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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 2 post(s) |
Nhemisor
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Posted - 2006.08.08 21:56:00 -
[121]
I believe what you seek is this:
(skill book)
Active AFK ISK Generator
Ability to fly thru space uncontested. Will fly ship from pick-up location to drop-off location and place sell order to current highest buyer. Upon arriving in drop-off location, will do a full scan of the entire market's sell orders and compare to the market's buy orders. Will automatically buy the highest cost-sell ratio items and set as next waypoint. Will undock from station and engage autopilot to pick-up location. Level 1 provides full, undetectable cloaking while flying thru 1.0 space, and each subsequent level increases the security level up to 0.5. Level 1 will also do a market scan of the entire region, and each subsequent level increases that distance up to 5 regions away.
(see also Dormant AFK ISK Generator for miners)
Many people may not be aware of this extremely valuable skill book, since CCP in its wisdom has made this skill book very rare. So rare, in fact, that only 1 is in game existence. Whoever it is that is currently sitting on the largest dragon's hoarde of ISK, is in possession of this skill book. You can, however, obtain this skill book. You must pod the person currently in possession of it. A cargo container will appear with the skill book intact. You can retain this skill book until you are podded yourself. Have fun!
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Taipan Gedscho
Taipan Industries
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Posted - 2006.08.09 01:46:00 -
[122]
 Originally by: Berrik Radhok
Then go rat in 0.0 and stop flying big pinatas full of isk around.
hey,
i named my hauler "Pinata" weeks ago!
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Devian 666
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Posted - 2006.08.09 03:34:00 -
[123]
There is far too much whining by haulers in this thread. All the tools to avoid being suicide ganked are already there. Every time you lose a ship in this game look at why it happend and be creative and find a solution. Solutions have been repeatedly presented in this thread and all haulers are doing is whining.
If you invest 100m+ in cargo and you fly it around in a 500k untanked ship you deserve to be ganked. You invest that much in cargo and nothing in your ship. Why not spend a few million and get your ship tanked. Oh you lose cargo expanders? So you'd rather lose cargo than lose cargo volume? Do the calculations as to what costs you more.
Also I think it is too easy for a new character to tank an industrial they need to be nerfed. /prepare for more whiney hauler flames and complaints because they don't want to think.
Why should haulers make money without using their wits? If you can't exact you revenge (like hire mercenaries to war dec, learn some combat skills or tank your hauler) then admit to yourself that you aren't cunning enough to play eve and cancel your account.
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Tyranical Teabagger
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Posted - 2006.08.09 05:52:00 -
[124]
The only thing safe from suicide gankers costs a billion isk and is fairly skill intensive. T2 indies aren't safe. Safer maybe, but a skilled BS pilot can pop them before concord shows up. The perp still gets insurence as well. It also involves little or no risk and can net you billions. Something is broken. At least make it difficult. I'm almost tempted to start jumping around the gates in jita with a couple 1 run battleship BPC's just to **** in the gankers cereal.
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Tecam Hund
Minmatar
The Buggers
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Posted - 2006.08.09 10:32:00 -
[125]
Don't know how many threads were there on these forums about high sec gankage.
There is no reason to argue and cry and moan. Train for transport ships.Its nobody's fault that you can't make a little training effort to ensure your own safety.
PvPers train level 5 ship command skills for high end pvp, why should high end traders be able to transport 100+ mil worth of cargo in t1 haulers without any risk? You say you can't afford or spend time on training for transports? If you can afford 100mil loads you can afford the ship. If you regularly transport 100mil cargo loads then trading/industry is your main profession. Take some time to get elite skills for that profession and stop whining.
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Mazare Mircea
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Posted - 2006.08.09 11:49:00 -
[126]
Considering my skills - 2months old and first time player, the best method i found is speed + tank.
I use a Stabber with 3300 shields and with resists. The ship also does 2.4 km/s .
Most valuable cargo I've transported was 3 bpc's of about 400 mil.
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Levrin Atischa
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Posted - 2006.08.09 12:29:00 -
[127]
Just to help everyone out of there dreams. Even Passive shield tanked transports are easy prey! It aint hard to pop em! 2-3 bs with smartbombs do the job en notime
Yes it is stupid to move expensive **** in t1 haulers
Yes t2 haulers are better
And yes a freighter might even be better than transports.
But no they are not the awnser to all the high sec hauling problems
I think the point some "carebears" are trying to make that its not realy fair in there view that to be save they have to buy a 1 bil ship that is as slow as trying push dung trough a funnel uphill. And they only alternative they have according to the community is buying a 30mil ship that can be destroyed for about the same price by the perps.
Its true that for shipping a bpo or skillbooks other means of transport are available. And doing this in a hauler is not realy the smartest thing. But suggesting that they should fit a bs to continue there normal trade(no bpo/skillbooks/factionmods) in highsec seems to me like suggesting to pvpers to all use mining barges. It only visualises you have no understanding of there trade and dont respect it. There is no way a bs would do for someone that trades as it lacks cargo space.
The proposal that is suggested in this thread is fair.(tho it could have been stated a bit better and less as flaimbait) Make the margin for ganking transports in highsec higher. you should at least be able to transport around 200m in one without the other party being better of because of insurance. This intstead of the current <100m you have to have in your hold to make it nonprofitable for gankers. You can ofcourse include the sec hit ppl get but this aint realy to high and hard to get back up.
I think its not realy fair from most pirates to mention all kind of non solutions while they gloathing from there stabbedup ships. it would be like ppl saying to them they shouldnt cry about the banning of stabs if it just had been mentioned by tux ;) (the last paragraph is just added to give most pvpers a visualisation they might understand and is in no way intended as flaimbait)
Well just my 2 cents anyway.
Levrin
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valerydarcy
The Priory
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Posted - 2006.08.09 12:46:00 -
[128]
blowing up ships in high-sec? 
who would do such a thing? 
***
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JoeT
Amarr
Short Attention Span
The Guardian Coalition
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Posted - 2006.08.09 13:53:00 -
[129]
to lazy to read 5pages... so
Go find a quite system.
---
Murder Murder, yes indeed, K-I-L-L-I-N-G
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voxen
Es and Whizz
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Posted - 2006.08.09 14:20:00 -
[130]
Originally by: JoeT
to lazy to read 5pages... so
Go find a quite system.
because you haven't read the 5 pages you just make yourself look stupid now... congrats 
Insta's help a lot, so does improving ship agility (either by having evasive manoeuvring or nano's), but even just hardening your t1 inty will save a LOT of problems.
Yes, BS'ses and other tanked ships don't have the problems inty's have, but they're useless for the serious hauler becauase of limited cargo space
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Angelic Resolution
The Arcanum
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Posted - 2006.08.09 15:27:00 -
[131]
I've got no problems with empire ganking, hell even tried to get ganked once and have an alt pick up my stuff, no one took the bait.
But the thing I love about these kinds of threads are the masses of people who say "Get a t2 hauler, get a freigher". To them I say, idiots. You honestly expect characters who are a few months old to just pull a freighter out of their arse? Please.. A t2 hauler sure.. why not.. that's only the cost of a BS or less/more. They're not that hard to get as long as you don't take into account the amount of time and skill training you have to do. Idiots.
Anyway, empires ganks are good. CCP do state "No space is safe space" So it's good to rattle empire, just hope they get rid of insurance.
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Tecam Hund
Minmatar
The Buggers
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Posted - 2006.08.09 17:38:00 -
[132]
Originally by: Angelic Resolution
But the thing I love about these kinds of threads are the masses of people who say "Get a t2 hauler, get a freigher". To them I say, idiots. You honestly expect characters who are a few months old to just pull a freighter out of their arse? Please.. A t2 hauler sure.. why not.. that's only the cost of a BS or less/more. They're not that hard to get as long as you don't take into account the amount of time and skill
T2 haulers cost 30-50 mil last time I checked. Explain to me how one can afford hauling high end goods that cost hundreds of millions and not be able to afford the ship?
As far as time and skill goes. It takes longer to train to use a cruiser to its full ability than a tranpsort ship. As I said earlier, if you are already advaned enough trader to move such expensive loads take your time and train for the darn transport.
Its really simple. You can keep hitting your head against the wall and lose hundreds of millions over and over again, or you can train for a transport and become successful.
Removing insurance payouts for CONCORD ganks will not solve the issue. Hell, there was a thread earlier about "recon ships high sec piracy! Something gotta stop cause pirates move their recons into mission runners' smart bomb range". Now imagine if there was no insurance payout. People who keep whining instead of acting will alays find something to get upset about.
Enforcing bigger security loss for high sec attacks is not possible unless you change the whole security loss/gain system. Besides I don't see why the punishement should be any bigger if somebody decided to gank a hauler in high sec.
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Levrin Atischa
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Posted - 2006.08.09 18:20:00 -
[133]
Quote:
T2 haulers cost 30-50 mil last time I checked. Explain to me how one can afford hauling high end goods that cost hundreds of millions and not be able to afford the ship?
Stop giving the same awnser over and over again! transports are as easily ganked as indy's It costs 30-50m to buy one and it costs 30-50m to blow one up. It only takes 4-5 volleys with large smartbombs. You only have to station the bs at the 15km distance from a gate and scan the hauler coming into to system.(and yes bookies would solve that problem but not everywhere is a warzone and copying for all of empire aint compareable with the effort it takes to set up a high sec gank(15m)) I would gladly pay 300m for a nice new transpart that is more agile and costs as much isk to blow up in high sec. The not being payed out on insurance is to create a larger margin for highsec ganking not make it inpossible.
Do not think traders and builders do not skill and are lazy. i wouldnt even mind if the new minny bs was dedicated to trading( and takes bs and tycoon lvl 5 as req) but i think the rest of the community would go haywire if they got a trading bs .
Levrin
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Tecam Hund
Minmatar
The Buggers
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Posted - 2006.08.09 18:44:00 -
[134]
T2 Large smartbomb (do they even exist?) does 350 points of damage. Tanked transport has 4000-5000 hp in shield/armour alone with high resistances. Eight smartbombs would do 2800 points of raw damage. Do the math.
And I can't really give any different answer when people come up with the same exact question again and again. But anyhow, this discussion is pointless it seems. I am sure there are plenty of traders who are enjoying a successful career just because they don't wait for CCP to change the rules for them.
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Levrin Atischa
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Posted - 2006.08.09 21:33:00 -
[135]
the point of my plea was that its sad to know that you lose your working capital( your cargo and ship) while the pvper gets his capital all back from the lovely ensurance company. This fact assaults my lovely fluffy feeling of economics thats part of my carebear side. Combine this with the fact that i get slanderd back for not doing my math on ship setups and posibilities seriously offends my pvp side. So i try again to make it more clear:
Quote:
T2 Large smartbomb (do they even exist?) does 350 points of damage. Tanked transport has 4000-5000 hp in shield/armour alone with high resistances. Eight smartbombs would do 2800 points of raw damage. Do the math.
3 domies with 6 large t1 smartbombs(250dmg) can do 2-3 vollies under concord fire (jamming doesnt help the victim) this ads up to 6750-13500 dmg. Should be enough. 
If you build all the stuff yourself your loss should end up in the same price region of a transport + the fitting me thinks.
Quote:
And I can't really give any different answer when people come up with the same exact question again and again. But anyhow, this discussion is pointless it seems. I am sure there are plenty of traders who are enjoying a successful career just because they don't wait for CCP to change the rules for them.
O i do enjoy trading very much. I wont wait until ccp changes the rules. I gladly take the risk that comes with the profesion and i agree that nobody should fly afk. Im only a bit bored with all the pvpers saying there is a easy defences against it and that all ppl in non combat ships are fluffy carebears that dont know how to setup or skill a ship and therefore should shutup.
So to state my point again in a few sentances: The economic risk for the takedown of 1 tranport is equivalent to the price of one thus it only provide adequately protection for its content in high sec when this content is less of value than double the ships price. This makes the argument that transports are a falid means for tranporting your more valuable cargo safely in high sec invalid.
Levrin.
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Larkonis Trassler
g guild
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Posted - 2006.08.09 21:43:00 -
[136]
Quote:
Whining
Top tips for all hauler nubs
Don't fly AFK
Don't fly valuable cargo in untanked haulers/shuttles
Don't waste bandwidth on the forums when you do get deaded and lose billions because you're an idiot
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Levrin Atischa
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Posted - 2006.08.09 22:05:00 -
[137]
p.s. the bookie thing doesnt work either it only shows the vouchers on scanner so no need to load long.
p.p.s
To above poster: what a nice and considering post 
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Tecam Hund
Minmatar
The Buggers
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Posted - 2006.08.09 22:15:00 -
[138]
Well, of course 3 battleships fitted with smart bombs could take out a transport... But its not like there are 3 Domis on each high security gate fitted with smart bombs and waiting for a person to pass with some valuable cargo.
What we are talking about is people getting ganked in their t1 haulers by 1-2 people. Transport should be able to protect you from that in most cases.
About the gain/loss of money to destroy a transport. I think it takes about 20 mil to platinum insure tier 1 battleship. So 3 Domis lost would account to 60 mil (75 with fittings?). Its close to price of a transport, but they will not be blowing up every ship trying to get by if it has 100mil in cargo because they only gain 25 mil for 3 people. Not really worth the sec hit and a chance of missing bigger target.
I am not saying that all players who trade are fluffy carebears and can't fit out a ship btw. I personally do both pirating and trade/industry. Carebear is not equal non-combat player.
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oodin
Beyond Divinity Inc
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Posted - 2006.08.10 09:05:00 -
[139]
all you t1 nubs transporting 100s of millions invaluables can convo me and i will escort you 
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Maximada
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Posted - 2006.08.10 09:22:00 -
[140]
well we suicide gank sometimes but only soft or stupid targets!
The best way to protect yourself is to get a few corpmates remote repping you while you travel. Thats about the only thing that would make us think twice about blowing you into kingdom come. 
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oodin
Beyond Divinity Inc
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Posted - 2006.08.10 09:31:00 -
[141]
remote repping you while you travel?? that has to be the dumbest advice i have heard in my entire life.
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Taipan Gedscho
Taipan Industries
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Posted - 2006.08.10 15:06:00 -
[142]
Edited by: Taipan Gedscho on 10/08/2006 15:13:10
Edited by: Taipan Gedscho on 10/08/2006 15:09:56
Originally by: Tecam Hund
Well, of course 3 battleships fitted with smart bombs could take out a transport... But its not like there are 3 Domis on each high security gate fitted with smart bombs and waiting for a person to pass with some valuable cargo.
What we are talking about is people getting ganked in their t1 haulers by 1-2 people. Transport should be able to protect you from that in most cases.
About the gain/loss of money to destroy a transport. I think it takes about 20 mil to platinum insure tier 1 battleship. So 3 Domis lost would account to 60 mil (75 with fittings?). Its close to price of a transport, but they will not be blowing up every ship trying to get by if it has 100mil in cargo because they only gain 25 mil for 3 people. Not really worth the sec hit and a chance of missing bigger target.
I am not saying that all players who trade are fluffy carebears and can't fit out a ship btw. I personally do both pirating and trade/industry. Carebear is not equal non-combat player.
i think that pretty much nails it.
from all the posts i think this one explains it best.
short, precise, understandable, and most probable damn close to whats actually going on.
and i like the last sentence.
btw, i saw someone in a tempy pop a ball of macrominers with 8 smartbombs. cant remember the sec rating of the system (bout 0.8 or something),
but he got TWO volleys off.
thats SIXTEEN possible large smartbomb hits from ONE ship.
since that guy tried it the first time...
well. first wave popped the barges, second one the pods. :(
well actually there was so much lag when concord arrived that nobody could tell if it was the first or the second wave.
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Dryxonedes Sae
Caldari Provisions
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Posted - 2006.08.10 16:05:00 -
[143]
Twice in a trip through high sec i've seen a T2 industrial survive assaults by suiciders. I'd assume they must have had something good to attempt a T2. First one was a raven and a dominix (dominix i'd assume was loaded with blasters and was parked to hit the transport directly incomming - i was on the other side of the gate ready to leave when it happened so.,...) - Transport was an actively tanked bustard, took an absolute hammering, but survived for concord to come deal with the guys doing it. In short, a T2 industrial can survive a reasonable ganking, it needs you to be at your keyboard and actively tank the ship. Don't complain if your an armour tanker, you get plenty of warning when you see locks start to pop up, and then you've got a shield as a buffer.
Guess it all really comes down to don't afk it, and use something appropriate for the job. T2 transport, mwd, active tank, and i have my doubts you'll get plugged. I won't take a caracal to assault a battleship, but i might take a cerberus. Why? Right ship for the right job, if I used a caracal i certainly wouldn't be whining when i got my arse handed to me.
****
Where's the problem? It's called natural selection - The bottom of the ****ing food chain. -Denis Leary |
jjinn
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Posted - 2006.08.10 16:22:00 -
[144]
Originally by: Leandro Salazar
And T2 indies would be a lot more viable if you didn't need industrial skill 5. That is quite a ***** to train just for safe hauling.
Personally I always put stuff worth more than 30 mil in MWD frigs or battleships, but even if it does not affect me I find the ease of suicide piracy ridiculous. They should at the very least get not insurance if their ship is blown up by concord.
Industrial 5 - Jesus I wish my life were so easy. One level 5 skill for a tech 2 ship. Just for an 'Ass Frig'in need 3 just to get the bloody thing flying, let alone make it worth the risk in ISK.
Its worth noting that the Industrial is the frigate of the transport world. Like everyone else you need to beef up, learn the skills, and getcha self one of those big f**k transports with like 12000 structure points/AP/ Shields and stick a tank on it.
Lets see anyone take that down before Concord show up. If you are moving tech 2 gear and millions of isk in a Iterion its the Mission equivilant of taking Frigates into low sec. You're easy prey. Don't be easy prey.
My advice Escorts, works against pirates in real life as well as eve. Sure they may attack you, but then even a cruiser with drones should be able to tie them up - or take a lot of them out. Ganks use high insurance ships. And of course prevent them getting your can. If it looks like they are going to win, have the escort take out the can and they are f**ked.
Solo'ing in EVE is risky. Gang or join a corp, get a plan, and then take it to those who bring you pain.
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Kaomi Zorbaz
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Posted - 2006.08.10 16:26:00 -
[145]
I think some of this could be fixed if Insurance companies didnt pay to people who were killed by Concord.
Now the pirates have to risk not taking down the target and losing their ship.
Right now even if they lose out, they get a lot of their money back from the insurance company. It is a law of avgs, eventually they will hit a big payout to make up for the small losses.
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Khanid Am
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Posted - 2006.08.10 16:55:00 -
[146]
Why o why do you still fly through Jita! Unless you have business, Jita is very easy to avoid. I can fly from example from Essence region to lonetrack without going through Jita.
how......... mmmmmmm ok then
Let's say you're in Reyn. Set you AP to Nonni.... done  AP on standard setting, sec space, thats all! I found it a shorter route as well. I only go through Jita in my fast frig 3.0 m/s. Last time they attemped to lock me (scanning) they could not even get a lock coz I was already in jump 
The Gank the standard route as well, so another way to avoid them.
So no more complains about you being blown up! It's part of EVE, live with it. And if they pod kill you in the process you get a 30 day kill right. Now that's a bonus 
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stoats
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Posted - 2006.08.10 17:55:00 -
[147]
Originally by: Khanid Am
So no more complains about you being blown up! It's part of EVE, live with it. And if they pod kill you in the process you get a 30 day kill right. Now that's a bonus
If you don't fight back you get 60 day kill rights for a ship kill.
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Krulla
Minmatar
Queens of the Stone Age
Chimaera Pact
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Posted - 2006.08.10 17:59:00 -
[148]
These kind of people amuse me.
You do realize that if you get ganked in empire you get kill rights on the pirate for 2 months, right? So, the next time you see them sitting at a gate doing their thing, you are free to gank them all you want.
But no. That would be too hard. It's a lot easier to whine instead.
People who do high sec ganks (myself included) have MASSIVE kill rights lists. Many have 30+. Yet people very very rarely bother to retaliate.
CCP has given you the tools to avoid being killed, and the tools to get even if you do get killed. Use them instead of whining like the lazy git you are.
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Lygos
ISS Navy Task Force
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Posted - 2006.08.10 18:25:00 -
[149]
I run a personal NBSI policy.
If it's not blue, scan it.
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coldplasma
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Posted - 2006.08.10 21:12:00 -
[150]
If you don't like piracy, uninstall EVE right now.
____________________________
See you in 0.0 kids... |
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