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Getting soooo fed up with Loes... damn macro haulers!!

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DarkElf Caldari DJ's Exotic Dancers Escorts	Posted - 2007.01.24 15:26:00 - [31] Originally by: SleepingBuddah Originally by: Damien Smith As much as I hate farmers, that statement makes no sense. CCP don't lose any money because they themselves aren't competing with them to sell isk for cash (excluding gtc's of course). The farmers are making money from CCP's property, and are paying CCP a tidy sum of cash for the privilege but the only ones losing out are the players themselves. Ingame stuff has a potential real money value. Even if CCP does not sell it (officially). Farmers decrease potential value, but they convert it to some profit for CCP. But the conversion rate is very poor. CCP could make much more money from that. Why CCP prohibits isk->RL $ conversion? Why they ban accounts of isk sellers? It would be more profitable to legalise isk sellers and take some commission from them. because when you do that you completely destroy the entire concept of a mmo game. it is no longer down to success in game it's to do with how much rl cash u have. it destroys games and has done in the past with many games the bottom line about this point is that ccp does not lose a single penny to them selling isk on ebay and they do make money from their monthly subscriptions. that can not be argued really. DE
JoeT Amarr Short Attention Span	Posted - 2007.01.24 16:18:00 - [32] i have seen the ones in yvan. but they are all in noob ships, once in a while a hauler, but nothing worth while in the loot. --- If i'm posting on the forums, it's mostly cause i'm at work :D
Marcus TheMartin Gallente Tuxedo.	Posted - 2007.01.24 16:29:00 - [33] Originally by: JoeT i have seen the ones in yvan. but they are all in noob ships, once in a while a hauler, but nothing worth while in the loot. Quafe is always worthwile
Lucifer Fellblade Ore Mongers SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2007.01.24 16:53:00 - [34] Originally by: JoeT i have seen the ones in yvan. but they are all in noob ships, once in a while a hauler, but nothing worth while in the loot. That's how they started off, noticing them in noob ships, then moved to Condors/Executioners/Atrons, now they've moved onto Badgers/Bestowers/Itties. ------
Marcus TheMartin Gallente Tuxedo.	Posted - 2007.01.24 16:56:00 - [35] Originally by: Lucifer Fellblade Originally by: JoeT i have seen the ones in yvan. but they are all in noob ships, once in a while a hauler, but nothing worth while in the loot. That's how they started off, noticing them in noob ships, then moved to Condors/Executioners/Atrons, now they've moved onto Badgers/Bestowers/Itties. They are like pokemon I wonder what their stage 3 evolution will be Macro Players Collect Them ALL!
KaptnSparrow Caldari TARDZ Gods of Night and Day	Posted - 2007.01.24 18:35:00 - [36] does nobody see's the bright side of this.... eve just got a new content! we all remember the high sec npc convoys. Now we have lowsec player convoys. Just make agent npc stuff something worth and we can make isk of the farmers like its supposed todo. otherwise just tax newbie corps higher after a while 1. Month = 10% 2. Month = 30% 3. Month = 50% 4. Month = 80% 5. Month = 100% so that after 5 month people will move out into a real corp or won't make money running missions/ratting. They still can mine veldspar in highsec or gank people for the fun of it. And once they rejoin the noob corp they start at 100% automatically. It think to fix the problem you need to fix the mechanics of the game, not ban the farmers. Cause they always will come back. And for Christ sake, don't buy isk of eBay in the first place... i was used to be ceo and now I have nothing to say, this is so relaxing :)
Gileas	Posted - 2007.01.25 07:57:00 - [37] Originally by: DarkElf Originally by: Damien Smith Originally by: SleepingBuddah Macroer pays 15$/month for account and gets (for example) 150$/month. It means that CCP loses 135$/month from that account. I do not know why it is unclear to you. As much as I hate farmers, that statement makes no sense. CCP don't lose any money because they themselves aren't competing with them to sell isk for cash (excluding gtc's of course). The farmers are making money from CCP's property, and are paying CCP a tidy sum of cash for the privilege but the only ones losing out are the players themselves. Totally correct. The previous poster is correct on the moral stance, yes they are stealing from ccp essentially but that does not mean that ccp are losing a penny because they themselves do not sell isk for RL cash (or as far as we know) the bottom line is unless eve players cancel their subscriptions because of this issue then ccp as a company are better off letting them pay DE But CCP really is in the market, but only peripherally. Their approval of GTC/isk trades equates to CCP selling isk. It doesn't matter if "it never occurred to them" when they first approved of it that was the equation going on. It doesn't matter if they're not selling the isk directly to the players like SOE was doing with microtransaction servers. One player is buying a GTC with real money and then selling that card in-game for isk. He has gained isk for his real money, and he's gained it with CCP's approval. They are the only ones that profit in RL money in this scenario because the final owner of the GTC will no-doubt use it to extend his subscription, which leads to further gameplay. As long as SOMEONE in the chain is paying the subscription costs, they don't care. But what if someone begins selling isk for cash? Well, then players don't have to sell GTC (which they bought from CCP) for isk, they can buy it at a better rate from the farmers, and since we've established that CCP is competing with the farmers for the sales of isk, that means CCP is losing sales to the farmers. So blow away a farmer for CCP!! --- Should CCP enact toll gates? Discuss it here!
Gaven Blands	Posted - 2007.01.25 10:25:00 - [38] While it is nice and easy gate ganking the farmers, you seem to have noticed what a fruitless endeavour it is. You are up against hundreds of paid accounts, so you'll get no help from CCP, and you'll get ganked by all the usual faces, and the additional people who are actually buying the isk. For those who not outlaws, you are destroying your sec, and seemingly getting nowhere. To quote a very apt time honoured English phrase, "It's like trying to fight back the march of the Chinese Army". Each one you kill, seemingly ten take his place. Here is something you may wish to consider to make the battle against them more efficient. 1. Learn the route they run time and after time. 2. Work for the same agent they do. 3. Thus finding out where the storyline mission springs from. 4. Camp the storyline base instead. No storyline, no Implant to sell on ebay. 15 missions wasted for the price of one. Additionally, you may get lucky and take out an implant hauler, that's a lot of isk in your pocket. And I know you love isk. If your sig is the best thing you've posted, stop posting.
Amael Galenus	Posted - 2007.01.25 13:37:00 - [39] Originally by: Gaven Blands Here is something you may wish to consider to make the battle against them more efficient. 1. Learn the route they run time and after time. 2. Work for the same agent they do. 3. Thus finding out where the storyline mission springs from. 4. Camp the storyline base instead. No storyline, no Implant to sell on ebay. 15 missions wasted for the price of one. Additionally, you may get lucky and take out an implant hauler, that's a lot of isk in your pocket. And I know you love isk. Genius! Just might give that a go. I hate to have to ask the stupid question but why can't a GM swing by Loes for a couple of hours and see for themselves what's going on? I'm tempted to petition the mission farmers but it'd take me ages to get all of their names and then theres the two week waiting period etc. whereas if a GM reported it, it'd get greater priority...
sliver 0xD Infinite Style Incorporated Chorus of Dawn	Posted - 2007.01.25 13:58:00 - [40] Originally by: KaptnSparrow does nobody see's the bright side of this.... eve just got a new content! we all remember the high sec npc convoys. Now we have lowsec player convoys. Just make agent npc stuff something worth and we can make isk of the farmers like its supposed todo. otherwise just tax newbie corps higher after a while 1. Month = 10% 2. Month = 30% 3. Month = 50% 4. Month = 80% 5. Month = 100% so that after 5 month people will move out into a real corp or won't make money running missions/ratting. They still can mine veldspar in highsec or gank people for the fun of it. And once they rejoin the noob corp they start at 100% automatically. It think to fix the problem you need to fix the mechanics of the game, not ban the farmers. Cause they always will come back. And for Christ sake, don't buy isk of eBay in the first place... BEST IDEA EVER !!!! u know the worst thing that i hate in this game. its not all the cheaters that u see in every system or all the bugs. its the incompitent GM that dont know what there doing and dont give a F. about whats happening. u keep spaming them with obvious cheaters like the macro npcers and all they say is. will look into it and a month later u still have the same macro npcers in the system. a blackhole is, where god divided by zero.
Marcus TheMartin Gallente Tuxedo.	Posted - 2007.01.25 14:00:00 - [41] Originally by: sliver 0xD Originally by: KaptnSparrow does nobody see's the bright side of this.... eve just got a new content! we all remember the high sec npc convoys. Now we have lowsec player convoys. Just make agent npc stuff something worth and we can make isk of the farmers like its supposed todo. otherwise just tax newbie corps higher after a while 1. Month = 10% 2. Month = 30% 3. Month = 50% 4. Month = 80% 5. Month = 100% so that after 5 month people will move out into a real corp or won't make money running missions/ratting. They still can mine veldspar in highsec or gank people for the fun of it. And once they rejoin the noob corp they start at 100% automatically. It think to fix the problem you need to fix the mechanics of the game, not ban the farmers. Cause they always will come back. And for Christ sake, don't buy isk of eBay in the first place... BEST IDEA EVER !!!! u know the worst thing that i hate in this game. its not all the cheaters that u see in every system or all the bugs. its the incompitent GM that dont know what there doing and dont give a F. about whats happening. u keep spaming them with obvious cheaters like the macro npcers and all they say is. will look into it and a month later u still have the same macro npcers in the system. I'd like to say your sig wins
Humpalot	Posted - 2007.01.25 16:24:00 - [42] I am unclear how a farmer/macroer can make any money at all if they get their indies consistently popped? If they are running a courier mission and they get popped carrying the cargo they fail the mission and take a standings hit. Do that enough and that L4 agent won't be talking to you for long. Now add in the loss of the indy. Even if they build their own and insure them I think they'd lose some money on the deal. Maybe not a lot but still a loss. So how does this work? No, I am NOT asking so I can try (never macroed or farmed in my life and have no intention of ever starting). I am asking mostly out of curiosity but also if you understand the economics of it all then you stand a better chance of finding a way to hit them in their pocketbook where it counts (that or CCP can figure a way to adjust things so it does nto work so well). As for people griping at the Devs for doing nothing because they like the paid account you can forget it. EVE started as a home grown game and the Devs have their heart and soul in here more than any other MMO I have seen. WOW is a business. EVE is a labor of love. I forget which one but IIRC a Dev did respond, somewhat angrily, that they DO chase down macroers and happily ban them and that a paid account means nothing in this case. The problem is catching a macroer is not as simple as it sounds. They do not want to ban someone unjustly (AFK flying your hauler is not against the rules). You need to give the Devs a bit of a break. This is a huge and complex game. Show me an MMO of this size where the Devs do better.
voogru Gallente Massive Damage	Posted - 2007.01.25 17:37:00 - [43] Add them to your buddy list. Petition them. Keep petitioning them until their icon is always red. Also, be aware that a majority of farmers are not macros, but they are hired labor. They exist to farm ISK for the purpose of selling it, which is a bannable offense.
Ice Conch	Posted - 2007.01.25 18:12:00 - [44] Originally by: Humpalot I am unclear how a farmer/macroer can make any money at all if they get their indies consistently popped? If they are running a courier mission and they get popped carrying the cargo they fail the mission and take a standings hit. Do that enough and that L4 agent won't be talking to you for long. Now add in the loss of the indy. Even if they build their own and insure them I think they'd lose some money on the deal. Maybe not a lot but still a loss. So how does this work? No, I am NOT asking so I can try (never macroed or farmed in my life and have no intention of ever starting). I am asking mostly out of curiosity but also if you understand the economics of it all then you stand a better chance of finding a way to hit them in their pocketbook where it counts (that or CCP can figure a way to adjust things so it does nto work so well). As for people griping at the Devs for doing nothing because they like the paid account you can forget it. EVE started as a home grown game and the Devs have their heart and soul in here more than any other MMO I have seen. WOW is a business. EVE is a labor of love. I forget which one but IIRC a Dev did respond, somewhat angrily, that they DO chase down macroers and happily ban them and that a paid account means nothing in this case. The problem is catching a macroer is not as simple as it sounds. They do not want to ban someone unjustly (AFK flying your hauler is not against the rules). You need to give the Devs a bit of a break. This is a huge and complex game. Show me an MMO of this size where the Devs do better. get 30 accounts. get them in t1 cheap haulers. have them autopilot to their mission. complete mission. head back
Christopher Dalran	Posted - 2007.01.25 18:40:00 - [45] Edited by: Christopher Dalran on 25/01/2007 18:37:48 Can we get a macro for blowing up macro haulers? They problem is they just dont care, with dozens of accounts they more than make up for losses in the hour that someone isint camping the place. As far as banning goes these people dont train skills, they just get into a cheap hauler which you can do basically right away. If you ban their account they just get another one right away and start over.
gurista wreck	Posted - 2007.01.25 19:20:00 - [46] believe me, ccp does ban accounts on a whim. I had an account stolen from me way back in 2004. The account was created near in 2003. After taking a few years off eve, I tried to get it back. Even after establishing that I was the original owner of the account, the GM chose to just ban the account. I wont go into detail with the GM's reasons, but he/she said the account had changed hands several times after (the apparent theft) and since doing that with accounts was in violation of the EULA, it was banned. How Im supposed to be responsible for my account after it was stolen is besides me. Must be that icelandic logic
IRS Informant Income Redistribution Service	Posted - 2007.01.25 19:55:00 - [47] Yeah, we'll take potshots at the macroers if we already have aggression at the gates, but have pretty much stopped targeting them directly.. Just not worth picking up the gate gun aggro to kill a hauler carrying around a group of janitors.. But in their defense, there is somebody behind the screen.. Somewhere after the 200th hauler kill the guy got all his accounts together and swarmed us with an entire fleet of shuttles at the gate.. It was a beautiful thing, and I gotta give them props for style.. Even if their best attempt at smack is "Yoy are mnay dogs!"
Ridley Tree The Black Rabbits Fatal Persuasion	Posted - 2007.01.25 21:23:00 - [48] The Rabbits are taking a vacation in Placid, we're averaging 10 industrials a day. Mainly just by solo camping the gates looking for them while not doing anything. Then we changed our killboard and they don't show up as 'real kills' anymore. ---
Jalec Creed Gallente Pod Munchers	Posted - 2007.01.26 11:49:00 - [49] (Didnt bother to read the entire thread since the title explained enough) I recently moved my business into placid and yes, Loes and nearby system are crap-loaded with those macroers. Characters named CGBVTHEJH and such, hands full of bestowers and an average of 25 players in local. Irritating. When I return home from work ill hop in my ship and join the slaughterfest. -----------------------------------
Vasiliyan PAX Interstellar Services Anarchy Empire	Posted - 2007.01.26 16:22:00 - [50] I noticed these a while ago. Aren't they working for Roden Shipyards? I think they might be farming not ISK but standings, so they can get research agents. Imagine ISK sellers with a T2 BPO.
Frito11 Turbulent Anarchy Empire	Posted - 2007.01.26 17:56:00 - [51] Originally by: Vasiliyan I noticed these a while ago. Aren't they working for Roden Shipyards? I think they might be farming not ISK but standings, so they can get research agents. Imagine ISK sellers with a T2 BPO. oh man that is evil, your prob. right I never thought of that
Jalec Creed Gallente Pod Munchers	Posted - 2007.01.26 18:29:00 - [52] ISK selling standing raisers and/or macroers, its all the same. Im happily munching on their pods. -----------------------------------
Silane Daktor Sanguine Legion	Posted - 2007.01.27 09:42:00 - [53] Well, if it cheers anyone up, between Sanguine and Black Rabbits, we killed a lot of these damn farmers yesterday. Also, the fact eBay is now delisting all virtual in-game items will probably have an impact on these guys. But no doubt they'll use another method of selling ISK/ in-game items
Gileas	Posted - 2007.01.27 10:07:00 - [54] They already do use another service, but the rates that I see there are worse than current rates on GTC. Best rate there is approx 8m/$1, compared to about 10m/$1 on GTC. --- Should CCP enact toll gates? Discuss it here!
Hesod Adee Bright New Dawn Free Trade Coalition	Posted - 2007.01.27 10:49:00 - [55] Originally by: Gileas They already do use another service, but the rates that I see there are worse than current rates on GTC. Best rate there is approx 8m/$1, compared to about 10m/$1 on GTC. So you get more ISK per $ with buying GTCs than if you buy it directly ? And buying ISK directly is bannable, while buying GTCs and trading them is allowed. So if I wanted to buy ISK, why would I buy from the ISK sellers, when the GTC gets me more ISK and has less risk ? ----------------- My door is always open, just don't go in.
Gileas	Posted - 2007.01.27 15:19:00 - [56] Originally by: Hesod Adee Originally by: Gileas They already do use another service, but the rates that I see there are worse than current rates on GTC. Best rate there is approx 8m/$1, compared to about 10m/$1 on GTC. So you get more ISK per $ with buying GTCs than if you buy it directly ? And buying ISK directly is bannable, while buying GTCs and trading them is allowed. So if I wanted to buy ISK, why would I buy from the ISK sellers, when the GTC gets me more ISK and has less risk ? No idea. There certainly doesn't appear to be a compelling reason to buy from the site I checked. There may be other sites with more competitive rates but I doubt it. They're most likely counting on getting customers that are unaware of the GTC/isk exchange but know about their service from their business in another game. --- Should CCP enact toll gates? Discuss it here!
Soporo	Posted - 2007.01.28 00:44:00 - [57] Quote: There is a few highlevel courier agents there.. and once day I took my sniper there and killed like.. 20-30 haulers in like.. 15-30 minutes or so.. didnt even count. Let me know if you ever need a hauler to help you with that.
Soporo	Posted - 2007.01.28 01:09:00 - [58] EVE is all about Metagaming. Whether it's endless streams of Macros, n00b corp spies/suicide gank/scouts/haulers, multiple accounts, ISK sales, GTC sales, Charracter sales and buys, ugh. More rl money = huge edge in a GAME, no level playing field, not even close. Look at EVE China, very steady and steep decline in memebers. Mainly, it is said, because the two biggest Alliances are huge farmer/macroers, everyone else says screw it. When I get fed up and tired of it all, this will be my primary reason.
Petrothian Tong Gallente	Posted - 2007.01.28 08:40:00 - [59] They gotta run out of ships sometime!!!! hmmm, it would be interesting to see how many ships can they afford to lose before stopping all together.... On the plus side, we now got content!!! oh, and the smartbombing BS is just EVIL!!!! =P (btw, if you pop them, blow up their wrecks as well as long as any mission items, that will hurt their standings(no way to complete mission after that.), and after afew, they wont be able to do those mission anymore...just alittle FYI... ) -- Today my drones attacked a brothel without even being told too. Either they objected to the establishment or they heard about the hot drinks machine in there... Yakumo
DarkElf Caldari DJ's Exotic Dancers Escorts	Posted - 2007.01.28 10:48:00 - [60] Originally by: Petrothian Tong They gotta run out of ships sometime!!!! They really don't, that's the depressing thing DE

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