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Roamer excertes Caldari Paranoid Social Workers inc.	Posted - 2006.12.03 15:42:00 - [31] And if you think turning up in a system en -masse unannounced and proclaiming in local channels that you are moving in wether the locals like it or not is not the act of an elitist bully boy alliance or an act of aggression then you are seriously deluded. Your actions in doing so, I say again as you seem to keep managing to brush over that fact, is exactly the same actions you pretend to fight against. 4 legs good 2 legs bad
Roamer excertes Caldari Paranoid Social Workers inc.	Posted - 2006.12.03 15:54:00 - [32] Edited by: Roamer excertes on 03/12/2006 15:59:34 Edited by: Roamer excertes on 03/12/2006 15:56:54 Quote: We have no desire to impose anything on the locals of the area by military means or otherwise. You sir, are imposing your presence by military means. the every fact you are there and fighting to stay there is an act of imposition on the local area. If you genuinely repect the locals inhabitants why did you not contact the local alliance/corps CEO's before turning up with capital ships and en-masse and say that you wished to spend some time in the local area, not as a request but as a matter of courtesy? By your own admission you turned up, announced you were moving in, then A DAY LATER bothered to talk to the head of the biggest alliance in the area. Gunboat diplomacy. That is the arrogance that I speak of, You moved in a military force unannounced, that is an imposition. Have you asked BRUCE what they think about the war declaration against you? do they feel it is an appropraite response to youir aggression, or does your arrogance continue to let you ignore the local residents.
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2006.12.03 16:00:00 - [33] Roamer excertes you aren't listening. I think this lesson in Realpolitik is going to need to be taught you with hybrid cannons and flashy tech2 ships. There are people in new eden that you do not ask to bend their knee. You're about to meet some of them. Star Fraction is recruiting
Tatsue Nuko Tabula Rasa Systems The Star Fraction	Posted - 2006.12.03 16:02:00 - [34] Roamer, please offer evidence of our aggression. I am looking for shots fired. If you think being in system X is an act of aggression, well, then announce your claim to it and see if you can hold it against those that take offense. Offering peaceful coexistance is elitist bullying? So I guess exclusion at the point of a gun is filanthropy? The best nugget of gold is this one though: "You sir, are imposing your presence by military means." (with the confusion that continues thereafter) I find it hilarious that the one that thinks we have to ask his permission to go to a place he does not own accuses us of arrogance. We are "imposing" our presence by "military means" because someone decided they'd try to forcibly remove us. We don't like it when people do that, as your mentioned capital ship deployment would indicate. TBSV fired the first shot. We'll fire the last. Join the revolution, babeh!
The Cosmopolite Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2006.12.03 16:03:00 - [35] Edited by: The Cosmopolite on 03/12/2006 16:03:40 Originally by: Roamer excertes Have you asked BRUCE what they think about the war declaration against you? do they feel it is an appropraite response to youir aggression, or does your arrogance continue to let you ignore the local residents. I have had a communication from BRUCE and they declare their neutrality in the matter of the war declaration and that is quite satisfactory. There is no imposition on others by simply being present in an area. We have carried out no aggressive acts against locals and have no wish to do so unless they take aggressive action against us. The simple fact is that we hold that space itself is beyond claims. We are very happy to see people profitably use the bounty that space provides and have no designs on the operations of others. Our discussions with BRUCE are covered by diplomatic seal but it is my understanding their executor has no problem with our presence in the area. As I said, educate yourself before presuming to speak for others. The Cosmopolite The Star Fraction Recruitment
Roamer excertes Caldari Paranoid Social Workers inc.	Posted - 2006.12.03 16:04:00 - [36] yet again the arrogance of a bully boy, nay terrorist organisation. Stop your pretentions of being the white knight of freedom of space, and admit that you will go where you want not for any idealistic principle but becuase you have Hybrid weapons and T2 ships, Align yourselves with the Pirate Coalition and be a little more honourable, at least they have the balls to admit they are nothing more that Hi tech bullies.
Roamer excertes Caldari Paranoid Social Workers inc.	Posted - 2006.12.03 16:10:00 - [37] Quote: There are people in new eden that you do not ask to bend their knee. No-one has asked to you to bend your knee (I think that a little paranoid tendencies are creeping in here ) You are demanding respect at the end of a gun barrel, that is not the act of a principled moralistic band dedictaed to keeping space free from terratorial claims, but the act of a terrorist.
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2006.12.03 16:12:00 - [38] Originally by: Roamer excertes yet again the arrogance of a bully boy, nay terrorist organisation. Stop your pretentions of being the white knight of freedom of space, and admit that you will go where you want not for any idealistic principle but becuase you have Hybrid weapons and T2 ships, Align yourselves with the Pirate Coalition and be a little more honourable, at least they have the balls to admit they are nothing more that Hi tech bullies. Why would we be convinced to say anything by a one-man corporation and a CEO without the courage to fight for their convictions? Our deeds speak for themselves. Yours are entirely beneath the notice of valourous independent free captains. Star Fraction is recruiting
Roamer excertes Caldari Paranoid Social Workers inc.	Posted - 2006.12.03 16:16:00 - [39] Quote: Why would we be convinced to say anything by a one-man corporation and a CEO without the courage to fight for their convictions? So is it part of your "freedoms" that an individual has no say? that a small corporation who could not hope to stand up to your military might cannot speak out? That is YOUR freedoms? I should shut up and accept your presence in the area because you are bigger and have more guns? that goes gainst everything you proclaim to stnd for, you have just proved the point I was making, your principles are simply a smokescreen to pretend you are not in fact simply High tech bullies
The Cosmopolite Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2006.12.03 16:21:00 - [40] Edited by: The Cosmopolite on 03/12/2006 16:21:05 Roamer, you are quite free to howl into the wind. We are simply saying that we are exercising our freedom to discount your baseless rantings. We listen to the true representatives of the locals, not some obvious and rather unconvincing agitator. The Cosmopolite The Star Fraction Recruitment
Nekumi Caldari Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2006.12.03 16:24:00 - [41] Originally by: Roamer excertes Quote: Why would we be convinced to say anything by a one-man corporation and a CEO without the courage to fight for their convictions? So is it part of your "freedoms" that an individual has no say? that a small corporation who could not hope to stand up to your military might cannot speak out? That is YOUR freedoms? I should shut up and accept your presence in the area because you are bigger and have more guns? that goes gainst everything you proclaim to stnd for, you have just proved the point I was making, your principles are simply a smokescreen to pretend you are not in fact simply High tech bullies Can you illustrate exactly what The Star Fraction have forced anyone to do? Can you provide a list of things you'd like to see The Star Fraction do to prevent further ramblings of this calibre?
Roamer excertes Caldari Paranoid Social Workers inc.	Posted - 2006.12.03 16:25:00 - [42] An Orwellian Statement of the highest order.. "All animals are equal, but some are more equal than others" Keep proving to all how your principles are only as deep as your own self interests.
Roamer excertes Caldari Paranoid Social Workers inc.	Posted - 2006.12.03 16:30:00 - [43] Originally by: Nekumi Can you provide a list of things you'd like to see The Star Fraction do to prevent further ramblings of this calibre? Certainly. 1. A public apology for not respecting the local residents and moving in a military force including capitol ships BEFORE contacting any local CEO's 2. If you wish to stay in the area a commitment to a) Set all local freindly corps to Blue b) Defend the area alongside the local residents against any Pirate incursions (Dont just *** the local resources make a commitment to the area) the above simply show your TRUE desire to be part of the community while you are here, not a military imposed ***of local resources
Nekumi Caldari Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2006.12.03 16:30:00 - [44] Originally by: Roamer excertes An Orwellian Statement of the highest order.. "All animals are equal, but some are more equal than others" Keep proving to all how your principles are only as deep as your own self interests. Boxer died a few posts ago, maybe you should send it to the glue factory now.
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2006.12.03 16:37:00 - [45] Originally by: Roamer excertes Originally by: Nekumi Can you provide a list of things you'd like to see The Star Fraction do to prevent further ramblings of this calibre? Certainly. 1. A public apology for not respecting the local residents and moving in a military force including capitol ships BEFORE contacting any local CEO's 2. If you wish to stay in the area a commitment to a) Set all local freindly corps to Blue b) Defend the area alongside the local residents against any Pirate incursions (Dont just *** the local resources make a commitment to the area) the above simply show your TRUE desire to be part of the community while you are here, not a military imposed ***of local resources I spit on your terms. Nobody tells me how I should live. Star Fraction is recruiting
Roamer excertes Caldari Paranoid Social Workers inc.	Posted - 2006.12.03 16:42:00 - [46] Edited by: Roamer excertes on 03/12/2006 16:43:40 the above simply show your TRUE desire to be part of the community while you are here, not a military imposed raper of local resources Quote: I spit on your terms. Nobody tells me how I should live And again your arrogance comes to the fore.
The Cosmopolite Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2006.12.03 16:47:00 - [47] You're catching on. Our principles rest on self-interest. We've never said anything else. What you will refuse to understand but which I say to others who have open minds is that we see no contradiction between our self-interest and peaceful co-existence with others. We operate a strict policy of never shooting neutrals. We do not need to set locals to blue because we will not shoot them. If they request standings clarifications we will happily consider them. As for resources, we will talk to people about rational use of resources where it is necessary. In this case, it is not. The BRUCE executor knows this. You are ignorant and not privy to the facts so have no basis on which to make a judgement. As for area defence pacts. We do not sign-up to them with anyone. We fight those who aggress us. We do not act for others. Now, here are the facts: The Star Fraction has moved assets into an areas of space that is open to all. The Star Fraction is on cordial terms with the local BRUCE alliance and has no interest whatever in their operations. The Star Fraction has been declared on by a mercenary corp hired to 'persuade' us to move out. The Star Fraction will defend itself and whoever the client is will see that their act has achieved the precise opposite of the intention of the contract. We are not the aggressors here and only the most stupendous manipulation of the facts and the most Orwellian use of language, which is to say an abuse of language for political ends, could say otherwise. Your motives are not obscure. All can see you speak for the aggressors and no-one of even mind and temper will be fooled. The Cosmopolite The Star Fraction Recruitment
Roamer excertes Caldari Paranoid Social Workers inc.	Posted - 2006.12.03 16:57:00 - [48] Edited by: Roamer excertes on 03/12/2006 16:59:05 facts. 1. You moved a military force and capitol ships into a populated area and started operations in that area to gain resources, without even bothering to say hello 2. Your Pilots in local channels TOLD the local inhabitants that you were moving in (an imposition of your presence by military force) 3. You made NO attempt (by your own admission earlier in this post) to ensure freindly relations with the local community until 24 hours AFTER you moved in. 4. You have declared in this post that the rights of the individual to speak out against your actions will be ignored, and worse those speaking out will be hunted down .. because you have bigger guns, Not the act of fighters for freedom, buit the acts of bullies, more akin to the Pirate Coalition At least if you proclaim to hold certain principles you should attempt to uphold them, your actions so far and the repklies in this thread show clearly that your principles are not evn skin deep, brush the surface and they disappear into threats imposing your presence and, now discredited, ideals by use of force
The Cosmopolite Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2006.12.03 17:14:00 - [49] Originally by: Roamer excertes 1. You moved a military force and capitol ships into a populated area and started operations in that area to gain resources, without even bothering to say hello 2. Your Pilots in local channels TOLD the local inhabitants that you were moving in (an imposition of your presence by military force) Most people with rational minds will see that points 1 and 2 are in direct contradiction to one another on the question of talking to the locals. This rather undercuts the logic of your argument. As for the claim that simply being present in a system is an imposition on others by the use of military force: nonsense. Did the locals oppose our presence? No. So what need to impose it? None. As for the question of resources. What resources would those be? Do you know? The executor of BRUCE is aware we have no interest in the resources he was most concerned about. Quote: 3. You made NO attempt (by your own admission earlier in this post) to ensure freindly relations with the local community until 24 hours AFTER you moved in. I told you when the conversation took place. You cannot draw any conclusions from that as to any attempts at contact. I would point out that once again your point here is in some contradiction to your referencing our pilots talking to the locals. Quote: 4. You have declared in this post that the rights of the individual to speak out against your actions will be ignored, and worse those speaking out will be hunted down .. because you have bigger guns, Not the act of fighters for freedom, buit the acts of bullies, more akin to the Pirate Coalition This is straightforwardly a distortion and a lie. Your right to speak as you will is in no way affected by our exercising the right to discount your rantings. We have not said at any point that you will be hunted down. We say this: if you yourself take direct action in space against us, we will fight back against you. But have no fear. You are a coward and I doubt we will see your ship opening fire against us. So you will be quite safe from us. Quote: At least if you proclaim to hold certain principles you should attempt to uphold them, your actions so far and the repklies in this thread show clearly that your principles are not evn skin deep, brush the surface and they disappear into threats imposing your presence and, now discredited, ideals by use of force Tell us which principles and ideals you think we are proclaiming? List them and how we have broken them. I have dismissed your claim, utterly nonsensical, that we are infringing your free speech. So please list the other principles you allege we have broken. The Cosmopolite The Star Fraction Recruitment
Roamer excertes Caldari Paranoid Social Workers inc.	Posted - 2006.12.03 17:26:00 - [50] Quote: Roamer excertes you aren't listening. I think this lesson in Realpolitik is going to need to be taught you with hybrid cannons and flashy tech2 ships. There are people in new eden that you do not ask to bend their knee. You're about to meet some of them. There in this post is all the proof you require, a direct threat to one who speaks against your actions... You say that you will uphold the right to free space for all. but space cannot be free if it is invaded by military forces of such magnitude the local inhabitants cannot resist. I have been informed by a 3rd party that Star Fraction in fact chose these systems to rest in after their recent conflict due to finding out via the Gallnet that the local major alliance does not operate capitol ships. and that a major part of this "Moving In " was to jump in a military force with capitol ships to ensure the local alliance was subdued with as little or no resistance, To quote my informant, "A show of Force to ensure compliance" A militaristic tactic worthy of the worst Caldari mega corporations... Subjugation of a community by overwhelming military might. faced with a number of capitol ships appearing on his doorstep and a military force showing up announced and proclaiming they are now living in the area, I have no doubt BRUCE CEO declares their neutrality, You gave him no other choice, he had a gun to his head !!
Aeaus Tabula Rasa Systems The Star Fraction	Posted - 2006.12.03 17:29:00 - [51] Originally by: Roamer excertes facts. 1. You moved a military force and capitol ships into a populated area and started operations in that area to gain resources, without even bothering to say hello. Our operations included gaining from a resource with unlimited supply. We do not deploy StarBases and we do not use the local asteroids. Our capital ships are nothing more then logistical platforms until people decide to openly declare hostility toward us. Originally by: Roamer excertes 2. Your Pilots in local channels TOLD the local inhabitants that you were moving in (an imposition of your presence by military force) We had no military interests in the area before hostility was declared upon us. Our military presense for fighting pod-pilots and other neutral entities was not planned as part of our operations. We may be a military alliance, but we do not interupt the activities of neutrals, and most importantly we do not shoot neutrals. Originally by: Roamer excertes 3. You made NO attempt (by your own admission earlier in this post) to ensure freindly relations with the local community until 24 hours AFTER you moved in. If we were truly military power-mongrels as you try to portray us then we would have ensured that the second we jumped in relations would be made crystal clear. We did not engage, we did not bother you. We are not mindless bueracratic monkeys that will answer to every territory-claiming power. Once we saw need to expicitly confirm our friendliness we made contact with the local alliance. Otherwise, we consider all local alliances and corporations neutrals, and neutrals are absolutely off-limits for any SF pilot. Originally by: Roamer excertes 4. You have declared in this post that the rights of the individual to speak out against your actions will be ignored, and worse those speaking out will be hunted down .. because you have bigger guns, Not the act of fighters for freedom, buit the acts of bullies, more akin to the Pirate Coalition We do not respect the induvidual who claims to be representative of a larger body while completely obscuring who that body is. Representatives for any [real] party are never ignored. For all we know you're just a random pod-pilot with no backing of any real corporation and are simply trying to raise as torm. Last Weeks Signature
Roamer excertes Caldari Paranoid Social Workers inc.	Posted - 2006.12.03 17:39:00 - [52] We are not invading.. we are simply using all these Capitol ships to transport humanitarian aid, the Battleships are simply there to provide medical facilities, and all these pilots are only here to bandage the injured and comfort the poor orphans.. Pull the other leg, it has bells on it... You should get a job in PR for the Pirate Coalition, it would sound slightly more believable coming from them than an alliance that has repeatedly in this thread contradicted its own principles
The Cosmopolite Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2006.12.03 17:44:00 - [53] Originally by: Roamer excertes Quote: Roamer excertes you aren't listening. I think this lesson in Realpolitik is going to need to be taught you with hybrid cannons and flashy tech2 ships. There are people in new eden that you do not ask to bend their knee. You're about to meet some of them. There in this post is all the proof you require, a direct threat to one who speaks against your actions... Simply a statement that if you oppose us in space, that will be the response. I can tell you that if you show up and do not fire at us you will be left alone. Any SF pilot who fires on neutrals is disciplined - without exception. Quote: You say that you will uphold the right to free space for all. but space cannot be free if it is invaded by military forces of such magnitude the local inhabitants cannot resist. The locals have shown no desire to 'resist'. We have absolutely no desire to impede the locals. We have no desire to see the locals leave. We have no desire to interfere with the operations of the locals. We say quite clearly that all locals who wish to remain neutral to us will be left alone to do as they please. This is not military imposition. Anyone who says that it is demonstrates their agenda quite clearly: it is to push the line of those who have aggressed us. Quote: I have been informed by a 3rd party that Star Fraction in fact chose these systems to rest in after their recent conflict due to finding out via the Gallnet that the local major alliance does not operate capitol ships. and that a major part of this "Moving In " was to jump in a military force with capitol ships to ensure the local alliance was subdued with as little or no resistance, To quote my informant, "A show of Force to ensure compliance" Ah. I wondered when a mysterious 'third party' who has some salacious intel would be conjured with. Let me be clear: the above claim is a complete and utter lie. Provide proof or be regarded as a charlatan and a liar by all those who understand how the game of politics is played. You fool no-one, liar. Quote: A militaristic tactic worthy of the worst Caldari mega corporations... Subjugation of a community by overwhelming military might. Leaving the local population entirely to their own affairs, guaranteeing that no neutrals will be fired on and clarifying certain matters in diplomatic conversations is hardly subjugation. Quote: faced with a number of capitol ships appearing on his doorstep and a military force showing up announced and proclaiming they are now living in the area, I have no doubt BRUCE CEO declares their neutrality, You gave him no other choice, he had a gun to his head !! Simply another lie and one that impugns the BRUCE executor. Your mask of concern for the locals slips and all can see that you are willing to insult the independence of the BRUCE alliance to peddle your stupid lies. The BRUCE executor has been nothing but a model of diplomacy making clear his own independence and concern for his people and we have respected that. You, clearly, do not respect it for you slur him and all other locals with your lies. The Cosmopolite The Star Fraction Recruitment
valhalla MCMLXXIV Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2006.12.03 17:47:00 - [54] Edited by: valhalla MCMLXXIV on 03/12/2006 17:49:48 Originally by: Roamer excertes I have been informed by a 3rd party that Star Fraction in fact chose these systems to rest in after their recent conflict due to finding out via the Gallnet that the local major alliance does not operate capitol ships. and that a major part of this "Moving In " was to jump in a military force with capitol ships to ensure the local alliance was subdued with as little or no resistance, To quote my informant, "A show of Force to ensure compliance" Heh, I just noticed your corp name. Appropriate. Oh and 'Moving in' and 'ensure the local alliance was subdued' would gain us precisely what? A part of what Star Fraction stands for has already been explained above by Mr Cosmopolite, Ms Constantine and Ms Tatsu amongst others. Star Fraction is recruiting, join the revolution!
trojan warhorse	Posted - 2006.12.03 18:10:00 - [55] You may not post in this forum without showing your corporation/alliance identifiers, as detailed in the rules - Serathu ([email protected])
Celia Azur Minmatar Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2006.12.03 19:22:00 - [56] Edited by: Celia Azur on 03/12/2006 19:23:43 Roamer, At least use some stonger glue for your straw men if you plan to keep having them bear the entirety of your arguments.
merc999 Caldari Turbulent Subversion	Posted - 2006.12.03 19:23:00 - [57] Edited by: merc999 on 03/12/2006 19:28:21 Deleted as not appropriate MERC999 Public Relations Director TBSV Keeping Empire and Syndicate ship builders in business
Tatsue Nuko Tabula Rasa Systems The Star Fraction	Posted - 2006.12.03 19:25:00 - [58] Originally by: valhalla MCMLXXIV Heh, I just noticed your corp name. Appropriate. Yes, isn't that just priceless? By the way, Roamer, on the uses for battleships... This is a bit of a secret, so don't tell anyone, but there's SoE agents there. And if you never understood the use of moving goods with jump-drive capable vessels while you still have war declarations left to lapse their 24h timer... There's a hint. This third party of yours was truly hilarious though. I mean please, not even a single doctored image! No juicy records of our internal comms, no nothing! Come on, at least people like RAZOR had the skill to get some nice screens to put on display... Or could it be - oh the horror! - that your third party doesn't exist and you're just fruitlessly running your mouth? Mmm, it is rather cute though, in a bit of a wakibaki manner. Join the revolution, babeh!
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2006.12.03 21:32:00 - [59] Edited by: Jasmine Constantine on 03/12/2006 21:34:32 Originally by: Roamer excertes the above simply show your TRUE desire to be part of the community while you are here, not a military imposed raper of local resources See this makes me wonder. I mean we came to Aeschee originally to run some Sisters of Eve agents to improve the security levels of some of our pilots who'd seen them degraded by engaging -10s in lowsec during the Mito campaign. Now, either you are the kind of nutcase who believes that the unlimited isk of agent missions is somehow something you "own" - or (and this is the interesting bit) - maybe just maybe there is something valuable in Aeschee that you don't want other people finding out about? And now I'm curious I wondering if hiring mercs against the most media-savvy PR revolutionaries in Eve was the best way to keep this "secret" out of the headlines after all ... Star Fraction is recruiting
Wrayeth Tabula Rasa Systems The Star Fraction	Posted - 2006.12.03 22:00:00 - [60] Edited by: Wrayeth on 03/12/2006 22:14:09 Originally by: Roamer excertes Edited by: Roamer excertes on 03/12/2006 16:59:05 facts. 1. You moved a military force and capitol ships into a populated area and started operations in that area to gain resources, without even bothering to say hello So? Thousands of people do that all over New Eden. We're not talking about a tiny chunk of land, we're talking about an entire STAR SYSTEM. There's more than room enough for everyone. In terms of moving into an area to gain resources, you seem to think that our acquisition of resources necessarily requires that we take them from someone else. This is not true; we are more than happy to co-exist in peace with others who wish to co-exist in peace with us and whose ideologies are not flawed. We operate a strict NRDS (not-red-don't-shoot) policy, meaning the pilots in Aeschee and the surrounding systems had nothing to fear from us unless they fired the first shot. The first shot was fired by TBSV, and we have responded accordingly. (As a side note to TBSV, your use of dubious tactics to save a carrier that was half dead, outside of dock range, and had multiple webs and scramblers on it was pretty lame.) EDIT: I didn't realize this was in Corporations and Alliances and not IGS. As such, read "dubious tactics" as "exploit". In regards to moving capitals into the area, I don't see the problem. As long as they're not used for unprovoked aggression, I don't see how it's any of your business. Despite that, I'll let you in on the "secret" you can't seem to grasp and tell you why we brought in our capitals: a.) To move in supplies without having to do a tedious 20-jump trip from our former location. Our capitals have already been used for this. b.) To assist in local resource gathering. Our capitals have already been used for this. c.) To defend our assets from attack. We have used our capitals for this, as well, following the declaration of war by TBSV. Quote: 2. Your Pilots in local channels TOLD the local inhabitants that you were moving in (an imposition of your presence by military force) Hardly. "Moving in" is not synonymous with "taking over". Quote: 3. You made NO attempt (by your own admission earlier in this post) to ensure freindly relations with the local community until 24 hours AFTER you moved in. Why should we have to? We have a NRDS policy, meaning they had nothing to fear from us unless they shot first. Quote: 4. You have declared in this post that the rights of the individual to speak out against your actions will be ignored, and worse those speaking out will be hunted down .. The people who will be hunted down like the dogs they are are those who have declared war on us and those who put them up to it. Quote: because you have bigger guns, Not the act of fighters for freedom, buit the acts of bullies, more akin to the Pirate Coalition You really are clueless, aren't you? I think you need to contact BoB and order a crate of their patented Tinfoil HatsÖ. Quote: At least if you proclaim to hold certain principles you should attempt to uphold them, your actions so far and the repklies in this thread show clearly that your principles are not evn skin deep, brush the surface and they disappear into threats imposing your presence and, now discredited, ideals by use of force We did not initiate the use of force. We will, however, finish it. We are responding to acts of aggression by TBSV and their employers, and they will be dealt with. Again, note that we did not fire the first shot, and that we had moved in with no intention of interfering with the locals unless they interfered with us. I hope you like it hot, because TBSV and their employers are about to burn. -Wrayeth "Look, pa! I just contributed absolutely nothing to this thread!" Might As well Train Another Race

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