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Eve @ No 30 in the PCG top 100 games ever

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Brutor Shaun Minmatar Freelancers UK Alliance	Posted - 2006.08.09 14:26:00 - [1] The UK edition of PC Gamer has released their top 100 gamers ever, and Eve got a whole paragraph and came in at number 30. World of Warcraft? A whole page and placed number 5 Some things are just wrong. The PCG top 100 is one of them.
Crumplecorn Gallente Aerial Boundaries Inc. Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2006.08.09 14:31:00 - [2] Millions of people sitting in front of a computer grinding for levels can't be wrong. ----------
coldplasma	Posted - 2006.08.09 14:32:00 - [3] Edited by: coldplasma on 09/08/2006 14:32:44 To be honest, the only reason WoW is always voted ahead of EVE is because of it's huge advertising thrust resulting in huge popularity. I've played WoW and don't really find it very interesting. I hope CCP plans on making a few publicity campaigns once the new version of Trinity comes out. ____________________________ See you in 0.0 kids...
Aodha Khan Minmatar Blood Inquisition	Posted - 2006.08.09 14:34:00 - [4] Originally by: Brutor Shaun World of Warcraft? A whole page and placed number 5 Unbelievable. There is NOTHING that makes WoW a top 5 MMORPG never mind a top 5 game. So in war, the way is to avoid what is strong and to strike at what is weak.
Spartan239 Caldari Regeneration Axiom Empire	Posted - 2006.08.09 14:34:00 - [5] PCG did give wow 94% and only gave EVE 90% so yes something is wrong, as is that fact that it apears that most of the pcg office play wow and not many play eve anymore
Minsc Gallente Phoenix Order	Posted - 2006.08.09 14:36:00 - [6] Edited by: Minsc on 09/08/2006 14:36:49 TBH the fact that EVE is actually ranked in the top 100 games of all time in PCG is a high praise in and of itself, especially at number 30. Remember this isn't a list of JUST MMO's, it's all games from the start till now. There are a lot of games that could be considered AAA titles over the years and even still EVE ranks 30. For an independantly developed MMO that has had almost no real advertising done that is a monstrous achievement. Originally by: Sharkbait please for the love of god read the dam stickies
Commoner Caldari The Foundation of Free Traders The Core Collective	Posted - 2006.08.09 14:37:00 - [7] Originally by: coldplasma Edited by: coldplasma on 09/08/2006 14:32:44 To be honest, the only reason WoW is always voted ahead of EVE is because of it's huge advertising thrust resulting in huge popularity. I've played WoW and don't really find it very interesting. I hope CCP plans on making a few publicity campaigns once the new version of Trinity comes out. I don't get this one, in all fairness WoW is an extremely smooth game, both in terms of relability and performance, and it's virtually bug free. WoW is like popmusic, smooth and streamlined and for the masses, EvE is more like rockmusic or soul, and has a much more narrow userbase.
coldplasma	Posted - 2006.08.09 14:39:00 - [8] Edited by: coldplasma on 09/08/2006 14:39:03 WoW officially has a much lower average age in the userbase than EVE does. I can't remember the actual figures, but I guess chasing after Voldemorte with fairy wands and magic swords ends up the more desirable choice of MMO ____________________________ See you in 0.0 kids...
Tao Han Caldari Crucial Electronics	Posted - 2006.08.09 14:46:00 - [9] Both me an my brother used to play WoW alot but I cant help but feeling that it is infested by 1337-kids and immature 12 year olds. I really loved the game (yes!) but I cant stand its community and neither can my brother. I choose to stay in EvE and ditch my WoW account and my brother is hoping for Age of Conan to not get the same community.
Dark Shikari Caldari Imperium Technologies Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2006.08.09 14:51:00 - [10] Originally by: Aodha Khan Originally by: Brutor Shaun World of Warcraft? A whole page and placed number 5 Unbelievable. There is NOTHING that makes WoW a top 5 MMORPG never mind a top 5 game. World of Warcraft is popular for the same reason N'Sync and the Backstreet Boys went platinum. --Proud member of the [23]-- -WTS Heavy Electron II, 100mn AB II
Novarei The Dead Parrot Shoppe Inc.	Posted - 2006.08.09 14:51:00 - [11] So what did they rate the games on?
Aodha Khan Minmatar Blood Inquisition	Posted - 2006.08.09 14:54:00 - [12] Originally by: Commoner I don't get this one, in all fairness WoW is an extremely smooth game, both in terms of relability and performance, and it's virtually bug free. Still, a basic, limited MMORPG thats 'reliable' and 'bug free' shouldn't justify it getting to no.5 on the best games of all time. So in war, the way is to avoid what is strong and to strike at what is weak.
Lei'ella Neirenn	Posted - 2006.08.09 14:56:00 - [13] Originally by: Dark Shikari Originally by: Aodha Khan Originally by: Brutor Shaun World of Warcraft? A whole page and placed number 5 Unbelievable. There is NOTHING that makes WoW a top 5 MMORPG never mind a top 5 game. World of Warcraft is popular for the same reason N'Sync and the Backstreet Boys went platinum. mmm Backstreet Boys anyway ihave to agree taht wow is realy popular game, much more popular then eve, well cos they have like 5 mills kids from 11 to 13 years old playing that game yeah i am teh banned happy now ?
Boonaki Caldari Suffoco Noctis Atrocitas	Posted - 2006.08.09 15:02:00 - [14] What was number 1? Fear the Ibis of doom!
Dark Shikari Caldari Imperium Technologies Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2006.08.09 15:04:00 - [15] Originally by: Boonaki What was number 1? The game made by the company that gave them the most money. --Proud member of the [23]-- -WTS Heavy Electron II, 100mn AB II
Aodha Khan Minmatar Blood Inquisition	Posted - 2006.08.09 15:06:00 - [16] Edited by: Aodha Khan on 09/08/2006 15:06:05 It's got to be Doom or Championship Manager !!? So in war, the way is to avoid what is strong and to strike at what is weak.
Peter Stuyvesant Amarr	Posted - 2006.08.09 15:09:00 - [17] #1 was Oblivion. At least Eve went up a few places and WoW dropped a few...
Clytamnestra Jazz Associates R i s e	Posted - 2006.08.09 15:11:00 - [18] Am I the only one a little bit tired of the animosity shown World of Warcraft, and all the other fantasy first-person mmorpgs? I mean, they're two completely different games. I played WoW for a long time. Bored of it now. Felt like I was paying a monthly fee to spend time woth other peoples' kids. But arguing whether WoW is better than EVE is like arguing whether chess is better than poker. Oh, and I don't put much past any top-100 games ever list. It's like when MTV ran top-100 songs ever, and none of them were older than twenty years. Missed The Beatles by a smidge, eh? --
Matori Kar	Posted - 2006.08.09 15:15:00 - [19] Silly fanboys WOW is a VERY different type of game to EVE. In many ways WOW is alot more fun than EVE, it provides instant and constant action/gratification with little/no down time (in play terms) is much easier to get into, has little/no learning curve...in short a nice fast paced (usually) action packed mindless game. It does however have IMO a short shelf life and the need to do stupid instance grinding at high levels which spoils all that 'is' good about WOW. Compared to many MMOs however, there really is little 'grind' in WOW, even EVE could be argued to require more 'grind' than WOW EVE, has legs, it has staying power, it is in game design a VERY different concept to WOW and almost any other MMO. No 'character classes', the ability to train to do anything, the ability to be able to compete (to a degree) with anyone (usually restricted to specialization unfortunately, but thats another discussion). You can pvp in many many different forms, you could for example never leave a station and still play the game and have fun. It has risk, it has reward. There are many aspects of the game that people love and hate, but the inbuilt adaptability is what I think makes it attractive and also what keeps people playing it. It has shelf life EVE is the better GAME, however, WOW is/was certainly far more fun for the few months I played it. It has mass appeal, EVE does not. WOW has been responsible for a huge increase in people playing MMOs, I expect there are quite a few people coming to EVE from WOW. Silly fanboys like to point fingers and call all WOW players 10 year olds, but that's simply not true, when I played WOW, I met people from 12 to 65, guess what? yes thats right, I play EVE with people aged 12 - 65.....and the same age range in every other MMO I have played over the years(DAOC, Planetside, Jumpgate, Anarchy Online.....)
Splagada Minmatar	Posted - 2006.08.09 15:22:00 - [20] id put Populous, Lemmings way before any wow or eve, or wolfenstein castle (the original). for online, what was it. Realm Online? those were the programs that invented the "gaming" idea. real new concepts, totally original. now we call that a "fps" or sadly a "dommlike", or a "mmorpg" - Looking for technetium delivery contracts
Pepperami Art of War	Posted - 2006.08.09 15:25:00 - [21] Originally by: Peter Stuyvesant #1 was Oblivion. At least Eve went up a few places and WoW dropped a few... That was the best of all time? I enjoyed it, but there were far better games I enjoyed much more at the time they were "new", baldurs gate, baldurs gate II (omg dual wield!), day of the tentacle, wolfenstein 3D and so on.
Dark Shikari Caldari Imperium Technologies Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2006.08.09 15:30:00 - [22] Edited by: Dark Shikari on 09/08/2006 15:35:36 Originally by: Matori Kar EVE is the better GAME, however, WOW is/was certainly far more fun for the few months I played it. It has mass appeal, EVE does not. I played WoW before EVE, and even then without being spoiled by EVE, it bored me in about 20 minutes. I kept playing, but it never got fun. Saying that WoW has "little grind" is ridiculous: its the only game I have played in my entire life that made every part of the game a grind. PvP is a grind: a grind to get honor. Raiding is a grind: a grind to get that uber-rare raid item you want. Leveling is a grind, obviously. Crafting is a grind: get all your materials (a grind) and go click, click, click on the button. Getting faction standing is a grind... god everything is a grind. Oh, and Oblivion number 1 is ridiculous. Morrowind was better in many ways (especially in the sense of the story). There were flawed game mechanics (the leveling and XP system was downhill from morrowind... e.g. you got the same XP for every spell no matter whether its a noob spell or a 100-mana uberspell). And overall while it was a damn good game, saying it is the best of all time is absolutely ridiculous. My method of judging games is simple: how long they keep my attention. The vast majority of games can't keep my attention for more than a few hours to days, simply because they are boring and uninteresting. A select few have kept my interest for more than a month: Alpha Centauri EVE Online Earth and Beyond Shattered Galaxy Anarchy Online (just barely, 2 months) Starcraft Age of Empires 2 Diablo 2 Homeworld and a few more that I've probably forgotten about. --[23] Member-- Originally by: DB Preacher The only time BoB's backs are to the wall is when Backdoor Bandit is in local.
Clytamnestra Jazz Associates R i s e	Posted - 2006.08.09 15:41:00 - [23] Originally by: Peter Stuyvesant #1 was Oblivion. At least Eve went up a few places and WoW dropped a few... Hell I played Daggerfall more than Oblivion. --
Matori Kar	Posted - 2006.08.09 15:44:00 - [24] Edited by: Matori Kar on 09/08/2006 15:44:45 Originally by: Dark Shikari Originally by: Matori Kar EVE is the better GAME, however, WOW is/was certainly far more fun for the few months I played it. It has mass appeal, EVE does not. Saying that WoW has "little grind" is ridiculous: its the only game I have played in my entire life that made every part of the game a grind. PvP is a grind: a grind to get honor. Raiding is a grind: a grind to get that uber-rare raid item you want. Leveling is a grind, obviously. Crafting is a grind: get all your materials (a grind) and go click, click, click on the button. Getting faction standing is a grind... god everything is a grind. Lol, I am happy for you that you never played earlier games like DAOC etc - the grind in WOW is pathetic in the extreme when compared to earlier games in the genre Originally by: Dark Shikari Oh, and Oblivion number 1 is ridiculous. Morrowind was better in many ways (especially in the sense of the story). There were flawed game mechanics (the leveling and XP system was downhill from morrowind... e.g. you got the same XP for every spell no matter whether its a noob spell or a 100-mana uberspell). And overall while it was a good game, saying it is the best of all time is absolutely ridiculous. WOW (pun intended ) I agree with something DS has written /faints (no sarcasm intended) Originally by: Clytamnestra Oh, and I don't put much past any top-100 games ever list. It's like when MTV ran top-100 songs ever, and none of them were older than twenty years. People always vote for the latest and 'greatest' even if it isn't
Dark Shikari Caldari Imperium Technologies Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2006.08.09 15:47:00 - [25] Edited by: Dark Shikari on 09/08/2006 15:47:39 Originally by: Matori Kar Originally by: Dark Shikari Originally by: Matori Kar EVE is the better GAME, however, WOW is/was certainly far more fun for the few months I played it. It has mass appeal, EVE does not. Saying that WoW has "little grind" is ridiculous: its the only game I have played in my entire life that made every part of the game a grind. PvP is a grind: a grind to get honor. Raiding is a grind: a grind to get that uber-rare raid item you want. Leveling is a grind, obviously. Crafting is a grind: get all your materials (a grind) and go click, click, click on the button. Getting faction standing is a grind... god everything is a grind. Lol, I am happy for you that you never played earlier games like DAOC etc - the grind in WOW is pathetic in the extreme when compared to earlier games in the genre I'm not saying that in WoW the grind is long. Indeed, leveling and the like is fast compared to old-style and Korean MMOs. However, instead of grinding for a long time and then doing something fun (like PvP), the entire game consists only of short grinds and nothing else. Even PvP is turned into a grind through the honor system. --[23] Member-- Originally by: DB Preacher The only time BoB's backs are to the wall is when Backdoor Bandit is in local.
Stephar Amarr Viziam	Posted - 2006.08.09 15:51:00 - [26] Originally by: Clytamnestra Am I the only one a little bit tired of the animosity shown World of Warcraft, and all the other fantasy first-person mmorpgs? I mean, they're two completely different games. I played WoW for a long time. Bored of it now. Felt like I was paying a monthly fee to spend time woth other peoples' kids. But arguing whether WoW is better than EVE is like arguing whether chess is better than poker. Oh, and I don't put much past any top-100 games ever list. It's like when MTV ran top-100 songs ever, and none of them were older than twenty years. Missed The Beatles by a smidge, eh? Agreed, bashing WoW is getting a little old. They are two completely different games. WoW is the best traditional fantasy MMORPG ever created, manipulating all the old tricks & trades better than any of its predecessors. Its easy to play, highly customizable, and offers content for both hardcore and casual players. And of any MMORPG that I've ever played, it is by far the most polished and bug-free. Is it perfect? Of course not. Its design is not exactly original, the introduction of new content is extremely slow, the end-game is a grind, and too much of its content is instanced. And worst of all, the game is designed linearly. Raids are the worst culprit, as you have to farm Molten Core to do Blackwing Lair, which you need to farm to do Naxx, which you need to farm to do _____, etc. This is where EVE wins. With player generated content, the game has a much longer shelf life. I'd love to see an EVE-style game with the financial backing of a company like Blizzard. Imagine if CCP could increase the number of devs by x10... more bugs would get fixed, and content would arrive at a higher rate. IMO, such a game would almost be perfect. But perfection is something that can never be attained, only something to strive for. WoW is like the Starcraft of MMORPG's. Starcraft didn't really do anything new with the RTS genre, it just did it better than any of its predecessors. EVE is more of a pioneer, and I wouldn't be surprised to see some of its defining mechanics incorporated into future MMORPG's. I don't understand why people can't appreciate both games for what they are.
Verone	Posted - 2006.08.09 15:55:00 - [27] Originally by: Dark Shikari I played WoW before EVE, and even then without being spoiled by EVE, it bored me in about 20 minutes. I once looked at WoW and picked it off the shelf in my local Game Store. I then laughed and promptly proceeded to put it back. Immediately after, I headed to the toilet block in the shopping center to wash my hands free of the mindless, pointless filth of grinding with NO outcome and the stupidness of elves and pixies sitting in a field picking flowers all day. I'd rather remove certain, specific parts of my anatomy with a rusty bread knife than become a fanboi of Blizzard. VETO RECRUITMENT
Clytamnestra Jazz Associates R i s e	Posted - 2006.08.09 15:59:00 - [28] Originally by: Verone Immediately after, I headed to the toilet block in the shopping center to wash my hands free of the mindless, pointless filth of grinding with NO outcome and the stupidness of elves and pixies sitting in a field picking flowers all day. Well to be fair, what's the outcome in EVE? Isn't it just like any other game. You play it, you have fun doing it, and that's what you take out of it? --
Matori Kar	Posted - 2006.08.09 16:02:00 - [29] Edited by: Matori Kar on 09/08/2006 16:03:08 Originally by: Dark Shikari However, instead of grinding for a long time and then doing something fun (like PvP), the entire game consists only of short grinds and nothing else. Even PvP is turned into a grind through the honor system. [/quote Bah, you didnt NEED to follow the honour system, heck, I played for quite some time just to log on and use WOW as an fps style game (ignored instances etc cos I got bored of doing them) I only quit because the server I was mainly playing on became so absurdly imbalanced I would have had to wait 6 hours to get into AV, although I am sure I wuold have quit soon after anyway.. It was only because I had quit WOW and had no other game to play (was/am waiting for Pirates of the Burning Sea - but then, I have been waiting for it for years, but they look like they are screwing it up in a majorly sad carebear (badly implimented pvp) sort of way ) that I came back and looked at EVE again (was in the BETA which is why I didnt go retail, heh, god it was f'in bad) Edit: Still not finished playing Oblivion, it really is not as good as Morrowind
Dark Shikari Caldari Imperium Technologies Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2006.08.09 16:05:00 - [30] Originally by: Clytamnestra Originally by: Verone Immediately after, I headed to the toilet block in the shopping center to wash my hands free of the mindless, pointless filth of grinding with NO outcome and the stupidness of elves and pixies sitting in a field picking flowers all day. Well to be fair, what's the outcome in EVE? Isn't it just like any other game. You play it, you have fun doing it, and that's what you take out of it? You play it in a way you find fun and you have fun doing it. In World of Warcraft, you play it in a way Blizzard tells you is fun and don't have fun doing it. --[23] Member-- Originally by: DB Preacher The only time BoB's backs are to the wall is when Backdoor Bandit is in local.

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