EVE Search - Proposal: Minmatar ship fixes

Check My IP Information

All Channels

Ships and Modules

Proposal: Minmatar ship fixes

» Click here to find additional results for this topic using Google

Monitor this thread via RSS [?]

Pages: [1] 2 3 :: one page

Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 1 post(s)
Amy Wang	Posted - 2006.08.23 13:17:00 - [1] Edited by: Amy Wang on 23/08/2006 13:18:21 Muninn: - increase pg by 200 - change 1 high to 1 med Typhoon: - increase pg by 1000ish - reduce build cost by 10 Mio worth - switch shield and armor hp values Nidhoggur: - change remote armor rep duration bonus to 5% fighter damage per lvl (that way there are 2 carriers with tanking bonus and 2 with damage bonus, perfectly balanced) Maelstorm: - yes I know its not yet out, but when its out it will take long to fix - intended as shield tanking fleet BS but the planned shield boost bonus is useless in fleet combat - change shield boost bonus to 5% to all shield resists per lvl or 10% shield amount per lvl - make sure it can fit 8 1400 IIs with 0-1 fitting mod Target Painters: - the only non defensive ew module and arguable the most useless one - solution 1: give minmatar ew ships bonuses to one of the other racial ew variants, leave target painters as a module that each race can use equally effective (might even give each ew ship a bonus to a different ew type, minmatar is about variability after all) - solution 2: add a secondary defensive effect to the target painter module, either a weakened version of the effect of one of the other racial ews or a unique effect like a sig radius reduction for the using ship or a sig resolution increase for the targeted ships weapon systems or sth like that) (think of the painting stream as disrupting the targeted ships sensor systems or whatever)
Testy Mctest	Posted - 2006.08.23 13:28:00 - [2] Originally by: Amy Wang Muninn: - increase pg by 200 - change 1 high to 1 med PG, yes. Slot change, not needed. Quote: Typhoon: - increase pg by 1000ish - reduce build cost by 10 Mio worth - switch shield and armor hp values Grid yes - although it needs to be more like 2000 total, so about 1600-1700 before skills. Build cost, why not, costing more is random and unfair. Switching HP values, yes, because it's an armour tanker. Quote: Nidhoggur: - change remote armor rep duration bonus to 5% fighter damage per lvl (that way there are 2 carriers with tanking bonus and 2 with damage bonus, perfectly balanced) Meh, carriers, whatever. This would cause outcry among Amarr and Caldari. Try something more unique that we might actually get. Quote: Maelstorm: - yes I know its not yet out, but when its out it will take long to fix - intended as shield tanking fleet BS but the planned shield boost bonus is useless in fleet combat - change shield boost bonus to 5% to all shield resists per lvl or 10% shield amount per lvl - make sure it can fit 8 1400 IIs with 0-1 fitting mod Shield bonus is yawn. Give it a range bonus. It already can fit 8 1400s wit no fitting mod with AWU 5. Quote: Target Painters: - the only non defensive ew module and arguable the most useless one - solution 1: give minmatar ew ships bonuses to one of the other racial ew variants, leave target painters as a module that each race can use equally effective (might even give each ew ship a bonus to a different ew type, minmatar is about variability after all) - solution 2: add a secondary defensive effect to the target painter module, either a weakened version of the effect of one of the other racial ews or a unique effect like a sig radius reduction for the using ship or a sig resolution increase for the targeted ships weapon systems or sth like that) (think of the painting stream as disrupting the targeted ships sensor systems or whatever) The best way to solve this is to make target painters useful. They need changing totally. Scrapheap Challenge! Liverpool Eve CCG Tournament, 02/09/06!
Jim McGregor Caldari	Posted - 2006.08.23 13:38:00 - [3] Its "Maelstrom". And im not convinced I even care about the ship... the old stats certainly made me go into a frenzy of misbelief. --- Eve Wiki \| Eve Tribune \| Eve Pirate
TuRtLe HeAd The Bratwurst Burglars	Posted - 2006.08.23 13:42:00 - [4] Quote: Nidhoggur: - change remote armor rep duration bonus to 5% fighter damage per lvl (that way there are 2 carriers with tanking bonus and 2 with damage bonus, perfectly balanced) Give it a bonus to Sheild or rep Duration or increase. NOT Remote Duration. At least give it something. All Carriers EXCEPT minmatar get an Offensive PvP bonus. Caldari - Sheild resist. Amarr- Armour resist. Gallente - Drone Damage. Minmatar - Remote Sheild/Armour bonus ? WTF AM I a Friggin Hospital ship.
Great Artista Earthbound Inc.	Posted - 2006.08.23 13:49:00 - [5] Target painter bonus to somekind of web bonus maybe? Its just an idea, no flaming, im on a SENSITIVE mood today. ------------- ½Artista - One name. One legend.+ -Sloganizer.net
Bhoki Tentor	Posted - 2006.08.23 13:50:00 - [6] I'm prolly one of the few that thinks the minmatar carriers bonus is a bonus that fits with the carrier, unlike the others. However I do think that the duration reduction is the wrong bonus because it also increases cap use of the transfers. A better bonus would be to just directly increase the boost they give(or alternatively give an equal reduction of cap use to keep cap use the same). I see the carriers as support ships keeping others in battle etc. Though the whole concept of supporting modules needs changing first before carrier can fullfill its true role(imo)
Triest Sebiestor tribe	Posted - 2006.08.23 13:54:00 - [7] I like the idea of the Muninn swapping a high for a mid, but it's not nearly as vital as boosting the grid. I'm 10 days away from it, and I'm struggling mightily to find any reason to use it over my Vagabond for either PVP or PVE purposes; give it the grid to use the artillery with a moderate tank and there would be a reason. A fourth mid would give it the option of doing the shield-tanking-artillery-boat thing that CCP is promoting with the Maelstrom as well.
xKillaH Minmatar The Kru Coalition of Carebear Killers	Posted - 2006.08.23 14:44:00 - [8] Edited by: xKillaH on 23/08/2006 14:44:36 /signed Edit: except for the muninn(changing 1 high to 1 med) Need Sig?Gallery
Maya Rkell Sebiestor tribe	Posted - 2006.08.23 14:51:00 - [9] People need to stop obsessing over the 720mm guns on Munnins. Really.
Bhoki Tentor	Posted - 2006.08.23 14:54:00 - [10] Originally by: Maya Rkell People need to stop obsessing over the 720mm guns on Munnins. Really. Can't disagree with that really.

Shamis Orzoz SniggWaffe	Posted - 2006.08.23 15:03:00 - [11] Don't mess with the painter bonus's. They are essential for certain tactics. Other than that most of what you said was ok. BUT, HOW COULD YOU FORGET the worst minmater ship ever: THE CLAW. - Claw needs at least an extra 5km of base locking range - The claw needs more cpu. Shamis
Maya Rkell Sebiestor tribe	Posted - 2006.08.23 15:09:00 - [12] giggles Shamis, that's nasty. Wait, you were SERIOUS? o.O
xeom Veto.	Posted - 2006.08.23 15:20:00 - [13] Remove the speed penalty on hail. CCP where are our t2 shield power relays? \| ..SIN is closed.New sig coming soon!
Benglada Sebiestor tribe	Posted - 2006.08.23 15:22:00 - [14] Originally by: xeom Remove the speed penalty on hail. Yar. --------------------------- Originally by: Arkanor 0.0 is the Final Frontier. Bring money and friends.
Midnighter Minmatar Liberal Trading Co Electus Matari	Posted - 2006.08.23 15:24:00 - [15] Breacher - Up the Armour HP and CPU/PG Bellicose - Up Shield HP and CPU/PG Typhoon - More PG + Armour HP Wolf - +1 Mid Cheetah - Extra CPU/PG + velocity
Elaine Threepwood Office linebackers Blood of the Innocents	Posted - 2006.08.23 15:24:00 - [16] IMO muninn grid increase, yes. Slot change, no. All 3 typhoon ideas, definitely. Hail, fix please (remove speed penalty is probably the best solution?). Everything else: meh. Team Minmatar forums
Midnighter Minmatar Liberal Trading Co Electus Matari	Posted - 2006.08.23 15:42:00 - [17] I'm also happy with the Painter as is. It doesn't nerf your opponents ship as much as the others, but the maount of high damage and wrecking shots it can let a good squad dish out is awesome.
Jim McGregor Caldari	Posted - 2006.08.23 15:47:00 - [18] Edited by: Jim McGregor on 23/08/2006 15:47:00 Originally by: Benglada Originally by: xeom Remove the speed penalty on hail. Yar. I guess they dont want Vagabonds with hail and no speed penalties... --- Eve Wiki \| Eve Tribune \| Eve Pirate
Triest Sebiestor tribe	Posted - 2006.08.23 15:59:00 - [19] Edited by: Triest on 23/08/2006 16:01:13 Edited by: Triest on 23/08/2006 16:00:07 Edited by: Triest on 23/08/2006 15:59:16 Originally by: Maya Rkell People need to stop obsessing over the 720mm guns on Munnins. Really. What else are we supposed to put on it? Because last time I checked the Vagabond does autocannons better, and artillery on the Muninn already deals less DPS than the other HACs that function as long range ships. Zealot: 4 Heavy Beam IIs, aurora, 3 HS IIs, 60% min resist, MAR II 240 DPS at 120 km. Eagle: 4 250mm Railgun IIs, spike, 3 MS IIs, 66% min resist 155 DPS at 200 km. Deimos (lol) 4 250mm Railgun IIs, spike, 3 MS IIs, 1 RCU II, 60% min resist 240 DPS at 100 km. Muninn: 5 720mm Howitzer IIs, tremor, 3 Gyrostab IIs, 1 RCU, II, either 10 or 25% min resist, no armor rep. 220 DPS at ~110 km. 5 650mm Howitzer IIs, tremor, 3 Gyrostab IIs, 2 hardeners, 60% min resist, no armor rep. 215 DPS at ~90 km. Oh, and for fun: Cerberus: 5 Heavy Missile Launcher IIs, 3 BCS IIs, minimum resist at least 60% 300 DPS out to 150 km For a ship which is the 'very definition of a gunboat' the Muninn seems to stack rather poorly with the other HACs. It has the worst DPS of the longer range ships (save the Eagle), while not having any range advantage to compensate.
Famine Aligher'ri	Posted - 2006.08.23 16:07:00 - [20] Edited by: Famine Aligher''ri on 23/08/2006 16:07:16 Eagle and Zealot have no drone support. Hence the DPS decrease. Not everything is about sniper. Hence the quoted comment.

Triest Sebiestor tribe	Posted - 2006.08.23 16:10:00 - [21] Edited by: Triest on 23/08/2006 16:11:52 Edited by: Triest on 23/08/2006 16:11:26 Originally by: Famine Aligher'ri Edited by: Famine Aligher''ri on 23/08/2006 16:07:16 Eagle and Zealot have no drone support. Hence the DPS decrease. Not everything is about sniper. Hence the quoted comment. We already have the Vagabond if we want close range combat, and it does the job better than the Muninn. If you've got magical drones that can hit at 100km+, I'd like some. The Muninn's a decent close range ship that can fit a heavy tank, but that's not its intended role at all, and it really needs a fix if it's going to be comparable to the other longer range HACs. I mean, really, if the Deimos, arguably one of the 'badly in need of a fix' HACs, and a close range blasterboat by role, can deal more DPS at comparable ranges as the Muninn, with a better tank besides, that tells you something.
Bhoki Tentor	Posted - 2006.08.23 16:24:00 - [22] Originally by: Jim McGregor Edited by: Jim McGregor on 23/08/2006 15:47:00 Originally by: Benglada Originally by: xeom Remove the speed penalty on hail. Yar. I guess they dont want Vagabonds with hail and no speed penalties... If that would be the reason for giving hail a speed penalty, i'd quit the game... My take, give hail a 30% falloff penalty (like void has an additional 30% penalty to optimal range(0.5 -30% = 0.35 or -65%))
Famine Aligher'ri	Posted - 2006.08.23 16:33:00 - [23] Edited by: Famine Aligher''ri on 23/08/2006 16:35:41 Originally by: Triest Edited by: Triest on 23/08/2006 16:11:52 Edited by: Triest on 23/08/2006 16:11:26 Originally by: Famine Aligher'ri Edited by: Famine Aligher''ri on 23/08/2006 16:07:16 Eagle and Zealot have no drone support. Hence the DPS decrease. Not everything is about sniper. Hence the quoted comment. We already have the Vagabond if we want close range combat, and it does the job better than the Muninn. If you've got magical drones that can hit at 100km+, I'd like some. The Muninn's a decent close range ship that can fit a heavy tank, but that's not its intended role at all, and it really needs a fix if it's going to be comparable to the other longer range HACs. I mean, really, if the Deimos, arguably one of the 'badly in need of a fix' HACs, and a close range blasterboat by role, can deal more DPS at comparable ranges as the Muninn, with a better tank besides, that tells you something. It's not about having drones go up to 100km range (would be useless if they could). It's about having support from frigates being that's really the only fear you should have when sniping other than covert op/recons. Which can be avoided at ease due to recab times and warp in delays/lags. Yes, the Vagabond is a much better autocannon hac. Not due to the dps it has, being obviously the Muninn has more DPS potential than the Vagabond. It's due to the speed, agility, and falloff bonus to put it out of range of any Muninn autocannon. We should all know, you can't just kill a vagabond with heavy missiles and drones. None the less, the Muninn can be very useful as a sniper. The bonuses it has can be looked at more of a role for sniper. However, like I stated above. It has other support as well. Like the example of drones, being there is not just just damage drones anymore. You have all different style drones in the new EVE. I personaly think the Muninn is fine. I love it with autocannons and I love it with Arty's. One man sniper is never good and it's not something I want to use to solo a battleship or even a decent cruiser setup. I would want to just use it, to get the jump on lone frigs and tech II frigs. Anything else, well is ment for autocannons and complete close range smackdown as the Vagabond does well. Being vaga's are 200+ on market and muninns can be as low as 90-100m. I will OP for a automuninn over a vaga and take the weakness to Vagabond barrage and pg/range gimpness with arties fitted.
voidvim Minmatar Genco Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2006.08.23 16:38:00 - [24] /signed lots of good points on this thread but I personal like the targer painter minmatar often have the most differnt type of weapon system and target painters work for them all.
Caillech Freelance Unincorporated Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2006.08.23 18:49:00 - [25] Edited by: Caillech on 23/08/2006 18:49:36 The Muninn is fine IMO for its role. Sure, it is hard to fit the 720s and creates its challenges, but you can do it. DPS is not an accurate metric for snipers - the value and likelihood of a salvo after the second drops off significantly. Maybe its DPS is a little lower, but that alpha is monstrous. It has its limitations, but no more so than the others. Don't touch the Phoon, either - we have plenty of other things to worry about that I would put ahead in priority. The Nid's bonuses are indeed a joke compared to the other carriers. One big complaint is that you have to do substantial additional training to be able to take advantage of both bonuses, while the other races don't. It seems they are trying to apply consistent racial bonuses across ships. For tanking, that's boosting for Gal/Min and resists for Amarr/Caldari. Since that doesn't work here, they tried to carry over the Gallente drone strength, but couldn't carry over Minmatar projectile damage, so they gave up and slapped on two remote rep bonuses. Minmatar: Red-headed Stepchildren of Eve Exhibit AA-27b. Maybe they can look at a hefty boost of gang mod bonus. That would give the versatility they look for with Minmatar ships. It's not a front-line/combat bonus but could be tasty without being imbalancing.
xeom Veto.	Posted - 2006.08.23 19:28:00 - [26] Originally by: Jim McGregor Edited by: Jim McGregor on 23/08/2006 15:47:00 Originally by: Benglada Originally by: xeom Remove the speed penalty on hail. Yar. I guess they dont want Vagabonds with hail and no speed penalties... Yes so lets screw up everone else too \o/.It needs a Buff plain a simple. CCP where are our t2 shield power relays? \| ..SIN is closed.New sig coming soon!
Lord Violent	Posted - 2006.08.23 19:42:00 - [27] Muninn - Grid, Maybee I was under the impression its arty that needs fixing and not the muninn. Slots, well could lose a high but id like a low for it, id also like a vaga with 5 missile hardpoints while were there please. Phoon - HP's on the tanked part, yes please. Hog - 7.5% Tracking And how could you forget the bane of minnies everywhere. Fix the godamn cheetah having to use 3 co-pro 2's with maxed fitting skills at cov ops lvl4 just to fit a cloak and probe launcher is 4tl.
Maya Rkell Sebiestor tribe	Posted - 2006.08.23 19:44:00 - [28] Triest, you're obsessing over 720's again. One little change in gun size and you get a MWD and a rep AND the rest.
Triest Sebiestor tribe	Posted - 2006.08.23 20:19:00 - [29] Edited by: Triest on 23/08/2006 20:22:41 Edited by: Triest on 23/08/2006 20:20:13 Originally by: Maya Rkell Triest, you're obsessing over 720's again. One little change in gun size and you get a MWD and a rep AND the rest. No one would fit artillery with an MWD on a Muninn; you need that midslot for a sensor booster so you can actually target past 70 km. Not to mention that you can't fit 650mm IIs and an MWD and a medium rep without an RCU II. Even if you do downgrade to 650 IIs, and use a standard 2 tracking comp/sensor booster II loadout, you still can only barely fit a named medium armor rep, T2 doesn't fit. In exchange, your effective range drops by over 20 to barely 100 km, and DPS and alpha strike suffer as well. The only reason to use artillery, as has been ground into our heads, is because they do more alpha strike than other guns, and using the lower tier weapons removes even that. It's not like the DPS comes even close to other guns. So you're right, I do want to be able to use 720s, and I'd like to not waste two high slots. But that's not really an option right now, hence my complaining. I do think that my arguments are logical, however, particularly in comparison to the other HACs.
xeom Veto.	Posted - 2006.08.23 23:44:00 - [30] Also something for the minmatar carriar but i can't think of a replacement for drones. How about less fuel/cap needed per jump? CCP where are our t2 shield power relays? \| ..SIN is closed.New sig coming soon!



Pages: [1] 2 3 :: one page
First page \| Previous page \| Next page \| Last page

COPYRIGHT NOTICE
EVE Online, the EVE logo, EVE and all associated logos and designs are the intellectual property of CCP hf. All artwork, screenshots, characters, vehicles, storylines, world facts or other recognizable features of the intellectual property relating to these trademarks are likewise the intellectual property of CCP hf. EVE Online and the EVE logo are the registered trademarks of CCP hf. All rights are reserved worldwide. All other trademarks are the property of their respective owners. CCP hf. has granted permission to EVE-Search.com to use EVE Online and all associated logos and designs for promotional and information purposes on its website but does not endorse, and is not in any way affiliated with, EVE-Search.com. CCP is in no way responsible for the content on or functioning of this website, nor can it be liable for any damage arising from the use of this website.