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Rezerwowy Pies
Caldari
   |
Posted - 2006.09.11 17:35:00 -
[91]
Edited by: Rezerwowy Pies on 11/09/2006 17:38:25
Drop in lvl4 missions is very very bad since last two week (only the cheapest items and small number of items). Before that i find for example limos or even a arbalest heavy/crusie/siedge missile launcher, now i see only standard crappy equipment). In low sec should be only lvl5 missions (and ccp should unlock lvl5 agents ofcourse).
If you want make big money you go rat'ting.
--
Why some admins can't do that
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Gretchen Dawntreader
Minmatar
Brutor tribe
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Posted - 2006.09.11 19:02:00 -
[92]
Geez low sec has POS and conquerable stations and sovereignty and moon mining and every roid above Kernite and high level plexes and rat agents and etc etc etc...now you want all the level 4 agents.
Ain't gonna happen.
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Dixon
Caldari
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Posted - 2006.09.11 19:20:00 -
[93]
Why do you all assume that going to low-sec will result in instant death by pirates? I'd love to have my agent moved to low-sec, then I'd atleast have some reason not to run missions while partially awake.
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I have no strong feelings one way or the other... |
Rezerwowy Pies
Caldari
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Posted - 2006.09.11 19:31:00 -
[94]
Edited by: Rezerwowy Pies on 11/09/2006 19:32:15
 Originally by: Dixon
Why do you all assume that going to low-sec will result in instant death by pirates?
Ok - move lvl4 agents to low sec, but move concord also there :) You know, we assume that pirates will not attack other people, so concord shouldnt be any problem in low sec right? ;)
--
Why some admins can't do that
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Dixon
Caldari
|
Posted - 2006.09.11 19:41:00 -
[95]
Originally by: Rezerwowy Pies
Edited by: Rezerwowy Pies on 11/09/2006 19:32:15
Originally by: Dixon
Why do you all assume that going to low-sec will result in instant death by pirates?
Ok - move lvl4 agents to low sec, but move concord also there :) You know, we assume that pirates will not attack other people, so concord shouldnt be any problem in low sec right? ;)
Yes, this idea makes alot of sense.
I'm not going to persuade you to grow a pair and move to lowsec, I don't care about high-sec mission farmers. I do, however, want more risk involved in missions (and a lot more reward tbh). I'd also like them to be a bit more random and complex.
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I have no strong feelings one way or the other... |
Tsanse Kinske
WeMeanYouKnowHarm
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Posted - 2006.09.11 19:49:00 -
[96]
Originally by: Rezerwowy Pies
Edited by: Rezerwowy Pies on 11/09/2006 19:32:15
Originally by: Dixon
Why do you all assume that going to low-sec will result in instant death by pirates?
Ok - move lvl4 agents to low sec, but move concord also there :) You know, we assume that pirates will not attack other people, so concord shouldnt be any problem in low sec right? ;)
It's not that the pirates wouldn't attack you if they got the chance. Rather it's that they're not going to get the chance if a mission runner does things intelligently.
* * *
In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move.
-Douglas Adams, writing about EVE |
Rezerwowy Pies
Caldari
|
Posted - 2006.09.11 19:58:00 -
[97]
Edited by: Rezerwowy Pies on 11/09/2006 20:00:01
Originally by: Dixon
I do, however, want more risk involved in missions (and a lot more reward tbh). I'd also like them to be a bit more random and complex.
Another way - you simply want lvl 5 missions. I think that ccp is working about better missions (more dangerous than lvl4 from your perspective :), because ccp already give us lvl5 agents (simply not active at this moment)
--
Why some admins can't do that
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Dixon
Caldari
|
Posted - 2006.09.11 20:07:00 -
[98]
Originally by: Rezerwowy Pies
Edited by: Rezerwowy Pies on 11/09/2006 20:00:01
Originally by: Dixon
I do, however, want more risk involved in missions (and a lot more reward tbh). I'd also like them to be a bit more random and complex.
Another way - you simply want lvl 5 missions. I think that ccp is working about better missions (more dangerous than lvl4 from your perspective :), because ccp already give us lvl5 agents (simply not active at this moment)
Not really, I'd like level 5 missions to be rare (in other words: not farmable) and extremely difficult and require lots of teamwork.
But I'd also like to see alot more agents spread out between systems as mission running systems are currently massivly overpopulated.
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I have no strong feelings one way or the other... |
Rezerwowy Pies
Caldari
|
Posted - 2006.09.11 20:27:00 -
[99]
Edited by: Rezerwowy Pies on 11/09/2006 20:35:10
Edited by: Rezerwowy Pies on 11/09/2006 20:28:56
Originally by: Dixon
I'd like level 5 missions to be rare (in other words: not farmable) and extremely difficult and require lots of teamwork.
You know... doing lvl5 missions in low sec will be a lot easier. Why? Becouse dreds and carriers can only fly there (and that ships are really popular today). Doing lvl5 missions in hi-sec will be a real challenge (only bs/hacs allowed ;), because <i think that> dmg will be so high that even in a teamwork, some mates will lose their ships.
Other thing - number of ships on mission... you know lag problems... maybe ccp on lvl5 missions give us something more dangerous than a raven for a 2,500,000 bounty.... maybe even larger class ships... such as dred or smth. It's should be better way than a 150 ships on one spawn like as bs/bc/ frigs, and mega lagg for a bonus.
--
Why some admins can't do that
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Dixon
Caldari
|
Posted - 2006.09.11 21:00:00 -
[100]
Originally by: Rezerwowy Pies
Edited by: Rezerwowy Pies on 11/09/2006 20:35:10
Edited by: Rezerwowy Pies on 11/09/2006 20:28:56
Originally by: Dixon
I'd like level 5 missions to be rare (in other words: not farmable) and extremely difficult and require lots of teamwork.
You know... doing lvl5 missions in low sec will be a lot easier. Why? Becouse dreds and carriers can only fly there (and that ships are really popular today). Doing lvl5 missions in hi-sec will be a real challenge (only bs/hacs allowed ;), because <i think that> dmg will be so high that even in a teamwork, some mates will lose their ships.
Other thing - number of ships on mission... you know lag problems... maybe ccp on lvl5 missions give us something more dangerous than a raven for a 2,500,000 bounty.... maybe even larger class ships... such as dred or smth. It's should be better way than a 150 ships on one spawn like as bs/bc/ frigs, and mega lagg for a bonus.
Well focused fire is being looked at and I've never liked the whole mission aggro system. I'd like to see rats attacking numerous targets and ofcourse dreads and carriers should not be allowed to run missions... it's silly.
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I have no strong feelings one way or the other... |
Johncrab
Minmatar
Typo Corp
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Posted - 2006.09.11 21:14:00 -
[101]
Edited by: Johncrab on 11/09/2006 21:15:08
I do believe that people that post threads like this never did a solo lvl 4 deadspace mission. Easy!!!???
Common, try to warp in and get dozens of intys, cruisers and a few bs's right on top of you, webbed and scrambled, with enough dps to destroy a freakin station... what are you going to do with a raven then? Kill the intys with torps or cruise missiles at close range? You can only do that with double webb and target painter, and with drones as buged as they are... go do a few of the really hard missions solo, and then get back to this thread. |
Leandro Salazar
Aeon Industries
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Posted - 2006.09.11 22:09:00 -
[102]
Originally by: Dixon
Why do you all assume that going to low-sec will result in instant death by pirates? I'd love to have my agent moved to low-sec, then I'd atleast have some reason not to run missions while partially awake.
Certainly no insta-death, but eventually it will happen. And there is also the possibility of probing pirates preventing you from playing at all, which really sucks. Kills your ISK/time and such the risk is high and the reward low...
---------
ZOMG my sig was concordokkened!
Link removed due to bad language on remote site. -wystler
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Areconus
|
Posted - 2006.09.11 23:17:00 -
[103]
Originally by: Nahia Senne
navy's maintain the safety of their respectable empires.
lvl4 agents offer highly rewarding missions where you fight hordes of enemies... in the middle of highly secure empire space!
for consistency's sake, we need to move at least lvl4 agents into lowsec. there, where there is little navy presence, fighting large enemy fleets will be more believable.
also, this will improve the risk vs. reward ratio that lowsec was meant to offer.
No definetly not a scheme to get more people in lowsec for you to kill! 
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Depko
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Posted - 2006.09.12 10:38:00 -
[104]
Edited by: Depko on 12/09/2006 10:39:07
Originally by: Dixon
Why do you all assume that going to low-sec will result in instant death by pirates? I'd love to have my agent moved to low-sec, then I'd atleast have some reason not to run missions while partially awake.
Anybody stated, that going to low-sec is instant death ?
I have the impression, that you see things black or white. Either instant death or no risk ?
According to your agent: Why do you not simply move to low sec agents ?
I can't imagine why do you want your lvl4 quality<19 agent to move into low sec, if you can find lvl4 q=20 agents intead in low sec ?
The drop in LP's value recently is surely not a motivation to move into low sec and run these agents.
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Tommy Vercetti
The Nexus Syndicate
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Posted - 2006.09.12 10:40:00 -
[105]
Originally by: Leandro Salazar
Originally by: Dixon
Why do you all assume that going to low-sec will result in instant death by pirates? I'd love to have my agent moved to low-sec, then I'd atleast have some reason not to run missions while partially awake.
Certainly no insta-death, but eventually it will happen. And there is also the possibility of probing pirates preventing you from playing at all, which really sucks. Kills your ISK/time and such the risk is high and the reward low...
Exactly why you guys ***** me up. Just the fact that you MIGHT lose a ship if you get caught sleeping gets your panties in a twist.
I suppose we should just have crokite in 0.5, I might lose my 500m hulk. I suppose we should have 6mil rat spawns in empire, i might lose my t2 mach. I suppose we should move 0.0 into empire, as i might lose my blockade runner hauler to a 0.0 choke camp. So its ok for people to lose their covetors and retrievers and mammoths with their strip miners/nanos being forced to low sec/0.0 if they want something decent, meanwhile, others will complain how hard a lvl 4 is in a CNR with a faction fit in high sec. My oh my that sounds real dangerous, dont make it so people have to think, gee no, the casual player doesnt have a brain.
Perhaps you would prefer it this way. Everytime you lose a ship, the agent whose mission you were running gives you a full officer fitted CNR, just so you dont have to work to get anything back. Oh and he chucks in a isk print machine for good measure, wouldnt want you to actually put some time into working it back now would we.
Originally by: Exlegion
If PVP'ers exercised a bit more discretion and perhaps a bit more courtesy, then maybe more people would venture out into 0.0.
You can't be serious. you really cant be serious. So what do you expect, rock up to a 0.0 choke system, say please and thank you, then head off into the yonder? Actually, have you ever been to 0.0? No wait, have you actually finished the tutorial and undocked?
Bah you people make me want to pirate. I've finished my rant, Im off to the pirate forum
---------------------------------------------------
Tommy Vercetti
A&E Director
The Nexus Syndicate
--------------------------------------------------- |
Leandro Salazar
Aeon Industries
|
Posted - 2006.09.12 11:02:00 -
[106]
Originally by: Tommy Vercetti
Exactly why you guys ***** me up. Just the fact that you MIGHT lose a ship if you get caught sleeping gets your panties in a twist.
It is really more the fact that we WILL lose a ship when we get caught by probing pirates while running a mission, or rather that in order to prevent that we will not be able to run missions a lot of the time when probing pirates are around.
Both these things would spoil a mission runners gameplay in lowsec if all lvl4 missions were moved there and the pirates inevitably flocked to the mission hubs. Kinda like a reverse of Concord, which I guess also somewhat spoils the pirating experience in highsec...
And with pirates being able to play safe from Concord in lowsec and 0.0, why shouldn't we be able to play safe from pirates in highsec?
I am all for increased risk in lvl4 missions, but it must come from better NPCs, not from PvP.
---------
ZOMG my sig was concordokkened!
Link removed due to bad language on remote site. -wystler
|
Celeste Storm
Gallente
Elite United Corp
Antigo Dominion
|
Posted - 2006.09.12 11:10:00 -
[107]
Originally by: Rafein
ooohhh, great idea here. And pretty realistic.
To make it even better and more realistic, if players really missions ***** for Empires in .4-.1 systems, it sould raise the sec radius, until it becomes .5, as the players made the system more secure for the navies.
wtf, hell I love this one!!  sooner or later we are all living in a peaceful high sec universe with all those ebil prats rasoming roids.  
Cel.
whiners make m3 s!ck | Do you like farmers?
|
Tommy Vercetti
The Nexus Syndicate
|
Posted - 2006.09.12 11:55:00 -
[108]
Originally by: Tommy Vercetti
...rant...
Actually you missed the point. No mission runner was asking to change anything, none were complaining about low sec or 0.0 or even pirates. It was a pirate who wanted some easy prey and got a slap for asked such stupid wishes. Thats all m8 and now have fun in the pirate forum. 
Cel.
Ahem, I dont know why I bother
Originally by: Gaboloran
Now you want them to take our missions all to lowsec too so that people can sit at the gates waiting to destroy a months worth of my work for 60 seconds of their own fun.
Originally by: GTSI
yeah move all lvl4 agents to low sec so the pvpers can have more targets.
DOH!
Originally by: Kerfira
Please note that the OP mistyped the title of her post. It shouldn't have been 'moving all lvl4 agents into lowsec', but instead 'Whine, whine. Why can't I shoot empire dwellers'.
Originally by: Gaius Sejanus
Oh look, another PK trying to force other people into playing the way she wants them to, and not how they want to.
Originally by: UniqueOne
Ok then, if your going to move level 4 missions to lowsec, also make anyone with a negatyive standing concorded in anything other then 0.0 space. Pirates would be captured/shot on sight in real life.
Originally by: Depko
I reccomend the CCP to raise the 13 eruo/month to 130/month for the 0.0 inhabitans like you.
need i go on. the op made a suggestion (albeit it might not be the best one), and its turned into a mission runner vs everyone else. The mission runners ability to handle criticism isnt very high. Myself at least, I would rather see the pve content increased dramatically in this game. But talking about low sec myths, pk crap and other flames just doesnt help the situation
---------------------------------------------------
Tommy Vercetti
A&E Director
The Nexus Syndicate
--------------------------------------------------- |
Dixon
Caldari
|
Posted - 2006.09.12 12:08:00 -
[109]
Quote:
need i go on. the op made a suggestion (albeit it might not be the best one), and its turned into a mission runner vs everyone else. The mission runners ability to handle criticism isnt very high. Myself at least, I would rather see the pve content increased dramatically in this game. But talking about low sec myths, pk crap and other flames just doesnt help the situation
And the Italian slave wins the thread.
- - - - - -
I have no strong feelings one way or the other... |
Exlegion
|
Posted - 2006.09.12 13:18:00 -
[110]
Originally by: Celeste Storm
Edited by: Celeste Storm on 12/09/2006 11:19:48
Originally by: Rafein
ooohhh, great idea here. And pretty realistic.
To make it even better and more realistic, if players really missions ***** for Empires in .4-.1 systems, it sould raise the sec radius, until it becomes .5, as the players made the system more secure for the navies.
wtf, hell I love this one!! sooner or later we are all living in a peaceful high sec universe with all those ebil prats rasoming roids.
Originally by: Tommy Vercetti
...rant...
Actually you missed the point. No mission runner was asking to change anything, none were complaining about low sec or 0.0 or even pirates. It was a pirate who wanted some easy prey and got a slap for asked such stupid wishes. Thats all m8 and now have fun in the pirate forum.
Cel.
Thanks! You actually understood what I was trying to say. Now here's a pirate I like  Assuming you are one
|
Leandro Salazar
Aeon Industries
|
Posted - 2006.09.12 15:01:00 -
[111]
Originally by: Tommy Vercetti
need i go on. the op made a suggestion (albeit it might not be the best one), and its turned into a mission runner vs everyone else. The mission runners ability to handle criticism isnt very high. Myself at least, I would rather see the pve content increased dramatically in this game. But talking about low sec myths, pk crap and other flames just doesnt help the situation
Part of the reason for the vehement reactions is probably another thread that was on the general forum when this thread was started where a lot more pirates and wannabes posted a lot of stupid stuff in favor of moving all L4s to lowsec. And of course the fact that such a move would not just nerf but destroy the gameplay for a whole lot of people.
And what do you think how all the pirates would respond if someone posted a suggestion about 'Concord intervention to aggression in lowsec' on their forum?
I don't think ANY player group will handle 'criticism' very well if that 'criticism' aims to demolish the very foundation of their existance.
---------
ZOMG my sig was concordokkened!
Link removed due to bad language on remote site. -wystler
|
Dixon
Caldari
|
Posted - 2006.09.12 15:16:00 -
[112]
Originally by: Leandro Salazar
I don't think ANY player group will handle 'criticism' very well if that 'criticism' aims to demolish the very foundation of their existance.
If the very foundation of their existance revolves around not interacting with other players, then they have no place in a MMORPG.
- - - - - -
I have no strong feelings one way or the other... |
Leandro Salazar
Aeon Industries
|
Posted - 2006.09.12 15:29:00 -
[113]
Originally by: Dixon
Originally by: Leandro Salazar
I don't think ANY player group will handle 'criticism' very well if that 'criticism' aims to demolish the very foundation of their existance.
If the very foundation of their existance revolves around not interacting with other players, then they have no place in a MMORPG.
I am sure the people I buy my expensive stuff off are quite happy about my interaction. You DO realize there are other ways of interacting than just blowing each other up?
Imho people like you who advocate that certain types of players have no place in the game are the ones that really don't.
---------
ZOMG my sig was concordokkened!
Link removed due to bad language on remote site. -wystler
|
Depko
|
Posted - 2006.09.12 15:34:00 -
[114]
Originally by: Dixon
Originally by: Leandro Salazar
I don't think ANY player group will handle 'criticism' very well if that 'criticism' aims to demolish the very foundation of their existance.
If the very foundation of their existance revolves around not interacting with other players, then they have no place in a MMORPG.
Do you think pvp is the only way how to "interact with other players" ?
Or do you think, that doing lvl4 missions in empire doesn't involve any interaction with other players?
I would like to point that even a person not taking a single word to enyone in the game would be dramatically infulenced by other players in many ways. The market is player based, the belts are mined by other players, the wars and pvp are handled by players. Nobody can't exist in EVE without interacting with others by buying their stuff, selling them his things and doing other very basic activities
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Celeste Storm
Gallente
Elite United Corp
Antigo Dominion
|
Posted - 2006.09.12 15:35:00 -
[115]
Originally by: Dixon
Originally by: Leandro Salazar
I don't think ANY player group will handle 'criticism' very well if that 'criticism' aims to demolish the very foundation of their existance.
If the very foundation of their existance revolves around not interacting with other players, then they have no place in a MMORPG.
You made a point here m8, but how you define _interaction with other_ ? There is no right or wrong playing a game. Its about having fun. Interactivity could be buying things from other or building things for others. It could be anything, ofc pvp. Interactivity is NOT defined by shooting or getting shoot by other players.
If a game supports the idea of pvp AND pve both groups of players should be able to have the same amount of fun. As many wrote before, I fail to see my fun part in loosing a 500M ship plus another 500M fitting to a gatecamp of 5 T1 cruisers.
Thats what this whole story is about. Most of us spend weeks of mission running to get this faction ship. Can u imagine that we actually want to fly it? Do u know anybody who would risk such an investment in such a way?
What else is my 500M, 1B, 1.5B faction ship good for if not for mission running in high sec? There is still the risk of loosing it to lag, stage aggro, what ever.
And to make things clear, I also hunt in low sec and sometime in 0.0, just because I cannot stand the 100000000000000000 Angel Etravag. mission my agent gives me. But I cannot and will not demand that everybody also does this. If a player wants to stay in high sec its absolutly ok, he/she is no carebear, but a player with a different playstyle which I HAVE TO ACCEPT!
Cel.
whiners make m3 s!ck | Do you like farmers?
|
Matori Kar
|
Posted - 2006.09.12 15:36:00 -
[116]
Originally by: Dixon
Originally by: Leandro Salazar
I don't think ANY player group will handle 'criticism' very well if that 'criticism' aims to demolish the very foundation of their existance.
If the very foundation of their existance revolves around not interacting with other players, then they have no place in a MMORPG.
*scribble scribble scribble*
*mutters* page twenty of stupid list 
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Dixon
Caldari
|
Posted - 2006.09.12 15:50:00 -
[117]
Originally by: Celeste Storm
Edited by: Celeste Storm on 12/09/2006 15:36:17
Originally by: Dixon
Originally by: Leandro Salazar
I don't think ANY player group will handle 'criticism' very well if that 'criticism' aims to demolish the very foundation of their existance.
If the very foundation of their existance revolves around not interacting with other players, then they have no place in a MMORPG.
/EDIT: Damn Depko, you were faster.
You made a point here m8, but how you define _interaction with other_ ? There is no right or wrong playing a game. Its about having fun. Interactivity could be buying things from other or building things for others. It could be anything, ofc pvp. Interactivity is NOT defined by shooting or getting shoot by other players.
If a game supports the idea of pvp AND pve both groups of players should be able to have the same amount of fun. As many wrote before, I fail to see my fun part in loosing a 500M ship plus another 500M fitting to a gatecamp of 5 T1 cruisers.
Thats what this whole story is about. Most of us spend weeks of mission running to get this faction ship. Can u imagine that we actually want to fly it? Do u know anybody who would risk such an investment in such a way?
What else is my 500M, 1B, 1.5B faction ship good for if not for mission running in high sec? There is still the risk of loosing it to lag, stage aggro, what ever.
And to make things clear, I also hunt in low sec and sometime in 0.0, just because I cannot stand the 100000000000000000 Angel Etravag. mission my agent gives me. But I cannot and will not demand that everybody also does this. If a player wants to stay in high sec its absolutly ok, he/she is no carebear, but a player with a different playstyle which I HAVE TO ACCEPT!
Cel.
I accept your playstyle, I don't understand it however. I only mean to say that low-sec is not as dangerous as you seem to think it is. Currently high-sec is getting more and more crowded with farmers (I'm not talking about mission runners specifically) because it has almost no risk.
High-sec should never be a place for any high-income occupation IMO. If you've ever escorted a freighter through 0.0 (man I'd love to do that without instas) or ganged up to complete a 10/10 complex you'll know teamwork from farming. Teamwork is what I'd like to see more often and the best way to encourage teamwork is by adding risk to solo ops.
- - - - - -
I have no strong feelings one way or the other... |
Leandro Salazar
Aeon Industries
|
Posted - 2006.09.12 16:01:00 -
[118]
Originally by: Dixon
I accept your playstyle, I don't understand it however. I only mean to say that low-sec is not as dangerous as you seem to think it is.
Yes, current low-sec is not as dangerous and running missions is feasible in many quite systems because not all that many people do it. But if lowsec became the only option for Lvl4 missions, it would become a LOT more dangerous as the multitude of runners now forced to do lowsec or quit would most certainly attract tons of pirates to the good agent systems and thus making mission running a chore at best.
Adding PvP as risk for mission runners can only end in failure. The only way to properly add more risk is through better and smarter NPCs and maybe even some randomness to mission compostition.
---------
ZOMG my sig was concordokkened!
Link removed due to bad language on remote site. -wystler
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Ghan Tylous
Caldari
Infinite Dreams Inc
Kimotoro Directive
|
Posted - 2006.09.12 16:20:00 -
[119]
Originally by: Nahia Senne
navy's maintain the safety of their respectable empires.
lvl4 agents offer highly rewarding missions where you fight hordes of enemies... in the middle of highly secure empire space!
for consistency's sake, we need to move at least lvl4 agents into lowsec. there, where there is little navy presence, fighting large enemy fleets will be more believable.
also, this will improve the risk vs. reward ratio that lowsec was meant to offer.
Sure, let us move all lvl4 agents to 0.0 space /sarcasme.
and that comes from a pirate.
Serious: No.
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eff one
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Posted - 2006.09.12 18:01:00 -
[120]
Im a lvl3 agent runner in high sec space, and tbh i think the idea is great. I actually cant stand ppl that dont give these suggestions a chance and say 'whine whine whine' really gets on my nerves, try putting some imput in rather that your pathetic dribble. Also ive been out in deep 0.0 (hi stain ppl)
and its not only very easy to play.. its fun! Also if enough ppl go out in 0.0 areas then ure less likely to get killed, weird but try.
Anyway just had to put my input in, as for the guys that say they'll go and play WoW if something like this happens, we could do without you.....
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