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OULENfditle	Posted - 2006.08.08 00:58:00 - [1] oooookay so whats with missiles? Did you really set out to make them completely useless in pvp situations? Because as it is anyone with a mwd seems all but impervious to damage OR damage is so small as to be laughable. HOW is this fair when every other turret gets a BONUS when opponents use a mwd against them? Second point, When targets arent' moving why don't missile hit for full effect? would make sense, NO? CCP you did away with the dual mwd and then the mwd & ab setup because ships traveled too fast. NOW you put mods in game to RECREATE the problem you took steps to remove from the game. I"m seriously puzzled buy your logic. >> see a problem, romove said problem>> then return the problem to game resulting in the same unbalanced affect that was there in the first place. Whats the point unless all you are trying to do is waste peoples time. Same goes for fighters, whats the point when they can't hit anything that simple turns on a mwd??? AND an even bigger puzzle, send you fighters to kill a frigate standing still ........ OMG they can't hit the dam thing!!! YOur kidding right!!!?
ArtemisEntreri Turbulent	Posted - 2006.08.08 01:39:00 - [2] Originally by: OULENfditle oooookay so whats with missiles? Did you really set out to make them completely useless in pvp situations? Because as it is anyone with a mwd seems all but impervious to damage OR damage is so small as to be laughable. HOW is this fair when every other turret gets a BONUS when opponents use a mwd against them? I'll turn this around, why do missiles always hit a target unless they're moving at ridiculous speeds, when a turret can't hit a target that's moving 200m/s? Originally by: OULENfditle Second point, When targets arent' moving why don't missile hit for full effect? would make sense, NO? Guns hit for full effect sometimes, but sig radius effects how many times, it's the same % of damage over time! Originally by: OULENfditle Same goes for fighters, whats the point when they can't hit anything that simple turns on a mwd??? AND an even bigger puzzle, send you fighters to kill a frigate standing still ........ OMG they can't hit the dam thing!!! YOur kidding right!!!? Target paint it you'll see a difference Originally by: Vadoc Trax The only actual players are BoB, everyone else are their alts, and alts of alts. CCP is also BoB.
OULENfditle	Posted - 2006.08.08 23:40:00 - [3] dude large turrets can still insta pop inties running at over 4,000m/s. Get real, can't hit at 200 m/s. Ever hear of transverse veloctiy? Why do you think its availible on your overview. MWD should not be a continous use item. ALL mwd should drain your cap in a short amount of time, the faster they propel you the more energy they should use. Is susposed to be a "short" burst of speed. NOT a device that makes your ship immune to damage........ As a penalty for use of a mwd would be nice >>such as>>> if using a mwd prevented you from entering warp for the same amount of time the mwd was in use. something like that would provide many more interesting logistical situations for combat.
Testicular Testes	Posted - 2006.08.09 02:02:00 - [4] Worst. Thread. Ever.
xh'duality Caldari Bravehearts	Posted - 2006.08.09 02:43:00 - [5] Edited by: xh''duality on 09/08/2006 02:43:57 Well a sniper with rails at 100km can inst pop intie's nomather what speed tehy go. Missiles do like 0.2 or 0.0 dmg even cruiese. But a sniper with guns cant hit em at say 20 km range but crise missiles can almost insta pop em with painter. what I realy hate is that the intys never stick around once i start shooting em. So basicly every race has theyre own bonus's and no **** up from CCP site out its just the way it is. Sig removed, maximum allowed image size is 24,000 bytes. Please contact [email protected] for more info (including a copy of your picture!) -wystler
Outa Rileau	Posted - 2006.08.09 15:33:00 - [6] How did they bring the problem back ingame? AFAIK there's no change in ship speeds... ------------------------- Getting Sig Removed / Rank 8 / SP: 762039 of 2048000
OULENfditle	Posted - 2006.08.11 00:14:00 - [7] Battleships doing over 3K m/s, cruisers doing over 6k m/s, inty/interdictors doing over 8k m/s. The problem returns anytime "speed" by itself negates any weapon type from having any real damaging effect. The orginal missiles nerfs were bad enough but now seeing how the speed enhancements fully matured by players in the game neutralizes missiles completely ....... well its discouraging to say the least.
UnSiViLiZeD Beagle Corp	Posted - 2006.08.11 00:46:00 - [8] Quote: Battleships doing over 3K m/s, cruisers doing over 6k m/s when was this possible ? with a speed implant set costing 1 billion, Nano fibers and OD'd ? so all they can do is really run, cant fight or tank, i have yet to see these speeds, and read the description on MWD.... + increase to sig radius.... hmmm wonder what a determining factor to dmg, ill give you a a hint "SIG RADIUS" hmmm whats a target painter do increases sig radius, what a webber do ...slow a ship down, i dont see why your complaining, you web them paint them nos them there not going anywere and if they can reach speeds over 5000ms in any ship there really gonna have a hard time hitting you back, so why worry ? And ive seen 1st hand what fighters can do no they cant hit a frig but they can rip BS's apart, its carriers main defense. _______________________________________________ Life is a game if your not winning you must be loseing.
Harisdrop Gallente RONA Deepspace CORE.	Posted - 2006.08.11 16:53:00 - [9] Devblog Inertial Stab
Harisdrop Gallente RONA Deepspace CORE.	Posted - 2006.08.11 16:56:00 - [10] Originally by: Outa Rileau How did they bring the problem back ingame? AFAIK there's no change in ship speeds... Soo you now can have nanofibers and inertial stabs on your battleship and you will be a cruiser. Get the new Rigs You rill rock the space pirates. As we all get older and into capital ships things will get nasty in 0.0. Gate camps wont be the issue it will be who is in the biggest fleet of capital and support ships.
OULENfditle	Posted - 2006.08.11 23:06:00 - [11] It was possible before the dual mwd and mwd & ab nerf. The nerf was specifically made to prevent these speeds as they are totally out of the balance of game weapon systems, but just like ccp, take it away cause it causes foolish problems but then bring it back to sell more subscriptions, dam greedy bast0rds ...... YOu would think that with the sig radius going through the rooof once a mwd was turned on would negate the speed increase BUT it doesn't ............... speed rules totally making missiles USELESS and target painters don't help because speed rules in the damage equation(based upon what i'm seeing in real game play). So ya, if the larger sig radius offset the increase in speed all would be happy in missile land but it doesn't so here we sit with more stupid things happening.
Dark Shikari Caldari Imperium Technologies Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2006.08.11 23:41:00 - [12] Originally by: OULENfditle dude large turrets can still insta pop inties running at over 4,000m/s. Get real, can't hit at 200 m/s. Ever hear of transverse veloctiy? Why do you think its availible on your overview. Are you crazy? I can't hit an inty with my Tempest at 170km when its DOCKING WITHOUT AN MWD OR AB. 4000m/s is far more than enough: I can't hit something moving at 300m/s. Missiles, on the other hand, can hit something moving 3-4 times as fast just fine. --[23] Member-- Originally by: DB Preacher The only time BoB's backs are to the wall is when Backdoor Bandit is in local.
Rule2k Fate. Dusk and Dawn	Posted - 2006.08.12 01:18:00 - [13] diddums :(
Putain Caldari Project Mayhem Corp	Posted - 2006.08.12 04:05:00 - [14] Originally by: OULENfditle but just like ccp, take it away cause it causes foolish problems but then bring it back to sell more subscriptions, dam greedy bast0rds ...... Something tells me avoiding the language filter is frowned upon. On a more "your argument is horrible" note, how does un-nerfing a combo help CCP sell more subscriptions? You'd think most people who aren't even players yet wouldn't know about "dual mwds" and the "mwd + ab combo." Usually only people who play a game know specific strategies and things of that nature. I could see an argument made that they could get more users because current players would like the game better without the nerf and would thus recruit more new players, but that seems a little hollow in terms of real-world applicability. So tell me, how is this an evil CCP plot to make more money (isn't everything these days)? "Pity stands in opposition to all the tonic passions that augment the energy of the feeling of aliveness: it is a depressant. A man loses power when he pities." - Friedrich Nietzsche
OULENfditle	Posted - 2006.08.12 14:31:00 - [15] Your skills must be horrible because I get crows "popped" instantly at over 100Km and when I'm traveling in excess of 4000km/s regualarly particularly by tempests ....... what can I say to you when you can't. Removing content and then returning said content in a repackaged form is a marketing tool...
dailyhazard Caldari Unauthorised.	Posted - 2006.08.12 15:12:00 - [16] Originally by: OULENfditle Your skills must be horrible because I get crows "popped" instantly at over 100Km and when I'm traveling in excess of 4000km/s regualarly particularly by tempests ....... what can I say to you when you can't. Removing content and then returning said content in a repackaged form is a marketing tool... your piloting sucks, all i can say, if a missile is going 3000m/s its not gonna hit something thats going 4000/s your lucky you hit it for even 0.2 damage, dont whinge because you cant hit a ceptor. You dont have to worry about tracking and many other things connected with turrets.
Dark Shikari Caldari Imperium Technologies Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2006.08.12 16:31:00 - [17] Originally by: OULENfditle Your skills must be horrible because I get crows "popped" instantly at over 100Km Well yeah, thats easy when the crow is heading straight towards you. 99% of the time, the crow isn't a fool. --[23] Member-- Originally by: DB Preacher The only time BoB's backs are to the wall is when Backdoor Bandit is in local.
Jim McGregor Caldari	Posted - 2006.08.12 17:04:00 - [18] I suggest the Missile Guide and the Tracking Guide to the poster of this thread. --- Eve Wiki \| Eve Tribune \| Eve Pirate
OULENfditle	Posted - 2006.08.12 18:11:00 - [19] such noobs, do any of you pvp against experienced pvp'ers that know what they are doing ffs? The point is that with advanced skills trained up and using the correct mods missiles are neutralized completely, and thats BS. CCP has already modified the game to remove this type of advantage due to nothing other than ships going too fast and here we are with the same problem back in the game because ccp brought speed back in the game through the back door. Bottom line, its a stupid cycle to remove a problem only to bring it back months later through "new" additions to the game.
zurich93 XERCORE	Posted - 2006.08.13 08:12:00 - [20] Edited by: zurich93 on 13/08/2006 08:13:10 I got a tip for ya, post with your main. Missiles are fine, turrets find it very difficult to hit targets going at these speeds you say i mean 8km/s you talk about it like everyone is going that speed, i pearsonaly have never seen someone going 8km/s, your argument is all about flaming the posters who are against your point and therefore is a bad argument. better luck with your next flame/suggestion. Maby it will be, ZOMG my large hybrid railgun cant hit a frig thats orbiting me at 3KM.
scrooloose Minmatar Universal Army Curse Coalition	Posted - 2006.08.13 10:44:00 - [21] i attacked a rifter with MWD in a raven with torpedoes!!!! one volley took him to half armour. this was simply because the MWD increased his sig radius (just like a target painter) causing my torps to do alot of dmg, he was orbiting a corp member, so my torps were going to hit him, if he was running away they would never have reached him. "im not completely mad, parts are missing"
fire 59 Destructive Influence Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.08.13 12:03:00 - [22] Originally by: OULENfditle such noobs, do any of you pvp against experienced pvp'ers that know what they are doing ffs? The point is that with advanced skills trained up and using the correct mods missiles are neutralized completely, and thats BS. CCP has already modified the game to remove this type of advantage due to nothing other than ships going too fast and here we are with the same problem back in the game because ccp brought speed back in the game through the back door. Bottom line, its a stupid cycle to remove a problem only to bring it back months later through "new" additions to the game. Tbh, i don't see the problem your whineging about, turret user's get miffed coz missiles always hit and missile users whinge coz they cant always do max damage at any range. Buhu, use a painter, web or nos and stp being a baby and footstomping because people with intelligence disagree with you Iron and G eat babie's , my views are my own, they do not refect my corp or my alliance
OULENfditle	Posted - 2006.08.14 23:41:00 - [23] obviously people who don't have a clue disagree and sit here and talk about missiles like they hit for max damage all the time. blah blah blah. you dont' know what your are talking about. Speed makes missiles useless, I use that for defense all the time and its such a joke. Missiles never hit all the time unless its a noob just sitting there. Obviously its a bunch of turret people here that want to maintain their advantage over missile boat captains.
Ujio Noki Puppets on Steroids Veritas Immortalis	Posted - 2006.08.15 00:49:00 - [24] Originally by: OULENfditle obviously people who don't have a clue disagree and sit here and talk about missiles like they hit for max damage all the time. blah blah blah. you dont' know what your are talking about. Speed makes missiles useless, I use that for defense all the time and its such a joke. Missiles never hit all the time unless its a noob just sitting there. Obviously its a bunch of turret people here that want to maintain their advantage over missile boat captains. you are 100% idiot good points have been made about missiles vs guns and you have quite simply ignored them, missiles cannot hit inties orbiting at 4k m/s, and guns cannot... its jus that simple
OULENfditle	Posted - 2006.08.15 02:16:00 - [25] u should try reading the whole thread before throwing in your ignorant comments. missiles traveling faster than 4km/s will certainly catch and hit ships as they should fool. Hitting for next to zero damage is retarded like your response.
UnSiViLiZeD Beagle Corp	Posted - 2006.08.15 06:07:00 - [26] Edited by: UnSiViLiZeD on 15/08/2006 06:09:52 Edited by: UnSiViLiZeD on 15/08/2006 06:09:44 I have been playing eve for close to a year i curently pirate and have fought in about 10 wars, there are guys here that have been playig double or triple what i have, we are trying to understand what you are going on about, but instead you insist on calling everyone noob and tell us we have no idea of what we are talking about, you must be one of those people were everyone is wrong and your always right ? For the record, ships have resist, ships move, they have a sig radius these affect dmg, correct me if im wrong at all........ missles will always hit if its going faster then the target, how hard it hits depends on the sig radius and resist. For each one of these there is a counter its called webbing, painting, and knowing what ammo to use per race. BTW to clarify: what ships are you flying and what setup you useing and what are your targets pvp ? pve ? smaller ? bigger ? _______________________________________________ Life is a game if your not winning you must be loseing.
UnSiViLiZeD Beagle Corp	Posted - 2006.08.15 06:10:00 - [27] BTW to clarify: what ships are you flying and what setup you useing and what are your targets pvp ? pve ? smaller ? bigger ? _______________________________________________ Life is a game if your not winning you must be loseing.
Jet Collins	Posted - 2006.08.15 14:25:00 - [28] OULENfditle dude you need to calm down. Think about what people are saying and what you are saying.. be a little racional. right now you look like the Newb. If you had any clue you would now the people that have responded in this post have been playing for quite some time and since you are either a newb or an alt you have no credibility. Most of us know how missles work. Cruise missles can insta pop inties and they can also 0.0 damage agaist them. Try ship fit for the missle similator on the website play with the differnet stats and you might understand. If a ships is going insane speeds it is mostlikly using a MWD. in which case it will have a large sig. This will cause missles to do more damage. But you also have to factor the speed. If its going faster than missles speed it will do less damage. If the person is MWD turns off MWD right before missle hits yes it will do 0.0 damage. Missles work very well. If they didn't more people would whine about it and not just you .
LUGAL MOP'N'GLO	Posted - 2006.08.15 16:39:00 - [29] Edited by: LUGAL MOP''N''GLO on 15/08/2006 16:41:00 I will say this. Missiles do not hit as hard as turrets NO. However! I have a pretty good Tackler Maller setup as follows. 3 medium nos 3 200mm Autocannons II's (what can I say, the other char is minmatar best gunnery skills are for AC's) 10mn MWD Webber 7.5 Scram 2x Medium Armor Repairer II 2x Energized Adaptive 1x Energized Thermal 1x WCS In Scrims with Corp: I tackled and utterly slaughtered a Prophecy the other day by getting under his T2 lasers. He couldn't even hit me just hit orbit at 500m start to head out, then hit approach again then hit orbit, approach and rinse/repeat. He couldn't hit me worth a damn. About 2 minutes passed, he was out of cap and my AC's were ripping him up at that point. I tried the same thing vs a Damnation with T2 heavy missiles. I lost... BAD. Of course I couldn't get under his guns, he was using missiles. They hit every time. In that light, missiles are great for some applications, but generally pretty crappy to use in PvP. You have to wait for them to get to the target and half the time the target is approaching a gate. On the other hand, you warp to gate at 100km in a Tempest and one volley a frig approaching the gate. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Win a Cynabal for 10ml!!!
lestus Amarr The Echelon Corporation The Echelon Order	Posted - 2006.08.15 21:17:00 - [30] as somebody already mentioned: worst.thread.ever
Phoenix Lord The Arrow Project The ARR0W Project	Posted - 2006.08.16 05:57:00 - [31] Someone just shoot this ***** retard.... Btw, since when were large guns able to shoot inties going at 4km/s? Unless ofcourse the inty pilot was a pure n00b who decided to go charging straight towards the BS. I would love to have some of the ** youre smoking man. ---------------- Meet... bunneh:
OULENfditle	Posted - 2006.08.17 00:53:00 - [32] LOL talk about dumbazzes, no you dont' have to be traveling straight toward them noob to be blown out of the sky. Turn your mwd on and you're pretty easy pickins for a turrent gun but on the other hand turn on your mwd and become immune to missile damage of any meaning full amount. believe what you want, its an tactic i use religously now. It is just another example of eve turning into empire heaven and nothing but blob warfare in the 0.0 regions.
fire 59 Destructive Influence Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.08.17 08:44:00 - [33] OP, you are so bloody clueless i think you can't be helped tbh. If it is travelling that fast, fire something which has a faster explsion velocity, like t2 light missile's. I believe they are designed to put the hurt on frigates so you have the tool's, use them and stop whining that your cruise or whatever can't hit for max damage all the time. Iron and G eat babie's , my views are my own, they do not refect my corp or my alliance
John Blackthorn Foundation Free Trade Coalition	Posted - 2006.08.17 17:02:00 - [34] I have to counter something here. Just the other day I am in my recon ship, orbiting a tempest at 20km. I am traveling 738 m/s/ (AB II and nanofibers) and the tempest hits me with his 1400mm. The six shots were 328, 253, 336, 352, and 1956. What the.... 1956! Those shots happend at the same time. Instant pop of my ship. So don't try to tell people turrets don't hit. They all hit me, and no misses. In orbit at high speed with a cruiser size ship.
dailyhazard Caldari Unauthorised.	Posted - 2006.08.18 11:14:00 - [35] Originally by: John Blackthorn I have to counter something here. Just the other day I am in my recon ship, orbiting a tempest at 20km. I am traveling 738 m/s/ (AB II and nanofibers) and the tempest hits me with his 1400mm. The six shots were 328, 253, 336, 352, and 1956. What the.... 1956! Those shots happend at the same time. Instant pop of my ship. So don't try to tell people turrets don't hit. They all hit me, and no misses. In orbit at high speed with a cruiser size ship. 1 word....transversal...
Crumplecorn Gallente Aerial Boundaries Inc. Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2006.08.18 13:57:00 - [36] nerf missles again plz kthxbye ----------
GPerson Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2006.08.18 15:19:00 - [37] I have read this thread. I have read the ops "arguments." And I only have one thing to say. Please, for the love of EVE, go back to WoW.
Jim McGregor Caldari	Posted - 2006.08.18 15:36:00 - [38] Originally by: John Blackthorn I have to counter something here. Just the other day I am in my recon ship, orbiting a tempest at 20km. I am traveling 738 m/s/ (AB II and nanofibers) and the tempest hits me with his 1400mm. The six shots were 328, 253, 336, 352, and 1956. What the.... 1956! Those shots happend at the same time. Instant pop of my ship. So don't try to tell people turrets don't hit. They all hit me, and no misses. In orbit at high speed with a cruiser size ship. I love when Tempest kills something. --- Eve Wiki \| Eve Tribune \| Eve Pirate
Arnold Swartzenegger Gallente Penetrate	Posted - 2006.08.18 16:49:00 - [39] smart raven pilots fit webber drones
Druid R Murder of Crows E N I G M A	Posted - 2006.08.18 19:50:00 - [40] as to why the ships evade the damage, its called explosive velocity. this has a figure in our game as it does in RL. moving at abov roughly 4kms evades this. because when the missile detonates near u, u are going faster than its exposion, so dont get damaged. Speed is a good defence to everything. in my clawe i can effectivl avoid both missile and gunnery users. Speed is a defense not an offense. Missiles are overpowered in the sense if i orbit at 8km/s and fire a missile, as long as my target is moving at these insane speed smy missile will hit, but using uns, no chance, this is however to do with the fact that the devs decided that u get transversal velocity on your turrets when orbiting an effecitvly stationary object, which isnt true (swing a conker on a string for proof). but hey ho itsa game, and its well balanced at the mo.
OULENfditle	Posted - 2006.08.19 00:36:00 - [41] Edited by: OULENfditle on 19/08/2006 00:36:38 there is no magic transverse velocity for missiles thus they are completely neutralized by speed which is totally stupid. IF missiles catch the target they should always do a minimum amount of damge. The old balance between running at speed till the missiles ran out of steam vs how long their cap lasted was much more balanced. When missiles hit in real life they do real damage, ALL THE TIME. In RL the trick is getting them to hit. The whole point is that there is no way to neutralize turrets to the same effect as currently applies to missiles. Thats game imbalance. And before you go off whining about missiles hitting too hard that was the point, ships with big firepower but weak defenses, which is what caldari have. CCP has a continual habit of removing something from the game, like nerfing missiles, then bringing it back through a "content addition", "precision missiles" BUT the problem is CCP is getting us BALANCED except on paper which is reflected in actual game play. Most people started out caldari cause they were "prettier" and missiles just came along with them. Don't throw stupid stones trying to make out like people decided they were going to go caldari just for the "missile advantage". My initial point isn't about poor poor missiles its about INBALANCE in the game, something EVERYONE should be interested in achieving(except those only interested in owning the 'I win button'). COMBAT, PvP was a lot more fun two years ago when there was much more balance "in the game". Its turned into gank-athon today and doesn't seem to be getting any better.
Waragha Art of War	Posted - 2006.08.19 01:07:00 - [42] Originally by: OULENfditle dude large turrets can still insta pop inties running at over 4,000m/s. Get real, can't hit at 200 m/s. Ever hear of transverse veloctiy? Why do you think its availible on your overview. MWD should not be a continous use item. ALL mwd should drain your cap in a short amount of time, the faster they propel you the more energy they should use. Is susposed to be a "short" burst of speed. NOT a device that makes your ship immune to damage........ As a penalty for use of a mwd would be nice >>such as>>> if using a mwd prevented you from entering warp for the same amount of time the mwd was in use. something like that would provide many more interesting logistical situations for combat. Quote of the day. Originally by: Trepkos ... The only difference between GS and NPC's are that GS respawn quicker.
Vicious Phoenix	Posted - 2006.08.19 07:34:00 - [43] Wow, I can't believe I just saw this thread, its amazing and has been BM'd for future entertainment. To the OP, you need to play EVE more and learn how it works as most of youre arguments show little to no understanding of the game's mechanics. CFW (Certified Forum Warrior) I kill people ingame too.
OULENfditle	Posted - 2006.08.20 05:41:00 - [44] I take it you're one of the "game mechanic" types that think because the math works on paper it's what you actually see in the game. Sorry it doesn't always work out in actual game play the way it looks on paper. If it did the game would never need adjusting.
Vicious Phoenix	Posted - 2006.08.20 07:11:00 - [45] Originally by: OULENfditle I take it you're one of the "game mechanic" types that think because the math works on paper it's what you actually see in the game. Sorry it doesn't always work out in actual game play the way it looks on paper. If it did the game would never need adjusting. Huh? CFW (Certified Forum Warrior) I kill people ingame too.
Frater Perdurabo The Ancient Illuminated Seers of Bavaria	Posted - 2006.08.20 12:47:00 - [46] Hi, i'd like to contribute nothing to this comedy-gold-star-entertainment of a thread. I meerly hope more people reply with well thought out points showing how the OP is in error... so he can post and call them all noobs again
SUNscatcher Caldari Interstellar eXodus	Posted - 2006.08.20 17:26:00 - [47] Edited by: SUNscatcher on 20/08/2006 17:30:41 Edited by: SUNscatcher on 20/08/2006 17:29:24 Edited by: SUNscatcher on 20/08/2006 17:28:08 I see what she is saying why all the anger at her opinion? If you can catch me you can have me.
Daylorim Caldari Through the Looking Glass	Posted - 2006.08.21 15:44:00 - [48] Originally by: OULENfditle When missiles hit in real life they do real damage, ALL THE TIME. In RL the trick is getting them to hit. In fact, missiles rarely hit planes, IRL. They explode when thay are cloase enough (or estimate they are). And, luckily for the pilots, they don't inflict damages every time. A smart pilot may evade them. And, believe me, the actual fighters never go faster than a missile. Please notice I'm talking about evading, not jamming. So, why couldn't the interceptors do it? That's represented by the explosion speed of the missiles. Originally by: OULENfditle Most people started out caldari cause they were "prettier" and missiles just came along with them. Don't throw stupid stones trying to make out like people decided they were going to go caldari just for the "missile advantage". First, I never see anyone thinking the caldari ships are "pretty". I've hear ugly, strange, particular, but never pretty. I personally like them, but I don't think they are pretty, and I didn't choose to play a caldari bacause of their ship of their missiles. I choosed after having the background. But I must be a noob, so, you don't care about what I say...
OULENfditle	Posted - 2006.08.23 23:12:00 - [49] Caldari characters dumbazz. Missiles hit planes all the time. In real life the limitations are the targeting systems. Get a life and stop spewing crap.
Nathanial Victor	Posted - 2006.08.24 01:29:00 - [50] Originally by: Testicular Testes Worst. Thread. Ever. omg OP you are totally helpless man. G/l w/ the rest of your life man, its gonna be real tough for you out there....
OULENfditle	Posted - 2006.08.25 13:22:00 - [51] It is soo sad to see so many unable to see the point. There are always those that wade in and trash any opinion put foward but fact is mwd were assigned a penalty for a reason. Go back to the dev blogs that covered their concerns and the reasons for their actions at the time. Turn on a mwd and you recieved a PENALTY as far as damage goes but today when you turn on a mwd you receive a BONUS with regard to missile damage. RECAP for all you slower thinkers: MWD ON = PENALTY vs TURRETS MWD ON = BONUS vs LAUNCHERS bonus for one group vs penalty for orginal intent equals imbalance.
Wizzkidy Stupid People Always Need Killing E N I G M A	Posted - 2006.08.25 13:48:00 - [52] lol, OP is the dumbest person EVER!!11 NO ONE can hit my crusader with a turret when i'm traveling at over 4000m/s I have NEVER had this happen to me ONCE and I have been flying the things for months and months and have had my fair share of tempests/geddons/apocs/megas and ajnything else that fires turrets shoot me! u nub!
Sendraks	Posted - 2006.08.25 14:04:00 - [53] Originally by: OULENfditle Caldari characters dumbazz. Missiles hit planes all the time. In real life the limitations are the targeting systems. Get a life and stop spewing crap. Either you are a comedy genius or the heir to the throne of the kingdom of idiots. Regardless, thank you for the laughs you have provided on a slow Friday afteroon.
Talio ZomB	Posted - 2006.08.26 12:27:00 - [54] OMG OULENfditle you sound so much like a noob. you quote dual AB/MWD that would hark back to the 2003 early 2004 days. But still you are a noob. I am a missle junkie, got heavy spec 4, cruise spec 4, torp spec 4, citadels. and have used all extensively and used the tech II ammos on sisi, tq pvp and pve. I find that you argue missles as gimped.... I (speaking as a zeolot of the missle religion) feel that turret users have it harder. stating from the top here are some random scenarios that ppl are faced with often. my citadels will hit an orbiting carrier, turret dreads will miss...(ok maybe not a scenario ppl face often but on sisi it sure is) my torps can kill orbiting frigates, a turret BS wont...ever....in a million years. my cruise can kill an orbiting frig even better, relatively speaking, than torps will and heavies same again now turret bs deal with transversal only a target could be doing 4000 but if transversal is 0m/s then the target is gonna feel some serious hurting... OMG I FOUND AN ADVANTAGE TO TURRETS F***G NERF IT NOW CCP. while missles damage will be negated by speed in almost any direction, apart from flying head long in to the missle stream, I find that targets tend to get a mouth full of death if they cant exceed the explosion velocity by a lot. Now if a target is going so fast u cant damage it, then damn good on them, that is their defense against your weapons, they didnt just happento pick a fast ship for nothing, (courier missions done quick? nah) But as with any weapon systems some have advantages in certain areas, while others have them else where. if missles were like rails or blasters, why make them in the first place, why not just use rails and blasters. if you dont like them stop F**G using them. fighters are drones, but more like BC class of drones, all cap ships suck vs frigs, get used to it. the frig may be setting still but the fighters sure as hell aint, they fly about mental. I know I am leaving a lot unsaid, with regards to precision missles adding webs and painters to the mix, but I feel I dont need to mention all that, OULENfditle you are just wrong.... says a zealot of the missle religion.
Talio ZomB	Posted - 2006.08.26 12:38:00 - [55] I pvp in a torp spamming scorp and raven. Once upon a time Talio ZomB took his sparkling EWWWWWW scorp in to geminate on a pre-imtive vigilante stunt to erradicate evil whever it may lurk and in whatever form it was. Talio ZomB went deeper in to region meandering left right up and down, he then happend upon a mushroom which he chose to eat which doubled his size which allowed him to jump to higher areas and collect and eat a flower of fire, this allowed him to throw orbs of fire to kill the turtles. After killing a few turtles an ebil t2 frig squad came round to spoil Talio ZomB plans, but noooooooo...no no no no no.... 3 AFs 2 ceptors didnt not win, they lost two of their number and the rest fled. then they all lived happily ever after.. A torp config scorp eh...
OULENfditle	Posted - 2006.08.28 02:03:00 - [56] Originally by: Talio ZomB if you dont like them stop F*****G using them. quote] I really don't give a hoot as I use projectiles but got tired of those missile pilots always whining about unfair it was so I needed some good comebacks. I got a bunch. thanks guys
Vichan Ly'onsen	Posted - 2006.09.12 20:35:00 - [57] In RL (as if RL mattered in a game) Air to Air and surface to AirMissiles do NOT always hit their target, the reason they do not is NOT entirely due to limitation of their tracking systems. In RL missiles are almost ALWAYS much faster than thier targets can ever hope to be, but they are lacking in maneuverability. A well used tactic to avoid any heat seeking or radar homing missile attacking an aircraft is to turn into the missile. The tactic is used to take advantage of the planes increased agility over the missile...basicly it requires the pilot to get a visual on the missiles contrail, he then places his aircrafts lift vector on or near to the contrail and begins a gentle turn towards the missile, as the missile nears that turn increases, when the missile is close the pilot pulls a maximum G turn into the missile...this turn will exceed the missiles ability to track the aircraft and will often result in the missile overshooting from behind, and losing its lock on the aircraft. If the pilot executes this properly he will even be out of the proximity fuse detection range and the missile will not detonate, even if he is not the missile will explode directly behind the aircraft, from behind aircraft offer a much smaller target such that shrapnel from the exploding warhed for the most part misses. This tactic has been successful since Vietnam and is still used today. Even the most flawless tracking system in the world will not make a missile travelling at mach 3+ able to turn with a plane. However in EVE - missiles have what appears to be infinite agility and never lose their track on target ships..well maybe that would be difficult to code... so explosion velocity is incorporated and I'm willing to bet a rounding off of damage is done, if your targets velocity far exceeds the explosion velocity of the missile, then no damage is done.
SibSpi	Posted - 2006.09.15 20:30:00 - [58] Originally by: OULENfditle oooookay so whats with missiles? Did you really set out to make them completely useless in pvp situations? Because as it is anyone with a mwd seems all but impervious to damage OR damage is so small as to be laughable. HOW is this fair when every other turret gets a BONUS when opponents use a mwd against them? Second point, When targets arent' moving why don't missile hit for full effect? would make sense, NO? snip Same goes for fighters, whats the point when they can't hit anything that simple turns on a mwd??? AND an even bigger puzzle, send you fighters to kill a frigate standing still ........ OMG they can't hit the dam thing!!! YOur kidding right!!!? Let me take you on a quick adventure in pvp 'basics' Missiles have three factors involved in calculating their damage. 1) the damage type and amount of the missile vs the resist of your target 2) the explosion velocity of your missile against the speed of your target 3) the explosion radius of your missile against the signature radius of your target So let's look at torpedoes or cruise missiles vs frigates or cruisers An average frigate has a signature radius of about 40m, while the explosion radius of a slightly skilled cruise missile would generally be around 250m. Given the damage is dissipated over the area that the missile blows up the smaller your target is, the less of that damage it absorbs. Now let's look at the velocity of your target. The average non microwarpdrive using frigate does around 750m/s or so, while the explosion velocity of a slightly skilled cruise missile is about 575m/s or so. Given the explosion has to catch up to your target to deal damage to it in the first place this quite obviously means the explosion isn't catching up to the frigate too well, and thus deals limited damage to it. End of it is, don't use cruise missiles against frigates unless the frigate is moving slower than your maximum explosion velocity, and if possible, bloat its signature radius either by forcing it to use a mwd or painting it. MWD'ing frigates are NOT immune to larger missiles, they are in fact MORE immune to larger missiles, since their signature radius can easily become as large as the explosion radius of a cruise missile, the only reason why they're taking reduced damage is because you're not webbing them, reducing their velocity. Next let's look at fighters. Fighters are effectively really quick cruisers with pretty wimpy tracking. Their tracking speed and scanning radius are those of a quicker rate of fire cruiser weapon, thus meaning they don't hit frigates or smaller well AS STANDARD In addition to this, they are artificial intelligence, they are pretty darn stupid, unlike a real player (yes, I know players can be pretty dumb as well). Because of this, they orbit at a range and velocity that makes their weapons stop tracking frigates well. Now let's look at how you get around this - did you know there's a little thing known as 'transversal velocity'? Make the transversal between the frigate and the fighter low enough, and it'll hit it. Same thing goes for virtually all other turrets, provided their target is in range. So logically, if a fighter is busy following a frigate, they're moving in the same direction, doing for argument's sake the same speed, because of this their transversal velocity drops, allowing the fighter to hit. Go relearn tracking and missiles, it'll do you good. http://www.eve-online.com/guide/en/g26.asp <- turrets http://www.eve-online.com/guide/en/g27.asp <- missile guide There's no problems with mwd's, missiles or turrets, there's just a problem with YOUR logic and understanding of game mechanics
Kyle Sucks	Posted - 2006.09.15 21:27:00 - [59] You seem to be having some extremely rare difficulties PvPing with a missile ship... i think this might have something to do with a mental deficiancy which i call retardedness I'm a regular raven pilot, i've used this ship for a long time, and have had no problems with it(except when i was an ignorant nub). If you are using torpedoes to try and hit an interceptor, you shouldnt expect to instapwnomgwtfbbq the ****zle out of it, and lewt that nice gistii mwd. If the instabbq idea is what you have in mind you should look at the eagle. It has the perfect stats for a frig popping specialist, with it's long range cruiser guns. If you want to fly a missile ship, look at the cerb. Long range, and better explosion velocity/radius than torps. You could also try the t2 missiles. We have the shortest ladder to large t2 weapons... use it, i've popped several ceptors with my javelins. Simple version: I r raven pil0t. I r not nub. I use t2 Missls. Use em. Or Eagle. Turrets, rofl, can't hit ----------- www.stavros-online.com

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