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Thoughts on PLEX prices and what can possibly be done.

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Shade Alidiana PROSPERO Corporation MinTek Conglomerate 82	Posted - 2015.10.17 16:28:47 - [1] - Quote I've been thinking a lot in the light of the recent CCP proposal. Yes, they may really lack subs and want money. They have a right to. I have some friends that don't resub because PLEX prices went insane. They might come back. I also know some friends that don't even start because of that. And some alts aren't created for the same reason. That is one thing. Other thing. Mostly CCP introduce new stuff through aurum system. PLEX is tied to aur, so people (some of them) buy PLEX and turn it in. This increases demand for them, thus increasing price. CCP reasonably want more money so they introduce more and more stuff, and plex keeps going up all the time possibly because of that. Another thing. Some of the people buying PLEX turn it to aur and sell as, say, SKINs. This removes it from market, thus decreasing supply. Surely this increases its price. I don't think this factore is heavy enough, though. I may be wrong, not havung any stats. Yet another thing. For people that want to buy isk for $, PLEX isn't the best option. Maybe not even a good one. So, thoughts are: if we untie PLEX from AUR system, it might stabilize. Just don't let it be turned into AUR any more. Also, maybe (just maybe) it will help to decrease AUR price a little bit. 10-20% at most. Just to make PLEX a little more viable option. SKINs and clothes will still be bought, regardless. This way I expect to increase the supply of PLEXes on market. Now are there flaws in my logic or should I actually poke someone from CSM or CCP themself (or try to at least) with this idea? P. S. Please don't beat me for asking to increase AUR prices. That can be made to work in different ways, it's just a suggestion.
Mr Epeen It's All About Me 9260	Posted - 2015.10.17 16:32:12 - [2] - Quote Here's the solution in one sentence: If you find the price too high, don't buy it. Glad I could help. Mr Epeen There are 86,400 seconds in a day. You just saved one of them by typing 'u' instead of 'you'.-á Congratulations, dumbass!
Shade Alidiana PROSPERO Corporation MinTek Conglomerate 82	Posted - 2015.10.17 17:04:23 - [3] - Quote I think we were having player numbers issue here. The fact that I'm posting on forums suggests that I'm holding a subscription and so am mostly ok with the price. But we two (three, with the person that liked you) aren't alone in this world. I find the whole AUR thing disruptive to normal things' pace, so limiting PLEX to only being what it initially was (game time) and maybe way to pay for fanfest and similar tickets can do a little damage control. I wouldn't care if CCP didn't try silly things again and again to bring more people in. I've suggested a possible way to do so, without disrupting gameplay and other stuff. P. S. yes, I'm among those considering old EVE being better than current one. And it getting worse and worse with time (even thougs some features/changes are nice).
Chainsaw Plankton IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE 1905	Posted - 2015.10.17 17:15:12 - [4] - Quote if they uncouple plex and aur people will just look to see what gets the most isk and buy that. Might get a slight decline in price as I assume people are lazy, and will probably just buy plex. Look at the difference between the multi-character training cert and PLEX. there is almost no difference, but the MPTC trades with far lower volume. Also there are so many skins and clothing items that trading in those would get rather complected and a pain in the arse fast. way, way easier to just buy a plex convert to aur and get the skins you want. @ChainsawPlankto
Rykuss In Praise Of Bacchus 146	Posted - 2015.10.17 17:16:22 - [5] - Quote Here's a radical solution: Pay the sub. You, too, can be a Solid Gold dancer.
Shade Alidiana PROSPERO Corporation MinTek Conglomerate 82	Posted - 2015.10.17 17:28:21 - [6] - Quote Chainsaw Plankton wrote: if they uncouple plex and aur people will just look to see what gets the most isk and buy that. Might get a slight decline in price as I assume people are lazy, and will probably just buy plex. Look at the difference between the multi-character training cert and PLEX. there is almost no difference, but the MPTC trades with far lower volume. Also there are so many skins and clothing items that trading in those would get rather complected and a pain in the arse fast. way, way easier to just buy a plex convert to aur and get the skins you want. You can still buy aur and get the skins you want Currently, PLEXes that were bought just to be converted to AUR don't ever hit market. With my suggestion, as I stated in the OP, any PLEX purchased will be either used for game time (I consider 2nd character actually more game time, because it's quite similar to 2nd account without multiboxing option) or sold.
Akrasjel Lanate Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance 1836	Posted - 2015.10.17 17:43:14 - [7] - Quote Break the link between PLEX and Aurum. Akrasjel Lanate Member of Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance Citizen of Solitude
Deck Cadelanne CAStabouts 236	Posted - 2015.10.17 18:16:26 - [8] - Quote This is really simple: 1. In game PLEX price is a function of the market. Straight supply v. demand. Seeing as the number of player accounts has dropped and PLEX price has gone up, this suggests a drop in supply more than anything. 2. Has the recent PLEX sale increased supply and driven down the in game PLEX price? Market says no as in game PLEX price still going up. So why aren't players with jobs spending cash for PLEX? Perhaps because they already have enough ISK to do what they want? 3. Declining number of player accounts is not caused by in game PLEX price. It is caused by a lot of things but not that. If your friends were driven out of the game by the in game price of PLEX, they ought to consider getting jobs and just paying a sub. EVE is far more entertaining that way. *"When the going gets weird, the weird turn professional."* - Hunter S. Thompson
Calum Raholan Sektor 17 JJS Spectral Coalition 1	Posted - 2015.10.17 18:45:02 - [9] - Quote Deck Cadelanne wrote: This is really simple: 1. In game PLEX price is a function of the market. Straight supply v. demand. Seeing as the number of player accounts has dropped and PLEX price has gone up, this suggests a drop in supply more than anything. 2. Has the recent PLEX sale increased supply and driven down the in game PLEX price? Market says no as in game PLEX price still going up. So why aren't players with jobs spending cash for PLEX? Perhaps because they already have enough ISK to do what they want? 3. Declining number of player accounts is not caused by in game PLEX price. It is caused by a lot of things but not that. If your friends were driven out of the game by the in game price of PLEX, they ought to consider getting jobs and just paying a sub. EVE is far more entertaining that way. "Declining number of player accounts is not caused by in game PLEX price. It is caused by a lot of things but not that." If you want a TLDR just skip to the last paragraph. Oh come on you can't really believe that can you? I mean at least you accept is as a possibility from the following statement, but can we please look at this from the point of view of CCP as a business rather than the obligatory posts about get a job? I mean is it really going to help CCP in anyway by telling people to go get a job? We live in a day and age where there are people who genuinely lack the disposable income to subscribe to EVE Online while working and even though this will be a small minority shouldn't we at least take it in to account? It might just be the case that they are subscribed to one game as I know many gamers who limit themselves to this or it can get out of hand, should CCP be turning them away? We also have to remember that even though EVE has a mature player base, there is a younger community of gamer among us, many I know that have parents which disapprove of a subscription based model, should CCP be forgetting about them? The fact is that PLEX does allow a small portion of the player base to continue playing the game they love and at a time when CCP is literally having to ask us to play EVE as CCP Seagull did in one of the video updates if I am not mistaken. In my opinion something has to be done in order to prevent losing more of this ever shrinking playerbase. Now lets take some facts into account shall we? Now I'm a British scrub so I'm not sure if this is just for us, but... Plex cost more than a subscription. Now can we think about this from CCP's point of view? CCP would, I assume, rather someone bought a plex and it was used rather than someone subscribing to the game for a month and then hitting cancel as many players do now the reoccurring payment system has been introduced. So in fact, its more beneficial to CCP if these players don't get a job and then purchase a plex off the market, removing it from circulation and allowing for its position as cheapest in the market to be taken by another plex which will then be sold and so on and so forth. Now the counter argument to that is, well under your (referring to my) logic we should continue to let the prices rise as this will mean more people will want to buy and subsequently sell plex, which is absolutely correct to a certain extent. But we have to take into account this ISK price as only if the price is viable to the masses will plex continue to sell on the same scale. You must admit that two years ago it was relatively easy to plex off mining, by maybe putting in 24 hours a month making purchasing ingame plex a very viable option. It also would mean that for people wanting to sell plex, they would have to purchase more in order to get them same ISK value today. Now this is almost imposible on the same time scale as in 24 hours you would be extremely lucky if you made 800 Million, let alone 1.2 Billion as I last checked plex was sitting at. Now I could keep arguing with myself all evening and keep offering counterarguments, but to me having a lower price of plex ingame, would retain more of the playerbase and even bring some of our lost members back. I know its against the sandbox and EVE in general, however I think a cap on plex prices is something that seriously needs to be considered rather than disconnecting it from Aurum. Now I'm not talking something drastic, but I think that 1 Billion would be an interesting mark to at least discuss among the community, preferably with out the obligatory get a job comments as plex > subscription for CCP going of British figures (-ú15 > -ú10)
malcovas Henderson THoF 418	Posted - 2015.10.17 19:06:17 - [10] - Quote Every time I read a thread like this, I cannot help but to think "Self entitled fkwit"
Calum Raholan Sektor 17 JJS Spectral Coalition 1	Posted - 2015.10.17 19:15:13 - [11] - Quote malcovas Henderson wrote: Every time I read a thread like this, I cannot help but to think "Self entitled fkwit" Then please make a constructive contribution to the discussion.
malcovas Henderson THoF 418	Posted - 2015.10.17 19:19:40 - [12] - Quote Calum Raholan wrote: malcovas Henderson wrote: Every time I read a thread like this, I cannot help but to think "Self entitled fkwit" Then please make a constructive contribution to the discussion. I just did.
Calum Raholan Sektor 17 JJS Spectral Coalition 1	Posted - 2015.10.17 19:46:41 - [13] - Quote malcovas Henderson wrote: Calum Raholan wrote: malcovas Henderson wrote: Every time I read a thread like this, I cannot help but to think "Self entitled fkwit" Then please make a constructive contribution to the discussion. I just did. Then please make a constructive contribution to CCP by at least stating your opinions on the subject matter originally stated in the first post of the thread instead of focusing on the individuals that are moving for these proposals.
malcovas Henderson THoF 418	Posted - 2015.10.17 20:16:43 - [14] - Quote Calum Raholan wrote: malcovas Henderson wrote: Calum Raholan wrote: malcovas Henderson wrote: Every time I read a thread like this, I cannot help but to think "Self entitled fkwit" Then please make a constructive contribution to the discussion. I just did. Then please make a constructive contribution to CCP by at least stating your opinions on the subject matter originally stated in the first post of the thread instead of focusing on the individuals that are moving for these proposals. I would imaging calling someone complaining about the price of plex, "A self entitled fkwit", would point directly to the side of the fence I am sitting on, and my opinion of said "proposals"
ArmyOfMe Hull Breach. Outnumbered. 478	Posted - 2015.10.17 20:19:00 - [15] - Quote If you think plex prices are bad atm, just wait until that sp for isk comes into play, cause plex prices will skyrocket then. QUOTE CCP Dolan and the EVE Online development team:-áThe battle was relatively even for some time with CFC and Russian forces holding moderate lead at first and only have a slight lead in Titan kills. Then came a turning point in the battle. Manfred Sideous, the initial Fleet Commander for PL/N3, handed over command to the CEO of Northern Coalition., Vince Draken
Beta Maoye 81	Posted - 2015.10.17 20:49:51 - [16] - Quote You cannot reduce price by controlling it. You have to create demand for goods that plex can buy. The ingame-price of plex is a bargain between demand for plex and demand for isk. High demand is created for plex for the usage in game time, multiple training and aur shop. On the other hand, now the demand for isk is low because of yet-to-complete space structures, yet-to-complete capital ship rebalance, yet-to-open new spaces. Unless sufficient demand for isk is created to balance the situation, ingame-price of plex will continue to rise without limit. I think too high or too low a ingame-price of plex is not good for the game. The game needs enough percentage of dedicated gamers that use plex to maintain their accounts to keep the Eve space alive.
Algarion Getz Aideron Corp 74	Posted - 2015.10.17 20:50:09 - [17] - Quote Akrasjel Lanate wrote: Break the link between PLEX and Aurum. This. PLEX stands for Pilot License Extension, yet it is used for buying SKINS, apparel, fanfest tickets, collectors edition, donations for charity, etc. In the future probably also for buying SP. PLEX should be used for paying the subscription and nothing else. Active players is THE most important asset CCP has. CCP should not allow that useless cosmetic stuff and RL goods drive up the price of the most important item in the game.
Mr Epeen It's All About Me 9276	Posted - 2015.10.17 20:55:46 - [18] - Quote Algarion Getz wrote: PLEX should be used for paying the subscription and nothing else. Active players is THE most important asset CCP has. CCP should not allow that useless cosmetic stuff and RL goods drive up the price of the most important item in the game. Are you one of my alts? I was about to say pretty much exactly the same thing. Mr Epeen There are 86,400 seconds in a day. You just saved one of them by typing 'u' instead of 'you'.-á Congratulations, dumbass!
xxxTRUSTxxx Galactic Rangers EVEolution. 384	Posted - 2015.10.17 21:47:10 - [19] - Quote Rykuss wrote: Here's a radical solution: Pay the sub. might be too rad man or just subrad lol
moep Hedion University Amarr Empire 24	Posted - 2015.10.17 22:46:48 - [20] - Quote Well, I am always asking myself why people think they have a given birth right to play EVE for free I am not worried about players or alts dropping because they do not want to grind their plex anymore. Reduces server load and TIDI. I am more concerned about the players not paying their sub fee or purchasing Plex for real money anymore. So to answer your question: Plex price should increase, motivates the credit card and helps CCP. But of course I am missing the point that all dropped plexers are so called content creators and the paying folks are sheeps. Nevertheless, this is just my veteran-cattle point of view. Over and out!
Divine Entervention Rational Chaos Inc. Phoebe Freeport Republic 699	Posted - 2015.10.17 22:52:37 - [21] - Quote Back in my day the only way we could play MMOs was by paying for them with a subscription. But ya know what? times change. We got gifted with PLEX and were able to use our play time to fund our play time. Play 2 Play is what it's called. Now you kids are crying about the change no longer being good enough? To change it again? Make it EASIER for you to play for free? Then how come you all **** and moan about another change? Another change that makes accessing the game easier? Buying skill points? Get good, bads. #thebest
ArmyOfMe Hull Breach. Outnumbered. 479	Posted - 2015.10.17 23:03:13 - [22] - Quote moep wrote: I am more concerned about the players not paying their sub fee or purchasing Plex for real money anymore. So to answer your question: Plex price should increase, motivates the credit card and helps CCP. Im starting to think you dont have the slightest grasp on the basics of economics QUOTE CCP Dolan and the EVE Online development team:-áThe battle was relatively even for some time with CFC and Russian forces holding moderate lead at first and only have a slight lead in Titan kills. Then came a turning point in the battle. Manfred Sideous, the initial Fleet Commander for PL/N3, handed over command to the CEO of Northern Coalition., Vince Draken
moep Hedion University Amarr Empire 24	Posted - 2015.10.17 23:12:13 - [23] - Quote ArmyOfMe wrote: moep wrote: I am more concerned about the players not paying their sub fee or purchasing Plex for real money anymore. So to answer your question: Plex price should increase, motivates the credit card and helps CCP. Im starting to think you dont have the slightest grasp on the basics of economics Gave me a laugh for that one. Please explain me the market basics, Mr. economical expert. Really looking forward to your answer. But to give you a small idea, in real life economy, CCP can't plex their server costs.
Hole Checker Unstable Anomaly 39	Posted - 2015.10.17 23:34:21 - [24] - Quote Anybody who cant afford to pay for at least one sub a month should probably consider getting a job instead of playing video games in the first place If you have no job and play a lot then plex is still easily affordable if you work too much to get enough isk to buy plex then you pay a sub its really not that much money for the amount of entertainment you get outta it I really don't see the problem
Niriel Greez Specimen 794 Project.Mayhem. 41	Posted - 2015.10.17 23:40:52 - [25] - Quote Plex prices aren't even much of a problem; players make a lot more ISK/hour than they did when plex was 400m. Sure, if you were missioning in HS for 30m an hour years ago and haven't learned that there are more lucrative things you could do, your little Retriever might have trouble keeping up with plex prices.
Feledain Elmsfeuer 57	Posted - 2015.10.17 23:49:42 - [26] - Quote Uh uh econ 101 I predict something and explain afterwards why it was right or wrong. SP for isk will decrease Plex price! Dumb rich guys allready buy officer mods, they will also buy SP to fly a Vindicator on day 1. They will sell Plex on mass. SP for isk will increase Plex price! All those guys who skilled mining or that useless skill X will want to make some isk or transfer the SP to an alt. They buy plex and convert it to aurum so they can make these pakets. Quote: Gave me a laugh for that one. Please explain me the market basics, Mr. economical expert. Really looking forward to your answer. But to give you a small idea, in real life economy, CCP can't plex their server costs. It helps CCP more when ppl buy plex, because gametime costs more $ via Plex. Who gets the gametime in the end is irrelevant.
ArmyOfMe Hull Breach. Outnumbered. 480	Posted - 2015.10.17 23:54:01 - [27] - Quote moep wrote: But to give you a small idea, in real life economy, CCP can't plex their server costs. Where exactly do you think plexes come from? Its not like ppl get them out their ass by magic you know QUOTE CCP Dolan and the EVE Online development team:-áThe battle was relatively even for some time with CFC and Russian forces holding moderate lead at first and only have a slight lead in Titan kills. Then came a turning point in the battle. Manfred Sideous, the initial Fleet Commander for PL/N3, handed over command to the CEO of Northern Coalition., Vince Draken
moep Hedion University Amarr Empire 24	Posted - 2015.10.18 00:05:41 - [28] - Quote ArmyOfMe wrote: moep wrote: But to give you a small idea, in real life economy, CCP can't plex their server costs. Where exactly do you think plexes come from? Its not like ppl get them out their ass by magic you know You should really improve your reading and interpretation skills. Plex price = price on the isk market in the context of this thread, maybe start at the beginning of a thread and not the end. Well I do not know what you stick out of your ***, maybe your a magician. But back to topic and to help you a bit: Credit card = real money, buy plex or sub. Quite easy, isn't it? Jesus Christ, your telling me something about market principles
Adooni H.O.M.E.W.O.R.L.D 1	Posted - 2015.10.18 00:15:29 - [29] - Quote I made similar post about PLEX and I proposed solution PLEX but I made similar error like you. I thoughts that player or CCP would liek to do something but honestly people that truly are impact by PLEX price are just to busy to farm in game trying to gather just enough ISK to play EVE one more week longer. And at forum are posting people that $20 are not money for them (for same countries is few % of salary) and they do not care if PLEX will be even 10B or people that manipulate PLEX price to earn even more money. I would like for CCP to publish how many % of people subscribe EVE and how many is buying PLEX in game to play one more mount. Looking at about 200 of my colleagues I would say that about 90% is buying PLEX in game what will mean that soon game will die. As I post in my topic from 2014 more than 100 of my colleagues left game and main reason for this was that they need to farm quests for min 2 weeks just to get money for PLEX. I know that in LS is possible making same quests made 60M in 2-3 minutes but not every one got skills, fleet, knowledge to do that. I see several similar post about this subject and if CCP do not do something the best MMO game ever will die in 2016. I remember that middle of 2013 60days GTC price was about 800M now after 2 years we need to play 1.2B just for 30 days subscription. We lost already about 50% of players and now is the last chance to change it. Please remember that PLEX/GTC price rise is not just because inflation is because a lot of players that were buing PLEX left game when colleagues that used PLEX in game for subscribe left game. There is were sensitive balance between P2P players and F2P players and we are now in situation that will crush game soon.
Teckos Pech The Executives Executive Outcomes 3548	Posted - 2015.10.18 00:39:48 - [30] - Quote Shade Alidiana wrote: I think we were having player numbers issue here. The fact that I'm posting on forums suggests that I'm holding a subscription and so am mostly ok with the price. But we two (three, with the person that liked you) aren't alone in this world. I find the whole AUR thing disruptive to normal things' pace, so limiting PLEX to only being what it initially was (game time) and maybe way to pay for fanfest and similar tickets can do a little damage control. I wouldn't care if CCP didn't try silly things again and again to bring more people in. I've suggested a possible way to do so, without disrupting gameplay and other stuff. P. S. yes, I'm among those considering old EVE being better than current one. And it getting worse and worse with time (even thougs some features/changes are nice). So what you are saying is people who used to pay for their sub with ISK/PLEX should have their game subsidized? Yeah, thanks...but no. Upgrading Local to Eliminate All AFK Influence So Local Chat vanished, now what?

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