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Thalen Draganos
Thunderwaffe Goonswarm Federation
43
|
Posted - 2014.09.12 18:34:00 -
[31] - Quote
Dead New wrote:Im a null sec player, who is inevitably forced into flying ceptors as they are the final word in catching and killing anything outside of blue balls and gate camps.
I dont like it, they are OP for what they are.
If your going to make other role ships use slots for thier unique abilities then why not the interceptors?
Cov Ops have cloaks, ECM have thier various modules, T3s have thier sub systems.
Why not introduce a similar module for interceptors, reasonably heavy on thier resources that they do not have effective tanks AND dps therefore making them a fleet component (like the ballance of logi in a fleet) and NOT a every man in a ceptor.
While i love getting carrier kills, ratter kills etc.. i still think a whole fleet getting through a bubble at these expensive ships INSTANTLY is unfair to those who have bought the ships.
Balance these ships similar to cov ops or T3 please so you have to fit to warp through bubbles p[lease
I agree with you on a couple things. I've been saying the "mod to gain a nullified advantage" thing since ceptors were changed to a nullified ship. Without the mod change to be nullified only if the mod is fitted, they are OP. They are literally impossible to catch unless they aggro you. I've been trying for months to figure it out. Even with Stilleto, with a sebo and being remote boosted, getting to a scan res of 4500 or more, they can still warp away quickly enough that they are in warp in before a lock and mod activation is even possible. The problem is latency. The time it takes for the server to respond to the mod activation. An insta-lock with enough time for your mod to activate is only possible if you are closer to the server than the ceptor pilot. I know that because when I lock in 1 second or less (and yes I'm being honest there) and the mod doesn't activate quickly enough to catch a ceptor, that's a problem.
I do know that above a certain level of scan res, the rest is wasted. However, I had multiple people remote boosting me at one point, and I had a scan res of around 6250 and a range of 168km in that stilleto. I still couldn't catch them. I see a real problem here. |

scorchlikeshiswhiskey
interstellar initiative Incorporated
266
|
Posted - 2014.09.12 18:34:00 -
[32] - Quote
Faren Shalni wrote:If you are com plaining about inties always being the ships that get the tackle on ratter/targets then well THAT IS WHAT ITS DESIGNED TO DO
There are lots of counters to interceptors:
Warrior II's (hell even Acolyte II's murder them) RLML's Combat Inties A Scram Webs AF's Dessies Dictors (yes these murder Inties) EAF's t1 frigs Pirate Frigs Navy Frigs Smartbombs neuts Recons And the Big one
BETTER PILOTING!!!!! I don't see the button for that on EFT, Inty's are broke!!! Too OP!! Interceptors online!! Interceptor fleets are destroying Null sec!! How can we fight such a small, fragile ship?!?! |

Belen Shields
Iskender Kebap Corp
2
|
Posted - 2014.09.12 18:39:00 -
[33] - Quote
Faren Shalni wrote:If you are com plaining about inties always being the ships that get the tackle on ratter/targets then well THAT IS WHAT ITS DESIGNED TO DO
There are lots of counters to interceptors:
Warrior II's (hell even Acolyte II's murder them) RLML's Combat Inties A Scram Webs AF's Dessies Dictors (yes these murder Inties) EAF's t1 frigs Pirate Frigs Navy Frigs Smartbombs neuts Recons And the Big one
BETTER PILOTING!!!!!
You're assuming that the Inty is long enough on grid to get a lock on it .... your argument is just wrong. I'm not whining about any AFK Kills but you're whining about your cheap-as-shirt-ship which can get you shiny killmails without getting into the danger of loosing it.
If you land in a gatecamp, all you have to do is to hit the warp-to button, wave to the gatecamp and spam the local with "Ceeya Nerds" Oh and eriting with capslock does not intensify your argument. It just makes reading your Post harder. JFYI |

Thalen Draganos
Thunderwaffe Goonswarm Federation
43
|
Posted - 2014.09.12 18:48:00 -
[34] - Quote
Faren Shalni wrote:If you are com plaining about inties always being the ships that get the tackle on ratter/targets then well THAT IS WHAT ITS DESIGNED TO DO
There are lots of counters to interceptors:
Warrior II's (hell even Acolyte II's murder them) RLML's Combat Inties A Scram Webs AF's Dessies Dictors (yes these murder Inties) EAF's t1 frigs Pirate Frigs Navy Frigs Smartbombs neuts Recons And the Big one
BETTER PILOTING!!!!!
That's only if you surprise them or they aggro you and you are fitted for it. Catching them on a gate or an undock with a good insta, when in a bubble, even with 6250 scan res in another ceptor, is still impossible. Even having mods activated before the lock doesn't help since they deactivate even if you fail to completely lock a few times. I'm going to start frapsing the attempts and putting them on youtube.
Before you start spouting about how you think I'm a low skill noob with no experience. Current Skills: 361 (Skill Points: 139,265,270.00) I've been playing eve non-stop since 2006 I've been in nullsec since 2008 Most of the time spent in frig and cruiser sized ships Tackling and Ganking anywhere there was PvP. So, I've had a lot of practice. |

scorchlikeshiswhiskey
interstellar initiative Incorporated
266
|
Posted - 2014.09.12 18:52:00 -
[35] - Quote
Belen Shields wrote:Faren Shalni wrote:If you are com plaining about inties always being the ships that get the tackle on ratter/targets then well THAT IS WHAT ITS DESIGNED TO DO
There are lots of counters to interceptors:
Warrior II's (hell even Acolyte II's murder them) RLML's Combat Inties A Scram Webs AF's Dessies Dictors (yes these murder Inties) EAF's t1 frigs Pirate Frigs Navy Frigs Smartbombs neuts Recons And the Big one
BETTER PILOTING!!!!! You're assuming that the Inty is long enough on grid to get a lock on it .... your argument is just wrong. I'm not whining about any AFK Kills but you're whining about your cheap-as-shirt-ship which can get you shiny killmails without getting into the danger of loosing it. If you land in a gatecamp, all you have to do is to hit the warp-to button, wave to the gatecamp and spam the local with "Ceeya Nerds". Oh and writing with capslock does not intensify your argument. It just makes reading your Post harder. JFYI See... funny thing. I did that in a Crow and right when I started to wave was when they popped me. I guess it's different since they were actually putting forth effort... Later on they ran from our fleet and waited for a few dozen of their closest friends to show up so they could have a fair 2-v-1 fight, but that's a different matter entirely. The point is that, while I was not in a maxed out Crow, if inty's were so horribly broken then how did I get away when my cloak only dropped after I hit Warp To? Or is the effort required to catch one that you object to? |

Faren Shalni
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
54
|
Posted - 2014.09.12 18:53:00 -
[36] - Quote
Thalen Draganos wrote:Faren Shalni wrote:If you are com plaining about inties always being the ships that get the tackle on ratter/targets then well THAT IS WHAT ITS DESIGNED TO DO
There are lots of counters to interceptors:
Warrior II's (hell even Acolyte II's murder them) RLML's Combat Inties A Scram Webs AF's Dessies Dictors (yes these murder Inties) EAF's t1 frigs Pirate Frigs Navy Frigs Smartbombs neuts Recons And the Big one
BETTER PILOTING!!!!! That's only if you surprise them or they aggro you and you are fitted for it. Catching them on a gate or an undock with a good insta, when in a bubble, even with 6250 scan res in another ceptor, is still impossible. Even having mods activated before the lock doesn't help since they deactivate even if you fail to completely lock a few times. I'm going to start frapsing the attempts and putting them on youtube. Before you start spouting about how you think I'm a low skill noob with no experience. Current Skills: 361 (Skill Points: 139,265,270.00) I've been playing eve non-stop since 2006 I've been in nullsec since 2008 Most of the time spent in frig and cruiser sized ships Tackling and Ganking anywhere there was PvP. So, I've had a lot of practice.
I do agree on the fact you cant catch them on a gate, that's just dumb. but in all other occasions A inty is just as killable as a kiting garmur/dramiel you just need to know how So Much Space |

Rivr Luzade
Coreli Corporation Ineluctable.
694
|
Posted - 2014.09.12 18:59:00 -
[37] - Quote
Belen Shields wrote: You're assuming that the Inty is long enough on grid to get a lock on it .... your argument is just wrong. I'm not whining about any AFK Kills but you're whining about your cheap-as-shirt-ship which can get you shiny killmails without getting into the danger of loosing it. If you land in a gatecamp, all you have to do is to hit the warp-to button, wave to the gatecamp and spam the local with "Ceeya Nerds". Oh and writing with capslock does not intensify your argument. It just makes reading your Post harder. JFYI
You die in a gatecamp in a properly combat-fitted ceptor if the gate campers aren't completely incapable. You die to Caracals, Talwars, Flycatchers with Light Missiles. You die to drone ships with fast drones. You die to T1 frigs, as numerously demonstrated by Suitonia. In bigger fleets you die to well tracking turret ships with webs. You die to fleets with webbers and logi. You die to fleets with missiles.
You die to Exhumers. You die to Ishtars which are fitted properly. You die to Tengus which are fitted properly. You die to carriers if they are not incapable.
You die a lot if the other players use the tools available to counter your tool. I don't see OP in ceptors. |

Stitch Kaneland
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
40
|
Posted - 2014.09.12 19:02:00 -
[38] - Quote
Belen Shields wrote:
You're assuming that the Inty is long enough on grid to get a lock on it .... your argument is just wrong.
If the inty isnt on grid long enough for you to lock him, then how is it doing any damage/tackle? just warp off.. If youre meaning a gatecamp.. then your camping tears are entertaining. So you cant grab every ship through a gate, intys are OP because of that? |

Antillie Sa'Kan
Forging Industries Silent Infinity
656
|
Posted - 2014.09.12 19:02:00 -
[39] - Quote
Belen Shields wrote:1. A Dictor is useless against an Interceptor while the Destroyerclass always was the hard counter to most Frig hulls. Hardly. An interdictor will shred an interceptor that is dumb enough to stick around. Just because you didn't kill him doesn't mean you didn't counter him.
Belen Shields wrote:2. An Interceptor is not pointable right now if fitted correctly. It's not possible, even with a 4500mm scan res Hyena. An interceptor fitted this way is almost useless in combat. It is little more than a shuttle. |

Belen Shields
Iskender Kebap Corp
2
|
Posted - 2014.09.12 19:03:00 -
[40] - Quote
scorchlikeshiswhiskey wrote: Oh and writing with capslock does not intensify your argument. It just makes reading your Post harder. JFYI
See... funny thing. I did that in a Crow and right when I started to wave was when they popped me. I guess it's different since they were actually putting forth effort... Later on they ran from our fleet and waited for a few dozen of their closest friends to show up so they could have a fair 2-v-1 fight, but that's a different matter entirely. The point is that, while I was not in a maxed out Crow, if inty's were so horribly broken then how did I get away when my cloak only dropped after I hit Warp To? Or is the effort required to catch one that you object to?[/quote]
Here's an example of a "waving"fit for a crow :
[Crow, "Ceeya Nerds" Edition] Nanofiber Internal Structure II Micro Auxiliary Power Core I Inertia Stabilizers II
Limited 1MN Microwarpdrive I Medium F-S9 Regolith Shield Induction Warp Disruptor II Adaptive Invulnerability Field II
Light Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Fury Light Missile Light Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Fury Light Missile Light Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Fury Light Missile
Small Low Friction Nozzle Joints I Small Polycarbon Engine Housing I
|

Shepard Wong Ogeko
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
776
|
Posted - 2014.09.12 19:06:00 -
[41] - Quote
I like the idea of splitting the Interceptors into one with DPS/tank and one with the bubble immunity.
Right now, since they all get the same basic Interceptor bonuses, people just use the Crow and Maladiction because they get weapons bonuses on longer range weapons along with all the Interceptor goodness.
Make it so each race gets a sturdy damage dealing Interceptor, and a bubble immune version that is only good for landing tackle. It is sort of broken in that the Interceptor is supposed to be like a scout who goes in and lands a tackle and calls in the cavalry, but instead the Interceptors are also the cavalry. |

Faren Shalni
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
54
|
Posted - 2014.09.12 19:12:00 -
[42] - Quote
Belen Shields wrote:Faren Shalni wrote:If you are com plaining about inties always being the ships that get the tackle on ratter/targets then well THAT IS WHAT ITS DESIGNED TO DO
There are lots of counters to interceptors:
Warrior II's (hell even Acolyte II's murder them) RLML's Combat Inties A Scram Webs AF's Dessies Dictors (yes these murder Inties) EAF's t1 frigs Pirate Frigs Navy Frigs Smartbombs neuts Recons And the Big one
BETTER PILOTING!!!!! You're assuming that the Inty is long enough on grid to get a lock on it .... your argument is just wrong. I'm not whining about any AFK Kills but you're whining about your cheap-as-shirt-ship which can get you shiny killmails without getting into the danger of loosing it. If you land in a gatecamp, all you have to do is to hit the warp-to button, wave to the gatecamp and spam the local with "Ceeya Nerds". Oh and writing with capslock does not intensify your argument. It just makes reading your Post harder. JFYI
The "Shiny" kills you refer to are usually carriers as they dont have a disengage like BS's and smaller have (and even if its a BS thats killed sorry but thats just the BS pilot being Bad)
Carriers can kill interceptors with warriors and acolytes (hobs are too slow) ore even, in the case of a solo inty getting point, refit off a Depot for a warp stab (the inty cant kill the depot fast enough) But more importantly: Why are you in a Carrier Unsupported?
Again i do agree that the Inty warping from gates is a little too much however in an interceptor seconds count. the longer i am spending in warp or aligning is more time for the target (i still have to find) to get away.
Im sorry if this aint you view but there are too many nullbears who dont like the fact I can warp a frig to their site out of 20 others and tackle their carrier before they can align and warp off, So Much Space |

Faren Shalni
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
54
|
Posted - 2014.09.12 19:22:00 -
[43] - Quote
Belen Shields wrote:scorchlikeshiswhiskey wrote: See... funny thing. I did that in a Crow and right when I started to wave was when they popped me. I guess it's different since they were actually putting forth effort... Later on they ran from our fleet and waited for a few dozen of their closest friends to show up so they could have a fair 2-v-1 fight, but that's a different matter entirely. The point is that, while I was not in a maxed out Crow, if inty's were so horribly broken then how did I get away when my cloak only dropped after I hit Warp To? Or is the effort required to catch one that you object to?
Here's an example of a "waving"fit for a crow : [Crow, "Ceeya Nerds" Edition] Nanofiber Internal Structure II Micro Auxiliary Power Core I Inertia Stabilizers II Limited 1MN Microwarpdrive I Medium F-S9 Regolith Shield Induction Warp Disruptor II Adaptive Invulnerability Field II Light Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Fury Light Missile Light Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Fury Light Missile Light Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Fury Light Missile Small Low Friction Nozzle Joints I Small Polycarbon Engine Housing I Antillie Sa'Kan wrote:Belen Shields wrote:1. A Dictor is useless against an Interceptor while the Destroyerclass always was the hard counter to most Frig hulls. Hardly. An interdictor will shred an interceptor that is dumb enough to stick around. Just because you didn't kill him doesn't mean you didn't counter him. Belen Shields wrote:2. An Interceptor is not pointable right now if fitted correctly. It's not possible, even with a 4500mm scan res Hyena. An interceptor fitted this way is almost useless in combat. It is little more than a shuttle. I've seen pilots multiboxing several Intys so you still have the problem that it can't be catched on a stargate so DPS ist just a matter of how many clients you can run. I am also assuming a scenario of a gatecamp. If the scenario moves from a gate to lets say a Planet and the Inty is out of Webrange, the Inty wins against sabre and an eris easily and might loose to a Heretic or Flycatcher and here comes the if, if he stays on grid without warping off as the Inty point outranges the dictor one's.
So your trying to say because you can kite me and stay out of my effective range (as I need to web you to shoot you) and disengage because you only pointed you are OP and therefore should not be able to do that........
So recons are OP, T3's are OP, Bhargests/Orthrus/Garmur are OP, Cynabals, Vagabonds, Munnins, Condors, Cormorants, Slicers, Sentinels, Jag's, Wolf's, Coercers, Deimos's, Thorax's AND a whole other list of ships that can kite and disengage when needed to Because (this is the point) They are fitted to do so are now officially declared by you to be OP and therefore needing to be nerfed so they cant out pilot you
EDIT: I will also add that the INTY is using a Long point not a scram, so therefore yopu can disengage as much as he can, its just a tad harder. So Much Space |

Belen Shields
Iskender Kebap Corp
2
|
Posted - 2014.09.12 19:28:00 -
[44] - Quote
Faren Shalni wrote:
The "Shiny" kills you refer to are usually carriers as they dont have a disengage like BS's and smaller have (and even if its a BS thats killed sorry but thats just the BS pilot being Bad)
Carriers can kill interceptors with warriors and acolytes (hobs are too slow) ore even, in the case of a solo inty getting point, refit off a Depot for a warp stab (the inty cant kill the depot fast enough) But more importantly: Why are you in a Carrier Unsupported?
Again i do agree that the Inty warping from gates is a little too much however in an interceptor seconds count. the longer i am spending in warp or aligning is more time for the target (i still have to find) to get away.
Im sorry if this aint you view but there are too many nullbears who dont like the fact I can warp a frig to their site out of 20 others and tackle their carrier before they can align and warp off,
I like explosions myself, don't get me wrong! It's fine if you can get cheap kills like carriers or whatever capital is ratting/minging, but the way Null smallscale has changed is unacceptable. 90% of Smallscale pvp is done by under 1% of Ships avaiable in EVE. Just open your Intel and count how many maledictions and crows get reported during EU or US prime..... and you can't catch them. Smallscale isn't happening except for those real pvp'ers who are willing to loose stuff. Intys are just farming AFK-Ratters, nothing more while smallscale is not existing. |

scorchlikeshiswhiskey
interstellar initiative Incorporated
266
|
Posted - 2014.09.12 19:28:00 -
[45] - Quote
Quote: So recons are OP, T3's are OP, Bhargests/Orthrus/Garmur are OP, Cynabals, Vagabonds, Munnins, Condors, Cormorants, Slicers, Sentinels, Jag's, Wolf's, Coercers, Deimos's, Thorax's AND a whole other list of ships that can kite and disengage when needed to Because (this is the point) They are fitted to do so are now officially declared by you to be OP and therefore needing to be nerfed so they cant out pilot you
It's only OP if the OP dies to it. That's the way these kinds of posts go, and I'm sorry to say that I fell into the troll-trap this time around. Of course, I could just argue that gate camps are OP and need nerfing because one time, at band camp....  |

Lugia3
Intentionally Dense Easily Excited
1269
|
Posted - 2014.09.12 19:33:00 -
[46] - Quote
Antillie Sa'Kan wrote:Wow. You would almost think that weren't some mid or high slot modules which completely ignore transversal that can totally shut down an inty. Or ships slightly larger than inties that could send super fast drones after them.
Only a battleship or curse can carry these "high slot modules which completely ignore transversal that can totally shut down an inty", aka heavy neuts. Any inty pilot with a few brain cells is going to stay way outside of the 12.6km range medium neuts have.
And if you're in a longpoint interceptor and die one on one to a drone boat... you should be laughed at and hit with an oar. No drone boats in the game can keep up with the Crow or Malediction, meaning if you for some reason CAN'T outrun or outright kill their drones, you can leave. "CCP Dolan is full of ****." - CCP Bettik
Remove Sov! |

Faren Shalni
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
54
|
Posted - 2014.09.12 19:36:00 -
[47] - Quote
Belen Shields wrote:Faren Shalni wrote:
The "Shiny" kills you refer to are usually carriers as they dont have a disengage like BS's and smaller have (and even if its a BS thats killed sorry but thats just the BS pilot being Bad)
Carriers can kill interceptors with warriors and acolytes (hobs are too slow) ore even, in the case of a solo inty getting point, refit off a Depot for a warp stab (the inty cant kill the depot fast enough) But more importantly: Why are you in a Carrier Unsupported?
Again i do agree that the Inty warping from gates is a little too much however in an interceptor seconds count. the longer i am spending in warp or aligning is more time for the target (i still have to find) to get away.
Im sorry if this aint you view but there are too many nullbears who dont like the fact I can warp a frig to their site out of 20 others and tackle their carrier before they can align and warp off,
I like explosions myself, don't get me wrong! It's fine if you can get cheap kills like carriers or whatever capital is ratting/minging, but the way Null smallscale has changed is unacceptable. 90% of Smallscale pvp is done by under 1% of Ships avaiable in EVE. Just open your Intel and count how many maledictions and crows get reported during EU or US prime..... and you can't catch them. Smallscale isn't happening except for those real pvp'ers who are willing to loose stuff. Intys are just farming AFK-Ratters, nothing more while smallscale is not existing.
Intys are used to hunt in null because of the amount of bubble's and Intel channels. In a inty you can cover a large are faster than other ships (Hey isnt that is job) you can also get to the target quickly and have a reasonable survival chance.
I use interceptors because the moment I jump into local everyone is already running. and there are many times I land ongrid as a carrier warps off because I had to do a 40 au warp instead of a 35au warp. when hunting seconds count, and one server tick is the difference between a kill or a miss So Much Space |

Belen Shields
Iskender Kebap Corp
2
|
Posted - 2014.09.12 19:37:00 -
[48] - Quote
Faren Shalni wrote:
So your trying to say because you can kite me and stay out of my effective range (as I need to web you to shoot you) and disengage because you only pointed you are OP and therefore should not be able to do that........
So recons are OP, T3's are OP, Bhargests/Orthrus/Garmur are OP, Cynabals, Vagabonds, Munnins, Condors, Cormorants, Slicers, Sentinels, Jag's, Wolf's, Coercers, Deimos's, Thorax's AND a whole other list of ships that can kite and disengage when needed to Because (this is the point) They are fitted to do so are now officially declared by you to be OP and therefore needing to be nerfed so they cant out pilot you
EDIT: I will also add that the INTY is using a Long point not a scram, so therefore yopu can disengage as much as he can, its just a tad harder.
I didn't say either that Kiting is illegitimate nor what you stated above my friend. It just sounds like you want to outline that you are the better pvper than me by turning my arguments into ridicule.
BTW I don't expect CCP to make any big changes to Intys, maybe a small increase of align time to some specific Intys (namely malediction and Crow) will do the trick. Oh and new Ingame-models for Dictors to round it up. |

Ama Atavuli
Rolled Out Triumvirate.
63
|
Posted - 2014.09.12 19:51:00 -
[49] - Quote
Interceptors are exactly where they need to be. If you split them into dps or nullified, then it's pointless to ever use the dps versions as opposed to an AF.
Interceptors are countered by literally any ship with a scram. Non-combat ceptors can barely kill anything without multiple ceptors, or as is intended, assistance. And combat interceptors are easily countered by assault frigates.
The only way an interceptor can stay on grid risk-free is to be combat ineffective and unable to point. If you are within crow LML range of a target you are susceptible to other frigates coming after you.
MJDs have further balanced interceptors in that if you decide to stay safe and longpoint a battleship/battlecruiser you risk them MJDing away, assuming they are fully aligned when they do this they can instantly warp as soon as the MJD ends.
Catching ratting carriers in interceptors is extremely difficult and generally only achieved by the carrier making a mistake. For example a ratting carrier not having light drones, not having a neut, or a falcon buddy. If the carrier pilot has any of these things an interceptor pilot is rendered completely ineffective.
A single flight of light drones with 1 drone navigation computer makes warriors go 8.1km/s, faster than most skirmish linked interceptors. Even if you are faster than warriors, unless it is by a great deal (10km/s or so, not realistic for ceptors) you will be caught unless you are going in a straight line and hence, unable to maintain point. Light drones are so much more agile than an interceptor that even if their total velocity is lower, their orbit velocity is higher, so if the inty is orbiting he will most likely be caught.
The popular trend of afktars is even harder on ceptors as generally an ishtar will have a drone nav comp and light drones of some sort.
Any sort of neut immediately hurts interceptors because it requires above average skills to maintain cap stability with your propmod and point(s) on (even with the point cap usage decrease). As soon as your propmod shuts off any drones after you catch up and your transversal drops.
Inties are even more vulnerable in massive nullsec fights. You basically have to stay off grid because someone will always come after you or cheeky members of the enemy fleet will shoot at you, or logi will send light drones after you, or you'll get target painted scrammed and 50 ishtars decide you are the next prime.
And none of this even mentions RLML cerbs or caracals.
Interceptors are easily countered by anyone interested in countering them, they take advantage of complacency and laziness, but are vulnerable to awareness and defensiveness. |

Belen Shields
Iskender Kebap Corp
2
|
Posted - 2014.09.12 20:00:00 -
[50] - Quote
Ama Atavuli wrote: Interceptors are easily countered by anyone interested in countering them, they take advantage of complacency and laziness, but are vulnerable to awareness and defensiveness.
The role of an Interceptor is to intercept and to tackle. What do you expect of a 20 mil hull?? It's not killing ratters, it's not killing ratting caps. But that is what they are used for 95% of the time. I don't rat afk, I prefer the active ratting aspect of eve. But what I would like to see is a ship that is not broken by exploiting latency physics and server ACK/ARP times.
|

Alundil
Isogen 5
661
|
Posted - 2014.09.12 20:04:00 -
[51] - Quote
Ama Atavuli wrote:Interceptors are exactly where they need to be. If you split them into dps or nullified, then it's pointless to ever use the dps versions as opposed to an AF.
Interceptors are countered by literally any ship with a scram. Non-combat ceptors can barely kill anything without multiple ceptors, or as is intended, assistance. And combat interceptors are easily countered by assault frigates.
The only way an interceptor can stay on grid risk-free is to be combat ineffective and unable to point. If you are within crow LML range of a target you are susceptible to other frigates coming after you.
MJDs have further balanced interceptors in that if you decide to stay safe and longpoint a battleship/battlecruiser you risk them MJDing away, assuming they are fully aligned when they do this they can instantly warp as soon as the MJD ends.
Catching ratting carriers in interceptors is extremely difficult and generally only achieved by the carrier making a mistake. For example a ratting carrier not having light drones, not having a neut, or a falcon buddy. If the carrier pilot has any of these things an interceptor pilot is rendered completely ineffective.
A single flight of light drones with 1 drone navigation computer makes warriors go 8.1km/s, faster than most skirmish linked interceptors. Even if you are faster than warriors, unless it is by a great deal (10km/s or so, not realistic for ceptors) you will be caught unless you are going in a straight line and hence, unable to maintain point. Light drones are so much more agile than an interceptor that even if their total velocity is lower, their orbit velocity is higher, so if the inty is orbiting he will most likely be caught.
The popular trend of afktars is even harder on ceptors as generally an ishtar will have a drone nav comp and light drones of some sort.
Any sort of neut immediately hurts interceptors because it requires above average skills to maintain cap stability with your propmod and point(s) on (even with the point cap usage decrease). As soon as your propmod shuts off any drones after you catch up and your transversal drops.
Inties are even more vulnerable in massive nullsec fights. You basically have to stay off grid because someone will always come after you or cheeky members of the enemy fleet will shoot at you, or logi will send light drones after you, or you'll get target painted scrammed and 50 ishtars decide you are the next prime.
And none of this even mentions RLML cerbs or caracals.
Interceptors are easily countered by anyone interested in countering them, they take advantage of complacency and laziness, but are vulnerable to awareness and defensiveness. This guy ^ knows. He's lost sacrificed a few inties.
I'm right behind you |

Gilda45
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
0
|
Posted - 2014.09.12 20:05:00 -
[52] - Quote
I think it's fair enough to say that the combination of nullified/dps/long point can be too much. I like the idea of splitting them into dps/scram tackle and a nullified/disruptor tackle. Of course this puts the former into the AF category unless you keep the tank low and keep it's warp speed intact along with the ability to run stable with a mwd.
Or maybe, like what I think some previous posters were hinting at, is having to make the choice of two of the three: nullified/dps/ long point.
In no way do I think we should completely eliminate nullified inties. |

Ama Atavuli
Rolled Out Triumvirate.
64
|
Posted - 2014.09.12 20:09:00 -
[53] - Quote
Belen Shields wrote:Ama Atavuli wrote: Interceptors are easily countered by anyone interested in countering them, they take advantage of complacency and laziness, but are vulnerable to awareness and defensiveness.
The role of an Interceptor is to intercept and to tackle. What do you expect of a 20 mil hull?? It's not killing ratters, it's not killing ratting caps. But that is what they are used for 95% of the time. I don't rat afk, I prefer the active ratting aspect of eve. But what I would like to see is a ship that is not broken by exploiting latency physics and server ACK/ARP times.
That is what intercepting and tackling is bro, it's catching ratters, catching people who are sleeping/botting/afk. Interceptors are also hugely common in pvp fleets as scouts, in fact there is no other ship in the game as specialized for fleet scouting as an interceptor. I don't see your point, if your point is they are too cheap, well, I say they are cheap because they die so much, and the market responds to high demand with high supply.
They already nerfed ceptors agility. Many of them (including the crow/raptor) can be caught by a ship with 5k or greater scan res. I have been killed 3 times by a multiboxer in Kalevala who assists warriors off pure dps fit tristans to an insta slasher. Not to mention oodells smartbombing moas in deklein.
I wonder how much time you've spent scouting for fleets or tackling in interceptors...
Jump through gate, initiate warp, this happens |

Bronson Hughes
Prophets of Fear
411
|
Posted - 2014.09.12 20:51:00 -
[54] - Quote
I think that 'Ceptors are in a good place as a whole. They have clearly defined roles, bonuses that are in line with those roles, and abundant counters. They are also an absolute blast to fly. The only thing I see 'ceptors needing is an internal re-balancing.
1. Fix the Craptor. It's always been bad. No need to overpower it, but it shouldn't be rendered obsolete by the Taranis. Or every other 'ceptor for that matter.
2. Balance the "Fleet" 'ceptors relative to each other. While I don't think that the Crow and Malediction are out of balance relative to other ships*, they do a fine job making the Stiletto and Ares remarkably underwhelming.
3. One thing that I could consider interesting, but hardly necessary, would be to give the "Combat" 'ceptors a range bonus to Warp Sramblers only. Instead of forcing them to be brawlers, this would give them the option to be specialist scram-kiters without interfering with the role of the "Fleet" 'ceptors. EDIT: And perhaps to go along with this, make the "Fleet" 'ceptor's bonus only apply to Warp Disruptors so they have less utility as scram-kiters.
Just my thoughts.
*They are incredibly popular and very common on killboards because they are arguably the best ships in the game at target selection. But over-representation doesn't equal overpowered. When your corp/alliance is a stickler for KB efficiency, the ability to GTFO at will to avoid a loss is a powerful motivator. CCP Falcon's thoughts on suicide ganking. Reading Comprehension: a skill so important it deserves it's own skillbook. I want to create content, not become content. |

Antillie Sa'Kan
Forging Industries Silent Infinity
661
|
Posted - 2014.09.12 20:54:00 -
[55] - Quote
Belen Shields wrote:I've seen pilots multiboxing several Intys so you still have the problem that it can't be catched on a stargate so DPS ist just a matter of how many clients you can run. I am also assuming a scenario of a gatecamp. If the scenario moves from a gate to lets say a Planet and the Inty is out of Webrange, the Inty wins against sabre and an eris easily and might loose to a Heretic or Flycatcher and here comes the if, if he stays on grid without warping off as the Inty point outranges the dictor one's. If they are in a gang then you shouldn't expect to beat them without one of your own. If they are fit for travel then they aren't a threat to anyone anyway. Also the fact that an inty, if flown smartly, can beat an interdictor in certain situations is fine. Nothing is ever a hard counter to anything else.
You are also totally ignoring Minmatar and Galente recon cruisers with their long range webs and scrams. Nevermind the super fast drones from the Dragoon and Algos or the long range neuts of the Curse. And then of course there is ECM and damps, both of which cripple any interceptor.
There are plenty of ways to kill inties. You just have to use your brain. |

Antillie Sa'Kan
Forging Industries Silent Infinity
661
|
Posted - 2014.09.12 20:56:00 -
[56] - Quote
Belen Shields wrote:The role of an Interceptor is to intercept and to tackle. What do you expect of a 20 mil hull?? It's not killing ratters, it's not killing ratting caps. Actually, this is exactly what I would expect from a class designed to quickly pin down targets. They are supposed to be good at this. Its the reason they exist. |

Antillie Sa'Kan
Forging Industries Silent Infinity
661
|
Posted - 2014.09.12 21:02:00 -
[57] - Quote
Lugia3 wrote:Only a battleship or curse can carry these "high slot modules which completely ignore transversal that can totally shut down an inty", aka heavy neuts. Any inty pilot with a few brain cells is going to stay way outside of the 12.6km range medium neuts have. I would like to introduce you to mid slot ECM and sensor dampers. Any ship can fit them and they work wonderfully against interceptors. To be fair ECM does need a specialized hull to be really effective. However damps work great on any hull.
Lugia3 wrote:And if you're in a longpoint interceptor and die one on one to a drone boat... you should be laughed at and hit with an oar. No drone boats in the game can keep up with the Crow or Malediction, meaning if you for some reason CAN'T outrun or outright kill their drones, you can leave. The Dragoon's three flights of HP and damage bonused 7.88km/sec Warrior II's would like to say "hi" as they catch and gun down any interceptor you care to name. Oh the inty can was forced to leave? I guess he was countered then. |

Antillie Sa'Kan
Forging Industries Silent Infinity
661
|
Posted - 2014.09.12 21:08:00 -
[58] - Quote
Belen Shields wrote:Some Intys are broken right now and that has come to CCP's attention. I didn't say "Ceptors are a bad thing", I said that the synergy of their fast align time and bubble immunity made them an uncatchable one-trick-pony. Half of this statement is correct. The Raptor and Crusader need a buff. The other half is just unfounded tears. Tasty ones at that. |

Immortal Chrono Pimpin
Big Rifters Inc.
111
|
Posted - 2014.09.12 21:10:00 -
[59] - Quote
op just upset that i can move all my lp goodies through his resebod gatecamp with the only risk being smartbombs. |

Antillie Sa'Kan
Forging Industries Silent Infinity
661
|
Posted - 2014.09.12 21:12:00 -
[60] - Quote
Belen Shields wrote:I like explosions myself, don't get me wrong! It's fine if you can get cheap kills like carriers or whatever capital is ratting/minging, but the way Null smallscale has changed is unacceptable. In your opinion. An opinion which others do not share.
Belen Shields wrote:90% of Smallscale pvp is done by under 1% of Ships avaiable in EVE. I don't think you understand how PVP works. Some ships are just better at small scale than others by design.
Belen Shields wrote:Just open your Intel and count how many maledictions and crows get reported during EU or US prime..... and you can't catch them. I suppose the concept of "baiting" is unknown to you.
Belen Shields wrote:Smallscale isn't happening except for those real pvp'ers who are willing to loose stuff. Intys are just farming AFK-Ratters, nothing more while smallscale is not existing. PVP in general is only done by people willing to loose stuff, this isn't new information. I see nothing wrong with farming AFK-Ratters. They should not have been AFK. |
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