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Valea Silpha
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Posted - 2006.03.24 03:02:00 -
[1]
CCP in the spirit of 'one persistant world' has always kept clear of instancing for the most part. Even missions which are ALMOST instance-esque things can be crashed by folks with probes if they are motivated enough. Of course this means that player have to work together or against each other in almost all aspects of game play. Excellent goal. Well applied for the most part.
However, I wonder if there is something to be said for the idea of instancing. For example, complexes are for the most part camped, and even if they aren't other casual complex go-ers will have almost certainly showed up before you and stolen all the keys. Now this is good in some ways, but bad in others, because it means that for those willing to work hard and stake out a complex to find keys and overseers and keep hitting a complex until they get the faction loot and big boutnies on the last levels. It does however presents a problem for the rest of us. I have gone a-complexing a lot recently and have never gotten further than the first level sitting on an acceleration gate waiting for keys to appear, then eventually giving up and going home.
Its because of this I have come up with the idea of semi-instanced complexes. That is to say a cross between the current mission system and the current complex system. You show up to a complex beacon and see an agent a-la COSMOS. Then , the agent gives you the key and co-ordinates for the first gate. You can then bring all your gang-mates and such with you and launch into the complex. However, should you leave the complex the first gate won't let anyone who has been 'detected' before in, but if you've picked up the level 2 key you can warp to that gate instead, and so forth.
All it needs is for CCP to define the loot tables very closly so you don't definitely get an uber drop, but you are guarenteed something tasty at the end. Maybe cap instanced complexes at 4/10 so its mainly aimed at the newer pilots out there, to give them a chance to get their hands on loot thats better than named gear, and to show them how complexes can be without having to fight much more experianced players.
What do people think ?
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MysticNZ
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Posted - 2006.03.24 03:06:00 -
[2]
I don't think you should be able to enter a complex once someone is in it. Complex camping sucks at happens at every complex, which is why I've done them maybe 3 times.
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You got pwnd by us too :P - Wrangler
lol - Imaran |
Stahlregen
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Posted - 2006.03.24 03:08:00 -
[3]
 Originally by: MysticNZ
I don't think you should be able to enter a complex once someone is in it. Complex camping sucks at happens at every complex, which is why I've done them maybe 3 times.
Well, coming from someone who actively enters complexes in order to flush enemies out and prevent them from running it i can say that yes camping sucks, But its great when your doing the camping.
"Don't worry, My friend is just admiring the shape of your skull-throne." |
Rutoo
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Posted - 2006.03.24 03:15:00 -
[4]
Originally by: MysticNZ
I don't think you should be able to enter a complex once someone is in it. Complex camping sucks at happens at every complex, which is why I've done them maybe 3 times.
Yea But it's SOOOO funny when it's camped by people who think they are good.
I have a funny story.
Basicly a Complex was camped by 3 pirates. i jumped in there mining my own business, and sure enough they attacked me,
I Sat there and watched as the Caracel, Went Pop, The Rifter Went Pop, and the Maller, it went Pop also.
Theres nothing like taking care of 3 pirates when they attacked you first.
Afterwords i eve-mailed thier CEO letting him know about what happened.
I'll Post the Mail Here when i get home, it was something i just had to save.
________________________________
Club Seals Not Sandwichs |
Kel Shek
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Posted - 2006.03.24 04:29:00 -
[5]
easy.
no, there is no place for instancing in eve.
period.
no. really. there isn't.
~~~~~
To see a World in a Grain of Sand
And Heaven in a Wild Flower
Hold Infinity in the palm of your hand
And Eternity in an hour
~~William Blake |
Alexis DeTocqueville
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Posted - 2006.03.24 04:31:00 -
[6]
If we instanced complexes, pretty soon the demand would go up for missions to be instanced. Then asteroid belts. Then systems. Then pretty soon we'd have 12 different shards.
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Ceilidh
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Posted - 2006.03.24 04:59:00 -
[7]
There isn't any real need for instancing in EvE. The place is big enough ;)
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-Ceilidh (KAY-lee) |
Shodai
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Posted - 2006.03.24 05:05:00 -
[8]
Please don't turn Eve into easymode(wow). :\
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Lisento Slaven
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Posted - 2006.03.24 05:05:00 -
[9]
Just as the previous poster said - Eve is big enough.
Seriously, it is.
You're thinking of changing the current system, when there are already a LOT of complexes out there. You can easily find one in a quiet system and get keys whenever you want. I know a few systems that practically no one runs the complexes in (or I rarely find anyone trying the compelx when I go to do it that is). Get out of the high-travel areas =P
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Nyphur
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Posted - 2006.03.24 05:06:00 -
[10]
Instancing turns a limited resource to be competed over into an unlimited resource with no competition. It would devalue the complex in question and any good loot it gives, as well as devaluing belt NPCing since everyone could just do a complex instead.
Eve-Tanking.com - For the ultimate tanking spreadsheet and resources. |
Idara
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Posted - 2006.03.24 05:12:00 -
[11]
Edited by: Idara on 24/03/2006 05:12:26
Edited by: Idara on 24/03/2006 05:12:19
Didn't read what the OP said, but just reading the title of the thread....
NO
Missions are far too close to being instances ATM anyways.
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Lieutenant Commander
BSC Military
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Kylania
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Posted - 2006.03.24 05:30:00 -
[12]
Originally by: MysticNZ
I don't think you should be able to enter a complex once someone is in it. Complex camping sucks at happens at every complex, which is why I've done them maybe 3 times.
Just wait till Kali, when they put boosters only in 0.0 complexes and a small handfull of players will monopolize these. So instead of everyone getting a chance at the good new items, only the small handful of alliances will get it. If you thought camping was bad now, just wait.
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Lil Miner |
MysticNZ
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Posted - 2006.03.24 05:36:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Stahlregen
Originally by: MysticNZ
I don't think you should be able to enter a complex once someone is in it. Complex camping sucks at happens at every complex, which is why I've done them maybe 3 times.
Well, coming from someone who actively enters complexes in order to flush enemies out and prevent them from running it i can say that yes camping sucks, But its great when your doing the camping.
I've never camped a complex.
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You got pwnd by us too :P - Wrangler
lol - Imaran |
Valkazm
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Posted - 2006.03.24 06:39:00 -
[14]
Instances are we calling it that ?
Or has this WoW expressions tried to make its way here if it were up to me i would remove them all togheter but seems some people are WoW damaged and must go on quests ..
The day a dragon ship will be waiting in the end is the day the Wow player would have reached nirvana ..
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JamesTalon
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Posted - 2006.03.24 06:44:00 -
[15]
Yay! Instancing FTW! Lets kill everything Eve stands for and bankrupt CCP! [/sarcasm]
If you will excuse me, I have to go put my hand in a wood chipper, as it is less painful than the thought of instanced Eve.
http://caldarisurplus.2myip.net
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Kahani Lyn
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Posted - 2006.03.24 07:05:00 -
[16]
Originally by: JamesTalon
Yay! Instancing FTW! Lets kill everything Eve stands for and bankrupt CCP! [/sarcasm]
If you will excuse me, I have to go put my hand in a wood chipper, as it is less painful than the thought of instanced Eve.
The deadspace missions are instanced, are they not?
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Valkazm
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Posted - 2006.03.24 07:06:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Kahani Lyn
Originally by: JamesTalon
Yay! Instancing FTW! Lets kill everything Eve stands for and bankrupt CCP! [/sarcasm]
If you will excuse me, I have to go put my hand in a wood chipper, as it is less painful than the thought of instanced Eve.
The deadspace missions are instanced, are they not?
/me gets an axe and choops the WoW players one by one ..
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Nyphur
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Posted - 2006.03.24 07:22:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Kahani Lyn
Originally by: JamesTalon
Yay! Instancing FTW! Lets kill everything Eve stands for and bankrupt CCP! [/sarcasm]
If you will excuse me, I have to go put my hand in a wood chipper, as it is less painful than the thought of instanced Eve.
The deadspace missions are instanced, are they not?
Nope. If I use the scanner and scan probes, I can track you down and get into your deadspace mission complex. It's not instanced, just in the middle of nowhere.
Eve-Tanking.com - For the ultimate tanking spreadsheet and resources. |
Herko Kerghans
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Posted - 2006.03.24 07:52:00 -
[19]
Edited by: Herko Kerghans on 24/03/2006 07:52:52
Originally by: Nyphur
Instancing turns a limited resource to be competed over into an unlimited resource with no competition.
Truth spelled, right there.
The problem with instancing is not so much that it isolates you from other players, but rather that it is an "unlimited resources" button, which is completely against what EVE is about.
Missions in EVE are not fully instanced since, as others indicate above, you are not fully isolated (aka you can be found and shoot). Still, they are an unlimited resource: your favourite agent is a 'produce resources' button.
In the end, THAT is the problem with missions (and instancing in general), and that is why not only complexes should remain as they are, but missions should be "complexized": agents should not have an unlimited number of missions to offer to everybody, but a finite quantiy; a resource worth competing for, like everything else in EVE.
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Barriers - an EVE novel - Chapter #4 released |
James Lyrus
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Posted - 2006.03.24 08:33:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Nyphur
Originally by: Kahani Lyn
Originally by: JamesTalon
Yay! Instancing FTW! Lets kill everything Eve stands for and bankrupt CCP! [/sarcasm]
If you will excuse me, I have to go put my hand in a wood chipper, as it is less painful than the thought of instanced Eve.
The deadspace missions are instanced, are they not?
Nope. If I use the scanner and scan probes, I can track you down and get into your deadspace mission complex. It's not instanced, just in the middle of nowhere.
I'm of the opinion that you should be able to bribe agents for some mission BMs.
Any in response to the OP, no, instancing restricts interaction, and is therefore bad. I agree that 'plex camping is irritating, and annoying, but IMO the solution there is to move the complexes on a regular basis. (Like, each time they're completed)
--
We are recruiting
We sell carriers. |
Sevarus James
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Posted - 2006.03.24 09:05:00 -
[21]
CCP has emphatically stated that EVE will NEVER be instanced. PERIOD.
EVE is about adapting and overcoming obstacles.
I happen to agree, and its one of the primary reasons for staying with EVE.
So, to give yet another answer to your thread title:
No there isn't anything to be said for it. You want instances? There be plenty of other games that have it.
"Ubuntu 5.10 cedega 5.1.1 and EVE= happy camper" |
Blacklight
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Posted - 2006.03.24 09:38:00 -
[22]
No thanks.
Eve Blacklight Style
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Avon
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Posted - 2006.03.24 09:54:00 -
[23]
Edited by: Avon on 24/03/2006 09:57:32
Actually, I think this is a great idea, the introdution of which would probably bring joy to the majority of subscribers.
/me hears voices...
Oh, sorry, I thought you said cAKe.
Oh, in that case no, instancing would suck.
The Battleships is not and should not be a solo pwnmobile - Oveur |
Jaketh Ivanes
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Posted - 2006.03.24 09:54:00 -
[24]
They allready are semi-instanced.
IF you get the key and get through the gate, noone can follow you, as the gate becomeslocked. If WoW wasn't concensual PvP, then you would see the same there. Every popular instance would have an opposed force camping it, because its a sure way to get a few kills.
So, OP, your request is allready there.
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Zulaya
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Posted - 2006.03.24 10:00:00 -
[25]
/me looks at his giant can full of complex keys
Gate locked huh
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Noluck Ned
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Posted - 2006.03.24 10:21:00 -
[26]
Edited by: Noluck Ned on 24/03/2006 10:25:01
Originally by: Idara
Missions are far too close to being instances ATM anyways.
I hear that loud and clear.
I jumped into Motsu last night and on both sides of the gate that Lvl 4 was being runs....forget the name but its the guristas attacking a gate...about 3 or 4 waves.
Anyway thats as close to instancing as we want to get, even though I have also had keys Ninja'd out from under my very nose before.
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Dark Shikari
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Posted - 2006.03.24 10:26:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Nyphur
Instancing turns a limited resource to be competed over into an unlimited resource with no competition. It would devalue the complex in question and any good loot it gives, as well as devaluing belt NPCing since everyone could just do a complex instead.
Truly QFT.
There's not much more to say about this.
The only way to balance an instanced complex would be to make the loot very rare, which would aggravate complexgoers far more than campers. EQ, anyone?
[23] Member: Official Forum Warrior
What's with the blue robots? Click my sig.
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Aodha Khan
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Posted - 2006.03.24 10:30:00 -
[28]
No instancing! No instancing! No instancing!
*brings out a banner*
ffs this is a player v player based environment. Learn to deal with your in-game problems rather than yelling on the forums for the game to be changed.
So in war, the way is to avoid what is strong and to strike at what is weak. |
Rod Blaine
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Posted - 2006.03.24 10:39:00 -
[29]
Bah, you are all just those same griefers that cmp the complexes !
There is nothing wrong with instancing ! IT works in WoW, and see how many people play that. CCP should learn something from blizzard ! There is nor eason why stupid 12 year old complex camping griefers should stand in teh wya of my fun
Ahem *cough*
Anyway, indeed, no instances please, limitation of resources is a key compenent of Eve gameplay. Also, the basic ability to confront another player whever and whenever is another.
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Ysolde Xen
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Posted - 2006.03.24 10:52:00 -
[30]
Just Say No To Instancing.
kthxbi
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Just because you couldn't get a ship to do what you wanted doesn't mean it's a crap ship - it means you're a crap pilot of that ship.
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