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Batolemaeus
Free-Space-Ranger Nulli Secunda
62
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Posted - 2014.05.17 16:39:00 -
[1] - Quote
tl;dr: Give players an easier way to create plastic wrap containers without abusing courier contracts
Long-winded explanation follows:
Doing supply runs for a corp or alliance tends not to be the most satisfying from a gameplay perspective. It is a rather tedious profession for people with masochistic tendencies.
One of the many problems stems from the fact that not everyone has a jita alt to simply courier contract their purchases. Corporations often organize orders though a webshop interface, but someone still has to buy the items and correctly separate them again at the destination. This gets very tedious as more people order more items and there is more room for mistakes.
An alternative would be separating orders in containers, one container per order. However, some container types don't play well with jumpfreighters. It also introduces a lot of wasted space. Space is expensive on JF.
Enter plastic wraps. As a workaround, it has become common to courier contract items to an alt. This results in a plastic wrap container. The container can be renamed and doesn't waste any space. The plastic wrap containers are then traded back to the JF pilot, shipped, and contracted whole to the receiving player.
This workaround creates its own problems however. Here's the absolute minimum number of steps required for an in-corp alt:
- Items in deliveries are courier contracted to the alt
- Alt accepts contract for corp
- JF pilot takes the plastic wrap, renames it to make it recognizable
- alt fails the courier contract
- JF pilot deletes the contract
I consider it an abuse of game mechanics, but it's still vastly preferable to the alternatives. Therefore, I propose to make it easier to access. |

Evelgrivion
Calamitous-Intent Feign Disorder
296
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Posted - 2014.05.17 19:29:00 -
[2] - Quote
I like everything about this idea. |

hmskrecik
TransMine Group German Information Network Alliance
179
|
Posted - 2014.05.17 21:19:00 -
[3] - Quote
I like the idea and for quite different reasons.
Now and then there happens a situation when I'd like to prepare a ship for use, just not now. Such wrapping would be nice solution, when I could wrap a ship along with all modules I'd like to use into one nice package which could have been moved wherever I want it to have. |

Arkon Olacar
Imperial Guardians Spaceship Samurai
347
|
Posted - 2014.05.18 10:59:00 -
[4] - Quote
Given that Fozzie seems intent upon thrusting his fist elbow deep in the ass of anyone with a JF, I'd appreciate at least this minor reacharound while being screwed. Warping to zero |

Paikis
Lycosa Syndicate Surely You're Joking
1217
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Posted - 2014.05.18 12:09:00 -
[5] - Quote
Scan Reflective Bubble Wrap.
Made from plastics or something from PI. It is a container that is produced and used like any other, except it prevents cargohold scanning on items inside of it and it can stretch to fit any size items.
The restriction? You need one for every item (or stack of items) that you want to be scan proof.
|

Petrified
Old and Petrified Syndication TOG - The Older Gamers Alliance
134
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Posted - 2014.05.18 12:32:00 -
[6] - Quote
I like the idea over all. It makes sense given the current in-game mechanics.
This was a tad confusing to me:
Batolemaeus wrote:
- Items in deliveries are courier contracted to the alt
- Alt accepts contract for corp
- JF pilot takes the plastic wrap, renames it to make it recognizable
- alt fails the courier contract
- JF pilot deletes the contract
Why are either party failing the contract? I usually find it simpler to: JF pilot couriers to Alt who couriers back to the JF pilot. The JF Pilot delivers the package and then the alt delivers it again. No failed contracts on record. |

Batolemaeus
Free-Space-Ranger Nulli Secunda
116
|
Posted - 2014.05.18 13:28:00 -
[7] - Quote
Petrified wrote: Why are either party failing the contract? I usually find it simpler to: JF pilot couriers to Alt who couriers back to the JF pilot. The JF Pilot delivers the package and then the alt delivers it again. No failed contracts on record.
Completing a courier contract destroys the plastic wrap container, but the plastic wrap container is what I'm after. I don't want to break the container (aka deliver the courier contract) at the destination because all items will just mix with other deliveries, my own stocks and trading stocks.
It is also much neater for the people receiving the goods. They get a nice present with their name on it, they can break the wrapping now or have a ready made package for later. |

Jasmine Assasin
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
165
|
Posted - 2014.05.18 13:32:00 -
[8] - Quote
Batolemaeus wrote:Petrified wrote: Why are either party failing the contract? I usually find it simpler to: JF pilot couriers to Alt who couriers back to the JF pilot. The JF Pilot delivers the package and then the alt delivers it again. No failed contracts on record.
Completing a courier contract destroys the plastic wrap container, but the plastic wrap container is what I'm after. I don't want to break the container (aka deliver the courier contract) at the destination because all items will just mix with other deliveries, my own stocks and trading stocks. It is also much neater for the people receiving the goods. They get a nice present with their name on it, they can break the wrapping now or have a ready made package for later.
Interesting, and thanks for the explanation. Although I'm in the process of selling my freighter alt now so yeah... |

Iris Bravemount
Fweddit I Whip My Slaves Back and Forth
321
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Posted - 2014.05.18 14:00:00 -
[9] - Quote
Everything that makes our Logibro's life less tedious is something I wholeheartedly agree with. "I will not hesitate when the test of Faith finds me, for only the strongest conviction will open the gates of paradise. My Faith in you is absolute; my sword is Yours, My God, and Your will guides me now and for all eternity." - Paladin's Creed |

Techno36
Fweddit I Whip My Slaves Back and Forth
4
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Posted - 2014.05.18 14:55:00 -
[10] - Quote
I support this idea. |
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Puchoco Voluspa
Volition Cult The Volition Cult
3
|
Posted - 2014.05.18 15:05:00 -
[11] - Quote
Holy molly that actually makes sense. +1 |

Xe'Cara'eos
A Big Enough Lever
188
|
Posted - 2014.05.18 15:53:00 -
[12] - Quote
it should have a minimum cost of 10,000 isk - so it's no cheaper than contracts (in fact, make it an NPC sold item?) For posting an idea into F&I: come up with idea, try and think how people could abuse this, try to fix your idea - loop the process until you can't see how it could be abused, then post to the forums to let us figure out how to abuse it..... If your idea can be abused, it WILL be. |

Elise Randolph
Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion
1220
|
Posted - 2014.05.18 16:15:00 -
[13] - Quote
This is a good idea. ~ |

Torval Shank
Hidden Agenda Deep Space Engineering
3
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Posted - 2014.05.18 16:55:00 -
[14] - Quote
This needs to be a thing.
Or even just a base cost per m3 or something.
Right-click, "Plastic Wrap."
"This 252,000m3 package will cost XYZ to wrap. Accept this charge?"
I also do like the idea of making plastic wrap an "item" with a limited amount of usage. I.E. one unit of plastic wrap can cover 5000m3 of goods. So your 200,000m3 package will take 40 units of plastic wrap. Just so long as it doesn't get TOO expensive. |

Kaeden Dourhand
Capital Fusion. Circle-Of-Two
23
|
Posted - 2014.05.18 17:56:00 -
[15] - Quote
This idea is good, and I see no harm in it.
Other than the environment. poor dolphins, man, getting stuck in plastic wrap leftovers.
This change of policy can only be implemented if facilities are equipped with enough recycling equipment for plastic materials.
|

Habris
Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation
33
|
Posted - 2014.05.18 18:26:00 -
[16] - Quote
eh, I really don't see the harm in being able to bubble wrap things +1 |

Reaver Glitterstim
Dromedaworks inc Test Alliance Please Ignore
1376
|
Posted - 2014.05.18 18:29:00 -
[17] - Quote
I suggest this and people tell me I'm an idiot. You suggest it and you get a ton of likes. What gives? I'm not allowed to make intelligent suggestions?
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=288396 See? No likes. Not one. Fit a warfare link to your tech 1 battlecruiser. Train Wing Commander. Get in the Squad Commander or Wing Commander position. Your fleets will be superior to everyone else's. (had this sig BEFORE Odyssey BC rebalance) And bring back the missile Inquisitor!! |

Domanique Altares
Rifterlings Point Blank Alliance
2701
|
Posted - 2014.05.18 18:49:00 -
[18] - Quote
Reaver Glitterstim wrote:
Have a like. Rifterlings pirate corporation is now recruitng members for lowsec PvP operations. Newbie friendly, free T1 frigate and dessy hangar, solo tutoring and PvP classes for new members. Join our in game channel 'weflyrifters' and speak to a recruiter today. |

hmskrecik
TransMine Group German Information Network Alliance
182
|
Posted - 2014.05.18 18:57:00 -
[19] - Quote
Reaver Glitterstim wrote: Just having a glimpse on your thread I think the mistake you made was to make a case of unscannability while here the focus is on goods logistics.
Marketing, dude. :) |

Timandris Telestrion
Telestrion Holdings
11
|
Posted - 2014.05.18 19:11:00 -
[20] - Quote
Yes, please do this! May ECM ships forever be the answer to the question " Is solo pvp a good thing?". |
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Nys Cron
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
21
|
Posted - 2014.05.18 19:14:00 -
[21] - Quote
This is a good idea and should be implemented as soon as possible. |

RatKnight1
Dirty Old Bastards Nulli Secunda
58
|
Posted - 2014.05.18 23:31:00 -
[22] - Quote
Why is this not already a thing? +1 |

Max Kolonko
High Voltage Industries Ash Alliance
413
|
Posted - 2014.05.18 23:58:00 -
[23] - Quote
Agree completely. This will mkae so much easier getting stuff for multiple members. Read and support: Don't mess with OUR WH's What is Your stance on WH stuff? |

Domanique Altares
Rifterlings Point Blank Alliance
2705
|
Posted - 2014.05.19 01:31:00 -
[24] - Quote
For my serious reply, I will say that anything that gives us more options for organizing our things gets a +1 from me. Rifterlings pirate corporation is now recruitng members for lowsec PvP operations. Newbie friendly, free T1 frigate and dessy hangar, solo tutoring and PvP classes for new members. Join our in game channel 'weflyrifters' and speak to a recruiter today. |

Gothmog VanMorgoth
Ubuntu Inc. The Fourth District
1
|
Posted - 2014.05.19 07:23:00 -
[25] - Quote
Yes please! +1
|

Qoi
Exert Force
6
|
Posted - 2014.05.19 07:28:00 -
[26] - Quote
This is a great idea. May i suggest we call it "bubble wrapping" for marketing reasons? I like bubble wrap. |

Arya Regnar
Darwins Right Hand
377
|
Posted - 2014.05.19 07:28:00 -
[27] - Quote
Fix unscannable double wraps too please.
EvE-Mail me if you need anything.
|

Seliah
Noir. Noir. Mercenary Group
167
|
Posted - 2014.05.19 07:30:00 -
[28] - Quote
Sounds like a good idea, +1 !
It should however come with a mini-game of popping bubble wraps. This would be a good alternative to ship-spinning. |

Batolemaeus
Free-Space-Ranger Nulli Secunda
155
|
Posted - 2014.05.19 10:00:00 -
[29] - Quote
Arya Regnar wrote:Fix unscannable double wraps too please.
That's only tangentially connected to a better UI solution for creating plastic wrap. I don't have any stake in that mechanic, so I'd recommend making a separate thread about it. |

Sable Moran
Moran Light Industries
393
|
Posted - 2014.05.19 10:55:00 -
[30] - Quote
Iris Bravemount wrote:Everything that makes our Logibro's life less tedious is something I wholeheartedly agree with.
Ditto, +1 distributed. Sable's Ammo Shop at Alentene V - Moon 4 - Duvolle Labs Factory. Hybrid charges, Projectile ammo, Missiles, Drones, Ships, Need'em? We have'em, at affordable prices. Pop in at our Ammo Shop in sunny Alentene. |
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Nathan Yates
Free-Space-Ranger Nulli Secunda
0
|
Posted - 2014.05.19 13:48:00 -
[31] - Quote
+1 |

Delhaven
Vicis Inter Astrum I'd Rather Be Roaming
45
|
Posted - 2014.05.19 17:00:00 -
[32] - Quote
This seems way too logical, simple, and easy.
I'd get a lot of use out of it for separating stuff out in station inventory. You can't put containers in containers, so this would be a nice way to split out stuff that's not used often.
It could also be used for prepackaged kits. Need a PvP ship, spare ammo, drones, and alternate fittings? Package it all up in one nice bundle. Have a "Welcome to the Corporation!" gift basket you give out to new members? Make up 20 of them and give them out as needed.
+1 |

Thoirdhealbhach
Liga der hessischen Gentlemen
3
|
Posted - 2014.05.27 17:48:00 -
[33] - Quote
Great Idea! +1 |

Leafar Nightfall
Native Freshfood Minmatar Republic
125
|
Posted - 2014.05.27 18:42:00 -
[34] - Quote
I don't always do logistics, but when I do, I want to bubble wrap all the things
+1, and another +1 if we can pop the bubbles |

TheSmokingHertog
TALIBAN EXPRESS
229
|
Posted - 2014.05.27 21:31:00 -
[35] - Quote
Let me sneak this in here, crosspost from little things thread;
***
Suggestion: Make special plastic wraps
Keywords: CoCo, Courier, Enablers, PlasticWrap
Note: Make it possible to ship Ores, "ammo types" or 'Special Bay' groups in special contracts. Make it so that they get a wrap of one of the special hold types. Since we have now special bays in Transport Ships, transporters should be able to utilize them (and it would give a reason to train racial industry to V again).
Such a wrap could be shipped in the special bay type of the sort chosen or in a general freight area. I could image that the special wraps would all have a different color, to make it easier for the transport organisations in EVE. Just limit the max. size of the contracts based on the maximum volumes of the volume bays.
*** |

fudface
ACME-INC
49
|
Posted - 2014.05.28 10:10:00 -
[36] - Quote
being able to wrap up a ship and the fit would be fantastic for several reasons
conflict driver need i say more
tidy for the OCD 
my 2 isk worth
+1 for this idea |

Maximus Aerelius
PROPHET OF ENIGMA
1275
|
Posted - 2014.05.28 11:58:00 -
[37] - Quote
Ah hell yes, why not.
I'd say make it an NPC seeded item to start with from each of the Empires main Courier\Hauling corporations (I've read EVE Source, they exist!) and this will add an ISK sink in as well. Not too expensive but not dirt cheap either.
Eventually add this as a schematic or something to PI or a BPO that uses PI goods and voila, another thing to make, build, sell.
GG OP. +1 Fast Character Switching "XP Stylee" Undocking - More Routes Out of Station Here's my tear jar > |_| < Fill 'er up! |

Frostys Virpio
The Mjolnir Bloc The Bloc
1102
|
Posted - 2014.05.28 14:45:00 -
[38] - Quote
This need to be a thing. |

Batolemaeus
Free-Space-Ranger Nulli Secunda
185
|
Posted - 2014.05.29 15:30:00 -
[39] - Quote
Maximus Aerelius wrote: I'd say make it an NPC seeded item to start with from each of the Empires main Courier\Hauling corporations (I've read EVE Source, they exist!) and this will add an ISK sink in as well. Not too expensive but not dirt cheap either.
Eventually add this as a schematic or something to PI or a BPO that uses PI goods and voila, another thing to make, build, sell.
That is exactly the kind of overhead I want to get rid of. I didn't make this thread to make logistics more tedious. |

Kasli Catal
Sniggwaffe WAFFLES.
5
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Posted - 2014.05.29 16:02:00 -
[40] - Quote
I like this idea. It might make most freight containers obsolete though. Why use a set of 50k cans that you only fill part way to separate items for different clients when you can custom wrap them. |
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Batolemaeus
Free-Space-Ranger Nulli Secunda
186
|
Posted - 2014.05.29 17:25:00 -
[41] - Quote
Kasli Catal wrote:I like this idea. It might make most freight containers obsolete though. Why use a set of 50k cans that you only fill part way to separate items for different clients when you can custom wrap them.
But that is already the case. Plastic wraps are functionally superior if you are using them as shipping crates.
I mean, there are a few reason why I'd want containers:
I want to use magical hyperspace to store more stuff in a hauler
I want to separate cargo in my ship cargo hold (refitting mods) and need to put things in them and take things out
I want airtight shipping crates (plastic wrap) and don't need to modify the crate after creating it
I want a container for security (audit log etc)
I want to organize my personal hangar
Giving a simple right click stack -> wrap in plastic option (account for the need to also add ships) doesn't change the picture. I am not proposing wild functional divergence, I'm perfectly fine with the current mechanics beyond UX gripes with the process of creating those shipping crates. The use cases for other types of containers are still valid and aren't touched on. |

Meandering Milieu
House Aratus Fatal Ascension
64
|
Posted - 2014.05.29 21:03:00 -
[42] - Quote
I don't understand a thing about courier contracts, or plastic wrap.
Can someone give me the layman's of the current system, and what this proposes to do? Because I didn't understand it at all from the OP. |

Reaver Glitterstim
Dromedaworks inc Test Alliance Please Ignore
1462
|
Posted - 2014.05.29 21:10:00 -
[43] - Quote
Meandering Milieu wrote:I don't understand a thing about courier contracts, or plastic wrap.
Can someone give me the layman's of the current system, and what this proposes to do? Because I didn't understand it at all from the OP. Plastic wrap is when you place a courier contract package into a courier contract. The goods inside cannot be scanned and the package has the same volume as the goods inside.
The proposal is to allow a system to put things into a package of any size that is unscannable, without the use of courier contracts. Fit a warfare link to your tech 1 battlecruiser. Train Wing Commander. Get in the Squad Commander or Wing Commander position. Your fleets will be superior to everyone else's. (had this sig BEFORE Odyssey BC rebalance) And bring back the missile Inquisitor!! |

Paul Panala
Caldari Colonial Defense Ministry Templis CALSF
168
|
Posted - 2014.05.29 21:12:00 -
[44] - Quote
Paikis wrote:Scan Reflective Bubble Wrap.
Made from plastics or something from PI. It is a container that is produced and used like any other, except it prevents cargohold scanning on items inside of it and it can stretch to fit any size items.
The restriction? You need one for every item (or stack of items) that you want to be scan proof.
That is one idea. Another is to not have that option or anything like it. IMO being immune to scanners is something that should be limited to ships designed for it. I do not think it is good for the game if someone can pretty safely wrap 100 B in product up into a freighter and auto-pilot it across high sec. |

hmskrecik
TransMine Group German Information Network Alliance
200
|
Posted - 2014.05.29 21:28:00 -
[45] - Quote
Reaver Glitterstim wrote:The proposal is to allow a system to put things into a package of any size that is unscannable, without the use of courier contracts. I think you're missing the point. As I understand it, it's Quote:to allow a system to put things into a package of any size , no more and no less. I would use it even if it was fully scannable.
The containers and wrapping serve different purposes. Containers are to organize goods, are to be put to and taken from many times. Wrapping instead is to make packages, created once and taken from once. They complement each other. |

Evelgrivion
Calamitous-Intent Feign Disorder
296
|
Posted - 2014.05.29 21:38:00 -
[46] - Quote
hmskrecik wrote:Reaver Glitterstim wrote:The proposal is to allow a system to put things into a package of any size that is unscannable, without the use of courier contracts. I think you're missing the point. As I understand it, it's Quote:to allow a system to put things into a package of any size , no more and no less. I would use it even if it was fully scannable. The containers and wrapping serve different purposes. Containers are to organize goods, are to be put to and taken from many times. Wrapping instead is to make packages, created once and taken from once. They complement each other.
Indeed, this; the purpose of the idea is to bundle items together for one time transit, with a method that is more convenient than cargo containers. It doesn't have to be, nor should it be, un-scannable. |

Batolemaeus
Free-Space-Ranger Nulli Secunda
186
|
Posted - 2014.05.30 07:06:00 -
[47] - Quote
Reaver Glitterstim wrote:Plastic wrap is when you place a courier contract package into a courier contract. The goods inside cannot be scanned and the package has the same volume as the goods inside.
The proposal is to allow a system to put things into a package of any size that is unscannable, without the use of courier contracts.
No it isn't, and I don't care about that mechanic.
The base problem of organizing corp/alliance logistics is the inability to separate shipments for different people in a way that does not waste space without first creating a courier contract to an alt and using the resulting plastic wrap.
This is purely a UX/UI problem. I have not proposed a specific solution on purpose because I am not a UI designer and don't know Eve's backend. However, some possible ones come to mind:
- Context Menu Item. Select multiple items, right click -> plastic wrap ; Items are packaged into a shipping crate
- A a flexible volume container that shrinks and expands when items are put in or taken out. Probably the nicest solution, but perhaps unwanted because it obsoletes half of Eve's containers
|

hmskrecik
TransMine Group German Information Network Alliance
200
|
Posted - 2014.05.30 15:50:00 -
[48] - Quote
Batolemaeus wrote:
- Context Menu Item. Select multiple items, right click -> plastic wrap ; Items are packaged into a shipping crate
- Or reuse contract UI: right click -> plastic wrap -> go to the item selection as in contracts. |

Stalence
Caldari Colonial Defense Ministry Templis CALSF
19
|
Posted - 2014.05.30 16:10:00 -
[49] - Quote
Quote:Context Menu Item. Select multiple items, right click -> plastic wrap ; Items are packaged into a shipping crate
This makes complete sense and it helps makes the lives of logistics and supply chain pilots better I'm all for it.
+1 |

Noxisia Arkana
Deadspace Knights
357
|
Posted - 2014.05.30 16:44:00 -
[50] - Quote
hmskrecik wrote:I like the idea and for quite different reasons.
Now and then there happens a situation when I'd like to prepare a ship for use, just not now. Such wrapping would be nice solution, when I could wrap a ship along with all modules I'd like to use into one nice package which could have been moved wherever I want it to have.
+1 and mostly for the reason above. I'd love to ship prebuilt ships to my new pilots. |
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Batolemaeus
Free-Space-Ranger Nulli Secunda
190
|
Posted - 2014.05.30 20:33:00 -
[51] - Quote
I have amended the original post to make it clearer. As clear as my wall of text can be. Maybe. Hopefully. |

Crzykiddo
The Dark Space Initiative Scary Wormhole People
1
|
Posted - 2014.05.30 20:50:00 -
[52] - Quote
I remember back in the day when CCP was talking about the new inventory system. I was thinking that this was going to happen. Unfortunately, I was disappointed. Idea is +1 from me, as long as the contents are still scannable. |
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