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codepic
Mithril Inc
Antigo Dominion
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Posted - 2006.07.22 13:40:00 -
[1]
SOrry if this has been posted already but here we go:
Corporate Bookmarks
These days every member of the corporation needs to manage their own set of bookmarks. If we want every member to have certain bookmarks, it uses a lot of time to copy those and make sure everyone got them.. Also, it leads to a lot of unnecessary database entries for bookmarks.
CEO & Directors could maintain a set of bookmarks. Each shared bookmark folder would have permissions & roles. So we could determine whos got the permissions to view which bookmarks.
Example:
Ceo creates a new corporate bookmark folder
- He gives every corp member the permission to view (not edit) the bookmarks
- He gives directors the permission to edit the bookmarks too
- He drags a regional G2G set into the folder
BOOM: Every member has the gate to gate set visible in their people and places
Now, if we find out one of the bookmarks bein offset, a director edits/replaces the bookmark
Also, the database server will only need to maintain one set of the bookmarks even though the corporation would have 200 members...
No lag, no hassle, everyone got the bookmarks etc...
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Maya Rkell
Corsets and Carebears
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Posted - 2006.07.22 18:23:00 -
[2]
It's not a bad soloution in many ways, no... (it's not ideal, but no soloution I've seen is, and it's certainly workable)
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Reggie Stoneloader
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Posted - 2006.07.22 20:17:00 -
[3]
Sounds pretty good. It has the added bonus of preventing spies from jacking all the safespot BMs and selling them on the black market.
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Tammarr
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Posted - 2006.07.23 02:39:00 -
[4]
Very good idea, and very doable.
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codepic
Mithril Inc
Antigo Dominion
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Posted - 2006.07.23 08:09:00 -
[5]
Also, if a safespot is busted, it'd be easy to centrally delete the safespot and create a new. Adding to corporate security.
Also, a corporation which is good in security, could cycle the safespots every now and then adding further to the safespot security...
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DeckardIRL
Gallente
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Posted - 2006.07.23 11:18:00 -
[6]
Good Idea,
As has been said its not a perfect solution but one that will drastically reduce Insta copying for a start.
I have seen no feedback from the Devs on this topic in general... it is one of the most common topics... if someone has seen a Dev comments... please link it.
Deckard
______________________________________________
Watchin' the Game.... Havin' a Bud....
I shoot better on Bud..... |
Xar Zanyll
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Posted - 2006.07.23 19:45:00 -
[7]
The best thing about this idea is that it will significantly reduce server load. Such bookmarks would be the same for every member of the corp, allowing a single master access file to be used. Currently, every bookmark is its own entity, even if it is a copy. That's what drags the servers down so much.
An Explorer position should be added for creating and tweaking and managing the bookmarks. Such a position need not include director access to other corporate assets.
The best thing about this system is it still allows for personal bookmarks, while greatly reducing the overhead by centralizing those bookmarls most used.
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vinnymcg
eXceed Inc.
Ascendant Frontier
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Posted - 2006.07.23 19:51:00 -
[8]
I think this idea has been said befor but as people in this tread have allready said the devs havent said a word, are they even reading this???
Well im gona BM this topic and bump it every now and then :) if it stays at the top of the list it is more likly to be seen.
Anyway its a good idea it does seem to be able to reduce some of the server load but with out the devs saying it will or wont we will never know :/
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Vera Nosfyu
Minmatar
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Posted - 2006.07.23 21:53:00 -
[9]
Yeah. This won't solve all the problems relating to BMs, but it'll solve a few of them and it doesn't bring about any new ones.
-----------------------------------------------------------
"Violence solves all problems, no man, no problem." --Josef Stalin |
codepic
Mithril Inc
Antigo Dominion
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Posted - 2006.07.24 07:55:00 -
[10]
Well mostly I got this idea when wondering why on earth the bookmark system is designed to force people to make so much copies while in general software & database design tries to avoid copies.
EVERYBODY hates copying. I believe also CCP hates the copies they got in the database, plus of course the whinage from people when they need to copy bookmarks.
All of this would stop with centrally managed repository. Lag, duplicate entries in DB, whinage and wasted time.
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Ellaine TashMurkon
Em Pack
HUZZAH FEDERATION
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Posted - 2006.07.24 08:10:00 -
[11]
That one is a really good idea :)
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Clansworth
Caldari
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Posted - 2006.07.24 21:34:00 -
[12]
I definately aggree with this one. Seems a no-brainer quick fix for the BM database loading.
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Taran Blake
ANZAC ALLIANCE
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Posted - 2006.07.25 09:21:00 -
[13]
Hardly ever come in here, but I have to say that this is a very good idea.
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Y'laaris Brood
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Posted - 2006.07.25 12:51:00 -
[14]
 Originally by: Maya Rkell
It's not a bad soloution in many ways, no... (it's not ideal, but no soloution I've seen is, and it's certainly workable)
Agreed - thats one one the better ideas I've seen.
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BrerLapin
Caldari
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Posted - 2006.07.25 22:58:00 -
[15]
Fantastic idea
Originally by: Market Scanner
Maybe CCP needs to remove all 3D models of NPC's and replace them with white 2D squares with the NPC's name typed in the square. I miss pong.
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K Shara
Caldari
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Posted - 2006.07.26 09:57:00 -
[16]
suggested this awhile ago,
it has the good points as follows.
it takes a load from teh server as not every member of a corp would need to have a copy of a region / regions
it keeps teh current functionality of bookmarks that people now expect
it will get rid off of these bloody bm threads :)
Bad points....
the gate camping nubs will moan that eveyone has instas now and they cant kill poeple from 200km away any more
<><><><><><><><><>
Contraband
hpookde is so a word !!!!!!!!
<><><><><><><><><> |
Maya Rkell
Corsets and Carebears
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Posted - 2006.07.26 12:23:00 -
[17]
Originally by: K Shara
it will get rid off of these bloody bm threads :)
Now THAT'S wishful thinking :P
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Chaoskeeper
Minmatar
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Posted - 2006.07.26 12:36:00 -
[18]
well I see it this way.
if you make corporation BMs and only limit the personal BMs to let's say 200. - you'll drastically reduce the BMs
- since only player made corporations can use that feature, you will force ppl to join them.
- don't let noob corpers use personal BMs (block them if you're in one) -> macro killer
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vinnymcg
eXceed Inc.
Ascendant Frontier
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Posted - 2006.07.27 22:05:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Chaoskeeper
well I see it this way.
if you make corporation BMs and only limit the personal BMs to let's say 200. - you'll drastically reduce the BMs
- since only player made corporations can use that feature, you will force ppl to join them.
- don't let noob corpers use personal BMs (block them if you're in one) -> macro killer
NICE!! Kill all macroers
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Reggie Stoneloader
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Posted - 2006.07.28 15:32:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Chaoskeeper
- don't let noob corpers use personal BMs (block them if you're in one) -> macro killer
Nah, newbies need to learn how BMs work, too. Just limit them to 200. I don't like crippling gameplay just to mess with macroers.
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Nicoli Voldkif
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Posted - 2006.07.28 19:14:00 -
[21]
Great Idea know this would reduce the amount of BMs all my corp mates have from around 400k to about 10k
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Brogan Dagarkin
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Posted - 2006.07.29 02:00:00 -
[22]
/signed
Limiting the amount of personal bookmarks will also have the effect of limiting alt spies and alt scouts who remain in newb corporations. It will also have the effect of limiting traders and industry based players who don't want to join a corp. I believe that the limitation of personal bookmarks would actually encourage players to join or form their own corporations.
On another note, can I offer another suggestion for this idea: Allow player corporations (or individuals in player corporations) to 'subscribe' to other corporation's bookmark list.
This would help bookmark sellers as they could then just charge a monthly fee to allow entire corporations, alliances or individuals access to their bookmark set. Corporations wouldn't have to buy and update their own set, they would just have to subscribe to a trusted exploration corporation.
If you allowed each folder in the corporation bookmark area to have different access rights you could also have situations where alliances may pay more to stop other alliances/corporations having access to bookmarks within their region, unless the other alliance/corporation bookmark it themselves.
Finally, I would hope that the right click shortcut would have a menu for each corporation set you subscribe to and under that menu it would have the bookmarks from that corporation.
BTW, great idea which, as several have posted before me, the many positives far outweigh the few negatives. Would it be possible to include this with the corporations update that is being looked at? |
codepic
Mithril Inc
Antigo Dominion
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Posted - 2006.07.30 10:25:00 -
[23]
Originally by: K Shara
Bad points....
the gate camping nubs will moan that eveyone has instas now and they cant kill poeple from 200km away any more
Is that a bad point? Hehe, seriously... In our corporation EVERYONE has instas even without corporate bookmarks. It's just the tedious task of copying and making sure everyone got them...
MAYBE
CCP would like to add a new contract at some point that a bookmark dealer could allow people to SUBSCRIBE for sets of bookmarks. Personal, Corporate & Alliance subscriptions would be priced differently and this would also make sure we get rid of crappy incomplete BM sets & escrow scams...
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Ellaine TashMurkon
Em Pack
HUZZAH FEDERATION
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Posted - 2006.07.30 10:47:00 -
[24]
Just like in my bookmark upgrades proposal ;) (in sig)
---
Bookmark improvements
Player owned brokers |
Clais Monaige
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Posted - 2006.07.30 15:02:00 -
[25]
I fully support the idea of corporate bookmarks, would abolish much nasty work, imho.
Originally by: DeckardIRL
I have seen no feedback from the Devs on this topic in general... it is one of the most common topics... if someone has seen a Dev comments... please link it.
Sorry, no links, but iirc the devs don't like the way bookmarks are used as instas, mostly because of it's server lag (an improvement in the bookmarking code could also make bookmarking easier, e.g. copying dozens of bookmarks in a second or so  ).
_____________________________
- be excellent to each other -
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Mr Xofar
Minmatar
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Posted - 2006.08.04 03:33:00 -
[26]
Awesome idea, even though I'm not in a player owned corp, which brings me to my question on this.
What about non player corp's? Are Players who choose to not join a player corp to be required to rely on their own BM making?
Or, would it be too far off to introduce the whole idea of CorpBM instas to new players by providing them with a few 1.0 security system BM's for running missions. CCP could even make them mission oriented, and work their way into acquiring instas for 0.9 and then 0.8 security systems with the Non-player or even the starter University corps.
These "free bees" would have little or no effect on gate gankers since they don't gank in Hi Security systems. I'm talking 0.8 and above here. But, the new players won't feel that immediate discovery of "OMG! It takes so long to travel." If they want more instas than that they would either have to make them, which could be introduced in the tutorial, or join a corp, or buy the old instas that I assume would still be around.
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codepic
Mithril Inc
Antigo Dominion
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Posted - 2006.08.04 14:04:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Mr Xofar
What about non player corp's? Are Players who choose to not join a player corp to be required to rely on their own BM making?
This could maybe be addressed by a new type of "Contract" when Kali comes so that BM providers could create contracts for people to subscribe for sets of bookmarks as suggested above. You could subscribe as a person/corporation/alliance.
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Mr Xofar
Minmatar
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Posted - 2006.08.05 16:23:00 -
[28]
Okay, Oveur, there you have it. Most likely the best, most workable, idea yet.
/signed
[---------------------------------------------]
Incompetent |
Brogan Dagarkin
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Posted - 2006.08.08 16:22:00 -
[29]
Edited by: Brogan Dagarkin on 08/08/2006 16:22:18
How did this get all the way to page 4?
No one will see it there and we need more comments or just /sign.
I know /signing doesn't work since I remember the 12 page small freighter topic which had so many /signs and still no comment from Devs but I'd still like to see others comments on this.
Corporation Bookmark Folder(s) - http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=234417SHIP |
Reggie Stoneloader
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Posted - 2006.08.08 21:58:00 -
[30]
/signed and all, but it's not a polished idea just yet. What do we think about the limits on individual bookmarks? Should each character be able to store 200 bookmarks of their own, and corps have an unlimited capacity for them? How would bookmarks be transferred from corp to corp, or individual to corp?
I really like the idea of having corp sets be accessed via role privileges. Everyone gets the gate and station instas, but the safespots, POSes and secret ammo stash can bookmarks are only available to wing leaders or above. Awesome.
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Attractive Spokesmodel
Gallente
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Posted - 2006.08.08 22:25:00 -
[31]
I like the idea of corporate bookmarks as it has been outlined here... But not at the expense of personal bookmarks...
My corp maintains a pretty exhaustive set of marks and it would be great to have those automatically available to any new corpie.
But I also solo around a bit and keep marks, not just instas, to certain spots. Also, when you finish a mission, don't you just bookmark the cans, kill the mission, then come out in a looter?
It seems that some folks suggestions would kill that functionality. I don't want to lose that capability. Of course, it isn't like we are in danger of this revolutionary idea being implemented quickly...
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Scorpyn
Caldari
Infinitus Odium
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Posted - 2006.08.08 22:50:00 -
[32]
I like this, but only as a partial solution. In fact, it's not really addressing what seems to be considered to be the real problems with bookmarks, but rather the logistics with them.
In fact, it appears that this idea will increase the current non-logistical problem with bookmarks.
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Maya Rkell
Sebiestor tribe
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Posted - 2006.08.08 23:02:00 -
[33]
That's why I'd not take it alone, but it sure does fix the logistics side dosn't it.
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Scorpyn
Caldari
Infinitus Odium
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Posted - 2006.08.08 23:11:00 -
[34]
Definitely.
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Mr Xofar
Minmatar
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Posted - 2006.08.09 03:41:00 -
[35]
Edited by: Mr Xofar on 09/08/2006 03:42:43
Originally by: Attractive Spokesmodel
I like the idea of corporate bookmarks as it has been outlined here... But not at the expense of personal bookmarks...
My corp maintains a pretty exhaustive set of marks and it would be great to have those automatically available to any new corpie.
But I also solo around a bit and keep marks, not just instas, to certain spots. Also, when you finish a mission, don't you just bookmark the cans, kill the mission, then come out in a looter?
It seems that some folks suggestions would kill that functionality. I don't want to lose that capability. Of course, it isn't like we are in danger of this revolutionary idea being implemented quickly...
I don't see any reason why personal bookmarks should be affected. As I understand it, one of the main focuses of changing instas is to reduce the lag cause by low priority copying of 1000's of bookmarks. CorpBM's seems to cure that problem. That cure may kill the insta market however, at least to a point. And that would also reduce the copying of bm's as well, I imagine.
I make all my own BM's. I could save alot of time if I just bought them, but I don't know a good source and I imagine they are expensive. Point is, I'm doing just fine without having to purchase them and if CCP implemented CorpBM's and limited the ability to copy 1000's of BM's, then it wouldn't break my heart.
Maybe limit copying of BM's to a selection of 10-20 or so, (don't kill that number Maya, it's just a suggestion). This would allow the effective transfer of safespots and other non station/gate bm's to other players. They could still tranfer station/gate BM's, but only a limited number, thereby reducing the copying process even further.
Another suggestion would be that BM's within 20km of a gate/station simply cannot be copied and transfered. If you want instas, make'em, or get them from your player/non-player Corp. This would certainly kill the insta market, but safespots and the like would still be copyable, and sellable.
[---------------------------------------------]
Incompetent |
Sensemann
Minmatar
eXceed Inc.
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Posted - 2006.08.23 12:35:00 -
[36]
/signed
|
Saladira
Caldari
Bulgarian Mafia Squad
The OSS
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Posted - 2006.08.24 08:48:00 -
[37]
/signed
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Ellaine TashMurkon
MetaForge
Knights Of the Southerncross
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Posted - 2006.08.24 09:03:00 -
[38]
2Corp bookmarks are good :)
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Za Po
Caldari
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Posted - 2006.08.24 09:25:00 -
[39]
I love the idea of corp bookmarks. It sounds like something the devs could keep even when/if the BM system is finally replaced.
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codepic
Mithril Inc
Xelas Alliance
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Posted - 2006.08.24 12:07:00 -
[40]
Could this also become a tactical thing... Like in many military/space games, there's a mission briefing and coordinates given, uploaded to your ships computer.
Say, a covops pilot (who is a director) can make bookmarks 5 minutes before an OP, shares them and all pilots in the corp has this "Mission Data Uploaded"...
Also, if an SS is blown in the middle of the OP for example with probes, it can be easily removed from every pilot to avoid them warping to it...
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vasco di
Gallente
Mithril Inc
Xelas Alliance
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Posted - 2006.08.24 17:58:00 -
[41]
Edited by: vasco di on 24/08/2006 17:59:28
Codepic,
Great idea, hope it works out.
Vasco.
null |
Bin Matar
Fallen Angel's
Xelas Alliance
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Posted - 2006.08.24 18:44:00 -
[42]
/signed . Excellent idea
Anything that stops staring at folders waiting while nothing happens gets my vote.
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Shoulin
Mithril Inc
Xelas Alliance
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Posted - 2006.08.25 18:29:00 -
[43]
/signed
Great Idea!!
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Black Torment
Caldari
White Wolves Defence league
E.R.A
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Posted - 2006.08.26 00:20:00 -
[44]
Genius. Why didn't I think of that :D *pats OP on the back*
Devs - Get this on the drawingboard ASAP, or at least a comment on your thoughts behind it, I'll get everyone to bump this thread til kingdom come til we hear something on this because its a flawless plan that should not be ignored.
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TheBelgarion
Caldari
Kinetic Vector
Freelancer Alliance
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Posted - 2006.08.26 10:41:00 -
[45]
/agreed
Corp BM should be non-copyable tho
( only for the CEO)
so u cant make any copied of the BM and give it or even SELL it to someone else ..
--------------------------------------------
upgrade to Combat Log - additional Information |
Nunea
|
Posted - 2006.08.26 11:06:00 -
[46]
Good idea.
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Aldir Rundal
Gallente
The Order of Chivalry
The OSS
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Posted - 2006.08.26 18:07:00 -
[47]
BUMP!
Great Idea. Needs to implemented yesterday!
Recruiting |
codepic
Mithril Inc
Xelas Alliance
|
Posted - 2006.08.26 18:29:00 -
[48]
Originally by: TheBelgarion
/agreed
Corp BM should be non-copyable tho
( only for the CEO)
so u cant make any copied of the BM and give it or even SELL it to someone else ..
I think the access should be role-based (read/write/copy/delete) so a director who participates in the bookmark management, can backup the bookmarks prior to deletion or editing...
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t72Buttz
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Posted - 2006.08.26 19:25:00 -
[49]
great idea! |
E'Veel P'Tiga
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Posted - 2006.08.26 23:06:00 -
[50]
/signed
_______________
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PoPa
Gallente
The Renegade Order
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Posted - 2006.08.28 11:41:00 -
[51]
This idea definately has my vote.
- = Join The Renegade Order Now! = - |
Orin Fatch
Eve Defence Force
Ascendant Frontier
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Posted - 2006.08.28 13:19:00 -
[52]
/signed
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XZeroXCompanyX
|
Posted - 2006.08.28 14:33:00 -
[53]
/signed
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herasin
|
Posted - 2006.08.28 14:35:00 -
[54]
/signed
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TuRtLe HeAd
The Bratwurst Burglars
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Posted - 2006.08.30 14:28:00 -
[55]
Unquestionably the best solution yet.
Everyone thinks from a single player view, Your Multi-person approach may well have provided the best solution Ever ! |
Thuul'Khalat
Phoenix Wing
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Posted - 2006.08.31 07:29:00 -
[56]
Indeed the best idea presented so far, and very disappointing that no dev (as usual) have taken the time to comment on it.
---
As one life ends, another rises from the ashes. Ingame Channel - "Phoenixpublic" |
Baleorg
Gallente
Guys of Sarcasm
|
Posted - 2006.08.31 15:29:00 -
[57]
ye. i like it...
there are already "jettison for self, jettison for corp" cans, why not "bookmark for self, bookmark for corp" somehow
(sorry too lazy to read whole thread :-P, will do later )
---
Beware: This Post may contain sarcasm
My EVE-Universum (in work) (works ingame aswell) |
codepic
Mithril Inc
Xelas Alliance
|
Posted - 2006.08.31 15:40:00 -
[58]
Hehe, actually, who knows the BMs could reside in the corp hangar in a sec can... This would allow role access management and avoid ppl (esp. spies) yanking out the BMs from the containers 
Our People & Places would just show BMs from the cans in corp hangar within the region we currently are in. Which would get us rid of loading by default BMs from other regions... => less loading & lag
The can name could be the corporate BM folder name.
Never thought of it this way really. Depends a lot on how eve is coded but it might be a working idea....
Ofc, you'd need always travel to your office to manage the bookmarks but I doubt it'd be that big deal...
P.S. Baleorg, don't I know you?
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Baleorg
Gallente
Guys of Sarcasm
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Posted - 2006.08.31 16:03:00 -
[59]
Originally by: codepic
P.S. Baleorg, don't I know you?
hmm. no clue :) your name sounds somewhat "i know you" tbh
perhaps in some other games.. ultima online (torvak/aldi) or starwarsgalaxied (http://swg.xtrapas.de/buffing.jpg the fastest doc on the server ;) ) )
or.. wow *eew*
http://wow.xtrapas.de would be there as torvak i believe
---
Beware: This Post may contain sarcasm
My EVE-Universum (in work) (works ingame aswell) |
codepic
Mithril Inc
Xelas Alliance
|
Posted - 2006.08.31 16:07:00 -
[60]
Hehe, now I know, you're from CAS =)
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Recco
Mithril Inc
Xelas Alliance
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Posted - 2006.08.31 16:08:00 -
[61]
Well you can also look at this matter from this side.
How many active corporation are ingame [5000 - 8000] example
How many active players are ingame [80.000-90.000] example
Well if my examples are somewere near the actual numbers. OMG it would reduce the lag so much.
10.000 copy¦s instead of 100.000 ?? wouldnt that solve some problems.??
They already nerfd the drones due to reduce of lag.
Now they are gona nerf 5bm to copy eche time, to reduce lag ?
GM¦s plz read this. idea and atleast try to make it work.
p.s. btw I realy hate opening my People& Places.. dont you ?
___________________________________
http://www.mithrilinc.com
 |
Baleorg
Gallente
Guys of Sarcasm
|
Posted - 2006.08.31 17:40:00 -
[62]
Edited by: Baleorg on 31/08/2006 17:42:48
Originally by: codepic
Hehe, now I know, you're from CAS =)
ye i started there. guess i was there for about 4 months before moving on finaly, doesnt hurt that much as Everyone stated :-P
poor casa clubs though :-)
i sometimes chill around in rookie help with my lots of macro answers of my buddys new account .P
perhaps i get accepted into isd thingy i applied
---
Beware: This Post may contain sarcasm
My EVE-Universum (in work) (works ingame aswell) |
Baleorg
Gallente
Guys of Sarcasm
|
Posted - 2006.08.31 17:40:00 -
[63]
Edited by: Baleorg on 31/08/2006 17:42:04
DELETE PLZ
---
Beware: This Post may contain sarcasm
My EVE-Universum (in work) (works ingame aswell) |
Kraven Kor
Sturmgrenadier Inc
R i s e
|
Posted - 2006.08.31 18:53:00 -
[64]
/signed.
Brilliant!
Strength through Unity, Discipline, and Honor! |
Karash Amerius
Amarr
O.E.C
|
Posted - 2006.08.31 20:33:00 -
[65]
Another idea is that people in the Newbie NPC corps dont get this service. Therefore, if you plan on staying "safe" from war declarations and such, you have to have some sort of penalty.
We can just say that creating a Corporation gives you a valid shared starmap charter.
Merc Blog |
codepic
Mithril Inc
Xelas Alliance
|
Posted - 2006.09.01 03:39:00 -
[66]
Yes, people in NPC or noob-corps wouldn't get this...
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nomlasmit
Elite Angels
The OSS
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Posted - 2006.09.01 08:04:00 -
[67]
/signed
Spent far too much time looking at the inside of a station, I have 1 guy who has barely been in space in 6 months for all the moving around and copying.
Please god save us from the BM hell...
Nomlasmit
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codepic
Mithril Inc
Xelas Alliance
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Posted - 2006.09.01 13:56:00 -
[68]
During our last move, our ceo spent a week copying BMs for our directors & allied corp directors...
Wasted time I'd say as ceos have a lot more duties than that...
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Black Torment
Caldari
White Wolves Defence league
E.R.A
|
Posted - 2006.09.04 09:39:00 -
[69]
Bumpity bump after recent error messages regarding bookmarks..
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Cattraknoff
Caldari
Sha Kharn Corp
Ascendant Frontier
|
Posted - 2006.09.04 22:38:00 -
[70]
/signed
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Jessica May
|
Posted - 2006.09.05 06:11:00 -
[71]
Originally by: codepic
Yes, people in NPC or noob-corps wouldn't get this...
I don't see why a 2 tier system of 'people who can have BMs' and 'people who can't have BMs' should exist.
If poeple want to stay in a Noob corp then it's a perfectly ledgitimate form of game play. But this idea is try force them to play the game the way someone else wants them too. The solution has to be equal for ALL players no matter what game play they wish to play. |
codepic
Mithril Inc
Xelas Alliance
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Posted - 2006.09.05 08:42:00 -
[72]
Originally by: Jessica May
I don't see why a 2 tier system of 'people who can have BMs' and 'people who can't have BMs' should exist.
Ofc, noob corp players can have BOOKMARKS. But who would handle Corporate Bookmarks as there's no CEO/Directors??? In Noob corp, everyone needs to maintain their own set. Or if in Kali there would be a new contract type "Bookmark Subscription", people in noob corps could subscribe to bookmark sets from a bookmark provider. But again, everyone would need to do this in person. As opposed to player corps where the whole corp could subscribe as corp and all pilots in corp would get the bookmarks...
Noob corp is already a 2-tier system. You cannot be war decced, you got loads of restrictions, you can't shoot each other, etc... etc...
Originally by: Jessica May
If poeple want to stay in a Noob corp then it's a perfectly ledgitimate form of game play. But this idea is try force them to play the game the way someone else wants them too. The solution has to be equal for ALL players no matter what game play they wish to play.
Yes, it's perfectly legitimate for you to stay in a noob corp. But then again, you'll loose half of what eve is about. It's all your choice to make but don't demand equality of you want to stick with an unequal corp. If you want to keep integrity for yourself, you're gonna pay for it.
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Jessica May
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Posted - 2006.09.05 10:14:00 -
[73]
Edited by: Jessica May on 05/09/2006 10:15:11
Originally by: codepic
Ofc, noob corp players can have BOOKMARKS. But who would handle Corporate Bookmarks as there's no CEO/Directors??? In Noob corp, everyone needs to maintain their own set. Or if in Kali there would be a new contract type "Bookmark Subscription", people in noob corps could subscribe to bookmark sets from a bookmark provider. But again, everyone would need to do this in person. As opposed to player corps where the whole corp could subscribe as corp and all pilots in corp would get the bookmarks...
Noob corp is already a 2-tier system. You cannot be war decced, you got loads of restrictions, you can't shoot each other, etc... etc...
Agreed there are tiers in other ascepts but you are suggesting 2 tiers on something as basic as travelling the universe. Why should a PC-Corp player have travel provided quicker and relatively safer than NPC Corp players?
You suggest that NPC Corp players CAN have Bookmarks, OK, so they make thousands of Bookmarks just like now. They leave the NPC Corp and join a PC Corp, they then get access to the Corp BM's. Do you think they'll delete their personal BMs? Nope, they be kept for "Just In Case" (eg they leave the corp)
Originally by: codepic
Yes, it's perfectly legitimate for you to stay in a noob corp. But then again, you'll loose half of what eve is about. It's all your choice to make but don't demand equality of you want to stick with an unequal corp. If you want to keep integrity for yourself, you're gonna pay for it.
Agreed, but some people don't want to see the other half. Just like some people are hardcore PvP'ers and others dream of Veldspar the game works for every style of player. Trying to push people into playing a set way takes that option away. I sit in my corner of 0.0 and I'm very happy, others might think I'm as mad as a box of frogs and stick to Empire...As long as they enjoy it then good on them!
If anything secure space should have this 'Warp to 0km' everyone is going on about and unsecure shouldn't. Why? Well surely with Empire having widely travelled trade routes then ships computers should have highly accurate star charts. Like a motorway has lots of signs for various places and B raods don't. |
Black Torment
Caldari
White Wolves Defence league
E.R.A
|
Posted - 2006.09.05 12:03:00 -
[74]
Originally by: Jessica May
Edited by: Jessica May on 05/09/2006 10:15:11
Originally by: codepic
Ofc, noob corp players can have BOOKMARKS. But who would handle Corporate Bookmarks as there's no CEO/Directors??? In Noob corp, everyone needs to maintain their own set. Or if in Kali there would be a new contract type "Bookmark Subscription", people in noob corps could subscribe to bookmark sets from a bookmark provider. But again, everyone would need to do this in person. As opposed to player corps where the whole corp could subscribe as corp and all pilots in corp would get the bookmarks...
Noob corp is already a 2-tier system. You cannot be war decced, you got loads of restrictions, you can't shoot each other, etc... etc...
Agreed there are tiers in other ascepts but you are suggesting 2 tiers on something as basic as travelling the universe. Why should a PC-Corp player have travel provided quicker and relatively safer than NPC Corp players?
You suggest that NPC Corp players CAN have Bookmarks, OK, so they make thousands of Bookmarks just like now. They leave the NPC Corp and join a PC Corp, they then get access to the Corp BM's. Do you think they'll delete their personal BMs? Nope, they be kept for "Just In Case" (eg they leave the corp)
If you have a better, realistic solution then contribute it. The majority of people in newbie corps don't have the entire universe of eve in personal bookmarks anyway so you're making a huge point out of something fairly insignificant. Even if someone in the newbie corp WAS able to manage bookmarks, do you think its right for a one day old player to be able to travel the universe with a full set of instas?
Theres nothing stopping them travelling the universe, they just don't have the benefit of a director to provide bookmarks for them. Corps already do this, copy must-have bookmark sets for its members, this is just a way of cutting down strain on the server and copying time.
Next you'll be saying to give the newbie corp a corp hangar filled with modules, ships, ammo and blueprints :/
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Shailo Koljas
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Posted - 2006.09.05 12:30:00 -
[75]
/signed
Very nice solution, the same concept has come up on another forum I frequent. Acts just like the hard-links used by Exchange and Groupwise to manage attachments (in other words, it's been done before, so there's examples! :) |
Jessica May
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Posted - 2006.09.05 12:59:00 -
[76]
Originally by: Black Torment
If you have a better, realistic solution then contribute it.
I have, thanks for your interest.
Originally by: Black Torment
The majority of people in newbie corps don't have the entire universe of eve in personal bookmarks anyway so you're making a huge point out of something fairly insignificant. Even if someone in the newbie corp WAS able to manage bookmarks, do you think its right for a one day old player to be able to travel the universe with a full set of instas?
No, you're missing the point, I'm not saying NPC Corps should have BM I think the WHOLE idea of corp BM isn't workable.
Originally by: Black Torment
Theres nothing stopping them travelling the universe, they just don't have the benefit of a director to provide bookmarks for them. Corps already do this, copy must-have bookmark sets for its members, this is just a way of cutting down strain on the server and copying time.
No, but by having personal BM AND Corp BM's you have increased load. Plus think of it this way, Corp BM's would require all corp member access to thay same single set of data. As travelling is a common occurance then you could have 100-200 players accessing that set of data all at the same time. Try getting that many players access the same Corp hanger in the same station.
Originally by: Black Torment
Next you'll be saying to give the newbie corp a corp hangar filled with modules, ships, ammo and blueprints :/
Why you are you making suggestions not connect to this discussion? |
codepic
Mithril Inc
Xelas Alliance
|
Posted - 2006.09.05 14:38:00 -
[77]
Originally by: Jessica May
I think the WHOLE idea of corp BM isn't workable.
Based on what?
Corp Bookmarks have several significant POSITIVE effects
- It removes the need of copying, keeping track of, sharing the bookmarks that are essential to corporate operations to simply copying & configuring one set and sending evemail to corp to acknowledge players there is such a new set available
- It decreases the total amount of bookmark entries in the database to a fraction from what it is today... Because every member don't need their own copy, this leads to less lag & server load
- It increases the security of corporation bookmarks by making it impossible for a spy to snag the corp safespots and run. Still allowing every trusted member to use them
So it addresses SEVERAL current problems in the player corps. Why would we need to deny this from player corps just in case some noob/npc corp members might whine??? Following the same logic, we should remove corp hangars too?
ESPECIALLY, when further developed this could be useful for noob/npc corp players...
- When bookmarks could be instantiated & shared, it'd only need a new contract type (bookmark subscription). This is not much change to corp bookmarks as it ALREADY is players subscribing to sets of bookmarks through their corporation...
- Noob/noc corp players could this way subscribe to bookmark sets from bookmark providers. Paying a small monthly/yearly fee for the sets as opposed to paying a big one time fee for one copy which YOU have to keep up to date
Now, keep in mind that the future will bring us a new contract system. And every pilot will have their contract history. Say, you become a bookmark service provider and people subscribe to your bookmarks. YOU as a provider will need to keep the bookmarks updated and working....
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Black Torment
Caldari
White Wolves Defence league
E.R.A
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Posted - 2006.09.05 22:00:00 -
[78]
Originally by: Jessica May
Originally by: Black Torment
If you have a better, realistic solution then contribute it.
I have, thanks for your interest.
Post or link it then?
Originally by: Jessica May
Originally by: Black Torment
The majority of people in newbie corps don't have the entire universe of eve in personal bookmarks anyway so you're making a huge point out of something fairly insignificant. Even if someone in the newbie corp WAS able to manage bookmarks, do you think its right for a one day old player to be able to travel the universe with a full set of instas?
No, you're missing the point, I'm not saying NPC Corps should have BM I think the WHOLE idea of corp BM isn't workable.
You make statements but fail to back them up with reasons. Seriously, think your arguments through.
Originally by: Jessica May
Originally by: Black Torment
Theres nothing stopping them travelling the universe, they just don't have the benefit of a director to provide bookmarks for them. Corps already do this, copy must-have bookmark sets for its members, this is just a way of cutting down strain on the server and copying time.
No, but by having personal BM AND Corp BM's you have increased load. Plus think of it this way, Corp BM's would require all corp member access to thay same single set of data. As travelling is a common occurance then you could have 100-200 players accessing that set of data all at the same time. Try getting that many players access the same Corp hanger in the same station.
As i said, if everyone in noob corps has a full set of bookmarks for the eve universe I'll eat my ibis. You are nitpicking a good idea because of one or two insignificant factors. And everyone having access to the same database entry for a bookmark is far far less server load than everyone having their own individual database entry with exactly the same data in.
Originally by: Jessica May
Originally by: Black Torment
Next you'll be saying to give the newbie corp a corp hangar filled with modules, ships, ammo and blueprints :/
Why you are you making suggestions not connect to this discussion?
I'm making similarities between one stupid rant and another, its not intended to be taken literally. Train discussion to level 5 :)
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ET PostAlt
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Posted - 2006.09.06 09:50:00 -
[79]
YeS, marvelous idea! You seem to agree with a lot of people that something has to be done about instas. However, your idea for a solution and mine, aswell as others opinions of a solution is, well, let's put it mildly, pretty diFfErEnt. You need to consider that you want to remove as much as possible of the instas. noT a differnet kind of Database structure and instas handling. And I'm confused, really, why would you want to retain the instas in the database and not just make them skillwise as sugessted in other posts ? That would decrease the database size by, hell, ALOT. You would still have the same situation regarding every insta corpbookmark or not, because it's just like if you have them in your folder as your set of database entries, I don't see the difference, it's either calling this set or that set of entries in a database, but you are still calling/checking up on them the same way, thus the same lag. I could be wrong because i don't know how they would implement your idea databasewise, maybe REcReATE the entire database StrucTuRE? Hmmmmmm, that makes me think.
Well, and what about all those poor nuuuooob suckers that want to have instas, should they not be able to have instas as everyone else, or do you want to force them to join a corp ASAP when they start playing? What about everyone else not wanting to be a part of a corp, they just wanna be poor and lonesome?
Please consider the pros/cons of your suggestion regarding peoples playstyles/interest and the number of database entries before making a post regarding instas.
Your suggestion is a suggestion, however it isn't a good one I would say.
Whine, whine, whine. Who cares in a hundred years.
[CCCP, Accomdating the whims of the griefers since the game start]Ö [CCCP's stamp of approval]Ö
Originally by: Price Watcher
Please, CCCP Sir. May we have another server crash to go along with all the wonderful NEW CONTENT? May we have more LAG? More BUGS? Pretty please with sugar on top?
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Chaoskeeper
Minmatar
Confederation of Red Moon
Ascendant Frontier
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Posted - 2006.09.06 10:12:00 -
[80]
Originally by: codepic
Yes, people in NPC or noob-corps wouldn't get this...
actually they could not, since you need a director to give "bookmark manager" roles.. there's no such thing in NPC corps.
and I'm all for that idea, but I got something to add which will light up the little flaming a bit.
I think copying of BMs shouldn't be allowed either. If you want to get into an enemy or unknown territory you shouldn't be able just to buy the BMs from escrow and basta... no, you should take your own little ship and make them on your own (in this care the ones that can make BMs for the corp).
This wouldn't just kill any "useless" BMs but like that corporations have to make big efforts to get a BM set.
and covert ops get another very important role.
flame away
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ET PostAlt
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Posted - 2006.09.06 10:38:00 -
[81]
Originally by: Chaoskeeper
Originally by: codepic
Yes, people in NPC or noob-corps wouldn't get this...
actually they could not, since you need a director to give "bookmark manager" roles.. there's no such thing in NPC corps.
and I'm all for that idea, but I got something to add which will light up the little flaming a bit.
I think copying of BMs shouldn't be allowed either. If you want to get into an enemy or unknown territory you shouldn't be able just to buy the BMs from escrow and basta... no, you should take your own little ship and make them on your own (in this care the ones that can make BMs for the corp).
This wouldn't just kill any "useless" BMs but like that corporations have to make big efforts to get a BM set.
and covert ops get another very important role.
flame away
heheheheheee :) m8 , he did write WOULD NOT = could not, written by you.
Look for yourself :)
Whine, whine, whine. Who cares in a hundred years.
[CCCP, Accomdating the whims of the griefers since the game start]Ö [CCCP's stamp of approval]Ö
Originally by: Price Watcher
Please, CCCP Sir. May we have another server crash to go along with all the wonderful NEW CONTENT? May we have more LAG? More BUGS? Pretty please with sugar on top?
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Rayvenous
Amarr
Viziam
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Posted - 2006.09.06 10:46:00 -
[82]
/signed |
Das Yad
0utbreak
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Posted - 2006.09.06 17:32:00 -
[83]
Nice idea, i think that players should still have thier own bookmarks. but corporation bookmarks for g2g's & supply spots etc would be really nice. should eliminate a fair bit of server lag too. i really hate when we move area's cause it means new bookmarks copying for corpmates etc 
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codepic
Mithril Inc
Xelas Alliance
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Posted - 2006.09.06 18:24:00 -
[84]
Agree... I don't think personal bookmarks even could be removed as how otherwise anyone could come up with a set to share?
I mean it HAS TO be pilot making those bookmarks first before sharing for the corporation...
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