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Eve, please tell me why the waiting game, where is the skill :(

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Nyxsion	Posted - 2007.02.08 22:34:00 - [1] Well started playing 2 days ago and so far all good except the following. I want to fly a Mammoth BUT not due to lack of skill but time. Ive brought the mammoth(collecting dust) and over 2 days started training the req's to fly it (even brought skill book in advance sitting in cargo bay collecting dust "industrial ships") So why on earth if I have the Skill to amass that kind of Isk do I now have to twidle my thumbs waiting for a countdown on training skills? Where is the skill in just sitting idle? (insert any class of ship) flying skills should increase while you fly as well as if you train it like a multiplier in addition to learning the next skill. Of course the first level should be learnt the slow way of course. Shouldnt flying a class of ship for an extended time give you experience in that field? p.s. Dont say time spent can be doing other things, yes Id like to do salvaging aswell but hell Id have to wait for that to and sacrifice more time to get other things my Isk can afford, maybe Iam missing something, please enlighten me!
Ketrin	Posted - 2007.02.08 22:37:00 - [2] This is a direct conceqence of make the training of skills go faster. More implants, skills wich give on atributes and now 900k starting number of skillpoints.
between4and24	Posted - 2007.02.08 22:38:00 - [3] Edited by: between4and24 on 08/02/2007 22:36:46 edit: maybe you could go explore 0.0 in a cheap ship like a frigate, and see what its like out there while waiting on your industry ship skills to train, you might be able to find loot cans laying around that someone didn't want to take the time to empty and you could find something really nice
mechtech	Posted - 2007.02.08 22:41:00 - [4] I guess you are advancing faster than the average new player. Once you hit a certain point, you get enough skills that you can play the game without feeling that you have to have to have your training skill finished. As for the skill training suggestions, there is debate over it all the time, but in the end, this system works.
Sheial Tarlien Minmatar Forsaken Empire The Forsaken Empire	Posted - 2007.02.08 22:42:00 - [5] Originally by: Nyxsion Well started playing 2 days ago and so far all good except the following. I want to fly a Mammoth BUT not due to lack of skill but time. On my WOW account i would like to use my level 20 armor but im only level 15 will take me another 2 days to get level 20?? WTF why cant i use it now?!?! The above is an example is another version of basic leveling you just dont have to grind for it and no i dont own a wow account -_- Quote: Where is the skill in just sitting idle? (insert any class of ship) flying skills should increase while you fly as well as if you train it like a multiplier in addition to learning the next skill. Of course the first level should be learnt the slow way of course. Shouldnt flying a class of ship for an extended time give you experience in that field? Kool i can go afk orbiting an asteriod in my Interceptor and wake up with interceptors level 5 skill has my vote!!! another example at one time it was tried and explioted beyond belif also flying a ship more does make you better. Just not in skillpoints just in your own skill. IE you buy a 30 million skillpoint charactor with maxed BS skills from Ebay.. and another person whos played for a couple of years comes along and wtfpwns you even though he has equal skill points just the guy who didnt insta get 30 million skill points know how to fly his ship like second nature.
D'an Y'eal Dirty Deeds Corp. Axiom Empire	Posted - 2007.02.08 22:44:00 - [6] /me sits in the rocking chair and strokes beard thoughfully Back in the day you used to get skill points for "doing stuff" AND for actively training a skill, was uber exploitable and hence no longer an option. ----------------- #begin Sig: Everything I say is the official word of me, my corp and my alliance. Anyone who says otherwise is full of themselves. :D Hillary Clinton on Exxon: "I want to take
Cotton Tail Rage of Angels Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2007.02.08 22:45:00 - [7] The issue here is a core part of the game design and something which a lot of people absolutely love about the game, you don't need to invest a huge amount of time to be able to compete on skill points with players of a similar age. The advantage of the amount of time you can play in EVE is in your ability to amass isk which you can spend on many benefits such as implants to progress faster with training. When talking about industrials it is important to remember that they're designed to take a little bit of time to be able to fly to prevent people simply making disposable hauler alts without impacting the advancement of their main character. Hang in there and be thankful you don't have to train skills like battleship to level 5 which can take 40+ days.
Dirtball Kemono. Privateer Alliance	Posted - 2007.02.08 22:48:00 - [8] Its what makes eve uber, the only thing you get by playing is isk. People with fulltime jobs and kids can still play the game and only have to log in for 5 minutes at a time for 6 months if they so choose. (its also a killer way to have people keep on paying unlike the grinding games where you get uber get bored and quit) The training is the best part of eve cause in a short amount of time you can get proficient, but having the extra 5% of a lvl 5 can mean the difference between living and dieing. Join a corp and people will teach you more in 30 minutes than 4 hours of forum browsing can show you.
Rells Caldari Agony Unleashed	Posted - 2007.02.08 22:51:00 - [9] Hmm .. a newbie to the game that does not yet understand its beauty. Isnt it time you learned how to fight back?
Nyxsion	Posted - 2007.02.08 23:02:00 - [10] Edited by: Nyxsion on 08/02/2007 23:02:28 I dont want easy street, dont get me wrong. My issue is with you spend time making Isk, yet you can spend it instantly but you cannot use that item you've just brought? Where is the logic in that? Yes you can say well buy a ship at 75mil if you have the Isk but certainly it is my right to buy it and of course loose it just as fast due to inexperience. Maybe all Iam after is yes you can use it straight away, BUT train skills to become more effiecent at it would make more sense. I find it fustrating that I cannot explore other aspects of game example being salvaging without stoping to become effecient at one field of expertise. But atleast I would have option to see if I wanted to be better in a different field.
Blue Pixie	Posted - 2007.02.08 23:11:00 - [11] You're frustrated because after a grand total of TWO whole days of playing, you can't fly any ship you want? Maybe it's time to turn off your computer and go find yourself a Nintendo?
Frug	Posted - 2007.02.08 23:12:00 - [12] Isk isn't everything. Sounds like you want a win button and are whining about not being able to farm your skill points like you farmed your isk with your super isk farming "skills" I hear mario Bros. doesn't require skill training. try that. - - - - - - - - - - Do not use dotted lines - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - or automatic signatures - - - - - - - -
Frug	Posted - 2007.02.08 23:12:00 - [13] Isk isn't everything. Sounds like you want a win button and are whining about not being able to farm your skill points like you farmed your isk with your super isk farming "skills" I hear mario Bros. doesn't require skill training. try that. - - - - - - - - - - Do not use dotted lines - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - or automatic signatures - - - - - - - -
Grash Freedom Gallente MAZA Solutions	Posted - 2007.02.08 23:15:00 - [14] Edited by: Grash Freedom on 08/02/2007 23:12:53 You are in the wrong game Eve is not all about grinding and botplaying, as in your RL you need to read a book to learn new stuff, that takes time You can't just jump into a 737 and fly it because you have money, hence the skills
Grash Freedom Gallente MAZA Solutions	Posted - 2007.02.08 23:15:00 - [15] Edited by: Grash Freedom on 08/02/2007 23:12:53 You are in the wrong game Eve is not all about grinding and botplaying, as in your RL you need to read a book to learn new stuff, that takes time You can't just jump into a 737 and fly it because you have money, hence the skills
Clementina Eye of God X-PACT	Posted - 2007.02.08 23:22:00 - [16] Sell the Mammoth, Get a Wreath. You can haul with minmatar hauler two, and you won't have to wait. when you get minmater hauler 4, then get a Mammoth.
Clementina Eye of God X-PACT	Posted - 2007.02.08 23:22:00 - [17] Sell the Mammoth, Get a Wreath. You can haul with minmatar hauler two, and you won't have to wait. when you get minmater hauler 4, then get a Mammoth.
Daddy's Belt Minmatar	Posted - 2007.02.08 23:24:00 - [18] Edited by: Daddy''s Belt on 08/02/2007 23:23:10 Originally by: Blue Pixie Nintendo? "Whhhaaaaahhhh whhhhaaaaaahhhh! (Wrings hands.) I want to play level 15 of Diddy Kong Racer! (Tear.) Why do I have to play the first 14 levels? Boohoo! (Soils diaper.)" OP, if this is what it's like for you after two days, you're going to have a very disappointing life in Eve. And now, it's time for your buttwhippin!
Daddy's Belt Minmatar	Posted - 2007.02.08 23:24:00 - [19] Edited by: Daddy''s Belt on 08/02/2007 23:23:10 Originally by: Blue Pixie Nintendo? "Whhhaaaaahhhh whhhhaaaaaahhhh! (Wrings hands.) I want to play level 15 of Diddy Kong Racer! (Tear.) Why do I have to play the first 14 levels? Boohoo! (Soils diaper.)" OP, if this is what it's like for you after two days, you're going to have a very disappointing life in Eve. And now, it's time for your buttwhippin!
Rells Caldari Agony Unleashed	Posted - 2007.02.08 23:28:00 - [20] Originally by: Nyxsion Edited by: Nyxsion on 08/02/2007 23:02:28 I dont want easy street, dont get me wrong. My issue is with you spend time making Isk, yet you can spend it instantly but you cannot use that item you've just brought? Where is the logic in that? Yes you can say well buy a ship at 75mil if you have the Isk but certainly it is my right to buy it and of course loose it just as fast due to inexperience. Maybe all Iam after is yes you can use it straight away, BUT train skills to become more effiecent at it would make more sense. I find it fustrating that I cannot explore other aspects of game example being salvaging without stoping to become effecient at one field of expertise. But atleast I would have option to see if I wanted to be better in a different field. You are new to the game and dont see why it works the way it does. In time you will come to LOVE the skill system. Just think of what would happen if you could fly anything you want out the door. The EBAYers and the rich people would be flying around in faction fitted carriers and PWNing everyone. Eve has a vey rich and deep game play that rewards thinking and tactics and perseverence. If you want it all and you want it tomorrow then this is not the game for you. Isnt it time you learned how to fight back?
Rells Caldari Agony Unleashed	Posted - 2007.02.08 23:28:00 - [21] Originally by: Nyxsion Edited by: Nyxsion on 08/02/2007 23:02:28 I dont want easy street, dont get me wrong. My issue is with you spend time making Isk, yet you can spend it instantly but you cannot use that item you've just brought? Where is the logic in that? Yes you can say well buy a ship at 75mil if you have the Isk but certainly it is my right to buy it and of course loose it just as fast due to inexperience. Maybe all Iam after is yes you can use it straight away, BUT train skills to become more effiecent at it would make more sense. I find it fustrating that I cannot explore other aspects of game example being salvaging without stoping to become effecient at one field of expertise. But atleast I would have option to see if I wanted to be better in a different field. You are new to the game and dont see why it works the way it does. In time you will come to LOVE the skill system. Just think of what would happen if you could fly anything you want out the door. The EBAYers and the rich people would be flying around in faction fitted carriers and PWNing everyone. Eve has a vey rich and deep game play that rewards thinking and tactics and perseverence. If you want it all and you want it tomorrow then this is not the game for you. Isnt it time you learned how to fight back?
Billy Sastard Amarr Zephyr Enterprises Inc. Astral Wolves	Posted - 2007.02.08 23:30:00 - [22] There will come a time when you look forward to the 30 day skill training so that you don't have to worry about logging in and changing skills on time for a while -=^=-
Billy Sastard Amarr Zephyr Enterprises Inc. Astral Wolves	Posted - 2007.02.08 23:30:00 - [23] There will come a time when you look forward to the 30 day skill training so that you don't have to worry about logging in and changing skills on time for a while -=^=-
Strel Samodelkin Caldari Nationalist Party	Posted - 2007.02.08 23:36:00 - [24] Actually this is one of Eve's main selling points.
Nikla Uthaan Caldari	Posted - 2007.02.08 23:40:00 - [25] Indeed to all the above. Though I'll imagine the OP will be eating his words when he has the skill to fly a dreadnaught, but not the ISK. But yeah, ISKBay is a very good reason why skills take time, and I love it. also imagines the op trying to wait out the 14-24 days (attr dependant) for Indy 5 so he can fly freighters,, where 2 days skilltrain is 'too long' As a tangent,,, accruing the cash for an indy and the skillbook in two days? Not such a grand feat,, ----------------- One word,, emo,,, The Mishing is an ethnic group in the districts of North Lakhimpur, Sonitput, Dhemaji, Dibrugarh, Sibsagar, Jorhat, Golaghat, Tinsukia of Assam.
Tabet Saens The Dead Parrot Shoppe Inc. Brutally Clever Empire	Posted - 2007.02.08 23:42:00 - [26] Originally by: Strel Samodelkin Actually this is one of Eve's main selling points. Truth, though I didn't quite appreciate this until I was in my 3rd month or so.
Shevaresh	Posted - 2007.02.08 23:43:00 - [27] Nyxsion, I agree. I have (compared to a new character) tons of ISK; I can afford to buy a battleship for my 2-day-old alt, why couldn't I just have him fly it and just not be as effective? Or maybe an Iteron V - he could carry a lot of stuff in that. /sarcasm off The truth is, that's one of the main reasons. The other reason is that it defines a clear difference between the different levels of equipment; a Iteron V is much more difficult to pilot than a Iteron IV. If it makes you feel better, assume that "Big Brother" (e.g. Concord) requires Aura to check for a valid pilot's license before allowing your ship to undock. Another *****pot theory of mine is that you are learning the skills through direct connection to the brain; in order to keep your brain from getting fried (see the NPC's on pirate ships) they need to use a relatively slow upload speed...
Mona X Caldari C0VEN	Posted - 2007.02.09 00:01:00 - [28] Originally by: Nyxsion Well started playing 2 days ago and so far all good except the following. "Skill at operating Minmatar industrial ships. Can not be trained on Trial Accounts." -- Homo homini YAAAAAARRRRRRRRRR!!
Mona X Caldari C0VEN	Posted - 2007.02.09 00:01:00 - [29] Originally by: Nyxsion Well started playing 2 days ago and so far all good except the following. "Skill at operating Minmatar industrial ships. Can not be trained on Trial Accounts." -- Homo homini YAAAAAARRRRRRRRRR!!
Tellenta White-Noise	Posted - 2007.02.09 00:32:00 - [30] Edited by: Tellenta on 09/02/2007 00:31:00 grinding for skills is the number one reason why i trashed my eq2 character, after 2 years of playing i was grinding from 60 to 70... reached 65 and asked myself why its all the same and promptly unsubsribed. After blindly searching around the internet and being a forum wh... professional I discovered eve. I tried its free trial and discovered that grinding for levels does not exist, its pvp system is functional, and I love it. If you want grinding added to the game please just die. There is a relief in this game to know that you can leave it alone for afew days/months come back and your better skill wise not horribly behind. There are tons of skill grinding games out there, please dont make this one of them
Vekin Lestrak	Posted - 2007.02.09 00:34:00 - [31] If you don't like how the game mechanics work, then why play? Plus, you've only played for two days, you shouldn't be able to fly any ship just because you have the ISK.
Masheine	Posted - 2007.02.09 01:06:00 - [32] I completely agree with the general sentiment in the thread (ie, anything worth doing takes time), but if a player doesn't like it straight off from the get go, I don't think they're going to learn to enjoy it later. Most of the power gamers I know refuse to play Eve because they can't be "uber" by playing more than anyone else, or minmaxing their class grind. No matter how much you try to explain to these people how different roles work (eg, fleets need dps, and ew, and tackling), they're still ****ed because they can't fly a battleship any faster by killing more stuff. Too many other games out there have followed the same levelling pattern for long that a certain type of player refuses to even attempt to enjoy anything different. Meh. Their loss.
Nyxsion	Posted - 2007.02.09 01:55:00 - [33] Well some interesting posts and assumptions, and idiotic stuff about nintendo games which really doesnt focus on my desire to want to play this game and see all that it has to offer. No iam not on a trail account straight paid for I want to see everything it had to offer without limitation but read below. My argument is simple, No-one like grinding any game, there are some Iam not one of them. But Eve gives the wrong impression, you log in you see wow Battleship or Hulk even think amazing Id love one of those then look at price tag, think to yourself how am I going to go about getting that 75mil again is one of the higher figures I can remeber, my grudge... you get the money and cant use damn thing. Only one person managed to inspire hope in me to carry on playing and that was 3rd poster Mech tech with "Once you hit a certain point, you get enough skills that you can play the game without feeling that you have to have to have your training skill finished." I think if it was harder to Aquire Isk to buy those ships there would be more skill and challenge to the game. Day 2 - Problem to much money not enough Skill yet I have the Isk. Think Eve lacks balance in some respects. If in day 2 I only had who knows 250k Isk, Id be more Inclined to join a Corp and think hey if we pool and work together we can get manufacturing going and build **** ships to make/sell whislt learning invention etc so forth to build better ships and progress, may have been different and even sounds like a more exciting experience Id want to enjoy while waiting for skills to train then the time waiting for skills wouldnt bother me so much as Id be busy helping my corp progress, But Day 2 and currently on 1h 50 minutes training rank 1 industrials and ship ready and waiting in hanger (having all other Req's), knowing full well that I probably have estimated 15 days to wait to fly the thing, something in game balance is wrong. I thought this game based around Corp's so forth would be about money and power, sure money buys u stuff but its useless untill X number of days later, again balance issue maybe? I wanted to be lost to a game doing and striving to something but watching a clock just doesnt help.
Nalar Marnith Minmatar Sebiestor tribe	Posted - 2007.02.09 02:03:00 - [34] First off, try re-reading your posts, they're not that easy to get through. All of us had to spend time flying our n00b ships and beginner frigates. I have spent more time in frigs than anything else, they're damn fun, and in a few hours, maybe a coupla days you'll have the skills to fit the standard equipment. I spent a month on learning skills before even starting on the useful stuff. Yeah it sucks at first, but after a while you'll find plenty to do while your next skill is training. Also, your OP is basically a whine, if you'd asked in a more constructive manner you'd have got more constructive replies. For someone like me that has maybe 2 nights free a week to play, eve is perfect. I don't have to play all the time to get my skills up. I'm still annoyed every now and then when a skill won't be ready for one of the nights I have free, but that's how things work.
Azerrad InExile	Posted - 2007.02.09 02:07:00 - [35] Originally by: Nyxsion Well some interesting posts and assumptions, and idiotic stuff about nintendo games which really doesnt focus on my desire to want to play this game and see all that it has to offer. No iam not on a trail account straight paid for I want to see everything it had to offer without limitation but read below. My argument is simple, No-one like grinding any game, there are some Iam not one of them. But Eve gives the wrong impression, you log in you see wow Battleship or Hulk even think amazing Id love one of those then look at price tag, think to yourself how am I going to go about getting that 75mil again is one of the higher figures I can remeber, my grudge... you get the money and cant use damn thing. Only one person managed to inspire hope in me to carry on playing and that was 3rd poster Mech tech with "Once you hit a certain point, you get enough skills that you can play the game without feeling that you have to have to have your training skill finished." I think if it was harder to Aquire Isk to buy those ships there would be more skill and challenge to the game. Day 2 - Problem to much money not enough Skill yet I have the Isk. Think Eve lacks balance in some respects. If in day 2 I only had who knows 250k Isk, Id be more Inclined to join a Corp and think hey if we pool and work together we can get manufacturing going and build **** ships to make/sell whislt learning invention etc so forth to build better ships and progress, may have been different and even sounds like a more exciting experience Id want to enjoy while waiting for skills to train then the time waiting for skills wouldnt bother me so much as Id be busy helping my corp progress, But Day 2 and currently on 1h 50 minutes training rank 1 industrials and ship ready and waiting in hanger (having all other Req's), knowing full well that I probably have estimated 15 days to wait to fly the thing, something in game balance is wrong. I thought this game based around Corp's so forth would be about money and power, sure money buys u stuff but its useless untill X number of days later, again balance issue maybe? I wanted to be lost to a game doing and striving to something but watching a clock just doesnt help. Maybe try working for your isk instead of buying it?
Wendat Huron Lupus Industries	Posted - 2007.02.09 02:07:00 - [36] So fly the less demanding industrial and stop whining, it takes time to learn to fly the better ships...
Nyxsion	Posted - 2007.02.09 02:20:00 - [37] Edited by: Nyxsion on 09/02/2007 02:17:27 Originally by: Azerrad InExile Maybe try working for your isk instead of buying it? Wouldnt dream of it no sense of self accomplishment, besides rotating roid fields in Uplinger avoiding the pirates on pure jaspet and selling refined minerals in a different part of town does help but not giving you all my secrets :P besides avoiding nasty lasers adds to excitement, you should try it.
shivan Rampage Eternal Ka-Tet	Posted - 2007.02.09 02:21:00 - [38] Well back in 'Narm, or mid to late 2003 this was the case. Modules or ships you used would directly increase the number of SP in that given area. However, it was removed as it was seen, afaik, that you could grind your skill faster simple by say, going afk and sitting idle in your ship in space. Or shooting an astroid for 12 hours while at work with a small laser. It does make sense, to have your sp go up while you are using a module or ship. Experence I think is the word you are looking for, but in doing so you would be making EvE more like WoW type games where you can grind your skill and one of the biggist things with the uniqueness of EvE's skill system would be diluted and lost. So yes, it makes sense, but obviosuly CCP thought that the current system is better, and tbh, having experence both systems myself I prefere the latter as it means everyone is on an even footing with how fast they can possible train skills. ------------------ Ka-Tet alliance Diplo RAM KB
ScreamingLord Sutch Hand in Mouth	Posted - 2007.02.09 02:23:00 - [39] If you dont like it then please leave. If you don't "get it" then plase ask. Diving in and saying its not balanced / sucks after two days shows you lack the knowledge to judge and the patience to think about it. Just 2 or 3 months ago your character would have started with 60k-150k skillpoints. It would have been even worse for you then
Nikla Uthaan Caldari	Posted - 2007.02.09 02:30:00 - [40] Originally by: Nyxsion My argument is simple, And your solution is non-existant. Besides scrapping skills, which would turn the game into Freelancer a-la sucky Quote: ...But Eve gives the wrong impression, you log in you see wow Battleship or Hulk even think amazing Id love one of those then look at price tag, think to yourself how am I going to go about getting that 75mil again is one of the higher figures I can remeber, my grudge... you get the money and cant use damn thing. I love how you just suddenly have the money, and would be incredibly intrigued to find out how. You either A) Bought it off ebay B) Have an incredibly generous corp who need to rethink how much they give a two day old character C) Spend a majority of your day in front of the computer playing EVE and doing, well, not much else. D) Got lucky, not through any real skill as you've claimed and got a faction spawn, zyd hauler drop Regardless, this is the good thing about eve which means people who physically can't do C) can still participate in the game. The biggest difference being those people cant afford to lose stuff as much as someone who frequently plays does, as they have more ISK to burn from their activities. No doubt you'll respond with 'I dont want to give away my skilled winning isk machine strategy', but if you are just two days old I'll introduce you to a little fact that everyone important probably already knows your tactic, or just couldnt care about it. I think if it was harder to Aquire Isk to buy those ships there would be more skill and challenge to the game. Quote: But Day 2 and currently on 1h 50 minutes training rank 1 industrials and ship ready and waiting in hanger (having all other Req's), knowing full well that I probably have estimated 15 days to wait to fly the thing, something in game balance is wrong. Welcome to EVE, hope you never want to fly a capital ship. Quote: I thought this game based around Corp's so forth would be about money and power, sure money buys u stuff but its useless untill X number of days later, again balance issue maybe? It's not balance, it's because you're new. As it stands, you're actually starting with 10 times the skillpoints my character started with thanks to Kali. I was capable of doing Quote: I wanted to be lost to a game doing and striving to something but watching a clock just doesnt help. Then dont sit there watching the clock. Undock, do stuff, explore, mine, rat, mish, pvp, whatever. If you've got the isk to burn go for it. Make your fun. If you've got the non-game skills to make cash, than I'd hope you'd have the skills to give a 2/10 plex a shot in just a frigate, heck try a 3/10 if they're too easy. ----------------- One word,, emo,,, The Mishing is an ethnic group in the districts of North Lakhimpur, Sonitput, Dhemaji, Dibrugarh, Sibsagar, Jorhat, Golaghat, Tinsukia of Assam.
Surfin's PlunderBunny Minmatar	Posted - 2007.02.09 02:31:00 - [41] I started at 38k sp And you didn't even use the 2 week free trial? ponders what you were thinking, thinking you need to ask more about the mechanics of the game, even though when given them you still feel the whole game needs to change just for you Started as an alt... became the main! Someone was drunk, a carrier was involved... old main stuck 30 jumps into 0.0 in a pod with no ship and no cash. That's about all I know
Kesrina	Posted - 2007.02.09 02:32:00 - [42] TBH and not a flame. This is probably the wrong game for the OP
Nyxsion	Posted - 2007.02.09 03:13:00 - [43] Edited by: Nyxsion on 09/02/2007 03:11:46 Originally by: Nikla Uthaan Originally by: Nyxsion My argument is simple, And your solution is non-existant. Besides scrapping skills, which would turn the game into Freelancer a-la sucky Make skills at level 1 so that if you do play and continue the ones you focus on improve your character and role the most and aid you on your journey, but dont deny freedom to explore all aspects of the game.(Mine in particular is wont care less if I could fly mammoth with only 3% agility/speed - whatever it was instead of upping this to a higher level to improve it over all - I just wanted a ship that fit my expectation for isk i worked for to but it). Apologies if I sounded like I dived in to bash your game not my intent just to gain insight into skills, I only raise this because sometimes change is good, dont expect it to, but sometimes debates are a good thing and inspire and educate etc. Some of these post show that alot of you defend and love Eve immensly no fault there(why I havnt disappeared because you must love it for a reason), but it's a pity to think you push people away instead of helping them understand - I can only assume probably because there's alot of whine posts and isk selling aswell. Iam glad I posted and got some insight into way things are, atleast you have raised issue like started skill points was 38 sp and that dev's did try other alternatives. Apologies to those offended, of course Iam new and dont know everything about Eve, but how is one to understand if they dont ask questions. Ive probably learned a great deal more about Skills and its history than any other noobie that has asked about it from this thread.
Blue Pixie	Posted - 2007.02.09 03:14:00 - [44] Originally by: Nyxsion Edited by: Nyxsion on 09/02/2007 02:17:27 Originally by: Azerrad InExile Maybe try working for your isk instead of buying it? Wouldnt dream of it no sense of self accomplishment, besides rotating roid fields in Uplinger avoiding the pirates on pure jaspet and selling refined minerals in a different part of town does help but not giving you all my secrets :P besides avoiding nasty lasers adds to excitement, you should try it. No offense, bro, but your story gets a little fishier with each post. You don't like grinding, you didn't buy ISK off eBay, but in 48 hours û as a total novice to the game û you've managed to squirrel away enough to get a Mammoth? And you're complaining it's too easy to acquire ISK? Something just isn't adding up here. Assuming that ISK wasn't just handed over to you (or the Mammoth for that matter), I think it's fairly safe to say your experience is NOT typical of the average newcomer. Best case scenario is you engaged in some fairly high-risk behavior that could have just as likely left you bankrupt.
Nyxsion	Posted - 2007.02.09 03:28:00 - [45] Originally by: Blue Pixie Originally by: Nyxsion Edited by: Nyxsion on 09/02/2007 02:17:27 Originally by: Azerrad InExile Maybe try working for your isk instead of buying it? Wouldnt dream of it no sense of self accomplishment, besides rotating roid fields in Uplinger avoiding the pirates on pure jaspet and selling refined minerals in a different part of town does help but not giving you all my secrets :P besides avoiding nasty lasers adds to excitement, you should try it. No offense, bro, but your story gets a little fishier with each post. You don't like grinding, you didn't buy ISK off eBay, but in 48 hours û as a total novice to the game û you've managed to squirrel away enough to get a Mammoth? And you're complaining it's too easy to acquire ISK? Something just isn't adding up here. Assuming that ISK wasn't just handed over to you (or the Mammoth for that matter), I think it's fairly safe to say your experience is NOT typical of the average newcomer. Best case scenario is you engaged in some fairly high-risk behavior that could have just as likely left you bankrupt. Would you like screenshots of all my transactions?
moxica	Posted - 2007.02.09 03:28:00 - [46] A WOW Troll drenched in petrol playing with matches.
Asinia Au Amarr Order of the Blessed Sisters of Amarr	Posted - 2007.02.09 03:29:00 - [47] It strikes me as funny that the OP feels hat ISK comes too easily considering the relative "difficulty" of training. I suppose, given the one possible course through the early days of EVe one could make that argument. After all, most of his time was spent acquiring ISK, and little to none in "spending" it. What if, on the other hand same OP had decided with a couple of friends on day 2 to go to low sec and see what they could blow up? Likely they would find a target or three, and have a blast doing it, with only one thing impeding their fun. The fact that they also got blown up a few times and now they are completely ISKless due to the need to replace their ships. One must wonder if the same OP would then be on these forums complaining about balance, it's so easy to go through ISK, but so hard to make it, the game must be unbalanced. Funny how one perspective can differ so completely from another, isn't it?
Asinia Au Amarr Order of the Blessed Sisters of Amarr	Posted - 2007.02.09 03:30:00 - [48] Originally by: moxica A WOW Troll drenched in petrol playing with matches. ROFL!!!
sesanti Minmatar Universal Exports Namtz'aar k'in	Posted - 2007.02.09 03:37:00 - [49] Originally by: Blue Pixie Originally by: Nyxsion Edited by: Nyxsion on 09/02/2007 02:17:27 Originally by: Azerrad InExile Maybe try working for your isk instead of buying it? Wouldnt dream of it no sense of self accomplishment, besides rotating roid fields in Uplinger avoiding the pirates on pure jaspet and selling refined minerals in a different part of town does help but not giving you all my secrets :P besides avoiding nasty lasers adds to excitement, you should try it. No offense, bro, but your story gets a little fishier with each post. You don't like grinding, you didn't buy ISK off eBay, but in 48 hours – as a total novice to the game – you've managed to squirrel away enough to get a Mammoth? And you're complaining it's too easy to acquire ISK? Something just isn't adding up here. Assuming that ISK wasn't just handed over to you (or the Mammoth for that matter), I think it's fairly safe to say your experience is NOT typical of the average newcomer. Best case scenario is you engaged in some fairly high-risk behavior that could have just as likely left you bankrupt. You're so right... a complete noob on day 2 mentioning mammoths, industrials knowledge, isk buying on ebay, and having that qty of money... Hmm... it's more than fishy. I wouldn't be suprised if this is an alt of someone who is just laughing at us. On day 2 I had no idea what an afterburner was, let alone about industrials haulers, isk buying, etc. etc. _______________________________________________ The ShadowMaster - <I am a guy... don't mind the portrait>
Nicoli Voldkif Warped Mining Gunboat Diplomacy	Posted - 2007.02.09 03:43:00 - [50] in Defense of the OP its a MAMMOTH not a BS or titan. Getting the money to buy one of those in 2 days is not that hard. even for somebody new to the game. I assume he does not have the money to go running around with it fitted with T2 cargo expanders. but buying the skill and ship is not that hard. As for the issue with skill training it is a new player issue. It will take less time for you to get into most things as you progress since you will already have some prerequisites trained, implants and learning skills, and you'll be able to do more stuff overall. Just realize that later on having cash to purchase things will be alot more of a pain to get as costs do get a little more expensive at later levels to the point of near exponetial increase. ------------------------------------------------- Originally by: Seroquel it takes a while to get use to the people in eve. they are a little too... friendly. sorta like the texas chainsaw massacre country
Chronojam	Posted - 2007.02.09 03:43:00 - [51] I got my first Battlecruiser on day 290 or so. I did not ***** that my friends all had Battleships long before me. Why is that, you ask? Because I was busy having fun playing the game, exploring, trying out new things, being amazed by the local and regional markets, looking over the maps and familiarizing myself with the different alliances there were, what wars were going on, and deciding what role I wanted for myself during that time. I took a little Imicus into .4 and .3 space several times, fought against NPCs, got exploded by ruthless pirates, chatted it up with ruthful pirates, checked out deadspaces and missions and all that good stuff. I developed skills that were generic to every ship type and player role more or less, before even standing up and screaming BY THE BLOOD IN MY VEINS I WILL FLY AN ITERON 5 BY THE END OF THE WEEK. And then I maxed out my drone skills
Nicoli Voldkif Warped Mining Gunboat Diplomacy	Posted - 2007.02.09 03:48:00 - [52] Edited by: Nicoli Voldkif on 09/02/2007 03:48:55 Originally by: sesanti You're so right... a complete noob on day 2 mentioning mammoths, industrials knowledge, isk buying on ebay, and having that qty of money... Hmm... it's more than fishy. I wouldn't be suprised if this is an alt of someone who is just laughing at us. On day 2 I had no idea what an afterburner was, let alone about industrials haulers, isk buying, etc. etc. Well since I managed to ask the right questions so that I knew what a industrial was, How to travel faster(yes including how to setup insta BMs), and numerous other things by day 2 does that mean I'm lying or just that I spent time to ask serious question in chat. Realize that just because you didn't know something does not mean that nobody else knew it at the same time period. ------------------------------------------------- Originally by: Seroquel it takes a while to get use to the people in eve. they are a little too... friendly. sorta like the texas chainsaw massacre country
Ash Vincetti Agony Unleashed	Posted - 2007.02.09 07:26:00 - [53] Getting the isk for a mammoth and the Industrial skill, even for a 2-day player is trivial. You are talking about 1.3M isk tops. I had near that after I finished the tutorial missions back when I first started (after selling that tasty implant). A bit of market fudging, some minor mining in lowsec, etc and you can have that isk almost effortlessly. No, the problem with the Op, is that he is used to other games where buying that full plate +7 lets him be able to equip it. Again, it's the powergamer mentality of "If I grinded the money, i should damn be able to use it". Op, i know you are trying to understand Eve, as such, please also understand the skill system. A mammoth is a more advanced industrial than say, a wreathe, which you can use with minimal skill. Be glad that what you bought wasn't an iteron V - that would have been an additional 20+ days to train Gallente Industrial V The prerequisite to a mammoth is I think minmatar frigate III and industry I isn't it? you should have started with those skills just about, depending on your starting character path. Eve is all about planning, patience, and foresight. There are things you can do other than just sitting there wating for a skill to finish - for example - you could check out what t2 components sell for in your region, and how much they sell for in other regions, and if you see an item that has a disparity, you can buy it in one region and sell it in the other for a profit - that doesn't require a mammoth - in fact, you can do that in just about any small (150m3 cargo or so) ship, for a decent profit to boot. You also asked why you couldn't just use something at "no benefit until i trained the prerequisites" - I actually wish you could. I'd like to see the whining in the forums when someone looses a Battleship because it only goes 30m/s, can't track with the large guns they can't use properly yet, can't tank because the large repper repairs as much as a small repper, can't shoot because the lasers do as much damage as a small laser due to not having the skills up, etc. Anyway, i'm rambling now. Good luck in your skill training, and hopefully you learn to se eve for what it is, and that is something completely different to other MMO's. ----- /ash
Venkul Mul Gallente	Posted - 2007.02.09 07:40:00 - [54] Originally by: Mona X Originally by: Nyxsion Well started playing 2 days ago and so far all good except the following. "Skill at operating Minmatar industrial ships. Can not be trained on Trial Accounts." And so? I have multiple account, never used trial.
Venkul Mul Gallente	Posted - 2007.02.09 07:58:00 - [55] Originally by: Nyxsion (slow progression high isk) I think you are going the wrong way. You aren't increasing your skill learning skills and not buying the implants to learn faster. For more explanations look the part of the forum dedicated to the skills, but: your characteristic modifi the speed at wich you learn skills the characteristics are modified by the skills under learning and by the characteristics enanching cyberimplants. As your current stats are low (at most 15 for your highest, more probable 13 or so), even a +1 implant (price about 800-900.000 isk) will speed up your trainign time by 6-7%, adding another +1 in the secondary characteristic give another 3%, so with 2 millions at most you get an increas in 10% training time for a series of skills. Do the same for all characteristics and: you have spent 3,5-4,5 millions (no more too much isk problem) you get a 10% bonus in training time buy all the basic learning skills and learn the skills at least to 2, another 20% faster training (you will use 1 day at most). At this point you should divide your training time: some you should use to train the skills you need to be effective at what you dant to do, som eyou should use to increase further the learning skills. your goal should be to train the basic skills to 4, buy the advanced (4,5 millions each one) and then train them to at least 3. At that point you have almost dubled all your starting characteristics and halved your training time.
Dr Aryandi	Posted - 2007.02.09 08:34:00 - [56] Well I think some of the replies have been overly negative, but as you can see people feel very strongly about the eve skill system - and in many ways its one of the attractions to the game for me too :) (Although sometimes waiting 20 days for a skill to finish with no way to speed it up gets frustrating for me too). Its nice going away for the weekend and knowing that you are still advancing. Its good that if you cant play eve for a few days you are not 'falling behind'. If you look around you will find plenty of things to spend the isk on. Get better equipment on your frigates, get implants to speed up learning, etc. Try looking into faction frigates if you are feeling really wealthy. Blueprint Research Service Available See thread for details.
Nicholai Pestot Gallente Havoc Inc	Posted - 2007.02.09 08:37:00 - [57] Hi, I'm 2 days old. I want to fly a titan. Now! The training time system and learning skill system are good. They blur the line between powerplayer and recreational player by removing the SP grind. The down side of this is that there is no skill-point fast track. Now come back to me when you are training skills that take 2 months or more. Then we will talk and compare notes about frustration
Sadao Minmatar Delictum 23216	Posted - 2007.02.09 08:46:00 - [58] Some of you guys make me sick! The way you troll and a big and tough behind your PC monitor. If you were standing in the bus queue and he asked you the same questions as in the OP would you smack so hard? No I didn't think so. FFS grow up. Eve has a rep as being a great community but some of the tards in here seem to refute that. To the OP. You will find as time progresses that the training in eve works very well. But at times you will get frustrated. when you do best advice is find something else to do in game till you can do what you wanted to do. Its just atm your very new and theres alot to learn but stay the course and get the rewards
Kao Lei	Posted - 2007.02.09 12:28:00 - [59] Edited by: Kao Lei on 09/02/2007 12:34:50 Edited by: Kao Lei on 09/02/2007 12:30:18 Well, look at it from this point of view. yes, it sucks to wait 15 days or more (100 days till Command Ships for me... getting closer every day now... ) but the moment you hear the message for that last skill you needed 'Skill training completed' gives you a real rush.... But for the love of god, don't just sit in the station till the training is finished. Do the stuff you were doing before you decided going for that skill. Fly the lesser versions which you can fly already while progressing to higher levels. Plus, there's another aspect regarding skill training in EVE and why it takes so long. It's all about making choices.... What do you prefer the most... going for the industrial? Getting better mining skills? Have to make a choice, can't do it at all once.... So you'll train industrial first and decide to go for better mining skills immediatly after that but when you get your industrial,... you've discovered production and need to make again a choice: production skills or mining skills? Ahh... and so on This is one of the nice things in Eve... everyone can choose his own path. It's near impossible to do ALL things equally well in Eve.... Does this mean you're screwed once you've chosen a path and you don't like it? Not at all but you've lost some time yes. And once you've learned to fly a certain ship, you get an edge towards others that haven't decide to focus on those skills.... and then it's in your advantage that learning skills takes time. Right now you're at a disadvantage and you don't like that. I think we all can understand that as we've been there (and much worse as you can start with 800k+ skill points which took us quite a long time to acquire back then! Huge advantage for new starting players). BTW, you might want to do a search for 'EVEmon' (think it's stickied in the Skills section of the forum). It's a tool that let's you plan your progress towards a specific ship or module. It also tells you how you can speed this up as much as possible by training certain learning skills.
Jenson Cole Red Dagger Fleet	Posted - 2007.02.09 12:38:00 - [60] Nyxsion, there is a difference from being able to fly a ship and properly be able to use it in EVE. I could train from Character Creation and be in a Tempest within 1-2 months but then again the ship would be using small artillery cannons and standard missiles at best and would be using civillian or small shield boosters and moving like a slug through space. EVE is unlike any other MMO that you play where in WOW, SWG or any other grind based game you can grind a decently powerful character within a month here in EVE you can't plain and simple. You won't be able to run out to 0.0 instantly and hold your own vs battle hardened players nor will you become the richest person in game within a week or two. In two days plus of playing EVE you've barely scratched the surface. If you want to really know how to play the game and survive you MUST work on more than just the skills to fly a ship. If you go into Low Sec do you have the skills to properly kit out your ship to tank rats or potential pirates and get away alive? What about your offensive capabilities? Can you do anything besides shoot pellets using the civillian guns and miner that you get with the starter ship and be accurate at it? Can you properly install Cargo Expanders on your Mammoth? If you're planning on using just basic equipment on your Mammoth I'll tell you right now that you're wasteing slot space. Can you use 10 or 100mm Afterburners and have them last more than 5-10 seconds without drainning your cap? Do you have the CPU and Powergrid space for your planned setup? And if not do you have the skills to use the equipment that can help lower the CPU or Increase Powergrid Space? Are you maximizeing your total Hull, Structure and Shield Points? There are skills that will increase all these attributes. Are you trainning your skills at the best possible speed capable of your character? In less than a week of playing EVE I know you're answering no to many of these questions especially the last two. 1. You've stated that trainning is to slow because you have little or no learning skills. 2. In order to maximize Hull Structure and Shield Points you need 3 seperate skills and take on average 1-2 weeks EACH to get to level 5 if you focused on it with maximum trainning efficiency. (Learning Skills trainned up rater high) And this isn't even includeing the sub skills to boost the recharge rates of your cap and shield. I suggest you sit down and download a program such as EVEMon or Quickfit and put together a trainning Regiment and you'll quickly find that you're months or even years from where you want to be. Hell I've been in game since December 04 and I have a basic regiment that's going to take me a year to learn and that's not even touching capital ships or T2 Ships. That's just to get me effective in my current T1 Ships.(And BTW I do have Learning maxed across the board at 5 and have a set of +4's in my head). Give yourself some time and listen to just the basic suggestions. Set a goal and plot it out via a Trainning Regiment using 1, 3, 6 months and 1 year goals. You will get there eventually but first you need to learn paitiance otherwise you will find yourself in a very difficult situation of being broke after taking to many risks and finally getting caught due to your impaitiance.
Chewan Mesa Beagle Corp	Posted - 2007.02.09 12:41:00 - [61] Originally by: Nyxsion knowing full well that I probably have estimated 15 days to wait to fly the thing, something in game balance is wrong. A) Do something fun while waiting for a skill to finish. B) 15 days for a mammoth? o.0
Tareen Kashaar Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.09 12:46:00 - [62] Originally by: Shevaresh Another *****pot theory of mine is that you are learning the skills through direct connection to the brain; in order to keep your brain from getting fried (see the NPC's on pirate ships) they need to use a relatively slow upload speed... Actually, that's what the tutorial says. Skills are directly uploaded to your brain, and the speed with which this process can happen is directly dependant on your attributes (i.e. how easy you adapt to new knowledge in certain areas). That said, I think EVE's skill system is just brilliant! No powergaming, and the best ever long term motivation! --- WTS: Forum Signatures, 30mil a piece. Evemail me!
Natalia Fachiri	Posted - 2007.02.09 14:02:00 - [63] Get a hoarder and not a mammoth. Its minmatar industrial 2 instead of 4 and you should have been able to train this skill in a matter of hours. Yes you will haul a little less, but its still much much much more then a frigate could. There are 3 industrial ships and you shot for the 3rd, hardest to get, one. Go for the middle one instead and buy it (you seem to have the money) and use it while your industrial skill trains higher.
Rhaegar Targarin Minmatar	Posted - 2007.02.09 14:08:00 - [64] I understand where the OP is coming from, but it is just how this game is designed. I restarted this character about 3 weeks ago after about five weeks of playing on my first character. I have yet to actually play this character and probably won't for another month or so until I can fly a Hurricane again with a decent tank and decent gun skills. I guess I rather be actually playing the game, but really absolutely no reason to as I transferred 500 million to my new guy when I made him and I have no need for reptutation or standing as I will be heading straight out to 0.0 once I am a somewhat capable Hurricane pilot again. Rhaegar Targarin - Minmatar Combat Pilot
Valan	Posted - 2007.02.09 14:19:00 - [65] Dude doesn't get any easier, further on. I've just put my training list together for a Carrier. I have to train a rank 5 skill to level 5 just to train another skill. The skill doesn't even do anything. It's the way EVE is, think ahead and plan your skills and things will get better down the road. /start sig I love old characters that post 'I've beeen playing the game three years' when I know their account has been sold on. /end sig
Auren I'del Minmatar Freelancer Alliance	Posted - 2007.02.09 15:34:00 - [66] If the skill system is changed I would cancelling my account as fast as I could press the buttons. As said earlier this is the game where you dont fall behind in SP if you dont have time to play as much as the hardcore players. I dont have time to play every day. work, family and other comittments takes a lot of time, and because of that it is good to sit down a few times during a week and play with the other guys....without loosing a single SP! This is one of the main reason many adult people play this game. If the skillsystem is changed we would have fallen behind bigtime! Although your questions are reasonable and honest they have been answered. CCP has changed pretty much everything in this game the last two years, but I doubt they ever gonna mess with the skilltraining system. They would loose a lot more players then they would get.
Tabet Saens The Dead Parrot Shoppe Inc. Brutally Clever Empire	Posted - 2007.02.09 15:40:00 - [67] Originally by: Nyxsion But Day 2 and currently on 1h 50 minutes training rank 1 industrials and ship ready and waiting in hanger (having all other Req's), knowing full well that I probably have estimated 15 days to wait to fly the thing, something in game balance is wrong. There's nothing wrong with the balance. You bought a ship that took a longer time to train for. You should have just bought a Wreathe and voila, you'd probably be in it after 30minutes or so worth of training. The Mammoth is the best Minmatar T1 industrial. Why should you be able to climb into that immediately? Secondly, the other aspect is having the money, but not the skill. So are you complaining that ships are TOO cheap? Ships are relatively cheap for a reason. Anytime you're in space, which happens to be the ONLY time ships are actually useful, you can be attacked. Being attacked means you either fight back, run, or get destroyed. Newsflash: Ships get destroyed in this game! I just had my T1 indy blown up last night trying to run thru a gate. It was worth roughly 2 million ISK (very cheap actually, which was why I took the risk). If T1 ships were hard to obtain, this game would become a ridiculously hard ISK grind. It's not right now, for those of us satisfied with flying T1 ships. Let's leave T1 ships that way, mkay? If you want "hard to obtain" ships, try shopping for T2 ships. Have fun with that. Those ships are for the folks who have the time to grind ISK. Prediction: If you manage to stay in this game for 8 months, you will end up complaining about the outrageous price of T2 ships/mods, and how you have the skill but not the ISK to fly them. Whiners never stop whining, they just find different things to whine about.
Cipher7 Acme Technologies Incorporated Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2007.02.09 15:42:00 - [68] People use this excuse all the time and it's baloney. Use a hoarder till you can fly the mammoth.
Isyel Minmatar Masuat'aa Matari Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2007.02.09 15:52:00 - [69] The EvE skill system is pure and simple genius. It will take a while for you (or a lot of other people) to figure it out but it is. It dawned on me when i trained up Minmatar Cruiser 5 for HACs. I checked other T2 ships of similiar and nearby categories and what i saw was awesome. You start training for T2 cruisers and suddenly they're all so close! It sucks you in, you want to train for everything! And then if you're bored of that race you just train, for example, Amarr frigate or cruiser 5 and you can fly all of THEIR T2 cruisers and frigs. It's sheer brilliance! Even the Sleipnir doesn't seem so far once you train for HACs. Of course it all takes time, and lots of it, but eventually you grow to love it and see how perfect it is. I tried to play a MMO with levelling after eve and i just can't do it. P.S. Perhaps the genius of the skill tree of eve is due to careful planning. Or pure luck drunk people are so known for. Decide yourselves. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Originally by: Wrangler We don't want to discriminate anyone! We want both anti-social and social players to grief each other!
Asinia Au Amarr Order of the Blessed Sisters of Amarr	Posted - 2007.02.09 16:10:00 - [70] Originally by: Isyel ... Of course it all takes time, and lots of it, but eventually you grow to love it and see how perfect it is. I tried to play a MMO with levelling after eve and i just can't do it. ... QFE! I agree, EVE has spolied me too. I just can't play a grind game anymore!
Billy Sastard Amarr Zephyr Enterprises Inc. Astral Wolves	Posted - 2007.02.09 16:10:00 - [71] I have read all the OP's posts, and to be honest, all I see his argument boiling down to is 'I have the ISK to do such and such, why cant I do it without having to train the skills?' That argument is bull. The items in this game are not the same as in other games. In other mmo's your characters ability to act on his environment is greatly determined by the trained skills that the player has learned by 'leveling up'. In EVE, you are a clone in a pod, the 'gear' you buy determines what means you have to act on your environment. You know, after a little bit of reflection, it is almost as if the OP is mad because he cant twink out his character. There is no twinking in EVE, this is a good thing. Amassing ISK just means you have the capital to keep yourself supplied in ships and modules. Another note here, somewhere in one of the posts, he says somethign about 75m and a hulk. a hulk at a bargain price would be around 450m, that is no small amount for the vast majority of the player base. A basic PvP BS is going to run 200-400m after ship cost and fittings. Again no small amount to the majority of players. One cannot comment on the balance of a game based on ones experience during the earliest moments of the game. -=^=-
Asinia Au Amarr Order of the Blessed Sisters of Amarr	Posted - 2007.02.09 16:15:00 - [72] Originally by: Nyxsion ... But Day 2 and currently on 1h 50 minutes training rank 1 industrials and ship ready and waiting in hanger ... Wait a minute! Nearly 2 hours to train rank 1 industrial? It just occurred to me, part of your problem is lack of learning skills. Learning rank 1 industrial should take more like 40 minutes if I remember correctly, now close to 2 hours. Train your learning skills, everything else will go much faster after that!
Neon Genesis Gallente Developmental Neogenics Amalgamated	Posted - 2007.02.09 16:20:00 - [73] Breaking news, 2 day old player doesn't like game, posts thread.
Neon Genesis Gallente Developmental Neogenics Amalgamated	Posted - 2007.02.09 16:20:00 - [74] Breaking news, 2 day old player doesn't like game, posts thread.
Tabet Saens The Dead Parrot Shoppe Inc. Brutally Clever Empire	Posted - 2007.02.09 16:23:00 - [75] Originally by: Isyel The EvE skill system is pure and simple genius. It will take a while for you (or a lot of other people) to figure it out but it is. It dawned on me when i trained up Minmatar Cruiser 5 for HACs. I checked other T2 ships of similiar and nearby categories and what i saw was awesome. You start training for T2 cruisers and suddenly they're all so close! It sucks you in, you want to train for everything! And then if you're bored of that race you just train, for example, Amarr frigate or cruiser 5 and you can fly all of THEIR T2 cruisers and frigs. It's sheer brilliance! Even the Sleipnir doesn't seem so far once you train for HACs. Agree. Most of the skills you need to train to get to T2 ships, you WANT to train-- like Engineering, Mechanics, etc. The same thing also occurs with some ships in the T1 line as well. When the myrmidon came out, I wanted to climb into that sucker so bad. But I wasn't trained in Gallente ships at all. Roughly 4 days of training Gallente frig 4, and Gallente cruiser 3, and now I can climb into one. I already have BC4, so voila! Of course being Minmatar meant I already trained decent drone skills and armor tanking skills, and the myrmidon doesn't have hybrid bonuses, so I can fly that sucker with projectiles almost as well as a gallente pilot.
Tabet Saens The Dead Parrot Shoppe Inc. Brutally Clever Empire	Posted - 2007.02.09 16:23:00 - [76] Originally by: Isyel The EvE skill system is pure and simple genius. It will take a while for you (or a lot of other people) to figure it out but it is. It dawned on me when i trained up Minmatar Cruiser 5 for HACs. I checked other T2 ships of similiar and nearby categories and what i saw was awesome. You start training for T2 cruisers and suddenly they're all so close! It sucks you in, you want to train for everything! And then if you're bored of that race you just train, for example, Amarr frigate or cruiser 5 and you can fly all of THEIR T2 cruisers and frigs. It's sheer brilliance! Even the Sleipnir doesn't seem so far once you train for HACs. Agree. Most of the skills you need to train to get to T2 ships, you WANT to train-- like Engineering, Mechanics, etc. The same thing also occurs with some ships in the T1 line as well. When the myrmidon came out, I wanted to climb into that sucker so bad. But I wasn't trained in Gallente ships at all. Roughly 4 days of training Gallente frig 4, and Gallente cruiser 3, and now I can climb into one. I already have BC4, so voila! Of course being Minmatar meant I already trained decent drone skills and armor tanking skills, and the myrmidon doesn't have hybrid bonuses, so I can fly that sucker with projectiles almost as well as a gallente pilot.
Valan	Posted - 2007.02.09 17:35:00 - [77] Originally by: Cipher7 People use this excuse all the time and it's baloney. Use a hoarder till you can fly the mammoth. On that basis the following is also baloney. Fly a frigate before a battleship. Fly a battleship before a Titan. Give up now it isn't going to change and you'll save yourself time you can spend playing an MMORPG you like. If at this low level you're frustrated it'll get much worse and it'll you even more unhappy. Play games for fun not frustration and unhappiness. /start sig I love old characters that post 'I've beeen playing the game three years' when I know their account has been sold on. /end sig
BobFromMarketing Amarr The Syndicate Inc INVICTUS.	Posted - 2007.02.09 18:49:00 - [78] (I think I may be the first to get this one in !) Can I have your stuff?
Nachshon Caldari Gradient Namtz'aar k'in	Posted - 2007.02.09 19:18:00 - [79] While your skill is training, buy a lesser ship and earn money that way! __________________________________________ What I say should not be taken as the position of Gradient or NMTZ.
Hilabana Minmatar Sebiestor tribe	Posted - 2007.02.09 20:20:00 - [80] hey i hear if you fly out in to 0.0 space there is a secret skill book that will speed up your training time. So get a cheap ship and fly all the way out to 0.0 and look at the market. oh yes and please have a good day .
Brutor Shaun Minmatar Freelancers UK Alliance	Posted - 2007.02.09 20:37:00 - [81] Don't know if anyone else has asked this, but why did you spend the best part of 1.5 mill isk on something you can't use? And how did you earn that much in 2 days????
Shamis Orzoz Sniggerdly	Posted - 2007.02.09 20:42:00 - [82] In eve you grind for isk, not for skills.
Reiisha Black Eclipse Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.02.09 20:43:00 - [83] Originally by: Nyxsion Edited by: Nyxsion on 08/02/2007 23:02:28 I dont want easy street, dont get me wrong. My issue is with you spend time making Isk, yet you can spend it instantly but you cannot use that item you've just brought? Where is the logic in that? Yes you can say well buy a ship at 75mil if you have the Isk but certainly it is my right to buy it and of course loose it just as fast due to inexperience. Maybe all Iam after is yes you can use it straight away, BUT train skills to become more effiecent at it would make more sense. I find it fustrating that I cannot explore other aspects of game example being salvaging without stoping to become effecient at one field of expertise. But atleast I would have option to see if I wanted to be better in a different field. Someone starts playing now. In a week or 2 he manages to hook up with a gallente starship research agent. He suddenly wins a hulk bpo in 3 weeks, sells it for 50+ billion isk. He buys a dreadnought with uber faction gear, and comes on the forums to whine that he can't even fly it yet. Not to insult or anything, but it does put things in perspective (i hope). EVE History Wiki - Help us fill it!

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