Originally by: Glenntwo

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You should be an anti pirate because you enjoy giving a player who is looking for an unfair fight an extremely unfair fight

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Originally by: Kodiak31415

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Edited by: Kodiak31415 on 08/02/2007 03:32:56
When I think of combat in eve I think about ships blowing the stuffing out of eachother, tanking, ganking, big booms, massive 8 gun/launcher battleships standing toe to toe blasting eachother into little itty bitty peices. "Wave of mutilation 2 style" for thoes you that have seen it. Or like some of the Lock n' Load video fights.

But it seems that combat in eve is now more based on the "other stuff". Look at ships like the myridon, curse, nannodomi/phoon. Look at the dominance of EW, damps, tracking disruptors, and above all else nos. The big guns and launchers are silent because they ship they're attached to are damped down to 5km lock range. You somehow manage to wait through the 2 minute lock time and lock a target 5km away from you! Now that little damper is going to die! But wait.....you have no cap to fire your guns because it's all been sucked off by nos! Not to worry, you picked minmatar or caldari and don't need cap to fire your guns! Too late, you got ecm'ed, now your going to have to wait 2.5 minutes to get another lock. Time to turrtle up and use that handy rep bonus that your ship has...but you have no cap to rep with. So slowly your tank fails, as you sit there as harmless as a veldspar asteroid watching your hardcore tanked death dealing uber ship get slowly picked apart by a couple of little leech ships that you should have been able to blast to smithereens within seconds of getting a lock.

BTW, this wasn't supposed to be a whine (It did kind of turn into one). It was going to be an observtion of mine and I wanted to know how the rest of the playerbase felt about it. Please keep replies constructive, you can tell me I'm wrong without calling me a noob/idiot/moron/asking if I even play eve ect...

Am I wrong here or is eve combat now all about EW and cap warfare with damage only becoming a factor once a ship is defanged and nosed to the point of death? I want people to see a hyperion or abbadon and think "if that guy has a close rang gank setup were toast" not just "meh, slap some damps and nos on him and watch him wither away on the vine." I know CCP wanted to increase combat times but did do it at the cost of combat itself? Am I just full of nonsense? Is there a way to 'fix' this without remving EW and nos from the game completley? Does it even need to be fixed?

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Originally by: Vim

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People are learning to take thoose things and put them into a collaborate effort working togheter with a couple of small ships versus a battleship. Tactics and teamwork(the T in MMO) makes things intersting compared to: My big phat ship can tank this much and do this haxxor damage with my big guns!

Basicly teamwork>solo as it should be else we humans wouldnt have come this far.

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Originally by: hotgirl933

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kill 2 birds with one stone nerf nos by giving any use of it a sig radius boost as an offset as well as reducing inertia ( NOS = reducing speed and turning speed) and the benefits are sustain a tank, suck youre opponent

On the other hand ishtab and nano fittings give a 10% reduction for each one fitted penalty to any NOS u have fitted

Therefore u either fit ishtabs-nanos or NOS.

Kills to birds with one stones and gives a slight nerf to nanodomis and nanophoons that are around atm

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Originally by: Kodiak31415

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Edited by: Kodiak31415 on 08/02/2007 03:32:56
When I think of combat in eve I think about ships blowing the stuffing out of eachother, tanking, ganking, big booms, massive 8 gun/launcher battleships standing toe to toe blasting eachother into little itty bitty peices. "Wave of mutilation 2 style" for thoes you that have seen it. Or like some of the Lock n' Load video fights.

But it seems that combat in eve is now more based on the "other stuff". Look at ships like the myridon, curse, nannodomi/phoon. Look at the dominance of EW, damps, tracking disruptors, and above all else nos. The big guns and launchers are silent because they ship they're attached to are damped down to 5km lock range. You somehow manage to wait through the 2 minute lock time and lock a target 5km away from you! Now that little damper is going to die! But wait.....you have no cap to fire your guns because it's all been sucked off by nos! Not to worry, you picked minmatar or caldari and don't need cap to fire your guns! Too late, you got ecm'ed, now your going to have to wait 2.5 minutes to get another lock. Time to turrtle up and use that handy rep bonus that your ship has...but you have no cap to rep with. So slowly your tank fails, as you sit there as harmless as a veldspar asteroid watching your hardcore tanked death dealing uber ship get slowly picked apart by a couple of little leech ships that you should have been able to blast to smithereens within seconds of getting a lock.

BTW, this wasn't supposed to be a whine (It did kind of turn into one). It was going to be an observtion of mine and I wanted to know how the rest of the playerbase felt about it. Please keep replies constructive, you can tell me I'm wrong without calling me a noob/idiot/moron/asking if I even play eve ect...

Am I wrong here or is eve combat now all about EW and cap warfare with damage only becoming a factor once a ship is defanged and nosed to the point of death? I want people to see a hyperion or abbadon and think "if that guy has a close rang gank setup were toast" not just "meh, slap some damps and nos on him and watch him wither away on the vine." I know CCP wanted to increase combat times but did do it at the cost of combat itself? Am I just full of nonsense? Is there a way to 'fix' this without remving EW and nos from the game completley? Does it even need to be fixed?

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Originally by: Allantia

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Edited by: Allantia on 08/02/2007 08:58:00
/signed

Combat in EVE today is all about having the most I-WIN buttons - ECM & NOS.

Edit: Can't blame CCP entirely though. The dominate attitude regarding PvP is just as responsible for the problems... no one cares about having fights that are even remotely balanced or challenging, it's all about getting that killmail.

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Originally by: DarkFenix

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I'll agree with the OP on one point only. Nos's. They're just a bit too good against smaller ships (considering years ago CCP deliberately introduced tracking to make large weapons not hit small ships, and more recently missiles were nerfed against smaller ships too).

Other than that, I can't see what people are complaining about. You're complaining that enemy support ships are using their nerf-bat modules to gimp your ship before it fires a shot. The solution is simple, fly with your own support. Your support lets loose the pew pew on enemy support, while the battleships or whatever damage dealers slug it out. Obviously this is a massive simplification, but is in essence true.

To analogise it to real life, real wars are not fought by lines of tanks driving up to one another then fighting until one side wins. They get air support, recon/intel support, infantry support, and any side without this kind of support is at a serious disadvantage.

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Originally by: Jon Hawkes

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I thought most of the combat took place on the forums...

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Originally by: Cailais

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I for one am getting a bit bored with the 'nerf module x' - ECM mods were nerfed becuase no body would fit the counter ECCM (admitedly not a great counter but it did eventually get boosted). Now RSDs are getting it in the neck because (apparently) fitting a sensor booster 'wastes a valuable slot'. No it doesn't: you choose not to fit the counter, you suffer the disadvantage. NOS gets the same grief - yes its frustrating to get nossed in your inty, but then should 1 inty, or even a couple of frigates disable a BS?? A small frig swarm of 5-6 frigs can avoid the effects of most Heavy Nos fitted BS, with the possible exception of nosdomi - a quite specialized ship.

I think the nerf bat should be put away for a while - and more thought put into how we can 'adapt' our ships mid combat because the real reason the 'nerf it!' cries go up is because once you're in space and engaged thats it - you're stuck with the set up you have.
Think about it this way, if you could 'scale' your cap replen rate, shields, weapon rof and so forth by shifting more, or less power to discreet functions combat would become more tactical and hopefully last a bit longer. Getting nossed? - flick the sliding scale control to boost cap replen (perhaps rof on weapons drops), want more firepower - boost your guns up etc etc etc. Alternatively more mods should require activation to provide a bonus (say heat sinks for example).

yes this is a bit more of a 'button mashing' style of play but some comprimises or changes to the way combat happens will be needed otherwise everything will have been nerfed until we're all flying around in identikit ships...

C.

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Originally by: Bryg Philomena

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FoF

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Originally by: Kodiak31415

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Edited by: Kodiak31415 on 08/02/2007 03:32:56
When I think of combat in eve I think about ships blowing the stuffing out of eachother, tanking, ganking, big booms, massive 8 gun/launcher battleships standing toe to toe blasting eachother into little itty bitty peices. "Wave of mutilation 2 style" for thoes you that have seen it. Or like some of the Lock n' Load video fights.

But it seems that combat in eve is now more based on the "other stuff". Look at ships like the myridon, curse, nannodomi/phoon. Look at the dominance of EW, damps, tracking disruptors, and above all else nos. The big guns and launchers are silent because they ship they're attached to are damped down to 5km lock range. You somehow manage to wait through the 2 minute lock time and lock a target 5km away from you! Now that little damper is going to die! But wait.....you have no cap to fire your guns because it's all been sucked off by nos! Not to worry, you picked minmatar or caldari and don't need cap to fire your guns! Too late, you got ecm'ed, now your going to have to wait 2.5 minutes to get another lock. Time to turrtle up and use that handy rep bonus that your ship has...but you have no cap to rep with. So slowly your tank fails, as you sit there as harmless as a veldspar asteroid watching your hardcore tanked death dealing uber ship get slowly picked apart by a couple of little leech ships that you should have been able to blast to smithereens within seconds of getting a lock.

BTW, this wasn't supposed to be a whine (It did kind of turn into one). It was going to be an observtion of mine and I wanted to know how the rest of the playerbase felt about it. Please keep replies constructive, you can tell me I'm wrong without calling me a noob/idiot/moron/asking if I even play eve ect...

Am I wrong here or is eve combat now all about EW and cap warfare with damage only becoming a factor once a ship is defanged and nosed to the point of death? I want people to see a hyperion or abbadon and think "if that guy has a close rang gank setup were toast" not just "meh, slap some damps and nos on him and watch him wither away on the vine." I know CCP wanted to increase combat times but did do it at the cost of combat itself? Am I just full of nonsense? Is there a way to 'fix' this without remving EW and nos from the game completley? Does it even need to be fixed?

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