That's not what CCP want, the shot callers are just stupid and think these changes will make eve more new player friendly.

That's not what CCP want, the shot callers are just stupid and think these changes will make eve more new player friendly.

The answer, of course, is yes. That's why running level 4 missions is better than running anomalies. That's why gank-protection keeps being increased. That's why scamming keeps getting nerfed, whether it's through contract changes or MOTD changes on in-game communication channels. That's why highsec's production slots are a thousand times cheaper and a thousand times more plentiful than nullsec's. That's why wardec rules keep being changed. That's why shooting TCUs is like punching your own 'nads repeatedly. That's why corporations like Ivy League Poopnuggets keep getting special exceptions made for their newbie members even though a large part of the group has been in that corporation for over six months. That's why remote repair GCC was removed. That's why highsec incursions basically spout ISK.

I could go on, but you get the point.

Eve is supposed to be a cold, harsh universe. It's looking more and more like Puppies and Hugs Online every day. Unfortunately for CCP, the main selling point of the game is being a cold harsh universe. So as it keeps switching from the category on which it built its reputation to the World of Borecraft model, people are looking at Eve more and more saying "Really? What makes your game so different that I should play it? Is it the fascinating PvE? The highsec production system? The fantastic and interactive mining system?"

I'm sorry, I couldn't keep a straight face typing that last sentence.

Anyway, my point is this: stop catering to players who are unwilling to risk things. It's really starting to make Eve just another MMO in the crowd. And it can't compete there.

The biggest way I've seen subscriptions get made is through word of mouth. Mostly it was me telling my friends that Eve was pretty sweet, and they tried it out. Some of them, like the roleplayer who still runs raids on WoW, didn't get it or didn't like it. They left. Others have stayed for years, because of the vicious struggles going on out of sight of CONCORD's ever-watching lameness. People who want an easy-mode game aren't going to stick with Eve, so don't nerf the game trying to make them like it. It won't work, and it'll ruin things for everyone else. Nay, it IS ruining things for everyone else.

I thought they wanted us to live in nullsec.

Eve is a cold harsh universe.
CCP clearly want players to have environments where they stand a decent chance of learning the game and joining groups of other players without be driven out. A new player who has everything scammed away or is repeatedly targeted for ganks before learning how to get along on their own is going to leave the game whether they would have otherwise enjoyed it or not. If eve were a happy-rainbow-pony-filled place, they wouldn't feel the need to step in.
Missions and incursions pay more in low/null than they do in high. If you think that the safety afforded by highsec allows them to be exploited to greatly, then show those running them how unsafe eve really is. You have the capability, or should. One of the ways you could use concord to do the job is gone, but then I could never get concord to attack ninja salvagers so I call it even. What is happening to stop goon sponsored blue ice interdiction or any of the other ganks for fun and profit? Nothing. It will be made less profitable, but do you think they care? If these little changes are enough to stop players from making eve a cold harsh place, and the players are the only thing even remotely harsh in this game, then it was never really all that bad to begin with. All the mechanics still exist, just a few restrictions on using them to help the game grow.

We all have the same choice here: HTFU and adapt or GTFO

Because scamming "new" players out of 500 million ISK is totally wrong and unacceptable from a business standpoint. (it isn't)

Because making ganking harder by making the best current ship choices (i.e. battleships) not usable in most circumstances is "doing nothing."

Because Eve isn't supposed to be a happy-rainbow-pony-filled place and they aren't supposed to step in BECAUSE it's not supposed to be that way.

Because the risk versus reward is horribly skewed towards highsec at the moment.
And because (some of) the players are pretty much the only thing that makes Eve a cold harsh place.

Ganking someone for the lulz is pointless. It still is possible, but Soundwave won't be holding your hands any longer.

If you want to gank someone, do it right. Patrol the choking points, organize a gang and talk with them via teamspeak.. use passive targeters, cargo scanners and ship scanners.

You'd be surprised by the amount of T1 indies carrying over 500m in goods through some of the less known choking points. I, for one, won't tell you where it is because i don't want competition (and don't bother looking at this toon battleclinic, i use an off-alliance alt)


The point is, ganks should happen to people who deserve it. It est, those who do stupid things.


EVE has had a rule since launch. It ain't griefing if you're turning a profit. Point is, for over 70% of the ganks nobody was turning any kind of profit. Don't insult my intelligence by telling me that killing a random retriever with a thrasher gave you profits. You were just being a jerk to random people.

Cold and harsh != chaotic and pointless.


Now stop crying and learn 2 play the game.

You say I'm wrong and then agree with me (like when saying highsec is more profitable than anything else)

And by god or whatever deity you do or do not hold sacred, a newbie is not someone with 500 million ISK.

Who is this CCP you keep writing about?

There's also

Couldn't Care less about the Players

but since Hilmar's message where he basically bent over and grabbed his ankles we can't use that one anymore.

That's not what CCP want, the shot callers are just stupid and think these changes will make eve more new player friendly.

Dont you think thats a tad cruel, given that CCP sure has made some lets say "non influential" decisions in the past and its affecting our future sure, but in context it is nothing more than a tactic to bring in new blood for the bloodsuckers out there and creating a meal fit for an army? I mean we all talk about how ruthless it can be and even with me playing as a carebear at the moment until I am more comfortable with a covert ops position which i am learning about ( but thats besides the point) but in short we are stating that CCP doesnt care about the players all because their priorities changed. I dont think we should be slamming the developers for doing something that might change the way the game is interpreted as. Sure the PVP content is lacking in some aspects but lets look at it from its basic foundation... Without the PvE content or as you guys call "carebears" the game would simply be one huge bloodbath and there would be no one to guide you along the path, you would be thrown into the abyss with no hopes of getting out.. Life is more than this.... "EVE" is a game nothing more, nothing less, it is not a religion, we are not going "hell" by playing the way we like... So sure we can talk about the developers and cry like whining spoiled rich children who dont get their way, but in the end do we see any of the financial reports? No.... we just see pretty words and promises in text... Instead of chastizing the developers and each other perhaps we need to just be the sitting ducks for awhile and wait to see what really happens in the next few months before starting another shitstorm. EVE is meant to be a place for everyone to do what they see it no matter what it is... its not Hilmar's fault... its not our fault... if anything the fault should lie dead with no one and just disappear. This is pointless to point the finger as in the end its only the players who are going to suffer from it.

Ganking someone for the lulz is pointless. It still is possible, but Soundwave won't be holding your hands any longer.

If you want to gank someone, do it right. Patrol the choking points, organize a gang and talk with them via teamspeak.. use passive targeters, cargo scanners and ship scanners.

You'd be surprised by the amount of T1 indies carrying over 500m in goods through some of the less known choking points. I, for one, won't tell you where it is because i don't want competition (and don't bother looking at this toon battleclinic, i use an off-alliance alt)


The point is, ganks should happen to people who deserve it. It est, those who do stupid things.


EVE has had a rule since launch. It ain't griefing if you're turning a profit. Point is, for over 70% of the ganks nobody was turning any kind of profit. Don't insult my intelligence by telling me that killing a random retriever with a thrasher gave you profits. You were just being a jerk to random people.

Cold and harsh != chaotic and pointless.


Now stop crying and learn 2 play the game.

I will keep repeating this because of the hotfix from today. If CCP can fix mechanics in the span of DAYS because incursion bears had a modicum of risk injected into their runaway ISK faucet why can't CCP fix glaring problems with mechanics in the same swoop. Case in point is logi not inheriting a session penalty for RR allowing logi to remain effectively invincible on station and star gates.

If they can do that to the aggression mechanics that fast why are people allowed to dock ships with aggro into carriers and play worthless games. It would seem the writing is on the wall as far as the fact that CCP is going to turn this game into dumbed down candy land where knowledge of mechanics is usurped by hand holding and faceted with bullshit loopholes that let the risk adverse have their cake and eat it too.

Ganking someone for the lulz is pointless. It still is possible, but Soundwave won't be holding your hands any longer.

If you want to gank someone, do it right. Patrol the choking points, organize a gang and talk with them via teamspeak.. use passive targeters, cargo scanners and ship scanners.

You'd be surprised by the amount of T1 indies carrying over 500m in goods through some of the less known choking points. I, for one, won't tell you where it is because i don't want competition (and don't bother looking at this toon battleclinic, i use an off-alliance alt)


The point is, ganks should happen to people who deserve it. It est, those who do stupid things.


EVE has had a rule since launch. It ain't griefing if you're turning a profit. Point is, for over 70% of the ganks nobody was turning any kind of profit. Don't insult my intelligence by telling me that killing a random retriever with a thrasher gave you profits. You were just being a jerk to random people.

Cold and harsh != chaotic and pointless.


Now stop crying and learn 2 play the game.

Seems that gankers are more concerned with accumulating tears then actual isk profits. Theres plenty of opportunities to both ruin someones day AND collect a nice profit, but i guess that takes too much work and patience for some people.

Carebears in highsec pay as much as you do without pissing others off ...

I'm down with this - but only if CCP increases the cost of Strip miners to about 70 or 80M each.
That way, you can gank a Hulk and make a profit. Shouldn't have to take a loss every time I kill a Hulk or Mackinaw.

Or are you trying to say that people should ONLY be ganking Haulers with huge payloads, or Officer fit CNRs?

Or is this a better way to blow up Hulks and earn a profit?

Find a miner in a Hulk.
Kill the Hulk.
Add the miner to your addressbook.
Demand a ransom. Threaten to gank them again in the future.
Miner pays, you win.
If miner doesn't pay, you use a locator agent and blow them up again, and again. Either way, you win.
Its not griefing, because all the victim has to do to stop the pain is pay you 200M or so.

Random Hulk ganking is fun.

Ganking the same miner over and over until they quit. Priceless. That is REAL PVP.

That's griefing and you can be banned for that... just saying

I'm gonna go dig up the calculations that were done about how nullsec would run out of ammo-replacement production capacity after an hour or two of a hundred-odd Maelstroms firing. And CCP wonders why nobody builds out there and everyone builds in highsec...

Please lock for no content.

You'd look cooler if you didn't post this in every thread.

Do i care how people perceive me ?

Hell no.



Do threads like this, which only repeat the same **** over and over again, deserve it ?

Hell yeah.

words

Douche

Anomalies are being buffed for Winter.
IIRC, they'll get extra value, but not spawn more often. More bang for your buck. Or is it buck for your bang?

No, its my choice to do so.

And no running lvl IVs is less profitable then belt ratting. Not to mention that for running lvl IVs you need two accounts / one in noctis. And even then is less profitable then belt ratting just for bounty.

Just my experience about how much i can make...

two accounts doing lvl IVs roughly 60-70 mil per hour at best. LP change is now 0,5 isk per LP or even less, thanks to incursions.

one account ratting in regular PvP hurricane / well - point + LSE. is round 40 mil per hour just on bounties with occasional faction drop worth 20-460 mil.

Anomalies will come back in greater number, or at least thats what i read.

Doing sanctums nets round 60 mil per hour in drake/tengu with occasional maze bookmark nets 80-1000 mil. and faction drop worth as stated above.

Maybe you should ditch your noctis and make 50M/h on one account instead of 60-70M/h on two. 40M/h on bounties in belts seems a bit steep to be sustainable with a PvP cane, but maybe you can do it if chaining (but then you don't get the faction loot). And don't forget to factor in a few random hot-drops and ganks on your cane as well as downtime when local is a little too hot for belt ratting.

lol u so dumb

I'm down with this - but only if CCP increases the cost of Strip miners to about 70 or 80M each.
That way, you can gank a Hulk and make a profit. Shouldn't have to take a loss every time I kill a Hulk or Mackinaw.

/facepalm.

This. Thousand times this.

Seems that gankers are more concerned with accumulating tears then actual isk profits. Theres plenty of opportunities to both ruin someones day AND collect a nice profit, but i guess that takes too much work and patience for some people.

There is a difference between a hardcore player and a griefer. The latter pretend to be hardcore players, "PVPers", and other hijacked labels.

I don't think we are losing much if "they" leave.


Now what I am wondering is, not whether CCP wants more subs, but more individuals playing. I fear that there are really only around 70000 actual players, with half of them being griefers with multiple accounts - one for griefing, one for ratting/botting/mission running (to pay for it all), one for scouting so they don't end up getting griefed themselves - and the rest being a rotating group of trial accounts who don't stay on, and those ragequitting, and more so those getting bored in high-sec and leaving because when they try to leave it's gank and grief time.

So I expect something like "I can't invoke enough tears!!!1! I am unsubbing my (insert large number of accounts here) accounts!!!1 EvE is dead!!1! Marsha Marsha Marsha!"

I don't think this game is going to be a carebear haven though. But the mechanics of griefing are finally being recognized as a tool used by a few who, if they killed this game, would be proud of that. Remember with each gank, smaktalking session, insult, etc, they are trying to ruin the game for just the victims involved in the incident. If they can drive off enough people to make the game shut down, they ruin it for everybody, and they will do this acting like they care about the game.

Stuff... I don't think this game is going to be a carebear haven though. But the mechanics of griefing are finally being recognized as a tool used by a few who, if they killed this game, would be proud of that. Remember with each gank, smaktalking session, insult, etc, they are trying to ruin the game for just the victims involved in the incident. If they can drive off enough people to make the game shut down, they ruin it for everybody, and they will do this acting like they care about the game.

Eve is supposed to be a cold, harsh universe. It's looking more and more like Puppies and Hugs Online every day. Unfortunately for CCP, the main selling point of the game is being a cold harsh universe.

Your post is wrong on all counts.

Because scamming "new" players out of 500 million ISK is totally wrong and unacceptable from a business standpoint. (it isn't)

Because making ganking harder by making the best current ship choices (i.e. battleships) not usable in most circumstances is "doing nothing."

Because Eve isn't supposed to be a happy-rainbow-pony-filled place and they aren't supposed to step in BECAUSE it's not supposed to be that way.

Because the risk versus reward is horribly skewed towards highsec at the moment.

And because (some of) the players are pretty much the only thing that makes Eve a cold harsh place.

I really think the only way to make people budge is to turn Highsec into a wasteland of pain and suffering.

Working on that bit.

There is the problem. Since EVE is a PvP-game THEY should deal with it instead of trying to destroy the game for the rest.

There is the problem. Since EVE is a PvP-game THEY should deal with it instead of trying to destroy the game for the rest.

Since when? All I see of your high sec a geddon (sponsored by Goons) is words.

Goons are affecting the game with the ice interdiction more than HAG ever did lol



Yes but those ppl have all the gold. Quoth the golden rule: "those who have the gold make the rules"

There is the problem. Since EVE is a PvP-game THEY should deal with it instead of trying to destroy the game for the rest.

If its a PvP game, then why do we have missions, and rats and stuff?

A more accurate conclusion is the Eve is Player driven. CCP gave us the toys, and let us do want EVERYONE wants with them.

Let me pose this to you...you feel that CCP is pushing you to play their way, while you want everyone to play the game your way. Who is right?

None of the changes thus far are the death knell of pvp, they only increase the challenge of it rather minutely. And if anything, PvP could use a challenge for once.

My stance is live and let live. PvEers and PvPers are locked in a symbiotic embrace, like it or not. If you take away the entry level part of the game, you will ultimately starve the game of future PvPers.

I really think the only way to make people budge is to turn Highsec into a wasteland of pain and suffering.

Working on that bit.

If you don't believe me take a look at the price of oxygen isotopes lately

I really think the only way to make people budge is to turn Highsec into a wasteland of pain and suffering.

Working on that bit.

[
Non sense.

Many ignorant players don't care about EVE economy and wouldn't mind if it was based on fixed prices set by NPC buy/sell orders only. All they want is trade loot for ISK and get new ships/modules. I guess you are one of them, and you will destroy this game if given a chance.

[
Eve: 48K average players connected

Wow: several millions

You want to talk about wow child casual harsh world or whatsoever? -go ahead, your opinions wouldn't feed anyone's kids.

Eve will never be a huge MMO like WoW, even CCP has stated Eve isn't for everyone, Steep learning curve, extremely long training times, etc.

So you think you can force people into hi-sec? People are more likely to quit than change their playstyle.

Ganking someone for the lulz is pointless. It still is possible, but Soundwave won't be holding your hands any longer.

If you want to gank someone, do it right. Patrol the choking points, organize a gang and talk with them via teamspeak.. use passive targeters, cargo scanners and ship scanners.

You'd be surprised by the amount of T1 indies carrying over 500m in goods through some of the less known choking points. I, for one, won't tell you where it is because i don't want competition (and don't bother looking at this toon battleclinic, i use an off-alliance alt)


The point is, ganks should happen to people who deserve it. It est, those who do stupid things.


EVE has had a rule since launch. It ain't griefing if you're turning a profit. Point is, for over 70% of the ganks nobody was turning any kind of profit. Don't insult my intelligence by telling me that killing a random retriever with a thrasher gave you profits. You were just being a jerk to random people.

Cold and harsh != chaotic and pointless.


Now stop crying and learn 2 play the game.

You don't get it - PvP is much more than combat. EvE has a unique market and player driven economy at it's heart. It is game that need conflicts, and a less peaceful solution to conflicts than we strive for IRL, to thrive.

If you don't believe me take a look at the price of oxygen isotopes lately.

I say this, make highsec safe and EVE will die. New players need to learn that asap so they can adapt or leave.

lol, boohoo, i dont have the stones to live in null sec, waaah, i want to rob/**** carebears but ccp makes it too hard, sniffle, null sec is too dangerous for me, sob, i want to stay in high sec where its safe and attack people there, whimper, why is ccp making it so hard for me to attack people where im safe blah. get a life, move to null if you're so hardcore