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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 4 post(s) |
Aisha Shimaya
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2
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Posted - 2015.10.02 20:22:39 -
[91] - Quote
Zappity wrote: A single scripted module capable of mitigating both turret and missile damage would be practically compulsory and make drones even stronger. I like the idea of separate ewar modules even though it will be more difficult to use this way.
Maybe lower the disruptor effect a bit and make it work on drones too ? |
Soldarius
Naliao Inc. Test Alliance Please Ignore
1381
|
Posted - 2015.10.02 20:23:06 -
[92] - Quote
Ransu Asanari wrote:I've expected to see these for a while, and generally I'm in favor of them. I do wonder why you've chosen to give this new EWAR ability to Amarr however - yes it fits alongside Tracking Disruptors, but Amarr already get Tracking Disruption and Energy Neutralizers as a primary and secondary EWAR on their class ships. So now they're going to have Missile Disruption as well? Caldari ships only get ECM and... ECM. That's it - they have no secondary EWAR capability on their Electronic Attack Ships, or Recon Ships. Unless you are also planning on introducing a drone counter EWAR system, would it not make more sense to give this ability to Caldari ships? I understand that may take more work to revamp all of the ships, but if an ECM rebalance is in the works anyway, logically it would make sense to give drone and missile EWAR to Caldari ships. I've outlined a bit more detail on this here, and I believe Corbexx may have sent it your way: https://www.reddit.com/r/Eve/comments/3itkns/rogue_drone_battleship_grasping_robot_arms_have/cuke0v4
The short answer is that "tracking disruption" is Amarr EWAR. However, your argument is very persuasive.
Thoughts, CCP Fozzie?
http://youtu.be/YVkUvmDQ3HY
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W0lf Crendraven
Welfcorp
353
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Posted - 2015.10.02 20:36:39 -
[93] - Quote
Ripard Teg wrote:If they're going to use the same skills/bonuses as Tracking Disruptors, why not just use missile disruption scripts for the existing Tracking Disruptors instead of a new module? As always ( ), my thinking here is geared toward small gang, who while roaming are not going to know if they're going to be facing turret ships or missile ships until they're facing them.
cause that would make them op as hell and the got to mod for every spare mid |
Arthur Aihaken
CODE.d
4685
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Posted - 2015.10.02 20:40:47 -
[94] - Quote
Well, this is quite possibly the biggest missile nerf in EVE history. You might as well just eliminate all missile systems other than rapid light and heavy launchers, because after this you won't be able to even hit a battleship with heavy assault or heavy missiles - let alone torpedoes or cruise missiles.
I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.
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unidenify
Plundering Penguins Solyaris Chtonium
141
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Posted - 2015.10.02 20:42:46 -
[95] - Quote
unidenify wrote:I have big concern that I would like to see to be addressed.
current missile has issue where any change on missile range during in flight cause it to disappear
it is common knowledge among Golem pilot that once missile get in flight and bastion either go online or offline after launch, Missile simple disappear.
need to quote this again because this is important issue if we were to bring disruptor into missile |
Solarus Explorer
The Church of Awesome Heiian Conglomerate
7
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Posted - 2015.10.02 20:55:33 -
[96] - Quote
This mod single-handedly kills all missile fits using medium and large missiles, and quite handsomely nerfs the small missiles as well. While this would be appreciated by people who fight garmurs and orhtrus's in low-sec (they wont hit anything now with a single sentinel on field)...... it also makes all the larger missiles totally useless, as they were pretty close to being useless already frankly.
Well.......... adapt and live....... Sentinels is the new low-sec meta ! |
Nix Pardus
Stay Frosty. A Band Apart.
1
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Posted - 2015.10.02 21:02:37 -
[97] - Quote
Has CCP found a fix for the bug where missiles with partial seconds of flight time loose their last tick of flight?
https://www.reddit.com/r/Eve/comments/3f38ok/major_bug_with_missile_volleys_completely/
If it isn't fixed this will compound with the effects of missile disruptors and make them more powerful than intended. |
elitatwo
Eve Minions The-Company
864
|
Posted - 2015.10.02 21:07:48 -
[98] - Quote
Harvey James wrote:Bienator II wrote:something tells me there will be a HAM, torp, cruise buff in conjunction with this mod. Because things like torp ravens will hate those new mods. HAM's and rockets need a range nerf .. they are both a class up atm from what they should be.
Please stop!
And don't let e2 see the thread, this is really important. When she comes back on Friday evening after visiting her parents - ohohhhh..
Tired of low and nullsec? Join Eve Minions and experience the beauty of wormholes!
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Altrue
Exploration Frontier inc
1972
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Posted - 2015.10.02 21:21:28 -
[99] - Quote
1- Thank you for not making an omni module that works on both turrets and missiles, leave more depth of choice and reason to have good intel.
2- I assume that the reduction of flight time and flight speed will apply on the same script? If so that's completely not okay! Reducing flight time and flight speed by 50% equals a 75% reduction in range, you should rebalance those values so that the TOTAL is 50%, instead of 50% on each stat.
Signature Tanking Best Tanking
Retired Exploration Frontier Inc [Ex-F] CEO - Ex-BRAVE - Eve-guides.fr
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Zappity
Black Aces I N F A M O U S
2480
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Posted - 2015.10.02 21:33:32 -
[100] - Quote
I'm a bit worried that drones will become even more powerful now. An AoE TD smartbomb would be nice. Or just have a TD affect a ship's drones as well as turrets.
Zappity's Adventures for a taste of lowsec.
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elitatwo
Eve Minions The-Company
865
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Posted - 2015.10.02 21:37:32 -
[101] - Quote
I leave you for a few hours and what do I get when I come back?
Dear CCP Fozzie, I have a couple or Navy buddies that owe me a favour and they are willing to give you are free of charge demonstration on how missiles work.
And if someone else needs a free of charge rocket demonstration, like Harvey does, I am willing to show you why you are mistaken.
What comes to mind at first? NO. Double NO. And of course HELL NO.
It is fine that you do not know the game mechanics quite as good as I do, you haven't been here long enough to see the error of your ways.
Let me elaborate. AGAIN.
When you finally give missiles back the application they once had, it will apply to all missiles. For the very, very slow, this means that defender missiles will recieve the biggest buff in the history of mankind.
If you find yourself a small missile ship gang, you can form your anti-missile gang with the same ships, just not as many and shoot most of the missiles down with rocket launcher (again for the very, very slow, you put the now freshly buffed and very, very useful defender missiles into the rocket launchers and press FONE) Caracal's.
Funny sidenote, the "friend or foe" missile has a very different name in the Air Force. They call them "fire and forget" missiles.
Now 80% of said missile gang in destroyed before the rest of your gang with beam Omens start working on them (or Zealots if you have them.)
Opponents Caracals disarmed. Fight lost.
For the capsuleers that believe something is overpowered, they should definately re-read of the definition of "overpowered". CCP made it very clear how they define something as overpowered.
A not funny sidenote, the energy neutralizer module fits into this category.
Now for the last time, missiles need to be taken seriously before you start throwing more unnecessary counters to them in the box.
And no I will not respond in kind. I hate to repeat myself over and over and over again.
You can read my esseys again if you want, I gave an explanation often enough.
On the ECM thing for Caldari there is a tiny error in the description of the ECM, which is the Caldari only sometimes get ECM. Everyone always get their ewar.
Tired of low and nullsec? Join Eve Minions and experience the beauty of wormholes!
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Warde Guildencrantz
Tundragon
1208
|
Posted - 2015.10.02 21:53:11 -
[102] - Quote
Sounds good, as much as I will be annoyed by these when I fly missile-based ships, not like I can't easily use them in 1v1s to screw over other missile-based ships.
TunDraGon ~ Low sec piracy since 2003 ~
Youtube ~ Join Us
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Petrified
Old and Petrified Syndication TOG - The Older Gamers Alliance
293
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Posted - 2015.10.02 22:09:10 -
[103] - Quote
Yadaryon Vondawn wrote:Question, why not have one module? The current Disruptors, but with this added functionality. Or a missile script. Especially if you are going for solo PVP I imagine this is a bit weird. You fit one module for all turrets, except for missiles. Now you have to choose which disruptor module to fit. All other EWAR is 'across the board', why is this designed for missiles only?
I see how it creates fitting options and more choices but I am genuinely interested in the thought proces behind creating a new module for this :)
I assume they want to ensure that one ship can't do it all - switch from one type of disruption to another (turret versus missile guidance). Also, EWAR is not across the board: There are multiple type of ECM depending on the ship target type as well as damps being seperate.
Now, what would be convenient, and very over powered, would be to have one type of EWAR module and just use scripts to change what it does: damps to ECM to tracking disruption to missile guidance disruption. |
Dani Maulerant
Order of the Valkyrie LOADED-DICE
37
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Posted - 2015.10.02 22:09:59 -
[104] - Quote
I strongly believe it should rather be a script for current TD's that convert them to missile disruptors. |
Chance Ravinne
WiNGSPAN Delivery Services The WINGSPAN Logo Alliance
519
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Posted - 2015.10.02 22:47:45 -
[105] - Quote
BTW thanks Fozzie for including the buff to Missile Guidance Enhancers/Computers in this change. This is something I have been hoping for for some time and asking for as a result of the somewhat sudden Aegis release nerfs to these modules.
Ultimately I think 10% is going to be good enough for Missile Guidance Computers (mid slots), since this will put them very closely in line with T2 application rigs. They won't be *as* good as TPs, but they are more flexible.
Still concerned the lowslot modules, Missile Guidance Enhancers, will need more love. Current bonuses are so low that 10% will barely eke over stacking penalties. I get the feeling a 20-25% buff will ultimately be what makes them worthwhile.
You've just read another awesome post by Chance Ravinne, CEO of EVE's #1 torpedo delivery service. Watch our misadventures on my YouTube channel: WINGSPANTT
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Tiberius Mathusia
Gallente Rebels Inc. Villore Accords
13
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Posted - 2015.10.02 22:49:02 -
[106] - Quote
The proposed effects seem quite weak compared to the effect TD's have on turrets. With an unbonused hull I can expect 40% range reduction against a turret with the optimal script but a 30% reduction in flight time doesn't even equate to a 30% in range because the missile range is still buoyed up by missile speed.
That said I'm glad it's being introduced given that TD fits are generally weak against missile boats. |
Marech Bhayanaka
Misfits United I N G L O R I O U S
58
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Posted - 2015.10.02 22:55:35 -
[107] - Quote
Riela Tanal wrote:As has been stated by others. If they go with the script method, every ship will fit just one of these tracking disruptors and swap the script out for whatever weapon type they are fighting. In the same way that every ship currently fits a sensor damp or ECM module?
Oh wait ... That hasn't actually happened, has it?
Marech. |
Lugh Crow-Slave
1239
|
Posted - 2015.10.02 22:57:15 -
[108] - Quote
so as predicted that "buff" to missiles is playing its course
Fuel block colors? Missiles for Caldari T3? Corp Stasis
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Marech Bhayanaka
Misfits United I N G L O R I O U S
58
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Posted - 2015.10.02 22:59:15 -
[109] - Quote
Petrified wrote: Now, what would be convenient, and very over powered, would be to have one type of EWAR module and just use scripts to change what it does: damps to ECM to tracking disruption to missile guidance disruption.
Damps work against all turret and missile ships, as do the generic ECM modules.
Marech. |
W0lf Crendraven
Welfcorp
353
|
Posted - 2015.10.02 23:04:07 -
[110] - Quote
elitatwo wrote:I leave you for a few hours and what do I get when I come back?
Dear CCP Fozzie, I have a couple or Navy buddies that owe me a favour and they are willing to give you are free of charge demonstration on how missiles work.
And if someone else needs a free of charge rocket demonstration, like Harvey does, I am willing to show you why you are mistaken.
What comes to mind at first? NO. Double NO. And of course HELL NO.
It is fine that you do not know the game mechanics quite as good as I do, you haven't been here long enough to see the error of your ways.
Let me elaborate. AGAIN.
When you finally give missiles back the application they once had, it will apply to all missiles. For the very, very slow, this means that defender missiles will recieve the biggest buff in the history of mankind.
If you find yourself a small missile ship gang, you can form your anti-missile gang with the same ships, just not as many and shoot most of the missiles down with rocket launcher (again for the very, very slow, you put the now freshly buffed and very, very useful defender missiles into the rocket launchers and press FONE) Caracal's.
Funny sidenote, the "friend or foe" missile has a very different name in the Air Force. They call them "fire and forget" missiles.
Now 80% of said missile gang in destroyed before the rest of your gang with beam Omens start working on them (or Zealots if you have them.)
Opponents Caracals disarmed. Fight lost.
For the capsuleers that believe something is overpowered, they should definately re-read of the definition of "overpowered". CCP made it very clear how they define something as overpowered.
A not funny sidenote, the energy neutralizer module fits into this category.
Now for the last time, missiles need to be taken seriously before you start throwing more unnecessary counters to them in the box.
And no I will not respond in kind. I hate to repeat myself over and over and over again.
You can read my esseys again if you want, I gave an explanation often enough.
On the ECM thing for Caldari there is a tiny error in the description of the ECM, which is the Caldari only sometimes get ECM. Everyone always get their ewar.
this is comedy gold |
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CaptainMorgan49
Troglodytes of Narnia
7
|
Posted - 2015.10.02 23:09:41 -
[111] - Quote
I'd agree with the missile guidance buffs empirically because I very rarely see those modules fitted to ships when people I know in eve are linking fits for every job imaginable or creating new doctrines; it follows therefore that they are not currently powerful enough to make them worth their weight in most setups.
I also like the idea of adding missile disruption to the ECM and turret disruption modules already in eve and feel they will fit in rather well.
To all those people who said "why not just have a single disruptor and then use scripts to target missiles or guns", I would say "for the same reason there isn't one ECM module and a script for each sensor type; Because it would be overpowered." I would also point out that every new type of module in eve widens the array of combat situation, which is great for variety in the game. |
Justa Hunni
State War Academy Caldari State
10
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Posted - 2015.10.02 23:12:41 -
[112] - Quote
TrouserDeagle wrote:afkalt wrote:TrouserDeagle wrote: not sure how a general missile buff to compensate for missile disruptors achieves that
Because if 75% of the systems are weak and 25% are too good, we reign in th 25% and give the 75% a leg up. Hit quote limit non-rapid/light missiles are fine. you just never see them because rapids and lights are op
I would hazard a guess that the reason you never see non-rapid/light missiles is because they are CRAP. While rapid lights and lights might be OP (and I'm still not sold on that) having only one or two usable weapon system classes for an ENTIRE race of ships seems a little one-sided. Glad those of us who fly Caldari don't fly their battleships . . . |
Matt Faithbringer
Rapid Withdrawal
21
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Posted - 2015.10.02 23:12:54 -
[113] - Quote
I hope we will be able to request refund on SP invested into missiles since you are nerfing them to the ground with this module. |
Haatakan Reppola
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
94
|
Posted - 2015.10.02 23:18:35 -
[114] - Quote
Matt Faithbringer wrote:I hope we will be able to request refund on SP invested into missiles since you are nerfing them to the ground with this module.
You can request that, but the answer will always be no |
Matt Faithbringer
Rapid Withdrawal
21
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Posted - 2015.10.02 23:20:09 -
[115] - Quote
Haatakan Reppola wrote:Matt Faithbringer wrote:I hope we will be able to request refund on SP invested into missiles since you are nerfing them to the ground with this module. You can request that, but the answer will always be no
I know, but come one, that module will render missiles almost useless |
Thirdsin
The Red Island Foundation Shadow Cartel
31
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Posted - 2015.10.02 23:25:02 -
[116] - Quote
DaJokr wrote:This means you're adding remote missile guidance enhancers to match all the other modules and balance it out, correct?
^this ccp |
Harvey James
The Sengoku Legacy
1200
|
Posted - 2015.10.02 23:27:00 -
[117] - Quote
Chance Ravinne wrote:BTW thanks Fozzie for including the buff to Missile Guidance Enhancers/Computers in this change. This is something I have been hoping for for some time and asking for as a result of the somewhat sudden Aegis release nerfs to these modules.
Ultimately I think 10% is going to be good enough for Missile Guidance Computers (mid slots), since this will put them very closely in line with T2 application rigs. They won't be *as* good as TPs, but they are more flexible.
Still concerned the lowslot modules, Missile Guidance Enhancers, will need more love. Current bonuses are so low that 10% will barely eke over stacking penalties. I get the feeling a 20-25% buff will ultimately be what makes them worthwhile.
m.. they are underwhelming mods atm, and having things like TP's and webs being more universal for just as good if not better at the job its very questionable they will ever be used much without nerfs too the aforementioned.
T3's need to be versatile not have T2 resists, OP dps and tank obsoleting T2 ships entirely.
ABC's are clearly T2 in all but name, remove drone assist, nerf sentries, -3 highslots for droneboats
Nerf web strength, Make the blaster Eagle worth using
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Niriel Greez
Specimen 794 Project.Mayhem.
34
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Posted - 2015.10.02 23:32:42 -
[118] - Quote
Before addressing some of the issues light missiles currently have with this 'fix', how about we look at fixing existing application issues of anything not light missiles?
Torpedoes and HMLs, and perhaps cruise to a certain extent, need some love. Ship velocity in particular has too much of an impact on damage application. |
Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE
1835
|
Posted - 2015.10.02 23:37:32 -
[119] - Quote
Tiberius Mathusia wrote:The proposed effects seem quite weak compared to the effect TD's have on turrets. With an unbonused hull I can expect 40% range reduction against a turret with the optimal script but a 30% reduction in flight time doesn't even equate to a 30% in range because the missile range is still buoyed up by missile speed.
That said I'm glad it's being introduced given that TD fits are generally weak against missile boats. considering that missile guidance computers add speed and time with a range script, I would assume that using a range script will drop flight speed and flight time. Seems pretty strong on the range side.
@ChainsawPlankto
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Jaiimez Skor
Hard Knocks Inc. Hard Knocks Citizens
121
|
Posted - 2015.10.02 23:43:35 -
[120] - Quote
My main dislike is the requirement to have 2 modules I am supportive of the idea of having a missile disruption script and gun disruption script but they all fit into the same module so instead of tracking disruptors we just have weapon disruptors. If this doesn't happen it will still make TD's MD's completely useless outside of blob warfare where you know what the other blob is bringing and can fit accordingly for small gang and roaming, other forms of ewar will still out-perform this to the point where it's not worth the fitting slot. |
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