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Corp managers wanting login screen screenshots??

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Sirial Soulfly	Posted - 2006.05.07 15:57:00 - [61] I think its a nonsense request since it gives people a false sense of security, if you really have a person who wants to steal or spy, he will have a 2nd account. At the same time people with only 1 account who do not want to disclose their alts are at a disadvantage.
Tasuric Orka	Posted - 2006.05.07 16:00:00 - [62] Eve is not candyland where everyone dances with eachother under the rainbow happily ever after.. hell, eve is worse than real life. If you dont like to be checked, then dont do it, but it makes perfect sense if you realise that some people put many many hours in making their corp. Do you tell your employer you dont want to show him some ID, or do you show him a fake one? Please.. ________________________________________________ I survived Veto and all i got was this lame sig.
Jim McGregor	Posted - 2006.05.07 16:06:00 - [63] Since the option to have several accounts exists, you will not be safe taking these measures. They are useless. Any real spy will have several accounts, since spies arent usually stupid. He will of course never transfer cash back and forth using the wallet. He could put stuff in a can somewhere and go get it later. There are many, many ways to get assets to someone without leaving a trace. I understand that the big corporations want to be as safe as possible, so by all means, use the screenshots and whatever. But you will not catch the real spies. --- The Eve Wiki Project
Joshua Foiritain	Posted - 2006.05.07 16:08:00 - [64] Originally by: Sirial Soulfly I think its a nonsense request since it gives people a false sense of security, if you really have a person who wants to steal or spy, he will have a 2nd account. At the same time people with only 1 account who do not want to disclose their alts are at a disadvantage. If someone truely wants to rob a corporation he can do it with one account just as easiliy. This requirement however does keep away the weekend thiefs that join your corp with an alt, then just ride along in the background untill they bump into something expensive to steal. This requirement keeps these guys out since theyre willing to put in too much of an effort. That and knowing which alts our members have is handy ------- [Coreli Corporation Mainframe]
Montague Zooma	Posted - 2006.05.07 16:29:00 - [65] MMORPGS turn into cash cows because they encourage interpersonal relationships that keep people playing the game much longer than they would have otherwise. Eve, on the other hand, encourages antisocial behavior like theft and scams. The mistrust and paranoia really gets old after a while. I have no doubt that it adversely affects subscriber retention. I'll give a screenshot to a corp I want to join. But it's as useless as 99.99999% of the security screening done at airports...all it does is irritate the innocent and make the real scumbags laugh at how easy it is to circumvent. ____________________________________________________________________ Open skies policies are signs of strength and courage, not weakness.
Galk	Posted - 2006.05.07 17:20:00 - [66] Edited by: Galk on 07/05/2006 17:22:09 Originally by: Benco97 i'd rather join a corp that wasn't so serious and was fun. I've been playing since release and I recently left some things because some people's seriousness was choking all the fun out of the GAME Pretty much exactly what i think. You know, this guy started asking me about the me, the corp and whatnot... it took less than a minute for somebody to pipe up.... he's probaly an alt... It is a game, but too many people take it at win at all costs, that makes it crap at times. A ring of paranoia, thankfully there's an opt out option. ______ Long ago one gorgeous night, we let the stars grow free. We let Zhuge do that once, he came back carrying a traffic cone, a forsale sign and three empty bottles of dutch lager. He also lost his Zimmer Frame... - Imaran
Skaz	Posted - 2006.05.07 17:23:00 - [67] It's a valid security procedure, and if I were to join a corp I would comply, but one has to wonder if it really is all that effective as an security check. The scammers we all love to hate have already shown considerable ambition in their trade and an uncanny ability to adapt. They will find a way and it seems a bit simple, a second account. But on the other hand the small time con artists will definately be rooted out by this check as they normally won't have a second account. But those who really are out to con you and are ready to ANYTHING...well we can't stop them because they will find a way. But this method will make their work a bit more complicated... - - PINK PINK PINK PINK
Lord Sid	Posted - 2006.05.07 17:24:00 - [68] If you have good common sense you won't have a problem with alt corp thiefs. If you're corp gets looted thats your damn fault. Just like if you get a virus on your computer that is YOUR fault. Screenshots of login aren't going to proove anything. Privacy does not correlate to wrong doing. Anyone who thinks otherwise probably voted for Bush. -=Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds=-
Jenny Spitfire	Posted - 2006.05.07 17:27:00 - [69] Edited by: Jenny Spitfire on 07/05/2006 17:26:54 Do you people show your bank statements? If you do, by all means. If you dont, find a different corp. Dont make things harder than it should. ---------------- Official -V- Forum CarebearÖ. I mine on forums. RecruitMe@NOINT!
Kel Shek	Posted - 2006.05.07 17:30:00 - [70] Quote: you wouldn't share anything. A persons account infomation and password are not shown in the login screen. The one and only purpose is to show who your alts are if you have any. exactly. and IMO thats pretty much an invasion of privacy, and s sign of entire distrust that I would not tolerate. I wouldn't expect to be trusted with lots of acess right off, or anything like that. thats silly. Quote: Some people really must have a lot to hide if you get so up tight about such a trivial matter. I would happily comply at a moments notice, or more honestly I would just expect such a measure from any corp I was applying to even if I had a wealth of positive references or knew the guys in real life. Being in a corp with active real members who are there to committ themselves fully to the corp, and not full of the alt play toys of bored main characters, is probably the most important thing. its called privacy. and trust. you will NEVER be able to 100% prevent things where someone gets high in the corporation over a long slow period of time and then backstabs you. EVER. it is ABSOLUTELY impossible. now, for new characters to get more than trivial acess... eh, maybe. but why are new people being given such acess to begin with? Quote: To refer to an example given above; it's as if I apply for a job, and the company expect to see my brother's, uncle's and sister's employment records to make sure I'm honest. They have nothing whatsoever to do with the application. I wouldn't go THAT far either. you are one player. Quote: If a single screenshot is causing that much trouble, i'd advise any ceo to drop relations at once. Just for the fact that with that attitude you won't be contributing anything. you work for department of homeland security or something? to put it simply thats silly. I will not be a slave of the corp. my alts, my personal wealth and assets are my business. its simple as that. no reason to comply with such an absurd request. Quote: I don't understand why anyone would have a problem with providing a screenshot of their login screen. The only reason I can see for NOT giving the corp boss such a screenshot is if you're intending to rip the corp off, are a spy or have pirate alts when you're trying to join a non-pirate corp. man.. didn't know how many people who worked for, or were ok with DHS played EVE. creepy. seriously though. I can see it as being a reasonable formality for "high level" acess. but not just to be in the corp at all. >>"We ask our unknown prospective members for wallet screenshots with transactions shown, results of a windows prompt detailing all EVE Installations, Extensive check of employment history and corp business as well as other measures. If you can't provide that then a) we don't trust you and b) we don't want you." if you NEED that I don't trust YOU and I don't want your corp. Interrogating past-CEO's and corp members, or wanting references, that is all fine. hell I'd even go as far as MAYBE giving up a fully-collapsed assets window. but beyond that, details? not a chance. Quote: If you have good common sense you won't have a problem with alt corp thiefs. If you're corp gets looted thats your damn fault. Just like if you get a virus on your computer that is YOUR fault. amen. ~~~~~ To see a World in a Grain of Sand And Heaven in a Wild Flower Hold Infinity in the palm of your hand And Eternity in an hour ~~William Blake
hilaw	Posted - 2006.05.07 17:56:00 - [71] I hate to say this but i can fake a login screen very simply. Anyone who realy wants to get in will. The most foolproof method ive seen uses windows media encoder, but there are ways around that too sadly
Kordesh	Posted - 2006.05.07 20:41:00 - [72] I understand the whole "to make sure you're not a spy" thing, but thinking about it, it's a bit silly. Any good spy would be smart enough to photoshop their alts out before sending in the pic =p ------------------------------------------- "What's it like being a turtle?" "It's a lot like being a walking house that eats lettuce." (Hurray temp sig!)
Sensor Error	Posted - 2006.05.07 22:56:00 - [73] Edited by: Sensor Error on 07/05/2006 22:56:41 This really ***es me off. It's like people complaining about the ID cards that ARE comming in the UK. The only people who have anything to fear are those that have something to hide. The whine about it not being effective (photoshoping the login screen and forging the support documents to get the ID card) should sthu. Yes, it's not fool proof. Nothing never is. It just makes it more difficult for people who have... less than pure intensions from achieving their goals. Like chip and pin - people whined and whined and whined about this, saying it won't cut fraud. Over night, over the counter fraud dropped to 0.1%. Yes, customer nor present fraud went up but the overall fraud level DID drop. It's not a perfect solution (dodgy postman, identity theft etc etc etc). It just helps throw a spanner. P.S And the people who are "STFU, this is BS I'm never gonna join a corp that makes me do this!!!!!111111111111111!!!2one" you are officially banned from ever* whining about corp theft and spies again. ok? RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE!!! ------------------------------------------ Dev Responses to common questions
Adrian Kerensky	Posted - 2006.05.07 23:00:00 - [74] Not that hard to fake tbh. I faked a login screen I was asked for once to infiltrate a corp and then blow up one of their mining opps. Amused the hell out of me.
Adonis 4174	Posted - 2006.05.07 23:14:00 - [75] Originally by: Sensor Error The only people who have anything to fear are those that have something to hide. Glad you feel that way and as one last security check I need to examine your daughter's underwear drawer. Sorry, dude, but people with nothing to hide are dead. ----- Caldari battle chef I was a geek before it was cool
Daimos Bellurdan	Posted - 2006.05.07 23:43:00 - [76] Edited by: Daimos Bellurdan on 07/05/2006 23:44:38 If someone has more than one account it is no problem at all for a spy to get into a corp. For a spy with one account it is not possible. There is one thing you cannot fake: The data in the eve database. You need three screenshots from the new member: 3xLoginscreen with every character slot activated. This way you see how long each char/alt has been in his current corp. If a slot is empty he just creates a new char. You then check in eve if the char exists or if the dates are correct. Edit: Ok, I came up with an idea to fake this too. I take everything back ;)
JForce	Posted - 2006.05.07 23:47:00 - [77] Trust is earned in Eve. Those who give it too easily often live to regret it. JForce The Arrow Project N.W.A Reprezent
Kel Shek	Posted - 2006.05.08 00:47:00 - [78] ugh. that whole "only ones with someting to fear are those that have something to hide" is disgusting and nonsense. did you know thanks to the patriot act, a bank can pretty much arbitrarily prevent a person from starting a new account at any "normal" bank(in the US), for like 5 years, and theres ABSOLUTELY nothing that person can do about it? seriously, while it has nothing to do with this,lol, the "nothing to hide" thing is full of it. such a thing would be fakeable, and provide nothing but alienation. Quote: Trust is earned in Eve. Those who give it too easily often live to regret it. exactly. but if all it takes to earn your trust is a few fakable screen shots.... rather than actions over time... meh. it'd be fun to use one of my alt accounts/characters to see how far... submitting to their invasive nonsense. then clear it out, then say "see how much of a waste all that nonsense was?" ... well, of course I couldn't help but give it all back after getting the point across. what'd be even funnier is if it could be done, then act innocent and see if it could be done without anyone even being able to nail down who did it... lol, then maybe with a separate account that just joined, give it back, >_< lol, that'd be some funny crap. ~~~~~ To see a World in a Grain of Sand And Heaven in a Wild Flower Hold Infinity in the palm of your hand And Eternity in an hour ~~William Blake
Valium Summer	Posted - 2006.05.08 01:22:00 - [79] Originally by: Jim McGregor Originally by: Aakron Some people really must have a lot to hide if you get so up tight about such a trivial matter. I would happily comply at a moments notice, or more honestly I would just expect such a measure from any corp I was applying to even if I had a wealth of positive references or knew the guys in real life. Being in a corp with active real members who are there to committ themselves fully to the corp, and not full of the alt play toys of bored main characters, is probably the most important thing. I can understand his point. This logic is used by Bush too... "if you have nothing to hide, why do you object to being monitored by us?". I'm definately no bush fan. But comparing the pre-war monitoring of Iraq by the United Nations to taking a screen shot for corp application in the game world of Eve is a irresponsible stretch. Maybe you are too young to remember what Iraq did to Kuwait and the burning oilfields left in Iraq's retreat. That is why Iraq was being watched, not because they wanted to join a player corp in EvE. If you apply for any corporation in the real world many will ask for a drug test. Why? To find out if you are a drug user. A drug user can be a serious liablility to a coroporation. Why does an Eve Corp request screen shots upon applying? Because they want to know if you are affiliated with an enemy corp. Employing your enemy can be a serious liability to a Corporation. I have seen the Arctic Circle... And it is round.
Fierce Deity	Posted - 2006.05.08 01:46:00 - [80] any ceo asking for my screen better have his to show to me. hell maybe he should check my bank account to see if i can afford to be an active member in the corp. should i fax him my work schedual so that i can have further supporting proof i can be active? there are better ways to keep your corp hanger safe. ------FD------ Recruiting: Hera Star
GC13	Posted - 2006.05.08 02:40:00 - [81] Wow. Such hostility to something so simple. I'll make a note to ask for login screens if I'm ever responsible for hiring... Regardless of how well it keeps spies out, it seems like it will do wonders for people who get uppity real easy, and don't want to follow even the slightest amount of corporate discipline. --- New to Eve? Interested in manufacturing stuff, or doing research on blueprints? Check out my fully-updated Science and Industry guide.
Kolatha	Posted - 2006.05.08 03:47:00 - [82] Originally by: Skaz They will find a way and it seems a bit simple, a second account. But on the other hand the small time con artists will definately be rooted out by this check as they normally won't have a second account. But those who really are out to con you and are ready to ANYTHING...well we can't stop them because they will find a way. But this method will make their work a bit more complicated... No need for a second account. Just take a trial account, take a screenshot of the log in screen and photoshop (or gimp or whatever your flavour of image editor) your active character into the login blank. Or just edit out your alts to make them look like blank slots. This way you can send them your "login screen" and your alt slots will appear blank. No messing about with extra accounts (unless you have more than 3 characters) and no one would be the wiser.
The Slayer	Posted - 2006.05.08 04:27:00 - [83] Its a more simple way of implementing the whole "alts are responsible to their mains" Thing. It allows corp leaders to know who they have in their corp, and dont give me this crap about "there are better ways to secure the corp" and "Second accounts make spying easy". There are better ways to secure hangers, but not corp, local or alliance chat. If you let someone into the corp who is an alt of an enemy, all they need to do is log in and boom, they know where you are and with what numbers. And yes, second accounts make this check redundant. But it is still a worthwhile thing to do, and if you have nothing to hide, why do you care. __________________________________ Your Dual 250mm Prototype I Gauss Gun perfectly strikes Estamel Tharchon, wrecking for 187.6 damage.
Bohoba	Posted - 2006.05.08 04:50:00 - [84] Originally by: Fierce Deity any ceo asking for my screen better have his to show to me. hell maybe he should check my bank account to see if i can afford to be an active member in the corp. should i fax him my work schedual so that i can have further supporting proof i can be active? there are better ways to keep your corp hanger safe. Yes Yes Yes Yes screenshots are req... Yes your bank account is needed if you canÆt pay you can't play Yes we need your work schedule so we know when youÆre going to be able to be on for Corp ops and such so we can put you to work with others ok ok eve is just a game but the above is really info a CEO would like to have to plan things or even have a chance to Funny how everyone compares EVE to RL come on people itÆs just a game <<<<<<<<<<Admitted addicted to EVE can we close this now hehe Get Into the Game it makes it fun for all
bsspewer	Posted - 2006.05.08 05:54:00 - [85] Edited by: bsspewer on 08/05/2006 05:54:23 I scanned through this post but no one seems to be showing that it's possible to create a fake. Everyone says they can do it but why doesn't anyone prove it? anyways..Here's some proof that character screens are useless.
Tristan	Posted - 2006.05.08 05:55:00 - [86] please post that at full res, Then ill take a proper look at it
SengH	Posted - 2006.05.08 06:17:00 - [87] Post the original res, otherwise i'd say its suspect as your colors are off and theres way too much noise around the letters for it to be jpeg compression. Also one big error... your missing the shadowing of the letters.
Kornelia Shedim	Posted - 2006.05.08 06:50:00 - [88] Seriously guys, if your egos are so fragile that you cannot make even the smallest effort to work within the guidelines of the corp you are attempting to join, then you are not worth the corp's time. Trust is something that you earn in this game. It is not your right to join a corp, it is the right of the corp's leadership to be selective about who they admit. You, as a player, have the right to share only the information you wish to give out, but not sharing any information is going to severly limit the quality of corp/alliance you will be able to join. Just because you have to earn trust of members of a corp does not mean you cannot have fun in the game. If you are not able to have fun in the game without being a corp that trusts you completely, then I suggest you start your own corp and you can let in anyone you want without any screenshots or questions and everything can be right in your world with everyone living happily ever after.
Marcus Aurelius	Posted - 2006.05.08 06:58:00 - [89] Originally by: Triscuit I know people do this, I think it's stupid and crap policy. I'd never join a corp that makes you do this. But hey what do I know (not much). Smart remark. ?me prepares alt to apply to Triscuits' corp
Shere	Posted - 2006.05.08 07:07:00 - [90] It's as simple as this; If you object to the policies of a corporation and/or its CEO. Don't. Join. However, if a CEO wants to see your login screen, what reason is there to object? If you're so over-protective of your privacy, just get on of these supposed photoshop proz to edit your login screen for you. It's not a question of whether or not the security measure is valid. No, it's the policy of individual CEO's to use this method. If it's good enough for them, it should be good enough for any potential corp-members of theirs.

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