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Diana Nayli
Zebra Corp The Bastion
0
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Posted - 2015.07.22 21:33:47 -
[1] - Quote
Hello there, I have tried to adapt on new sovereignty mechanics, I thought it will be better than structure grinding and less boring, but recent events changed my mind. It's not that long ago since it has been implemented, but I am already totally annoyed and bored by that. You wanted to make people parcitipate more, but it doesn't work that way. We ended up with couple of interceptors capturing nodes around constellaton and hundreds of people sitting in POS and doing nothing. Empires weren't prepared for that style of playing. Everyone assembles large fleet like before....but no one shows up to face them. I would recommend changing some stuff about entosis links, like only capitals can fit them. This could attract some attention of players and people might fight again. At this moment even rookie ship can conquer space. It might seem good for new players, but older players will be overfed of fleets going to kill an Ibis and will play less. People are already playing less, because nothing big is happening. No large fleets, no long battles for timers, nothing. Only couple of frigates trolling in null sec. Now I'm really missing long structure grinding with 1-hour long elevator music loop.... |
Myrradah
Apotheosis of Caledvwich Dirt Nap Squad.
16
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Posted - 2015.07.22 21:42:07 -
[2] - Quote
You are doing it wrong....
Learn to adapt and split fleets... |
DaReaper
Net 7
2382
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Posted - 2015.07.22 21:43:08 -
[3] - Quote
post in the correct forum.. ib4l
OMG Comet Mining idea!!! Comet Mining!
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Diana Nayli
Zebra Corp The Bastion
0
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Posted - 2015.07.22 21:46:02 -
[4] - Quote
Myrradah wrote:You are doing it wrong....
Learn to adapt and split fleets...
Yeah, we can split fleets, but still nothing will happen. |
Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
22508
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Posted - 2015.07.22 21:46:22 -
[5] - Quote
Please enjoy the following short video on Narwhals while we contemplate your thread.
Also enjoy this picture because it made me smile.
Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings?
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Rowells
ANZAC ALLIANCE Fidelas Constans
2601
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Posted - 2015.07.22 22:11:49 -
[6] - Quote
so, you say you tried to adapt, yet you mention you used the same tactics as before...
pick one |
Renegade Heart
Carebear Miners R Us
510
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Posted - 2015.07.22 22:24:48 -
[7] - Quote
Diana Nayli wrote:We ended up with couple of interceptors capturing nodes around constellaton and hundreds of people sitting in POS and doing nothing
It's almost like you want to be spoonfed fights rather than creatively adapt to the new meta. I'm quite impressed with the nullbears tears these changes have caused.
Awesome job CCP. More nerfs please (to high sec too). |
Jenshae Chiroptera
2050
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Posted - 2015.07.22 22:36:10 -
[8] - Quote
Rowells wrote:so, you say you tried to adapt, yet you mention you used the same tactics as before... pick one Adapt what? Who wants to go chase a few interceptors around? I know I don't. Have been very demotivated since the change and hardly logged on.
CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids
.
High Sec needs a stepping stone to other spaces, where they can grow
Fozzie SOV is treating a symptom.
|
Rowells
ANZAC ALLIANCE Fidelas Constans
2602
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Posted - 2015.07.22 22:43:57 -
[9] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Rowells wrote:so, you say you tried to adapt, yet you mention you used the same tactics as before... pick one Adapt what? Who wants to go chase a few interceptors around? I know I don't. Have been very demotivated since the change and hardly logged on. certainly not by amassing your entire fleet in a POS |
Diana Nayli
Zebra Corp The Bastion
0
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Posted - 2015.07.22 23:12:12 -
[10] - Quote
Rowells wrote:so, you say you tried to adapt, yet you mention you used the same tactics as before...
pick one
May I ask you, what do YOU like about that sov system? DO you enjoy chasing few frigates for whole night? |
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Rowells
ANZAC ALLIANCE Fidelas Constans
2604
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Posted - 2015.07.22 23:32:35 -
[11] - Quote
Diana Nayli wrote:Rowells wrote:so, you say you tried to adapt, yet you mention you used the same tactics as before...
pick one May I ask you, what do YOU like about that sov system? DO you enjoy chasing few frigates for whole night? Step 1: Leave the POS |
Diana Nayli
Zebra Corp The Bastion
0
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Posted - 2015.07.22 23:44:59 -
[12] - Quote
Rowells wrote:Diana Nayli wrote:Rowells wrote:so, you say you tried to adapt, yet you mention you used the same tactics as before...
pick one May I ask you, what do YOU like about that sov system? DO you enjoy chasing few frigates for whole night? Step 1: Leave the POS And for the most part dont have to. from what it looks like, only about 7 attempts in the last 7 days. Pretty good timers and enough people online at PT that 1 person going to check on it isn't a big deal.
First days of new sov I was in couple of fleets defending your space.... But nevermind.
We can change doctrines, fleet composition and sizes, but that doesn't bring fun to sov warfare. That's I am talking about. We are forced to look for content elsewhere.
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Rowells
ANZAC ALLIANCE Fidelas Constans
2604
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Posted - 2015.07.23 00:03:27 -
[13] - Quote
Diana Nayli wrote:Rowells wrote:Diana Nayli wrote:Rowells wrote:so, you say you tried to adapt, yet you mention you used the same tactics as before...
pick one May I ask you, what do YOU like about that sov system? DO you enjoy chasing few frigates for whole night? Step 1: Leave the POS And for the most part dont have to. from what it looks like, only about 7 attempts in the last 7 days. Pretty good timers and enough people online at PT that 1 person going to check on it isn't a big deal. First days of new sov I was in couple of fleets defending your space.... But nevermind. We can change doctrines, fleet composition and sizes, but that doesn't bring fun to sov warfare. That's I am talking about. We are forced to look for content elsewhere. alright dude, which is it?
>chasing trollceptors in my space >staying POSed up in big fleet >defending allied systems >can't adapt
or are you upset that another major alliance/coalition hasn't tried to invade? |
Grorious Reader
Imperial Shipment Amarr Empire
18
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Posted - 2015.07.23 02:31:50 -
[14] - Quote
Huge fleet battles are boring and require no skill from individual players. They just turn a couple hundred derps into tools for a handful of FCs to have actual fun. All the nullbears are getting butt hurt now because so many of them have no idea how to small gang or solo pvp. All they know is target primary and F1, so of course they're not prepared for these mechanics.
Not to mention the real reason these new mechanics exist is because it takes load off the servers. That's why they discourage giant doom fleets and favor small gang fighting. Not because anybody cares if it's more or less fun that way. |
McChicken Combo HalfMayo
The Happy Meal
913
|
Posted - 2015.07.23 03:27:38 -
[15] - Quote
How about attacking people who want to defend their systems instead of trolling the easiest carebear targets you can find in the hopes they undock a half dozen strong kitchen sink fleet that you can hotdrop 300 Harpies on.
There are all our dominion
Gate camps: "Its like the lowsec watercooler, just with explosions and boose" - Ralph King-Griffin
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Darth Terona
Black Rebel Rifter Club The Devil's Tattoo
146
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Posted - 2015.07.23 03:46:11 -
[16] - Quote
So.. The skills me and my ilk represent are highly valuable now... Hmm |
Neuntausend
Rens Nursing Home
242
|
Posted - 2015.07.23 04:04:01 -
[17] - Quote
My only experience on a final timer with fozzie sov looked like this:
we brought a 120 man fleet of t2 frigates, they brought like 80 t1 cruisers and hacs. each side stood on the opposite side of a gate and waited for the other side to jump into them, while about 5 people in each fleet in ceptors and t1 frigs/destroyers were actually playing the game and capping nodes.
when both sides had around 30%, we brought in some more guys, smoked their fleet, split up and steamrolled the rest of the nodes.
It was definitely better than most Dominion final timers, but from what it looks like, the intended little skirmishes all over the constellation are not going to happen.
I am also afraid, that in a few weeks the novelty will have worn off, as will have the illusion, that smaller groups have a chance to win against an alliance that can field 1000 ships if needed at which point, those groups will stop showing up for timers like before fozzie sov. |
Dante Cirrus
Deep Structure. The Bastion
2
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Posted - 2015.07.23 12:14:03 -
[18] - Quote
I should first point out from the outset that these thoughts are my own, based on my personal observations, and in no way reflect the thought of the corp or alliance I happen to be a memeber of ...
Why Fozzie soft has totally failed in its goals:
Has Fozzie soft made it easier to claim nullsec space? Yes, if it is completely undefended.
However if it IS defended.. the little guy has no chance still.. he has to try to capture many nodes in systems spread across an entire constellation. If someone should want to hold another system or 3 in that constellation.. Well too bad.. you got to go into that hostile space to claim a system up to 9 jumps away! The small guy has no chance if there is any sort of defence This = fail of the goals stated.
Has Fozzie soft made null sec sov mechanics better? Hell No.. Sov mechanics are now as boring as hell.. chasing nodes with 'ceptors across 10 systems with ZERO pay off if the attacker cannot mount a decent attack is bullshit.. All Fozzie soft has done is to make it possible for a single player to hold an alliance of hundreds or thousands of PLAYERS to ransom for a couple of hours..
Has this improved player content? resoundingly .. NO.. it is no fun to have many pilots on standby "in case" the attackers mean business while 20 interceptors clean up the vomitous nodes that spawn.. NO ONE enjoys this..
Is this advancing the game of EVE Online? No.. Just look at the number of folks online when you log in.. All that Fozzie soft has done is drive away players that are unwilling to subject themselves to fleets that have zero pay off at the end...
Where Fozzie soft 'could' be fun.. is if a MAJOR power decides to take sov from a DIFFERENT major power.. then there will be fleet fights and it will be fun..
But right now... the fact that a single player has the ability to commit a massive alliance to multiple hours of boredom, is simply messed up..
CCP REALLY needs to rethink how easy it can be to reinforce a structure. Right now, One guy with a ceptor can **** up a system in FIFTEEN MINUTES... Recquiring at least 2 hours from many many pilots to fix.. Is this a fair change to Sov?
NO
Take it BACK to the drawing board... CSM.. get writing how to fix this in the REAL game... In the interim.. Let's go back to PRE DOMINION with tower wars.. at least that was a 'FUN' grind.... |
Akballah Kassan
Zeura Brotherhood Mordus Angels
6
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Posted - 2015.07.23 13:42:44 -
[19] - Quote
CFC tears best tears. Adapt or die. Fozziesov working as intended. |
Neuntausend
Rens Nursing Home
244
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Posted - 2015.07.23 13:50:55 -
[20] - Quote
It's not like the CFC is "losing" Fozzie Sov. They have adapted much better than most - it's just not fun. |
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Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
3852
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Posted - 2015.07.23 13:51:09 -
[21] - Quote
As I've said a few times... give it six months.
73% of EVE characters stay in high security space. 62% of EVE subscribers barely PvP. 40% of all new accounts just "level up their Ravens". Probably that's why PvE content in EVE Online is sub-par and CCP is head over heels for PvP...
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baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
16430
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Posted - 2015.07.23 13:57:41 -
[22] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Rowells wrote:so, you say you tried to adapt, yet you mention you used the same tactics as before... pick one Adapt what? Who wants to go chase a few interceptors around? I know I don't. Have been very demotivated since the change and hardly logged on.
Chased around a Moa cepter gang in my solo mega twice and had great fun doing it. Content hasn't been this easy to come by for years.
Join Bat Country today and defend the Glorious Socialist Dictatorship
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Neuntausend
Rens Nursing Home
244
|
Posted - 2015.07.23 14:01:19 -
[23] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Chased around a Moa cepter gang in my solo mega twice and had great fun doing it. Content hasn't been this easy to come by for years.
Have you caught any? (let me answer that: no, they are ******* interceptors)
It's great that you are having fun, but you are really easy to entertain. As long as it involves Megathrons, you seem to be happy. |
Akballah Kassan
Zeura Brotherhood Mordus Angels
6
|
Posted - 2015.07.23 14:04:39 -
[24] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Rowells wrote:so, you say you tried to adapt, yet you mention you used the same tactics as before... pick one Adapt what? Who wants to go chase a few interceptors around? I know I don't. Have been very demotivated since the change and hardly logged on. Chased around a Moa cepter gang in my solo mega twice and had great fun doing it. Content hasn't been this easy to come by for years.
We also had fun being chased around. We've never seen so much Goon activity Pure Blind. Surely making Goons start to use this region which until recently was almost completely empty is a good thing and what Fozziesov intended.
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baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
16430
|
Posted - 2015.07.23 14:07:39 -
[25] - Quote
Neuntausend wrote:baltec1 wrote:Chased around a Moa cepter gang in my solo mega twice and had great fun doing it. Content hasn't been this easy to come by for years. Have you caught any? (let me answer that: no, they are ******* interceptors) It's great that you are having fun, but you are really easy to entertain. As long as it involves Megathrons, you seem to be happy.
Its only a matter of time before I catch one.
Join Bat Country today and defend the Glorious Socialist Dictatorship
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Akballah Kassan
Zeura Brotherhood Mordus Angels
6
|
Posted - 2015.07.23 14:07:52 -
[26] - Quote
Neuntausend wrote:baltec1 wrote:Chased around a Moa cepter gang in my solo mega twice and had great fun doing it. Content hasn't been this easy to come by for years. Have you caught any? (let me answer that: no, they are ******* interceptors) It's great that you are having fun, but you are really easy to entertain. As long as it involves Megathrons, you seem to be happy.
I think the difference is he doesn't need to roam in a hundred plus fleet for pvp and have FC make all his decisions for him which as an opponent I respect. |
baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
16430
|
Posted - 2015.07.23 14:13:41 -
[27] - Quote
Akballah Kassan wrote: I think the difference is he doesn't need to roam in a hundred plus fleet for pvp and have FC make all his decisions for him which as an opponent I respect.
Not like that ever worked on me in the past, I don't even bring the right ship to the fleet
Join Bat Country today and defend the Glorious Socialist Dictatorship
|
Dante Cirrus
Deep Structure. The Bastion
2
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Posted - 2015.07.23 14:45:44 -
[28] - Quote
Akballah Kassan wrote:CFC tears best tears. Adapt or die. Fozziesov working as intended.
Not tears actually.. far from it.. simple boredom from working with fail mechanics.... That's where I am.. I do my DED plexes, I do my "re-entosising" Other than that.. no decent content improvement at all..
Fozzie soft in a nut shell = ;yawn: ... boring
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Seven Koskanaiken
FinFleet Northern Coalition.
1601
|
Posted - 2015.07.23 14:45:52 -
[29] - Quote
I flew through Vale two days ago and half the LAWN and BSTN system had zero indices across the board, so if you are not using the space why care if someone comes and takes it? |
Jenshae Chiroptera
2057
|
Posted - 2015.07.23 15:07:54 -
[30] - Quote
Fozzie SOV is such fun!
CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids
.
High Sec needs a stepping stone to other spaces, where they can grow
Fozzie SOV is treating a symptom.
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Baaldor
Dixon Cox Butte Preservation Society Black Legion.
428
|
Posted - 2015.07.23 15:38:55 -
[31] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Akballah Kassan wrote: I think the difference is he doesn't need to roam in a hundred plus fleet for pvp and have FC make all his decisions for him which as an opponent I respect.
Not like that ever worked on me in the past, I don't even bring the right ship to the fleet
FC!! I HAVE DRAKE!!
c/d
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Oliver Delorean
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
19
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Posted - 2015.07.23 15:40:34 -
[32] - Quote
They whine cuz they loose space what they don't use.
Seven Koskanaiken wrote:I flew through Vale two days ago and half the LAWN and BSTN system had zero indices across the board, so if you are not using the space why care if someone comes and takes it? Exactly!
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Jenshae Chiroptera
2057
|
Posted - 2015.07.23 17:04:21 -
[33] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Who wants to go chase a few interceptors around? I want to amend this. "Who wants to go chase a few interceptors / their replacements around for the next few years?"
CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids
.
High Sec needs a stepping stone to other spaces, where they can grow
Fozzie SOV is treating a symptom.
|
TigerXtrm
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
1200
|
Posted - 2015.07.23 17:12:03 -
[34] - Quote
Quote:We ended up with couple of interceptors capturing nodes around constellaton and hundreds of people sitting in POS and doing nothing.
I think I found your problem...
My YouTube Channel - EVE Tutorials & other game related things!
My Website - Blogs, Livestreams & Forums
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Grorious Reader
Imperial Shipment Amarr Empire
20
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Posted - 2015.07.23 17:18:33 -
[35] - Quote
So it's taken 2 pages for this thread to arrive at "entosis links should probably require battleship fitting." |
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat Working Stiffs
5127
|
Posted - 2015.07.23 17:27:11 -
[36] - Quote
Would putting say a 10 ship fleet on every node not work?
Of course, I still don't understand why anybody would let a structure (other than a TCU) get reinforced anyways, when it takes one defender per structure to counter one sov-troll during the window.
I admit, I may not understand the mechanics completely. |
Tollen Gallen
Glory of Reprisal Enterprise
9182
|
Posted - 2015.07.23 17:37:51 -
[37] - Quote
EVE
I like Cheese.
Zimmy Zeta - I f*cking love martinis. the original ones, with gin, not that vodka martini crap.
Your old Friends can use me for 7 days, free!!!
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Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat Working Stiffs
5127
|
Posted - 2015.07.23 17:45:13 -
[38] - Quote
Don't ever use Photobucket. There is an insane amount of scripts and cookies on that site. |
Delt0r Garsk
Shits N Giggles
416
|
Posted - 2015.07.23 17:55:59 -
[39] - Quote
How the hell can't you get a single cepter? what is hard about killing cepters? Oh they ran away. Doesn't that link thingy have a max range?
Death and Glory!
Well fun is also good.
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Vol Arm'OOO
Bagel and Lox
686
|
Posted - 2015.07.23 18:08:56 -
[40] - Quote
Renegade Heart wrote:Diana Nayli wrote:We ended up with couple of interceptors capturing nodes around constellaton and hundreds of people sitting in POS and doing nothing It's almost like you want to be spoonfed fights rather than creatively adapt to the new meta. I'm quite impressed with the nullbears tears these changes have caused. Awesome job CCP. More nerfs please (to high sec too).
Because whack a mole is fun?
Nobody ever gave two figs for what a couple of frigs did to each other in the backendass of nowhere. Eve has always grown because of the big events such as the br fight which lead to news coverage which lead to new subs. Now, folk say adept, split up your fleets, etc . . . but all that does is lead to boring ass repetitive content, that doesnt allow for people to feel they are part of an event. There has been no spike in no users, or folk returning to the game. Thus Fozziesov has likely already failed.
I don't play, I just fourm warrior.
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Vincent Athena
V.I.C.E.
3542
|
Posted - 2015.07.23 18:23:34 -
[41] - Quote
Vol Arm'OOO wrote:
Because whack a mole is fun?
It must be. It's made quite a bit of money.
Edit: Ive been trying to figure out just what the OP is complaining about. I think its:
"We showed up for a timer with a big fleet. But the enemy did not show, so our big fleet had nothing to do, and just sat in a POS while our interceptors flew about and did the capture task. Yes, we could fly around, following our interceptors, watching them do their job, but that is hardly content."
OP: You want a fight? Knock over someone's sov who really wants to keep it.
Know a Frozen fan? Check this out
Frozen fanfiction
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Kestral Anneto
The Founding Four Fidelas Constans
100
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Posted - 2015.07.23 18:26:08 -
[42] - Quote
FozzieSov is about as much fun as going on holiday with a bunch of germans.
Seriously, whoever thought that waving the magic sov wand at structures needs to be fired.
What should have happened was that the indexes degraded over time if they aren't maintained, until the point that the sov drops. This way, an entity would have control of the volume of space that it can rightly use.
Please, for the sake of New Eden and BoB, role the servers back and get rid of FozzieSov. Nullsec Sov should have nothing in common with FW.
This picture is getting spread until Fozzie come down and rolls back the FozzieSov
http://puu.sh/j0jX9/92e94d8a2d.jpg
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Vic Jefferson
The Greater Goon Clockwork Pineapple
498
|
Posted - 2015.07.23 18:42:17 -
[43] - Quote
Vol Arm'OOO wrote:There has been no spike in no users, or folk returning to the game. Thus Fozziesov has likely already failed.
Eh...
So, big battles did in fact lead to big spikes. However, you can't really praise those spikes as being all that more healthy for the game than a massive sugar high is for a person - sure it feels great then, but it's not part of a healthy lifestyle. Lots of people sub, lots of people buy the game, plex goes down, everyone's happy....but it's not a lasting thing. A large portion of the people who sub after, say Asakai or BR, end up quitting when they realize just how distant what they play is from what they saw, or how disconnected the average play session is from hype and excitement felt by the people in those fights.
In defence of FozzieSov, it has the potential to be closer to what it is advertised; people could actually get involved in the span of a few months - it could actually slowly add on subs rather than just getting a bunch of people disillusioned. What it needs more than anything is a way to have and incorporate those punctuated moments where history is made to actually hook people, rather than just day-to-day defence. I completely see where the epic feel is gone from New Eden - reduced to world of interceptors where everything feels terribly episodic and static rather than a flowing narrative of cause and effect.
Vote Vic Jefferson for CSM X
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Deck Cadelanne
172
|
Posted - 2015.07.23 18:47:46 -
[44] - Quote
Diana Nayli wrote: Yeah, we can split fleets, but still nothing will happen.
Split fleets. Give each fleet an entosis link fit ship. Watch as you complete the command node capture really quickly by splitting up and doing several of them at once.
Engage brain. Stop being a "but the FC didn't tell me to push F1" lemming.
"When the going gets weird, the weird turn professional."
- Hunter S. Thompson
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Jenshae Chiroptera
2060
|
Posted - 2015.07.23 18:52:16 -
[45] - Quote
Vic Jefferson wrote:... However, you can't really praise those spikes as being all that more healthy for the game than a massive sugar high is for a person - .... With every batch of players that come in, some stay. However small that percentage is, it is better than nothing. You think Fozzie SOV will result in a slow gain. I think with time it will have the opposite result.
CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids
.
High Sec needs a stepping stone to other spaces, where they can grow
Fozzie SOV is treating a symptom.
|
Deck Cadelanne
172
|
Posted - 2015.07.23 18:55:02 -
[46] - Quote
Vol Arm'OOO wrote: There has been no spike in no users, or folk returning to the game. Thus Fozziesov has likely already failed.
It is summer in the northern hemisphere. In summer a lot of people do things other than EVE. Like go outside. Go on vacation. Play sports.
Wait for spring before you declare failure.
As has previously been pointed out, big spikes are not healthy. A pile of folks join based on the hype, most of them quit shortly after and tell all their friends what a **** game EVE is since all the "cool stuff" you see on the videos and hear about in the news is inaccessible until you've played for years.
"When the going gets weird, the weird turn professional."
- Hunter S. Thompson
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Deck Cadelanne
172
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Posted - 2015.07.23 19:01:17 -
[47] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote: You think Fozzie SOV will result in a slow gain. I think with time it will have the opposite result.
Better than the stagnation that defined the previous sov system.
Admittedly I think fozziesov was not the best option on the table; a better choice would have been to drop sov entirely.
With player numbers and revenue in decline, CCP has to roll the dice now. Maybe they get it right. Maybe not. Time will tell. So far, fozziesov looks pretty interesting to me and has generated content (and fun) for me and mine.
"When the going gets weird, the weird turn professional."
- Hunter S. Thompson
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Jenshae Chiroptera
2060
|
Posted - 2015.07.23 19:01:21 -
[48] - Quote
Deck Cadelanne wrote:... In summer a lot of people ... The seasons are blamed both summer and winter.
CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids
.
High Sec needs a stepping stone to other spaces, where they can grow
Fozzie SOV is treating a symptom.
|
Vic Jefferson
The Greater Goon Clockwork Pineapple
499
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Posted - 2015.07.23 19:05:56 -
[49] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Vic Jefferson wrote:... However, you can't really praise those spikes as being all that more healthy for the game than a massive sugar high is for a person - .... With every batch of players that come in, some stay. However small that percentage is, it is better than nothing. You think Fozzie SOV will result in a slow gain. I think with time it will have the opposite result.
I didn't make any predictions there, nor did I directly compliment nor disparage FozzeSov; plenty of threads already cover this in depth, back to the surface, and in depth again. I'm just pointing out that one shouldn't expect the same sorts of growth patterns. I.E. there was no spike, therefore failure, is not the best most thought out analysis.
If you want to toss around words like failed, you need to demonstrate it. Personally, I'd wager that the average newer player in Karmafleet, Pandemic Horde, et al., has a much higher retention rate than people who saw Asakai on YouTube and burnt themselves out on L4s. Rather, its harder to get people interested in one of those corps, or any other corporation, if they weren't already interested in the game itself; Asakai level events get a lot of people interested in the game.
Vote Vic Jefferson for CSM X
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Seven Koskanaiken
FinFleet Northern Coalition.
1604
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Posted - 2015.07.23 19:06:47 -
[50] - Quote
Kestral Anneto wrote:FozzieSov is about as much fun as going on holiday with a bunch of germans.
Seriously, whoever thought that waving the magic sov wand at structures needs to be fired.
What should have happened was that the indexes degraded over time if they aren't maintained, until the point that the sov drops. This way, an entity would have control of the volume of space that it can rightly use.
Please, for the sake of New Eden and BoB, role the servers back and get rid of FozzieSov. Nullsec Sov should have nothing in common with FW.
Yea, you're talking about the people who wouldn't remove a tunnel animation that was making people feel literally sick, so good luck removing the biggest released feature in years. |
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baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
16431
|
Posted - 2015.07.23 19:18:48 -
[51] - Quote
Delt0r Garsk wrote:How the hell can't you get a single cepter? what is hard about killing cepters? Oh they ran away. Doesn't that link thingy have a max range?
I have yet to find a way to get a mega up to the speeds to catch one.
Join Bat Country today and defend the Glorious Socialist Dictatorship
|
TigerXtrm
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
1201
|
Posted - 2015.07.23 20:32:13 -
[52] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Delt0r Garsk wrote:How the hell can't you get a single cepter? what is hard about killing cepters? Oh they ran away. Doesn't that link thingy have a max range? I have yet to find a way to get a mega up to the speeds to catch one.
Last I checked Intercepters weren't invincible before this and they still aren't. But yeah if you're using a Mega to try and catch an Interceptor... how long have you been playing this game again?
My YouTube Channel - EVE Tutorials & other game related things!
My Website - Blogs, Livestreams & Forums
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Vol Arm'OOO
Bagel and Lox
686
|
Posted - 2015.07.23 20:35:57 -
[53] - Quote
Vincent Athena wrote:Vol Arm'OOO wrote:
Because whack a mole is fun?
It must be. It's made quite a bit of money. Edit: Ive been trying to figure out just what the OP is complaining about. I think its: "We showed up for a timer with a big fleet. But the enemy did not show, so our big fleet had nothing to do, and just sat in a POS while our interceptors flew about and did the capture task. Yes, we could fly around, following our interceptors, watching them do their job, but that is hardly content." If the enemy does not show up, ANY sov system will be boring. OP: You want a fight? Knock over someone's sov who really wants to keep it.
Whack a mole is fun once or twice then you move on. Usually its little kids that play whack a mole and they age out of it. The game makes money because there are always more little kids being born. CCP on the other hand has to attract players for long term to be successful. Making folk engage in an endless game of whack a mole is not likely to engender long term success, as it is just not that interesting or entertaining; after all, whether you win or lose - what have you done of merit? maybe killed an inty? as for sov, the cycle is just going to repeat itself ad nausem.
I don't play, I just fourm warrior.
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baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
16431
|
Posted - 2015.07.23 20:42:07 -
[54] - Quote
TigerXtrm wrote:
Last I checked Intercepters weren't invincible before this and they still aren't. But yeah if you're using a Mega to try and catch an Interceptor... how long have you been playing this game again?
You must be new.
Join Bat Country today and defend the Glorious Socialist Dictatorship
|
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat Working Stiffs
5128
|
Posted - 2015.07.23 20:42:31 -
[55] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Delt0r Garsk wrote:How the hell can't you get a single cepter? what is hard about killing cepters? Oh they ran away. Doesn't that link thingy have a max range? I have yet to find a way to get a mega up to the speeds to catch one. Maybe don't chase it, and snipe it? Not a lot of transversal at >100km as the troll-ceptor tries to leave grid.
The Rokh is made for sniping. |
Diana Nayli
Zebra Corp The Bastion
0
|
Posted - 2015.07.23 20:46:53 -
[56] - Quote
Deck Cadelanne wrote:Diana Nayli wrote: Yeah, we can split fleets, but still nothing will happen.
Split fleets. Give each fleet an entosis link fit ship. Watch as you complete the command node capture really quickly by splitting up and doing several of them at once. Engage brain. Stop being a "but the FC didn't tell me to push F1" lemming.
But still, there is NO FUN involved. Yeah, we did it. Every squad had it's own system to hold and capture command node. System succesfully defended without any enemy presence. Congrats. Now we will have great mining/ratting empires all around. |
Eli Stan
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
251
|
Posted - 2015.07.23 21:02:46 -
[57] - Quote
Diana Nayli wrote:
But still, there is NO FUN involved. Yeah, we did it. Every squad had it's own system to hold and capture command node. System succesfully defended without any enemy presence. Congrats. Now we will have great mining/ratting empires all around.
How'd the capture event get generated in the first place? Why not just kill the Interceptor when it attempts to reinforce the TCU, IHub or Outpost in the first place, rather than wait for the command node spawn even to happen? Undock a Stabber or RLML Caracal, blap the Inty, go back to whatever else you were going. Just a few seconds worth of work. |
Jenshae Chiroptera
2061
|
Posted - 2015.07.23 23:03:37 -
[58] - Quote
Eli Stan wrote:... Just a few seconds worth of work. Over and over again. That is the key thing, the repetition. Everyone is saying, "Don't let small things bother you," but they seem to have never slept in a room with a mosquito many nights running.
CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids
.
High Sec needs a stepping stone to other spaces, where they can grow
Fozzie SOV is treating a symptom.
|
DaReaper
Net 7
2384
|
Posted - 2015.07.23 23:09:22 -
[59] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Vic Jefferson wrote:... However, you can't really praise those spikes as being all that more healthy for the game than a massive sugar high is for a person - .... With every batch of players that come in, some stay. However small that percentage is, it is better than nothing. You think Fozzie SOV will result in a slow gain. I think with time it will have the opposite result.
i htink its way too soon to tell what fozzie sov will actually do.
With the above said, ccp is suppose to be able to make tweeks to it quicker and easier, so if they make tweeks it might get better...
With THAT above said... CCP tends to not make tweeks
OMG Comet Mining idea!!! Comet Mining!
Yes i am optimistic about eve.. i'm giving it till dec 31st 2016 before i doom n gloom
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Eli Stan
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
251
|
Posted - 2015.07.23 23:16:52 -
[60] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Eli Stan wrote:... Just a few seconds worth of work. Over and over again. That is the key thing, the repetition. Everyone is saying, "Don't let small things bother you," but they seem to have never slept in a room with a mosquito many nights running.
Oh no! PVP! Multiple times! However will the game survive???
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Neuntausend
Rens Nursing Home
248
|
Posted - 2015.07.23 23:21:33 -
[61] - Quote
Delt0r Garsk wrote:How the hell can't you get a single cepter? what is hard about killing cepters? Oh they ran away. Doesn't that link thingy have a max range?
I don't think anyone's complaining about not being able to defend their space. Sure, a single trollceptor is easy to drive away. It's actually not that hard to defend sov now, given the numbers and activity. The issue is, that it's fairly annoying and not very entertaining. |
Kestral Anneto
The Founding Four Fidelas Constans
102
|
Posted - 2015.07.24 00:10:09 -
[62] - Quote
Neuntausend wrote:Delt0r Garsk wrote:How the hell can't you get a single cepter? what is hard about killing cepters? Oh they ran away. Doesn't that link thingy have a max range? I don't think anyone's complaining about not being able to defend their space. Sure, a single trollceptor is easy to drive away. It's actually not that hard to defend sov now, given the numbers and activity. The issue is, that it's fairly annoying and not very entertaining.
give this man a cookie, hes smarter than CCP
This picture is getting spread until Fozzie come down and rolls back the FozzieSov
http://puu.sh/j0jX9/92e94d8a2d.jpg
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Darth Terona
Black Rebel Rifter Club The Devil's Tattoo
154
|
Posted - 2015.07.24 00:14:14 -
[63] - Quote
Ok. So I'm not in this mess but I have an idea to bounce off those that are.
What if;
1 make the link not fit on a ceptor. This will make pilots that want to attack a system be more dedicated to the cause and cuts out trolling. Gives defenders and attackers more options
2. Make it so reinforcing nodes takes more than one link. Maybe 5 or so. If an attacker or defender cannot dedicate five ships to the cause, then they deserve to loose.
This will reduce the ammount of trolls and make attacking a system more tactical and less lol |
Kagura Nikon
Mentally Assured Destruction The Pursuit of Happiness
2069
|
Posted - 2015.07.24 00:43:43 -
[64] - Quote
Neuntausend wrote:Delt0r Garsk wrote:How the hell can't you get a single cepter? what is hard about killing cepters? Oh they ran away. Doesn't that link thingy have a max range? I don't think anyone's complaining about not being able to defend their space. Sure, a single trollceptor is easy to drive away. It's actually not that hard to defend sov now, given the numbers and activity. The issue is, that it's fairly annoying and not very entertaining.
Because DENY ALL THE CONTENT... tactics taht the coalitiosn were using in dominin sov was incredbly entretaining?
"If brute force does not solve your problem.... then you are surely not using enough!"
For the rest hire PoH |
Recruitment
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Kagura Nikon
Mentally Assured Destruction The Pursuit of Happiness
2069
|
Posted - 2015.07.24 00:47:38 -
[65] - Quote
Diana Nayli wrote:Deck Cadelanne wrote:Diana Nayli wrote: Yeah, we can split fleets, but still nothing will happen.
Split fleets. Give each fleet an entosis link fit ship. Watch as you complete the command node capture really quickly by splitting up and doing several of them at once. Engage brain. Stop being a "but the FC didn't tell me to push F1" lemming. But still, there is NO FUN involved. Yeah, we did it. Every squad had it's own system to hold and capture command node. System succesfully defended without any enemy presence. Congrats. Now we will have great mining/ratting empires all around.
AND WHERE WAS THE FUN BEFORE? BEcause clearly by all researchs that CCP made poeopel were NOT FINDING fun at all to stay docked to deny content. ANd that was the MAJOR tactic in dominion sov.
Face it, in dominion 90% of time you did ABSOLUTELY NOTHING. MOst allainces even did nto expect epopel to log in, the Idea was to eventaullly call them trough a PING!!!
"If brute force does not solve your problem.... then you are surely not using enough!"
For the rest hire PoH |
Recruitment
|
Kagura Nikon
Mentally Assured Destruction The Pursuit of Happiness
2069
|
Posted - 2015.07.24 00:49:04 -
[66] - Quote
Akballah Kassan wrote:Neuntausend wrote:baltec1 wrote:Chased around a Moa cepter gang in my solo mega twice and had great fun doing it. Content hasn't been this easy to come by for years. Have you caught any? (let me answer that: no, they are ******* interceptors) It's great that you are having fun, but you are really easy to entertain. As long as it involves Megathrons, you seem to be happy. I think the difference is he doesn't need to roam in a hundred plus fleet for pvp and have FC make all his decisions for him which as an opponent I respect.
Taht is the whole point. PEople will learn that it is MORE fun if you start actign a bit more by yourself and stop expecting a FC to tell you EVERYTHIGN you need to do.
"If brute force does not solve your problem.... then you are surely not using enough!"
For the rest hire PoH |
Recruitment
|
Vol Arm'OOO
Bagel and Lox
688
|
Posted - 2015.07.24 00:52:29 -
[67] - Quote
Eli Stan wrote:Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Eli Stan wrote:... Just a few seconds worth of work. Over and over again. That is the key thing, the repetition. Everyone is saying, "Don't let small things bother you," but they seem to have never slept in a room with a mosquito many nights running. Oh no! PVP! Multiple times! However will the game survive???
Fozziesov is pvp the same way killing farmers in fw is pvp. Repetitive, boring, pointless. When your enemies have an endless supply of cheap throw away ships, where is the meaning in the combat?
I don't play, I just fourm warrior.
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Delt0r Garsk
Shits N Giggles
416
|
Posted - 2015.07.24 07:45:53 -
[68] - Quote
Vol Arm'OOO wrote:Eli Stan wrote:Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Eli Stan wrote:... Just a few seconds worth of work. Over and over again. That is the key thing, the repetition. Everyone is saying, "Don't let small things bother you," but they seem to have never slept in a room with a mosquito many nights running. Oh no! PVP! Multiple times! However will the game survive??? Fozziesov is pvp the same way killing farmers in fw is pvp. Repetitive, boring, pointless. When your enemies have an endless supply of cheap throw away ships, where is the meaning in the combat? More to the point, now that it seems clear foziesov is not evejesus, what's next? I predict that ccp continues to dumb down the game in a continuing effort to appeal to new players while aggravating old players, which causes a continuing trickle of old players to leave the game which is not counter balanced by any significant numbers of new players. In other words, the slow burn continues. Oh god. We are back to a eve is dying thread now? sheesh.
Death and Glory!
Well fun is also good.
|
Daerrol
Krieger Industries Inc. Phoebe Freeport Republic
196
|
Posted - 2015.07.24 08:46:32 -
[69] - Quote
Aren't entosis links like 20m? Are people entosising you on a regular basis in Condors and ventures? If so, I have a Crusader interceptor pilot I would love to put in your corp and farm these guys. Unlike FW they can't warp out when I warp in, and I get a huge bonus for kiling them
Edit: Entosis links are currently 34m in Jita. So if I kill 1 farmer/trollcondor every 20 minutes I'm getting comparative income to null ratting. Except I can null rat between trollceptor attacks....
The numbers just get mcuh happier if they bring a T2 entosis. |
Renegade Heart
Carebear Miners R Us
512
|
Posted - 2015.07.24 12:33:31 -
[70] - Quote
Vol Arm'OOO wrote:Because whack a mole is fun?
Nobody ever gave two figs for what a couple of frigs did to each other in the backendass of nowhere. Eve has always grown because of the big events such as the br fight which lead to news coverage which lead to new subs.
These tears are very sweet indeed. You are really bad at frigate PvP eh? You could always take a Titan to the battle and show those frigates who is boss!
Perhaps you are too chicken to risk something big? Worried it might turn into another BR fight? Put your supercaps where your mouth is son!
Or you could just quit and give me some nice things that you don't need anymore. |
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Jenshae Chiroptera
2071
|
Posted - 2015.07.24 13:02:48 -
[71] - Quote
Kagura Nikon wrote:Neuntausend wrote:Delt0r Garsk wrote:How the hell can't you get a single cepter? what is hard about killing cepters? Oh they ran away. Doesn't that link thingy have a max range? I don't think anyone's complaining about not being able to defend their space. Sure, a single trollceptor is easy to drive away. It's actually not that hard to defend sov now, given the numbers and activity. The issue is, that it's fairly annoying and not very entertaining. ... because deny all the content... tactics taht the coalitiosn were using in dominin sov was incredbly entretaining? My signature points to a different approach. I think Fozzie's team approached the problem from the wrong direction. Instead of trying to smash apart the coalitions, they could have enabled other groups to grow big enough to actually challenge them for their space.
(Also, Supers and Titans are so common that they could just be heavily nerfed across the board. Less damage output, less need for high eHP structures and less boredom for sub-caps)
CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids
.
High Sec needs a stepping stone to other spaces, where they can grow
Fozzie SOV is treating a symptom.
|
Vic Jefferson
The Greater Goon Clockwork Pineapple
504
|
Posted - 2015.07.24 19:00:35 -
[72] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:I think Fozzie's team approached the problem from the wrong direction. Instead of trying to smash apart the coalitions, they could have enabled other groups to grow big enough to actually challenge them for their space.
On paper, they did. There's plenty of space that could be taken quite readily by small, motivated alliances with lots of dedicated people willing to spend time doing virtual work. What can't be patched, is making people want to do said virtual work.
Vote Vic Jefferson for CSM X
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Globby
Cohenberg's Ethical Hauling CODE.
143
|
Posted - 2015.07.24 19:08:26 -
[73] - Quote
my opinion is changes is good
thanks for listening |
Jenshae Chiroptera
2083
|
Posted - 2015.07.24 19:12:57 -
[74] - Quote
Vic Jefferson wrote:... by small, motivated alliances with ... Why are they small? Why do they stay small?
CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids
.
High Sec needs a stepping stone to other spaces, where they can grow
Fozzie SOV is treating a symptom.
|
Vic Jefferson
The Greater Goon Clockwork Pineapple
505
|
Posted - 2015.07.24 21:08:39 -
[75] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Vic Jefferson wrote:... by small, motivated alliances with ... Why are they small? Why do they stay small?
Simple. Only the best organized and managed entities can survive being big for any appreciable amount of time. There aren't that many people who have the motivation and ability to actually make this sort of thing happen; I believe CCP calls them enablers in their power-point speak. Get more enablers to care about sov if you want to create more, bigger entities. Chances are though, anyone showing promise will find a better deal working for one of the established entities, unless she or he is exceptionally motivated....and currently there's nothing even remotely appealing about sov, at least from my perspective.
It has often been pondered if one were to replay the past 450 million years, if we would end up with a very similar world in terms of the same critters evolving. It has also been pondered, with a more concrete and defensible conclusion, if you reset New Eden, what would happen? Names may be slightly different, but chances are the same personalities and same organizations would rise to, and hold on to power, simply by virtue of the strength of their organizational tools, as those are the primary reason things grow and prosper at that scale. Chance doesn't really play into it that much.
It's not a thing that can be entirely remedied by game mechanics. It's not so much that you cant physically or militarily beat one of of the established entities - far more doable in FozzieSov than it was before. You are also fighting their decade of experience running an alliance/coalition, which is why no new large entities really manifest often, or at least one factor.
Have YOU tried becoming the change it looks like you want to see?
Vote Vic Jefferson for CSM X
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Deck Cadelanne
173
|
Posted - 2015.07.24 21:24:39 -
[76] - Quote
Eli Stan wrote:Diana Nayli wrote:
But still, there is NO FUN involved. Yeah, we did it. Every squad had it's own system to hold and capture command node. System succesfully defended without any enemy presence. Congrats. Now we will have great mining/ratting empires all around.
How'd the capture event get generated in the first place? Why not just kill the Interceptor when it attempts to reinforce the TCU, IHub or Outpost in the first place, rather than wait for the command node spawn even to happen? Undock a Stabber or RLML Caracal, blap the Inty, go back to whatever else you were going. Just a few seconds worth of work.
But...but...they'd have to actually be there to do that...
"When the going gets weird, the weird turn professional."
- Hunter S. Thompson
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Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
6728
|
Posted - 2015.07.25 03:07:50 -
[77] - Quote
Trollsov is the greatest update that really shakes up null...
By the way, we're starting up our program of cooperative coprosperity, check "Sell Orders" subforum for details. Really shaken up null is available...
^^ Delicious goon ((tech nerf, siphon, drone assist, supercap)) tears.
Taking a wrecking ball to the futile hopes and broken dreams of skillless blobbers.
|
Jenshae Chiroptera
2095
|
Posted - 2015.07.25 11:44:25 -
[78] - Quote
Vic Jefferson wrote:... which is why no new large entities really manifest often, or at least one factor. ... You do not think another large factor is a bottle neck? Where the estabilished alliances shut the small ones out unless they join their coalitions?
CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids
.
High Sec needs a stepping stone to other spaces, where they can grow
Fozzie SOV is treating a symptom.
|
Danny Nuttall
Perkone Caldari State
5
|
Posted - 2015.07.25 12:02:18 -
[79] - Quote
i wonder what it would be like if instead of command nodes appearing it was instead facilities in districts on the planets, maybe even get those dust bunnies involved somehow
Aka the MatchMaker
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Harrison Tato
Yamato Holdings
458
|
Posted - 2015.07.25 12:08:59 -
[80] - Quote
TTLTL: DL |
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baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
16437
|
Posted - 2015.07.25 12:24:25 -
[81] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Vic Jefferson wrote:... which is why no new large entities really manifest often, or at least one factor. ... You do not think another large factor is a bottle neck? Where the estabilished alliances shut the small ones out unless they join their coalitions?
This is by far the best chance for smaller groups to gab a chunk of space for the past decade. More changes are due to drop too which will help with that.
Join Bat Country today and defend the Glorious Socialist Dictatorship
|
Jenshae Chiroptera
2095
|
Posted - 2015.07.25 12:42:06 -
[82] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:... This is by far the best chance for smaller groups to gab a chunk of space for the past decade. More changes are due to drop too which will help with that. Don't make that honey trap too sweet. They might grow suspicious.
CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids
.
High Sec needs a stepping stone to other spaces, where they can grow
Fozzie SOV is treating a symptom.
|
Kestral Anneto
The Founding Four Fidelas Constans
102
|
Posted - 2015.07.25 13:04:55 -
[83] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Vic Jefferson wrote:... which is why no new large entities really manifest often, or at least one factor. ... You do not think another large factor is a bottle neck? Where the estabilished alliances shut the small ones out unless they join their coalitions? This is by far the best chance for smaller groups to gab a chunk of space for the past decade. More changes are due to drop too which will help with that.
your kididng, right? the entire point is to hold the grid while the Magic Sov Wand waves. it basically boils down to attrition and man power, and the larger entities in Nullsec can throw a lot more meat into the grinder than and small high or lowsec entity.
This picture is getting spread until Fozzie come down and rolls back the FozzieSov
http://puu.sh/j0jX9/92e94d8a2d.jpg
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baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
16438
|
Posted - 2015.07.25 13:22:18 -
[84] - Quote
Kestral Anneto wrote:
your kididng, right? the entire point is to hold the grid while the Magic Sov Wand waves. it basically boils down to attrition and man power, and the larger entities in Nullsec can throw a lot more meat into the grinder than and small high or lowsec entity.
Blobs are too big an unwieldy for this kind of sov game, small gangs are all the rage and upcoming changes are only going to make them better. You might not have much luck with the fortress that is goondor but fountain on the other hand...
Join Bat Country today and defend the Glorious Socialist Dictatorship
|
baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
16438
|
Posted - 2015.07.25 13:28:02 -
[85] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:baltec1 wrote:... This is by far the best chance for smaller groups to gab a chunk of space for the past decade. More changes are due to drop too which will help with that. Don't make that honey trap too sweet. They might grow suspicious.
Who could be suspicious with our fantastic offer of live in pureblind and reap the rewards of fozziesov, living next to the most secure space in all of nullsec. Why, miners from across highsec who say that null is more secure than highsec should jump at our offer of protection and "mad roids" as far as the eye can see and all of your mining help to defend our space. Work Sets You Free.
Join Bat Country today and defend the Glorious Socialist Dictatorship
|
Kestral Anneto
The Founding Four Fidelas Constans
102
|
Posted - 2015.07.25 13:29:50 -
[86] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Kestral Anneto wrote:
your kididng, right? the entire point is to hold the grid while the Magic Sov Wand waves. it basically boils down to attrition and man power, and the larger entities in Nullsec can throw a lot more meat into the grinder than and small high or lowsec entity.
Blobs are too big an unwieldy for this kind of sov game, small gangs are all the rage and upcoming changes are only going to make them better. You might not have much luck with the fortress that is goondor but fountain on the other hand...
they have basically turned sov warefare into faction warefare, and a blob can split into mini-blobs to control the grid of each plex.
turning sov warefare into small gang stuff is the biggest mistake that CCP has made, in my opinion. Sov warfare, and controling space, should be the domain of big fleets, with capital support, not a bunch of ceptors and cruisers. If people wanted small gang content, they would go on roams and do faction warfare. its that simple.
This picture is getting spread until Fozzie come down and rolls back the FozzieSov
http://puu.sh/j0jX9/92e94d8a2d.jpg
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Kiandoshia
Applied Anarchy SpaceMonkey's Alliance
2306
|
Posted - 2015.07.25 13:40:39 -
[87] - Quote
Diana Nayli wrote:Rowells wrote:so, you say you tried to adapt, yet you mention you used the same tactics as before...
pick one May I ask you, what do YOU like about that sov system? DO you enjoy chasing few frigates for whole night?
It's only for four hours a day but yes, I agree, it is dumb. But I don't blame CCP for that. I blame the people who still form blobs of **** to go and try to outblob three frigates :D |
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
6728
|
Posted - 2015.07.25 13:51:10 -
[88] - Quote
Kestral Anneto wrote:turning sov warefare into small gang stuff is the biggest mistake that CCP has made, in my opinion. Sov warfare, and controling space, should be the domain of big fleets, with capital support, not a bunch of ceptors and cruisers. If people wanted small gang content, they would go on roams and do faction warfare. its that simple. You see, it would appear that...
Kestral Anneto wrote:big fleets, with capital support, not a bunch of ceptors and cruisers. There's a fundamental disagreement between you and ccps vision of nullsec
^^ Delicious goon ((tech nerf, siphon, drone assist, supercap)) tears.
Taking a wrecking ball to the futile hopes and broken dreams of skillless blobbers.
|
Kestral Anneto
The Founding Four Fidelas Constans
102
|
Posted - 2015.07.25 14:24:25 -
[89] - Quote
Alavaria Fera wrote:Kestral Anneto wrote:turning sov warefare into small gang stuff is the biggest mistake that CCP has made, in my opinion. Sov warfare, and controling space, should be the domain of big fleets, with capital support, not a bunch of ceptors and cruisers. If people wanted small gang content, they would go on roams and do faction warfare. its that simple. You see, it would appear that... Kestral Anneto wrote:big fleets, with capital support, not a bunch of ceptors and cruisers. There's a fundamental disagreement between you and ccps vision of nullsec
thats because, as i have said before, CCP have started to buckle under their own hubris.
This picture is getting spread until Fozzie come down and rolls back the FozzieSov
http://puu.sh/j0jX9/92e94d8a2d.jpg
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Jenshae Chiroptera
2098
|
Posted - 2015.07.25 14:43:20 -
[90] - Quote
10 vs 100 Even if the 100 split into 10s to go to 10 nodes, they will still beat the 10 attackers, most of the time because they can hold them until another group arrives or just kill the attacking 10 because they have split into 1s to go wave their wands at each node.
N+1 still wins.
CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids
.
High Sec needs a stepping stone to other spaces, where they can grow
Fozzie SOV is treating a symptom.
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White Tree
Love Squad Confederation of xXPIZZAXx
932
|
Posted - 2015.07.25 14:56:26 -
[91] - Quote
In fairness this new sov system is some no fun allowed garbo lmao.
Former member of CSM6.
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Kagura Nikon
Mentally Assured Destruction The Pursuit of Happiness
2069
|
Posted - 2015.07.25 15:42:18 -
[92] - Quote
Kestral Anneto wrote:baltec1 wrote:Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Vic Jefferson wrote:... which is why no new large entities really manifest often, or at least one factor. ... You do not think another large factor is a bottle neck? Where the estabilished alliances shut the small ones out unless they join their coalitions? This is by far the best chance for smaller groups to gab a chunk of space for the past decade. More changes are due to drop too which will help with that. your kididng, right? the entire point is to hold the grid while the Magic Sov Wand waves. it basically boils down to attrition and man power, and the larger entities in Nullsec can throw a lot more meat into the grinder than and small high or lowsec entity.
Completely WRONG. It bouls down to the number of people WILLING to undock!! And willing to operate in a semi autonomous way.
Having 4 times as much peopel as your enemy is not 100% victory chance as it used to be. IT is still an advntage, but not an automatic win.
"If brute force does not solve your problem.... then you are surely not using enough!"
For the rest hire PoH |
Recruitment
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Kestral Anneto
The Founding Four Fidelas Constans
102
|
Posted - 2015.07.25 15:52:32 -
[93] - Quote
Kagura Nikon wrote:Kestral Anneto wrote:baltec1 wrote:Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Vic Jefferson wrote:... which is why no new large entities really manifest often, or at least one factor. ... You do not think another large factor is a bottle neck? Where the estabilished alliances shut the small ones out unless they join their coalitions? This is by far the best chance for smaller groups to gab a chunk of space for the past decade. More changes are due to drop too which will help with that. your kididng, right? the entire point is to hold the grid while the Magic Sov Wand waves. it basically boils down to attrition and man power, and the larger entities in Nullsec can throw a lot more meat into the grinder than and small high or lowsec entity. Completely WRONG. It bouls down to the number of people WILLING to undock!! And willing to operate in a semi autonomous way. Having 4 times as much peopel as your enemy is not 100% victory chance as it used to be. IT is still an advntage, but not an automatic win.
no it doesn't, because you cannot factor in peope that will just sit in station. the people that are on grid fighting are the people that matter. It doesn't matter how many times you split the grid, if the opposition has more forces, then they stand a much better chance of winning. If the opposition have 4x the number of craft on grid as you do, then they will be able to maintain a higher number of Magic Sov Wands on the target than you can. After that, its simple attrition, and the side with more man power will win.
This picture is getting spread until Fozzie come down and rolls back the FozzieSov
http://puu.sh/j0jX9/92e94d8a2d.jpg
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Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
6729
|
Posted - 2015.07.26 03:53:50 -
[94] - Quote
White Tree wrote:In fairness this new sov system is some no fun allowed garbo lmao. But you can use sov lasers, those are really fun :)
^^ Delicious goon ((tech nerf, siphon, drone assist, supercap)) tears.
Taking a wrecking ball to the futile hopes and broken dreams of skillless blobbers.
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Eli Stan
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
253
|
Posted - 2015.07.26 04:23:17 -
[95] - Quote
Kestral Anneto wrote:baltec1 wrote:Kestral Anneto wrote:
your kididng, right? the entire point is to hold the grid while the Magic Sov Wand waves. it basically boils down to attrition and man power, and the larger entities in Nullsec can throw a lot more meat into the grinder than and small high or lowsec entity.
Blobs are too big an unwieldy for this kind of sov game, small gangs are all the rage and upcoming changes are only going to make them better. You might not have much luck with the fortress that is goondor but fountain on the other hand... they have basically turned sov warefare into faction warefare, and a blob can split into mini-blobs to control the grid of each plex. turning sov warefare into small gang stuff is the biggest mistake that CCP has made, in my opinion. Sov warfare, and controling space, should be the domain of big fleets, with capital support, not a bunch of ceptors and cruisers. If people wanted small gang content, they would go on roams and do faction warfare. its that simple.
SOV warfare IS the domain of big fleets with capital support - but only IF both parties truly want the space being contested. Take an Interceptor to YA0 and see what happens. (You won't be able to win SOV.) Take an armor HAC fleet to YA0 and see what happens. (You won't be able to take SOV.) Drop dreads in YA0 - still no SOV. Jump in more Titans than Goons have, with overwhelming dread and carrier support, sub cap support, proper tactics - and you'll be able to take their SOV. (Obviously nobody has such a force, of course.)
The issue that Fozziesov solves is that large alliances can hold and defend systems without ever jumping in a single ship because the massive HP grind that taking SOV requires. No small group is going to risk dreads to get it done. But now small groups can take SOV with a frigate assuming nobody bothers to contest them. THATs the SOV that small groups will be taking - the SOV that large groups can't be arsed to defend because it's not important to them. That's SOV they took because they could, not because they needed it.
If a small group working with frigs takes SOV, then a group willing to deploy caps decide they want to live there - the small group will not stand a chance, as the larger group will also start with small ships for mobility of course but then will always be able to out-escalate the defenders as fights develop.
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Hands Tolen
University of Caille Gallente Federation
1
|
Posted - 2015.07.26 04:44:04 -
[96] - Quote
Seems like there's a lot of :mad: from the bittervets over needing to log in and do something besides a bi-monthly show of force from the supercapbois. The funny thing about the :content: narrative is that large fleet battles don't require sov. or any objective in particular. You didnt get the BR bloodbath because dominion sov was so amazing and fertile, you got it because two monster super-owning entities decided to drain their blue balls on one system to see who was the better beast.
Players expecting Imperium or PL/NC. to commit to anything on that scale ~because fozziesov~ are idiots and so are the players whinging that said commitment would have happened if only we'd still got dominion around. The ball bags of the goon and pl directorate are hard at work making content for their members, but it's for their members, not you random scrublords. If you can't beat them and don't want to join them, it's time for you to sit down and wait for them to bring the content. CCP, try as they might, cannot force the hand of entrenched coalition leaders.
You'll get your gudfites, but unless you put in the same kind of monolithic effort that hundreds of major coalition members put in daily, you won't be getting the gudfites when or where you want them. |
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp Vae. Victis.
6280
|
Posted - 2015.07.26 17:46:21 -
[97] - Quote
Hmmm, I rather thought the whole point of allowing sov lasers on anything was precisely to allow harassment of a large empire in area's that they eventually would decide was not worth defending.
If it's not a system your people live in (and can thus easily defend from harassment), or at least in close proximity to one, then you have to make that decision as to whether that system is worth the effort. Previously, no effort was involved to keep it (it couldn't be effectively put at risk of losing without a major force), the only effort involved was for the person wanting to take it.
I realize people don't like losing what the have claimed as their own for so long, but if you aren't actively utilizing that space it should easily be put at risk. Eventually you'll make those hard decisions, and start reducing the size of your territory to something you can actually manage (and make use of).
You should also probably recognize that if a big fight hasn't come your way under the present system, it certainly wouldn't have come your way under the old one during the same time period... and your large fleet would still not have been utilized.
Unless, of course, you actually went and seriously attacked someone.
Perhaps once you lose those fringe territories and smaller groups move in you'll have something you feel confident moving that large fleet to engage.
View the latest EVE Online developments and other game related news and gameplay by visiting Ranger 1 Presents: Virtual Realms.
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M1k3y Koontz
Respawn Disabled Initiative Mercenaries
766
|
Posted - 2015.07.26 21:21:31 -
[98] - Quote
Diana Nayli wrote:Empires weren't prepared for that style of playing.
Good, that's the idea.
Diana Nayli wrote: I would recommend changing some stuff about entosis links, like only capitals can fit them.
CCP said they won't do this. No ship restrictions because it forces players to use certain metas, which they want to avoid, and capitals because it increases the entry barrier significantly.
Diana Nayli wrote: Now I'm really missing long structure grinding with 1-hour long elevator music loop....
That hasn't changed. Now instead of bringing lots of T1 ammo you have 10 guys bring entosis links.
How much herp could a herp derp derp if a herp derp could herp derp.
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M1k3y Koontz
Respawn Disabled Initiative Mercenaries
766
|
Posted - 2015.07.26 21:42:48 -
[99] - Quote
Alavaria Fera wrote:Trollsov is the greatest update that really shakes up null...
By the way, we're starting up our program of cooperative coprosperity, check "Sell Orders" subforum for details. Really shaken up null is available...
Nothing con stop a well oiled corporate machine...
How much herp could a herp derp derp if a herp derp could herp derp.
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M1k3y Koontz
Respawn Disabled Initiative Mercenaries
766
|
Posted - 2015.07.26 21:49:37 -
[100] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Kestral Anneto wrote:
your kididng, right? the entire point is to hold the grid while the Magic Sov Wand waves. it basically boils down to attrition and man power, and the larger entities in Nullsec can throw a lot more meat into the grinder than and small high or lowsec entity.
Blobs are too big an unwieldy for this kind of sov game, small gangs are all the rage and upcoming changes are only going to make them better. You might not have much luck with the fortress that is goondor but fountain on the other hand...
10 Arty Cynabals 5 Entosis Interceptors (Fit with T1 entosis links, run if something capable of killing you shows up) 1 Rapier 1 Arazu ~3 Scimi's (Optional)
Congratulations, you can now take space.
Fast response is now more important than overwhelming force. EVE's history closely mirrors that of the real world's, and now we have finally reached the era of insurgencies fighting massive empires.
How much herp could a herp derp derp if a herp derp could herp derp.
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Jenshae Chiroptera
2110
|
Posted - 2015.07.26 23:46:06 -
[101] - Quote
Best long term tactics is still to just let them take the space, then keep griefing them by spawning loads of nodes until they give up and leave.
CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids
.
High Sec needs a stepping stone to other spaces, where they can grow
Fozzie SOV is treating a symptom.
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Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
6729
|
Posted - 2015.07.27 03:00:13 -
[102] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Best long term tactics is still to just let them take the space, then keep griefing them by spawning loads of nodes until they give up and leave. Yes... sounds about right for trollsov.
^^ Delicious goon ((tech nerf, siphon, drone assist, supercap)) tears.
Taking a wrecking ball to the futile hopes and broken dreams of skillless blobbers.
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M1k3y Koontz
Respawn Disabled Initiative Mercenaries
766
|
Posted - 2015.07.27 12:56:25 -
[103] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Best long term tactics is still to just let them take the space, then keep griefing them by spawning loads of nodes until they give up and leave.
If the indexes are high it'll take an hour to reinforce the ihub/station/TCU. If nobody can be bothered to drive off the hostile interceptor or other ship in their space in that time frame (which everyone would want to anyway because ratting with a neut in local is a bad idea) then what are they doing?
If indexes are low, yes, there will be tons of nodes spawning. But then you aren't using that space, so why do you want it? Harassment is the best way to take space, but it's more difficult to harass space that is actually useful to the owners.
How much herp could a herp derp derp if a herp derp could herp derp.
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Vol Arm'OOO
Bagel and Lox
694
|
Posted - 2015.07.27 13:10:16 -
[104] - Quote
Kagura Nikon wrote:Kestral Anneto wrote:baltec1 wrote:Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Vic Jefferson wrote:... which is why no new large entities really manifest often, or at least one factor. ... You do not think another large factor is a bottle neck? Where the estabilished alliances shut the small ones out unless they join their coalitions? This is by far the best chance for smaller groups to gab a chunk of space for the past decade. More changes are due to drop too which will help with that. your kididng, right? the entire point is to hold the grid while the Magic Sov Wand waves. it basically boils down to attrition and man power, and the larger entities in Nullsec can throw a lot more meat into the grinder than and small high or lowsec entity. Completely WRONG. It bouls down to the number of people WILLING to undock!! And willing to operate in a semi autonomous way. Having 4 times as much peopel as your enemy is not 100% victory chance as it used to be. IT is still an advntage, but not an automatic win.
thats always been the case. In the old days, folk stayed docked and denied fights because their folk were unwilling to die repeatedly in a meat grinder. Now folk stayed docked and deny fights because the system is unfun. The comparisons to fw are apropo - - in fact, the new sov mechanics are as if they made hunting fw farmers mandatory - ofc hunting fw farmers is frustrating and unfulfilling - and so is hunting trollceptors.
I don't play, I just fourm warrior.
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Kagura Nikon
Mentally Assured Destruction The Pursuit of Happiness
2071
|
Posted - 2015.07.29 10:09:29 -
[105] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Vic Jefferson wrote:... by small, motivated alliances with ... Why are they small? Why do they stay small?
Because they do NOT WANT TO become huge. The vast majority of peopel that leave null sec do it because they do nto want to be in HUGE groups where they are nameless drones.
"If brute force does not solve your problem.... then you are surely not using enough!"
For the rest hire PoH |
Recruitment
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Kagura Nikon
Mentally Assured Destruction The Pursuit of Happiness
2071
|
Posted - 2015.07.29 10:12:31 -
[106] - Quote
Vol Arm'OOO wrote:
thats always been the case. In the old days, folk stayed docked and denied fights because their folk were unwilling to die repeatedly in a meat grinder. Now folk stayed docked and deny fights because the system is unfun. The comparisons to fw are apropo - - in fact, the new sov mechanics are as if they made hunting fw farmers mandatory - ofc hunting fw farmers is frustrating and unfulfilling - and so is hunting trollceptors.
What is so hard to kill a ceptor that cannot warp of and need to stay CLOSE to a structure because the range of the entosis link is small and a frigate cannot fit the t2 version?
How hard is to undock a single damm rapier?
If you cannot have 1 people for each enemy that is in your system, then indeed they are controlling the system, and that is the very goal of the mechanic. IF you have more people than they do, why in hell you do not kill them? A few interceptors are EXTREMELY easy to kill if you have a few ships fitted to do so. Soon people will stop doing that when it becomes non productive.
"If brute force does not solve your problem.... then you are surely not using enough!"
For the rest hire PoH |
Recruitment
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Jenshae Chiroptera
2132
|
Posted - 2015.07.29 10:22:22 -
[107] - Quote
Kagura Nikon wrote:...The vast majority of peopel that leave null sec ... Wrong way around.
CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids
.
High Sec needs a stepping stone to other spaces, where they can grow
Fozzie SOV is treating a symptom.
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Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
6732
|
Posted - 2015.07.29 11:15:17 -
[108] - Quote
Kagura Nikon wrote:Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Vic Jefferson wrote:... by small, motivated alliances with ... Why are they small? Why do they stay small? Because they do NOT WANT TO become huge. The vast majority of peopel that leave null sec do it because they do nto want to be in HUGE groups where they are nameless drones. The vast majority of people that enter nullsec also want to be in huge groups, that's how they got huge.
^^ Delicious goon ((tech nerf, siphon, drone assist, supercap)) tears.
Taking a wrecking ball to the futile hopes and broken dreams of skillless blobbers.
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Vol Arm'OOO
Bagel and Lox
694
|
Posted - 2015.07.29 13:34:45 -
[109] - Quote
Kagura Nikon wrote:Vol Arm'OOO wrote:
thats always been the case. In the old days, folk stayed docked and denied fights because their folk were unwilling to die repeatedly in a meat grinder. Now folk stayed docked and deny fights because the system is unfun. The comparisons to fw are apropo - - in fact, the new sov mechanics are as if they made hunting fw farmers mandatory - ofc hunting fw farmers is frustrating and unfulfilling - and so is hunting trollceptors.
What is so hard to kill a ceptor that cannot warp of and need to stay CLOSE to a structure because the range of the entosis link is small and a frigate cannot fit the t2 version? How hard is to undock a single damm rapier? If you cannot have 1 people for each enemy that is in your system, then indeed they are controlling the system, and that is the very goal of the mechanic. IF you have more people than they do, why in hell you do not kill them? A few interceptors are EXTREMELY easy to kill if you have a few ships fitted to do so. Soon people will stop doing that when it becomes non productive.
You miss the point. It is not hard to kill a ceptor, just as it is not hard to kill a fw farmer. Its just unfun to do so. Making it mandatory to kill a small, throw away ship, over and over again is the definition of unfun.
I don't play, I just fourm warrior.
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Panthe3 Black
The Branded Few Test Alliance Please Ignore
1
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Posted - 2015.07.29 18:06:51 -
[110] - Quote
The new sov is like FW but without lp. Everyone drop sov and join FW. = profit |
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Pah Cova
Made in Portugal S.A.
13
|
Posted - 2015.07.30 00:56:18 -
[111] - Quote
Eureka, everybody have discoreved the powder plans.
Fozzie-¦s sov = Low sec FW
Guess that was obvious when CCP releases that, but people, as always, try to see what dosent exist. CCP have reduced their funds and of course servers have been reduced too, so its just not possible to them to suatain a 5.000 player battle in the same system with tons of drones etc, its no fun at all when someone enters that system and get freezed for 10 ou more minutes. So they have to do something to split the palyers and end that big battles turning them into small roams. However FW is not the best choice from far, but guess that was lazzy from the dev-¦s or they just want to give quickly content on pvp just because to many people are tired to shoot structures and want some change.
Before people stay docked and dosent show up to fight, now they do the same or the attacker-¦s do it. Before the capital nerf, roaming people have some to shoot near, now they have to fly empty and empty systems with nobody there or if is someone, probably is an hs explorer, no pvp at all except in a few systems.
WH-¦s are dead, nobody cares about them, theres a few corps living there but nothing compared to what it was 2 years ago, thats why they put some sleeper data sites in hs, low sec and null, however they have been nerf this sites, and now the riks dosent worth the effort to find them and run them.
Guess CCP as to realise first, that EVE is a game, EVE dosent pay the RL bills, players as RL and they work, most of the players has 2/4 hours a day to play, if they have to spend all that time on defending their sov, so its fair to say that they have to pay for the month and then pay for some plexes to sell on market to buy ships, modules and whatever they need.
Now they talk about citadels that can be destroyed. This is another big mistake or better, another shot on their foot. The citadels seems to me that they will be what null sec stations now shloud be years ago. If hs stations as weapons and police to defend them, null sec stations should have waepons too.
Mining Structures, lol, guess what, theres no miners anymore, they get tired and warpout to another free game.
CCP wants new players, but i guess the magic formula has been lost 3 or 4 years ago, first they have to keep all the players happy, not only a few ones, then those happy players are going to bring some friends and the comercials does the rest. Changes are needed yes, but not too many changes at one time and specially not to many impopular changes.
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Commander Spurty
Dimension Door We need wards.
1533
|
Posted - 2015.07.30 10:53:19 -
[112] - Quote
You sat in a pos like a good sheep
Someone has not adapted
Baaa baaa baaa
This is comedy gold
There are good ships
And wood ships
And ships that sail the sea
But the best ships are
Spaceships
Built by CCP
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Spurty
Dimension Door We need wards.
1534
|
Posted - 2015.07.30 10:53:19 -
[113] - Quote
You sat in a pos like a good sheep
Someone has not adapted
Baaa baaa baaa
This is comedy gold
There are good ships
And wood ships
And ships that sail the sea
But the best ships are
Spaceships
Built by CCP
|
Commander Spurty
Dimension Door We need wards.
1533
|
Posted - 2015.07.30 10:56:46 -
[114] - Quote
I actually have an inkling of pity for you.
http://evemaps.dotlan.net/alliance/memberCount
Find your alliance.
Wardec / invade the sov holding entity above yours.
If they are blue, please "adapt".
I only said please. There was no mandate. Your play time is your responsibility mate
There are good ships
And wood ships
And ships that sail the sea
But the best ships are
Spaceships
Built by CCP
|
Spurty
Dimension Door We need wards.
1534
|
Posted - 2015.07.30 10:56:46 -
[115] - Quote
I actually have an inkling of pity for you.
http://evemaps.dotlan.net/alliance/memberCount
Find your alliance.
Wardec / invade the sov holding entity above yours.
If they are blue, please "adapt".
I only said please. There was no mandate. Your play time is your responsibility mate
There are good ships
And wood ships
And ships that sail the sea
But the best ships are
Spaceships
Built by CCP
|
Ugly Eric
Fistful of Finns Triumvirate.
103
|
Posted - 2015.07.30 13:34:51 -
[116] - Quote
When the Entosis mechanics were announced I was hyped. At last thing's going to change! When the entosis mechanics were launched, I was devastated. Really, 1 hour sovbeaming a structure noone appears to defend? When I have played the mechanics for few weeks I have reached the conclusion that the mechanics itself is mostly good, but we, the players are bad.
We still have the dominion sov mindset. Lot of us having vast amounts of un-used space, that is easy to troll. That creating ton's of timers and even more of command nodes to capture with most times noone harrassing at.
The problem is us players having too much space. My alliance TRI is having almost one region worth of space, where 2 constellations is what we actually could keep up easily. We the players should start dropping unused space. We should keep only the systems/constellations/regions we actually use and can keep up. Systems with high index multipliers are not getting harrassed, and thus are not gettin unimportant entosis attempts. With us, the sovholding alliances, dropping unused space, would give opportunities for other alliances to get into sovgame. With more alliances in the sovgame, we would get more content for us all. With more content, we get more fun. With more fun, we get more and more ppl logging in.
I agree the mechanics should need some minor tweaking, but it's sound in the mainlines. What is wrong, is us, the players. We'd need to change our mindsets from the dominion sov model to a completely new and alien model of fighting. This is hard for many groups. Even the most hardcore elite pew alliances can just barely do it.
So all of ya sovholding alliances, let the un-used space u hold drop. Someone will eventually move in and thus create content for u guys. |
Pah Cova
Made in Portugal S.A.
13
|
Posted - 2015.07.30 16:53:50 -
[117] - Quote
Ugly, forget that.
Nobody wnats to see their daily activities constantly disrupted everyday. The unused space you refer, should be the one-¦s that nobody wants rigth? Those -0.1 -0.2 systems. Some years ago all the systems provide good ratting, and good explorer/combat sites, now its only the true sec ones. When CCP put the anomalies by constellation instead of the upgraded system, nobody buy those upgrades, specially just because the upgraded system has none amomalies and they are given anomalies to others. I-¦ve upgraded one system once and in 3 months i get 3 anomalies and 2 of them was low sec anomalies, but the other systems on constellation has 3/4 anomalies everydays, do you think that is fair? I dont think so, for me the previous version was very good, you upgrade your system, you collect that benefit, not others. The same are applied for the quantum flux generators however this special one-¦s upgrades should be visible for all corps in the alliance or remove them from the ihub and make a new structure/beacon, you put them in your system, should be only your problem and not others problem.
People are just not going null with this fozzies-¦s troll sov mechanics, its not the players, its the mechanics.
2 years ago you have huge fights, big losses, now you have small fights and ridiculous losses, just frigs, ceptors and some cruisers. You think its better now? Ok, if so enjoy it, I dont think that way.
Even if they unnerf the capitals or at least the sub capitals just to allow transports from null to hs and vice-versa, people just not go on null due this sov mechanics, they prefer the wild farwest of hs. Better to stay in hs with nothing to lose and go on null just to disrupt activities just for troll, thats what this new sov mechanics is, troll sov. If you cant make money on null, you cant afford to pay your sov bills and you cant have ships to fight, of course unless you buy plexes and sell them on market.
Many people like to shoot things, many people likes to mine, many people likes to explore, many people likes pve and the many people that only makes pvp, thinks that all the players should do the same as they do. Why? What if CCP makes a new expansion where there are no pvp at all, the pvpeers aren-¦t going to be happy with that right? The fun of this game are on you can do whatever you want, pvp, pve, mine, explorer and so on, some say pvp is not fun, ok they have other activities they can do, anothers say mine is not fun, thats ok too, theres more activities, why should everything resumes on the end to pvp? Its cool i like it but theres much more then that.
Mobility are needed on this game, there-¦s no mobility and even if the troll sov change to something much better and fair, people are not going to move into null, they just cant move their assets, and with the ghost of the new destructible citadels aproaching, forget, no one wants to go there and lose their assets.
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Jenn aSide
Smokin Aces.
12002
|
Posted - 2015.07.30 17:28:33 -
[118] - Quote
I understand what people are saying when they say it's too early to tell. I didn't like the idea of Fozzie sov so i've been extra careful to actually observe it in action taking that pre-existing dislike into account.
That being said, I've now had a few experiences with 'Fozzie Sov', been in a few save fleets, and a few 'lets reinforce stuff' fleets in Wicked Creek, Detorid and Scalding Pass.
So far it's not been almost any kind of fun, it's been a bunch of sitting around doing nothing while others SovBeam stuff, or rushing 3-4 jumps to save one of our Entosisers from something that we can't catch or kill, or fighting skirmishes against people in 'slippery pete' style tengus (ok, I admit, killing them with tornadoes that one time was kind of fun).
In dominion sov at least you got to shoot something, or get some structure killmails. As useless and boring as that was, it was more fun that orbiting a gate while some dude sovlasers some crap because the people that reinforced the thing you are defending doesn't really want the space.
The problem with Fozzie sov is that it's like small gang focused, as if it' was trying to import the low sec way of life to null. If I wanted skirmishes and small gang stuff i would have stay in low, what I liked about null was fleet action. I haven't seen a Capital ship in a long time now.
Overall I'm still haivng fun in EVE and in null, there is PVE and Defense fleets and i join the occasional hot drop/wormhole drop fleet, but that fun used to be punctuated by the occasional FLEET FIGHT, now that isn't happening, at least where I'm at.
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Jenshae Chiroptera
2139
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Posted - 2015.07.30 17:41:22 -
[119] - Quote
If a small alliance takes less used systems, they set themselves up to be farmed and griefed. It suits the large alliances that live nearby.
CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids
.
High Sec needs a stepping stone to other spaces, where they can grow
Fozzie SOV is treating a symptom.
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Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat Working Stiffs
5143
|
Posted - 2015.07.30 18:01:10 -
[120] - Quote
Park a Scorpion on your station, ihub, and TCU during their vulnerability window. Troll-ceptors no longer a problem.
It doesn't have to kill it, but it can break entosis lock out to the hard-lock range limit, and it has at least a few minutes to obtain a lock on the small sig. |
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Jenshae Chiroptera
2139
|
Posted - 2015.07.31 00:27:28 -
[121] - Quote
How long before that scorpion is hot dropped?
CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids
.
High Sec needs a stepping stone to other spaces, where they can grow
Fozzie SOV is treating a symptom.
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Frostys Virpio
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
2072
|
Posted - 2015.07.31 01:48:52 -
[122] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:How long before that scorpion is hot dropped?
That hot drop will be damn more commited to where they are right now than a 4km/s inty so you might get a fight.
Might is the keyword of course. |
Delt0r Garsk
Shits N Giggles
422
|
Posted - 2015.07.31 07:05:43 -
[123] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:How long before that scorpion is hot dropped? You mean to say, there is a counter to the counter? Well Duh. That is the point. Cepters have easy counters as just pointed out (hell if your on a budget, go blackbird).
The point is that if you can't be bothered undocking, you can't be bothered keeping sov. Before fozzie sov, huge sections of sov space was totaly and completely empty. I was getting my pod out of paragon sol, 50 jumps of null and not getting contested even once. But even as empty as it was, taking that sov back was near impossible without a **** ton of dreads+support.
Not now, now you can't have empty unused sov. That is the point. If sov is not worth the undock.. then you don't get to keep sov.
Death and Glory!
Well fun is also good.
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Di Mulle
108
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Posted - 2015.07.31 11:59:45 -
[124] - Quote
Dante Cirrus wrote:I should first point out from the outset that these thoughts are my own, based on my personal observations, and in no way reflect the thought of the corp or alliance I happen to be a memeber of ...
Why Fozzie soft has totally failed in its goals:
Has Fozzie soft made it easier to claim nullsec space? Yes, if it is completely undefended.
However if it IS defended.. the little guy has no chance still.. he has to try to capture many nodes in systems spread across an entire constellation. If someone should want to hold another system or 3 in that constellation.. Well too bad.. you got to go into that hostile space to claim a system up to 9 jumps away! The small guy has no chance if there is any sort of defence This = fail of the goals stated.
Has Fozzie soft made null sec sov mechanics better? Hell No.. Sov mechanics are now as boring as hell.. chasing nodes with 'ceptors across 10 systems with ZERO pay off if the attacker cannot mount a decent attack is bullshit.. All Fozzie soft has done is to make it possible for a single player to hold an alliance of hundreds or thousands of PLAYERS to ransom for a couple of hours..
Has this improved player content? resoundingly .. NO.. it is no fun to have many pilots on standby "in case" the attackers mean business while 20 interceptors clean up the vomitous nodes that spawn.. NO ONE enjoys this..
Etc etc etc.....
The post contradicts itself in so many ways I find it is hard to decide is it funny or is it deadly boring.
<<Insert some waste of screen space here>>
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Akballah Kassan
Zeura Brotherhood Mordus Angels
12
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Posted - 2015.07.31 12:17:19 -
[125] - Quote
We had an entosis skirmish that escalated last night.
We started off in sniper Corms as we were entosising an IHUB. We killed a Maulus and jamming interceptor that tried to disrupt our operation. Then Goons escalated and brought a Caracal fleet, a harpy fleet and a mixed bag fleet. We burned back to our staging system and reshipped into Cerbs with Logi looking to try and defend our entosis ships and were doing well till Goons escalated with 2 Titans and a dozen or so carriers.
We still had fun though, no major head on fight but several skirmishes and a few good kills (including t2 cyno fit cruisers).
A few of our guys were complaining about overkill from Goons but if they have Titans and are prepared to throw them on grid fair play IMO. If they'd have stuck with the cruiser and Frig fleets we would have taken the fight but as always with CFC the strategic objective is far more important then any 'good fight'. |
Nou Mene
Out of Focus Odin's Call
6
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Posted - 2015.07.31 17:21:03 -
[126] - Quote
Vol Arm'OOO wrote: You miss the point. It is not hard to kill a ceptor, just as it is not hard to kill a fw farmer. Its just unfun to do so. Making it mandatory to kill a small, throw away ship, over and over again is the definition of unfun.
i completely lose the point...
First, i want to know whats so interesting to do in your Null Sec that makes hunting ceptors "unfun", i can hardly imagine a DAILY more engaging activity.
Second, as someone pointed, if every entosis link (t1) is around 35m, then every 2 ceptor killed you expect to get 35m on loot. If the problem (during your SHORT vulneravility window) is so acute then is a pretty profitable activity.
Third, you shouldnt be hunting them, if it is in your system. Warp once in an hour (good indexes) to kill the ceptor, there are many options to kill them quite quickly. (HINT: t3d work wonders). If is an empty system, working as intended: the system has no value for you, you should lose it.
Fourth, if the big groups have hundreds or thousands of pilots, just form an anti-ceptor (or similar) group to keep things going, flying light. Pay them if you want. Carebears can keep doing their own stuff. If the "trolling" faction really wants sov, they are going to bring bigger assets, you will have bigger fights.
Finally, all this makes forming an ANTI-CEPTOR MERCENARY CORP (ACMC) [just coining the term] a really tempting idea. |
Jenshae Chiroptera
2142
|
Posted - 2015.08.01 01:52:32 -
[127] - Quote
Delt0r Garsk wrote:... That is the point. If sov is not worth the undock.. ... The interceptor(s) are not worth the undock / reship.
CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids
.
High Sec needs a stepping stone to other spaces, where they can grow
Fozzie SOV is treating a symptom.
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Eli Stan
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
262
|
Posted - 2015.08.01 06:03:34 -
[128] - Quote
Akballah Kassan wrote:We had an entosis skirmish that escalated last night.
We started off in sniper Corms as we were entosising an IHUB. We killed a Maulus and jamming interceptor that tried to disrupt our operation. Then Goons escalated and brought a Caracal fleet, a harpy fleet and a mixed bag fleet. We burned back to our staging system and reshipped into Cerbs with Logi looking to try and defend our entosis ships and were doing well till Goons escalated with 2 Titans and a dozen or so carriers.
We still had fun though, no major head on fight but several skirmishes and a few good kills (including t2 cyno fit cruisers).
A few of our guys were complaining about overkill from Goons but if they have Titans and are prepared to throw them on grid fair play IMO. If they'd have stuck with the cruiser and Frig fleets we would have taken the fight but as always with CFC the strategic objective is far more important then any 'good fight'.
Good example of those cap fleets some people are saying don't exist in Aegis Sov anymore. Anybody who's not seeing caps while Entosing is simply not Entosing anything worthwhile to cap owners. Sounds like CONDI have figured out how to operate in Aegis Sov. |
Icycle
Dissident Aggressors Mordus Angels
5
|
Posted - 2015.08.01 10:51:11 -
[129] - Quote
The core issue with some people that are complaining about the new sov is that they got to run after the entosis entities. There is a lot of compain about interceptors and some other type of ships. The reality thats not the real problem. You can put thousands of excuses and acuse interceptors of nullify issues etc. But again thats not the issue.
The issue is that most of these alliances are still bent on not giving up systems. So they are stuck with many systems they dont use but they want to hold on to them out of spite. So they end up doing crazy fleet for two to three days mining to raise the index level. Then they abandon the system again and remains empty. They will have hundreads systems like this. A good example is Catch and some regions CFC controls. There a great many systems that are not even habited yet they keep sov out of spite.
What needs to change here is way of thinking. They need to stop claiming sov on those systems that they dont use. This will drastically reduce the entosing. Example the big populated systems in CFC have had no attempt to entosis(besides some obvious attempt to get you to fight). You wonder why? Cos they are heavelly populated. If you look at the systems that are been attacked, they are systems that have either no people or very few people in it. So example CFC needs to stop claiming those systems they dont use and therefore cant defend cos of the absurd amount of timers. This will cause much much less entosis timers. Mittani tried to counter this not by releasing systems but instead they tried to fill them up with renters. It has not worked. The new sov system was created to give greater chance for smaller entities to gain space and force the large ones to realease those systems they dont really use.
Stop blaiming fozzy sov or ships or other mechanics for your inability to hold a system which you obviously cant defend cos its stretches you alliance activities(entosis defence) way too much. Pull back and release those system for other entities the same way that the new sov was meant to be utilised. Dont and suffer the consequences!
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Delt0r Garsk
Shits N Giggles
423
|
Posted - 2015.08.01 13:27:55 -
[130] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Delt0r Garsk wrote:... That is the point. If sov is not worth the undock.. ... The interceptor(s) are not worth the undock / reship. Again, if it is not worth the undock, you don't get to keep the sov. Working as intended.
Death and Glory!
Well fun is also good.
|
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Falin Whalen
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
795
|
Posted - 2015.08.01 17:04:21 -
[131] - Quote
Delt0r Garsk wrote:Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Delt0r Garsk wrote:... That is the point. If sov is not worth the undock.. ... The interceptor(s) are not worth the undock / reship. Again, if it is not worth the undock, you don't get to keep the sov. Working as intended. http://i.imgur.com/SZHGYof.gif
"it's only because of their stupidity that they're able to be so sure of themselves."
The Trial - Franz Kafka-á
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Pah Cova
Made in Portugal S.A.
13
|
Posted - 2015.08.01 18:42:17 -
[132] - Quote
Icycle wrote:The core issue with some people that are complaining about the new sov is that they got to run after the entosis entities. There is a lot of compain about interceptors and some other type of ships. The reality thats not the real problem. You can put thousands of excuses and acuse interceptors of nullify issues etc. But again thats not the issue.
The issue is that most of these alliances are still bent on not giving up systems. So they are stuck with many systems they dont use but they want to hold on to them out of spite. So they end up doing crazy fleet for two to three days mining to raise the index level. Then they abandon the system again and remains empty. They will have hundreads systems like this. A good example is Catch and some regions CFC controls. There a great many systems that are not even habited yet they keep sov out of spite.
The problem are not running after ceptors or some other ships, the real problem is that small entities just cant hold sov. Theres too many people in hs that dosent care about sov cta-¦s and so on, they just want to play their game where they want and when they want. People get tired about cta-¦s isn-¦t funny anymore except for those who are in null.
The real problem is, how to bring people from hs to null sec?
Well, much can be said about this, but im my point of view the true power are all in one side and that is not good and healty to the game, whatever the other sides do will not make any difference, in the end they loose, thats the real problem, you can fight them but you cant win, you can win some fights but you cant win the war. So, if people stay in hs, they have nothing to gain, but of course they have nothing to loose too, pvp they can make it anywhere, hs, null sec or wh but the diference is that they only will do it, when they want and when they can, not when others want them to make it. If the goal is to make people go into null, this sov mechanic are a complete fail and have made the opposite, people are leaving null and back to hs. To me it dosent really matter anymore what are CCP going to do, it always ended on the same, people leaving the game and people bored for having nothing to shoot at, make 50 or more jumps just to shoot something, thats why somebody says somewhere in forum that wants some way to get faster on fights... maybe CCP will pesent them with the "move me into system x" some day, after all they bring sleeper loot from wh-¦s to hs, low sec and null sec, they are going to bring bots to null just for mine (that horrible mining hobby that thounsands of players liked are really bad) just for give some more ressources to the alliances and take it from players.
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ISD Buldath
ISD STAR
42
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Posted - 2015.08.01 19:13:11 -
[133] - Quote
Quote: 17. Redundant and re-posted threads will be locked.
As a courtesy to other forum users, please search to see if there is a thread already open on the topic you wish to discuss. If so, please place your comments there instead. Multiple threads on the same subject clutter up the forums needlessly, causing good feedback and ideas to be lost. Please keep discussions regarding a topic to a single thread.
You can find the Proper thread for Feedback on Sob mechanics here
Locked. |
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