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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Barbara Nichole
Cryogenic Consultancy
503
   |
Posted - 2014.02.01 06:49:00 -
[61] - Quote
Gaj Butler wrote:I've been playing now for a few weeks and tbh every one I see in PVP just has faction stuff. Since you can buy ISK, EVE is really just pay to win, you can just buy yourself to the top, just get all the best gear and it doesn't matter if you lose it as you can just buy more with real money. .
try it. it's not as easy as you think to drop money on this game a "win". Of course that all depends on how you define winning.
-á-á- remove the cloaked from local; free intel is the real problem, not-á "afk" cloaking-á-
[IMG]http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a208/DawnFrostbringer/consultsig.jpg[/IMG] |
Rastafarian God
18
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Posted - 2014.02.01 07:21:00 -
[62] - Quote
Before we finally had enough of our BS highsec alliance, we ran into something like this. AKA a play to win guy thinking he could take is.
Im not going to name names.. but our alliance was a highsec one and even participated in an alliance tourney. Although when it was all said and done... there was more BS then use so we left.
Some guy that went full PTW bought an account and wardecced our smaller corp. Not sure how that worked since we where in an alliance but whatever.
He immediately went after our POS in VERY expensive ships. The handfull of us, being experienced, fought him off in cheap stuff. By the time he attacked in force a second tme with help by more PTW accounts... the alliance was there with us and we rapped him... all still in cheap stuff.
So ya.. there is no PTW in EVE. Yes you can pay to buy things faster. But you can not pay to "win".
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Serene Repose
Saanen Freight Service
932
|
Posted - 2014.02.02 16:49:00 -
[63] - Quote
I've heard kids give better arguments against brushing their teeth.
How come my stupid posts don't get this much attention?
I have sworn upon the altar of God eternal hostility toward every form of tyranny over the mind of man.-á |
Lugia3
Emerald Inc.
792
|
Posted - 2014.02.02 18:22:00 -
[64] - Quote
It's not skill in the sense of "see dude in the window 10 meters left, turn and put bullet in his face". You have to be a strategist, a tactician, you have to know what your ship can do.
Say, there is a general in a military. He is about 50 years old, and probably is nowhere near as competitive with a gun as most of the younger grunts (because of his age). However, he is still an extremely valuable asset due to his strategic and tactical genius. This is the EvE "skill scenario".
"CCP Dolan is full of ****." - CCP Bettik |
Mag's
the united
SCUM.
16634
|
Posted - 2014.02.02 18:37:00 -
[65] - Quote
Serene Repose wrote:I've heard kids give better arguments against brushing their teeth.
How come my stupid posts don't get this much attention?
Mine try the 'Yes dad, I have done them.' But so far have not realised I feel the heads of their brushes before asking. 
When that stops working, I'll simply move on to actual inspection. 
Destination SkillQueue:-
It's like assuming the lions will ignore you in the savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless. |
Tuttomenui II
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
201
|
Posted - 2014.02.03 01:38:00 -
[66] - Quote
Batelle wrote:I feel like this is a copy paste job from a troll thread I've seen before.
I think you have that backwards.
But yeah this THREAD now makes sense after finding this one. |
Ten Bulls
Sons of Olsagard
275
|
Posted - 2014.02.03 01:47:00 -
[67] - Quote
Eaphod wrote:
I can't believe I even made this far into your post, but I stopped reading after that line. If you don't know or can't remember something as simple as them being called corporations, then you obviously don't know enough about the game to comment on PVP skill.
I cant believe you wrote all those words because someone used a different word that has a similar meaning.
Your a terrible person. |
Jill Chastot
Oath of the Forsaken
193
|
Posted - 2014.02.03 02:15:00 -
[68] - Quote
Nexus Day wrote:Vaju Enki wrote:The OP is the type of person that thinks chess doesn't take skill. It doesn't if you play against kids in pre-school. This poster is the type of person who doesn't consider SP difference.
I sure bet my 8m SP in Jump skills /capital skills will help us in a frig 1v1
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=298596&find=unreadOATHS wants you. Come to the WH |
Billy McCandless
The McCandless Clan
Turing Tested
193
|
Posted - 2014.02.03 02:17:00 -
[69] - Quote
Gaj Butler wrote: the top
beeleevin in dis is y u r not havin fun |
Katran Luftschreck
Royal Ammatar Engineering Corps
2281
|
Posted - 2014.02.03 03:02:00 -
[70] - Quote
Gaj Butler wrote:At this point I'll just be waiting for Star Citizen to do Space Combat well, unlike EVE.
OP is sort of correct. "Skill" in ever comes down to tactics and quick mouse clicks, and most of the tactics are decided before the battle is even started. If you want actual dogfighting, strictly player versus player skill, with their toon stats not mattering, then yeah, Star Citizen probably is your better choice.
As for complaining about pay-to-win, well, welcome to new age of MMOs. Name a game that doesn't have golden bullets anymore? Complaining about P2W is like complaining about corrupt politicians. Gripe all you want, but it's never going to change for the better.
Nullsec in a Nutshell:
http://nedroid.com/comics/2006-08-24-2155-arrrdino.gif |
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Antihrist Pripravnik
Direwolf-Rayet
skylian Verge
174
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Posted - 2014.02.03 05:04:00 -
[71] - Quote
Here's one (a bit old,but anyway...) example of skill in EVE:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rlFQ4jL-HBg
This one shows that if you have the skill, you don't need anything more than a rookie ship:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vLTLDJd_qEk
... or a single bomber:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZLtHzH3uWis
Here's another example of skill:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ISvmezI9dOU
And another one:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S0FdO7pjMkY
Want to see and hear the exact skills and how they are applied? See this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RMFahR4wXTg
and
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XrYe_4vHzgE
There are hundreds of videos showing pure skill applied in the game.
CCP Ytterbium: Yarrblblbgrlblbgrlblblblbblbgrlblblbgrblblyarrrrdrooooooolonthekeyboardlikealunatic   |
Decian Cor
Disconnected.
The Cursed Few
148
|
Posted - 2014.02.03 05:52:00 -
[72] - Quote
Gaj Butler wrote:I've been playing now for a few weeks and tbh every one I see in PVP just has faction stuff. Since you can buy ISK, EVE is really just pay to win, you can just buy yourself to the top, just get all the best gear and it doesn't matter if you lose it as you can just buy more with real money. This ruins the game really, there is no feeling of loss as no time has been put in to get anything, I bet most people in PVP just buy their way to it. The exception is the large guilds or whatever you call them in this game, they're always the exception, they're so big they can just own large portions of real estate and never be out of pocket.
When you get into combat, EVE never has skilled fighters, it is all who has paid more, who has more friends or which ship counters the other... there is never skill. On top of that you have to wait ages for skills to train....... why? Why am I wasting my life here? My friends who got me into the game, just tend to login to put a new skill on train and log out. It is a pointless passive system that really is not a good mechanic at all, no one finds it fun and it means skills don't require skill to train. I mean if it was like taking a medical test in America's Army 2, then yeah, that is training, how this game does it though... just tedious for all.
I just do not find any redeeming quality to combat in EVE, to me it is pay to win, buy a character with skills, buy isk to get the best stuff...
At this point I'll just be waiting for Star Citizen to do Space Combat well, unlike EVE.
While the meta-game is often-times predictable, it's much the same in any other game that many people already play. There is always a style of playing that is modeled after because it works the best.
I will admit that I am a noob, and since I just started eve a few months ago and knew that I couldn't 'play to pay' just yet, bought 2 plex with my first subscription.
Would you really rather sit at your desktop for 8 hours straight and right click things in order to train a skill?
Because that would totally be way more fun....you should go play WoW.
Sometimes I wonder if people even use their brain before posting here.
Unfiltered for the masses.
Forum Posting - Basic
Common Sense Level - III Grammar Level - III Reading Comprehension - III Facetiousness - III Skin Level- V Trolling Level - V |
Alaric Faelen
Sabotage Incorporated
Executive Outcomes
232
|
Posted - 2014.02.03 07:53:00 -
[73] - Quote
This is a non-sequitur.
Simply- it's not the faction stuff that determined the outcome of the fight. This is a false assumption and the entire post crumbles because of it.
In many MMO's this is indeed often the case. Spending more does influence the outcome. But in Eve, the opposite is usually true.
For example- by far the most expensive and rare sub-caps in Eve are the PvE-fit mission/incursion/anom runners that will flee in terror at the slightest hint of PvP. Despite being the same class of warship, often fit to the gills compared to PvP fittings- they are utterly incapable of defense against even modest player attacks.
I personally own a kill mail on a Fleet Issue Typhoon with just my Stiletto and a buddy in a Rifter.
Pretty much the last step in a PvP encounter is actually targeting and shooting someone. Most fights are won or lost long before you even landed on grid.
Do not confuse lack of talent for economic disadvantage. |
Effect One
Vengeful Swan
106
|
Posted - 2014.02.03 09:20:00 -
[74] - Quote
OP, please spend a couple hundred [insert currency here] on PLEX and buy the ship of your dreams. I'd be happy to duel you with a frigate or cruiser or something.
Hit me up in game.
'EVE is a game about spaceships and there's an enormous amount of work to do on the in-space gameplay before players (or developers) are ready to sacrifice it for a totally new type of gameplay' - CCP Rise |
Kagura Nikon
Mentally Assured Destruction
The Pursuit of Happiness
1212
|
Posted - 2014.02.03 09:23:00 -
[75] - Quote
Gaj Butler wrote:I've been playing now for a few weeks and tbh every one I see in PVP just has faction stuff. Since you can buy ISK, EVE is really just pay to win, you can just buy yourself to the top, just get all the best gear and it doesn't matter if you lose it as you can just buy more with real money. This ruins the game really, there is no feeling of loss as no time has been put in to get anything, I bet most people in PVP just buy their way to it. The exception is the large guilds or whatever you call them in this game, they're always the exception, they're so big they can just own large portions of real estate and never be out of pocket.
When you get into combat, EVE never has skilled fighters, it is all who has paid more, who has more friends or which ship counters the other... there is never skill. On top of that you have to wait ages for skills to train....... why? Why am I wasting my life here? My friends who got me into the game, just tend to login to put a new skill on train and log out. It is a pointless passive system that really is not a good mechanic at all, no one finds it fun and it means skills don't require skill to train. I mean if it was like taking a medical test in America's Army 2, then yeah, that is training, how this game does it though... just tedious for all.
I just do not find any redeeming quality to combat in EVE, to me it is pay to win, buy a character with skills, buy isk to get the best stuff...
At this point I'll just be waiting for Star Citizen to do Space Combat well, unlike EVE.
In case you really think that. a challenge for you. Select a group considered high skill, even in high sec, and go for it. Proove that you can defeat them....
I am really sure you cannot, because your posts clearly state how clueless of eve you are. Skill in eve is not the same as in playing quake, its more like playing chess while managing a senate election at same time.
"If brute force does not solve your problem..... -áthen you are -ásurely not using enough!" |
Kagura Nikon
Mentally Assured Destruction
The Pursuit of Happiness
1212
|
Posted - 2014.02.03 09:32:00 -
[76] - Quote
Nexus Day wrote:Vaju Enki wrote:The OP is the type of person that thinks chess doesn't take skill. It doesn't if you play against kids in pre-school. This poster is the type of person who doesn't consider SP difference.
A 2 M sp alt form someone that KNOW how to PVP will defeat everytime a 100M SP character of a carebear that never PVPed before.
"If brute force does not solve your problem..... -áthen you are -ásurely not using enough!" |
Reiisha
Evolution
495
|
Posted - 2014.02.03 10:09:00 -
[77] - Quote
Gaj Butler wrote:I've been playing now for a few weeks and tbh every one I see in PVP just has faction stuff. Since you can buy ISK, EVE is really just pay to win, you can just buy yourself to the top, just get all the best gear and it doesn't matter if you lose it as you can just buy more with real money. This ruins the game really, there is no feeling of loss as no time has been put in to get anything, I bet most people in PVP just buy their way to it. The exception is the large guilds or whatever you call them in this game, they're always the exception, they're so big they can just own large portions of real estate and never be out of pocket.
When you get into combat, EVE never has skilled fighters, it is all who has paid more, who has more friends or which ship counters the other... there is never skill. On top of that you have to wait ages for skills to train....... why? Why am I wasting my life here? My friends who got me into the game, just tend to login to put a new skill on train and log out. It is a pointless passive system that really is not a good mechanic at all, no one finds it fun and it means skills don't require skill to train. I mean if it was like taking a medical test in America's Army 2, then yeah, that is training, how this game does it though... just tedious for all.
I just do not find any redeeming quality to combat in EVE, to me it is pay to win, buy a character with skills, buy isk to get the best stuff...
At this point I'll just be waiting for Star Citizen to do Space Combat well, unlike EVE.
EVE is a game of planning, foresight and organization. It's not an instant gratification shoot-em-up.
Not all games are about twitch skill.
Instead of trying to criticize the game for not being what it's not trying to be you may want to think of simply playing something else. I don't mean this in a mean way, but you're not going to play Risk to then complain that it's not enough like soccer either, are you? ;p
If you do things right, people won't be sure you've done anything at all... |
Alice Ituin
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
50
|
Posted - 2014.02.03 11:15:00 -
[78] - Quote
It's funny how you always read the same arguments when it's about p2w games.
"you still need skill", "you don't automatically win"
By that definition there are no pay to win games, because no p2w game grants you automatic wins when you pay.
EvE IS pay 2 win in the sense that it makes winning easier - just like in any other p2w game. The only problem with that is the definition of "winning" in EvE. |
Doc Severide
State War Academy
Caldari State
25
|
Posted - 2014.02.03 12:31:00 -
[79] - Quote
Eaphod wrote:Gaj Butler wrote:The exception is the large guilds or whatever you call them in this game... I can't believe I even made this far into your post, but I stopped reading after that line. If you don't know or can't remember something as simple as them being called corporations, then you obviously don't know enough about the game to comment on PVP skill.
I looked up idiot in the dictionary and I saw a pic of the OP... |
Doc Severide
State War Academy
Caldari State
25
|
Posted - 2014.02.03 12:46:00 -
[80] - Quote
Destination SkillQueue wrote:You're a new player so by default you're terrible at EVE...
That's just so wrong. I've been playing 5 years and I'm still terrible at EVE...
Can't do PVP well if my life depended on it...
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Arsine Mayhem
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
121
|
Posted - 2014.02.03 12:54:00 -
[81] - Quote
Gaj Butler wrote:I've been playing now for a few weeks and tbh every one I see in PVP just has faction stuff. Since you can buy ISK, EVE is really just pay to win, you can just buy yourself to the top, just get all the best gear and it doesn't matter if you lose it as you can just buy more with real money. This ruins the game really, there is no feeling of loss as no time has been put in to get anything, I bet most people in PVP just buy their way to it. The exception is the large guilds or whatever you call them in this game, they're always the exception, they're so big they can just own large portions of real estate and never be out of pocket.
When you get into combat, EVE never has skilled fighters, it is all who has paid more, who has more friends or which ship counters the other... there is never skill. On top of that you have to wait ages for skills to train....... why? Why am I wasting my life here? My friends who got me into the game, just tend to login to put a new skill on train and log out. It is a pointless passive system that really is not a good mechanic at all, no one finds it fun and it means skills don't require skill to train. I mean if it was like taking a medical test in America's Army 2, then yeah, that is training, how this game does it though... just tedious for all.
I just do not find any redeeming quality to combat in EVE, to me it is pay to win, buy a character with skills, buy isk to get the best stuff...
At this point I'll just be waiting for Star Citizen to do Space Combat well, unlike EVE.
Very true on all points. PVP in EVE is a sick joke.
Old games like Unreal Tournament, Counter Strike you could tell who had skills. Unlike skills in eve where they just use them to seek out 1 or 2 month old toons to gank, or blop overwhelming numbers against their opponent. |
Eugene Kerner
TunDraGon
Backseat Promises
1205
|
Posted - 2014.02.03 13:02:00 -
[82] - Quote
Gaj Butler wrote:I've been playing now for a few weeks and tbh every one I see in PVP just has faction stuff. Since you can buy ISK, EVE is really just pay to win, you can just buy yourself to the top, just get all the best gear and it doesn't matter if you lose it as you can just buy more with real money. This ruins the game really, there is no feeling of loss as no time has been put in to get anything, I bet most people in PVP just buy their way to it. The exception is the large guilds or whatever you call them in this game, they're always the exception, they're so big they can just own large portions of real estate and never be out of pocket.
When you get into combat, EVE never has skilled fighters, it is all who has paid more, who has more friends or which ship counters the other... there is never skill. On top of that you have to wait ages for skills to train....... why? Why am I wasting my life here? My friends who got me into the game, just tend to login to put a new skill on train and log out. It is a pointless passive system that really is not a good mechanic at all, no one finds it fun and it means skills don't require skill to train. I mean if it was like taking a medical test in America's Army 2, then yeah, that is training, how this game does it though... just tedious for all.
I just do not find any redeeming quality to combat in EVE, to me it is pay to win, buy a character with skills, buy isk to get the best stuff...
At this point I'll just be waiting for Star Citizen to do Space Combat well, unlike EVE.
troll
and a bad one...
just get lost - nobody will miss you punk.
"Also, your boobs  " -á
CCP Eterne, 2012
|
Anomaly One
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
203
|
Posted - 2014.02.03 13:06:00 -
[83] - Quote
Every game is different, not all games that have "quick reflexes" and dodging stuff is skill all the time, this is one bad argument really.
EvE is like chess, you don't make your move in chess and then correct it, you think about it for a while THEN think of the next move, then the next move, then 10 moves after that and before you know it you still get ganked because you forgot something.
EvE requires thinking, but I can understand why some people don't consider that as requiring skills, because you can't grind thinking.
Never forget.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a8sfaN8zT8E
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5l_ZjVyRxx4
Trust me, I'm an Anomaly.
DUST 514 FOR PC |
Arsine Mayhem
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
121
|
Posted - 2014.02.03 13:12:00 -
[84] - Quote
Decian Cor wrote:
Because that would totally be way more fun....you should go play WoW.
PVP in WOW was fun, especially the original Alterac Valley in which one battle would last 12 hours or more. It was better in the beginning before gear took over. But I spent hours, night after night of nonstop PVP. And it was fun. They kinda messed up the whole game with arena and adjusting classes around that.
So yea, maybe he should go play WOW or Rift is good also. |
Kagura Nikon
Mentally Assured Destruction
The Pursuit of Happiness
1216
|
Posted - 2014.02.03 13:34:00 -
[85] - Quote
Alice Ituin wrote:It's funny how you always read the same arguments when it's about p2w games.
"you still need skill", "you don't automatically win"
By that definition there are no pay to win games, because no p2w game grants you automatic wins when you pay.
EvE IS pay 2 win in the sense that it makes winning easier - just like in any other p2w game. The only problem with that is the definition of "winning" in EvE.
Issue is Eve is NOT pay to win. Isk is nearly meaningless on an individual basis on a single fight and the richest people in eve do not PAY to get that isk.
Isk is relevant when you are talking about a long war between entities, not a single combat. You can make a cruiser equiped with 5 billion isk modules. You will still die if you face a pair of tempests. But if you have 2 corps fighting a war, having isk allows you to recover from losses better, but will not insure you win a fight.
Finnaly there is NOTHING in eve that cannot be bought without real life money. In fact the most powerful stuff in eve is NEVER bought with plexes. No one pays 5 thousand dollars to have a 200Billion isk titan. That money is ALWAYS made without plex.
"If brute force does not solve your problem..... -áthen you are -ásurely not using enough!" |
Kagura Nikon
Mentally Assured Destruction
The Pursuit of Happiness
1216
|
Posted - 2014.02.03 13:38:00 -
[86] - Quote
Arsine Mayhem wrote:Gaj Butler wrote:I've been playing now for a few weeks and tbh every one I see in PVP just has faction stuff. Since you can buy ISK, EVE is really just pay to win, you can just buy yourself to the top, just get all the best gear and it doesn't matter if you lose it as you can just buy more with real money. This ruins the game really, there is no feeling of loss as no time has been put in to get anything, I bet most people in PVP just buy their way to it. The exception is the large guilds or whatever you call them in this game, they're always the exception, they're so big they can just own large portions of real estate and never be out of pocket.
When you get into combat, EVE never has skilled fighters, it is all who has paid more, who has more friends or which ship counters the other... there is never skill. On top of that you have to wait ages for skills to train....... why? Why am I wasting my life here? My friends who got me into the game, just tend to login to put a new skill on train and log out. It is a pointless passive system that really is not a good mechanic at all, no one finds it fun and it means skills don't require skill to train. I mean if it was like taking a medical test in America's Army 2, then yeah, that is training, how this game does it though... just tedious for all.
I just do not find any redeeming quality to combat in EVE, to me it is pay to win, buy a character with skills, buy isk to get the best stuff...
At this point I'll just be waiting for Star Citizen to do Space Combat well, unlike EVE. Very true on all points. PVP in EVE is a sick joke. Old games like Unreal Tournament, Counter Strike you could tell who had skills. Unlike skills in eve where they just use them to seek out 1 or 2 month old toons to gank, or blop overwhelming numbers against their opponent.
Chess.. basically the only game that worldwide is universally recognized as an extreme skill game. It is far clsoer to eve than Coutenr strike
CS is just reflexes, you can make a Bot that defeats any human in these games. Took decades and millions of dolalrs to make a computer defeat a grandmaster at chess. Wich one needs more skill again?
Want an even more extreme game? Magic the gathering. Computer probably still need a few hundred years of eveolution to be match for a human player....
LEt me make it clear for you.. REFLEXES are not skill.. evena mouse has faster reflexes than the best CS player in world. We are humans we are distinguished by rational capabilities...
but if you cannot match humans and focus on what define us and want to try to be half as good as a mouse is on a characteristic that is not even close to relevant in a human.. so be it.. I feel sorry for you.
"If brute force does not solve your problem..... -áthen you are -ásurely not using enough!" |
Inari Visas
X-Prot
21
|
Posted - 2014.02.03 13:43:00 -
[87] - Quote
Eve is strategy focused. Once you realize that, you either quite because you don't like strategy, or you stay for it. The skills needed here are not so much those of the hands, but something else.
Thread please. |
Dark'Rai
Angelic Eclipse.
2
|
Posted - 2014.02.03 13:59:00 -
[88] - Quote
"The exception is the large guilds or whatever you call them in this game"
/done  |
Jamwara DelCalicoe Ashley
Arbitrary Spaceship Destruction
The Devil's Warrior Alliance
111
|
Posted - 2014.02.03 15:37:00 -
[89] - Quote
nb4 ISD Ezwal
http://www.devilswarrior.info/kb |
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ISD LackOfFaith
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
1095
|
Posted - 2014.02.03 17:06:00 -
[90] - Quote
Quote:3. Ranting is prohibited.
A rant is a post that is often filled with angry and counterproductive comments. A free exchange of ideas is essential to building a strong sense of community and is helpful in development of the game and community. Rants are disruptive, and incite flaming and trolling. Please post your thoughts in a concise and clear manner while avoiding going off on rambling tangents.
Thread locked.
Sorry I'm not Ezwal.
ISD LackOfFaith
Lieutenant
Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)
Interstellar Services Department
@ISD_LackOfFaith on Twitter |
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