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[ISS] Breach of Fiduciary Duty, Call For Resignations.

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Gord Freeman Commerce Raiders Inc.	Posted - 2007.01.09 21:23:00 - [1] After having failed to protect the interests of their shareholders, and effectively loosing untold billions of Isk because of their gross negligence in providing the highest possible standard of care for the assetts entrusted to them - I call on Count TaSessine and Serenity Steele to resign from their positions immediately. Furthermore, the head of the ISS Navy must be removed and replaced with a competent military commander. A temporary new management team must be installed and a full audit of all ISS financial records must occur immediately if there is to be any degree of trust or market confidence in their ISS leadership moving forward. For the sake of the newborn Eve public stock market, and shareholders across the galaxy - the leadership of ISS must be held accountable for this unacceptable lack of care. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fiduciary_duty Thoughts?
Preacher97 Caldari Obliteration Unlimited R i s e	Posted - 2007.01.09 21:27:00 - [2] Have a definition of risk to share?
Righteous Fury Slacker Industries	Posted - 2007.01.09 21:36:00 - [3] ISS can hire me if they so wish, but I don't come cheap.
Lexor SLice Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.01.09 21:38:00 - [4] Originally by: Righteous Fury ISS can hire me if they so wish, but I don't come cheap. Maybe when you have more gunnery SP then me. but not yet ____________________________________________ Your signature graphic file size is too large -Zhuge Sad Panda =(
Commander Thrawn Tarnak inc.	Posted - 2007.01.09 21:40:00 - [5] Edited by: Commander Thrawn on 09/01/2007 21:36:50 Originally by: Gord Freeman After having failed to protect the interests of their shareholders, and effectively loosing untold billions of Isk because of their gross negligence in providing the highest possible standard of care for the assetts entrusted to them - I call on Count TaSessine and Serenity Steele to resign from their positions immediately. Furthermore, the head of the ISS Navy must be removed and replaced with a competent military commander. A temporary new management team must be installed and a full audit of all ISS financial records must occur immediately if there is to be any degree of trust or market confidence in their ISS leadership moving forward. For the sake of the newborn Eve public stock market, and shareholders across the galaxy - the leadership of ISS must be held accountable for this unacceptable lack of care. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fiduciary_duty Thoughts? how many shares do you own in any of the outpost??
Barrier Solo Infinity Shipyard Masters Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2007.01.09 21:41:00 - [6] Who are you? A troll Barrier Solo, CEO, INSM, ISS Join us! http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadid=402528
Gord Freeman Commerce Raiders Inc.	Posted - 2007.01.09 21:43:00 - [7] Originally by: Barrier Solo Who are you? A troll No, I'm not.. if you look at my bio. And that accusation won't deflect attention from this monumental failure of ISS leadership.
David H'Levi Sniggerdly	Posted - 2007.01.09 21:45:00 - [8] So wait... They protect billions of ISK in conquerable assets for 18 months. Then they get gang-banged by half of EVE, and you're calling them incompetant? Well, at least we can change leadership and launch of comprehensive audit *IN THE MIDDLE OF A WAR*. Do you think your suggestion will have any effect besides being the deathknell of all investor assets? We Recruit!
Kalmanaka The Graduates Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2007.01.09 21:49:00 - [9] http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=454998&page=4#100 My vote is on troll.
Resipsa Loquitor Black Eclipse Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.01.09 21:50:00 - [10] Originally by: Gord Freeman After having failed to protect the interests of their shareholders, and effectively loosing untold billions of Isk because of their gross negligence in providing the highest possible standard of care for the assetts entrusted to them - I call on Count TaSessine and Serenity Steele to resign from their positions immediately. Furthermore, the head of the ISS Navy must be removed and replaced with a competent military commander. A temporary new management team must be installed and a full audit of all ISS financial records must occur immediately if there is to be any degree of trust or market confidence in their ISS leadership moving forward. For the sake of the newborn Eve public stock market, and shareholders across the galaxy - the leadership of ISS must be held accountable for this unacceptable lack of care. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fiduciary_duty Thoughts? Always fun when laymen quote legalese. It's the reason why I have a job - when lay people mess up thinking they know what they are doing and I help clean it up. Unfortunately, to RP a bit, I'm only licensed to practice in front of the Gallente Federation with their Supreme Court. As well, since either party has not hired me and neither are not my client as well as the fact that there (at this point) appears to be no identified counsel, to proffer advice or opinion at this point may mislead them and cause harm as well as appear to show bias. As an officer of the Court (as all attorneys are), this would be a failing in my professional and ethical responsibilities. Having said that, there probably is a meritorious argument on both sides regarding "failing to protect the interests of shareholders". One may be a financial interest, in which there may be a lost of share income as well as share value, which will have to be proven. Another is the actions of ISS in both stages of the conflict so far as well as the history of dealings with the engaged parties, if any. Please feel free to contact my office if either party wishes to explore retaining me as local counsel in the Gallente Federation. I am sure that our liberal interpretation of extraterritorial events and impact upon Gallente Federation citizens may warrant investigation into personal and subject matter jurisdiction as well as venue. Resipsa Loquitor, Esq. "If you're going to hire counsel, why not hire the most evil counsel available. What could be more evil than a BoB attorney???" --- John McCreedy and EDF never paid their complex runners for the 100s of billions gathered in the name of EDF and ASCN. Who's the slave master now, McGreedy? Where's the money? Pay ARC!

Athanasios Anastasiou Elite Storm Enterprises	Posted - 2007.01.09 21:50:00 - [11] The risks of investing in a station in lawless space was made clear to the investors. Any money invested were due the the shareholder's own judgement. Even if ISS is at fault, let's not forget that its the investors themsevles who deemed that reward > RISK for the ipo. I believe what you are experiencing a 'it's everyone's fault but mine' syndrome.
Hudsonn Minmatar FireTech Imperium Alliance	Posted - 2007.01.09 21:55:00 - [12] Originally by: Gord Freeman After having failed to protect the interests of their shareholders, and effectively loosing untold billions of Isk because of their gross negligence in providing the highest possible standard of care for the assetts entrusted to them - I call on Count TaSessine and Serenity Steele to resign from their positions immediately. Furthermore, the head of the ISS Navy must be removed and replaced with a competent military commander. A temporary new management team must be installed and a full audit of all ISS financial records must occur immediately if there is to be any degree of trust or market confidence in their ISS leadership moving forward. For the sake of the newborn Eve public stock market, and shareholders across the galaxy - the leadership of ISS must be held accountable for this unacceptable lack of care. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fiduciary_duty Thoughts? That's taking a bit too serously. You know. Don't make me start throwing ClichT's at you. --Imperium--
Ehrine Ashbark Lyrus Associates Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2007.01.09 21:56:00 - [13] Edited by: Ehrine Ashbark on 09/01/2007 21:53:30 Originally by: Gord Freeman http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fiduciary_duty Thoughts? Quote: A fiduciary duty is the highest standard of care imposed at either equity or law. A fiduciary is expected to be extremely loyal to the person to whom they owe the duty (the "principal"): they must not put their personal interests before the duty, and must not profit from their position as a fiduciary, unless the principal consents. The fiduciary relationship is highlighted by good faith, loyalty and trust, and the word itself originally comes from the Latin fides, meaning faith, and fiducia. So, according to that section on wikipedia, Count T and Serenity must not put personal interests before duty amdn must not profit from their position... So, staying up countless hours, spending as much time as possible trying to remedy an assault by a force massively outnumbering the ISS and spending billions of non-shareholder ISKs in defence, you're accusing Count T and Serenity of neglecting their Fiduciary Duty. I think you've missunderstood that wikipedia article, because from where I sit, they've done far more in attempt stop this then most others people would've have tried or managed.
Vensa Heckler ISS Navy Task Force Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2007.01.09 22:02:00 - [14] Originally by: Gord Freeman After having failed to protect the interests of their shareholders, and effectively loosing untold billions of Isk because of their gross negligence in providing the highest possible standard of care for the assetts entrusted to them - I call on Count TaSessine and Serenity Steele to resign from their positions immediately. Furthermore, the head of the ISS Navy must be removed and replaced with a competent military commander. A temporary new management team must be installed and a full audit of all ISS financial records must occur immediately if there is to be any degree of trust or market confidence in their ISS leadership moving forward. For the sake of the newborn Eve public stock market, and shareholders across the galaxy - the leadership of ISS must be held accountable for this unacceptable lack of care. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fiduciary_duty Thoughts? mate, if you feel you've lost money here, instead of pointing fingers at people; perhaps you should think about what you could have done to avoid this situation? i mean, i certainly haven't seen you in local helping to defend? or in any of our other station systems supplying ships to us? count and serenity (as well as all ISS management members) have done their damndest to keep the outposts under their control over the time since the outposts have been built. and what have you done? nowt - Love is the Law, Love under Will
Manas The Graduates Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2007.01.09 22:04:00 - [15] Hey, I bet the OP could go the route of suing the new Outpost owners for property damage, too. I am sure wiki has a link for it.
Resipsa Loquitor Black Eclipse Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.01.09 22:10:00 - [16] Originally by: Manas Hey, I bet the OP could go the route of suing the new Outpost owners for property damage, too. I am sure wiki has a link for it. Oh, more potential clients! --- John McCreedy and EDF never paid their complex runners for the 100s of billions gathered in the name of EDF and ASCN. Who's the slave master now, McGreedy? Where's the money? Pay ARC!
Butter Dog Wreckless Abandon The UnAssociated	Posted - 2007.01.09 22:22:00 - [17] The OP is utterly clueless. Firstly, it was your choice to invest and investment carried a risk. The value of shares can rise as well as fall. Your shares gave you a portion of the income of an outpost, now in someone elses hands. Too bad. Its called risk. Secondly, ISSN is a small unit of about 130. It was never designed or intended to be a force able to hold off 4 large alliances totalling 9000 members. No matter how competent their leader (and he IS very competent) there is absoultely nothing which ISSN could have done. You would have a strong case for the resignation of Count if you highlighted how his decision to press for all 3 of IAC's outpost led to an inevitable escalation in hostilities. He decided to try playing powermonger rather than peacebroker, and in there you may find a good reason to request his leave. And that just about covers it. ----------
Beringe Caldari Raptus Regaliter	Posted - 2007.01.09 22:22:00 - [18] Originally by: Athanasios Anastasiou The risks of investing in a station in lawless space was made clear to the investors. Clearly, this is the case. Besides, I think it's too early to start throwing in the towel quite yet. ------------------------------------------- "Sarcasm and irony are not to be used by the uninitiated." --Daitan Beringe, honorary director in charge of bottles--
Modok Strongsauce The Collective Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2007.01.09 22:23:00 - [19] Always fun when laymen quote legalese. It's the reason why I have a job - when lay people mess up thinking they know what they are doing and I help clean it up. I wince everytime I read your name. To RP abit myself...you are not the only person here that is "licensed to practice in front of the Gallente Federation with their Supreme Court"..... if you even are. Leave work at home.
Toranya Faidutti Gallente White Nova Industries Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2007.01.09 22:28:00 - [20] Originally by: Modok Strongsauce Edited by: Modok Strongsauce on 09/01/2007 22:20:59 Always fun when laymen quote legalese. It's the reason why I have a job - when lay people mess up thinking they know what they are doing and I help clean it up. Res Ipsa, I wince everytime I read your name. To RP abit myself...you are not the only person here that is "licensed to practice in front of the Gallente Federation with their Supreme Court"..... if you even are. Leave work at home. Oh, he is definitely licensed to practice law. I'm married to him IRL and put him through law school. And the game doesn't let you use three word names so that's why he had to squish Res Ipsa into Resipsa. Please resume bashing my beloved alliance at will.

Resipsa Loquitor Black Eclipse Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.01.09 22:31:00 - [21] Originally by: Modok Strongsauce Edited by: Modok Strongsauce on 09/01/2007 22:20:59 Res Ipsa, I wince everytime I read your name. To RP abit myself...you are not the only person here that is "licensed to practice in front of the Gallente Federation with their Supreme Court"..... if you even are. Leave work at home. Aw, don't be h8ing! You can understand in this competative environment that there is a race for tallented individuals to seek out large representations such as this. How can I not advertise my services to needy parties, especially on both sides! And, yes, I'm licensed to practice in front of the Gallente Supreme Court, as others are. But how would someone know? "Trust me - I'm a lawyer." --- John McCreedy and EDF never paid their complex runners for the 100s of billions gathered in the name of EDF and ASCN. Who's the slave master now, McGreedy? Where's the money? Pay ARC!
Admentus Cor'vion Black Avatar Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2007.01.09 22:38:00 - [22] Good luck finding someone? Talk about thankless job? _______________________________________________ Black Avatar - One of the oldest corps in Eve. "The end and the beginning."
Hakera Freelance Unincorporated Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2007.01.09 22:40:00 - [23] Edited by: Hakera on 09/01/2007 22:39:17 seriously though, sure there can be resignations, but what would that do really? This conflict was engineered to happen and in reality far beyond ISS control.
Xaintrix The Shadow Order Storm Armada	Posted - 2007.01.09 22:45:00 - [24] Whoa whoa whoa, I'm sorry but citing a freaking Wikipedia to back up an accusation? I really have seen it all.
0August0 Gallente The Crucible	Posted - 2007.01.09 22:47:00 - [25] As a major ISS shareholder I favor having Count and the present management team stay on indefinitely. I feel they are doing a spectacular job given the circumstances. I would also demand that ISS never listen to anyone from a corporation named "Commerce Raiders" . . . Regards, August
steamy Infinite Technologies	Posted - 2007.01.09 22:53:00 - [26] Investing is gambling for the rich. It's like flying a ship in 0.0, don't undock in something you aren't willing to loose or can't afford to replace. When this is over, I'm sure the shareholders get a full run down of what happens with their shares, but don't complain about loosing money, no one complained about the monthly paychecks either. On a role playing part, interesting viewpoint, but you lost the thread when a BoB lawyer proposed to help for a price... Lawyer and in BoB my respect grows ;-) I wonder what kind of professions are in other alliances.. just as fitting? Steamy If you only look at the road ahead, Life isn't worth the trip -- Dante
Astasia Orian Black Eclipse Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.01.09 23:15:00 - [27] Quote: Res Ipsa, I wince everytime I read your name. You're not the only one!
Dal Thrax Caldari House Of Troy	Posted - 2007.01.09 23:26:00 - [28] Originally by: Modok Strongsauce Edited by: Modok Strongsauce on 09/01/2007 22:24:07 Edited by: Modok Strongsauce on 09/01/2007 22:20:59 Always fun when laymen quote legalese. It's the reason why I have a job - when lay people mess up thinking they know what they are doing and I help clean it up. Res Ipsa, I wince everytime I read your name. To RP abit myself...you are not the only person here that is "licensed to practice in front of the Gallente Federation with their Supreme Court"..... if you even are. Leave work at ..the office. Agreed.
w0rmy Intensive CareBearz Imperium Alliance	Posted - 2007.01.09 23:34:00 - [29] Originally by: Hakera Edited by: Hakera on 09/01/2007 22:39:17 seriously though, sure there can be resignations, but what would that do really? This conflict was engineered to happen and in reality far beyond ISS control. There was a time when this conflict could have been avoided by ISS. But that chance was tossed asside. Someone should be held accountable for that. Right now? No, the fight isnt over. But in time, there are actions taken, that people should be held accountable for. Originally by: Avon Originally by: Dark Shikari What single item is larger than a jetcan? My ego?
Resipsa Loquitor Black Eclipse Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.01.09 23:36:00 - [30] Originally by: Astasia Orian Quote: Res Ipsa, I wince everytime I read your name. You're not the only one! Ouch! Pwned by my own corp. I don't think CCP will let me change it now. Geez, I'm just trying to derive more fees for the firm. I thought you wanted aggressive associates to get out there and find the people with problems and "help" them. With the "eat what you kill" revenue sharing program, how can you stop your younger associates from going out there and finding the juicy work? You never know from where a person or group with issues will turn into a profitable revenue stream of billings, settlements, and hard-fought victories that result in punitive damages. This issue is just ripe with long-term discovery, bitterness, anger, and lots of emotion. That translates into clients with shifting goals that can be manipulated easily. That translates into high billable hours, tons of frivolous motions, and general nastiness that helps rack up bills on both sides. It's a dream case! I'm going to go file a lawsuit. I don't know on what, but it'll be there. --- John McCreedy and EDF never paid their complex runners for the 100s of billions gathered in the name of EDF and ASCN. Who's the slave master now, McGreedy? Where's the money? Pay ARC!

DjDangle Euphoria Released Euphoria Unleashed	Posted - 2007.01.09 23:38:00 - [31] Originally by: Hudsonn Originally by: Gord Freeman After having failed to protect the interests of their shareholders, and effectively loosing untold billions of Isk because of their gross negligence in providing the highest possible standard of care for the assetts entrusted to them - I call on Count TaSessine and Serenity Steele to resign from their positions immediately. Furthermore, the head of the ISS Navy must be removed and replaced with a competent military commander. A temporary new management team must be installed and a full audit of all ISS financial records must occur immediately if there is to be any degree of trust or market confidence in their ISS leadership moving forward. For the sake of the newborn Eve public stock market, and shareholders across the galaxy - the leadership of ISS must be held accountable for this unacceptable lack of care. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fiduciary_duty Thoughts? That's taking a bit too serously. You know. Don't make me start throwing ClichT's at you. Ooooh I love Cliche's, they make me go all warm and fuzzy
Blitz'Krieg Caldari SkyMarshal Logistics	Posted - 2007.01.10 00:28:00 - [32] Basically they were investing in an idea that a 0.0 entity can be neutral and furthermore that that neutrality would be respected by everyone. Personally i think you'd have to be nuts to expect that to last forever, but even if you really were that naieve you shouldn't be asking for resignations now, but when the original mistakes that called the neutrality into question were made. The only really realistic way i can see a return on your money is if the outposts were sold. Now that the unthinkable has happened, ISS are no more than a weak alliance waiting to be conquered. Enter the ONE million for ONE billion lottery. details in bio or Linkage
James Lyrus Lyrus Associates Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2007.01.10 00:28:00 - [33] Edited by: James Lyrus on 10/01/2007 00:25:30 Is this a joke? Seriously, who'd want the job of running the show?
Vensa Heckler ISS Navy Task Force Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2007.01.10 00:44:00 - [34] Originally by: James Lyrus Edited by: James Lyrus on 10/01/2007 00:25:30 Is this a joke? Seriously, who'd want the job of running the show? lilan? :P - Love is the Law, Love under Will
Crozon Crozon Corp	Posted - 2007.01.10 00:52:00 - [35] Originally by: Blitz'Krieg Basically they were investing in an idea that a 0.0 entity can be neutral and furthermore that that neutrality would be respected by everyone. Personally i think you'd have to be nuts to expect that to last forever, but even if you really were that naieve you shouldn't be asking for resignations now, but when the original mistakes that called the neutrality into question were made. In a way I do have to agree with you. Although, even though my word may not mean much, I can state that ISS management have always had that ideal at heart, and I am 100% sure of that. All parties suffer from rogue members or entities, which can discredit those responsible. The example that D2 keep using of "ISS passing on intel to hostile fleets" was a corp that did so and got booted very quickly. The high ranks of ISSN were also inflitrated by a Goon agent, who actually was one of the founding members and well respected amongst ISS. Until, of course, he offlined a bunch of POS's in F4 and stole everything out of the corp hanger. You have to consider that the actions of individual members do not always reflect on the management, especially those who turn out to have been placed there as spies/agents by hostile groups.
Troubadour Slacker Industries	Posted - 2007.01.10 00:57:00 - [36] I believe the share holders assets were separate from the outposts. Meaning if you invested in ISS that is was separate then say if you invested in Marginis. besides, how long do you think this rag-tag allience of alliences will last before the infighting begins and ISS takes back the outposts 1 by 1. god people and their end-of world bull**** annoy me.
Raem Civrie Umbra Congregatio Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.01.10 00:58:00 - [37] Originally by: Gord Freeman After having failed to protect the interests of their shareholders, and effectively loosing untold billions of Isk because of their gross negligence in providing the highest possible standard of care for the assetts entrusted to them - I call on Count TaSessine and Serenity Steele to resign from their positions immediately. Furthermore, the head of the ISS Navy must be removed and replaced with a competent military commander. A temporary new management team must be installed and a full audit of all ISS financial records must occur immediately if there is to be any degree of trust or market confidence in their ISS leadership moving forward. For the sake of the newborn Eve public stock market, and shareholders across the galaxy - the leadership of ISS must be held accountable for this unacceptable lack of care. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fiduciary_duty Thoughts? Give them another three weeks. Maybe they CAN turn this around without their outposts, like Nyphur has been suggesting. ---- All you do is bark. You never meow.
Algey ISS Navy Task Force Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2007.01.10 00:58:00 - [38] Originally by: Gord Freeman After having failed to protect the interests of their shareholders, and effectively loosing untold billions of Isk because of their gross negligence in providing the highest possible standard of care for the assetts entrusted to them - I call on Count TaSessine and Serenity Steele to resign from their positions immediately. Furthermore, the head of the ISS Navy must be removed and replaced with a competent military commander. A temporary new management team must be installed and a full audit of all ISS financial records must occur immediately if there is to be any degree of trust or market confidence in their ISS leadership moving forward. For the sake of the newborn Eve public stock market, and shareholders across the galaxy - the leadership of ISS must be held accountable for this unacceptable lack of care. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fiduciary_duty Thoughts? Oh please explain to me how I could have defended against what hit us oh great and noble one. I look foward to the whole forum being enlightened by your insight into how I should have run the defensive campaign. I do expect exact details on what I should have done, and since I'm incompetent or negligent and the stations were easily saved I look foward to being enlightened.
Dr Slaughter ISS Navy Task Force Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2007.01.10 01:01:00 - [39] Originally by: Algey I do expect exact details on what I should have done, and since I'm incompetent or negligent and the stations were easily saved I look foward to being enlightened. You should have handed out Titans to all of ISSN.... err... yeah!
Hudsonn Minmatar FireTech Imperium Alliance	Posted - 2007.01.10 01:03:00 - [40] Originally by: DjDangle Originally by: Hudsonn Originally by: Gord Freeman After having failed to protect the interests of their shareholders, and effectively loosing untold billions of Isk because of their gross negligence in providing the highest possible standard of care for the assetts entrusted to them - I call on Count TaSessine and Serenity Steele to resign from their positions immediately. Furthermore, the head of the ISS Navy must be removed and replaced with a competent military commander. A temporary new management team must be installed and a full audit of all ISS financial records must occur immediately if there is to be any degree of trust or market confidence in their ISS leadership moving forward. For the sake of the newborn Eve public stock market, and shareholders across the galaxy - the leadership of ISS must be held accountable for this unacceptable lack of care. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fiduciary_duty Thoughts? That's taking a bit too serously. You know. Don't make me start throwing ClichT's at you. Ooooh I love Cliche's, they make me go all warm and fuzzy Oh, how about the one where someone say's "it's only a game!" And "everyone is out to have fun". Phwarrr!! --Imperium--

James Lyrus Lyrus Associates Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2007.01.10 01:16:00 - [41] Originally by: Algey Originally by: Gord Freeman After having failed to protect the interests of their shareholders, and effectively loosing untold billions of Isk because of their gross negligence in providing the highest possible standard of care for the assetts entrusted to them - I call on Count TaSessine and Serenity Steele to resign from their positions immediately. Furthermore, the head of the ISS Navy must be removed and replaced with a competent military commander. A temporary new management team must be installed and a full audit of all ISS financial records must occur immediately if there is to be any degree of trust or market confidence in their ISS leadership moving forward. For the sake of the newborn Eve public stock market, and shareholders across the galaxy - the leadership of ISS must be held accountable for this unacceptable lack of care. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fiduciary_duty Thoughts? Oh please explain to me how I could have defended against what hit us oh great and noble one. I look foward to the whole forum being enlightened by your insight into how I should have run the defensive campaign. I do expect exact details on what I should have done, and since I'm incompetent or negligent and the stations were easily saved I look foward to being enlightened. Well, first of all Algey, you should have been Oveur. I mean, that was your real mistake in life. I mean, not being a dev. Second, shoulda pressed whatever buttonything he's got under his desk for when he's _really_ ****ed off. Third. Actually, there's no third step, that'd have about done it.
Lygos Amarr ISS Navy Task Force Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2007.01.10 01:57:00 - [42] Dear OP, You will be happy to note that we have assembled a pre-committee to evaluate the feasibility and costs of launching such an inquiry. We have drafted a 48 point preliminary action plan which we will steadily implement over the period of 23 months. We will keep you updated of breathless developments. --- T2 Risk \| Corp Divisions
Belid Hagen The Graduates Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2007.01.10 02:03:00 - [43] ISS humor :P
Randay 0utbreak	Posted - 2007.01.10 02:16:00 - [44] What we have here is a failure to synergize mission-critical systems. If there was more thought put into transition impactful functionalities, then the implement viral supply-chains would not have maximize leading-edge infomediaries! What ISS needs to do is innovate back-end portals and reinvent collaborative partnerships, only then can they reintermediate rich e-markets!
Dr Slaughter ISS Navy Task Force Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2007.01.10 02:21:00 - [45] Originally by: Randay What we have here is a failure to synergize mission-critical systems. If there was more thought put into transition impactful functionalities, then the implement viral supply-chains would not have maximize leading-edge infomediaries! What ISS needs to do is innovate back-end portals and reinvent collaborative partnerships, only then can they reintermediate rich e-markets! lol... obviously a corporate speach writer in the making!
Dirtball Kemono.	Posted - 2007.01.10 02:41:00 - [46] Originally by: Resipsa Loquitor "Trust me - I'm a lawyer." You need to add something about graduating from the Ken Lay School outpost down in delve and how you know how to get around corporate laws. Say stuff like "If I cant get you off the hook we can fake your death". Sig removed, lacks Eve-related content. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] - Cortes
Archilies Elite United Corp Antigo Dominion	Posted - 2007.01.10 02:48:00 - [47] Out of curiosity. Lets say the shareholders voted the count and the other dude out. What would happen and would a vote that was successfull, actually have any impact? [i.e would they have to leave] Recruitment Thread
DiuxDium Casting Shadows	Posted - 2007.01.10 02:57:00 - [48] Originally by: Archilies Out of curiosity. Lets say the shareholders voted the count and the other dude out. What would happen and would a vote that was successfull, actually have any impact? [i.e would they have to leave] None voting shares. Also, no one else wants the job.
Murukan Minmatar The Priory Shroud Of Darkness	Posted - 2007.01.10 03:07:00 - [49] Using wikipedia as a base for your arguements is just stupid. That is like calling for the resignation of a politician for something you read in the tabloids. Manlove by Zaphod Jones
Plutoinum German Cyberdome Corp Veritas Immortalis	Posted - 2007.01.10 03:08:00 - [50] Tbh I doubt that ISS will survive this. At least not with their current business model. It depends on trust and investors. Guess it doesn't matter currently, who competent their leadership is. They have a large chunk of the universe against them and the pro-iss will think twice, if they invest any new money into ISS at least for the next months. Imho game-over. (I say think that without being an iss hater) CTD/con-loss vs. log-out. A proposal for a fix.

fugazii Forsaken Empire	Posted - 2007.01.10 04:12:00 - [51] Originally by: David H'Levi So wait... They protect billions of ISK in conquerable assets for 18 months. Then they get gang-banged by half of EVE, and you're calling them incompetant? Well, at least we can change leadership and launch of comprehensive audit *IN THE MIDDLE OF A WAR*. Do you think your suggestion will have any effect besides being the deathknell of all investor assets? i hardly say gangbang is the right word here,...considering they started the war, and initially brought in everyone(and thier mothers) to fight iac. i completely agree with the original poster. its completely imcompetant of iss to initiate agression in the first place. thier job is to ensure their investors make isk, not conquer space. whatever iac did to make iss start the war, doesnt matter. it should have been dealt with behind the scenes, not through war.
Benny Hill Caldari Deceased Inc	Posted - 2007.01.10 04:20:00 - [52] Originally by: Gord Freeman After having failed to protect the interests of their shareholders, and effectively loosing untold billions of Isk because of their gross negligence in providing the highest possible standard of care for the assetts entrusted to them - I call on Count TaSessine and Serenity Steele to resign from their positions immediately. Furthermore, the head of the ISS Navy must be removed and replaced with a competent military commander. A temporary new management team must be installed and a full audit of all ISS financial records must occur immediately if there is to be any degree of trust or market confidence in their ISS leadership moving forward. For the sake of the newborn Eve public stock market, and shareholders across the galaxy - the leadership of ISS must be held accountable for this unacceptable lack of care. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fiduciary_duty Thoughts? maybe you should have invested your isk into your one man corp?
Dano Sarum Umbra Congregatio Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.01.10 04:31:00 - [53] How exactly would the current leaders and the most experienced people ISS have resigning be a -good- thing? Despite recent events the ISS buisness model is pretty solid, if they were able to keep all of their members under control and do -exactly- what Count & Serenity wanted I'm sure that this current mess wouldn't be going on. Let things die down, quiet a bit and see where they go from there. Right now removing their leaders would be the worst thing anyone could do, do you really want lots of former ISS people applying to your corporations? ISS isn't the neutral low risk investment we all thought it would be. As much as I don't like ISS right the original vision was a good one, removing its leaders would just throw it into anarchy. ______ <Insert Sig Here>
patteSatan Celtic Anarchy Anarchy Empire	Posted - 2007.01.10 04:57:00 - [54] Originally by: fugazii Originally by: David H'Levi So wait... They protect billions of ISK in conquerable assets for 18 months. Then they get gang-banged by half of EVE, and you're calling them incompetant? Well, at least we can change leadership and launch of comprehensive audit *IN THE MIDDLE OF A WAR*. Do you think your suggestion will have any effect besides being the deathknell of all investor assets? i hardly say gangbang is the right word here,...considering they started the war, and initially brought in everyone(and thier mothers) to fight iac. i completely agree with the original poster. its completely imcompetant of iss to initiate agression in the first place. thier job is to ensure their investors make isk, not conquer space. whatever iac did to make iss start the war, doesnt matter. it should have been dealt with behind the scenes, not through war. See? It's not only me that thinks ISS started this mess.... On another note: changing leadership wont do any good, but letting the current leaders think about what they did wrong, and let them change that. I'm no fan at all of ISS, as I have been a victim of their backstabbings, and I left IAC because I wanted to get back at ISS (I wasnt permitted to shoot at ISS while in IAC, even after the damn zxic thing), but I do agree that ISS was a beautiful thing when it started, I think it grew too big too fast, too many loose cannons joined, and so on.
0August0 Gallente The Crucible	Posted - 2007.01.10 05:07:00 - [55] Originally by: fugazii i hardly say gangbang is the right word here,...considering they started the war, and initially brought in everyone(and thier mothers) to fight iac. i completely agree with the original poster. its completely imcompetant of iss to initiate agression in the first place. thier job is to ensure their investors make isk, not conquer space. whatever iac did to make iss start the war, doesnt matter. it should have been dealt with behind the scenes, not through war. But they didn't initiate hostilities, IAC did, and according to both sides, initiated them in a pretty big way by running rampant in both ISS station systems over a period of a few days, all the while their members were here on the forums gleefully talking about wiping out ISS. The important thing in my mind when judging the ISS response was the question of would have it have escalated beyond pew pew into the mess it is today if ISS hadn't called in outside reinforcements? Well I believe it would have. Before the arrival of MC the war was pretty much going IACs way and I think once they realized they could take the ISS stations on their own the opportunity would be impossible to pass up. However the quick and massive response from AAA tells me that IAC probably had a deal in place with them before the war started, so escalation was inevitable any way you look at it. It'll be interesting to see who they give the Tycho station to. Hey, maybe the anti-BoB coalition theory isn't as far fetched as it sounds! . . . Regards, August
chrisreeves Gallente Asgard Protectorate	Posted - 2007.01.10 05:09:00 - [56] Originally by: Randay What we have here is a failure to synergize mission-critical systems. If there was more thought put into transition impactful functionalities, then the implement viral supply-chains would not have maximize leading-edge infomediaries! What ISS needs to do is innovate back-end portals and reinvent collaborative partnerships, only then can they reintermediate rich e-markets! I must say, bravo!
Graalum Foundation R0ADKILL	Posted - 2007.01.10 06:01:00 - [57] Originally by: David H'Levi So wait... They protect billions of ISK in conquerable assets for 18 months. Then they get gang-banged by half of EVE, and you're calling them incompetant? Well, at least we can change leadership and launch of comprehensive audit *IN THE MIDDLE OF A WAR*. Do you think your suggestion will have any effect besides being the deathknell of all investor assets? Letting Lotka Volterra get involved was probably the most idiotic move ever. As soon as LV started shooting IAC is support of ISS, its "neutrality" was void and openly any enemy to most of eve.
Graalum Foundation R0ADKILL	Posted - 2007.01.10 06:04:00 - [58] Originally by: Ehrine Ashbark Edited by: Ehrine Ashbark on 09/01/2007 21:53:30 Originally by: Gord Freeman http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fiduciary_duty Thoughts? Quote: A fiduciary duty is the highest standard of care imposed at either equity or law. A fiduciary is expected to be extremely loyal to the person to whom they owe the duty (the "principal"): they must not put their personal interests before the duty, and must not profit from their position as a fiduciary, unless the principal consents. The fiduciary relationship is highlighted by good faith, loyalty and trust, and the word itself originally comes from the Latin fides, meaning faith, and fiducia. So, according to that section on wikipedia, Count T and Serenity must not put personal interests before duty amdn must not profit from their position... So, staying up countless hours, spending as much time as possible trying to remedy an assault by a force massively outnumbering the ISS and spending billions of non-shareholder ISKs in defence, you're accusing Count T and Serenity of neglecting their Fiduciary Duty. I think you've missunderstood that wikipedia article, because from where I sit, they've done far more in attempt stop this then most others people would've have tried or managed. They failed their duty by blindness and greed. Their own choices brought ISS's demise.
Graalum Foundation R0ADKILL	Posted - 2007.01.10 06:06:00 - [59] Originally by: Hakera Edited by: Hakera on 09/01/2007 22:39:17 seriously though, sure there can be resignations, but what would that do really? This conflict was engineered to happen and in reality far beyond ISS control. I have some t2 tinfoil on market in rens, looks like you need some.
Graalum Foundation R0ADKILL	Posted - 2007.01.10 06:07:00 - [60] Originally by: Troubadour I believe the share holders assets were separate from the outposts. Meaning if you invested in ISS that is was separate then say if you invested in Marginis. besides, how long do you think this rag-tag allience of alliences will last before the infighting begins and ISS takes back the outposts 1 by 1. god people and their end-of world bull**** annoy me. Do you seriously think that a self proclaimed carebear allaince can retake an outpost against or the aggressors?

XirtamVotf Vengeance of the Fallen Imperium Alliance	Posted - 2007.01.10 07:18:00 - [61] I do beleive that this would fall under military jurisdiction,and military courts. Seeing how that coming into game it was understood that it a PVP oriented game. So none of you public lawyers have anything to say:P
Varheg Xan Aerial Boundaries Inc. Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2007.01.10 07:39:00 - [62] OP, can I have your shares?
James Lyrus Lyrus Associates Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2007.01.10 08:31:00 - [63] Originally by: Murukan Using wikipedia as a base for your arguements is just stupid. That is like calling for the resignation of a politician for something you read in the tabloids. But... that NEVER happens! What's the world coming to. Originally by: Archilies Out of curiosity. Lets say the shareholders voted the count and the other dude out. What would happen and would a vote that was successfull, actually have any impact? [i.e would they have to leave] Forcibly? No. That'd still be their choice. Personally I really don't think that'd be very clever, since the actual outpost managers are different people. Originally by: Plutoinum Edited by: Plutoinum on 10/01/2007 03:09:21 Tbh I doubt that ISS will survive this. At least not with their current business model. It depends on trust and investors. Guess it doesn't matter currently, how competent their leadership is. They have a large chunk of the universe against them and the pro-iss people will think twice, if they invest any new money into ISS at least for the next months. Imho game-over. Even if they'd get some magic help now, they can't force people to trust them, love them, treat them as neutrals. The times of the ISS we know are over. (I think that without being an iss hater. I may be wrong though, wouldn't be the first time.) Reviewing the model? Yes, that's definitely on the cards. Whether it'll change or not, remains to be seen. Been a bit pre-occupied the last couple of weeks though :) Originally by: Graalum Letting Lotka Volterra get involved was probably the most idiotic move ever. As soon as LV started shooting IAC is support of ISS, its "neutrality" was void and openly any enemy to most of eve. When someone rolls up, in force, and says 'these guys your're currently fighting, we want some pew pew too' then you'd be a fool to say 'no go home'. I mean, assuming you could actually stop them in the first place (weren't LV and IAC already shooting each other at that point?), and didn't end up in the middle with both sides shooting you.
Chronos VIII Dark Blade Incorporated Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.01.10 09:20:00 - [64] Originally by: Resipsa Loquitor Always fun when laymen quote legalese. It's the reason why I have a job - when lay people mess up thinking they know what they are doing and I help clean it up. Unfortunately, to RP a bit, I'm only licensed to practice in front of the Gallente Federation with their Supreme Court. As well, since either party has not hired me and neither are not my client as well as the fact that there (at this point) appears to be no identified counsel, to proffer advice or opinion at this point may mislead them and cause harm as well as appear to show bias. As an officer of the Court (as all attorneys are), this would be a failing in my professional and ethical responsibilities. Having said that, there probably is a meritorious argument on both sides regarding "failing to protect the interests of shareholders". One may be a financial interest, in which there may be a lost of share income as well as share value, which will have to be proven. Another is the actions of ISS in both stages of the conflict so far as well as the history of dealings with the engaged parties, if any. Please feel free to contact my office if either party wishes to explore retaining me as local counsel in the Gallente Federation. I am sure that our liberal interpretation of extraterritorial events and impact upon Gallente Federation citizens may warrant investigation into personal and subject matter jurisdiction as well as venue. Resipsa Loquitor, Esq. "If you're going to hire counsel, why not hire the most evil counsel available. What could be more evil than a BoB attorney???" You are definitely not the only one out there, you gallentean scum! As for me, im the 276th Chief Justice of the Amarr Empire, nominated by the Emperor himself. Hail the Emperor
Clementina Eye of God	Posted - 2007.01.10 09:52:00 - [65] Originally by: Manas Hey, I bet the OP could go the route of suing the new Outpost owners for property damage, too. I am sure wiki has a link for it. There is! lookie! However there might be more luck in suing the corporations that make up an outpost. They're usually incorporated in one of the empires, and would, theoretically be liable according to the laws of their jurisdiction. Supposing, of course they did anything wrong.
Sergio Ling Standard Operations Building Services Maelstrom Alliance	Posted - 2007.01.10 09:55:00 - [66] I own a large amount of shares in various ISS investments (including the Count T action figure) and I'm happy with them so far _
velana The Syndicate Inc Ascendant Frontier	Posted - 2007.01.10 12:06:00 - [67] Originally by: James Lyrus Originally by: Graalum Letting Lotka Volterra get involved was probably the most idiotic move ever. As soon as LV started shooting IAC is support of ISS, its "neutrality" was void and openly any enemy to most of eve. When someone rolls up, in force, and says 'these guys your're currently fighting, we want some pew pew too' then you'd be a fool to say 'no go home'. I mean, assuming you could actually stop them in the first place (weren't LV and IAC already shooting each other at that point?), and didn't end up in the middle with both sides shooting you. Doesn't really matter the moment someone else than mercs joined your war. you lost the illusion of neutrality. Added to that that you are the caretaker of an outpost in LV space. and the people will see your actions as picking sides. This is in my opinion where you lost neutrality. or at least the appearance.
DeckardIRL Gallente Bravehearts Xelas Alliance	Posted - 2007.01.10 12:35:00 - [68] This war started over 6 months ago when ISS NAP'd CDC (who were enemies to both ISS and IAC at the time) and CDC were able to attack IAC from Marginnis. That was when IAC was not long in Catch and trying to get established having just deployed the Distillery. ISS then changed their charter so this couldn't happen again. But now this latest conflict. ISS then bungled it again by bringing in MC and thinking they would get a quick win. IAC held firm and totally turned it around. Count T made 2 public statements which Tyrrax rebuffed. The Count played politics the whole way instead of addressing IAC directly. ISS are now in trouble. However, remember IAC are not a conquering alliance and its now D2 and LV that are the real threat to ISS and with that its bye bye ISS- unless they can afford to employ BoB and that cost not even ISS can pay. Deck _____________________________________________ Watchin' the Game.... Havin' a Bud.... I shoot better on Bud..... Eve Info- All you need to know
Porter Hadlend Gallente Righteous-Indignation Imperium Alliance	Posted - 2007.01.10 12:59:00 - [69] Caveat Emptor. Buyer Beware. Thems the breaks unfortunately... Man.. I'm glad I took a little time to think about investing in the new ISS IPO. Be Chaotic Neutral
Algey ISS Navy Task Force Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2007.01.10 13:35:00 - [70] Originally by: Porter Hadlend Caveat Emptor. Buyer Beware. Thems the breaks unfortunately... Man.. I'm glad I took a little time to think about investing in the new ISS IPO.

Resipsa Loquitor Black Eclipse Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.01.10 16:53:00 - [71] Originally by: Dirtball Originally by: Resipsa Loquitor "Trust me - I'm a lawyer." You need to add something about graduating from the Ken Lay School outpost down in delve and how you know how to get around corporate laws. Say stuff like "If I cant get you off the hook we can fake your death". (does best impression of Sam Kenison from "Back to School") "All right. Good. I like the way you think. I'm going to keep my eye on you." (/Sam) I believe that station's name is "The Ken Lay School of Economics". Quite a fine institution I've heard. --- Resipsa Loquitor, Esq. - Visiting professor teaching "Ethics and business - why the two don't mix" at The Ken Lay School of Economics, Delve branch.
Baun 4S Corporation Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2007.01.10 17:01:00 - [72] Originally by: Porter Hadlend Caveat Emptor. Buyer Beware. Thems the breaks unfortunately... Man.. I'm glad I took a little time to think about investing in the new ISS IPO. Well Titan, that ISK is actually safe from this though the present conflcit indeed raises questions concerning how well it will be managed. The Enemy's Gate is Down
Kalmanaka The Graduates Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2007.01.10 17:06:00 - [73] How does one's ability to fight determine one's skill in managing and making money?
Shiftless	Posted - 2007.01.10 17:10:00 - [74] Originally by: Gord Freeman And that accusation won't deflect attention from this monumental failure of ISS leadership. Not to sound like too much of an idiot, but when did Seleen join ISS?
Porter Hadlend Gallente Righteous-Indignation Imperium Alliance	Posted - 2007.01.10 17:18:00 - [75] Originally by: Baun Originally by: Porter Hadlend Caveat Emptor. Buyer Beware. Thems the breaks unfortunately... Man.. I'm glad I took a little time to think about investing in the new ISS IPO. Well Titan, that ISK is actually safe from this though the present conflcit indeed raises questions concerning how well it will be managed. True enough. BTW.. why aren't you around more ;) Be Chaotic Neutral
James Lyrus Lyrus Associates Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2007.01.10 17:44:00 - [76] Originally by: DeckardIRL This war started over 6 months ago when ISS NAP'd CDC (who were enemies to both ISS and IAC at the time) and CDC were able to attack IAC from Marginnis. That was when IAC was not long in Catch and trying to get established having just deployed the Distillery. ISS then changed their charter so this couldn't happen again. But now this latest conflict. ISS then bungled it again by bringing in MC and thinking they would get a quick win. IAC held firm and totally turned it around. Count T made 2 public statements which Tyrrax rebuffed. The Count played politics the whole way instead of addressing IAC directly. ISS are now in trouble. However, remember IAC are not a conquering alliance and its now D2 and LV that are the real threat to ISS and with that its bye bye ISS- unless they can afford to employ BoB and that cost not even ISS can pay. Deck Actually CDC NAPped IAC at the same time. That was part of the deal. Didn't last long though, unfortunately. I'm sure someone will be quick to correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm _fairly_ sure it was IAC that re-opened hostilities at that point.
James Lyrus Lyrus Associates Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2007.01.10 17:46:00 - [77] Originally by: velana Originally by: James Lyrus Originally by: Graalum Letting Lotka Volterra get involved was probably the most idiotic move ever. As soon as LV started shooting IAC is support of ISS, its "neutrality" was void and openly any enemy to most of eve. When someone rolls up, in force, and says 'these guys your're currently fighting, we want some pew pew too' then you'd be a fool to say 'no go home'. I mean, assuming you could actually stop them in the first place (weren't LV and IAC already shooting each other at that point?), and didn't end up in the middle with both sides shooting you. Doesn't really matter the moment someone else than mercs joined your war. you lost the illusion of neutrality. Added to that that you are the caretaker of an outpost in LV space. and the people will see your actions as picking sides. This is in my opinion where you lost neutrality. or at least the appearance. If you get mugged in the street, it's not politics when the guy in the shop comes out with a baseball bat to assist. I can't change people's perceptions, but I do still think they're incorrect in this situation.
Smoking Mirror Secret Interests Inc.	Posted - 2007.01.10 17:59:00 - [78] Originally by: James Lyrus Originally by: DeckardIRL This war started over 6 months ago when ISS NAP'd CDC (who were enemies to both ISS and IAC at the time) and CDC were able to attack IAC from Marginnis. That was when IAC was not long in Catch and trying to get established having just deployed the Distillery. ISS then changed their charter so this couldn't happen again. But now this latest conflict. ISS then bungled it again by bringing in MC and thinking they would get a quick win. IAC held firm and totally turned it around. Count T made 2 public statements which Tyrrax rebuffed. The Count played politics the whole way instead of addressing IAC directly. ISS are now in trouble. However, remember IAC are not a conquering alliance and its now D2 and LV that are the real threat to ISS and with that its bye bye ISS- unless they can afford to employ BoB and that cost not even ISS can pay. Deck Actually CDC NAPped IAC at the same time. That was part of the deal. Didn't last long though, unfortunately. I'm sure someone will be quick to correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm _fairly_ sure it was IAC that re-opened hostilities at that point. From then-CDC member Tyrian Solteuer Posted - 2006.12.11 19:23:00: Originally by: Tyrian Solteuer Just to set the record straight on the CC/CDC conflict with ISS and IAC... We deployed 6 dreads into ZXIC, bottled up the system, put enough ISS starbases into reinforced mode and put up enough of our own to challenge the sovereignty of the system. IAC actually lost more ships than ISS during this siege while they tried to cut us off from our lines of supply. Once this was done we entered into negotiations with the Count, reached an accord, which had absolutely nothing to do with money, access, offices, resources or use of space...we then packed up our forces and withdrew. At the time of the negotiations Count Tessasine was gracious enough to require that we speak to IAC about a NAP at the same time. He actually insisted on a join NAP but we felt that it would set a bad precedent to deal with both groups as a unit....however, I heard what IAC had to say, struck a temporary cease fire, and promised to meet up again in a week to discuss a longer term agreement. Unfortunately IAC forces violated the accord twice over the next few days as our forces withdrew. We came to the conclusion that a long term peace with IAC was not in our interest. In the end ISS held up their end of the deal and IAC greased 2 of our battleships under a flag of truce. Nuff said. I have always found that ISS have stuck to their word when it comes to their charter and the actions of their membership. Every incident that I have ever had with ISS has always been resolved quickly and in good spirits. Its quite clear that after we departed the area, the IAC have gotten quite bored and full of themselves, and are now simply looking for something else nearby to shoot at. important portion bolded http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=441626&page=10#283
Pakmule Caldari Umbra Congregatio Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.01.10 18:08:00 - [79] You'll excuse me if I just ignore comments made by an alt quoting an enemy...
Mortin Skeer Multiplay UK	Posted - 2007.01.10 18:11:00 - [80] Originally by: Kalmanaka How does one's ability to fight determine one's skill in managing and making money? Going off current events? Quite a lot it seems... :P

Jacque Custeau Knights of the Minmatar Republic	Posted - 2007.01.10 18:43:00 - [81] I remember when ISS came into being well over a year ago. When I first heard about it, I thought to myself that they would immediatly fail and that they had no hope for success. What they accomplished over that time exceeded all my expectations. When someone engineers a big scam we all glamorize it and talk about it constantly. ISS's Executive team had hundreds of billions under their thumb and thus far managed all that isk with honor and integrity. For that I tip my hat to them. It truly is rare to find someone in EvE who does not have a 'magic' number at which they would abandon everyone and run off with all the assets. I do not know why IAC declared war on them, and I don't know why everyone else jumped on the bandwagon. Regardless ISS proved me wrong, and I sincerely hope they learn from this setback and move on. EvE people needs people like them.
Graalum Foundation R0ADKILL	Posted - 2007.01.10 19:01:00 - [82] Originally by: Graalum Letting Lotka Volterra get involved was probably the most idiotic move ever. As soon as LV started shooting IAC is support of ISS, its "neutrality" was void and openly any enemy to most of eve. When someone rolls up, in force, and says 'these guys your're currently fighting, we want some pew pew too' then you'd be a fool to say 'no go home'. I mean, assuming you could actually stop them in the first place (weren't LV and IAC already shooting each other at that point?), and didn't end up in the middle with both sides shooting you. The thing was, you could have and should have told LV to go home, you let them play politics with you and it was your undoing. Fix and MC and whatever assorted hired guns you had were more than enough to make sure that you would not loose marginis, assuming that an attempt would be made to take it. When you let LV in, and arrogantly posted pics of Enslavers e-peen in the midst of a swarm of dreads pummeling an IAC pos, there is no way you could not know that RA, Goon, TCF, and everyone else would be after you.
darkfuntime Minmatar ClanKillers Dusk and Dawn	Posted - 2007.01.10 20:16:00 - [83] I will buy any and all ISS shares for 1 mil isk a share.At least you will get something back for them,contact me in game
Baymm Shadow Gypsies R i s e	Posted - 2007.01.10 20:30:00 - [84] Originally by: Resipsa Loquitor Originally by: Gord Freeman After having failed to protect the interests of their shareholders, and effectively loosing untold billions of Isk because of their gross negligence in providing the highest possible standard of care for the assetts entrusted to them - I call on Count TaSessine and Serenity Steele to resign from their positions immediately. Furthermore, the head of the ISS Navy must be removed and replaced with a competent military commander. A temporary new management team must be installed and a full audit of all ISS financial records must occur immediately if there is to be any degree of trust or market confidence in their ISS leadership moving forward. For the sake of the newborn Eve public stock market, and shareholders across the galaxy - the leadership of ISS must be held accountable for this unacceptable lack of care. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fiduciary_duty Thoughts? Always fun when laymen quote legalese. It's the reason why I have a job - when lay people mess up thinking they know what they are doing and I help clean it up. Unfortunately, to RP a bit, I'm only licensed to practice in front of the Gallente Federation with their Supreme Court. As well, since either party has not hired me and neither are not my client as well as the fact that there (at this point) appears to be no identified counsel, to proffer advice or opinion at this point may mislead them and cause harm as well as appear to show bias. As an officer of the Court (as all attorneys are), this would be a failing in my professional and ethical responsibilities. Having said that, there probably is a meritorious argument on both sides regarding "failing to protect the interests of shareholders". One may be a financial interest, in which there may be a lost of share income as well as share value, which will have to be proven. Another is the actions of ISS in both stages of the conflict so far as well as the history of dealings with the engaged parties, if any. Please feel free to contact my office if either party wishes to explore retaining me as local counsel in the Gallente Federation. I am sure that our liberal interpretation of extraterritorial events and impact upon Gallente Federation citizens may warrant investigation into personal and subject matter jurisdiction as well as venue. Resipsa Loquitor, Esq. "If you're going to hire counsel, why not hire the most evil counsel available. What could be more evil than a BoB attorney???" Nice post. Lots of truth in it as well. 8) BTW, loquitur not loquitor. Give me a tell in game, would love to know where you practice and what field. Baymm Shadow Gypsies Rise
Resipsa Loquitor Black Eclipse Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.01.10 20:57:00 - [85] Originally by: Baymm BTW, loquitur not loquitor. Give me a tell in game, would love to know where you practice and what field. Yeah, misspelled it on purpose to avoid a conflict with another name at the time. Feel free to drop me an eve-m. As for the Amarr "Chief Justice", I think he'll find a problem with a little thing called "conflict of interest". How can he independently preside over a conflict he has a vested interest in as a full-fledged member and pod pilot in IAC? He can't. Now he can act as counsel for his party so long as he isn't a material witness or a liable actor in the case, which he may be. He will, however, under normal ethical standards of law, have to recuse himself from his ministerial roles with the Amarr "judiciary" during the term of the legal proceedings. Of course, using the term "normal standard" and Amarr in the same sentence gives even the most free-wheeling of counsel a wry smirk. We all know the Amarr have their own methods of administering "justice" - maybe this slight ethical conflict issue isn't really a problem for them. --- Resipsa Loquitor, Esq. - Visiting professor teaching "Ethics and business - why the two don't mix" at The Ken Lay School of Economics, Delve branch.
Nyphur Pillowsoft Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2007.01.10 21:19:00 - [86] I am not usually comfortable speaking on behalf of the entire ISS but I am 100% assured in my capability to do so in this thread. The skills that the ISS management team bring to the organisation are not generic or interchangeable. There is not a single member of the organisation who could be adequately replaced. This team includes the people you have demanded resignations from: chairman Count TaSessine, military director Algey and finance director Serenity Steele. They are not jobs, they are people. Nobody could be a better Count TaSessine than the man himself, nobody a better Serenity Steele than Serenity Steele and while the head of ISSN is an interchangable role, Algey is anything but incompetant. In addition, destroying our internal structure and spending all of our time for a few weeks digging up financial accounts from corp wallets will not help this situation one bit. It will, in fact, ruin the ability of our alliance to adequately address the current situation. Our time and effort is better spent dealing with situations than running away from them by resigning. Instead of destroying our entire management structure to appease one shareholder, we'll go ahead with our current plans to discuss how we'll proceed internally with our more than capable management team. We will hold a shareholder meeting (announcement should be out in the market order forum shortly) to detail the future plans we have and discuss the state of all current IPOs. I know eve has a semi-realistic economic model but not everything to do with real life business is applicable to eve. Eve-Tanking.com - For tanking spreadsheet and resources.


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