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Netan MalDoran
Last Garrison
130
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Posted - 2015.11.11 04:47:59 -
[1] - Quote
So, I was watching this interesting SOV video-> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vi9_ArJ2mEY and noticed that the only main alliance which survived the time period was the Goonswarm Federation, I'm just curious, as I have lived near goons before, what makes their alliance structure so much different than the other power blocks?
"Your security status has been lowered." - Hell yeah it was!
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Bag of Doritos
0
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Posted - 2015.11.11 05:22:24 -
[2] - Quote
Iron fist of waffle. Lots of waffles, force fed to the face. |
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
2683
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Posted - 2015.11.11 05:46:07 -
[3] - Quote
Mainly lots of playing the metagame.
The alliances that have died weren't as good at playing the metagame of spies, infiltrating directors, controlling mass media, and taking advantage of leaked information of upcoming changes from various places.
A lot of the other 'old' alliances are still around just maybe not in exactly the same place or shape. |
Benny Ohu
Chaotic Tranquility Snuffed Out
4487
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Posted - 2015.11.11 05:46:52 -
[4] - Quote
you need heavy equipment to shift your average goon |
Raffael Ramirez
Alcohol Fuelled
64
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Posted - 2015.11.11 06:00:55 -
[5] - Quote
I haven't been in many alliances in the last decade that were situated in 0.0 so probably not the best to answer that, but what I hear it is the amount of effort and work that goes into this alliance that basically out competes everyone else. Unless eve is your full time job/hobby/life it is hard to even come close to what is provided in the Goon infrastructure.
I really like to play spaceships but what these guys are doing is far beyond anything I would even consider to invest into a game.
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d0cTeR9
Astro Technologies SpaceMonkey's Alliance
275
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Posted - 2015.11.11 06:15:55 -
[6] - Quote
Netan MalDoran wrote:So, I was watching this interesting SOV video-> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vi9_ArJ2mEY and noticed that the only main alliance which survived the time period was the Goonswarm Federation, I'm just curious, as I have lived near goons before, what makes their alliance structure so much different than the other power blocks?
Because instead of complaining on the forums, we are in-game playing (and winning).
Been around since the beginning.
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Netan MalDoran
Last Garrison
130
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Posted - 2015.11.11 06:25:31 -
[7] - Quote
Nevyn Auscent wrote:Mainly lots of playing the metagame.
The alliances that have died weren't as good at playing the metagame of spies, infiltrating directors, controlling mass media, and taking advantage of leaked information of upcoming changes from various places.
A lot of the other 'old' alliances are still around just maybe not in exactly the same place or shape.
Ah, I never thought of this aspect, probably the most influential one!
"Your security status has been lowered." - Hell yeah it was!
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Yang Aurilen
Conspiracy Theory. Project.Mayhem.
973
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Posted - 2015.11.11 06:28:39 -
[8] - Quote
d0cTeR9 wrote:Netan MalDoran wrote:So, I was watching this interesting SOV video-> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vi9_ArJ2mEY and noticed that the only main alliance which survived the time period was the Goonswarm Federation, I'm just curious, as I have lived near goons before, what makes their alliance structure so much different than the other power blocks? Because instead of complaining on the forums, we are in-game playing (and winning).
But you're SMA.
Post with your NPC alt main and not your main main alt!
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Cecil Montague
PCG Enterprises
65
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Posted - 2015.11.11 07:34:55 -
[9] - Quote
Don't forget Goons have a strong external locus for their community in the Something Awful forums. Events that would lead to a failcascade in other alliances don't cause the same problems with Goons.
"There is no such thing as an effective segment of Totality" - Bruce Lee: The only man with a Chuck Norris killmail.
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BirdStrike
Pandemic Horde Inc. Pandemic Horde
142
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Posted - 2015.11.11 08:30:03 -
[10] - Quote
d0cTeR9 wrote:Netan MalDoran wrote:So, I was watching this interesting SOV video-> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vi9_ArJ2mEY and noticed that the only main alliance which survived the time period was the Goonswarm Federation, I'm just curious, as I have lived near goons before, what makes their alliance structure so much different than the other power blocks? Because instead of complaining on the forums, we are in-game playing (and winning).
Winning *cough* you just got spanked two nights in a row at pillow fort. |
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BirdStrike
Pandemic Horde Inc. Pandemic Horde
142
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Posted - 2015.11.11 08:40:48 -
[11] - Quote
Cecil Montague wrote:Don't forget Goons have a strong external locus for their community in the Something Awful forums. Events that would lead to a failcascade in other alliances don't cause the same problems with Goons.
They seem to rely mostly on reddit footsloggers from KF et al these days. If you look at most fleet comps actual SA goonwaffe are the minority. If goons had to hold sov without the rest of the cfc they'd get crushed pretty quickly. You assume SA is a thing but the KB activity shows redditors being the new majority these days. |
Jacob Holland
Weyland-Vulcan Industries
438
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Posted - 2015.11.11 08:46:16 -
[12] - Quote
Indeed. In the very early days of Goonswarm, when BoB had the consistent upper hand, I recall that they were virtually annihalated. Where almost any other alliance would have collapsed, shedding members until it dropped below critical mass and faded from existence, the forums began to be taken over by a swathe of rookie corp characters - all called VCB### (or was it VCBee###?). The Victory Clone Bees didn't stay around for long - but more than long enough... Then consider the dissolution of the alliance's assets... The "euthanasia" of Karttoon...
The external tie of SA (not to mention the assumption that everyone is out to get them so it's never been a surprise) has allowed Goonswarm to weather far more than anyone else has been asked to. |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
17218
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Posted - 2015.11.11 09:00:25 -
[13] - Quote
Raffael Ramirez wrote:I haven't been in many alliances in the last decade that were situated in 0.0 so probably not the best to answer that, but what I hear it is the amount of effort and work that goes into this alliance that basically out competes everyone else. Unless eve is your full time job/hobby/life it is hard to even come close to what is provided in the Goon infrastructure.
I really like to play spaceships but what these guys are doing is far beyond anything I would even consider to invest into a game.
That's exactly it, plus they put a huge amount of effort into recruiting and supporting new players.
"It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his ISK/hr depends upon his not understanding it!"
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Robert Warner
Back Door Burglars The Otherworld
151
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Posted - 2015.11.11 09:16:41 -
[14] - Quote
Netan MalDoran wrote:So, I was watching this interesting SOV video-> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vi9_ArJ2mEY and noticed that the only main alliance which survived the time period was the Goonswarm Federation, I'm just curious, as I have lived near goons before, what makes their alliance structure so much different than the other power blocks?
This is an easy question. Two points:
1. Goons are well organised with a strong management structure and an entire software environment to support their members.
2. You know how in your national sport there are people who always support the team at the top of the league even when they live at the other side of the country? |
Jarod Garamonde
Jolly Codgers Get Off My Lawn
2648
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Posted - 2015.11.11 09:22:11 -
[15] - Quote
Netan MalDoran wrote:So, I was watching this interesting SOV video-> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vi9_ArJ2mEY and noticed that the only main alliance which survived the time period was the Goonswarm Federation, I'm just curious, as I have lived near goons before, what makes their alliance structure so much different than the other power blocks?
You've clearly never been to a live goon party. If you've ever hung out with them, in person, you'd understand why.
That moment when you realize the crazy lady with all the cats was right...
[#savethelance]
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Markus Reese
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
739
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Posted - 2015.11.11 09:24:23 -
[16] - Quote
People pay attention to them. Being a powerhouse means they create more sense of victory through victory. That attracts more players and more power.
A long time ago we discussed how to defeat goons.
The result? Ignore them. If they invade, don't fight back. They burn jita, shop dodi, etc. They would implode via boredom.
To quote Lfod Shi
The ratting itself is PvE. Getting away with it is PvP.
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La Rynx
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
444
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Posted - 2015.11.11 11:25:59 -
[17] - Quote
Raffael Ramirez wrote:I haven't been in many alliances in the last decade that were situated in 0.0 so probably not the best to answer that, but what I hear it is the amount of effort and work that goes into this alliance that basically out competes everyone else. Unless eve is your full time job/hobby/life it is hard to even come close to what is provided in the Goon infrastructure.
I really like to play spaceships but what these guys are doing is far beyond anything I would even consider to invest into a game.
Yes, Goons and their allies have a good Meta-Infrastructure, giving them quite an advantage.
Atomic Virulent : "You can't spell DOUCHE. without CODE."
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Avvy
Republic University Minmatar Republic
206
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Posted - 2015.11.11 11:47:49 -
[18] - Quote
Netan MalDoran wrote:So, I was watching this interesting SOV video-> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vi9_ArJ2mEY and noticed that the only main alliance which survived the time period was the Goonswarm Federation, I'm just curious, as I have lived near goons before, what makes their alliance structure so much different than the other power blocks?
From what I understand of the Goons, is that they socialise outside of the game, they play various games and have a lot of members so that they should be able to do well in any MMO that they wish to play.
I expect you would do ok too, if you started an MMO with lets say a 100+ of your friends. |
Shallanna Yassavi
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
40
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Posted - 2015.11.11 12:01:09 -
[19] - Quote
They're good pretty much anywhere, and there are a lot of them. That combination is really powerful.
A signature :o
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Nafensoriel
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
186
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Posted - 2015.11.11 13:04:24 -
[20] - Quote
The EVE Goon organizational structure is more complex and well thought out than most mid sized corporations. Its also leveraged world wide talent to do this. From a raw business POV we win simply because somehow we figured out how to turn a game into work that we enjoy doing and staying flexible enough to respond to political changes in eve.
In short we survive because we work for it. Love it. And abuse that strength whenever we can without burning down the whole server. |
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Market McSelling Alt
Bernie Madoff Investment Services LLC
702
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Posted - 2015.11.11 13:07:44 -
[21] - Quote
Like the cockroach...
CCP Quant: Of all those who logon in Eve, 1.5% do Incursions, 13.8% PVP and 19.2% run Missions while 22.4% mine.
40.7% Join a fleet. The idea that Eve is a PVP game is false, the social fabric is in Missions and Mining.
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Intar Medris
Fusion Enterprises Ltd Phoenix Company Alliance
244
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Posted - 2015.11.11 14:31:20 -
[22] - Quote
Simple really those other power blocs existed for the sole reason of getting and holding sovereignty. Once they lost it the alliance no longer had any purpose. Goonswarm is basically a a giant party with 15,000 of your best friends. Even if they lost it all the tomorrow they would come back. They aren't invincible, but they exist to have fun. The others existed to hold power.
I try to be nice and mind my business just shooting lasers at rocks. There is just way too many asshats in New Eden for that to happen.
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Otso Bakarti
Filial Pariahs
459
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Posted - 2015.11.11 15:01:09 -
[23] - Quote
It's like that pair of saddle oxfords you can't bring yourself to throw away. They're too worn to wear, but they used to get you into so much trouble!
Paranoia strikes deep....
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Harry Forever
SpaceJunkys
1295
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Posted - 2015.11.11 15:05:35 -
[24] - Quote
Netan MalDoran wrote:So, I was watching this interesting SOV video-> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vi9_ArJ2mEY and noticed that the only main alliance which survived the time period was the Goonswarm Federation, I'm just curious, as I have lived near goons before, what makes their alliance structure so much different than the other power blocks?
cause there is a never ending supply of douchebags that need a home
Harry Forever vs. Goonswarm
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Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
6859
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Posted - 2015.11.11 15:15:10 -
[25] - Quote
Nafensoriel wrote:The EVE Goon organizational structure is more complex and well thought out than most mid sized corporations. Its also leveraged world wide talent to do this. From a raw business POV we win simply because somehow we figured out how to turn a game into work that we enjoy doing and staying flexible enough to respond to political changes in eve.
In short we survive because we work for it. Love it. And abuse that strength whenever we can without burning down the whole server. Q9PP, right?
Every change leaves the badguys just about to fall.
We just need more coalitions to exist to destroy them, more legions to be paid off, more lasersov, more something!!
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Otso Bakarti
Filial Pariahs
459
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Posted - 2015.11.11 15:20:15 -
[26] - Quote
Nafensoriel wrote:The EVE Goon organizational structure is more complex and well thought out than most mid sized corporations. Its also leveraged world wide talent to do this. From a raw business POV we win simply because somehow we figured out how to turn a game into work that we enjoy doing and staying flexible enough to respond to political changes in eve.
In short we survive because we work for it. Love it. And abuse that strength whenever we can without burning down the whole server. I love digital spin doctors. They truly make the reality virtual.
Paranoia strikes deep....
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Owen Levanth
Sagittarius Unlimited Exploration
418
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Posted - 2015.11.11 15:43:41 -
[27] - Quote
BirdStrike wrote:Cecil Montague wrote:Don't forget Goons have a strong external locus for their community in the Something Awful forums. Events that would lead to a failcascade in other alliances don't cause the same problems with Goons. They seem to rely mostly on reddit footsloggers from KF et al these days. If you look at most fleet comps actual SA goonwaffe are the minority. If goons had to hold sov without the rest of the cfc they'd get crushed pretty quickly. You assume SA is a thing but the KB activity shows redditors being the new majority these days.
Nah, KB activity doesn't really help with showing what a community does in the game. If you look at my KB for example, you would conclude I'm playing only about 1 day per year, which would be hilariously wrong.
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baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
16903
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Posted - 2015.11.11 22:39:25 -
[28] - Quote
We are a CIA front.
Join Bat Country today and defend the Glorious Socialist Dictatorship
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Markus Reese
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
743
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Posted - 2015.11.11 23:08:50 -
[29] - Quote
This topic is so interesting, and always puts me into a connundrum.
I have said before, and is discussed here about how the goonswarm actually operates and their structure etc being impressive, earning them their place as a powerblock.
The unfortunate part is the attitude directed towards other players, made me really lose respect for those involved. Too many encounters where the line of smacktalk was pushed too far. Is one thing to be disliked for asserted control over eve and playing a bad guy, but unfortunately, reputation precedes that.
Overall, it does get confusing, and a bit depressing to think about really :s
To quote Lfod Shi
The ratting itself is PvE. Getting away with it is PvP.
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Cidanel Afuran
Static-Noise Upholders
404
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Posted - 2015.11.11 23:26:39 -
[30] - Quote
Because, similar to CODE, everyone loves Goons. Even if they love to hate them (which most grr goons people won't admit is how they actually feel). Having someone to complain about/grrr against creates an enormous amount of content. |
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