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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 3 post(s) |
Alakazam
Bob The Builder Breidablik
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Posted - 2006.12.13 14:01:00 -
[31]
Originally by: Haks'he Lirky CCP has roughly 100 employees.
Most of those are people who are mature and quite frankly old, a great portion of them have spent more than 6 years working on their dream project wich is EVE online. The founders have been living this dream since 1997, thats nine years.
Do you seriously think that these people would allow their fellow employees to mess with a dream thats been almost a decade in the making?
This is not quake or counterstrike, cheating has long lasting effects on the economy and the very future of EVE online.
Read the Dev blogs of Oveur to fully understand that he is a man that lives the EVE dream not to get killmails or Sovereignity victories. Read Skellibjallas blog and think why he should spend time cheating in eve to gain fame, go on read all the dev blogs and wonder if those people are cheating their dreams and occupation.
Go on...
the OP is not about what actually a CCP doing anything pro or con anyone, he's just proposing that they shouldn't be allowed to play so that there are absolute no doubt that they don't do anything they shouldn't.
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DB Preacher
Reikoku Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2006.12.13 14:01:00 -
[32]
Originally by: Mariko San
Originally by: DB Preacher ASCN have utterly and completely lost the plot.
It's absolutely fantastic.
dbp
Why?
You know as well as anyone that several GMs and even some Devs have characters in BoB. By the same token there are similar people in other alliances.
No actually, I haven't got a clue if there are or aren't.
Neither do you, and neither do ASCN.
But what is absolutely fantastic about all this is that instead of ASCN actually looking for the real reasons behind their complete and utter failure as a 0.0 power, they are trying to blame it on GM's, Hax's, cheating, excuses, pc's blowing up and everything else.
As a dev of another game myself I can look at this impartially and say that ALL of this is absolutely and utterly hilarious,
Keep it up ASCN you are destroying your alliance faster than we ever could have,
dbp
Caldari Alliance PVP Championship Winner Current RKK Ranking: (PSCAL6) Proficient Short Tanto
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Nez Perces
Amarr Black Spot.
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Posted - 2006.12.13 14:01:00 -
[33]
Edited by: Nez Perces on 13/12/2006 14:04:46
...and the fun continues...
soo..
I think all your questions will be answered once Malochon decides to grace us with his presence.....
Originally by: Malochon Draco, Exceed Inc pilot Some things can't be proven, even if they are true. Other things I know are bound by confidentiality, to which I am coming dangerously close of breaking.
I've probably already said more than I should have according to some, but depending on how it goes from here, if it all doesn't matter anymore to the people involved, it will come out.
I can't say more until I talked to some people about our course of action from here on out, but if it is up to me you will hear exactly what happened. Regardless of the consequences for Eve and CCP.
Your post assumes what Malochon implies, that not only are there GM's in BoB (like there may well be in any number of alliances).. but that they congregate in order to.. and I quote ... "end up controlling a significant chunk of the playable area".
Do you realise the implications of what your post implies or asks about?
I really mean that, do you understand what this would mean if true?
Where do you get this stuff from. Is it spoonfed to you by your HC? ... or do you have a shred of evidence to support it?
Unbelievable, ASCN hits hard times and off we go with these CCP theories.
Why is it that only when alliances lose stuff does this topic rear its ugly head?
I wonder if BoB was losing Delve or Period Basis, would we get ASCN players implying or asking the same questions about CCP... I wonder.
[edit:typo]
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Plan Neun
Caldari Ganja Unlimited Serenity Fallen
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Posted - 2006.12.13 14:02:00 -
[34]
Edited by: Plan Neun on 13/12/2006 14:18:50
Originally by: Aen Bolusova Heh, I can hardly catch up to the responses, though most of them completely miss the point.
I'm happy with CCP having players in the game as it keeps them in touch with both how the code really works and with the player base. I also don't think any CCP employee in his right mind would use his influence to harm the players. I was just hoping to become enlightened as to the situation and hopefully getting some commentary on what it means in a global sense.
What garantee do we have that this gamers is not messing with politics, giving items etc etc, hints etc etc and therefore manipulate the game. We have none. And when we see whats going on in RL around the world what makes us think that the employee's in CCP has higher human standards.
I dont buy the garantees from CCP at all because of the human factor to error (greed etc, personal gain, taking sides in wars etc).
Such participation should be illegal, thats my opinion on this topic.
Cheers Signing off Galnet
Plan Neun
"I Will Drug You and Fluff You, through the permafrost"
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Del369
Caldari Office linebackers Center for Disease Creation
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Posted - 2006.12.13 14:03:00 -
[35]
I used to GM in the last game i played, there was only 2 sides in that and i only fought for one (even though people could and did swap sides much to the consternation of most others) my GM tools gave me the ability to cross sides when ever needed, to see both sides secure command channels, and to see everyone on the battlefield as opposed to just the one side a normal player would see. i had no problem what so ever of keeping my passion for the one side completely seperate from my completely unbiased duties as a GM, not only that but neither did 99% of my GM colleagues. ofc the GM's here play the game, but you can bet your arse that CCP has made it clear in no uncertain terms that the 2 shall never mix, and if they do, and are caught doing sillies, said caught GM will be out gone and banned for life. When you love something the last thing you want to do is fak it all up by being stupid, any GM in any game anywhere knows this it's not exactly rocket science. in fact i'd say from personal experience that you need to give GM's some credit, because they aren't as a rule stupid. imho
Originally by: Wrangler That is an outright lie! We don't want to discriminate anyone! We want *both* anti-social *and* social players to grief each other!
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Aen Bolusova
Gallente The Older Gamers Ascendant Frontier
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Posted - 2006.12.13 14:05:00 -
[36]
Originally by: DirtyHarry So DEVs and GMs shouldnt be able to experience the game they created/manage?
Seriously, man, you didn't even read the post.
Originally by: Blacklight Read this post by t20
Thanks Blacklight, that's pretty much what I was looking for. They're here, but the consequences of their discovery is severe.
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Tiuwaz
Minmatar Omacron Militia
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Posted - 2006.12.13 14:05:00 -
[37]
@op
grow up
devs playing the game can only help the game, and i think the eve devs have by far enough credibilty to not suspect them for any misbehaviour
every alliance that wins has either A) GM's B) Sploiters C) Devs D) Haxers
in short: start taking the anti-paranoia pills again plz ___________________________________
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Dekiri
Exanimo Inc
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Posted - 2006.12.13 14:06:00 -
[38]
Oh yea... if the GM's and Dev's would not spent a certain time on playing the game it would suck like most other games do. You need to be in touch with a product you develope and need to know about it to be able to do anything in it.
Just imagine people who are there to balance a game would not play it????
Especially in eve with all the fitting possibilities it would completly go downhill ....
I really wonder why some people can't think a bit and try to understand a bit more instead of just complaining...
--------------------------------- My dad can beat up your dad! |
Aen Bolusova
Gallente The Older Gamers Ascendant Frontier
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Posted - 2006.12.13 14:08:00 -
[39]
Oh, and by the way, attributing what anyone in ASCN says to the whole of the alliance is just absurd. I don't speak for the alliance, and I certainly don't want to put any blame on BoB. It's been a lot of fun so far, to be honest.
I just wanted to know more about this one aspect of the game. I believe my initial worries were mostly unfounded, and I'm happy that is the case.
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Extreme
Eye of God Axiom Empire
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Posted - 2006.12.13 14:09:00 -
[40]
I don't care about anyones opinion.
Aen Bolusova made a valid point;
1. CCP's integrity (involving employee's playing Eve) 2. CCP's credability (too many 'things' happened) 3. "Infested" Eve-TV (last Tournament was "clan" TV)
Somehow, somewhere, CCP got an image problem.
Definately some measures should be taken by CCP leadership to restore all 3 points. . .
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qrac
Caldari Shiva Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2006.12.13 14:09:00 -
[41]
Originally by: DB Preacher
No actually, I haven't got a clue if there are or aren't.
Neither do you, and neither do ASCN.
But I do and I think you do too even though you aren't in evol
Do I think they cheat? No. -------------------------------------------
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Ranko
Antares Frontier
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Posted - 2006.12.13 14:09:00 -
[42]
Edited by: Ranko on 13/12/2006 14:12:13 Another paranoia based post and/or thread replies.
Its common knowledge that Devs and GMs play this game, both in an official capacity, as advertised by their ISD corp. status etc. We also know they have normal player-made accounts which are members of various alliances and corp., come on its their game they can play it as mere mortals too you know.
Its also common knowledge that the tools that empower a GM or a DEV to do their job in an official capacity of a CCP employee are also stored under lock-and-key security within CCP HQ its self, the tools they use never leave the premises of CCP and this is the fundamental reasons why each and every single GM and/or dev/employee of CCP is relocated to Iceland, there is not one EVE:Online (CCP) employee who requires the GM/Dev toolset based outside of Iceland (China GMs, and DEVs withstanding, they are in Shanghi).
If the GMs and Devs wish to play the game as normal, they canÆt use their official empowered accounts by default (apart from Event staff, which play from within the building :P ) they play normal accounts either in their office (lol I want that kind of job) or play outside their working hours... They are limited to the same game mechanics that you and I are limited too; they canÆt empower their own accounts just because they are Devs or GMs....
ThereÆs been one recorded event in history that a new GM that did abuse their powers and gave out a lot of high powered items, that GM I believe was booted out of CCP so hard and fast, I think he left a skid mark on the runway at Heathrow when he landed (figuratively speaking).
So all this chatter and slander about various GMs and/or Devs abusing their CCP related accounts to benefit others and their 'normal' accounts is stupid, yes they know more about game mechanics and the technology behind EVE a lot more then you or I do, of course they do they work for CCP, they help maintain and/or design the very code base we use to play on. BUT they can not use their knowledge in anyway, shape or form to which would give any extraordinary beneficial precedence to their normal accounts, any corp. they are in relations with or any alliance their normal non-empowered accounts are members of. Sure they know ways of 'cheating', 'hacking', 'abusing' the system, would they do it? No they wouldnÆt, itÆs not their 5-6 digit salary.
So think, before you unwittingly slander and abuse various CCP and EVE:Online employees, not everyone is as paranoid in nature as you are.
ThatÆs my 2 pence on this subject
I now await the rebuttals, slander and abuse I am about to receive due to this post.
Edit: Typos etc ---
fixed my sig images from 24,241 bytes to 23,997 bytes ^_^ |
Aen Bolusova
Gallente The Older Gamers Ascendant Frontier
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Posted - 2006.12.13 14:13:00 -
[43]
Originally by: Ranko Edited by: Ranko on 13/12/2006 14:10:29 ThereÆs been one recorded event in history that a new GM that did abuse their powers and gave out a lot of high powered items, that GM I believe was booted out of CCP so hard and fast, I think he left a skid mark on the runway at Heathrow when he landed (figuratively speaking).
So all this chatter and slander about various GMs and/or Devs abusing their CCP related accounts to benefit others and their 'normal' accounts if stupid...
It's only stupid if the situation you described is common knowledge, and it's not. That's why I asked.
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Kuolematon
Space Perverts and Forum Warriors United
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Posted - 2006.12.13 14:16:00 -
[44]
At least PapaSmurf is still lowsec ganker pirate in some well known corporation. Mostly all dev's still play for gankfest.
I don't know many devs who are hisec empire huggers "It's great being Amarr, ain't it?Ö"
"A world without pain" |
Fi T'Zeh
Evolution Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2006.12.13 14:17:00 -
[45]
I couldn't pass up the opportunity to post this one.
O RLY
<3
Dont post pictures directly, link to them instead please. I fixed it for you this time. - Devil Hanzo
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Real men use blasters |
qrac
Caldari Shiva Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2006.12.13 14:21:00 -
[46]
Edited by: qrac on 13/12/2006 14:21:22 Did this thread disappear or something? I can't find it without using a direct link.
edit: ahh.. they moved it. -------------------------------------------
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Ranko
Antares Frontier
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Posted - 2006.12.13 14:22:00 -
[47]
Originally by: Aen Bolusova It's only stupid if the situation you described is common knowledge, and it's not. That's why I asked.
There was a Dev-Blog about this ohh a few months back I belive, but I could be incorrect about such matters. ---
fixed my sig images from 24,241 bytes to 23,997 bytes ^_^ |
ScoRpS
0utbreak
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Posted - 2006.12.13 14:25:00 -
[48]
tbh i would be more concerned if devs didnt moonlight in the game, it should give them a good idea of whats goin on at grass roots level and make more informed changes with each new patch. Its like salesmen who believe in their product so much that they use it themselves!
And i am sure Oveur would do unspeakable things to any member of his staff caught abusing their privelages!
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Aen Bolusova
Gallente The Older Gamers Ascendant Frontier
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Posted - 2006.12.13 14:25:00 -
[49]
Originally by: Ranko There was a Dev-Blog about this ohh a few months back I belive, but I could be incorrect about such matters.
If you've got a title or link I'd appreciate it.
I'm not sure why my honest questions were worthy of so much acrimony. I guess that's par for the Eve-online course.
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Jap theBlind
Minmatar The Wanderers
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Posted - 2006.12.13 14:28:00 -
[50]
Having a fleet battle against BoB, one year ago so discard the ASCN thing. It's a regular fleet battle, nothing special. A GM pops in and pats on the back of several BoB pilots.
Does this prove anything? No, it does not.
Maybe it's enough to raise some questions, but nothing more.
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DB Preacher
Reikoku Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2006.12.13 14:28:00 -
[51]
Edited by: DB Preacher on 13/12/2006 14:28:33
Originally by: Aen Bolusova Oh, and by the way, attributing what anyone in ASCN says to the whole of the alliance is just absurd. I don't speak for the alliance, and I certainly don't want to put any blame on BoB. It's been a lot of fun so far, to be honest.
I just wanted to know more about this one aspect of the game. I believe my initial worries were mostly unfounded, and I'm happy that is the case.
Then perhaps, just perhaps, you shouldn't have said:
Originally by: Aen Bolusova I was told recently that a number of GMs have admitted that they're in BoB. I don't know if this is true or not, but it makes me wonder.
As for us not attributing one post to the whole of an alliance... that would be fine if it wasn't the majority of your alliance posting ridiculous claims on the forums.
dbp
Caldari Alliance PVP Championship Winner Current RKK Ranking: (PSCAL6) Proficient Short Tanto
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ApophisXP
Cutting Edge Incorporated RAZOR Alliance
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Posted - 2006.12.13 14:29:00 -
[52]
Edited by: ApophisXP on 13/12/2006 14:28:52 stop moaning just cause ur alliance lost ur strongest asset.
The GM's that do play dont have enough time as it is to play to our level. Most of the time theyre working on GM thingies like petitions or fixing stuff. The last thing they need is for wingy minge bags like urself to start punching holes in them and ruining their day.
To end it. Grow up. If you dont wanna grow up, get a coke, sit down and stfu.
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Zeknichov
Amarr Black Avatar Firmus Ixion
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Posted - 2006.12.13 14:31:00 -
[53]
If they don't play the game then they can't make proper changes to improve the game. If they are not allowed to play the game why would they want to invest their efforts into something when they can't even reap the benefits. Developers playing the game is for the best. I'd rather developers make changes to the game based on their impressions from playing the game then make changes based on what will give them a higher profit margin. Sure CCP could screw up their game if they were power hungry but I have more faith in the devs then that.
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vipeer
Celestial Horizon Corp. Ascendant Frontier
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Posted - 2006.12.13 14:31:00 -
[54]
I hope you all agree that if one pilot warps into a fleet of 50+ ships and the consequence of that is in 100% destruction of his ship within seconds. This person then petitions the loss and his ship is reimbursed on grounds of lagging out apparently.
ASCN was the 50+ ships and a person not in ASCN was the one who got blown up in a full faction kitted ship.
Dunno about you but it sure raised my eybrows...
All conspiracy theories aside: A lot of odd "things" took place since BoBo declared on us. Starting with the constant node crashes and people complaining about not getting their ships back or getting ships back after 2-3 weeks. "Things" continued throughout the war. Oddly enough node never crashed when there were GMs in local... I agree a lot of deaths were caused by people not being good at pvp. The war took a U turn after 3 weeks of constant node crashes and ASCN fleet ALWAYS being on the receiving end of the punishment and CCP could not care less about it. People were sick of loosing ships to CCP, lag, node crashes, fleets dissapearing, screwed up POS timers... A very strange was the occurence when a GM told us that sharing accounts is legal and after we responded citing the EULA promptly deleted the petition. Thank you CCP for an excellent game but when the people working for you are blowing off and dismissing the opinions of 5000 account holders of the makers of 0.0 the way it was meant to be you should expect an uproar.
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Vala Draaken
Gallente Madhatters Inc.
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Posted - 2006.12.13 14:31:00 -
[55]
It's not the first time this question has come up.
Originally by: "Gnauton" I can tell you for sure that most of the devs who play the game (about 20 or so, to the best of my knowledge) are noob- to mid-level players. There's only one I can think of that can reasonably be called "uber," and that's just because he was an utterly manic EVE player long long before being hired. ... Sometimes, if what we're asking about is an implemented feature, we'll be able to wrest an answer from the programmer or designer in question. Most often, though, the answer is the same: "Ask the players," delivered in that same tone, betraying a cynical sort of wonder at how utterly our players dominate us at our own game.
From this post.
Hope that explains,
Vala D.
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Hitomi Ito
Caldari F13
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Posted - 2006.12.13 14:32:00 -
[56]
Originally by: Plan Neun Edited by: Plan Neun on 13/12/2006 14:18:50 I dont buy the garantees from CCP at all because of the human factor to error (greed etc, personal gain, taking sides in wars etc).
I don't really get where you're coming from. You seem to think them playing involves them constantly having access to tools/information that puts them leagues above us when they don't. Not to mention that, as many others have posted, the higher-ups at CCP wouldn't allow them to "ruin" the game by flooding the economy with spawned ISK/items/ships.
To those that say there's a conflict of interest. Exactly what interest? And if there's a CCP employee playing char that's in BoB and another that's in ASCN, what does that prove? Seriously, I'm pretty sure they all play just like you and I do. Better yet, they just might do what we do and talk about what they, heck, maybe even brag a little. Unless there's a blatant bias (ALL of them are in BoB, which you can't prove) there's no conflict of interest.
@OP: It's been common practice for Devs/GM to play the game they work on since MMOGs were created. Every company does log tracking, especially of GM tool/command use, so I doubt it would ever be a problem for CCP. You can't please everyone either, there's always going to be someone that doesn't like X because of Y. Just so happens that this is one of those cases and it's much easier to pull it on the people who run the show.
Food for thought, what if they told you they weren't allowed to play and continued to do so? You'd never know and suddenly the "CCP is doing bad things!" argument would be dead, but they'd still be flying beside you or against you. It's weird how people work.
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Lisento Slaven
Amarr The Drekla Consortium Kurai Komichi
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Posted - 2006.12.13 14:34:00 -
[57]
Hypothetical Situation:
Dev/GM/Employee XYZ comes across petition. Petition leads him to learn information regarding his in-game enemy ABC.
I don't think the OP is talking about spawning isk for yourself, your alliance, your friends, msetting mobs, sseting chars, osetting modules, or whatever the commands would be in EVE. It's a perfectly reasonable question to wonder if people in a position to have such endless possibilities, are going to pursue any of those possibilities.
Have you ever wondered what happens if you petition your POS that you've setup in enemy territory and the person who deals with it knows exactly every setting etc. in it? How about all those logs the employee's of CCP sift through all the time? I could imagine there is some pretty nifty stuff they find out all the time =P ---
Lisento Slaven wants to be a Space Whaler in EVE.
Put in space whales!
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Aen Bolusova
Gallente The Older Gamers Ascendant Frontier
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Posted - 2006.12.13 14:35:00 -
[58]
I think my concerns have been addressed. Thanks for the information, those that provided some. The rest of you can continue to throw monkey ****.
Cheers all.
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Hitomi Ito
Caldari F13
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Posted - 2006.12.13 14:37:00 -
[59]
At some point I'd like to think the people saying CCP employees use information to their advantage would think that maybe, just MAYBE, they have more to do outside of a video game. Especially when said actions might risk their job.
Just saying...
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Nev Clavain
Wise Guys Rogue Method Alliance
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Posted - 2006.12.13 14:37:00 -
[60]
Edited by: Nev Clavain on 13/12/2006 14:40:11 Edited by: Nev Clavain on 13/12/2006 14:38:59
Originally by: DB Preacher
Aye, I'm the one claiming that ASCN are gm's and dev's, that we sploit, hax, cheat our way to victory, that we crash pc's remotely and god knows what other hilarious stuff they have come up with.
It's awesome, absolutely awesome.
dbp
No one is really claiming that. Perhaps nuance and the tone of a post escapes you utterly, but the guy was talking about a potential conflict of interest, not about BoB Haxploits rahrahrah. He happened to use your alliance as an example, and you came storming in all guns blazing.
To be honest, it would stun me if your alliance didn't have one or two people who can make critical game decisions. GMs and Devs play this game too. Why is it impossible that some could be in BoB, or ASCN, or any corp/ alliance anywhere?
The fact that your reaction is so over the top is probably the most suspicious thing in this thread. But then you rarely seem to be able to control yourself, so it is in character at least.
My personal opinion is that people who have a position of responsibility like GM or Dev within the game, are for the mostpart going to be trustworthy and diligent, and will not use thier influence to bend the game in their favour. I am also sure there are multiple safe-guards (lol F E G is filtered now? sa***uards) to prevent the abuse of GM/ Dev powers, and that any actions they take will be logged thoroughly via independent systems, and scrutinised at the first sign of foul play.
The positive side is that it is important that Devs and GMs know how the game is to play, so they can help to develop / manage it in the best way. There is of course a potential for abuse, but I would hope that this is mitigated by stringent checks and balances.
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