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Tentimes
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Posted - 2003.09.16 14:11:00 -
[1]
I've lost count of the dozens of things that are to be changed, fixed etc.
The roid spawn bug was acknowledged by Lekjart and he told us they were working on it. How come it isn't in the upcoming patch, according to the notes, and more inportantly WHY?
I would like an honest answer on this, as it has been studiously avoided, and I think it's being kept in the game deliberately as a blunt implement to kosh the economy with and restrict growth.
Thanks for any Dev reply.
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Discorporation
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Posted - 2003.09.16 14:14:00 -
[2]
Because they're working on it?
Seriously, if someone's working on it, that does not mean there will be a fix in the next ten seconds.
[Heterocephalus glaber]
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Tentimes
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Posted - 2003.09.16 14:25:00 -
[3]
They have been working on it for more than 4 patches now, and things much harder to change have been changed. As a programmer, my guess is it's a VERY simple piece of code or alg that grows the roids - my cat could write it.
They are delberately dtalling it as far as many of us can see.
I applaud the other changes and love the game, but this is really long past du fixing - along with the autopilot.
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Discorporation
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Posted - 2003.09.16 14:41:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Discorporation on 16/09/2003 14:40:59
Your cat's code would probably look like this
{
iF
"GERWGFE $ RT!#%513x4344 EC34[24:)][C(C]3C"
then
"cm204982m0394823488omgwtf rocr roidfix0r31241mlk".
}
In all seriousness, if a fix is on the way and you don't hear about it and it doens't get into a patch, would it be unreasonable to assume that there is no fix yet?
[Heterocephalus glaber]
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Dats
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Posted - 2003.09.16 14:42:00 -
[5]
I will agree with this and also notice that they did not say if anchoring is added or not. Alot of things I know don't seem to make it to the patch notes before hand (I don't think pann gives out everything) sometimes the notes change when the patch is released.
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Tentimes
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Posted - 2003.09.16 14:43:00 -
[6]
Edited by: Tentimes on 16/09/2003 14:55:37
Hmm... my cat is a *bit* better than that at writing code ;) I think we will have to agree to differ on this one my friend :)
DAts: I hope you're right. I would be very pleased.
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Porno
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Posted - 2003.09.16 15:21:00 -
[7]
Forget baby roids - GIANT roids are the things most worrying me. Where I mine, there are now loads of belts I can't get to within 5000km of - I warp in, and get "bounced" back off a giant roid while in warp.
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Adam Sudbury
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Posted - 2003.09.16 15:35:00 -
[8]
Please fix this ... cause I love gneiss to much.
Adam
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NeoMorph
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Posted - 2003.09.16 17:07:00 -
[9]
 Quote:
Forget baby roids - GIANT roids are the things most worrying me. Where I mine, there are now loads of belts I can't get to within 5000km of - I warp in, and get "bounced" back off a giant roid while in warp.
Would you believe that it's part of the same problem? Because the algorythm detects that there is X amount of ore in a belt it replaces the new roids as baby ones to compensate!!!
Well that's what I got told at any rate and it does seem to work - Our corp went out an popped a few large roids and next uptime we found lots of new bistot roids (unfortunately they were babies too but we hadnt seen this many bistot roids in our system for a while)
-------------------------------------------
<Stavros> the first motor bike i ever rode
<Stavros> was a honda gold wing
<Ak-Gara> hah
<Stavros> |
THE SINISTAR
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Posted - 2003.09.16 17:22:00 -
[10]
Until baby roids get fixed, I'd rather have it so no roids appear at all once depleted.
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Avaton White
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Posted - 2003.09.16 17:35:00 -
[11]
Quote:
Until baby roids get fixed, I'd rather have it so no roids appear at all once depleted.
[humor]
Yeah and if you try to activate a mining laser after you deplete a roid your account gets deleted and two big guys come over and break your legs!
[/humor]
Seriously though, baby roids need looking at soon. Or if it's not broken please let us know what's going on. I was mining with a friend in Isinokka once and saw a scordite roid in belt 5 (5th in the list) that was half the size of the entire belt. I could mine it from 30k away!
------------------------------------------------
"The best defense is a dead opponent." - Avaton White
"The very notion of adding new features to broken code is self defeating to the point of being borderline insane." - Par'Nabuk
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Joshua Calvert
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Posted - 2003.09.16 19:59:00 -
[12]
Quote:
Forget baby roids - GIANT roids are the things most worrying me. Where I mine, there are now loads of belts I can't get to within 5000km of - I warp in, and get "bounced" back off a giant roid while in warp.
That can be a lifesaver though.
Especially when you warp in 2km from 3 Beasts and a Jugger  and then bounce away at 2km/s.
LEEEEERRRRRRRRRRROOOOOOOOOYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY! |
Jarjar
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Posted - 2003.09.16 20:04:00 -
[13]
Quote:
Quote:
Forget baby roids - GIANT roids are the things most worrying me. Where I mine, there are now loads of belts I can't get to within 5000km of - I warp in, and get "bounced" back off a giant roid while in warp.
That can be a lifesaver though.
Especially when you warp in 2km from 3 Beasts and a Jugger and then bounce away at 2km/s.
You've got 10 seconds to warp away, remember? 
They don't deal too much damage either, my shield (~4600 @ 2000 sec) kept 3 beasts busy for 5 minutes to get it down to 35% or so (hardeners, not using a shieldbooster). Then I killed them. 
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Cyrus Troy
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Posted - 2003.09.16 21:47:00 -
[14]
I'm positive that the baby roid problem is connected to the problem of growing roids. The Devs should've put a maximum size amount for each roid. I can't imagine the size of some veldspar roid on the edge of the galaxy, especially when people are posting screen shots of roids that are over 100Km across. If all the ore is being distributed evenly across the whole galaxy, even to belts that have never been mined, then there soon won't be much left in the belts that get mined all the time.
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agrizla
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Posted - 2003.09.16 23:52:00 -
[15]
Quote:
That can be a lifesaver though.
Especially when you warp in 2km from 3 Beasts and a Jugger and then bounce away at 2km/s.
For God's sake Josh you are in a BS  3 npc cruisers are not dangerous - not even after tomorrow's patch will they be dangerous 
Of course if you have set your BS up such that you can't do damage at short range, well.... 
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agrizla
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Posted - 2003.09.17 00:00:00 -
[16]
Quote:
I would like an honest answer on this, as it has been studiously avoided, and I think it's being kept in the game deliberately as a blunt implement to kosh the economy with and restrict growth.
Not trolling or in any way being sarcastic, funny or anything else, but I think you've hit the nail on the head here. Playerbase is too small hence not enough people competing for limited resources. Hence a large proportion of the playerbase getting seriously rich. I see the "module tweaking" and upping npc damage as another side to the "baby roids" issue - it limits money supply. It will make fighting npcs more fun though 
I'm starting to wonder just how far ahead of the curve the playerbase is and whether "tech 2" is going to have the effect some people think it is.
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Fartracker
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Posted - 2003.09.17 01:10:00 -
[17]
STOP WHINING!
You and your 'fix the baby roids' boo-hooing
MINE THE LESSER ORES INSTEAD!
I think you'll FIND, that works better than crying. And YES, I mean it'll help the other roids grow faster.
Eat My Shorts
Eat My Shorts! |
Dats
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Posted - 2003.09.17 02:58:00 -
[18]
I will have to disagree with the last post because if you see the Megacyte and the zydrine miners stop mining you will see a market sky rocket on those mins and you will see a further cheapening of the lower mins it is pretty bad when corps are buying below NPC and miners are thinking this is a good price to get.
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Jash Illian
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Posted - 2003.09.17 03:52:00 -
[19]
Quote:
I will have to disagree with the last post because if you see the Megacyte and the zydrine miners stop mining you will see a market sky rocket on those mins and you will see a further cheapening of the lower mins it is pretty bad when corps are buying below NPC and miners are thinking this is a good price to get.
Stop refining the minerals yourself and go sell the ore to the manufacturers. You may have to relocate, but you'll get better prices.
I mean its like you want corporations to oblige each other like its sex or something. Pffft I would rather **** my enemy.- Rohann
Be careful out there. That other guy waiting in the queue for the gate MIGHT be a baby-munching frock-burner, YOU JUST DON'T KNOW!- Lallante |
nono
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Posted - 2003.09.17 05:12:00 -
[20]
Quote:
Quote:
I will have to disagree with the last post because if you see the Megacyte and the zydrine miners stop mining you will see a market sky rocket on those mins and you will see a further cheapening of the lower mins it is pretty bad when corps are buying below NPC and miners are thinking this is a good price to get.
Stop refining the minerals yourself and go sell the ore to the manufacturers. You may have to relocate, but you'll get better prices.
Huh?
Maybe if you have no refining skills and a few weeks to haul ore instead of minerals.
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Pirindolo
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Posted - 2003.09.17 07:11:00 -
[21]
I bet CCP will fix the bug of asteroid growing funny rates at the same time they lauch Deep Core Mining and, of course, it will take a long time after the first (and probably bugged) release of mobile refineries.
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John Blackthrone
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Posted - 2003.09.17 08:33:00 -
[22]
i dont think that there will be an Patch it will be patched Serversided so you dont have to dl a Patch....( i guess)
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Tentimes
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Posted - 2003.09.17 08:56:00 -
[23]
Yes - I would guess it's one algorithm, it's already ready to go (and has been for soe weeks), but they are waiting to put it in the server and could do it at any time.
Fair enough, I can see that had they not broken the roidspawn, some people would have just kept getting richer and things would get out of control - but time is past for them to fix the real issue. I can see they are working on it - but at some stage they gotta have the guts to TRY something.
Tech II won't be perfect ewhatever way they launch it, and if they are upping npc damages, which equates to lost PC ships, then maybe it's a good time to put down the megacyte kosh and let the miners get on with their game. The curret control (baby roid spawning) is spoiling a valuable element of the game that many people specialise in, mining.
Again - I love this game and will try to be patient - I just think it's time for some honesty from hte devs. That whole tale they spun about the guy being on holiday that wrote some faulty code blah blah blah, now seems to be a deception and I don;t think it's a good way to inteact with the customers.
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drunkenmaster
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Posted - 2003.09.17 09:11:00 -
[24]
Maybe it's just not as simple a piece of code as you think...
Maybe it has bigger implications that need to be taken into account, that could destabilise the market rather badly.
Maybe it's very hard to test on chaos when there are only 2-3 miners, at the best of times.
Maybe you're right, and it's some wild, crazy conspiracy, designed to make people mine something other than the most expensive ore available, at the expense of all the others.
.
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Tentimes
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Posted - 2003.09.17 09:16:00 -
[25]
Not a wild and crazy conspiracy - just a simple and effective method of control :)
And I think it was Mr Happy, on the grassy knoll, with a pea-shooter btw ;)
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Kalle Port
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Posted - 2003.09.17 09:20:00 -
[26]
So why don't the players who complain about baby roids move to the system with the giant roids?
One explanation for the 'problem' (i don't think it is a problem) is that when you mine ore and use the minerals in production new ore gets spawned at a random location in the galaxy, growing a roid or creating a new one in a random belt. Now since the belts in secure space keep getting mined but the belts in 0.0 space not those will keep growing. The roids in secure space get mined out before getting the chance to grow.
The solution? Once the price for minerals gets high enough people will start mining those huge roids for veldspar and scordite in 0.0 space. In short CCP doesn't need to fix this, the players need to do that.
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Rust
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Posted - 2003.09.17 09:58:00 -
[27]
Edited by: Rust on 17/09/2003 09:59:40
Quote:
So why don't the players who complain about baby roids move to the system with the giant roids?
One explanation for the 'problem' (i don't think it is a problem) is that when you mine ore and use the minerals in production new ore gets spawned at a random location in the galaxy, growing a roid or creating a new one in a random belt. Now since the belts in secure space keep getting mined but the belts in 0.0 space not those will keep growing. The roids in secure space get mined out before getting the chance to grow.
The solution? Once the price for minerals gets high enough people will start mining those huge roids for veldspar and scordite in 0.0 space. In short CCP doesn't need to fix this, the players need to do that.
This would a good answer if this was the way roids worked, but as far as I am aware the official line is that this is not the case, and that the baby roids are a bug.
If you are correct I wish they would confirm it, and then we could get on with it.
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Dianabolic
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Posted - 2003.09.17 10:44:00 -
[28]
Quote:
Huh?
Maybe if you have no refining skills and a few weeks to haul ore instead of minerals.
Have to disagree, most ore buyers will place a buy order at source and arrange for the minerals to be hauled themselves.
That's what I do, anyway.
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Tentimes
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Posted - 2003.09.17 11:09:00 -
[29]
Edited by: Tentimes on 17/09/2003 11:09:57
To the player who said he doesn't think roids are broke: Devs posted over six weeks ago it was broke and have made about 4 more comments since then. To paraphrase comments from Pann and Lekjart:
(1) Yes we know it's broke. The guy who writes that code is not here atm (follow speculation that he is i'll or on vacation)
(2) 3 weeks later in reponse to "is the guy still on holiday? Sick? We found out the person fixing it was on paternity leave. LEkjart posted himself on having a new baby FFS :)
(3) A couple more response to players were posted in the devblog COMMENTS section by Lekjart stating that "we can work on more thing at once you know" (see cloaking player comments)
etc etc
So - YES it IS broke and they have confirmed it, and have said for more than 6 weeks now that they are "working on it".
They have made changes to this spawning before, in fact 2 in the case of a week once. It could be changed, but if they had allowed things to go on EVERYONE including noobs woulda been in a BS about a month ago - so I can understand that bit. They were obviously trying to plow ppl down. Hopefully the pirate bit will cause more turnover of raw materials and allow mining for megacyte to become more feasable again by those of us without a BS :)
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Tsaya
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Posted - 2003.09.17 13:20:00 -
[30]
Edited by: Tsaya on 17/09/2003 13:21:22
Quote:
Until baby roids get fixed, I'd rather have it so no roids appear at all once depleted.
All roids i have seen respawn in the last weeks have indeed been baby roids, but grow bigger each day, so i cant agree here.
There are indeed a lot of old bugged baby roids out there, but destroying em should do the deal.
Furthermore roids only seem to grow when ore is mined in the vicity (belt/system, not sure yet, need more testing). So if a system has dozens of mini bistot roids that wont grow, chances are that the maximum ore is reached already for that belt/system, no bug involved.
Most of the people in here have to accept that ore respawn is a LOT different from old times, and stop shouting bug all the time!
(And before people whine: "i dont want to mine scordite just to make more bistor appear"; if you dont want to, dont do it; adapt, or be gone ;)
P.S.: i do not outrule the possibility that some belts/systems are still bugged, im just stating that in my experience roid growth normally does work
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