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Destination SkillQueue
Are We There Yet
195
|
Posted - 2011.12.09 14:51:00 -
[31] - Quote
Lady Spank wrote:Considering the ease of jumping with capitals and bridges and what have you, having the clone jump feature limited to 24 hours feels somewhat outdated with the current state of New Eden.
Some random thoughts on this that I never bothered to flesh out.
It restricts accessibility of PVP, not talking about people that are unwilling to jump out of their precious +5 learning skills but those that fly a variety of ships and might be in their frigate set and get a CTA to do a pos bash with the chance of podding, then next day be asked to go on a BC roam. While you can say 'just deal with it',
I think the modern game features more diversity of activity for each player and being able to at least react to each evenings fleet ops (or even personal goals) with say, a 18 hour limit rather than 24, so you have some flexibility.
There is no reason to cater to people that just want to jump back into +5's at will but easing up a bit encourages more PVP... also useful for people involved in a mix of industry and pvp. In fact it is in this area that it is more critical. Who wants to go pvp with mining foreman links etc?
Lowering the timer enables more activity and doesn't just mean insta jumping across the universe any more than it does as it currently exists.
My thoughts follows pretty much the same line of thinking and that is why I think the OPs proposal isn't any good. It would be much preferable to simply separate the current clone jumping and the instant teleportation it provides from each other. Make it so, that teleportation is what triggers the long cooldown, while a local clone jump is treated more like a session change. That way you cater to the modern gameplay requirements and facilitate people to vary their activities more freely, while still maintaining the teleportation option and any balancing timers for it.
Joshua Aivoras wrote:Just remove learning implants, and there wouldn't be the need for a "learning clone" to swap between every other day. It's dumb anyhow.
You're still left with hardwirings not suited for the task you're trying to do, which leaves you with the same issue as before. |

Merovee
Gorthaur Legion Of Mordor
5
|
Posted - 2011.12.09 15:35:00 -
[32] - Quote
JC are bad. But this is business. |

Thelron
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
5
|
Posted - 2011.12.09 17:19:00 -
[33] - Quote
Lady Spank wrote:Considering the ease of jumping with capitals and bridges and what have you, having the clone jump feature limited to 24 hours feels somewhat outdated with the current state of New Eden.
Some random thoughts on this that I never bothered to flesh out.
It restricts accessibility of PVP, not talking about people that are unwilling to jump out of their precious +5 learning skills but those that fly a variety of ships and might be in their frigate set and get a CTA to do a pos bash with the chance of podding, then next day be asked to go on a BC roam. While you can say 'just deal with it',
I think the modern game features more diversity of activity for each player and being able to at least react to each evenings fleet ops (or even personal goals) with say, a 18 hour limit rather than 24, so you have some flexibility.
There is no reason to cater to people that just want to jump back into +5's at will but easing up a bit encourages more PVP... also useful for people involved in a mix of industry and pvp. In fact it is in this area that it is more critical. Who wants to go pvp with mining foreman links etc?
Lowering the timer enables more activity and doesn't just mean insta jumping across the universe any more than it does as it currently exists.
Or severely reduce the ease with which you can travel via cyno/bridge so cloning doens't seem so slow in comparison.
I could agree with cutting down on the timer if it were only for swapping between two clones on the same station (so folks can indeed keep their +5 learning implants safe, or have one *really specialized* setup and then something more general), but we really don't need to make it easier for people to just pop up somewhere completely different without any of the time or danger of moving via established spacelanes. Instant travel (even if it's "just" once per day) only encourages blob-play because everyone can get right to where they need to go immediately- there's no reason *not* to blob up and take everyone on an invasion if you know they can all just pop back home if someone tries to take advantage of your absence. |

Nova Fox
Novafox Shipyards
563
|
Posted - 2011.12.09 17:23:00 -
[34] - Quote
Needs option 3, New skill to lower cooldown.
|

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
1990
|
Posted - 2011.12.09 17:49:00 -
[35] - Quote
No.
At most it should be lowered to, say, 23h to remove the fence post error and make a proper once-a-day thing, rather than the current once-every-a-bit-more-than-a-day. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
If not, contact Miss DSA to shed your wardecs. |

baltec1
233
|
Posted - 2011.12.09 17:52:00 -
[36] - Quote
Karn Dulake wrote:
Gate camper and blob merchant detected
Instant gratification monkey detected |

Phlyk
The VonBraun Institute APEX Conglomerate
0
|
Posted - 2011.12.09 17:58:00 -
[37] - Quote
Do away with the jump clone timer when swapping with another clone in the same station. Keep the 24h timer for jumping to a remote clone.
That way you won't be jumping around the universe constantly, and you may have more people giving PvP a go if they aren't risking expensive clones, or a loss of training time.
|

Cerberine Saken
Aphelion Venture
1
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Posted - 2011.12.09 18:44:00 -
[38] - Quote
I'm personally in favour of removing learning implants altogether. Much as a shorter JC cooldown would be nice, it'd be even nicer if there weren't that 500mil-ISK discouragement to pvp sitting in my highsec clone. I know that there's still the issue of hardwiring then, but for me at least, the learning implants in my highsec clones make up the lion's share of their value. |

Cipher Jones
140
|
Posted - 2011.12.09 19:03:00 -
[39] - Quote
Brooks Puuntai wrote:I actually think they need to INCREASE the time or limit the ability of jump cloning. The whole JC process eliminates the need for normal travel and makes moving around WAY to easy. You can be at your home defending one day then JC to a staging area across the map the next. This makes any sort of longterm invasion a cake walk, aswell as defending large areas of space a breeze.
So no.
Yeah, its way easy to grind 8 standing, make a jump clone, take the jumpclone to where it has to be, and then jumpclone back.
/sarcasm
But you prove my point by bringing up "long term invasion". It takes long term planning to have jumpclones set up in a way that will allow a long term invasion, or defending multiple areas of space.
See what happens when fat neckbeards try to ride little ponies? The ponies die. |

Lord Zim
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
261
|
Posted - 2011.12.09 19:12:00 -
[40] - Quote
Crumplecorn wrote:Brooks Puuntai wrote:Its a point of force projection. Its another flawed design IMO. However at least thats limited based off of location and if your corp has a office in that station. So its at least somewhat controlled. Well at least if you pod yourself you lose your implants and have to buy a clone. Jump clones are more like "Would you like to use a set of +5's and then PvP without risking them? Well step right up!" I haven't had an implant in my char since I left hisec. Which means that for a few million, I can jump from deklein, to delve, to deklein, in a matter of less than 5 minutes.
"Force project" that, *****. |

Grukni
Shimai of New Eden N E X O
23
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Posted - 2011.12.09 19:13:00 -
[41] - Quote
If only CCP could provide us with an "I win" button... |

Lord Zim
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
262
|
Posted - 2011.12.09 19:15:00 -
[42] - Quote
Grukni wrote:If only CCP could provide us with an "I win" button... It's called "unsubscribe" or "log off". |

Bo Bojangles
Interstellar eXodus BricK sQuAD.
4
|
Posted - 2011.12.09 19:33:00 -
[43] - Quote
Phlyk wrote:Do away with the jump clone timer when swapping with another clone in the same station. Keep the 24h timer for jumping to a remote clone.
That way you won't be jumping around the universe constantly, and you may have more people giving PvP a go if they aren't risking expensive clones, or a loss of training time.
No way that's just a 'have your cake and eat it too' solution at the low cost of having two jc's at the same location, no deal.
You get in your +5's, you're stuck in them for at least 24 hours, deal with it.
You wanna go plex up North during Euro but be back with your blob down South by USTZ every day? Nope...
I'd go for that skill based solution though, but only a half hour per level.
Louis deGuerre wrote: If I have to change something in the highsec market and jump there i'm stuck there for 24 hours for no good reason.
Why'd ya jump then? |

Apollo Gabriel
Mercatoris Etherium Cartel
338
|
Posted - 2011.12.09 19:52:00 -
[44] - Quote
Make JC cost isk, and have it increase substantially as you use it.
24 hour cooldown is base, 1 m isk for each hour reduced, then the next time you use it, 2m isk for each hour reduced, then 3 m isk for each hour reduced, etc.
Sometimes it pays to be fast, other times just wait it out. I'm a ******* profanity filter that can catch **** and *****, but fuckin little else. -á
|

Nahrud Zirud
Hedion University Amarr Empire
0
|
Posted - 2011.12.09 20:04:00 -
[45] - Quote
this is not the feedback and ideas section of the forums, go post it there for beeter success |

Brooks Puuntai
Nomadic Asylum KUGUTSUMEN.
303
|
Posted - 2011.12.09 20:12:00 -
[46] - Quote
Nahrud Zirud wrote:this is not the feedback and ideas section of the forums, go post it there for beeter success
Your right.. However this is more a general discussion on the positive and negative affects of changing the jump clone timer.. Though it was nice of you to try and play forum police. Its cute.
|

Samantha Utama
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2011.12.09 21:22:00 -
[47] - Quote
Clone jump cooldown should be directly proportional to jump distance. |

Grayn
Esokal Command Vera Cruz Alliance
2
|
Posted - 2011.12.11 14:28:00 -
[48] - Quote
So far, the only argument I've seen in this thread against close clone jumping (same region or station) is "deal with it" or "this is just how it is". This only proves my point that the current timer is more of an hassle than a "challenge" and doesnt really add anything to gameplay.
In fact, if im stuck in an expensive clone somewhere unsafe and i dont feel like PVE'ing, ill probably just stay docked or only go on op I feel are safe. Basically, a player stuck in a expensive clone often results in an inactive player ship spinning.
I guess you could say its sort of a choice whether to jump clone or not, but then you cant really predict whats going to happen in the next 24 hours can you? |

Whiff
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
18
|
Posted - 2011.12.11 16:22:00 -
[49] - Quote
Karn Dulake wrote:Make it instant
I dont care about you lot i only care about me
(In before hate)
Instant - Do it. |

Avon
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
123
|
Posted - 2011.12.11 17:13:00 -
[50] - Quote
The jump clone timer should be removed by removing jump clones. Problem solved.
It was a stupid idea in the first place.
|

Widemouth Deepthroat
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
6
|
Posted - 2011.12.11 18:10:00 -
[51] - Quote
Apollo Gabriel wrote:Make JC cost isk, and have it increase substantially as you use it.
24 hour cooldown is base, 1 m isk for each hour reduced, then the next time you use it, 2m isk for each hour reduced, then 3 m isk for each hour reduced, etc.
Sometimes it pays to be fast, other times just wait it out. this but tbh it is already in the game in the form of podding yourself to your med clone (costs you whatever implants + update clone which is fine imo).
|

Zarian Uphius
Red Sky Morning BricK sQuAD.
4
|
Posted - 2011.12.11 18:14:00 -
[52] - Quote
Lord Zim wrote:Or you can just update the clone to a different station and pod your sorry ass.
This |

Marlona Sky
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
158
|
Posted - 2011.12.11 18:15:00 -
[53] - Quote
Power projection needs a nerf, not a buff. Voted no. |

Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1289
|
Posted - 2011.12.11 18:21:00 -
[54] - Quote
I love all this talk about force projection, it's like people have never heard of supercapitals |

Burseg Sardaukar
Sardaukar Merc Guild General Tso's Alliance
69
|
Posted - 2011.12.11 18:22:00 -
[55] - Quote
RaTTuS wrote:Having a skill that reduces it to 22hrs for level 5 I could live with ....
Maybe more like 2 hrs per level? We have a blog, it is terrible. How to fix Bounty Hunting |

Spurty
V0LTA VOLTA Corp
66
|
Posted - 2011.12.11 18:24:00 -
[56] - Quote
If you want EVE to feel big again, remove jump Clones (return our implants)
if you want eve to feel tiny (becuase you can appear across he map in seconds), reduce timer
Nothing else you point out in your posts matters. Just symptoms of this two Facts
EVE used to feel really vast when:
I had no skill for MWDs - could not fly better than a cruiser T1 - no access to jump bridges - no warp to zero - no carriers jumping 3 months of ships up to 0.0 - no jump clones - I had to wake up at 3am to change skills
I f'ing hated all of the above.
Just leave this part of the game alone now.
Other stuff to fix before you start breaking things ---- CONCORD arrested two n00bs yesterday, one was drinking battery acid, the other was eating fireworks. They charged one and let the other one off. |

Lord Zim
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
278
|
Posted - 2011.12.11 18:26:00 -
[57] - Quote
I love this talk about force projection, it's like there isn't an alternative that takes 2 minutes pr use, 3 if your fat fingers can't update the clone and set a new station quickly enough. |

Avon
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
123
|
Posted - 2011.12.11 18:53:00 -
[58] - Quote
Lord Zim wrote:I love this talk about force projection, it's like there isn't an alternative that takes 2 minutes pr use, 3 if your fat fingers can't update the clone and set a new station quickly enough.
Doing it the "old way" with medical clones was fine - there were plenty of restrictions and costs to balance. (Such as where you could jump to / where you were (no medical station, no setting a new clone destination) / loss of implants / clone cost / potentially having to use an uninsured clone).
Jumpclones aren't needed, they are just a carebearish way to avoid the above problems - thus making force projection easier, less costly and more convenient.
I used them to great effect and in fact can still use them to access stations where I just couldn't go otherwise. It is great for me, but bad for the game.
Get rid of them or at worst, leave them as they are. |

Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1289
|
Posted - 2011.12.11 20:37:00 -
[59] - Quote
Or remove jump clone cooldowns when you're doing it in the same station. |

Jita Alt666
644
|
Posted - 2011.12.11 20:52:00 -
[60] - Quote
Andski wrote:I love all this talk about force projection, it's like people have never heard of supercapitals
How many supercapitals have been in fights since last Wednesday? |
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