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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 3 post(s) |
FT Diomedes
The Graduates
2351
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Posted - 2016.03.10 21:41:07 -
[91] - Quote
Cometopappa wrote:Does this mean one ECCM module is not as good as they were before? ECCM right now gives 96%. How much sensor strength will an ECCM scripted sensor booster give after the patch?
I believe it is 100%.
CCP should add more NPC 0.0 space to open it up and liven things up: the Stepping Stones project.
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Tassadar Gantrithor
Easy Co. Get Off My Lawn
0
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Posted - 2016.03.11 09:59:20 -
[92] - Quote
HIGH-lariousGǪ
The point made of reducing the EVE universe complexity so someone new doesnGÇÖt have to learn a vast system of modules to choose from is completely ridiculous. Those "72 different" ECCM modules each had their own specific role to fulfill. The whole premise that EVE is built on is that it is a game not for the average casual player. One needs to be invested and be able to learn a large scale system to interact with the game to the absolute fullest. If they wanted something simple and a one-click-win system they go play WOW, GÇ£You have this class, with these items, and you win.GÇ¥ EVE was meant to be for those who are looking for a challenge. EVE wasn't meant for an instant win button.
And the whole argument about using the wrong module on your ship is a line of complete stupidity. If you arenGÇÖt looking at which ECCM module to fit on your ship and just pick one you arenGÇÖt paying attention to the game and trying to learn it, thus youGÇÖre just wanting to one-click-win. If you donGÇÖt understand the intricate workings of how each ship works and functions you will declare yourself dead the moment you decide to undock. Yes fitting a Gravimetric ECCM onto a Stabber Fleet Issue will not do you any benefit. Well, why did you fit that module in the first place? Are you protecting yourself against something? If you are then what are you protecting against? YouGÇÖre protecting yourself from a certain type of attack or you are trying to do a certain type of damage. ItGÇÖs no different than fitting for a specific tank on a ship. You know you are going to go up against an Amarrian fleet, therefore you just throw an Explosive Armor hardener on your Rokh battleship? NO, you do research. They are using energy weapons which do EM and Thermal damage so you fit for EM and Thermal resists. YouGÇÖre a shield focused ship so you fit for shield modules not armor. You are a turret based ship so you donGÇÖt fit a full load of energy neutralizers you fit hybrid turret batteries. YouGÇÖre using a Caldari ship so you train Minmatar industrial to V on the premise that it will boost your abilities in the Rokh, no. These things come from flying and playing EVE and learning the game. If youGÇÖre not looking at what a module does and what it affects then why are you fitting it? If you don't look into how things work and aren't willing to learn, why are you playing?
What was the problem with ECCM modules? GÇ£ItGÇÖs hard to use.GÇ¥ GÇ£No one uses the modules.GÇ¥ ItGÇÖs hard to use because you have to work with a ship that is sacrificing its offensive capabilities to become more defensive with its power. No one uses it because GÇ£the big leagues donGÇÖt use ECM.GÇ¥ Even as a member in the great Imperium, I will very often straight up disregard their GÇ£required fittingsGÇ¥ because I know my style of play and how to fly certain ships. ItGÇÖs their opinion of how to use the ship but itGÇÖs my ship to use so I will fit it the way I think is right. If you build to counter against a ship jamming you, you will want an ECCM module. It is no different than using a Signal Amplifier to counteract a Remote Sensor Dampener. It is no different than using a Tracking Computer or Enhancer to boost your guns to counteract a Tracking Disruptor. These are modules that are designed to be the opposite of EWAR to give each person a chance at defending themselves from everything in the game. You canGÇÖt fit it all to counter everything because there is no GÇ£winGÇ¥ ship. A dreadnaught capital ship may be one of the biggest powerhouses in the game but it will cower in fear in a corner weeping like a child against a single Crucifier with one tracking disruptor. It doesnGÇÖt matter how GÇ£perfectGÇ¥ you fit your ship, someone in the universe is your exact counter and death sentence. You just have to hope itGÇÖs not the person staring at your ship in the moment.
If you are going to make a module that has an effect on three different aspects of a ship [scan resolution/targeting range/ship sensor strength] then as a suggestion, make the module only be able to activate with a charge in it. A turret or missile battery can only function with ammunition in it. This can also be said about all of the boosting modules and offensive EWAR that possess scripts. Each module plays a role with needing a script to run a certain program to enhance a portion of your ship. Without the guidance of the script all you have is a module who is waiting for input to function. Therefore remote sensor dampeners, tracking computers, ect, need a script to activate the module same as weapons. Each mid slot booster module also has a passive low slot you are able to fit if you want more defenses in the aspect of your ship you are trying to protect. It wonGÇÖt be as powerful but thatGÇÖs the difference between the passive and the active modules of EVE. Something you learn while playing EVE Online. Straight numbers yes, an active tank holds better over a passive tank. Put time into the equation and the active tank falls out because it will run out of cap at some point but the passive stays strong. Each mid and low slow module has its own place and usefulness. Same goes for the ECCM passive modules and projected ECCM modules.
Obviously everyone will rip me a new one and most likely this falls on deaf ears. You post the thread for feedback. Here you go; 2 cents.
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Moloney
Mass Effect Enterprises
201
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Posted - 2016.03.11 10:54:10 -
[93] - Quote
CCP Fozzie wrote:
These new modules will give bonuses to all four sensor strengths, as choosing the right ECCM type for your ship is not and interesting choice or valuable gameplay.
Yes it is. It distinguishes the people that have put time and effort into learning something useful and morons that assume that anything will do.
CCP Fozzie wrote: This change also has the added benefit of reducing the number of modules a new player needs to learn about by over 100 (we actually had 72 kinds of Sensor Backup Arrays in the game alone, it blew my mind).
Just because you are not the sharpest tool in the shed, does not mean that everyone is a dull are you are. You have reduced options, choice, learning, differentiation and quality of game play. Eve is played specifically for its complexity. You are systematically making the game less enjoyable.
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Vailen Sere
Ixian Machines TOG - The Older Gamers Alliance
18
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Posted - 2016.03.11 21:44:25 -
[94] - Quote
SilentAsTheGrave wrote:Hopelesshobo wrote:This is the change ECCM/ECM has needed so people will stop complaining about ECM being OP so much. Give value to the module that isn't niche so people will actually have a module that gives them a bonus while on grid when they are not being jammed. What I think people don't like about ECM that many have pointed out is it has no counter play. If you are jammed, that's it. You can no do absolutely nothing of value for the next 20 seconds in addition to the time it takes to relock targets. Oh and heaven help you if you had someone tackled and they vomited out some light ECM drones on you and escaped. ECM drones are the most produced drone for all the EW drones than all other drones combined. The reason is very obvious. They are super cheap and turns any ship with a drone bay into a Kitsune. ECM is not a fun game mechanic. It is a dice roll to see if players are allowed to play the game or not. Merging these modules initially sounds good and does help the situation some, but still does absolutely nothing to address the fact being jammed offers no counter play what so ever. ECM is just a terrible game mechanic that is a relic from old game design philosophy.
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Vailen Sere
Ixian Machines TOG - The Older Gamers Alliance
18
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Posted - 2016.03.11 21:47:17 -
[95] - Quote
deleted because of copy |
Saarus
eXceed Inc.
4
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Posted - 2016.03.12 17:51:20 -
[96] - Quote
Tassadar Gantrithor wrote:HIGH-lariousGǪ
The point made of reducing the EVE universe complexity so someone new doesnGÇÖt have to learn a vast system of modules to choose from is completely ridiculous. Those "72 different" ECCM modules each had their own specific role to fulfill.
I really thought twice about reading the rest of your post after reading those first 2 lines. really? every one of those 72 eccm modules hat their own specific role? you dont really belive that, do you? divide that number by 4 and you maybe get the number of modules "intended to have different rolen". after that you look at the numbers and then tell me you would fit anything other than the meta4 ones or maybe t2 |
Akemon Numon
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
11
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Posted - 2016.03.12 21:59:16 -
[97] - Quote
hypocrites
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2530257#post2530257
CCP Greyscale "We're not, in general and with exceptions, fans of multi-function modules. EVE fitting is about trade-offs, not about having your cake and eating it. In this particular case, it was making the decision to take an active hardener over a passive one easier than it otherwise would be, which isn't a particularly good thing. "
So now 4 in one mods are ok, give us back the passive resist bonus on shield/armour hardeners. |
Tassadar Gantrithor
Easy Co. Get Off My Lawn
0
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Posted - 2016.03.12 23:08:13 -
[98] - Quote
Saarus wrote:
I really thought twice about reading the rest of your post after reading those first 2 lines. really? every one of those 72 eccm modules hat their own specific role? you dont really belive that, do you? divide that number by 4 and you maybe get the number of modules "intended to have different roles". after that you look at the numbers and then tell me you would fit anything other than the meta4 ones or maybe t2
Yes. Yes they all do. Because EVE is a game based around how you fit things. Each one was setup with a different requirement of CPU and PWG. You may not be able to get the absolute max from the mod you could get from a T2 but that's what EVE is... making your ship fit with your skills. The Meta 4 and T2 yes had the highest bonus to your ship but they required the most for fitting. You never say "O, well I can't fit a T2 mod of this screw this fit. New ship." No, you have the options of the T1 series to pick and choose carefully your mod selection. If the meta 2 has the lowest CPU requirements and you have CPU issues then you're going pick that one to still have some bonus to that area you wanted. But if you want to be the elitist person who only fits T2 and refuses to fit T1, whatever go for it. Don't strip another pilots' capabilities to modify their own ships. |
Kasumatsu
Assets and Holdings
4
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Posted - 2016.03.13 12:16:35 -
[99] - Quote
Looks like this is now active? All my ECCM bookmarks are grey now! |
Frostys Virpio
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
2673
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Posted - 2016.03.14 13:23:35 -
[100] - Quote
GetSirrus wrote:I suppose this makes ECCM near unprobable a thing of the past?
Nope. Fit the new SEBO and script it for ECCM. The ugly part is it now makes sniping doctrine who try to run more effective since they get harder to probe just by swapping a script from targeting range to snipe to ECCM to avoid easy probing. |
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Borg Alexandra
Digital Origami Evictus.
0
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Posted - 2016.03.16 09:46:46 -
[101] - Quote
PotatoOverdose wrote: Doesn't really change all that much tbh.
There's basically two cases where people complain about ecm. (1) When a falcon alt uncloaks and turns a 1v1 into a 2v1 and For (1), nothing really changes. If you bring sebo's to a 1v1, you're either giving up tank (hardeners, shield boosters) or damage application (webs, tracking computers) putting you at a disadvantage. Further, even 3-4 sebos won't stop a falcon with 5-6 jams from keeping you locked out of half of a fight. In the small gang case, people "lose" to falcons because there's another ship in play that they didn't expect - not because ecm is "broken". It doesn't really matter whether that ship is a falcon or something like a pilgrim/curse/rapier/proteus/neutral logi.
Basically, nothing really changes for ewar pilots.
This is very accurate, as a solo player I can confirm. |
Fourteen Maken
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
264
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Posted - 2016.04.14 19:14:20 -
[102] - Quote
Borg Alexandra wrote:PotatoOverdose wrote: Doesn't really change all that much tbh.
There's basically two cases where people complain about ecm. (1) When a falcon alt uncloaks and turns a 1v1 into a 2v1 and For (1), nothing really changes. If you bring sebo's to a 1v1, you're either giving up tank (hardeners, shield boosters) or damage application (webs, tracking computers) putting you at a disadvantage. Further, even 3-4 sebos won't stop a falcon with 5-6 jams from keeping you locked out of half of a fight. In the small gang case, people "lose" to falcons because there's another ship in play that they didn't expect - not because ecm is "broken". It doesn't really matter whether that ship is a falcon or something like a pilgrim/curse/rapier/proteus/neutral logi.
Basically, nothing really changes for ewar pilots.
This is very accurate, as a solo player I can confirm.
insta locking f1 monkeys sitting on gates is by far the biggest problem for solo players |
Fourteen Maken
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
264
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Posted - 2016.04.14 19:39:08 -
[103] - Quote
Flyinghotpocket wrote:i demand federation navy sebo's be replaced with imperial navy sebos. fed navy has litterally everything right next to winmatar.
so glad the 2 most advanced races in the game keep to their RP grounds when it came to warfare links. federation navy get skirmish and armor, and yet... they keep the eccm and sensor module. while amarr navy get information and armor. and yet, cant make anything.
nobody uses faction sebo's anyway so it doesn't make much difference who's name is on it, but faction modules as a whole need a complete overhaul and rebalance because there are too many useuless/overpriced faction modules and all the useful ones are concentrated in the lp stores of minmattar and gallente. It mainly only affects high sec mission runners but I'd still like to see some effort made to balance it all the same. |
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