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Are noobs moving too fast?

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Crumplecorn Gallente Aerial Boundaries Inc. Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2006.11.24 09:27:00 - [61] Rule 1: Fly what you can afford to lose* Rule 2: Fly what you want, fitted how you want, when you want, where you want. Rule 3: There are no other rules. *This may or may not be defined purely in ISK terms People who go on about only flying ships when you can use them to their maximum potential annoy the crap out of me. It actually makes no sense. In no particular order: It's a game, you're supposed to have fun. There are going to be situations where a badly fitted BS will serve you better than a excellently fitted cruiser. The idea that you shouldn't fly a ship before being able to fit it optimally supports this idea of SP>Player Skill. Far better to fly a ship from when you can afford to, learning how to pilot it effectively, and improving your setup as you train to allow you to take on progesively tougher situations. If you are not a deciated PvPer but simply want some PvP assets to your name, you will have more important things to be training than Obscure Skill That Gives 2% Bonus Lv.5. Only flying ships when you can fit appropriate T2 guns makes the T1 guns fairly pointess. They exist for a reason. If you were meant to either fly something or not, there would only be one level of each skill. There are shades of grey between 'Unable To Fly' and 'My Little Solopwnmobile' ---------- IBTL \o/ It's great being in ur forums mixing ur memes, ain't it?
Flitz Farseeker Gallente Eve guardians	Posted - 2006.11.24 10:28:00 - [62] For level 3 missions, I'll take out my Brutix. They can sometimes be tough, but I know the odds. For PVP, I fly a Thorax. My cruiser skills are a bit more rounded and more importantly I can afford to lose it.
Mi Lai Sanguine Legion	Posted - 2006.11.24 11:09:00 - [63] If noobs are moving to fast, use Webbers Usually for PVE, bigger is better. It's easier to rat in a Raven or other noobship then to try it in a Cruiser or Frigate. For PVP, you need a large ammount of sp's to be really effective in a BS, but then again, people like me usually learn what they need fitted and trained by using a ship, so I can occassionally be found in a BS.
Cletus Graeme Caldari Bladerunners Mordus Angels	Posted - 2006.11.24 11:46:00 - [64] I would say yes. Most players are too eager to jump into ships they cant fly so they spend a lot of time training up Spaceship Command skills and not enuf time training up the necessary support skills tp fly those ships well. They just train the minimum skills required to jump into it, fly somewhere dangerous and get popped ! When you see one year old players flying around in tech 1 cruisers and battlecruisers that should make you stop and think - Why are they still flying a ship a year into the game that I can jump into within a week of starting playing ? Cos the effectiveness of a ship improves with your SP. So even tech 1 ships are useful to older players -especially for piracy as disposable gankers. So bear in mind that while you THINK you can take on that thorax in your Brutix that you just bought (cos clearly Brutix > Rax right ?) you probably CANT if the player is much older than you.... I took the slow and steady approach and learned to fly ALL the ships (for my race) in EACH class. As a result I am now 7mths old and have only just got into my first battleship ! However, I would not expect everyone to do as I did. For new players to EVE here is a rough guide to what I would fly, with what SP and when : 1st mth - upto 1mill SP Fly Frigates only (Essential for lvl 1 missions. They are cheap and easy to fly/fit with low skills making them ideal for new players. You should be training learning skills anyway, so won't be able to fly anything else) 2nd mth - min 2mill SP Add Destroyers (You should still be training learning, so can't fly much else. You can arguably skip destroyers but if you REALLY want to fly something new then give them a try but be aware they are made of paper !) 3rd mth - min 3mill SP Add Cruisers (Essential for lvl 2 missions. The most versatile ships in the game. You will be flying these for a long time. The key is not to jump into them too soon.) 4th mth - min 4mill SP Add Battlecruisers (Essential for lvl 3 missions and add extra firepower in PvP but warp very slowly and a ahrd to fit so need good skills to be effective in PvP) 5th mth - min 5mill SP Add Battleships (The mainstay of fleets and essential to prosper in 0.0. Essential for lvl 4 missions. By now you should also be thinking about which Tech2 ships you want to aim for) Obviously, if you decide to aim for a specific Tech2 ship right from thestart then you can just train for that instead but most players will want to work slowly upto Battleship (making ISK along the way) before jumping into expensive Tech 2 ships.
Sapphron Dei Gallente Solid Ind.	Posted - 2006.11.24 11:49:00 - [65] Originally by: Pampinus Medusae The thing that amazes me is I learn about newbie characters flying around at 1M SP in brutixes, or 2M in battleships. Why do they do this? I know they feel safe in big ships but its very expensive and surely they'd be mounting crappy guns on them? I mean a small T2 neutron is as powerful as a T1 medium electron blaster with T2 ammo and advanced tracking/speed etc. Sapphron here has a little under 1 mill SP and I pilot a Brutix. No problem there and easily replaced if lost. My other alt flies a Ferox. I dont have a spectaculair income but i do make between 7-9 million in 2.5 hours (using 2 accounts to mine). Also, if you know half what your doing and set specific goals you can train towards them instead of randomly starting to learn all sorts of skills. I can mine relatively fast and refine at 90.5%, fly my Brutix + Ferox and make ratting in low sec (0.3-0.4) easy for myself. And no - I dont mount all too crappy guns on them. ¿Noobs¿ can do better than one might think, as long as they have a plan and a goal to work towards. -Solid Ind.: AMPS - ADC supporters!
Sapphron Dei Gallente Solid Ind.	Posted - 2006.11.24 11:57:00 - [66] Edited by: Sapphron Dei on 24/11/2006 12:01:49 Edited by: Sapphron Dei on 24/11/2006 12:00:37 Originally by: Cletus Graeme Long story about what one should and should not fly with specific amounts of SP As far as PvE goes: No, id absolutely disagree with flying only frigs till you get 1 mill SP. Cruisers and Destroyers are viable options as well. I also disagree with the battlecruiser opinion here. Why wait till you get 4 mill Sp if you can obtain them for your own specific reasons? If they serve your personal purpose effectively its money well spent. I do tend to agree more with the battleship section, altho the 5 mill SP is overboard to me. But its all about personal preference. As for piracy - I would agree more on these given suggestions. Just my 2 cents.. (Small note: I do agree with sticking with a shiptype at some point. to me its the BC. extremely versatile and not too expensive.) -Solid Ind.: AMPS - ADC supporters!
Luke Pubcrawler	Posted - 2006.11.24 12:09:00 - [67] I have around 5mill SP now and regularly fly BS and am glad I do as it lets me pick the right tool for the job. Missions - I got to Destroyer asap an blated thro level ones. Into a cruiser as soon as lvl 2s 2 were offered and blasted thro them with small guns. Earned me money, LP and standing. By the time I got lvl 3s at a bout a mill SP I was flying a Raven with Heavys and as much tank as I could fit. Worked well. For missions a noob wants a nice big ship for overkill. I know this makes the vets whine but it works. PvP - now here thngs are different. I mostly PvP in frigates still. If I lose I lose. However I am glad I can fly cruisers and BS even in PvP. Why? So I can help out my corp in a Blackbird or Scorpion. You don't need to be 10mill vet to be usefulin one of them. At 1 mil SP I flew a Blackbird in corp war and did some good in it. Sure a vet in one would have done better but a 1mill player in a BB is more useful than one in a Merlin or cormorant. Players should fly what they want and what suits them. Elitist ideas about only flying with ideal setups should be ignored.
Crumplecorn Gallente Aerial Boundaries Inc. Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2006.11.24 12:14:00 - [68] Edited by: Crumplecorn on 24/11/2006 12:15:48 Originally by: Cletus Graeme 1st mth - upto 1mill SP Fly Frigates only (Essential for lvl 1 missions. They are cheap and easy to fly/fit with low skills making them ideal for new players. You should be training learning skills anyway, so won't be able to fly anything else) 2nd mth - min 2mill SP Add Destroyers (You should still be training learning, so can't fly much else. You can arguably skip destroyers but if you REALLY want to fly something new then give them a try but be aware they are made of paper !) 3rd mth - min 3mill SP Add Cruisers (Essential for lvl 2 missions. The most versatile ships in the game. You will be flying these for a long time. The key is not to jump into them too soon.) 4th mth - min 4mill SP Add Battlecruisers (Essential for lvl 3 missions and add extra firepower in PvP but warp very slowly and a ahrd to fit so need good skills to be effective in PvP) 5th mth - min 5mill SP Add Battleships (The mainstay of fleets and essential to prosper in 0.0. Essential for lvl 4 missions. By now you should also be thinking about which Tech2 ships you want to aim for) Obviously, if you decide to aim for a specific Tech2 ship right from thestart then you can just train for that instead but most players will want to work slowly upto Battleship (making ISK along the way) before jumping into expensive Tech 2 ships. W T F Anyone who listens to this should be banned from the game for stupidity. Edit: I have, in order to be fair, now read thoroughly through his post rather than skimming over it, and would like to add another WTF. ---------- IBTL \o/ It's great being in ur forums mixing ur memes, ain't it?
Hilder Amarr Magnetar Ltd DeStInY.	Posted - 2006.11.24 13:03:00 - [69] As a new player I get a little tired hearing vets brow-beating all us poor nubs. Why should we have to play the game for a year or more before we can fly a decent ship? I accept that one of the main aspects of EVE gameplay is PvP. But there are also many other sides of the game which don't require millions of skill points to enjoy. Personally I have 2.5 million SP after about 3 months in-game and yes I do have a Battleship. I didn't fly it until I could fit Large Energy turrets, I'm sure not going to be mooching around 0.0 looking for a fight. But I'm sure if I did I'd fair better in my BS than in the cruiser a previous poster believes players of my level should be flying. This game is a sand-box so really everyone should be able to play as they see fit, and although I apologise to anyone who is genuinely trying to offer new players constuctive advice. In my own view, the real substance behind a lot of this criticism is a thinly veiled elitism i.e. New players like me should know our place and leave all the best toys in the hands of ppl who happen to have been playing the game for years. An attitude which I couldn't disagree with more, if this was really the case there would be no point in new players even starting the game in the first place. -------------------------- Before you embark on a journey of revenge, dig two graves...
Kibed Dulick	Posted - 2006.11.24 13:09:00 - [70] 3.5 mill sp and i carnt even fly a cruiser well yet
Benglada Finite Horizon The Red Skull	Posted - 2006.11.24 13:13:00 - [71] Originally by: Father Weebles Edited by: Father Weebles on 21/11/2006 16:50:39 I never flew a brutix for pvp until i could use tech2 medium blasters, never flew a dominix for pvp until i got tech2 heavy drones, and won't fly a megathron till i can use tech2 blaster cannons (large Hybrid III, Med Blaster Spec I) so about 30 days left. Why fly a certain ship if you cannot use it to its maximum potential? To put experience into perspective i have 11.5 million skillpoints Im pretty well the same, i wont fly a ship unless i can pimp it --------------------------- Originally by: Arkanor 0.0 is the Final Frontier. Bring money and friends.
Mush Room Caldari Svea Rike Tre Kroner	Posted - 2006.11.24 14:58:00 - [72] I'm a 3m SP char and I fly a Raven. 0 sp in anything but combat skills though. Do I win some sort of prize now? :D
Mi Lai Sanguine Legion	Posted - 2006.11.24 15:42:00 - [73] Originally by: Cletus Graeme lot's of stuff First: Why would anyone train up that specific path? I personally never set foot in a Destroyer, nor BC (though I trained it up when I heard of the Hurricane). I fly BS at times though. Second: for all the new people doing PVE or hugging empire, it's probably bad advise. My alt can run Level 3's and some 4's with really crappy combat skills (~1 M or so, divided between Shield Tanking and Missiles) and in a Raven he can pop any belt rat up to 1.85M. If mining is your thing, getting in a mining Cruiser ASAP or go straight toward a Poc or Domi will help you make a lot more ISK then spending months in Frigs and Dessies. Third: Looking back, it's easy to say: 'OMG, what was I doing in a Medium Gun fitted Battleship in my second month', but as a new player, how are you to know what support skills / weapon skills you need trained to fly a ship well? Best way to value the benefit of some of the skills is stepping into a ship and actually try to fly it, at least it is for me. .
Rojita	Posted - 2006.11.24 15:51:00 - [74] Nothing is more pointless than trying to dictate how somebody else should play the game.
St Dragon Blood Association of Dragons	Posted - 2006.11.24 15:56:00 - [75] Edited by: St Dragon on 24/11/2006 15:56:36 Once some newb was pirating at a gate i killed him with my destroyer because all he ahad fitted was some 150mm rails and a civillian shield booster EDIT:- forgot to say he was in a scorpion. ----------------------------------------------- "Kill one man, and you are a murderer. Kill millions of men, and you are a conqueror. Kill them all, and you are a god." -- Jean Rostand
Roxanna Kell BURN EDEN	Posted - 2006.11.24 15:58:00 - [76] Originally by: Patch86 Nothing makes Jesus cry more than a 1.5 mill SP noob flying around in a Megathron.............with 250 Rails on it i did that once. 2 years ago. Quote: "Don't touch the RED butt
Sammy Xan Caldari Order of the Storm	Posted - 2006.11.24 16:01:00 - [77] Quote: Noobs are moving way too fast. I was flying my hauler the other day and one flew past me doing at least 1000m/s. That was probably me in my Sigil (4-5 MAPCs and the MWD will fit ... )
Cletus Graeme Caldari Bladerunners Mordus Angels	Posted - 2006.11.24 16:46:00 - [78] All the trolls and flamers who replied to my post can ignore this one too - it isn't addressed to you either (1) Nobody is dictating anything to anybody. I am offering my opinion with my reasons for it in reply to the OP. I see many young players flying ships they can barely afford or fit. They are just asking to lose them. Still, if that's what they want to do that's their perogative. (2) My advice was general & therefore encompasses both PvP & PvE. I don't believe in flying ships for just one or the other. I have followed it myself to a certain extent so I knaow it works. It's not the only way to train of course but it should go someway to ensuring that you arent flying ships you are likely to lose. (3) The skillpath I listed is the most common and most general for players new to the game. Obviously I can't list all possibilities and as I said, if you know what you want to fly you can train specifically for that - but most new players don't. I STILL am not sure myself ! My advice remains the same.
Cletus Graeme Caldari Bladerunners Mordus Angels	Posted - 2006.11.24 16:52:00 - [79] Originally by: Crumplecorn W T F Anyone who listens to this should be banned from the game for stupidity. Edit: I have, in order to be fair, now read thoroughly through his post rather than skimming over it, and would like to add another WTF. You sir, are a troll - plain and simple. You remarks aren't witty or even funny. If you actually have something to say then come out and say it. But if all you can manage is "WTF" then please crawl back into your hole
Rooker	Posted - 2006.11.24 17:52:00 - [80] I'm at 1.5mil SP flying a Brutix for lvl3s and having a blast with it. I won't leave high sec in it just yet, but for PVE it's great. I lost the first one a couple weeks ago because my tanking skills weren't nearly good enough. Right now though, I can tank nearly all lvl3 missions and a few lvl4s. I'll get my learning skills to 5 now and get all the supporting skills up to 4 or 5 before moving into anything larger than this. I want to get a Domi, but yeah..... Not even buying the battleships skill book until I think I can fit one properly. --- Combat: Tuxford's 500MM Autocannon Nerfbat II strikes your blastarax perfectly, wrecking for omgwtfnerfed!
Karille Lordless	Posted - 2006.11.24 19:39:00 - [81] How about me gatecamping at 1.5 mil sp in a megathron. can i win some sort of noobs moving too fast award? it had LARGE blasters and killed battlecruisers under sentry fire can you please stop complaining about what you think noobs can and cant do?

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