06:21:00 -
[261] - Quote
It's EVE with Tom Cruise and Kenny Loggins. |
James Amril-Kesh
4S Corporation Goonswarm Federation
6267
|
Posted - 2013.11.22 06:28:00 -
[262] - Quote
Interdiction nullified interceptors are a counter to the fact that your ratting ship can now refit for self-defense if necessary. EVE Online - A Rigged Game |
Ari 2M
Fulminata XII
0
|
Posted - 2013.11.22 09:10:00 -
[263] - Quote
James Amril-Kesh wrote:Interdiction nullified interceptors are a counter to the fact that your ratting ship can now refit for self-defense if necessary.
It won't work, because... it simply won't. What any ship can do against a gang of interceptors? 15-20 of them? They will melt it with ease. I don't afraid of a single "catching" interceptor. I can deal with it. But the threat of gangs makes me scratch my head.
http://vimeo.com/79857329# |
Baali Tekitsu
B0SSAURA xXPlease Pandemic Citizens Reloaded Alliance.Xx
415
|
Posted - 2013.11.22 09:18:00 -
[264] - Quote
Ari 2M wrote:James Amril-Kesh wrote:Interdiction nullified interceptors are a counter to the fact that your ratting ship can now refit for self-defense if necessary. It won't work, because... it simply won't. What any ship can do against a gang of interceptors? 15-20 of them? They will melt it with ease. I don't afraid of a single "catching" interceptor. I can deal with it. But the threat of gangs makes me scratch my head. http://vimeo.com/79857329#
Nobody should be able to counter the combined effort of 15-20 people with ease. You will however counter up to 10 inties with an active thanked Ishtar for instance. RATE LIKE SUBSCRIBE |
Ari 2M
Fulminata XII
0
|
Posted - 2013.11.22 09:29:00 -
[265] - Quote
Baali Tekitsu wrote:Nobody should be able to counter the combined effort of 15-20 people with ease. You will however counter up to 10 inties with an active thanked Ishtar for instance.
Er... you did't get my point. I was talking about gangs of 15-20 people who can almost instawarp to you and they're immune to bubbles. See? T3s have nullifiers too, but they're relatively slow. Interceptors aren't. So. We live in interesting times. A week ago you could engage somebody, because his friends were 3 jumps away. Now they can join their mate in less than 1 minute and kill the killer, lol
Not to mention logintraps etc... :) It's time to think really hard and work it out, how to deal with new rules. I can live with extremely fast interceptors. They were made for it. But i'm not sure about their bubble immunity. |
Ari 2M
Fulminata XII
0
|
Posted - 2013.11.22 09:41:00 -
[266] - Quote
Also, just to make my point even more clear. Are interceptors overpowered these days? And the answer is: yes, they defnitely are. You know why? Because they're cheap! :) Nullified t3s are expensive and slow. Inties are cheap and fast :D |
OldWolf69
IR0N. SpaceMonkey's Alliance
90
|
Posted - 2013.11.22 10:37:00 -
[267] - Quote
It is really fun. As long you fly the Interceptor. |
Little Dragon Khamez
Guardians of the Underworld White Mountain Coalition
571
|
Posted - 2013.11.22 10:51:00 -
[268] - Quote
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:*edit Post Rubicon Update* While I still believe interdiciton nullified Inties are way over the top.... I'm having a blast using them! I've killed carriers, bastion mode marauders, tons of ishtars... and the kills will keep on coming. It takes hardly any time to zoom across nullsec in a fleet of inties. We can shotgun systems to greatly improve the likelihood of catching someone, and I have yet to meet a "home defense fleet" that we can't just zip on by and completely ignore. I strongly suggest CCP removes Inty Nullification, or limits the abilities of nullified inties.... these things are ridiculous right now!
/post rubicon update
CCP Fozzie and CCP Rise then went on to talk about features coming out with Rubicon, EvE's winter expansion:
While many of the ideas were pretty nifty, this little gem came out:
Interceptor changes: bubble immunity planned. Interdiction nullified, basically. Dropping average HP a little bit, very small cargo bays.
I'm sorry, but Interdiction Nullified ships are generally a BAD thing (i.e. too safe). Furthermore, giving Nullified to fast aligning interceptors is over-the-line, unless the Nullifier mechanics are revised.
Reason 1:
Interceptors are generally sent ahead of fleet to "catch" targets. This includes purposely warping them into bubbles where enemy "traps are", with the intention of tackling targets before they can run. This has mixed results depending on the inty pilot skills, but by making inties nullified, you prevent using this tactic!!! Reason 2: This is a dumbing down of the game. It allows inty pilots that stupidly warp gate-to-gate when hostiles are in system, rather than using bookmarks and celestials, to move about more safely. Nullsec travel already has covert ops ships, interdiction nullified ships, and MJD-cloak BSs to move around nullsec very safely. Interceptors themselves are currently very adept at navigating unhindered through nullsec, so why would we want to make them even safer? Reason 3: The number one method to gank inties is to surprise the gate-to-gate traveler with a drag bubble. This is a great way to catch scouts for a gang, which is very accessible even to very young solo frigate pilots. At the end of the day, serious gate campers will still use sensor boosted tacklers to catch inties before they warp, so this really won't really change your big gate camps. Instead, you are encouraging carebears to bubble wrap their systems gates, as a cheap inty will get them through the gate if they desire. making travel safer, especially for the "I don't know how to avoid drag bubbles" crowd. helping inties infringe on the covops role, by making it easier for inties to navigate hostile groups. Potential change to the Interdiciton Nullifier System that could balance out interdiction nullified inties: A long time ago, Interdiction Nullified subsystems were "accidentallied" by CCP, such that a nullified cruiser could warp out of a bubble, but if warped to a celestial with a bubble on it, they'd still be affected by the bubbles pull. P.S. Since most people seem to misunderstand my point: This isn't about "wah my bubble camps can be bypassed". This is about WHY ARE WE MAKING NULLSEC TRAVEL SAFER AND EASIER. We already have covops and nullified t3's for the risk adverse carebears. Why add inties to that list?
I am enjoying mine, really happy with it.
PS. I also afk cloak... Dumbing down of Eve Online will result in it's destruction... |
Abrazzar
Vardaugas Family
2159
|
Posted - 2013.11.22 11:07:00 -
[269] - Quote
The only real issue may be that interceptors may intrude on covops in their role as scouting ships. And secure low volume transportation.
For ratting, just set up bookmarks at the opposite side of the belt warp in and you'll have a few more seconds to warp off, even if the interceptor warps to the belt you are in first thing at jump in. Saved me more than once. Sovereignty and Population New Mining Mechanics |
Faenir Antollare
University of Caille Gallente Federation
153
|
Posted - 2013.11.22 11:11:00 -
[270] - Quote
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:*edit Post Rubicon Update* While I still believe interdiciton nullified Inties are way over the top.... I'm having a blast using them! I've killed carriers, bastion mode marauders, tons of ishtars... and the kills will keep on coming. It takes hardly any time to zoom across nullsec in a fleet of inties. We can shotgun systems to greatly improve the likelihood of catching someone, and I have yet to meet a "home defense fleet" that we can't just zip on by and completely ignore. I strongly suggest CCP removes Inty Nullification, or limits the abilities of nullified inties.... these things are ridiculous right now!
/post rubicon update
CCP Fozzie and CCP Rise then went on to talk about features coming out with Rubicon, EvE's winter expansion:
While many of the ideas were pretty nifty, this little gem came out:
Interceptor changes: bubble immunity planned. Interdiction nullified, basically. Dropping average HP a little bit, very small cargo bays.
I'm sorry, but Interdiction Nullified ships are generally a BAD thing (i.e. too safe). Furthermore, giving Nullified to fast aligning interceptors is over-the-line, unless the Nullifier mechanics are revised.
Reason 1:
Interceptors are generally sent ahead of fleet to "catch" targets. This includes purposely warping them into bubbles where enemy "traps are", with the intention of tackling targets before they can run. This has mixed results depending on the inty pilot skills, but by making inties nullified, you prevent using this tactic!!! Reason 2: This is a dumbing down of the game. It allows inty pilots that stupidly warp gate-to-gate when hostiles are in system, rather than using bookmarks and celestials, to move about more safely. Nullsec travel already has covert ops ships, interdiction nullified ships, and MJD-cloak BSs to move around nullsec very safely. Interceptors themselves are currently very adept at navigating unhindered through nullsec, so why would we want to make them even safer? Reason 3: The number one method to gank inties is to surprise the gate-to-gate traveler with a drag bubble. This is a great way to catch scouts for a gang, which is very accessible even to very young solo frigate pilots. At the end of the day, serious gate campers will still use sensor boosted tacklers to catch inties before they warp, so this really won't really change your big gate camps. Instead, you are encouraging carebears to bubble wrap their systems gates, as a cheap inty will get them through the gate if they desire. making travel safer, especially for the "I don't know how to avoid drag bubbles" crowd. helping inties infringe on the covops role, by making it easier for inties to navigate hostile groups. Potential change to the Interdiciton Nullifier System that could balance out interdiction nullified inties: A long time ago, Interdiction Nullified subsystems were "accidentallied" by CCP, such that a nullified cruiser could warp out of a bubble, but if warped to a celestial with a bubble on it, they'd still be affected by the bubbles pull. P.S. Since most people seem to misunderstand my point: This isn't about "wah my bubble camps can be bypassed". This is about WHY ARE WE MAKING NULLSEC TRAVEL SAFER AND EASIER. We already have covops and nullified t3's for the risk adverse carebears. Why add inties to that list?
EvE-O-Lution Dude, try getting on it. Any fast riders ?
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