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Tarantella Serpantine The Syndicate Inc Ascendant Frontier	Posted - 2006.07.25 11:14:00 - [61] I fail to see what peoples problem is with ASCN operating an NBSI policy in catch. If you're worried about getting killed, then either get +ve or go back to empire, neither one is impossible to do. Although based on the majority of negative responces i doubt many people who have posted here are openly worried about it based on their comments on how they percieve ASCN's combat abilities. In which case they're complaining for the sake of complaining at ASCN, which really is no grounds for anything reasonable. So really you have to decide; either you're afraid of getting killed by us, or you're just being unreasonable :p Oh and to the piracy comments, ASCN policy is not to kill neutral non-combat vessels, and that if you want +ve standings then talk to cyvok or one of our diplomats. IF (as someone posted) you have a problem with A pilot killing a neutral hauler or yours, then your problem is with the pilot not the policy. (that example of a neutral hauler kill was only 22 hours after this statement was made, if you have a way io immediately informing 4000+ ascn&axe members of this change, and making sure they understand it, i'd like to know about it) -- Love is the Law, Love under Will
Stella Centauri Spontaneous Defenestration	Posted - 2006.07.25 11:18:00 - [62] Originally by: Tarantella Serpantine i doubt many people who have posted here are openly worried about it QFT --------------------------------------- Stella - If your boss gets to choose.
Whoturned Outthelights	Posted - 2006.07.25 11:25:00 - [63] Originally by: Gunsnroses Originally by: Zhon Aside from the recent misunderstanding and acts of aggression between FOFF and ASCN they have been great to have around. Before said conflict we camped and roamed around the pipe with them many times. I can assure you that they do not run from a good fight and are very reliable in even joint battles against organized enemies. It is nice to have competent combat pilots around. Hope to do some more killing with you guys. Good to be home. Kind of missed that smell of exhaust fume at the pirates turned tail and run. Lies. I've yet to have them stay for a fight. Run Run Little Ark miners. Cant be bothered to relog onto other character but seriously I have been in HED a number of times and each time I have seen you guys you warp into spy out the gate at extreme range, hang around for a minute, smack local and bit and then run off. You only engage when you have the advantage the same as everyone else does. Why smack other people just because they can bring a bigger gang than you can. You are no more interested in a "fair fight" than anyone else I have come across. How many of those haulers you gank give you a fair fight?
Maggot Minmatar	Posted - 2006.07.25 11:43:00 - [64] The problem is this: Northen Providence is policed by the locals - all of whom do not employ NBSI policy against combat ships or haulers. They engage based on evidence and investigation. Now ASCN roll through and will shoot anything based on thier own NBSI policy regardless of the local sovereignty and policing methods. From accounts in the local channels ASCN in the last two weeks have been killing or hunting more locals than the combined forces of all pirates in this region. ASCN's good name has been spoiled in the eyes of the providence community as its pilots are actively hunting neutrals as opposed to shooting ships that pose a threat during escort missions. To stop the death of innocents U'K has provided ASCN with a list of its allies. U'K's focus has and always will be our fight with slavers. We will not be held responsible for the death of those killed by ASCN troops. ASCN's offer to set standings is of course a good step forward. But it is still a slap in the face for all the good folk who dwell in this dangerous border zone, and discourages those who taking their first step into these wildlands. I urge ASCN high command to revert to their prior policy, and use other methods to spot corp jumpers - U'K has the same problem but we know our foes by name. I fully support the ASCN policy regarding University graduates and other such spies being destroyed at the discretion of the pilot. Maggot.
Grimpak Gallente	Posted - 2006.07.25 11:54:00 - [65] Originally by: Maggot The problem is this: Northen Providence is policed by the locals - all of whom do not employ NBSI policy against combat ships or haulers. They engage based on evidence and investigation. Now ASCN roll through and will shoot anything based on thier own NBSI policy regardless of the local sovereignty and policing methods. From accounts in the local channels ASCN in the last two weeks have been killing or hunting more locals than the combined forces of all pirates in this region. ASCN's good name has been spoiled in the eyes of the providence community as its pilots are actively hunting neutrals as opposed to shooting ships that pose a threat during escort missions. To stop the death of innocents U'K has provided ASCN with a list of its allies. U'K's focus has and always will be our fight with slavers. We will not be held responsible for the death of those killed by ASCN troops. ASCN's offer to set standings is of course a good step forward. But it is still a slap in the face for all the good folk who dwell in this dangerous border zone, and discourages those who taking their first step into these wildlands. I urge ASCN high command to revert to their prior policy, and use other methods to spot corp jumpers - U'K has the same problem but we know our foes by name. I fully support the ASCN policy regarding University graduates and other such spies being destroyed at the discretion of the pilot. Maggot. hey you know our forum rep, and altho the change of RoE in ASCN seems like a bit harsh I say this: - If we come to the forums and say "we come in peace", most people will say "HEY LOOK ASCN HAS LACK OF BACKBONE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE SCUM AND THEY ARE STUPID LIL' BACKSTABBING HOBBITSES!" - If we come to the forums and say "For now on we operate an NBSI policy in our travel routes, so get your standings with us fixed.", people will come and say "HEY LOOK ASCN ARE PIRATES WITH NO REGARD FOR PEOPLE/CATS/SHEEP RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE SCUM AND THEY ARE STUPID LIL' BACKSTABBING HOBBITSES!" ...now you see the dillema. ------- Originally by: Abdalion Originally by: Jebidus Skari What, in EVE, is a Tyrant? Me. Especially when it comes to troll threads.
Lord Spidey Hmmzor.	Posted - 2006.07.25 13:30:00 - [66] Originally by: Whoturned Outthelights Originally by: Gunsnroses Originally by: Zhon Aside from the recent misunderstanding and acts of aggression between FOFF and ASCN they have been great to have around. Before said conflict we camped and roamed around the pipe with them many times. I can assure you that they do not run from a good fight and are very reliable in even joint battles against organized enemies. It is nice to have competent combat pilots around. Hope to do some more killing with you guys. Good to be home. Kind of missed that smell of exhaust fume at the pirates turned tail and run. Lies. I've yet to have them stay for a fight. Run Run Little Ark miners. Cant be bothered to relog onto other character but seriously I have been in HED a number of times and each time I have seen you guys you warp into spy out the gate at extreme range, hang around for a minute, smack local and bit and then run off. Well your definately not an ascn member mr. alt. Prolly RA. p.s. we have fraps of our attempted fight with ASCN and its same old same old
Oosel Nightmare Holdings Armorum Unitas	Posted - 2006.07.25 13:46:00 - [67] i will contact cyvok as suggested to prevent any incidents on behalf of our alliance and although it looks like ascn are rolling through prov on looking further into it the northern half as yet, hasnt been hampered that much by it and with the likes of ushra, nov odus, cva and maelstrom pretty much policing the areas very well would it not make sense for all of those involved in the non pirate activities to actually band together rather than get involved in tackling each other..... seems like you are all doing the same thing why not use your combined intel/patrols to make an even more effective deterant just a thought mind
Avernus Gallente	Posted - 2006.07.25 14:17:00 - [68] Tbh, I don't know why ASCN is bothering to put all the trimmings on their ROE in Catch and Providence... it doesn't make sense really, the vast majority of neutrals are simply going to be targets, and if they seek to defend themselves, or retaliate, then they'll find themselves on the list of ASCN enemies in short order. Honestly... what is the point of this whole song and dance routine? Actions speak far louder than any mincing of words or thoughts you've tried to communicate here. ASCN's armor is going to require a lot more polish if you want to be that 'shining knight'. Nothing in life is quite so sweet as the taste of payback.
Grimpak Gallente	Posted - 2006.07.25 14:32:00 - [69] Originally by: Avernus ASCN's armor is going to require a lot more polish if you want to be that 'shining knight'. I think we never said we wanted to be EVE's "shining knight" ------- Originally by: Abdalion Originally by: Jebidus Skari What, in EVE, is a Tyrant? Me. Especially when it comes to troll threads.
Hardin Amarr	Posted - 2006.07.25 14:36:00 - [70] Originally by: Maggot The problem is this: Northen Providence is policed by the locals - all of whom do not employ NBSI policy against combat ships or haulers. They engage based on evidence and investigation. Now ASCN roll through and will shoot anything based on thier own NBSI policy regardless of the local sovereignty and policing methods. From accounts in the local channels ASCN in the last two weeks have been killing or hunting more locals than the combined forces of all pirates in this region. ASCN's good name has been spoiled in the eyes of the providence community as its pilots are actively hunting neutrals as opposed to shooting ships that pose a threat during escort missions. To stop the death of innocents U'K has provided ASCN with a list of its allies. U'K's focus has and always will be our fight with slavers. We will not be held responsible for the death of those killed by ASCN troops. ASCN's offer to set standings is of course a good step forward. But it is still a slap in the face for all the good folk who dwell in this dangerous border zone, and discourages those who taking their first step into these wildlands. I urge ASCN high command to revert to their prior policy, and use other methods to spot corp jumpers - U'K has the same problem but we know our foes by name. I fully support the ASCN policy regarding University graduates and other such spies being destroyed at the discretion of the pilot. Maggot. Although Maggot is a dirty Minmatar terrorist whom I detest (IC ofc) I have to say that in this instance he is 100% correct. Maggot: "Northen Providence is policed by the locals - all of whom do not employ NBSI policy against combat ships or haulers. They engage based on evidence and investigation." The fact is that CVA space has always been open to well behaved neutrals. Many of these neutrals ACTIVELY help us to combat pirates and other troublemakers. We specifically launched the Deliverance project as an extension of the Amarrian Empire. We have created a region where law-abiding pilots can mine hunt and travel in relative safety. Unlike most other 0.0 alliances we do not operate NBSI. We generally give people the benefit of the doubt until the point the cause trouble. This system has worked for 18 months thanks to much hard work on our and our friends part. NBSI is a tool of the gung-ho, the lazy and the indisciplined. So far there have been few 'incidents' with ASCN primarily because their patrols are less frequent in the western Providence pipe. However those incidents that have occured to date have so far been settled amicably. Nevertheless this is not a stable situation and wont be unless ASCN change their policy or at least communicate openly with the local alliances on KOS lists. The CVA already has alliances such as LV, BoB, D2 and TSDS on our KOS lists due to incidents of their members pirating in our space (and to clarify we view any attack on a friendly or neutral in our space as piracy whether they are in a hauler or in a combat ship) and it would be a pity if we have to add ASCN to this list. Until now ASCN pilots have always had free access to and through our regions however if some control and discipline is not exerted over the roving patrols this will have to stop. As Oosel has pointed out above this would be a sad situation to get to. By their very nature ASCN and the Northern Providence alliances should be working cooperatively vs the various groups that attempt to restrict access to 0.0 through this region - however that requires ongoing communication rather than sweeping edicts. If Cyvok is still reading this thread then I suggest that he gets in touch with Aralis - who heads up the CVA - to discuss setting up mutual standings before something stupid happens... Similarly if ASCN have a particular problem with anyone living in our space then please let us know about it... ------------------------------ Hardin's Blog (BACK UP!)
Yodaron Ballsithor Gallente	Posted - 2006.07.25 14:52:00 - [71] Avernus, ASCN apparently set policy based on Cyvok's latest fantasies dreampt up during his sleep periods or the alliance actually believes it has the given right to dictate policy in areas that are not of importance to maintaining the space it holds. By way of example, I was noticing that FIX is now -5 due to "pirating the pipe," yet when they camp A2 and shoot everything there they are simply enforcing NBSI in a region they have no interest in. While I find all the pillow talk by ASCN interesting, the basic truth is that if you are not blue you will be shoot. Same here in FIX, so really no complaints. However, please quit running and logging when a force equal to yours arrives for a friendly visit bearing tea and crumpets. I hate to say it, but such actions are so uncivilized and fail to display proper etiquette. In closing, I believe this thread can easily be summed up as follows: ASCN pvp pilots are bored providing support for the ASCN mining machine. Camping NPC's can get extremely disheartening. Solution: Camp HED, camp Providence, camp A2, etc. Nothing wrong with it, but at least have the cohunas to admit it. We do so enjoy your little forays into FIX space. It keeps us alert and combat ready, plus the loot has been excellent so far. For a dead alliance like ours, we can use all the help you have been giving us, and for that I say, "Thank you." Almost forgot: Huzzah is Primary! Signature is inappropriate for the forums mail [email protected] for more info - Vanamonde
Avernus Gallente	Posted - 2006.07.25 15:03:00 - [72] Originally by: Grimpak Originally by: Avernus ASCN's armor is going to require a lot more polish if you want to be that 'shining knight'. I think we never said we wanted to be EVE's "shining knight" You're right, no such intention has ever been stated by ASCN on such a thing as far as I'm aware... it's simply a perception many people perhaps have. It might be more accurate to say, that there are two main schools of thought on ROE. There is the type of effort that you see CVA put in, and CFS before them, where every case was judged and nobody got hasty without good reason (basically very honourable behaviour in my eyes). On the other side of the fence, you have pure NBSI... no standings, shooty shooty (simple and fun, no headaches). From CYVOK's post though, it looks half assed, like he's trying to do a little bit of both in an attempt to appease both the more aggressive and the pacifistic members of ASCN. The result is a medley of the two standards of ROE, which simply doesn't work. If you want an example, use FIX. - FIX loses it's space. - ASCN drops FIX to neutral. - ASCN starts shooting FIX in HED. - CYVOK is contacted... waste of time. - FIX drops ASCN to neutral (NBSI in Catch for us). - FIX retaliates in HED. - ASCN drops FIX to -5.0 So a year of good standings go down the drain. Hey, if ASCN wanted to simply shoot at FIX, np, you've accomplished what you set out to do. But... if that wasn't your initial intention, then realise that your standings system sucks some serious ass. Nothing in life is quite so sweet as the taste of payback.
Kalil d'Maelstromo The Establishment	Posted - 2006.07.25 15:17:00 - [73] Dont worry Wiz, those nasty ASCN pirates will be cleared out of Upper Prov by the combined Ushra and EST Defence Fleet. Maggot please have the fleet assembled in 9-U for departure at the appointed time. Ofcourse I and other EST members will have set standings between our respective parties at +10. Please inform me once this has commenced so that no 'friendly' targets will be wrongfuly engaged. I'll be waiting for your comms in 4B ************************ Originally by:** Deb Loblaw Anybody who demands a reach around is just a greedy bastich, if you ask me. If you wanted satisfaction, you should have been on top.
Goberth Ludwig eXceed Inc. Ascendant Frontier	Posted - 2006.07.25 15:29:00 - [74] Originally by: Yodaron Ballsithor However, please quit running and logging when a force equal to yours arrives for a friendly visit bearing tea and crumpets. I hate to say it, but such actions are so uncivilized and fail to display proper etiquette. Look you guys have my sympathy and I dont wanna start flamage with FIX here but, I came to 9cg 3 times and you guys did the exact same so maybe you should keep your clever comments to yourself... - Gob [IXC] Admiral Goberius
Helganstandt Finis Lumen	Posted - 2006.07.25 16:12:00 - [75] Didn't ASCN run like 3 Freighters through HED last night? Or was I smoking something and just imagined one of our allies telling me that? ________________________________
Yodaron Ballsithor Gallente	Posted - 2006.07.25 16:18:00 - [76] Originally by: Goberth Ludwig Originally by: Yodaron Ballsithor However, please quit running and logging when a force equal to yours arrives for a friendly visit bearing tea and crumpets. I hate to say it, but such actions are so uncivilized and fail to display proper etiquette. Look you guys have my sympathy and I dont wanna start flamage with FIX here but, I came to 9cg 3 times and you guys did the exact same so maybe you should keep your clever comments to yourself... Let the flamage by ASCN begin. Again Signature is inappropriate for the forums mail [email protected] for more info - Vanamonde
Lord Spidey Hmmzor.	Posted - 2006.07.25 16:30:00 - [77] Originally by: Yodaron Ballsithor ASCN apparently set policy based on Cyvok's latest fantasies dreampt up during his sleep periods or the alliance actually believes it has the given right to dictate policy in areas that are not of importance to maintaining the space it holds. However, please quit running and logging when a force equal to yours arrives for a friendly visit bearing tea and crumpets. I hate to say it, but such actions are so uncivilized and fail to display proper etiquette. In closing, I believe this thread can easily be summed up as follows: ASCN pvp pilots are bored providing support for the ASCN mining machine. Camping NPC's can get extremely disheartening. Solution: Camp HED, camp Providence, camp A2, etc. Nothing wrong with it, but at least have the cohunas to admit it. I agree with all the 100%. MIght as well say your just bored and want pvp instead of hiding behind a smoke screen
Avernus Gallente	Posted - 2006.07.25 16:30:00 - [78] Originally by: Goberth Ludwig Originally by: Yodaron Ballsithor However, please quit running and logging when a force equal to yours arrives for a friendly visit bearing tea and crumpets. I hate to say it, but such actions are so uncivilized and fail to display proper etiquette. Look you guys have my sympathy and I dont wanna start flamage with FIX here but, I came to 9cg 3 times and you guys did the exact same so maybe you should keep your clever comments to yourself... Seriously, if you have FIX pilots logging to save their ships, seni me their names in-game. Do note, 9CG is a station system, if pilots are in the station and log out, there shouldn't be any complaints resulting from that. You should be getting familiar with who our more regular combat pilots are, I'd be surprised to hear of any incidents involving them. Nothing in life is quite so sweet as the taste of payback.
Grimpak Gallente	Posted - 2006.07.25 16:31:00 - [79] Originally by: Yodaron Ballsithor Originally by: Goberth Ludwig Originally by: Yodaron Ballsithor However, please quit running and logging when a force equal to yours arrives for a friendly visit bearing tea and crumpets. I hate to say it, but such actions are so uncivilized and fail to display proper etiquette. Look you guys have my sympathy and I dont wanna start flamage with FIX here but, I came to 9cg 3 times and you guys did the exact same so maybe you should keep your clever comments to yourself... Let the flamage by ASCN begin. Again first flames weren't started by us. ------- Originally by: Abdalion Originally by: Jebidus Skari What, in EVE, is a Tyrant? Me. Especially when it comes to troll threads.
Kalil d'Maelstromo The Establishment	Posted - 2006.07.25 16:36:00 - [80] Originally by: Helganstandt Didn't ASCN run like 3 Freighters through HED last night? Or was I smoking something and just imagined one of our allies telling me that? Saw two Obelisks goig tru G-A/TA3 route south last night. Axiom and ASCN tho I was stoned so could have been one or the other...... ************************ Originally by:** Deb Loblaw Anybody who demands a reach around is just a greedy bastich, if you ask me. If you wanted satisfaction, you should have been on top.
Yodaron Ballsithor Gallente	Posted - 2006.07.25 16:39:00 - [81] Edited by: Yodaron Ballsithor on 25/07/2006 16:42:58 Originally by: Grimpak Originally by: Yodaron Ballsithor Originally by: Goberth Ludwig Originally by: Yodaron Ballsithor However, please quit running and logging when a force equal to yours arrives for a friendly visit bearing tea and crumpets. I hate to say it, but such actions are so uncivilized and fail to display proper etiquette. Look you guys have my sympathy and I dont wanna start flamage with FIX here but, I came to 9cg 3 times and you guys did the exact same so maybe you should keep your clever comments to yourself... Let the flamage by ASCN begin. Again first flames weren't started by us. Comedic, probably. Flamage, not really. Regardless, we ate the tea and crumpets. More available for our next encounter. Edit: On a serious note: I can understand not engaging. I can understand leaving the system and running. I can understand just not wanting to engage. Heck, I can understand that gangs are set up specific ways and with even numbers against an opponent specced differently it is wiser to not engage. But, does ASCN support logging to avoid combat? Signature is inappropriate for the forums mail [email protected] for more info - Vanamonde
Goberth Ludwig eXceed Inc. Ascendant Frontier	Posted - 2006.07.25 17:44:00 - [82] I was on about the running from even fight, dont know about the logging to avoid combat honestly havent seen any from ascn (nor fix). - Gob [IXC] Admiral Goberius
Spacearoni Caldari	Posted - 2006.07.25 17:54:00 - [83] Originally by: Lord Spidey Originally by: Kai page Originally by: Lord Spidey So you camp Hed with your gangs to engage pirate organization and enemies that have made HED their home? To be honest I see the perma ascn gang on Hed/Keberz ganking more innocents than actually killing any dangerous folk (bad finite!) and when the dangerous folk come along teh ascn gang jumps out So which one of the newb alts in shuttles is yours? I'm the person your camp flees from and beleive it or not I dont show up in a shuttle. Of course checking killboards would have shown this but ill assume your stupid, clueless and/or lazy. Thanks for your time lol u guys seem to like each other a lot u should make peace :-)
Miss Overlord	Posted - 2006.07.25 18:04:00 - [84] nah what we need is a BOB and goonfleet peace treaty and co operative attack on ASCN just to mix things up - i know BOB vist out that way a bit but still
Spacearoni Caldari	Posted - 2006.07.25 18:14:00 - [85] what the .................why in the heck u need bob for attack them ur self and if u can't stay in empirer like a lot of them and mine or run mission
Grimpak Gallente	Posted - 2006.07.25 18:16:00 - [86] Originally by: Spacearoni what the .................why in the heck u need bob for attack them ur self and if u can't stay in empirer like a lot of them and mine or run mission indeed ...as I like to say to anyone that says "OMG HOPE BOB ATTACKS YOU!111one" I say "Bring it yourself or shut up" (to the alt, not to you, spacearoni) ------- Originally by: Abdalion Originally by: Jebidus Skari What, in EVE, is a Tyrant? Me. Especially when it comes to troll threads.
Daald Celestial Fleet Ascendant Frontier	Posted - 2006.07.25 18:18:00 - [87] Quote: I agree with all the 100%. MIght as well say your just bored and want pvp instead of hiding behind a smoke screen Isn't that what all the announcements here basically come down to? You basically see two types of announcements when you take away 99.999% of the smack or misinformation. 1- We're bored so we came up with a reason to pvp. YAY 2- We're bored of fighting you so we're taking a break. It's a game after all. We need to shooty shooty or we'll end up playing WoW and nobody wants THAT. And as a side note, I have been loving the trips to 9CG. I hope you guys are getting as much pleasure out of it as we are. ___________________________________________ Logic is a systematic method of coming to the wrong conclusion with confidence. -Murphy
Yodaron Ballsithor Gallente	Posted - 2006.07.25 20:51:00 - [88] Originally by: Daald Quote: I agree with all the 100%. MIght as well say your just bored and want pvp instead of hiding behind a smoke screen Isn't that what all the announcements here basically come down to? You basically see two types of announcements when you take away 99.999% of the smack or misinformation. 1- We're bored so we came up with a reason to pvp. YAY 2- We're bored of fighting you so we're taking a break. It's a game after all. We need to shooty shooty or we'll end up playing WoW and nobody wants THAT. And as a side note, I have been loving the trips to 9CG. I hope you guys are getting as much pleasure out of it as we are. /signed Signature is inappropriate for the forums mail [email protected] for more info - Vanamonde
Avernus Gallente	Posted - 2006.07.25 20:53:00 - [89] From what I've heard, everyone is enjoying the small scale combat we've been having. Personally, I much prefer sincere bloodthirsty, vengence-touting declarations of war loaded up with passion and promises of retribution (not just for shooting a shuttle). Makes things much more interesting. Someone who has commenced shooting due to boredom can pull out of a war at anytime because there is no 'face' to be lost, the excuses to depart are easy. When everyone knows you are out for blood, it ups the ante considerably. Nothing in life is quite so sweet as the taste of payback.
Drakma Celestial Fleet Ascendant Frontier	Posted - 2006.07.25 23:55:00 - [90] Originally by: Avernus From what I've heard, everyone is enjoying the small scale combat we've been having. Personally, I much prefer sincere bloodthirsty, vengence-touting declarations of war loaded up with passion and promises of retribution (not just for shooting a shuttle). Makes things much more interesting. Someone who has commenced shooting due to boredom can pull out of a war at anytime because there is no 'face' to be lost, the excuses to depart are easy. When everyone knows you are out for blood, it ups the ante considerably. Ok, here goes. Teh dirtay Fixians ate Celestial Fleet's Chocolate Pudding from the fridge. It was cleary marked with our name and date on the lid. Replace said Pudding or suffer the consequences. Sig must be under 24000 bytes - Cathath ([email protected])

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