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An exploit?

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Tsingtau	Posted - 2003.10.06 05:04:00 - [1] My corp is at war. we are out mining having a good ol time when we came under attack by our enemy. not having a combat fleet some of us returned to a station to grab our war ships. we lost a new player in a noob ship. The attacker was damaged and fled the scene. We used agents to track her down threwout the universe and located her some 10 jumps away. we gather our forces and trap her at a station. now she strikes up a convo with me and says that if I dont leave the system she is going to get out un harmed and "punish" my corp further. Well needless to say we didnt leave as she suggested. so after awhile she exits the station. without her corp tag one of our trigger happy corp mates didnt realise this and lost his ship to concord as she was defaulted to a noob corp so we get ****ed as if the war was to be ended there is a surrender tab...but instead she fleas we can do nothing as it takes place in 1.0 space. she flys to her HQ and rejoins the corp we are at war with. now if this isnt an exploit I dont know what is. any comments?
Danton Marcellus	Posted - 2003.10.06 05:08:00 - [2] Indeed, report her. Convert Stations
Tabius	Posted - 2003.10.06 05:08:00 - [3] WOW... ya, it takes hours to delete a character, it should take a few hours to exit a corp.... I'd say you got screwed, and I'd report it in a petition. That's seriously cheap.
Danton Marcellus	Posted - 2003.10.06 05:17:00 - [4] You should be able to boot people on the spot but as far as rejoining I'd say two weeks are in order. Convert Stations
Jash Illian	Posted - 2003.10.06 05:17:00 - [5] Cheap yes...Exploit, no. Your corp member failed to identify her. That's on his head I'm afraid. She didn't use anything to gain any real advantage over you. Any GM that would go and warn her for using that technique would risk outright laughter. "Go back and let them kill you next time!"? Yeah right You can report it via a petition but most likely all you'll be doing is issuing a bug report in the wrong location. I mean its like you want corporations to oblige each other like its sex or something. Pffft I would rather *** my enemy.- Rohann Be careful out there. That other guy waiting in the queue for the gate MIGHT be a baby-munching frock-burner, YOU JUST DON'T KNOW!*- Lallante
Skokeh	Posted - 2003.10.06 05:22:00 - [6] good trick - but should be prevented especially as some corps dont always have a visisble ticker.....
Tsingtau	Posted - 2003.10.06 05:23:00 - [7] See thats just it...leaving the corp anytime should be a no brainer. but going back to the corp after you quit in a matter of a half hour just so you can get away is BS. my corpmate loosing his ship was his fault and we know this. I just think it was dirty, low, and makes me quite upset that there isnt anything I can do about it. it will continue to happen everytime we meet up unless the odds are in her favor. But I would never stoop so low as to quit my corp to get away.
Scrapyard Jack	Posted - 2003.10.06 05:25:00 - [8] ehehehe! It's a dirty, underhanded, sneaky, cheap-as-hell trick...! But for once, ol' Jack is in agreement with Jashypoos. All's fair in love and war.
Cao Cao	Posted - 2003.10.06 05:53:00 - [9] This isn't an exploit but it is a well-documented and reported problem in the game mechanics. A corporation we were at war with attempted to use this little "trick" on us but we didn't fall for it. Definitely petition it. I've asked several times for there to be a "cooling down" time before leaving and a time restraint (2 weeks would be appropriate) before you can rejoin a corporation you recently quit.
Gaijin Lanis	Posted - 2003.10.06 06:06:00 - [10] I'm with the non-carebears on this one, the only thing that played any part in the destruction of your mate's ship is his own impatience. too bad, so sad. keep refreshing the info next time.

Singular	Posted - 2003.10.06 06:28:00 - [11] I like it how she warned you first. Thats just pure style points righ there =) Im Yo Huckleberreh
Tsingtau	Posted - 2003.10.06 06:39:00 - [12] Quote: I'm with the non-carebears on this one, the only thing that played any part in the destruction of your mate's ship is his own impatience. too bad, so sad. keep refreshing the info next time. Maybe I didnt make myself clear. I know why he lost his ship I know he was impatient. plz read what it is your answering before making a comment like that. I asked nicely for a comment if it was an exploit or not..has nothing to do with "care-bears" or hephalumps and woozels. its a matter of cheating the system to set yourself up in a better position. its dirty and in the game mechanics as of now. just wanted some insight is all.
Sam Sneak	Posted - 2003.10.06 07:16:00 - [13] people will always try to subvert the system. you should keep a suicide pilot around to deal with situations and use your other guys to prevent target from going to warp.
Snoop	Posted - 2003.10.06 08:51:00 - [14] Quote: I'm with the non-carebears on this one, the only thing that played any part in the destruction of your mate's ship is his own impatience. too bad, so sad. keep refreshing the info next time its not his fault he's at war with a bunch of *****'s who cant fight because there a high sec carebear corp ,they sound like the kind of lame ass holes that start a war then all exit the corp leaving an alt member there to keep the corp open while they all go join a new one, this makes me sick and CCP havent done a thing about it ,GM's couldnt even end the war's against non existant corp's and probably still cant. lame and should be classed as exploiting the combat system or concord should pod them for having no honour
DREAMWORKS	Posted - 2003.10.06 09:07:00 - [15] This was reported by 50+ guys MONTHS ago, CCP claimed they would fix it... Nice going.. __________________________ http://www.nin.com/visuals/thtf_hi.html
MOOstradamus	Posted - 2003.10.06 10:28:00 - [16] Yes its an exploit of poor game mechanics. MOOrovingian "Following & supporting EVE (since Jan 2001) is like wiping your arse with sandpaper."
Asmodia	Posted - 2003.10.06 10:42:00 - [17] If you can not fight a corp war. dont buy weapons Simply, in war and love is ALL allowed But it shows how weak the war mechanism is. How it is possible that a member can leave a corp when it is in war. Itwould be good that the member must make a money offer to aloud to leave the corp to the enemy corp. if there are more then one, the money will be shared. if someone says no, he stays in the corp. ------------------------------------------------ CEO of Spectre Syndicate - Curse Alliance ------------------------------------------------
Pilar Ispuzua	Posted - 2003.10.06 10:55:00 - [18] I overheard a heated exchange in local chat a few days ago about a similar occurrence. Apparently, A GM issued a warning to a player who used that, err, yes, lame exploit of poor game mechanics. Pili === Internships Available ===
NGRU Storm	Posted - 2003.10.06 11:01:00 - [19] Edited by: NGRU Storm on 06/10/2003 12:00:18 I've seen this done before to an ally corporation, and based on game mechanics it's unfortunately NOT and exploit. It could be described more aptly as an oversight by the CCP team during the coding of corporation mechanics. Blame can't really be placed in anyone's corner because all situations and cirmcumstances can't really be clearly foreseen. I think though that if a number of players put a suggestion regarding this in the CCP Suggestion Box, we might see a change in this in the future at some point. Perhaps a 48 hour wait period before a "quit corporation" request could be processed? Don't get me wrong folks, I agree with you all that quitting a corporation to prevent the destruction of a ship during a period of war is perhaps among the cheapest and most cowardly maneuvers in the book. Keep the Faith, NGRU Storm Commanding Officer/Founder Clan NGRU Gamers Association -- Worlds for the TakingÖ http://www.clan-ngru.com
Baldour Ngarr	Posted - 2003.10.06 11:07:00 - [20] Looks as though whether or not ppl think it's an exploit depends on their definition of exploit. In short, though, if people can do this, any and all wars are completely pointless. If you're fighting a rival corp in <0.4 space, you can do whatever the hell you like anyway, whether they switch corps or not: and in high-sec, it's a waste of time declaring war because anyone you hunt down to kill can just quit, move someplace else, and rejoin. So it HAS to be stopped, or else the entire system of corps declaring war on each other should be removed. I know which I'd vote for _______ "Soon" is an ancient Icelandic word meaning "some time before the next Ice Age."

Zanadulia	Posted - 2003.10.06 11:27:00 - [21] Quote: Cheap yes...Exploit, no. Your corp member failed to identify her. That's on his head I'm afraid. She didn't use anything to gain any real advantage over you. Any GM that would go and warn her for using that technique would risk outright laughter. "Go back and let them kill you next time!"? Yeah right You can report it via a petition but most likely all you'll be doing is issuing a bug report in the wrong location. exploit yes, jash needs to grow up , such childish antics and defense of exploit usage is very unbecoming, and would not make his parents proud. Love, Peace, Law, Order, Logic, the tools of the evolved!
Zanadulia	Posted - 2003.10.06 11:30:00 - [22] Quote: This isn't an exploit but it is a well-documented and reported problem in the game mechanics. A corporation we were at war with attempted to use this little "trick" on us but we didn't fall for it. Definitely petition it. I've asked several times for there to be a "cooling down" time before leaving and a time restraint (2 weeks would be appropriate) before you can rejoin a corporation you recently quit. using a flaw in the games mechanics, as you point out, in an unintentional means, to have the upperhand, is an exploit. (hands out the eve-webters to all) read up children. Love, Peace, Law, Order, Logic, the tools of the evolved!
Jash Illian	Posted - 2003.10.06 11:35:00 - [23] Quote: Quote: Cheap yes...Exploit, no. Your corp member failed to identify her. That's on his head I'm afraid. She didn't use anything to gain any real advantage over you. Any GM that would go and warn her for using that technique would risk outright laughter. "Go back and let them kill you next time!"? Yeah right You can report it via a petition but most likely all you'll be doing is issuing a bug report in the wrong location. exploit yes, jash needs to grow up , such childish antics and defense of exploit usage is very unbecoming, and would not make his parents proud. Now out of everyone that's said pretty much the same thing, you pick me to attack. Hmm...Why do I suspect this character will disappear in about 4 days. Or it'll begin to whinny like a nag? Whatever. If a GM actually warned someone for this I'd find it a remarkable waste of keystrokes. I mean its like you want corporations to oblige each other like its sex or something. Pffft I would rather *** my enemy.- Rohann Be careful out there. That other guy waiting in the queue for the gate MIGHT be a baby-munching frock-burner, YOU JUST DON'T KNOW!*- Lallante
Zanadulia	Posted - 2003.10.06 12:08:00 - [24] Quote: Quote: Quote: Cheap yes...Exploit, no. Your corp member failed to identify her. That's on his head I'm afraid. She didn't use anything to gain any real advantage over you. Any GM that would go and warn her for using that technique would risk outright laughter. "Go back and let them kill you next time!"? Yeah right You can report it via a petition but most likely all you'll be doing is issuing a bug report in the wrong location. exploit yes, jash needs to grow up , such childish antics and defense of exploit usage is very unbecoming, and would not make his parents proud. Now out of everyone that's said pretty much the same thing, you pick me to attack. Hmm...Why do I suspect this character will disappear in about 4 days. Or it'll begin to whinny like a nag? Whatever. If a GM actually warned someone for this I'd find it a remarkable waste of keystrokes. Jash has proven the point, childish. Petition the GM, petition them again and again, report it as a bug often. CCP has to pay attention soner or later, and the children like jash will have nothing to flame others about once the exploitation of bugs is brought to a halt. Love, Peace, Law, Order, Logic, the tools of the evolved!
Jash Illian	Posted - 2003.10.06 12:44:00 - [25] Quote: Quote: Quote: Quote: Cheap yes...Exploit, no. Your corp member failed to identify her. That's on his head I'm afraid. She didn't use anything to gain any real advantage over you. Any GM that would go and warn her for using that technique would risk outright laughter. "Go back and let them kill you next time!"? Yeah right You can report it via a petition but most likely all you'll be doing is issuing a bug report in the wrong location. exploit yes, jash needs to grow up , such childish antics and defense of exploit usage is very unbecoming, and would not make his parents proud. Now out of everyone that's said pretty much the same thing, you pick me to attack. Hmm...Why do I suspect this character will disappear in about 4 days. Or it'll begin to whinny like a nag? Whatever. If a GM actually warned someone for this I'd find it a remarkable waste of keystrokes. Jash has proven the point, childish. Petition the GM, petition them again and again, report it as a bug often. CCP has to pay attention soner or later, and the children like jash will have nothing to flame others about once the exploitation of bugs is brought to a halt. Definately either WhiteTroll or cbiscuit. sigh come up with something not so 80s eh? I mean its like you want corporations to oblige each other like its sex or something. Pffft I would rather *** my enemy.- Rohann Be careful out there. That other guy waiting in the queue for the gate MIGHT be a baby-munching frock-burner, YOU JUST DON'T KNOW!*- Lallante
WhiteDwarf	Posted - 2003.10.06 12:47:00 - [26] "Your corp member failed to identify her. That's on his head I'm afraid" Typical Jash ignorance. It's a cheap tactic, she should have been dealt with as an exploiter, especially if she re-joined her corp later. "Trust No One"
Tigrana Blanque	Posted - 2003.10.06 12:57:00 - [27] Edited by: Tigrana Blanque on 06/10/2003 13:01:25 Edited by: Tigrana Blanque on 06/10/2003 12:58:32 Leaving the corp is obviously "legal" as it fits entirely within game mechanics and doesn't involve taking advantage of a bug. Hence I don't think it could be considered an 'exploit' any more than waiting at a jump drop-in point for victims is an exploit. Its conceivable (not apparently in this case from your report of the ingame chat, but in general) someone might someday want to leave a corp at war because they don't support the corp's stand, etc. Players shouldn't be banned entirely from leaving corps at war. It is, however, totally ludicrous that the game mechanics allow it with no delays as a 'tactic', in the same way that waiting at a jump-in point with tremendous numbers of drones out to lag someone so they can be killed with no risk to the attacker is. Corps should be allowed to boot players immediately. Players should perhaps have a timelimit on 'quitting' just as in real life there's a standard 2 week notice. (IRL the notice when leaving a job is customary and polite, not law in most places....but in Eve where megacorps have more power than local laws and a coalition of corps (e.g. CONCORD) represent the police, would be no stretch of game logic to make it so). Inability of a player to leave might also help in some corporate theft issues, but probably not as no 'delay timer' to leave could supercede a 'kill this character' timer anyway, and that's likely all the time a thief would need. The rejoining part though (both the player wanting to and the corp re-accepting her without delays) is way out of line and proves corp and player intent to defraud the system....e.g. take advantage of poor game mechanics. That part can probably logically be called an "exploit". Nice to see you do recognize your own pilot's fault in shooting first. Too bad some here will ignore that part and pull all the same lame "you got pwned!" and namecalling crapola prevalent on these boards rather than pay attention to the bigger issue. I see the quitter tactics even get blessing from those who whine elsewhere about consequences of actions being logically based and blame those wanting to avoid fights for ruining the game by swaying the mechanics their way. If they even try to justify their inconsistency it will be with some b.s. about how you made your own bed (but their complaints are different).
Archain	Posted - 2003.10.06 13:06:00 - [28] LOL, how did I know the word exploiter would come out of his mouth =). I was almost sure enough to put money on it. I do agree though, that is a pretty cheap tactic. I don't know of anyway to counter that one except for maybe requiring more time for a corp drop or allowing us to designate personal war/KOS lists. I think the second option would need alot of restrictions though, you can't have those on the negative side declaring war with every single person. Space Invaders Movie Library - [SPVD]
McWatt	Posted - 2003.10.06 13:11:00 - [29] it s fair game, though not very nice. but again, we should address the real problem: uber-concord will******you for small crime ccp is not interested in their war-"system" at all, if they were it wouldn t be this utterly stupid and useless.
Danton Marcellus	Posted - 2003.10.06 13:19:00 - [30] Post the name of the corporation and the player, I want to see who the coward lamer is. Convert Stations



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