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Should High Sec Space Be Extended Rather Than Extending 0.0

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Maximillian Pele Caldari Jewel Enterprises	Posted - 2006.12.04 06:27:00 - [31] Jita exsists because it is a one-stop-shop. Most times when you check the market Jita will have the lowest prices, the most items, the most buy orders, and the most rare modules. So it becomes a self-reinforcing circle - Jita has the best market so everyone shops there so all the seller put their orders up in Jita so it remains the best market. Why not institute a NPC delivery service? Interbus exsists, why not use it. Allow players to buy things in Jita or other places and have them delivered to the local interbus office. I think player courier missions were supposed to achieve this but given the scams and gank traps under escrow, the threat of player theft, and now the limited number of contracts people have, courier missions won't fix the problem. Give EvE the equivalent of a UPS. CCP needs to give players a reason to spread out, whether in Empire or in 0.0. At the moment a combination of the map, resource concentration and a human tendency to gather means EvE is a world of overcrowded cities surrounded by undeveloped darkness (the pilots in space on the EvE map looks a lot like Earth view at night). In times of doubt I ask myself "What would BoB do?", and then do the opposite.
1Of9 Artificial Horizons YouWhat	Posted - 2006.12.04 06:29:00 - [32] Originally by: CERBERUS III Hello In the recent expansion of Revelations extra regions where added to 0.0. My discussion centres around these extra regions and how useful they are to the majority of players. Extra regions bring more opportunity for exploration, corporate expansion, hidden activities such as hidden deepspace pockets and greater game depth etc etc, however with these areas out in 0.0 how many people will get to use them?? With the influx of people to high sec due to LVL 4 missions replacement, new scanner system causing concern to low sec mission pilots and also the general danger placed on anyone who ventures their alone plus the cost of living in 0.0 all cause extra concern. As the game increases in size to over 30,000+ players are more 0.0 areas what the game needs or would more high sec regions be better?? What do you think? Ty drop empire men, grow up .. move to 0.0 .. in a simple answer: NO
Sir Drake	Posted - 2006.12.04 06:31:00 - [33] Originally by: Kiyano It is quite clear CCP have made this game as much player driven as possible, the next logical step would be to have the people in 0.0 able to create their own completely player driven Empires if you will, where it is entirely controlled by players. CCP will continue to add benefits for both Empire players and 0.0 players but with the 0.0 players always getting the better deal. Yeah, i see somthing like that comming too but its still pretty tought on the new ppl. That being said it would be nice for the aliances to build npc fleets and gate sentrys to protect their space from intruders (if amarr can why not ASCN) at minimum it would give those who really want to live in 0.0 and build an empire the option to protect their assets 23/7 without the need to rely on having ppl in all timezones. ------------------------------------------------------- Sig was removed due to derogatory comments towards a group of people. -Karl Chorimcer I like that.
1Of9 Artificial Horizons YouWhat	Posted - 2006.12.04 06:32:00 - [34] Originally by: Ridley Tree I think we should retract Empire by declaring all low sec regions to be lawless and made 0.0. /signed
Kiyano	Posted - 2006.12.04 06:33:00 - [35] Originally by: Maximillian Pele Jita exsists because it is a one-stop-shop. Most times when you check the market Jita will have the lowest prices, the most items, the most buy orders, and the most rare modules. So it becomes a self-reinforcing circle - Jita has the best market so everyone shops there so all the seller put their orders up in Jita so it remains the best market. Why not institute a NPC delivery service? Interbus exsists, why not use it. Allow players to buy things in Jita or other places and have them delivered to the local interbus office. I think player courier missions were supposed to achieve this but given the scams and gank traps under escrow, the threat of player theft, and now the limited number of contracts people have, courier missions won't fix the problem. Give EvE the equivalent of a UPS. CCP needs to give players a reason to spread out, whether in Empire or in 0.0. At the moment a combination of the map, resource concentration and a human tendency to gather means EvE is a world of overcrowded cities surrounded by undeveloped darkness (the pilots in space on the EvE map looks a lot like Earth view at night). Thats a pretty damn good idea imo. I'm getting sick of reading Jita this and Jita that threads, i've moved out of Caldari space because of that lol. The self reinforcing circle you are on about isn't going to get solved unless CCP do something to the mechanics to let us do it.
1Of9 Artificial Horizons YouWhat	Posted - 2006.12.04 06:33:00 - [36] Originally by: Lord Frost Edited by: Lord Frost on 04/12/2006 05:27:59 We all can see high sec is cramped, missioners get lagged, jump queues everywhere, the market sucks donkey balls, Jita is a pain, theres no reason why Jita has to be that way... its a fricken cattle drive. YES, Empire needs to get expanded. Take a look at the new map and new regions made available. Hardly 1% of the 32,000 people we had online were exploring that area. Don't force people to 0.0... they'll quit before they move. Let them chose to go there with greater rewards. Right now, its chump change difference between an agent in Empire and an agent in low sec. Not worth the risk. Don't tell me or anyone where they should go... people have made it clear, they don't want to move to 0.0.... and everyone is to blame. Only an idiot can't see that we need to expand Empire. CCP needs to learn to expand with their major player base, and not some dream idea of a multi-run 0.0 No!
Dufas Amarr Catalyst Reaction Xelas Alliance	Posted - 2006.12.04 06:40:00 - [37] NO! if you wanna stay nice and safe and cuddlie then deal with crowds ... jita problem will never go away .. there will always be some system that everyone will gather at to sell, chat, fight and to generally just be around other ppl..happened before in yuli and its just grown and moved to jita Empire space is a nothing more then an isk sink __________
Fester Addams Minmatar	Posted - 2006.12.04 07:42:00 - [38] Actually I would like to see some contested space between empire and 0.0. At present most exits out into 0.0 is in the form of chokepoints, single or strings of systems with very few gates, how about making those systems contested. If dedicated players choose to they could complete tasks to make the systems empire, such as deploying defensive grids, NPC corp owned POSes and the like. people who wish for the systems to remain 0.0 can likewise have objectives to take down the defensive grids and POSes and set upp their own devices that the empire players need to remove. If nothing else this would give players somthing to fight over in the fringes of space.
Verus Potestas Caldari Perkone	Posted - 2006.12.04 07:48:00 - [39] Originally by: Cyrus Graham Originally by: CERBERUS III with these areas out in 0.0 how many people will get to use them?? As many that want to. Thread over. Between corps atm, the NPC one is strictly a temporary thing. RAWR!111 Sig Hijackz0r!!11 - Immy
Malikton	Posted - 2006.12.04 08:29:00 - [40] Edited by: Malikton on 04/12/2006 08:30:40 My two cents: It strikes me that as the game progresses there should be a slow but perceptible "civilization" influence. One way to achieve this would be for every 10 0.0 systems added, 1 existing 0.0 system should become lowsec, and for every 10 0.0 to lowsec, one existing lowsec should become high sec. So for every 100 "frontier" systems added to the game, 1 0.4 system would become 0.5. Makes sense to me, as the changes would occur with major patches, and adds to the dynamic nature of the universe, with the huge spread of untamed space, but the gradual creep of civilization.
Merchantigus Minmatar Riot Zone	Posted - 2006.12.04 08:39:00 - [41] Edited by: Merchantigus on 04/12/2006 08:41:06 go away carebears this game is not for you. there are carebears ish actvivites(mining, manufacturing,trade) but this isn't ment to be a mining sim. i can't wait untill that star trek game comes out so we can finally be rid of them. And once again carebear is not the same thing as an anrgybear. i welcome the bears with teeth as brothers. the rest of you frew off
Scott Price	Posted - 2006.12.04 08:41:00 - [42] Several good idea have spawned from this thread: 1) NPC delivery system by means of interbus. /signed 2) High Sec Areas located in several 0.0 regions for lvl 5 agents and as market hubs. /signed 3) The amount of high sec should grow along with the amount of low sec. Start with Amamake please. /signed
Merchantigus Minmatar Riot Zone	Posted - 2006.12.04 08:42:00 - [43] Edited by: Merchantigus on 04/12/2006 08:49:17 "1) NPC delivery system by means of interbus." indeed but traders would be sol..oh wait no one has figured out to move stuff from jita to other palces yet my bad. this is the same thing as with low sec. tired of jita being the only trade hub? run stome stuff out to lowsec/.o where the people that actually need it live. player actions can remedy any problem in eve. "2) High Sec Areas located in several 0.0 regions for lvl 5 agents and as market hubs." there are. use the map. you may not have the same map but in my region alone i see 6 systems without looking around. "3) The amount of high sec should grow along with the amount of low sec. Start with Amamake please." die pls? with wtz it's even easier to get stuff to low sec. .0 all you have to do is avoid places with obvious camps(map again) and you'll have very little trouble. or you could all just hide in jita and ***** about how crowded it is. everytime i lose i a ship i have to make atleast 8 jumps for the ship and then hunt down all the parts. if there was a trade hub closer i'd sure as hell use it even if the prices were a bit more epensive. "Jita exsists because it is a one-stop-shop." jita exist because it's the only shop...
Apollo Balthar Minmatar The Sausage Smuggling Syndicate	Posted - 2006.12.04 08:50:00 - [44] Originally by: Scott Price Several good idea have spawned from this thread: 1) NPC delivery system by means of interbus. /signed 2) High Sec Areas located in several 0.0 regions for lvl 5 agents and as market hubs. /signed 3) The amount of high sec should grow along with the amount of low sec. Start with Amamake please. /signed You want a CCP endorsed NPC to wipe your virtual arse too by any chance ? ------------------------------------------------ WTS: tech2 clue
Embattle	Posted - 2006.12.04 09:24:00 - [45] This is nearly the most pointless thread because those in low space will generally say no and those in high sec will say yes both sides have valid points but in those points it is a very narrow view and nothing will get done. ----------- I put on my space suit, sat on the hull and threw my line over the side.....4 hrs later I realised fish can't breath in space.
Nanobotter Mk2	Posted - 2006.12.04 09:31:00 - [46] "there's too much empire already and most of it is never used." LMAO, you never been to 0.0 if you think empire is mostly unused....atleast 5 of every 10 systems in 0.0 is not only EMPTY, but it is offline because noone has even passed through.... Yes more space in empire because the majority of people play in empire. I always thought they kinda built he universe backwards arse in EVE. they should have made each major empire region ( Ie min,cald,amarr, galante) isolated from each other by way of gaps of low sec and 0.0 isntead of all empire clsuter together int he center with 0.0 a ring around the outside.
Lunadi Minmatar Solar Trade	Posted - 2006.12.04 10:32:00 - [47] Funny.. - those who wants play in secure say yes... but don't care about those who plays in 0.0 - those who don't want play in secure says no... but they do care that everyone moves out of secure (somtimes even try to insult) Why ?? What is your motivation to change someone's way of playing? Originally by: Admiral Feelgood High sec is the starter region, crowding gives them motivation to get out of it. WoW player ? Didn't knew eve has starter regions ;-) -------- hate my spelling? go play SCRABBLE!
James Snowscoran Coreli Corporation Corelum Syndicate	Posted - 2006.12.04 10:47:00 - [48] In the spirit of EVE, influencing system security should be influenced by player actions. I'm hoping future versions of FW will include ways to do this, both in the terms of changing existing empire systems rating (lowsec Jita anyone ) and pushing around the boundaries between lowsec, empire and zerosec, including the ability to expand en Empire's sphere of influence into existing zerosec areas and vice versa. -----
Sinder Ohm	Posted - 2006.12.04 10:56:00 - [49] No worst idea ive read today ! I myself used to live in Motsu and run mission after mission after mission hiding behind concord thinking that my faction fitted wtfbbq Raven was the bees knees. Grow a pair mate Heck I have less than 9 mill skillpoints and I have found myself a nice home in Pure blind. I started in a cheaply fitted Ferox and now have alot of assets there. And NO empire is far too big as it is, if anything it would be nice if CCP would throw in a few more complexes and other goodies in 0.0 my 2 isk ....
Rafein Eye of God Axiom Empire	Posted - 2006.12.04 11:07:00 - [50] Maybe open Jove space, and make it .5+. just make it so you gotta get through 0.0 to get there.
Taram Caldar Caldari Acheron Vanguard Armada The Shadow Ascension	Posted - 2006.12.04 11:21:00 - [51] No
James Duar Merch Industrial	Posted - 2006.12.04 11:39:00 - [52] If they really wanted to make Empire "interesting" (i.e. deadly) then when faction warfare starts they could have boundary systems between the Empire's rapidly decay from being secure to being sovereign 0.0 of the Empires, filled with NPC starbases but naturally no laws.
Zantazar Caldari The Syndicate Inc Ascendant Frontier	Posted - 2006.12.04 12:34:00 - [53] Well, here is my idea. No need to expand high sec, simply introduce incentives for the high sec population to spread around, thus reducing lag, and enhancing the feel good factor of the population that wish to stay there. One way CCP could implement this is to introduce a populus tax. Have built in tax rates based on the current population level for that system and these rates effective in ratting, mining, refining, purchasing, selling, and manufacturing. In systems that are highly populated the tax rates could be as high as 30%, and in sparse systems say 0%, and unlike refining these rates are not changed by player skill level. In order to keep these rates from fluctuating too dramatically, they could be calculated on a mean average statistic of say the previous 20 days, and this would be a relatively simple piece of coding to introduce. The population figure could be calculated by player activity in that system, thus avoiding bringing into the calculation any traffic simply passing through on a family outing (like a fleet of 60 ships on there way to gank an Osprey miner in some far flung part of the cosmos). A formula could be devised based on the total isk values of rats killed + (mining and refining value, based on existing market trends) + purchases + sales + (manufacturing, again based on current trends). Now, solo players and small corporations could move to the quieter systems to rat/mine etc. As these systems would gradually increase in population, the tax rates would gradually creep up, and as a result the player base would move around, but over a smooth period, not like every couple of days. This could also have the benefit of showing players new areas in high sec that they would otherwise have never seen. Could be the solution to Jita even. What do you think? Oh, and I thought the OP's thread was reasonably put, asking for a discussion. It always amazes me the immature and ignorant comments that some of you put. Break the mould, and debate in a reasonable manner, although I do realise for a few of you, this may seem an alien request. Signature removed due to incorrect size (400X120px and 24000 bytes). Please review the forum rules or e-mail us with any questions. You can view you signature here - Petwraith I would sell my soul, my body, and my entire family for a Navy Raven. (Just kidding .... my soul is not for sale)
Semper Sanguis	Posted - 2006.12.04 12:39:00 - [54] Or... make lvl4 mission payouts and lp rewards dimish rapidly as more people do them in the same system. Problem is zi solved!
Iyanah Minmatar Mining Munitions and Mayhem	Posted - 2006.12.04 12:53:00 - [55] Originally by: CERBERUS III Hello In the recent expansion of Revelations extra regions where added to 0.0. My discussion centres around these extra regions and how useful they are to the majority of players. Extra regions bring more opportunity for exploration, corporate expansion, hidden activities such as hidden deepspace pockets and greater game depth etc etc, however with these areas out in 0.0 how many people will get to use them?? With the influx of people to high sec due to LVL 4 missions replacement, new scanner system causing concern to low sec mission pilots and also the general danger placed on anyone who ventures their alone plus the cost of living in 0.0 all cause extra concern. As the game increases in size to over 30,000+ players are more 0.0 areas what the game needs or would more high sec regions be better?? What do you think? Ty perhaps beyond deep 0.0, we could encounter other factions who have created their own secure space, which would be the equivilant of low sec, with perhaps the odd 0.5 or 0.6 system to represent their capital. these mini-empires would be deep in 0.0, and so only experienced players could get to them, and they would only span a handfull of systems. it would add a little more flavour to space, and represent small nations policing their own territory away from the large empires. keeping things low sec means there is still some danger, but there is the hinting at a civilisation making it's way out there. ========================================== Iy
Patch86 Di-Tron Heavy Industries Freelancer Alliance	Posted - 2006.12.04 12:58:00 - [56] Hi-sec is largely uninhabited already- everyone clusters round in the same few regions, and most regions remain largely deserted. Expanding Empire isn't the answer- giving people a reason to spread out in Empire is much more relevent. Que my Dynamic Agent Quality idea -----------------------------------------------
Illifae	Posted - 2006.12.04 13:26:00 - [57] Originally by: Lunadi Funny.. - those who wants play in secure say yes... but don't care about those who plays in 0.0 - those who don't want play in secure says no... but they do care that everyone moves out of secure (somtimes even try to insult) Why ?? What is your motivation to change someone's way of playing? Blind malevolence and hate! These are the things that drive eve \o/
mjolnir feaw Gallente	Posted - 2006.12.04 13:43:00 - [58] I've never set a foot in 0.0 and I'm against an empire space extension. I'm even sure about the interbus UPS service (good idea, but not an eve-like solution). But perhaps the best agents in Jita & Co should move to a less crowded place (within empire). Perhaps agents beyond lvl2 should be banned from those hubs. So people would only come to a trade hub to trade and go away for everything else. Because it's true: empire space is vastly underused. I honnestly think 0.0 people want us in 0.0 as preys. Nothing more. Maybe I'm wrong, so answer me 0.0 fans: Given the fact that your regular low playing time Joe tell me: Without a corp/alliance, if I move to low-sec, what are the odd of this move being lucrative? What are the odds I'll lose ship after ship after clone? Until then I'll stick to losing one ship at a time chasing pirates in .1-.4 systems. ----- " There's no brave in a 5-to-1 fight. Just 5 cowards and a fool. - Perhaps. But it worked didn't it?"
Sir Drake	Posted - 2006.12.04 13:44:00 - [59] Originally by: Illifae Blind malevolence and hate! These are the things that drive eve \o/ You forgot about the egos mate. Some are getting planet sized. ------------------------------------------------------- Sig was removed due to derogatory comments towards a group of people. -Karl Chorimcer I like that.
Patch86 Di-Tron Heavy Industries Freelancer Alliance	Posted - 2006.12.04 13:47:00 - [60] Originally by: mjolnir feaw But perhaps the best agents in Jita & Co should move to a less crowded place (within empire). Perhaps agents beyond lvl2 should be banned from those hubs. So people would only come to a trade hub to trade and go away for everything else. Because it's true: empire space is vastly underused. Soooooo ahead of you......... -----------------------------------------------

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