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jedeye
StateCorp
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Posted - 2007.01.20 22:36:00 -
[31]
Edited by: jedeye on 20/01/2007 22:34:52
There was a Dev blog by CCP Fear which addresses this very subject.
 Quote:
Since I joined the team, I was given the task of fixing salvaging. Salvaging as a feature was not broken as such, but there are aspects of it that needed some attention and tuning. One, which you are undoubtedly aware of, is that certain NPCs were not dropping salvage. No matter how much you tried, you always got the nice message ôYour salvaging attempt has been successful, however there was nothing to salvageö. Having experienced this myself I do understand this frustration.
This is something that needed to be fixed, but it's not an easy task. There were about 500 entities not dropping salvage, but in order to make them drop, they needed to be categorized according to size, race and so forth.
Amongst other things that have been changed are player ships. They will now drop more salvage than they have been, and in more variety based on their faction. Damaged Artificial Neural Networks were also added to some NPCs as they were only being dropped in minimum amount in player ships.
The drops from NPC factions were also tweaked a bit, moved around, added to some, frequency increased and/or decreased and so forth, so balance would be held between the factions.
The work on this has been finished, and only awaits testing by the QA department.
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Ather Ialeas
Amarr
Karjala Inc.
Imperial Republic Of the North
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Posted - 2007.01.20 22:40:00 -
[32]
Originally by: smashsmash
Originally by: Jarjar
Originally by: ScreamingLord Sutch
Originally by: doctorstupid2
I'll preceed this by stating I am likely in the minority on this one.
I would prefer to see rigs stay expensive and impractical for most in a PVP ship. Putting in resist rigs that harden (3 damage types) better than the best deadspace EANM shouldn't come cheap, likewise an additional 15% to your MWD Shouldn't be something every ceptor pilot can afford to lose. 10% more powergrid with no drawback other than cost? That's no small benefit, and should come at a premium.
Rigs work similar to implants, if you've got the isk and are willing to take your chances, implants give you a decisive advantage over your opponent. If everyone were running around with pirate sets and 5% hardwirings, well, that would suck.
Just seems to me it kills the fun if everyone is implanted and rigged out the ass 
I echo this sentiment.
... and I agree completely too.
me2
Going the QFT route here too.
In fact I want to add my two cents: Rigs were a bad idea by CCP since they break up the slot limit of the balancing from some set-in-stone values to nearly random. In fact the only way rigs can be made balanced is to remove them from game entirely since if CCP starts to go the nerf route they'll just end up nerfing everything.
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Gone'Postal
Minmatar
LuthorCorp Combat Division
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Posted - 2007.01.20 22:43:00 -
[33]
Agreed with Ather Ialeas on this one.
Known Issues & Workarounds - The forum to fix the issues of Eve... Godhelp us if the Devs start trying to. |
insanebe
Caldari
soni Corp
Imperium Sonorumance
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Posted - 2007.01.20 23:28:00 -
[34]
its a dead market,
salvagers wont salvage if they don't get a good price, this keeps their prices higher
rig makers have to sell at the build cost atleast this keeps prices high
community doesn't think rigs are worth the effort so wont buy
end result short term no sales
long term shrinking of the market untill it dies out almost completely and is left to serve the hardcore rig users
knowledge is power.... guard it well |
Roger Douglas
Infinite Improbability Inc
Dusk and Dawn
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Posted - 2007.01.20 23:40:00 -
[35]
If Fried Interface Circuts were not required in 60%+ (Seems like) of rigs, Rigs would be much cheaper.
If Fried Interface Circuts dropped in larger amounts and proportionate to their frequency of use in rigs, Rig prices would be much lower.
This component is the bottleneck that is keeping Rig prices high. I have over a thousand of each other type of Circut Board, but barely any Fried's since they are needed in nay rig I want to build.
Solve the Fried Interface Circut problem = Rigs Fixed.
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Merdaneth
Amarr
PIE Inc.
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Posted - 2007.01.21 01:58:00 -
[36]
I have no idea what you are talking about. Did one mission today, dropped about 20 melted capacitors (among many other components), which I could sell for 700k isk a pop. Or about 14mil isk for 20-30 minutes salvaging.
Additionally, it is something a relatively new player could do. If, as a several week old player, I could earn 5-10 mil isk an hour by sweeping up after other players I would be jumping at the chance.
It's a good market for new players to get into, just help them along, they are still prepared to work for lower wages....
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glennkari
Gallente
DaHOOD Communication
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Posted - 2007.01.21 01:59:00 -
[37]
Originally by: Azerrad InExile
Sell them for under 10m and I'll buy.
Yeah 10 mill is about right.
So either salvagers need to drop there prices (i salvage for my corp) or CCP need to increase the salvage rate.
Lately it seems rats (least in my 0.7 system) have been nerfed and drops nothing.
When salvaging was put live, i pulled a miner 2 off my Bruitex and fitted a salvage module. This was so i could salvage wrecks while mining (alone or in a grp), and at first it was ok. This last week it takes 5 to 10 rats to get 1 succesfull salvage that actuatly yelds anything.
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Roy Batty68
Caldari
Immortal Dead
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Posted - 2007.01.21 02:23:00 -
[38]
Another thing that would help the situation out:
On the probe scan analysis panel there is a scan group named Scrap. At the moment it apparently does nothing as it never seems to return any results. If this was enabled to allow a player to scan down abandoned wrecks, this would go a long way towards making a salvager mini-profession more feasible.
There's still other things that make that a bit of a pain, such as tractor beams not working on others wrecks, but one thing at a time. As it is now, it's simply too time intensive actually finding wrecks to make it worthwhile as your main money maker. Even tagging along with a corpmate isn't time/isk effective. Better to just run your own missions or ratting.
Make finding abandoned wrecks possible and places like Motsu become a goldmine.
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... [OK] ...
zOMG! |
Joshua Foiritain
Gallente
Coreli Corporation
Corelum Syndicate
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Posted - 2007.01.21 02:33:00 -
[39]
Edited by: Joshua Foiritain on 21/01/2007 02:30:56
As long as rigs are worth twice my ship i wont fit em.
When 3 rigs combined equals the price of my ships ill conider it.
On the other hand rigs are overpowered and should remain expensive.
Dilemma. 
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[Coreli Corporation Mainframe] |
Darina Rea
Harvest System
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Posted - 2007.01.21 02:55:00 -
[40]
Rigs should be expensive and salvaging should be difficult (but not to difficult).
I've been salvaging things across the cluster and noticed so far:
1. small wrecks: forget about them, not worth the salvaging time unless you are absolutely positively sure you get shineys out of them, in other words, player ships.
2. salvaging in missions: in some missions you get salvage, in others you get nothing. The Blockage for example seems to get you salvage, but Illigal activities gives you.. nothing at all.
3. salvaging succes: I seem to have alot more succes and alot sooner on rats in 0.0 then on rats in high sec. In high sec it's generally 4 or more cycles of 'You was unsuccesfull' while 0.0 stays under 3 normally.
_________
Time is on our side. |
Sovereign533
Caldari
The Collective
Against ALL Authorities
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Posted - 2007.01.21 03:26:00 -
[41]
Originally by: Azerrad InExile
Sell them for under 10m and I'll buy.
me2
and all the other ppl i talk with in my corporation (already 200+)
oh note : this is my own oppinion not my corporations bla bla bla...
Second sig removed, only 1 signature graphic please - Xorus
^_^WOOHOO!!! my Sig finally got nerfed...
Added pink because it was lacking - Petwraith
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Ms Chen
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Posted - 2007.01.21 03:32:00 -
[42]
No demand seems to be the issue, however, i don't see how using 2 t2 rigs giving the same damage bonus as 3 x damage mods isn't enticing, especially for armor tankers and likewise for any other rig. If it comes down to it, i'll just stop salvaging my mission wrecks. Come to think of it, how many salvagers get their wrecks from missions or ratting? It takes a while to get enough parts for a rig and if they sell for 5m a pop, then the time isn't worth it for such a low volume that you can produce (or at least it doesn't justify the time to collect when you could keep ratting or get a new mission). Of course having said that, it seems then that salvaging would be more of a side profession, not something that can be relied on as a primary source of income.
my thoughts: tech 1 rigs would hit the sweet spot at 8-12m. I have no clue about tech 2. I do know that an archon with 3 cap amount rigs can have well over 125k cap and never go below 93% with great skills even with dual cap reppers going simultaneously (i.e. not staggered) that would be worth a lot more than 8-12m if you ask me (bad choice honestly since that rig is going for 135m). Some other prices seem to have stabilized and hit a nice middle ground where you can fit them on tech 1 ships without having that weird, irrational belief that a mod shouldn't cost more than XX% of your ship.
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Forum Troll
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Posted - 2007.01.21 08:55:00 -
[43]
Originally by: Ravenal
Originally by: Brutor Shaun
why would they need to add rigs to their fittings in a hurry before market stabilization?
Because I fly a Battleshield with 50,000+ shield.
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Grimpak
Gallente
Twisted Attitude
Apocalyptica.
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Posted - 2007.01.21 09:02:00 -
[44]
Originally by: Joshua Foiritain
Edited by: Joshua Foiritain on 21/01/2007 02:30:56
As long as rigs are worth twice my ship i wont fit em.
When 3 rigs combined equals the price of my ships ill conider it.
On the other hand rigs are overpowered and should remain expensive.
Dilemma.
so true.
it's stupid to have them so expensive if even a freakin' imicus can fit 3 rigs.
but it's also bad because they are so overpowered.
solution: flood market so that everyone can buy them at low prices.
drawback: they are still overpowered.
dilemma dilemma
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Originally by: Tiuwaz
for caldari perception weapons that hit up to 100km are short range weapons 
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Amaron Ghant
Caldari
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Posted - 2007.01.21 10:06:00 -
[45]
Happy with rigs.
Happy with the cost of rigs as I build my own.
Happy with the current drop rate, and will be happier after the next patch when all entities have a chance of dropping components.
Happy with the length of time it takes on missions to salvage. Why? Simple. A new choice. Do I just spank the mission for LP and do them as quickly as possible, do I just loot the cans, or do I take the extra time to salvage and drop my LP per hour ratio in favour of gathering rig components. Do I work with a corp mate instead of soloing so I can get good LP loot AND Salvage? I went with the last option and it¦s working fine.
Rigs add another level of randomness to PvP as well and for that I say good job CCP.
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MOS DEF
0utbreak
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Posted - 2007.01.21 10:53:00 -
[46]
Edited by: MOS DEF on 21/01/2007 10:49:57
Most people use BS in combat. The loss on a bS is 30 mill insurance + guns.
As long rigs cost about as much as the ship = not worth it!
I do use rigs on command ships though. Gotta love em.
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Majutsu
Caldari
Sound of Silence
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Posted - 2007.01.21 11:05:00 -
[47]
People often compare rigs with implants when talking about prices but that's not quite fair. Rigs can be manufactured and only give a bonus to one ship, my implants work whatever ship I jump into, implants should definately be a more expensive item.
I don't see a problem so much with rigs being fitted to bigger ships, fitting 100m worth of rigs to a Rokh which already is about 350m with purchase and fitting costs isn't too much of a big deal, the problem of course lies with the prohibitive costs of fitting them to smaller ships.
Solution?
Different sized rigs, many different items are like this anyway. We could have, small medium and large rigs. Large being appromiately being how they are now, medium taking say 60% of the compnents to build and small maybe 30-40%.
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Splagada
Minmatar
Tides of Silence
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Posted - 2007.01.21 11:07:00 -
[48]
lots of people dont have the skills yet. when they were just out, many of us took another path for skills because "why bother" when the rigs are 500M each
now i'm starting to look at those and will maybe go this path if it gets cheaper again
some are really sexy, stackable +15% armor for example is yummy
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Zana Kito
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Posted - 2007.01.21 11:22:00 -
[49]
The components required for rigs are simply too numerous for their prices to fall too much.
Rigs are only worthwhile on ships that you know you won't get blown up in all the time. This negates their use in anything smaller than HACs/BCs for pvp, and even then, its argueable if its worth it. So you already have low demand to begin with.
The biggest demand for them seem to be for mission runners doing L4s, or people doing complexes in safe areas or on cap ships. Missioners rarely lose their BSes, so once they have the rigs, it stays there.
T1 rigs at least should be much much cheaper to make in terms of components. They should cost for ~5M each so all the ship classes won't hesitate as much to use them. Make the T2 rigs rare and expensive. |
Corbin Devereux
Gallente
Federal Navy Academy
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Posted - 2007.01.21 13:41:00 -
[50]
Originally by: doctorstupid2
Just seems to me it kills the fun if everyone is implanted and rigged out the ass
Because more ways to customise your character are boring...
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