I think the biggest issue with Solo battleships is that as soon as you are reported every man and their dog comes out of the wood work to kill you..

And while fun its too easy to get whelped when compared to Frig/BC solo

Do answers relating to alliance fleet doctrines count

You can get like thousands of the same answer in that case.

Think of it sorta like Real Life. In the reals, battleship type vessels would get destroyed, if caught alone during combat. A battleship in a fleet, though, is a major force multiplier.

I fly battleships in PvE simply because they are harder to gank. Outside the "safety" of hisec I only use battleships to bridge covops around.

I can't imagine trying to roam lowsec in a BS without a few dozen of my closest friends. Which I don't have yet. Even then, a Gila or the new SOE cruiser will provide similar DPS in a significantly more mobile platform.

Dont need to go into every last one, but some examples of doctrine that battleships are used would be helpful

I use my Megathron, all the time, its fine how it is, If you touch it ill cut you, and sure it could be cheaper.

I only undock my Battleships when I got a small fleet after me. Or when I'm close to my HQ where they are docked and I noticed a target in a battleship. They dont get alot of kills so if my BS's can get one it's always nice.

Depending on the fleet setup I would undock the best BS for that setup... weather it be a Vindi/Bhaal/ArmorMAC.

Aside from that I don't use them for much anything else. PVE is a foreign concept for me.

So things have died down on the forums a bit from all that other controversy (looking at you SOMER), I wanted to bring up something for discussion to see where this stands exactly. I've always been a fan of the hyperion everyone knows that, but what strikes me odd is that people seem to really avoid this class of ship, so I was wondering if I could get some community feedback on this subject.

1.How often would you say you use a battleship outside of PVE?
a.What role do you use it as
b.Do you find it as effective as the other classes of ships
c.If you dont use a battleship, why dont you?

2.How do you feel about the current state of battleships?
a.Do you think they are fine as is or need some sort of work done
b.If you think they need work. what mechanic would you alter?

3.With the upcoming changes, battleships will be even slower and more cumbersome, how do you think this will effect your choice of using or not using a battleship?

4.Are there specific battleships you think need to be reworked?

5.Whens the last time you flew a battleship outside of PVE?
a.Was it solo, gang, or in a fleet?
b.Did you get blown up?
c.Did you feel that it was the right ship for the job?

6.What do you think of the prices of battleships vs other ships?
a.Is the cost to gain ratio worth it?
b.Do you hesitate to fly it in pvp because of it?

7.Lastly, what do you fear most in a battleship, what on your overview makes you wish you had chosen a different ship the second you see it?

1.
a. Blap Megathron.
b. None shall stand against the mighty Megathron.

2.
a. I think all the battleships are doing fine at the moment, except the Tempest. Tempest is just bad.

3. Doesn't matter to me. I'm in a battleship, I'm not an interceptor. My job is to get on grid and blap the crap out of stuff, surprise *********, not warping around.

4. Tempest and Fleet Tempest.

5.
a. Small Gang
b. No.
c. Hell yeah. In the words of Baltec1, "Never not Mega".

6.
a. **** expensive, but you still can't get 1300 DPS and 60k raw armor out of a Proteus. Worth everything.
b. Nope.

7. Fast Kitey cruisers who have loki boosts.

What would it take to get you to fly them more often? What about them makes you avoid them?

Did I say I avoid using them? They are not practical to hunt with unless you know what your facing when you head out to them? I like using them but they are there for very specific jobs and engagements.

I prefer flying my T3/T2 cruisers since they are quick, can lock fast, have Battleship Tanks and better with decent DPS.

I use my ships based on their abilities. Not because it is a certain hull.

So things have died down on the forums a bit from all that other controversy (looking at you SOMER), I wanted to bring up something for discussion to see where this stands exactly. I've always been a fan of the hyperion everyone knows that, but what strikes me odd is that people seem to really avoid this class of ship, so I was wondering if I could get some community feedback on this subject.

1.How often would you say you use a battleship outside of PVE?
a.What role do you use it as
b.Do you find it as effective as the other classes of ships
c.If you dont use a battleship, why dont you?

2.How do you feel about the current state of battleships?
a.Do you think they are fine as is or need some sort of work done
b.If you think they need work. what mechanic would you alter?

3.With the upcoming changes, battleships will be even slower and more cumbersome, how do you think this will effect your choice of using or not using a battleship?

4.Are there specific battleships you think need to be reworked?

5.Whens the last time you flew a battleship outside of PVE?
a.Was it solo, gang, or in a fleet?
b.Did you get blown up?
c.Did you feel that it was the right ship for the job?

6.What do you think of the prices of battleships vs other ships?
a.Is the cost to gain ratio worth it?
b.Do you hesitate to fly it in pvp because of it?

7.Lastly, what do you fear most in a battleship, what on your overview makes you wish you had chosen a different ship the second you see it?

1. POS bashes and gatecamps. That's about it, really.

2. Not enough output given their situational vulnerability. Not much wrong with their tank.

3. It won't. An Armageddon camps a gate just as effectively as before.

4. The ones that use their highslots for damage. But then, you could argue that's a problem with large guns, not battleship hulls themselves.

5. POS bash. Got my ass kicked, too. Unlike most of my major lossmails, this one is actually on this character. That was a pretty good fight, getting the Vindi made up for our entire losses lol. The guy was majorly PO'ed.

6. Their cost is fine.

Really, the only T1 battleships of mine that sees serious use outside of ship spinning because they're pretty (I LOVE the Typhoon model) are my Armageddon for camping, my Navy Apocalypse for missioning (lately anyway, I love that hull).

Most of the rest of the time in a PvP situation, there is a better tool for the job. I don't begrudge that, that's just how it is.

So you would say that current battleships can have their jobs done just as well in other classes?

I prefer flying my T3/T2 cruisers since they are quick, can lock fast, have Battleship Tanks and better with decent DPS.

I use my ships based on their abilities. Not because it is a certain hull.

Seriously? What is wrong with you? I gather English is not your 1st, 2nd, 3rd or 4th language.

If that was the case I would not have battleships at all. I said they are there for very specific engagements and jobs. But I would not use a battleship to hunt a Cruiser since it is just not practical. But if multiple cruisers came after me then I would jump into a Vindi for example to web them one by one to quickly pop them.

when the HRML comes out i will be using the Armageddon alot more than i already do for solo pvp

So things have died down on the forums a bit from all that other controversy (looking at you SOMER), I wanted to bring up something for discussion to see where this stands exactly. I've always been a fan of the hyperion everyone knows that, but what strikes me odd is that people seem to really avoid this class of ship, so I was wondering if I could get some community feedback on this subject.

1.How often would you say you use a battleship outside of PVE?
a.What role do you use it as
b.Do you find it as effective as the other classes of ships
c.If you dont use a battleship, why dont you?

2.How do you feel about the current state of battleships?
a.Do you think they are fine as is or need some sort of work done
b.If you think they need work. what mechanic would you alter?

3.With the upcoming changes, battleships will be even slower and more cumbersome, how do you think this will effect your choice of using or not using a battleship?

4.Are there specific battleships you think need to be reworked?

5.Whens the last time you flew a battleship outside of PVE?
a.Was it solo, gang, or in a fleet?
b.Did you get blown up?
c.Did you feel that it was the right ship for the job?

6.What do you think of the prices of battleships vs other ships?
a.Is the cost to gain ratio worth it?
b.Do you hesitate to fly it in pvp because of it?

7.Lastly, what do you fear most in a battleship, what on your overview makes you wish you had chosen a different ship the second you see it?

*Edit* Would really appreciate if a dev would pop in just to state how they feel about the current status of battleships. I'll take a "Working as intended" or "Thinking about it" :3

1. Never not Mega
a. Everything
b. yes
c. N/A

2. Healthy
a. I have few issues
b. I only need a way to fit a jump drive and a cov ops in order to take part n cap fleets and black ops

3. Frigate fleets will be problematic but I think I can still take part in cruiser fleets.

4. Teircide has yet to be finished.

5. Never not Mega
a. I do all 3
b. On average my Mega last 4 to 6 months. Longest serving was Delve mega that served for 10 months.
c. Always

6. I remember 60 mil Mega.
a. It is what it is
b. Not at all

7. Nothing.

Do you think that needs to be changed? Or do you feel thats fine the way it is and battleships should be the niche they are currently, situational.

From the thread, you can see that people love their AFK station camping Dominix fleets, and their Megathrons. Battleships are far too expensive for me to use in PvP given the types of PvP I usually see (on this character, hisec wardecs from misguided fools desperately trying to teach me to PvP).

I can't comment on whether or how to change BS for PvP since I don't use them and don't see situations where it would make sense for me to use them.

So things have died down on the forums a bit from all that other controversy (looking at you SOMER), I wanted to bring up something for discussion to see where this stands exactly. I've always been a fan of the hyperion everyone knows that, but what strikes me odd is that people seem to really avoid this class of ship, so I was wondering if I could get some community feedback on this subject.

1.How often would you say you use a battleship outside of PVE?
a.What role do you use it as
b.Do you find it as effective as the other classes of ships
c.If you dont use a battleship, why dont you?

2.How do you feel about the current state of battleships?
a.Do you think they are fine as is or need some sort of work done
b.If you think they need work. what mechanic would you alter?

3.With the upcoming changes, battleships will be even slower and more cumbersome, how do you think this will effect your choice of using or not using a battleship?

4.Are there specific battleships you think need to be reworked?

5.Whens the last time you flew a battleship outside of PVE?
a.Was it solo, gang, or in a fleet?
b.Did you get blown up?
c.Did you feel that it was the right ship for the job?

6.What do you think of the prices of battleships vs other ships?
a.Is the cost to gain ratio worth it?
b.Do you hesitate to fly it in pvp because of it?

7.Lastly, what do you fear most in a battleship, what on your overview makes you wish you had chosen a different ship the second you see it?

*Edit* Would really appreciate if a dev would pop in just to state how they feel about the current status of battleships. I'll take a "Working as intended" or "Thinking about it" :3

1. I don't use them at all, but that's more because I cant fly any of them besides Amarr properly (Amarr BS suck for solo)
2. Overall they are fine
3. Never gonna fly without a scout again
4. TEMPEST
5. I suicided a ECCM apocalypse into a Sabre/Falcon camp, efficiency brake even favoring me because I had fat insurance payout
6. As they are insurable I would always chose to fly a Armageddon instead of a Curse , when you can fly them theyre definatly better than smaller hulls.
7. Being tackled off gate is pretty bad, everything else is fine.

1.How often would you say you use a battleship outside of PVE?

I don't use battleships for PvE. Living in a wormhole, their common use is for home defense and rolling the static

a.What role do you use it as

Neuting Bhaalgorns are probably the big one in most wormhole, with Geddons being the cheaper version.

b.Do you find it as effective as the other classes of ships

Works well for what it does with good EHP.

2.How do you feel about the current state of battleships?

a.Do you think they are fine as is or need some sort of work done

Given where I live, it would take a lot of buffs to make battleships common for me to use, to the point that they'd have to be ridiculously overpowered.

3.With the upcoming changes, battleships will be even slower and more cumbersome, how do you think this will effect your choice of using or not using a battleship?

No effect.

4.Are there specific battleships you think need to be reworked?

I'd say Raven, but the RHMLs might just turn that around. We'll see.

5.Whens the last time you flew a battleship outside of PVE?

Few days ago? Hole rolling.

a.Was it solo, gang, or in a fleet?

Gang.

b.Did you get blown up?

Nope.,

c.Did you feel that it was the right ship for the job?

Yup. Then again, that's a function of it's mass, not it's usefulness in PvP, so... v0v

Outside of nueting & sentry drone shens, BS hulls in solo/small gang PVP are outclassed. In larger fleets with multiple traige carriers & support vessels{ 90% webs, 40% painters, scram}; they'll murder pretty much any subcap fleet with ease.

What if someone gave you and your friends some free BS's to fly around it? Would you be willing to go get them blown up?

What about larger fleets, dreads , carriers , titans? Any business on that battlefield?

Yes, the get more important as supers hit the field, people don't like their big rifters being talked.

Can you elaborate?

Like any other ship, supers can be zerged down.......if you.can keep them on the field.....in order to do that you need a sub-cap fleet, and normally that would be a battleship doctrine.

Is this a response to me telling you not to fly a battleship as a month one old ?

that's ridicilous ...

Is this a response to me telling you not to fly a battleship as a month one old ?

that's ridicilous ...

C'mon, she seems to be genuine in her curiosity and her the answers to her questions are interesting enough for other newbies (like myself), too.

I can't really answer all that on my phone however I will say this about them.

They have been nerfed from something that everyone aspired to have and use in PvP to something you get to shoot red crosses with.

They are not really battleships, its just a name they have left over from the day they were actually "battleships".

A T3 has equal tank. A T3 has equal dps in most cases. A T3 has better tracking. A T3 has better lock time. A T3 has better damage mitigation. A T3 has better mobility. A T3 has better resists. A ... I could go on forever. And do the same with most other large sized ships.

I'm sneaking round null at the moment in a battleship doing combat sites. It can tank 10/10's without speed tanking, sit there pump out amazing dps. Moves fast when I need it to. Cloaks up nicely. When I uncloak it doesn't take forever to lock stuff. Its an awesome battleship - its called an Ishtar.

Ironically if I was to actually use a battleship I'd need two other RR battleships to rep the first battleship because it can't tank anywhere near as well as a HAC. Why, sig radius. Cloak? When I uncloak it takes over 45 seconds, after the 10 second delay to lock a frigate.

T3's, HACS, BC should be given battleship hull graphics and we could call them Battleships because they outclass the battleship in almost every way.

There's a few people going around that will say BS are fine but they likely sit in a group of 100 people and pop people jumping from a gate or are talking fleet which is totally different. Large fleets virtually eliminate any deficiencies in a ships performance or at least mask it enough for it not to matter.

The last time I used a battleship was in Rancer lol. I took one out to 0.0 and nobody would engage it, probably thinking it was bait, and I had a cloak on it so whenever I tried to lock someone they'd warped away way before it finished locking.

I was so annoyed I fit up a battleship in Jita and pod killed some poor guy in a suicide. Then I fit a retro bleed tank megathron and took it to Rancer to suicide. Ended up getting into a fight with 2 pies but unfortunately 15 or so PL tards decided to interrupt us.

So battleships are the tacklers of cap fleets?

:3 no, thankyou for your advice, but this was more a response to everyone i talk to say they dont fly battleships, I decided to find out why people dont fly these magnificent ships.

Do you think that needs to be changed? Or do you feel thats fine the way it is and battleships should be the niche they are currently, situational.

Seven fleets at 6VDT

I had a scan with 992 megas on grid.

They are fine as is as tools in the tool box, just find the right tool to use.

Hate to smack something down, but whatever you say, battleships are not getting changed anytime soon. They just rebalanced them in Odyssey

Edit: but I do think they are in a strong state, for both solo and fleets.

Not getting changed?
You might want to try to fly one on Sisi right now, and try to go more than 3 systems through gates.
Then get back to me on how they are not being changed in 3 weeks.

Geddon.. One of the most useful battleships there is.

And because of this you avoid solo battleship pvp? What do you think would change that?

If you had bothered to really try out the changes you would realize that Battleships are dead. No one is going to roam in a ship that warps almost as slow as a freighter. The defense force doesn't even have to form until your a jump or two away.

Battleships will be relegated to Home Defense, and ratting...

Titan drops

Ya, we are going to roll our Mach fleet, hotdrop someone twenty jumps away and then spend an hour flying back, sounds like fun right? Right?

Battleships are designed for large fleets, and that is where they shine. Like a huge herd of Wilderbeest their best defense is to form a huge blob and stick together.

However in their own or in small groups, packs of smaller more agile ships will make mincemeat of them.

Outside of sov-nullsec fleet doctrines battleships probably don't see much use outside of PVE, with the exception of the black-ops ships. Certainly, I haven't PVP'd with in a battleship since I left sov-null.

This is incorrect. They were not designed for large fleets. All ships shine in large fleets. Battleships are the only subcap that have cap like penalties and no subcap advantages. They're the only subcap combat ship that can't solo, small gang pvp well.

[quote=Infinity Ziona][quote=Speedkermit Damo]

In essence....I like big pretty ships. I want to be able to use them for more.

The warp changes are going to hurt the BS game that is for sure.

As a new player I used the dominix primarily for several reasons. The main reason is that it was a fairly cheap purchase at 46 million isk, they now sell for 150+ million isk. As a low skill point character I was able to use energy vampires or neuts and still be combat effective with ogre 2 drones, it had a great tank.

I used a dominix to tackle shrikes titan during the old campaign on my alt, and anders the famous PL pirate also used a dominix for pvp before the energy vampire nerf.


These days battleships are too slow, and expensive to bring out in pvp, no fleet commanders want them in low sec or factions. I wouldn't bother spending the isk to bring one out for solo pvp, I can't enter any plexes besides a large, and large plexes are rare.

I'd just rather fly something else, like a stealth bomber, or a tech 3 cruiser.

Battleships are pretty much where they can be. Turining them into "solo" ships is ignoring the history of why they are the way they are now.

They are strategic tools, they occupy the niche between Caps and sub caps in the same way that Battlecruisers occupy the gap between cruisers and battleships.

If you want a solo capable "big ship", battlecursiers are as good as it's going to get. As it shold be. Small ships are raiders, big ships need support.