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Hakera
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Posted - 2006.08.29 21:20:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Hakera on 29/08/2006 21:26:51
From patch notes
"If a ship that is being targeted, and cloaks, the lock will now guarantee the uncloak effect occurs."
so I also notice the known issues page has removed the listing that the ability to complete a lock on a cloaked ship if targeting began before it cloaks (a bug brought in with dragon) was also removed.
So is it
a) that covert users have been kicked in the nuts whilst down?
b) badly worded patch notes that should of read "if a ship has been locked (<-- note past tense), and cloaks, the lock will now de-cloak it."
and whilst we're on the issue, any thoughts on the cloaks production tree? Or shall we all shelve our force recons and covert ops soon (and lol stealth bombers if anyone still uses them)
Discussion thread on cloak production tree
Pray tell dear tux/TomB!
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Verus Potestas
Caldari
Fiat Mort
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Posted - 2006.08.29 21:26:00 -
[2]
Kicked in the nuts (kieron clarifies in the sticky in general)
Given that it was a bug on known issues until a couple of hours ago, I'm starting to think they just couldn't work out how to fix it 
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Sensemann
Minmatar
eXceed Inc.
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Posted - 2006.08.29 21:52:00 -
[3]
well if its happening as everyone expected, any cloak-useing ship will be Kicked in the Nuts.
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ELECTR0FREAK
Eye of God
Axiom Empire
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Posted - 2006.08.29 21:58:00 -
[4]
Absolutely ridiculous. TUX, WTF?!
As if the whole production system for Cloaks wasn't stupidly expensive already with Cloak IIs going for 50 mill, but now you essentially made Covert Ops a convenient form of financial suicide?!
Fix the production requirements of the Covert Ops Cloak II so that it doesn't require an Improved Cloaking Device II, and make Prototype Cloak I BPO available on market. DONT shaft cloak users with this retarded crap. Cloak users have enough penalties at this point. Can't cloak in a bubble, can't cloak while locked, can't cloak while within 2000m of an object... these are all understandable penalties of being a cloak user.
But are you telling me that I can take a slow locking ship, catch a Covops cloaking at a gate with the beginning of a lock, and uncloak him moments later? That's ridiculous. Covert Ops is vital to any group of players who needs information on an enemy. Make this change and you're liable to make a LOT of Covert Ops users angry.
Discoverer of the Missile Damage Formula |
Orvas Dren
Gallente
The Nest
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Posted - 2006.08.29 22:00:00 -
[5]
I hope its not becoming a feature. I have spent a long time specializing in the Arazu and this would make travelling in it nearly as dangerous as any other ship, as well as practically make an escape impossible in some situations.
They must be trying to lower the price of cloaks the wrong way, by lowering demand...
EVE-Mail me for custom signature work. Price Negotiable |
Verus Potestas
Caldari
Fiat Mort
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Posted - 2006.08.29 22:04:00 -
[6]
Well, on the bright side, prices are probably going to drop as they become less useful
Of course, it is possible they will increase as they get destroyed more 
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Orvas Dren
Gallente
The Nest
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Posted - 2006.08.29 22:06:00 -
[7]
I have noted that CovOps cloaks tend to survive fairly well by comparison to most modules. I do like the fact that this means I can supply my own by taking from others, but sheesh, as if a Force Recon wasn't expensive already.
Time to start flying my Lachesis more.
EVE-Mail me for custom signature work. Price Negotiable |
Kai Lae
Gallente
Shiva
Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2006.08.29 22:08:00 -
[8]
 Originally by: Hakera
From patch notes
b) badly worded patch notes that should of read "if a ship has been locked (<-- note past tense), and cloaks, the lock will now de-cloak it."
I think it means this, in that before, they'd lock you when you went to de-cloak but you'd appear cloaked on your screen and then it would be OMGWTF time when you'd get roasted. Now, it's still bugged, but you at least know that you're in deep do-do, because when they lock you you'll uncloak. At least you might be able to do something then.
Raptor and Ares Fix |
inSpirAcy
Caldari
The Solopwnmobiles
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Posted - 2006.08.29 22:11:00 -
[9]
I really want to read something sensationalist in that, but I think I'm going to wait until a dev fixes the broken English to pass judgement.
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Hakera
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Posted - 2006.08.29 22:16:00 -
[10]
this would not be as much of an issue if covert ops cloak prices were even close to reasonable, like 5mill max and 2 mill for the T1 version roughly (following suggestion put forward on the cloak production discussion). But since your paying:
58mill for cloak
9mill for the covert or 50mill for the recon
have to contend with dictor gate camps where recons are decloaked very very easily (cant stress how easy they are) and covert ops frigs less so which are turning covert ops. This was not the case until recently when dictors became widespread member of any gatecamp and the simplicity of acquiring a lock is enough to condemn most to death nowadays.
Basically the combination of factors has turned cloaks and ships that rely on them into a broken feature, the last legacy of crieliere.
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Foulis
Minmatar
Chosen Path
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Posted - 2006.08.29 22:18:00 -
[11]
Ouch, right in the nuts. My poor hound.
----
Cake > Pie - Imaran
Cathath > Imaran - Cathath
Originally by: CCP Hammer
Boobies
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InnerDrive
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Posted - 2006.08.29 22:19:00 -
[12]
So basicly ccp managed not to be abble to fix and made a feauture out of it rofl gratz ccp.
Anyone got a screenshot showing the known issues page this morning?
I read it this morning and on the second line this:
"If a ship that is being targeted, and cloaks, the lock will now guarantee the uncloak effect occurs"
was still considered a bug.
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Callan Skiderlar
LIfeline Incorporated
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Posted - 2006.08.29 22:49:00 -
[13]
"If a ship that is being targeted, and cloaks, the lock will now guarantee the uncloak effect occurs."
I think (and hope) the highlighted part is the key - guaranteeing the effect occurs. I'm hoping that this is just ensuring that you see the uncloak effect if you get decloaked. Hopefully, the mangled English preceding it just reflects the fact that the condition the developer was using to recreate the decloak-with-no-effect bug happened to be the new locking-now-decloaks bug condition. Here's hoping further that there is another developer working on that bug.
---
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Enigmier
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Posted - 2006.08.29 23:04:00 -
[14]
and tbh interdictors were only brought in as a `balance` for inst`a users (which is another area they are shafting people with)
if it wasnt for insta`s there would be no interdictors, and cloakers would have it a bit easier,
nothing like `making it up as you go along` hey CCP
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Hakera
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Posted - 2006.08.30 06:15:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Callan Skiderlar
"If a ship that is being targeted, and cloaks, the lock will now guarantee the uncloak effect occurs."
I think (and hope) the highlighted part is the key - guaranteeing the effect occurs. I'm hoping that this is just ensuring that you see the uncloak effect if you get decloaked. Hopefully, the mangled English preceding it just reflects the fact that the condition the developer was using to recreate the decloak-with-no-effect bug happened to be the new locking-now-decloaks bug condition. Here's hoping further that there is another developer working on that bug.
and i pray your right. However there are numerous cloak issues that do require attention along with this.
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Death4You
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Posted - 2006.08.30 08:25:00 -
[16]
Originally by: ELECTR0FREAK
Can't cloak in a bubble
Is that true ? You cant cloak if you are in bubble? And when you are in a inerdiction sphere ?
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Testy Mctest
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Posted - 2006.08.30 08:52:00 -
[17]
Edited by: Testy Mctest on 30/08/2006 08:51:49
www.scrapheap-challenge.com/cloak.jpg
Scrapheap Challenge!
Liverpool Eve CCG Tournament, 02/09/06!
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Verus Potestas
Caldari
Fiat Mort
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Posted - 2006.08.30 09:20:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Death4You
Originally by: ELECTR0FREAK
Can't cloak in a bubble
Is that true ? You cant cloak if you are in bubble? And when you are in a inerdiction sphere ?
You can cloak in a bubble, but people will almost always uncloak you again before you can warp off.
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ELECTR0FREAK
Eye of God
Axiom Empire
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Posted - 2006.08.30 09:48:00 -
[19]
I'm pretty sure you can't cloak in a dictor bubble... tho maybe I'm mistaken. It's been a while. I know you can't cloak inside a POS shield.
Discoverer of the Missile Damage Formula |
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Tuxford
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Posted - 2006.08.30 10:06:00 -
[20]
Clicky
_______________ |
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ELECTR0FREAK
Eye of God
Axiom Empire
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Posted - 2006.08.30 10:08:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Tuxford
About the cloaking issue. There has been a little in house misunderstanding. The problem is that the way cloaking works now is that if you are being targetted but aren't locked you can cloak but the lock attempt isn't broken so when you're locked you get uncloaked but there is a bug where the uncloaking visual effect isn't performed so you happily think you're still cloaked.
The fix in the patch notes and the one Kieron mentioned fixes the issue of not seeing you uncloak. However cloaks didn't use to work this way, if nobody had you locked when you cloaked, all locking attempts were broken and you stayed happily cloaked. That is the way it supposed to work and we'll be restoring it back the way it was.
I don't really know when that will happen though. It was really news to me that this "wasn't a bug" until this morning so I've been talking to other devs and bughunters about this.
Thank you Tux.
Discoverer of the Missile Damage Formula |
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Tuxford
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Posted - 2006.08.30 10:10:00 -
[22]
Originally by: ELECTR0FREAK
Thank you Tux.
Did you feel that disturbance, its almost like I made a "happy post" 
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ELECTR0FREAK
Eye of God
Axiom Empire
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Posted - 2006.08.30 10:13:00 -
[23]
I'm happy at least 
Well, now I can't complain about that anymore. *Sigh*
Now for Plan B: complaining about bookmark limits.
I kid.
Discoverer of the Missile Damage Formula |
Verus Potestas
Caldari
Fiat Mort
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Posted - 2006.08.30 10:17:00 -
[24]
<3 tux
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Thunderbird Anthares
The New Empire
R i s e
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Posted - 2006.08.30 10:20:00 -
[25]
/me loves Tux
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When you get to the end of your journey,everything that really matters is the journey itself. |
Hakera
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Posted - 2006.08.30 17:49:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Tuxford
Clicky
thanks Tux!
Now about the other issues with cloaks - production tree & covert ops boosts (grid/cpu), anything happening on that?
though im no dev, i take it you cant slap the code that used to work pre-dragon over the dragon code hehe :p
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Boris2k
Elite United Corp
Antigo Dominion
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Posted - 2006.08.30 18:01:00 -
[27]
personally i dont see how something that uncloaks and fires at you from 150km with missiles should be nerfed in any way, hell they deserve a 200% dmg increase.
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Foulis
Minmatar
Chosen Path
Lotka Volterra
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Posted - 2006.08.30 18:04:00 -
[28]
Yeah, thanks tux. I'd also like to point out if you lose a ship to the bug petition it under exploits, I got mine back 4 minutes after losing it =D.
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Cake > Pie - Imaran
Cathath > Imaran - Cathath
Originally by: CCP Hammer
Boobies
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Jim McGregor
Caldari
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Posted - 2006.08.30 18:12:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Tuxford
Originally by: ELECTR0FREAK
Thank you Tux.
Did you feel that disturbance, its almost like I made a "happy post"
I felt the disturbance... it was like a million voices suddenly stopped whining for a second. Unfortunantly it then continued. :)
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Eve Wiki | Eve Tribune | Eve Pirate |
Hoshi
DAB
RAZOR Alliance
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Posted - 2006.08.30 19:01:00 -
[30]
Sorry if I don't become happy right now, I won't be until this thing is really fixed, and considering how long other cloaking related issues like the cloak/cyn field bug have gone unfixed I am not holding my breath.
But it is enough for me to not cancel my covert op alt account. At least not today.
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