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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 3 post(s)
Ghen White Wolves Defence league	Posted - 2006.10.25 17:08:00 - [31] Recon probe launchers can be fit on covops frigates as well (bit of a bad name I guess). Using a snoop probe will have a 30 second scan time with max skills, I believe there's also a rig that will shave 15% off that if you use the t2 version. The rate of fire on rpl is 2.5 seconds and you only need one probe to scan, so in effect it will take you 33 seconds or a bit under to scan someone down.
Rathstern Executus Gallente Merch Industrial	Posted - 2006.10.25 17:15:00 - [32] Dropping an observator, then dropping a snoop almost certainly won't work. There is a new rule enforced on probe locations -- probes cannot be within the scan range of other probes. If you're within the scan range of another probe (hopefully only another of yours) you cannot drop a probe. If the probe you're trying to launch would have another probe in scan range, it will not launch. Drop an observator, warp to 10,000k, you have to wait for the observator to wear off. A side effect of this is that you can no longer use observators for creating way off-grid SS's, and probing things out just got a hell of a lot cheaper.
xenodia Gallente RONA Corporation	Posted - 2006.10.25 17:28:00 - [33] Originally by: Skarsnik This I think is going to change things for the better. If you take into account the smaller gangs offered by the skill tree currently on SiSi this may make for an even further varied group of differently skilled pilots. I honestly wonder if CCP are doing this and creating Recon Launchers that only fit to Recon ships as a new bebfit over the cyno generation. Interesting changes that I will be keeping my beady eye on at least. Expect a new type of probe soon that can only be used with that launcher on recon ships.... cynosural field probe. Im betting that will be how they get around the "cant put cyno and cloak on recons" bug. This signature space for rent
Joerd Toastius Octavian Vanguard	Posted - 2006.10.25 17:49:00 - [34] Originally by: Aertuun The only way to reliably probe was to drop the three probes in a line. Patently not true, if you actually understand how the current system works.
CelticWarrior Lords Of Guile Alektorophobia	Posted - 2006.10.25 18:00:00 - [35] With these new quick scanning and accurate probes it just got a whole lot harder for alliances to take a rivals system etc.Your not even gonna be able to leave ur screen for more than 30 secs,theres gonna be one hell of alot of logging off and on with this just to take a leak.
DaemonBarber	Posted - 2006.10.25 19:28:00 - [36] I know it's a bit old but: From the 06/26/06 TomB Blog: Quote: Lost & Found Just finding objects will be based on the probe type you are using. Its stats will 'battle' against the stats of the objects within its scan radius, if the probe wins it finds the object and gives you the estimated location of the findings. Also from the comments: Originally by: TomB Originally by: F'nog If we use more than one probe at a time, does that increase our chances of success and accuracy? Now there's something I forgot to mention; Probes can not be deployed within scan radius of another probe owned by the same person Probe strength stacks with other probes if an object is located in both probe radiuses Inaccuracy is stacked as well with even freakier results, "stacking" a probe with high inaccruacy and another one with low inaccuracy won't give the same results as if the low inaccuracy would have given you Also this: Originally by: TomB Originally by: Donna Darko What happens to the Covert ops? Why did they have to lose their role as the fastest scanning ship? Woopsie, the name "Recon Launcher" has nothing to do with Recon ships there, it's just called that atm, Covert Ops are still supposed to be equally or even more scan based than Recons. I'll get the name changed, thanks for pointing that out. Quote: http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=357367
DaemonBarber	Posted - 2006.10.25 19:31:00 - [37] Given that the above is 4 months old it could have changed, but can anyone confirm any of that? Perhaps someone with those shiny gold bars?
xHoodx The Establishment Establishment	Posted - 2006.10.25 20:25:00 - [38] Originally by: Ernest Graefenberg Yes, nothing is more carebear than removing the ability to permasafespot with cloaks. Man, covert ops cloaks sure are pretty hardcore - what with being effectively invincible and all? My heart is pumping already. If I sit docked in station all day, am I invincible? Or if I log off for the day, I'm invincible until I get back on? Are you one of the people who thinks cloaking and going afk for a bit in a system is griefing?
Mahrin Skel Imperium Technologies Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2006.10.25 20:45:00 - [39] I'm seriously worried about this business of being able to scan and probe out cloaked ships. It's hard enough to get enough people to fly coverts in fleet ops, one of the reasons they do is because it allows you to deal with Real Life issues by simply going AFK. Take that away, and all you have left is the boredom. --Dave
Ernest Graefenberg Minmatar Cutting Edge Incorporated RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2006.10.25 21:18:00 - [40] Originally by: xHoodx If I sit docked in station all day, am I invincible? Yes, but it takes you longer than 6 seconds to move from a station to a belt and warpscramble a target. Quote: Or if I log off for the day, I'm invincible until I get back on? It probably takes you a good bit longer than a few seconds to log on too. Quote: Are you one of the people who thinks cloaking and going afk for a bit in a system is griefing? Are you one of those people that thinks cloaked capitals is brilliant? This can't possibly be hard to understand. Launching into space in EvE is what provides a majority of the opportunitys (yes, not all - no need to harp on that) - the cost thereof is being attackable. Remove that and you're playing a game you can impossibly lose, short of being criminally stupid.

Ernest Graefenberg Minmatar Cutting Edge Incorporated RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2006.10.25 21:23:00 - [41] Originally by: Nyphur Originally by: Damien Smith Yeah, lets make it so every noob and his dog can probe people. Lets give every covert pilot that's spent hours and days of his time perfecting the art of probing a smack in the face. Probing should be something that takes true player skill to master, not something where you just drop a probe, scan once and warp to the target. That's just stupid. Scan probing should be very challenging, because that's what seperates truly competent covert from wannabe noobs. I am also disappointed. They said they would make the probes 3D, that was the perfect solution. Instead they are basically releasing "win probes" where you can just launch them, scan and warp to your target. Instant win with no pilot-skill. While I'm all for the 3-dimensional fun involved in probing, and see how with the depth of the current system this is somewhat of a step back - I have to wonder, wouldn't it be worthwhile if these probes actually produce results over wide enough areas and fast enough to make finding safespotters reasonable? As it stands, the system may be interesting - but it's also entirely superflous as anyone non-afk/missioning won't be caught by it due to probes being scannable and taking 90s to resolve.
xHoodx The Establishment Establishment	Posted - 2006.10.25 21:34:00 - [42] Iirc there is at least a 5 second delay before a recon ship can even start locking you after uncloaking, no better with a cov ops frigate. If you're not alert enough to avoid the ship in that time you're not alert enough to avoid ships without cloaks either. My point was that saying a cloaked ship is invincible is ridiculous, you can't fight while cloaked. You can't find it with probes or scanner, this is true... but that's the whole point of the cloaks no? You can't activate any modules while cloaked, you can't send fighters then cloak or you will lose your fighters. What excactly is your problem with cloaked cap ships again? Scan it down when it is actually posing a threat ie fighting you or your friends... To answer your question I don't have a problem with cloaks on cap ships... you didn't answer mine except with another question :) If you couldn't scan down the ship while it was actually doing some fighting you missed your chance. Try again next time and hope for better luck. Or get your act together and do it without the luck :)
Butter Dog The Dead Miners Society	Posted - 2006.10.25 21:58:00 - [43] Originally by: Mahrin Skel I'm seriously worried about this business of being able to scan and probe out cloaked ships. It's hard enough to get enough people to fly coverts in fleet ops, one of the reasons they do is because it allows you to deal with Real Life issues by simply going AFK. Take that away, and all you have left is the boredom. --Dave I really wouldnt worry about it too much. You're not going to land in de-cloaking range of the ship and you then have 100km3 to trawl through trying to decloak.
Kaathar Rielspar Minmatar	Posted - 2006.10.25 22:06:00 - [44] first off: yay for probing love let me start with how I go about using probes to find ships: 1) Find rough position of target, lets say he's in a safespot between planet 1 and planet 2. 2) Warp to planet 1 and then to planet 2, making a bm (BM1) halfway. 3) Warp to BM1 and find out where in relation to BM1 the target is, lets say he's 5 AU away toward planet 1. 4) Continually warp to planet 1 from BM1 and back, making BM's along the way in order to reduce the distance to target to sub 95mil km. 5) Once within 95mil km of target, drop 3 probes, wait, warp in, position, drop a gank squad on them. now, questions... 1) What is the unit the 'range' attribute represents in the probe descriptions? AU? (i assume so) 2) If we cant drop 3 probes in a line at the spot where the target is within 95mil km (where 3au probes WILL pick up the target), how will it be possible to get it on all 3 probes due to the fact we cant drop them within their scan range of each other? 3a) Do we need to get a fix on the target using all 3 probes or will one suffice? (i.e. drop one at planet 1, one at planet 2, third one which will get the targets safespot when he's within 95mil km) 3b) If 3a is true, why bother with the old '3 probes to analyse' deal? switching to one probe to analyse would save a lot of headache. especially considering the probes have a much shorter flight time now and you are highly likely to have to warp around continually dropping probes because one will be slightly too close to the other. 4) Have 3au probes been fixed so we can now pick up targets at 1.5au? (their radius, or 200mil km roughly) 5) Can you flag my account for special sisi access so i can try this stuff out? ok, so i was kidding about 5, but any info from the lucky people/devs who are testing this stuff atm would be much appreciated. ____________________ Originally by: Jerick Ludhowe Originally by: Eximius Josari If BS Sized HACs would be overpowered, what are HACs? Overpriced Nos victims.
Ghen White Wolves Defence league	Posted - 2006.10.25 22:40:00 - [45] Originally by: Rathstern Executus Dropping an observator, then dropping a snoop almost certainly won't work. There is a new rule enforced on probe locations -- probes cannot be within the scan range of other probes. If you're within the scan range of another probe (hopefully only another of yours) you cannot drop a probe. If the probe you're trying to launch would have another probe in scan range, it will not launch. Drop an observator, warp to 10,000k, you have to wait for the observator to wear off. You can right-click your probe in the scanner and destroy it.
Deadzone Caldari Phoenix Propulsion Labs Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2006.10.25 23:33:00 - [46] Liketo remind folks that every post here is speculation until the Dev teams releases hard notes on exactly how they will work. Trying to guess how they work is just making the issue more and more confusing. Perhaps we can just sit back and chill and wait for an explanation from the dev team. DZ Vice-Admiral Military Division Phoenix Propulsion Laboratories
Princess Keela	Posted - 2006.10.26 06:21:00 - [47] I just had a mess on the test server with the new probes .. im not sure ifs its just me and early use of the new system but the probes force you to drop them away from each other which is fair enough but i found everytime i had deployed the final one the first was seconds from shut down ... and the system was that big ? am i doing something wrong ? also once i had actually got probes out "48au ones just to mess cause i seriouly couldnt get 3aus out in time,,, it wouldnt let me select them to analyes ... ?
Avulsion Duragon Pioneer Group GoonSwarm	Posted - 2006.10.26 07:57:00 - [48] Originally by: Rathstern Executus A side effect of this is that you can no longer use observators for creating way off-grid SS's, and probing things out just got a hell of a lot cheaper. If people can no longer make 100au+ off grid safespots, what good are the 192au and Observator probes now? You'll be able to find people's old safespots, but eventually they'll all be compromised and deleted. I hope that however the new system works, it's confusing as hell. I've had astrometrics V on my skillplan for a while, and spent a lot of time reading the various guides that people had written about the old system. I liked the idea of a skill that requires more practice than SP to use. http://img100.imageshack.us/img100/708/dpgavulsion4ty.png signature removed (max size 24000 bytes) - please email us (with the signature URL) if you want to know why - Pirlouit([email protected])
Hoshi DAB RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2006.10.26 12:31:00 - [49] It seems probing is now chance based, using the sensor strength of the ship and the probe. So if you want to find a BS or recon ship with an observetor probe I suggest you make a cop of tea than lean back because you are going to have to scan 10-20 times (more if you are unlucky) before you the ship shows up on your scan. Each scan takes 30-120 sec depending on skills. Also some strange results, I placed a rook and a slasher at the same SS (5 km from each other). Did 30 scans with an obervetor. In that time the rook showed up 2 times while the slasher NEVER showed up.
Aertuun Ars Caelestis Ascendant Frontier	Posted - 2006.10.26 13:31:00 - [50] Edited by: Aertuun on 26/10/2006 13:32:15 Didn't want to cross-post everywhere, so have made a couple of posts based on the discussions on this thread in the Kali development forum. Here (PvP!) and Here (fleet battles!) If CCP leave in what seems to be the proposed system of "lucky dice" scan probing, it will be an absolute disaster and nerf it beyond all usefulness.

Princess Keela	Posted - 2006.10.26 15:17:00 - [51] I totally agree it needs a hell of alot of work the only problem with the old system was the 2d scan the probes did thats all .. but from what ive seen it looks too far fetched
Damien Smith Turbulent	Posted - 2006.10.26 16:01:00 - [52] So probing has gone the way of ecm and become chance based, and you can now scan for cloaked ships, making them not really cloaked at all. Wonderful. I'm really feeling the love for the humble covert ops frig... ----------- Join channel 'Turby' or die! (bring pie) Mission running carebears drop good loot. Probe one out today! I <3 carebears on toast ^^ - Xorus I'll trade you some carebears for some sheep -Tirg +=♥ - Immy
Shoele Lialos Gallente Elite United Corp Antigo Dominion	Posted - 2006.10.26 16:15:00 - [53] I'm all with requiring probing and scanning to be a skill the player needs to have, but in the mean time, I want to ask a question of if there are different skills the character needs to have to get it done, or are we still looking at Survey and Astrometrics?
Githtakai	Posted - 2006.10.26 16:42:00 - [54] Originally by: xHoodx Iirc there is at least a 5 second delay before a recon ship can even start locking you after uncloaking, no better with a cov ops frigate. If you're not alert enough to avoid the ship in that time you're not alert enough to avoid ships without cloaks either. My point was that saying a cloaked ship is invincible is ridiculous, you can't fight while cloaked. You can't find it with probes or scanner, this is true... but that's the whole point of the cloaks no? You can't activate any modules while cloaked, you can't send fighters then cloak or you will lose your fighters. What excactly is your problem with cloaked cap ships again? Scan it down when it is actually posing a threat ie fighting you or your friends... To answer your question I don't have a problem with cloaks on cap ships... you didn't answer mine except with another question :) If you couldn't scan down the ship while it was actually doing some fighting you missed your chance. Try again next time and hope for better luck. Or get your act together and do it without the luck :) /QFT This looks like another case of devs who own 0.0 space trying to rework the game to make it more convenient for existing alliances, like when they "fixed" cloaking at gates and made it so anyone even trying to lock a cloaker uncloaked them. What role is left for the cloaker if they can't sit in a system and just watch? You might say they still can if they constantly change SS, but who wants to do that for the hours of time that pass waiting for things to happen? Right now if cloaked you can joke with your friends on TS or otherwise do whatever without having to worry that the one other guy in local is going to find you before the enemy fleet shows up. If the job of the recon guy now involves constant SS changing, suddenly there is no reason to risk an expensive cloak module, just send a guy in a frig to warp around, same outcome. The only thing that 80mil module lets you do now is watch people from a safe distance, and even that will no longer work in fleets because any fleet jumping into a system that will be there more than a minute will start probing for you immediately.
Aertuun Ars Caelestis Ascendant Frontier	Posted - 2006.10.26 16:50:00 - [55] Edited by: Aertuun on 26/10/2006 16:51:47 Have any of the people who are complaining about cloaked ships being probable ever tried using scan probes before? A good result on the most accurate probe available will usually land a scan prober 15-60km away from the target ship. In a random direction. So what's the problem? If you're actually cloaked, they STILL won't be able to find you. It's all very well knowing there's a ship somewhere around you within 15km-60km or so, but unless you decloak you'll still be nigh on impossible to find.
Princess Keela	Posted - 2006.10.26 17:01:00 - [56] there is more skills now too 2 more .. and ecm isnt chanced based its what it should be ecm ship designed .. not everyone and there alt carrying ecm.
Aramendel Amarr Queens of the Stone Age Anarchy Empire	Posted - 2006.10.26 17:22:00 - [57] Originally by: Aertuun If you're actually cloaked, they STILL won't be able to find you. It's all very well knowing there's a ship somewhere around you within 15km-60km or so, but unless you decloak you'll still be nigh on impossible to find. Exactly. If you are not afk you can simply warp away and make a new SS. If a cov ops is lucky and gets close enough to unloak you can can easily warp before the delay of the cloak wears off if you were alligned. The ONLY way you can kill a ship with a cloak is if it is AFKing.
Princess Keela	Posted - 2006.10.27 16:39:00 - [58] ALso if the new system is forcing you to drop probes away from other probes how the hell do you find someone whos SS is out in the sticks ? (between long distance planet routes) cause old way was to make a ss as close to the 3au as poss then drop 3 probes but if you cant drop all in same place then you aint findin them


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