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Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
5929
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Posted - 2014.10.19 22:39:00 -
[61] - Quote
Abrazzar wrote:Meh. Let me brainstorm some stuff.
Not capsuleers but mortal elite captains. Don't train skills. Skillset defined by chosen class. Restricted to one ship size/class. Mandatory membership in factional warfare. no wallet, no market ability. Earns LPs through FW. Can buy equipment with LPs. Capsuleers can offer LPs for equipment. When ship dies not in capsule but in escape pod. No warp in escape pod. Will get moved to the designated FW station after a timer expires should the pod survive. LP store offers skill implants to improve the ship crew.
Bah. Still no good. A game has to be designed around this concept. It just doesn't work right with EVE. Perhaps not those parameters specifically, but that is hardly the limit of what "could" be done. So far its just a rough concept, but they do seem to be paying a substantial amount of attention to looking at benefit vs. possibility of exploitation.
If they can iron out a good concept think of the bragging rights as an EVE player. Not only do you play a game where everything you lose is gone permanently, but it also has perma death.
Hard core mode indeed. If you like EVE Online and War Thunder content stop by my YouTube channel.-á
Ranger 1 Presents https://www.youtube.com/user/Ranger1Presents |

Bullock Brawn
Brawny Inc
30
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Posted - 2014.10.20 00:18:00 -
[62] - Quote
Seems very similar to a very popular "Death of a Spaceman" post on another site. |

KuroVolt
The Legion of Spoon Curatores Veritatis Alliance
2175
|
Posted - 2014.10.20 00:50:00 -
[63] - Quote
Oh how people fear change. BoBwins Law: As a discussion/war between two large nullsec entities grows longer, the probability of one comparing the other to BoB aproaches near certainty. Phoebe: Remember remember the fourth of november. |

Derrick Miles
EVENumbers
10153
|
Posted - 2014.10.20 03:04:00 -
[64] - Quote
KuroVolt wrote:Oh how people fear change. People don't like change when it's a terrible idea. I doubt fear is involved at all. |

Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
5930
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Posted - 2014.10.20 04:28:00 -
[65] - Quote
Just so that everyone is as informed as they can be, Rise discusses current thinking on perma death in EVE towards the end of his presentation called The New Player Experience, which can be found here.
The New Player Experience
Yes, the title of the presentation "is" slightly ironic as it pertains to this topic.  If you like EVE Online and War Thunder content stop by my YouTube channel.-á
Ranger 1 Presents https://www.youtube.com/user/Ranger1Presents |

Riyria Twinpeaks
Reasonable People Of Sound Mind
2133
|
Posted - 2014.10.20 05:40:00 -
[66] - Quote
Ranger 1 wrote:Just so that everyone is as informed as they can be, Rise discusses current thinking on perma death in EVE towards the end of his presentation called The New Player Experience, which can be found here. The New Player ExperienceYes, the title of the presentation "is" slightly ironic as it pertains to this topic. 
Thank you. |

Erin Crawford
314
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Posted - 2014.10.20 08:08:00 -
[67] - Quote
Thanks for the info Ranger 1. Will check that out just now...
Sounds like this new option would work similar to those pre-paid phones colloquially known as 'burner phones' - use once(or however often you need for whatever purpose) and then dispose of and get a new one.
I guess we could call them 'Burner Characters'...
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Zappity
SUPREME MATHEMATICS A Band Apart.
1459
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Posted - 2014.10.20 09:18:00 -
[68] - Quote
I would buy a smartbombing battleship for lowsec specifically for this purpose.
I understand that CCP needs to change the game to increase subs and retention but they should be careful. I'm sure they will be. Zappity's Adventures for a taste of lowsec. |

Schmata Bastanold
Black Rebel Rifter Club The Devil's Tattoo
2858
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Posted - 2014.10.20 09:49:00 -
[69] - Quote
Thanks Ranger 1 for those vids.
Rise actually mentioned number one thing I had in mind as a "frakk up" detail of those weird characters: they wouldn't be able to have skills in anything usable in stations. So no freebe on indy or market alts. Hopefully they won't be able to use cloaks or any other blops related stuff. AFK cloaking is in perfect condition and there's no need to spoil it will "make your own hotdrop crew in less than 5 minutes" ideas.
But anyway it seems that future releases will have quite a lot of "oh no you didn't!" stuff which is a good thing. I guess. Probably. Maybe... Invalid signature format |

Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation
1721
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Posted - 2014.10.20 11:45:00 -
[70] - Quote
I will awox the **** out of you using permadeath alts. |
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TigerXtrm
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
895
|
Posted - 2014.10.20 11:54:00 -
[71] - Quote
Ranger 1 wrote:Just so that everyone is as informed as they can be, Rise discusses current thinking on perma death in EVE towards the end of his presentation called The New Player Experience, which can be found here. The New Player ExperienceYes, the title of the presentation "is" slightly ironic as it pertains to this topic. 
Thanks for the link, that certainly put a lot of these rumors into context and actually got me excited for a feature like this (if properly implemented). My YouTube Channel - EVE Tutorials & other game related things! |

Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
5571
|
Posted - 2014.10.20 17:53:00 -
[72] - Quote
epicurus ataraxia wrote:First thought was when did they take the straitjacket off, but then he talked about these accounts would have no skill training, he got a bit conflicted then and talked about earning at double speed.
There's some idea here where you have disposable characters that can get going, doing stuff right away, and the account gets reset if you die, it seems.
Well, that's an option, one could get instantly useful alts, but the devil is in the detail, if I sub for a year and get podded, is all that subscription lost? Or do I have a character who is never able to do anything, sort of brain dead? Or do I reapply xmillion skill points again and roll a new set of skills and start again?
I wonder if he is talking more of a pheonix character rather than permadeath? Just lose your reputation. That has potential.
Or maybe they should put the straitjacket back on?
we will know when we see where this goes.............
For a while now whenever the topic comes up I have suggested a "Live Fast Die Young" option. Think of it like this "You got a turbo brain that lets you learn very fast, but they can't clone it".
The idea is not the best one - some people might use it to create a "never undock" alt meaning there's all the benefits of living fast, and never getting killed. So maybe such a character would need a SP cap. I don't know.
Seeing them address this idea is good though.
Imagine the epic butthurt when someone who thinks "It can never happen to me" goes for this option and then gets podded AFKing through Eudema. There will need to be like 20 popups warning players about this option before they select it, but we'll still get the butthurt threads.
Bring back DEEEEP Space! |

13kr1d1
Hedion University Amarr Empire
7
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Posted - 2014.10.20 18:39:00 -
[73] - Quote
Baneken wrote:Either way having free SP / XP / lvl's from the get go is never a good idea, no matter how smart for the business.
It's the next logical step from allowing people to buy their way into the game with PLEX for character trading. Everyone who supported that mechanic implicitly supported this coming along.
Both buying this type of character and the permadeath is against the fundamental nature of Eve. When people start complaining and asking for their money back from CCP, hopefully this bad idea will be removed and the creator of it will be fired for being drunk on the job. |

Frostys Virpio
The Mjolnir Bloc The Bloc
1331
|
Posted - 2014.10.20 20:50:00 -
[74] - Quote
Ranger 1 wrote:Just so that everyone is as informed as they can be, Rise discusses current thinking on perma death in EVE towards the end of his presentation called The New Player Experience, which can be found here. The New Player ExperienceYes, the title of the presentation "is" slightly ironic as it pertains to this topic. 
Everybody know trial account like that would be used massively more by vets who know how to optimise the training limit to get a "perfect" character for a specific job.
If they want to keep newbies, they have to find a way to make those newbies see what can be done in EVE during the trial time, not give them even more options which they have no idea are there or how to use them not to mention the complete reset of their progress even if they intend to sub because some people will make a career out of ganking these player because they can be veteran while the new player will again suffer from this. You don't keep customer by reseting their progress during the time they tried your game.
If you want more new player or to retain new player, stop building god damn alt functions. The new guy don't want an alt, he want to know if you game is worth his time and his :fifteenbux: . Teach him what he will be able to do in your game instead of piling more and more option on his plate knowing full well he can't even look through one fully before his time is out. Making him a potential perma death target is also a ****** idea because he most likely don't want to lose his 100% of his progress even if you promise he can get it back.
Would you throw money CCP's way if you were knew during the time you try to get a feel of their game, they let everybody in the game permanently reset any progress you have done if they choose to and there is nothing you can do about it beside pay before it happen? |

Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
5937
|
Posted - 2014.10.20 21:08:00 -
[75] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote:Ranger 1 wrote:Just so that everyone is as informed as they can be, Rise discusses current thinking on perma death in EVE towards the end of his presentation called The New Player Experience, which can be found here. The New Player ExperienceYes, the title of the presentation "is" slightly ironic as it pertains to this topic.  Everybody know trial account like that would be used massively more by vets who know how to optimise the training limit to get a "perfect" character for a specific job. If they want to keep newbies, they have to find a way to make those newbies see what can be done in EVE during the trial time, not give them even more options which they have no idea are there or how to use them not to mention the complete reset of their progress even if they intend to sub because some people will make a career out of ganking these player because they can be veteran while the new player will again suffer from this. You don't keep customer by reseting their progress during the time they tried your game. If you want more new player or to retain new player, stop building god damn alt functions. The new guy don't want an alt, he want to know if you game is worth his time and his :fifteenbux: . Teach him what he will be able to do in your game instead of piling more and more option on his plate knowing full well he can't even look through one fully before his time is out. Making him a potential perma death target is also a ****** idea because he most likely don't want to lose his 100% of his progress even if you promise he can get it back. Would you throw money CCP's way if you were knew during the time you try to get a feel of their game, they let everybody in the game permanently reset any progress you have done if they choose to and there is nothing you can do about it beside pay before it happen? Frosty, no jab intended, but perhaps you should watch that video again. I don't think this has any direct connection to trial accounts. If you like EVE Online and War Thunder content stop by my YouTube channel.-á
Ranger 1 Presents https://www.youtube.com/user/Ranger1Presents |

Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
5937
|
Posted - 2014.10.20 21:10:00 -
[76] - Quote
13kr1d1 wrote:Baneken wrote:Either way having free SP / XP / lvl's from the get go is never a good idea, no matter how smart for the business. It's the next logical step from allowing people to buy their way into the game with PLEX for character trading. Everyone who supported that mechanic implicitly supported this coming along. Both buying this type of character and the permadeath is against the fundamental nature of Eve. When people start complaining and asking for their money back from CCP after losing money when someone pops them, hopefully this bad idea will be removed and the creator of it will be fired for being drunk on the job. There's this trend of people thinking "it doesnt affect me, I don't have to use it if I dont like it, etc", its an MMO, it always affects you what goes into the game even if you choose not to use it. That's part of the package deal of MMOs and even real life. You cant avoid the affects of things that happen by not participating. They'll hit you anyways. People keep forgetting this simple rule even if they've run into it numerous times. I got the impression that this might become an option you could choose for one of the 3 character slots you have, not a separate character that you somehow "buy".
It's still just a rough concept though, so I suppose it could go in any direction. If you like EVE Online and War Thunder content stop by my YouTube channel.-á
Ranger 1 Presents https://www.youtube.com/user/Ranger1Presents |

Mharius Skjem
Republic University Minmatar Republic
20
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Posted - 2014.10.20 23:33:00 -
[77] - Quote
Milla Goodpussy wrote:Did I just hear that correctly?  what's next.. dark midget frigrates???
It's the dark influence of EA games being felt at CCP. A recovering btter vet, -áwith a fresh toon and a determination to like everything that CCP does to Eve... |

Nazri al Mahdi
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
119
|
Posted - 2014.10.21 02:51:00 -
[78] - Quote
Regnag Leppod wrote:Why don't they just run a special and run with the "pay to win" theme? 10Aurum and you get a shiny new alt, fully skilled for flying the T2 Neutron blaster fit Catalyst that comes with the account  Brings a whole new meaning to the term "suicide ganking", I approve, though I will still use my trusty old -10 ganker toon since she scares people. |

Nazri al Mahdi
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
119
|
Posted - 2014.10.21 02:54:00 -
[79] - Quote
13kr1d1 wrote:Baneken wrote:Either way having free SP / XP / lvl's from the get go is never a good idea, no matter how smart for the business. It's the next logical step from allowing people to buy their way into the game with PLEX for character trading. Everyone who supported that mechanic implicitly supported this coming along. Both buying this type of character and the permadeath is against the fundamental nature of Eve. When people start complaining and asking for their money back from CCP after losing money when someone pops them, hopefully this bad idea will be removed and the creator of it will be fired for being drunk on the job. There's this trend of people thinking "it doesnt affect me, I don't have to use it if I dont like it, etc", its an MMO, it always affects you what goes into the game even if you choose not to use it. That's part of the package deal of MMOs and even real life. You cant avoid the affects of things that happen by not participating. They'll hit you anyways. People keep forgetting this simple rule even if they've run into it numerous times. Think of it as enabling Phoebe's capital nerfs to be effectively nullified through pay to win. And I say this as someone who will likely use it for that purpose. |

Khorvek
Dead Pool Syndicate
0
|
Posted - 2014.10.21 03:50:00 -
[80] - Quote
I come from a line of hardcore games with limited lives, full loot, permadeath after X amount of times you've been killed by other players or even mobs. Every time you start a new character in that game, you get no bonuses. Multi, which is playing multiple characters at the same time, having alts that work together, etc, is forbidden in these games. Everyone in the game counts, and it feels truly like you're in a world because you/re so small on account of these limitations. This is another step towards Eve MMO: the single player game. |
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Rain6637
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
23171
|
Posted - 2014.10.21 05:35:12 -
[81] - Quote
it would be great if permadeath, constant suspect status was what happened with an outdated medical clone. Right now, the lore says a Pilots License Extension is what allows us to be in space, but we all know what it is: a month's subscription. If you split that bit of the lore, ........
wait.
if someone's sub runs out, just put them on permadeath status and let them play. but strip them of all station dweller abilities. !!!
move medical clones to something that happens automatically, but only for active subscribers....!!!
CCP you can't tell me you don't love this.
Free2Permadeath Free2Permadeath...
X if you want Free2Permadeath
President of the Commissar Kate Fanclub | Twitter |-ámk.III | Imgur
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Omnathious Deninard
Novis Initiis
2493
|
Posted - 2014.10.21 06:16:12 -
[82] - Quote
After watching CCP Rise's presentation on Permadeath, I think how he suggested to handle it is pretty good. My only thought would be rather than using SP implants use the existing implant system to allow for skill usage. Ex: Implant slot 1 would be for a spaceship command implant, like an Amarr Cruiser 4 implant.
These implants would need to be cheaper than existing implants, but not so cheap as to eliminate traditional characters.
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Captain Jazzmag
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
11
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Posted - 2014.10.21 06:44:57 -
[83] - Quote
The idea is stupid and would require convoluted mechanics to be added to prevent abuse. Someone needs to vet the ideas that get puked up by the current crop of games designers. |

Arronicus
Bitter Lemons Brothers of Tangra
1174
|
Posted - 2014.10.21 08:13:27 -
[84] - Quote
Sounds like someone gave a presentation while hopped up on -massive drug- |

Indahmawar Fazmarai
3116
|
Posted - 2014.10.21 13:45:43 -
[85] - Quote
Well, I've find a chance to see CCP Rise's presentation and I feel that this whole idea is like a "Level 90" for bored veterans. He actually talks about competing with other players for achievements accomplished before being killed...
In a way I hope CCP is never desperate enough to try and implement this idea. In another way, I am wondering what are they doing to my EVE.
No good vibes about this concept, not at all.
The Greater Fool Bar is now open for business, 24/7. Come and have drinks and fun somewhere between RL and New Eden! Ingame chat channel: The Greater Fool Bar
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Foxstar Damaskeenus
Soul Takers
229
|
Posted - 2014.10.21 13:48:46 -
[86] - Quote
Spent 2 and a half years waiting and picking skills and researching what skills to train and getting expensive implants and neural remapping and using evemon. Not to mention paying for my account.
They need to leave skill points alone, changing it would make me quit. I cant imagine how people with 100+ million skillpoints feel when they start talking about double training speed.
Edit: Also training for things to fly doctrines with corps rather than trining what I wanted to at times.
No changes to skill points EVER!!!
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Charlie Firpol
Noob Mercs Monkeys with Guns.
266
|
Posted - 2014.10.21 13:59:32 -
[87] - Quote
I like permadeath generally, but the amount of possible abuse in EVE is gigantic (Trader alts, manufacturing alts, supercap alts, ganking, awoxing...the list is probably endless).
I can-¦t think of a proper solution to that problem right now but if there is one: yes, permadeath please! |

Foxstar Damaskeenus
Soul Takers
229
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Posted - 2014.10.21 14:24:12 -
[88] - Quote
The original posters name is "Goodpussy" Give me a minute while I thumbs up every one of their posts.
No changes to skill points EVER!!!
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flaming phantom
T.R.I.A.D Ushra'Khan
40
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Posted - 2014.10.21 16:29:40 -
[89] - Quote
This sounds terrible. Why not give a 4th character slot on the test server, in which you can alter its skillpoints to whatever you want, or just an all lvl 5 characters?
This way everyone can test everything, and not mess up tranquility. |

Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
5941
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Posted - 2014.10.21 18:25:05 -
[90] - Quote
Charlie Firpol wrote:I like permadeath generally, but the amount of possible abuse in EVE is gigantic (Trader alts, manufacturing alts, supercap alts, ganking, awoxing...the list is probably endless).
I can-¦t think of a proper solution to that problem right now but if there is one: yes, permadeath please! Well, to be fair: Trader/Manufacturing alts: Not possible, those skills won't be available. SuperCap alt: Skills not available or too few to do this. Awoxing: Can already be done with any alt, or main for that matter. Ganking: Possible, but this is the main thing they are focusing on so as to prevent abuse.
Go watch the presentation again, the link is earlier in this thread.
If you like EVE Online and War Thunder content stop by my YouTube channel.-á
Ranger 1 Presents
https://www.youtube.com/user/Ranger1Presents
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