POCO's are corp asset, once the ROI is completed there is no reason for taxation if you price adjustments will gives you market advantage. Higher prices will be a general outcome. After reiciving the ROI itGÇÖs all about who can beat the market price. YouGÇÖre out of competition against anyone selling on a 0 tax scheme.

Would you give assurance to the neutral customer to set up a new POCO within the couple monthGÇÖs period once it was taken down defenseless? Are you willing to repeat the effort continually no matter the cost? (Further infestment)

How do you intent to hold your "tax cows" on the planet. Are you able to come up with the resources to assure uninterrupted production flow? (guarding and defending your POCO) Where is the point you decide to give in after Investment . /. Income drops heavily out of balance.

They hotdrop you and clear out a system within hours, getting rid of any competition. You will see MerchGÇÖs on 0.0. alliances payroll doing nothing but GÇ£poffGÇ¥ POCOGÇÖs in low. It will become a save source of income for them. You would be surprised on the financial capability of 0.0. alliances and willingnes to bring them in deployment if the make up their expens by gauging the market.

What are your costs? PI is not manufacturing, you don't have input costs once you've paid back your setup. So by that theory, prices should be zero?


Sure, there are no assurances, like pretty much anything else in EVE outside highsec. But what's the risk to them? The cost of setting up a PI installation is very small. If the situation changes, they can always switch to another planet. The POCO owner is taking the largest risk.

As I've said from the first devblog, POCOs are a boon to PVP corps. They are small enough to attract small gangs, which bring fun fights, while they don't have the logistics pain of towers. And at their price, they are cheaper than a bait battleship.

However, that's unrelated to their economic sense.


You mean just blowing them up? To do that in a remotely efficient way, they'd have to split up forces. I, for one, would welcome the small fights. If they do it to anchor their own, it's easy to keep harassing them until they give up.

Anyway, the whole 0.0 alliance scarecrow is just a fantasy by people who have never experienced the boredom of shooting structures. If you go into alliance chat and say "Everyone fleet up, we are going to shoot down lowsec POCOs for the next 3 hours", you'll see half the alliance logoff.

Well than, good luck with it.

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=402836#post402836

Heh. Sieged dreads away from station/pos? \o/

Each of those dreads is worth a dozen POCOs. Without a support fleet, they are easily killed by 10 battleships. You do the math.

Its not about the dreads, its about the change of CO's in player hands was intended to foster 0.0. income with low sec carring all the disadvantage.

No, it was intended to create more player conflict, and the dreads are very much about conflict.

Making Low sec. as secure as high sec wonGÇÖt cure the problem.

High sec = as intended
Low sec = POC holding corps canGÇÖt refuse to take or deny customers, so consequently eliminate any standing prerequisite for low sec.
This at least would gain a theoretical interest to use the POC by any others than members of the holding corp to add anticipate tax income, theoretically of course. If a corporation set up in low sec (what I truly do not believe) they focus mainly for their own PI production, so any tax issue is irrelevant anyway as charging no tax gives your own products an price advantage on the market.

For 0.0.; Of course you want to keep your foes off your lawn. So implementation as intended, zero tax for corp members and renters receive an GÇ£out of system GÇ£taxation, probably % share of the product to keep prices in balance. Problem solved for 0.0.!



But it wonGÇÖt work as intended anyway!

Still any tax income is just theoretical but bears no practical relevance as even lucrative Planets in 0.1. /0.2.wonGÇÖt attract more than 5 foreign installations. For now even less, as none of the GÇ£publicGÇ¥ users ever can be sure to use them in a productive sense in the long term.

WH holders will go into PI big time (zero tax) if the earnings bear any merits what is to be expect once the prices go to spike.

So again, no matter which taxation you imply it a.) never will pay off the investment as.) no one will set up a PI installation and willing to pay the requested tax on his export to a foreign corporation while his sales price (based on the higher export tax) is heavily under bided by corporations with zero taxation on their export.

It certainly was a nice idea to hand the COGÇÖs over in players hands. But unfortunately it will not work out as intended.

Weather you scrap the tax, or make them defendable, otherwise they will lose any and all attraction in low sec.

Again: Conflicts are only possible as long as 2 or more Groups show up. I don't see this happen here. Group A will chose a time where they are most comfort with - which will be some time while Group B (CO Owner) is not arround and start shooting their CO just to kill their CO.

I'd say this changes things a lot. POCO income for P1 or P2 extraction planets is now 144mil/BIF or 3.2mil/AIF per month, at 10% taxes. On a busy planet, that should repay the office in a couple months.

Errm, no-one has mentioned Wormholes. Surely now people will be blowing up these custom offices just for the hell of it? Jesus, you get a kill mail for it for christs sake. And what would be the point in spending loads of isk to replace them, when they'd still just be big floating targets for people to blow them up just for the hell of it?

From the devblog thread, the wiki page listing the new base tax values is up:

http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/CustomsOffice

I'd say this changes things a lot. POCO income for P1 or P2 extraction planets is now 144mil/BIF or 3.2mil/AIF per month, at 10% taxes. On a busy planet, that should repay the office in a couple months.

From the devblog thread, the wiki page listing the new base tax values is up:

http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/CustomsOffice

I'd say this changes things a lot. POCO income for P1 or P2 extraction planets is now 144mil/BIF or 3.2mil/AIF per month, at 10% taxes. On a busy planet, that should repay the office in a couple months.

Excellent changes. This is the "first step" from my initial post -- a straight up rebalance of reference tax values. Hopefully they continue to change them in the future, as their market values float.

POCOs are now competitive with Interbus COs. I'm not sure which I'd prefer to have in my system. We'll see!

3. The absence of CONCORD/Navy is the only actual difference between high-sec and low-sec at the moment, meaning low-sec is free-pirating zone. There is no place for pirates in high-secs (as NPC law present) or null-secs (replaced there with alliance wars).

I still haven't found in any of these threads how many runs the bpc has......


anyone know?

Right now lowsec PI is less profitable than nullsec (including wormholes), however is easily raidable by the large alliances.

.... or a really, really big high DPS fleet.

Tornado/Naga/Talos/Oracle...

fit for gank over tank... they will be an "easy" and "cheap" fleet that can throw out DPS like crazy.

I am becoming more and more convinced that CCP is doing things to start breaking up the "Great Wall of Carebear".

Yea, you just need 10-15 of these to reinforce or kill a POCO in 20 minutes.

On the other hand, that fleet can be countered by a well balanced t1 cruiser/destroyer/BC fleet. Fun fights.


I'm not sure what this means

To anyone reading my thread, I have no idea what this tengen san guy is talking about. After Interbus COs were announced he still seemed to think all lowsec/nullsec COs were disappearing on patch day (they are not). He also wanted lowsec COs to be 0% tax for whatever reason, and of course POCOs have had that option since they were first announced.

I am guessing he's just a highsec guy with a bunch of alts doing PI in lowsec who doesn't actually want lowsec groups to be able to exert some control over their home turf. Who knows!

A large alliance like mine has absolutely zero interest in sending capitals many regions away to kill some meaningless POCOs in lowsec. Our fleets are busy doing fun stuff like fleet fights in nullsec instead of randomly shooting lowsec PI structures.

Yea, you just need 10-15 of these to reinforce or kill a POCO in 20 minutes.

On the other hand, that fleet can be countered by a well balanced t1 cruiser/destroyer/BC fleet. Fun fights.


I'm not sure what this means

There's one big obstacle that keeps highseccers out of lowsec PVP, tho. The sec status losses.