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Please, please, please CCP get rid of the titan superweapon

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Vincent R	Posted - 2007.02.19 13:39:00 - [1] Dear CCP, I have enjoyed your game for a long time. In fact, I don't think I've ever had more fun in a game. Taking part in huge fleet battles is one of those insanely cool moments that just don't exist in any other game. Unfortunately, I think all of this will be going out the window, and soon. The introduction of titans will make all non-capitals almost useless in fleet battles, because you can lose them at a moment's notice with zero chance to fight back. I think titans are a cool concept. The first time I was doomsdayed, my heart started racing. I had never experienced something like that in any game before, getting physically affected by a virtual explosion. However, after this happens again and again and again, it quickly loses its charm. I can think of nothing that is less fun than losing something expensive without any sort of fighting chance. I don't mind losing ships to fleet battles, even if my side is horribly outnumbered. At least there is a fight, and you can talk tactics afterwards, what could we have done to increase our effectiveness, etc. When getting doomsdayed, all you get is angry and frustrated. Someone pushed a button, boom, your entire fleet is gone. Zero skill involved, no fight, no fun. I've lost more ships to doomsdays than battles these last weeks. One titan is bad enough, but imagine what happens when one alliance builds multiple titans, like we're already starting to see with D2 and BoB. Alliance warfare will be changed forever, and any alliance without a huge capital fleet will be run over. The old powers will be even more entrenched. Multiple titans is a so horribly broken concept. Summary: The doomsday devices are a horrible addition to the game, because they take away all meaning of non-capital ships. They bring nothing to the game except frustration, anger and a feeling of hopelessness. They make it impossible for newbies to put up any kind of a fight against larger powers. Please, please, please CCP do something about them before too many of them come into play and it becomes impossible to reverse the damage.
Alakazam Bob The Builder Breidablik	Posted - 2007.02.19 13:45:00 - [2] Maybe reduce ROF instead?
darklegionca Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2007.02.19 13:50:00 - [3] erm the rof is one hour isnt it why would they want to make it longer ------------------------------------ darklegionca - One name. One legend.
Canine Fiend Minmatar Gekidoku Koroshiya Buntai	Posted - 2007.02.19 13:51:00 - [4] How about, as soon as you see the cyno field go up and the animation start, you warp away. If memory serves me there's 5-8 seconds from start of animation to when damage is dealt. If you're aligned, you should never lose a ship to a doomsday. -------------------
AKULA UrQuan Caldari STK Scientific INVICTUS.	Posted - 2007.02.19 13:52:00 - [5] Been on the same grid as 4 Titan DD blasts. Didn't die. They're not that hard to avoid if you know what to look for.
Angelis666 Amarr The Knights Of Camelot DeStInY.	Posted - 2007.02.19 13:55:00 - [6] Originally by: Alakazam Maybe reduce ROF instead? Nah, increase the fitting requirements and cap cost all matters aside, The main tool in fleet combat is battleships, Battleships can EASILY tank DDDs and almost everyone knows what the enemys titan is making it very easy to get the resists for, loose what 1 maybe 2 damge/tracking mods to stay alive and pick off all the stranglers who are weak from the doomsday device.
Fi T'Zeh Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.02.19 13:56:00 - [7] Originally by: Vincent R Dear CCP, I have enjoyed your game for a long time. In fact, I don't think I've ever had more fun in a game. Taking part in huge fleet battles is one of those insanely cool moments that just don't exist in any other game. Unfortunately, I think all of this will be going out the window, and soon. The introduction of titans will make all non-capitals almost useless in fleet battles, because you can lose them at a moment's notice with zero chance to fight back. I think titans are a cool concept. The first time I was doomsdayed, my heart started racing. I had never experienced something like that in any game before, getting physically affected by a virtual explosion. However, after this happens again and again and again, it quickly loses its charm. I can think of nothing that is less fun than losing something expensive without any sort of fighting chance. I don't mind losing ships to fleet battles, even if my side is horribly outnumbered. At least there is a fight, and you can talk tactics afterwards, what could we have done to increase our effectiveness, etc. When getting doomsdayed, all you get is angry and frustrated. Someone pushed a button, boom, your entire fleet is gone. Zero skill involved, no fight, no fun. I've lost more ships to doomsdays than battles these last weeks. One titan is bad enough, but imagine what happens when one alliance builds multiple titans, like we're already starting to see with D2 and BoB. Alliance warfare will be changed forever, and any alliance without a huge capital fleet will be run over. The old powers will be even more entrenched. Multiple titans is a so horribly broken concept. Summary: The doomsday devices are a horrible addition to the game, because they take away all meaning of non-capital ships. They bring nothing to the game except frustration, anger and a feeling of hopelessness. They make it impossible for newbies to put up any kind of a fight against larger powers. Please, please, please CCP do something about them before too many of them come into play and it becomes impossible to reverse the damage. Been DDD'd recently Contrary to popular beleif there are several ways to avoid death by DDD. 1) A BS Can tank it, provided you know which one it is your enemy has. 2) See cyno, run cyno - you usually have about 15 seconds to leave between it being fired and you dying. Be aligned. If you aren't aligned in a fleet you deserve to die anyway. Infact, a frigate or cruiser should be able to escape even if they aren't aligned. 3) Don't jump a fleet of t1 ships into a bubble camp when it's known the enemy has a Titan. .... Playing EVE on easy mode since May 2003.
NeoTech Minmatar A.W.M Ka-Tet	Posted - 2007.02.19 13:58:00 - [8] IMO drop the radius of which is does damage to 100 (200 in diameter), and make the recharge time 2 hour+ Atleast that would balance it a little... but ye, i agree with the op. Originally by: DB Preacher nothing on those forums show that anyone in CCP is in RKK or have done anything to assist us and I am 100% certain that the investigation will show that nothing untoward has
Vincent R	Posted - 2007.02.19 13:58:00 - [9] Originally by: Canine Fiend How about, as soon as you see the cyno field go up and the animation start, you warp away. If memory serves me there's 5-8 seconds from start of animation to when damage is dealt. If you're aligned, you should never lose a ship to a doomsday. In a loaded system, there is often a lot of lag. Often you won't get away even if you are aligned. Not to even start talking about the fact that on jump-in to a loaded system, it often takes MINUTES to load the grid, but you are vulnerable to the DD during this time. In a perfect world without lag, yes, you could just warp out. Unfortunately there is lag, and it seems it is a very difficult problem for CCP to solve.
Xeliya Dark-Rising Fallen Souls	Posted - 2007.02.19 14:04:00 - [10] Edited by: Xeliya on 19/02/2007 14:02:40 If ya remove the DD then remove T1 Garbage Lag Blobs, kthx. Originally by: Fi T'Zeh Been DDD'd recently Contrary to popular beleif there are several ways to avoid death by DDD. 1) A BS Can tank it, provided you know which one it is your enemy has. 2) See cyno, run cyno - you usually have about 15 seconds to leave between it being fired and you dying. Be aligned. If you aren't aligned in a fleet you deserve to die anyway. Infact, a frigate or cruiser should be able to escape even if they aren't aligned. 3) Don't jump a fleet of t1 ships into a bubble camp when it's known the enemy has a Titan. QFT ----------
Vincent R	Posted - 2007.02.19 14:10:00 - [11] Originally by: Fi T'Zeh Contrary to popular beleif there are several ways to avoid death by DDD. 1) A BS Can tank it, provided you know which one it is your enemy has. 2) See cyno, run cyno - you usually have about 15 seconds to leave between it being fired and you dying. Be aligned. If you aren't aligned in a fleet you deserve to die anyway. Infact, a frigate or cruiser should be able to escape even if they aren't aligned. 3) Don't jump a fleet of t1 ships into a bubble camp when it's known the enemy has a Titan. Oh I know. I've survived several DD:s. However, your own alliance has at least two different types of titans, if not more. How do you fit a battleship to tank two (or three) different types of superweapons at once? You could just warp two titans to the gate and activate them simultaneously. Nothing that isn't a cap ship would survive. I'm trying my hardest not to make this sound like a whine. I'm just very sad that what I enjoy the most about this game seems to be going away so quickly.
James Duar Merch Industrial We Are Nice Guys	Posted - 2007.02.19 14:13:00 - [12] Get rid of the remote doomsday. You want to use your superweapon, then you have to put it in harms way.
Brisi Veto.	Posted - 2007.02.19 14:14:00 - [13] Originally by: James Duar Get rid of the remote doomsday. You want to use your superweapon, then you have to put it in harms way. I agree with this. It would solve a lot of the current problems I reckon. Resistance is Fertile.
Angelis666 Amarr The Knights Of Camelot DeStInY.	Posted - 2007.02.19 14:16:00 - [14] There is alot of chance based things in eve, this is one of them every time you move something valuable in high sec, theres a chance you might get suicude ganked. every time you jump through a gate in 0.0 there might be a gate camp on the other side every time you listen to britney spears sing theres a high chance you might go deaf. every time you go to a fleet battle theres a chance the enemy has a titan. Know your enemy, Know you surivial
Anatolius Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2007.02.19 14:16:00 - [15] Originally by: Vincent R Summary: The doomsday devices are a horrible addition to the game, because they take away all meaning of non-capital ships. They bring nothing to the game except frustration, anger and a feeling of hopelessness. They make it impossible for newbies to put up any kind of a fight against larger powers. In the same manner that an alliance that can field T2-fitted battleships can roll over one who can't? Or how an alliance that can field T1-fitted battleships can roll over one who can't? Or how an alliance that can field T2 ships can roll over one who can't? Or how an alliance that can X can roll over one who can't? No skill? Please. If there were no skill involved, you wouldn't see the average 'LOL TEN SHIPS AND ONLY FIVE WERE OURS!" reports vs. a certain incident involving a few hundred wrecks being created. "If God be for us, whom can be against us?"
Belladonna Nightshade	Posted - 2007.02.19 14:17:00 - [16] Maybe if you were in a corp that prefered small gang warfare to the uber-no skill-numbers blob out you would fall victim to the Titan less often. hmm? When was the last time you and one or two friends just hit the road and tried to see what you could get up to? I promise that its a ton more fun than the laggy, borring POS war BLOB thing. Just a frig and a few cruisers and the world is you oyster.
ScreamingLord Sutch Hand in Mouth	Posted - 2007.02.19 14:17:00 - [17] CCP can nerf DD's when they nerf superblobs. Want to zerg, prepare to die en-masse.
Jane Spondogolo	Posted - 2007.02.19 14:20:00 - [18] The problem with Titans is two fold. Unless you have mad bastards like BOB who actually camp with the damn thing (and hats off to that I suppose), they are virtually unstoppable. You just move out of the pos, fire whilst aligned and jump to the next pos. Zero risk required. You cant fight a titan with a titan. You cant ewar the thing to stop it ***ing off. You cant do much except drop as much cap ship power as only the alliances with the damn things have, and then only with drunk. Theres a few possible ways to remedy this imho. 1) Increase the cap requirements. If you fire it, your not jumping out for some time. Alternatively;- 2) Put a limit on how many can be in a system. 1 titans in systems a pain, but its not an I win button. 2 titans are a menace, but concievable to survive. Any more, and it just becomes a joke. Put 3 in with different types of damage, and most battleships wont be able to tank it. In my take, if a titan is in system, the game should make it impossible for another to enter. (Ie, stick it in the neighboring system to try and nail reinforcements if you must* do the multi titan thing). And hell, make it part of the strategy, get your titan in first to deny the enemy the ability to bring his in. Alternatively..... 3) EWAR EWAR EWAR. God damn it CCP, let us tackle the damn things. Put some risk into it. Alternatively (and my favorite!) 4) Get rid of the remote detonation nonsense. Come on, put some RISK into using a weapon. The fact that 2 titans have been lost to log timer technicalitys is imho purely a result of the fact there appears to be no other real way to kill it other than pure luck. Even the fiasco where BOB/LV vs Ra/goons put so many in a system to fight over a cap yard it crashed the hell out of the node is a result of the fact that the stakes are too high. The problem of multi titans are bad enough as it is. Give it 2-3 months, and its game over imho. The blobbings bad enough in this game. The titans just made it horrible.
darklegionca Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2007.02.19 14:24:00 - [19] oh god is this turning into a bob whine thread again ------------------------------------ darklegionca - One name. One legend.
Angelis666 Amarr The Knights Of Camelot DeStInY.	Posted - 2007.02.19 14:41:00 - [20] Originally by: Jane Spondogolo Edited by: Jane Spondogolo on 19/02/2007 14:20:27 4) Get rid of the remote detonation nonsense. Come on, put some RISK into using a weapon. How about when a DDD is fired, the power required to do so is so large that anyone can pick up the titan on there scanner and warp to the titan for the next 5-15 minutes
Scilent Enigma Minmatar	Posted - 2007.02.19 14:52:00 - [21] Just tossing around an idea here that struck me after reading the OP. What if the Titan experienced a similar thing as cyno pilots when the DD has been activated. They are static with almost no cap left, unable to warp away untill the ship systems have regained charge enough for it to become operational again (ten minutes or something?). That way there would be a much bigger cost to firing the DD even through a cyno and giving a slight possibility to kill a titan without metagaming, unawareness of gamemechanics, spys etc.
Rodj Blake Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2007.02.19 15:01:00 - [22] Edited by: Rodj Blake on 19/02/2007 14:58:22 Originally by: Scilent Enigma Just tossing around an idea here that struck me after reading the OP. What if the Titan experienced a similar thing as cyno pilots when the DD has been activated. They are static with almost no cap left, unable to warp away untill the ship systems have regained charge enough for it to become operational again (ten minutes or something?). That way there would be a much bigger cost to firing the DD even through a cyno and giving a slight possibility to kill a titan without metagaming, unawareness of gamemechanics, spys etc. That's not a bad idea. It would mean that titans would sit in a POS though. Dulce et decorum est pro imperator mori
D2O HeavyWater Amarr Synergy. Imperial Republic Of the North	Posted - 2007.02.19 15:03:00 - [23] DDD on its own as stated is avoidable, however DDD + LAG = death as I saw at weekend. In preparing for battle I have always found that plans are useless, but planning is indispensable.
Siri Blue Gallente Duvolle Laboratories Blue Division	Posted - 2007.02.19 15:05:00 - [24] Titans and Doomsday Devices should be SOLELY NPC weapons of choice, preferably in the hands of very able and talented Aurora agents playing Empire agents. You NEVER EVER EVER put the best, biggest and world wrecking weapons into the hands of the players! I really thought the guys at White Wolf would have hammered that into CCP's heads by now And from the storyline point of view...why the bloody frakking hell would the 4 Empires put weapons capable of destroying whole fleets and planets into the hand of uncontrollable barbarians like most of the 0.0 alliances are composed of!?!?!?!?!?!????!?!?! RABBLERABBLERABBLE
Gareth Angel Blue Star Enterprises	Posted - 2007.02.19 15:08:00 - [25] Originally by: Angelis666 ...every time you listen to britney spears sing theres a high chance you might go deaf... No, Britney is cool now. She's bald and has tattoos... But anyway - I do feel a little awkward towards the fact that a Titan doesn't need to be present at a location in order for it to use it's DDD... That may be changed imho.
Nicholas Barker Caldari Rampage Eternal Ka-Tet	Posted - 2007.02.19 15:09:00 - [26] Originally by: Angelis666 Originally by: Jane Spondogolo Edited by: Jane Spondogolo on 19/02/2007 14:20:27 4) Get rid of the remote detonation nonsense. Come on, put some RISK into using a weapon. How about when a DDD is fired, the power required to do so is so large that anyone can pick up the titan on there scanner and warp to the titan for the next 5-15 minutes and find yourself at a pos getting shot at. -------------------------------------
Arctic Angel	Posted - 2007.02.19 16:18:00 - [27] Just make the cyno that is used to remotely blast the DD a two way cyno that the hostile force (if not dead at this point) can use to get the Titan..
Kagura Nikon Minmatar MASS HOMICIDE FREGE Alliance	Posted - 2007.02.19 16:33:00 - [28] Just make the DD use all cap on the ship (so it cant jump ). If brute force doesn't solve your problem.. then you are not using enough!!
Kagura Nikon Minmatar MASS HOMICIDE FREGE Alliance	Posted - 2007.02.19 16:34:00 - [29] Originally by: Siri Blue Titans and Doomsday Devices should be SOLELY NPC weapons of choice, preferably in the hands of very able and talented Aurora agents playing Empire agents. You NEVER EVER EVER put the best, biggest and world wrecking weapons into the hands of the players! I really thought the guys at White Wolf would have hammered that into CCP's heads by now And from the storyline point of view...why the bloody frakking hell would the 4 Empires put weapons capable of destroying whole fleets and planets into the hand of uncontrollable barbarians like most of the 0.0 alliances are composed of!?!?!?!?!?!????!?!?! RABBLERABBLERABBLE I really beleive you forget htat must theoreticaly be a jovian Titan that can pown all titans together :P If brute force doesn't solve your problem.. then you are not using enough!!
NebulousBlur Minmatar Unknown Shoe Corp. SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2007.02.19 16:42:00 - [30] Edited by: NebulousBlur on 19/02/2007 16:39:08 I agree with removing the fire through a cyno ability. Baring that, make a doomsday that is fired through a cyno do 50% less damage. I think that the doomsday should use more cap, at least 50%, or it should be more costly to fire in fuel/ammo. But I would agree most of all with removing the doomsdays entirely and putting something else in their place. It is essentially creating a barrier to entry to 0.0 space, if you can't tank 65,000 damage of a single type in one hit, do not enter.
Dasi	Posted - 2007.02.19 17:00:00 - [31] Titan's reduce blobing. I swears it. Its cool how titans jump bridge entire fleets without the need for most stargates. Wait, a second.
Marcus TheMartin Gallente Tuxedo.	Posted - 2007.02.19 17:02:00 - [32] Originally by: Dasi Titan's reduce blobing. I swears it. Its cool how titans jump bridge entire fleets without the need for most stargates. Wait, a second. Never again are you allowed to complain about not training for combat
Shamis Orzoz Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2007.02.19 17:03:00 - [33] The doomsday weapon seems reasonable given the amount of effort required to acquire one. However, it should definitely use a lot more cap thatn it does. And the remote firing of it should be nerfed a bit. Using a DD should involve some risk to the titan. Currently it doesn't. Shamis
Sgt Blade Cutting Edge Incorporated RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2007.02.19 17:05:00 - [34] how about leave it as it is and make it take a penalty for everytime it uses a DD...mabey it cant move or do anything for 5-10 mins? that way people have a channce to counter the titan and making titan pilots of wary of using the DD instead of the usual spam every hour or on crappy targets Hypnotic Pelvic Thrusting Level 5
zykerx Pegasus Mining and Securities R0ADKILL	Posted - 2007.02.19 17:14:00 - [35] would like to see remote dd stopped, titan should be in same grid of the targets he wants to own with his dd
Mirasta Caldari Aggressive Tendencies Curse Alliance	Posted - 2007.02.19 17:37:00 - [36] With the DD equipped the Charge time of the titans cap should be more than 1 hour, all though its ROF remains at 1 hour. This coubpled with the other ideas of stopping the Remote DD means that the fleet using the titan will need to put alot of thought in to its logistics ships capabilitys, like remote cap transfer and such. With a change like that the titan would need to appear on the front lines, fire its DD, expend all of its cap, then have a group of charging carriers turn up to help it get off the battle feild. Still as devastating but requires more thought and risk. Of couse, You are now reading my sig.
Apollo Kreed Ministry of War	Posted - 2007.02.19 17:50:00 - [37] Originally by: NebulousBlur Edited by: NebulousBlur on 19/02/2007 16:39:08 I agree with removing the fire through a cyno ability. Baring that, make a doomsday that is fired through a cyno do 50% less damage. I like that it can fire through a cyno, gives it some flavor. That said I agree that the damage fired through cynos should be reduced. Also the cap idea makes sense as well. It takes an hour for the weapon itself to be capable of firing once more... that much energy would have to play hell on a ships cap, even a ship as impressive as a titan. So the weapon eats enough cap that the titan itself is vulnerable after using it (can't jump out basically) and the weapon does less damage when used from safe areas. Something as powerful as a DDD should come with risk vs. reward. Don't want to risk the titan, you don't do as much damage.
WilliamPD	Posted - 2007.02.19 18:03:00 - [38] don't forget the enemy need support as well, and they need to coordinate their fleet to jump out before the DD hits, because they might as well die from the superweapon (see latest bob report, they lost more ships than they killed from they DD). 1 hour countdown, with the price considered and the logistic needed, sounds balanced.
WilliamPD	Posted - 2007.02.19 18:03:00 - [39] don't forget the enemy need support as well, and they need to coordinate their fleet to jump out before the DD hits, because they might as well die from the superweapon (see latest bob report, they lost more ships than they killed from they DD). 1 hour countdown, with the price considered and the logistic needed, sounds balanced.
Shamis Orzoz Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2007.02.19 18:12:00 - [40] Originally by: WilliamPD don't forget the enemy need support as well, and they need to coordinate their fleet to jump out before the DD hits, because they might as well die from the superweapon (see latest bob report, they lost more ships than they killed from they DD). 1 hour countdown, with the price considered and the logistic needed, sounds balanced. A titan needs no support. It can't be killed while logged in, unless the player is unwilling to log out, and it can't be killed while logged out unless the owner really screws up. Sig removed, lacks Eve-related content. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] - Cortes
Jacque Custeau Knights of the Minmatar Republic	Posted - 2007.02.19 18:14:00 - [41] I support the OP. The titan DD needs to be removed from the game. A list should be compiled of all ships that died to a DD so that replacements can be made by GMs. -------------------
Kirex Gallente Vale Heavy Industries SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2007.02.19 18:30:00 - [42] I have mixed feeling about titans. Don't you guys think the ability to jump bridging 200+ ships across the galaxy and being able to destroy an entire fleet from the safety of your pos is overpowered? In a few months every major alliance will have 2-3 titans, it'll be like a huge fleet-sized warp core stab/I win button. Bubble the gate and fire DD at incoming fleet. Or jump bridge a fleet safely (no risks) into the enemys hq, kill poses/miners/npcers/whatever, a stronger hostile fleet shows up, then jump bridge out. That'll be boring... Click above for my killboard stats.
Malthros Zenobia Caldari Independent Navy Reserve	Posted - 2007.02.19 18:33:00 - [43] The solution would be to make them different, not grid hitting AOE. Hell, look at our DDDs and then read about the Jove Mothership, which is likely a titan by today's terms. It's a joke. Make the DDD fire once every few minutes, but have it fire a beam weapon of some sort, which just hits any and everything in the line and ends at the edge of the grid. Enemy blobbed tight as hell? Target the center and wipe out most of them. They're spread out? Pick which targets need to die the most. Originally by: kieron The Carrier was never intended to be a solo OMGWTF mission-farming PWNmobile.
Maranda Orbison	Posted - 2007.02.19 18:35:00 - [44] Cant be arsed to read the beginning of this, but to make a suggestion. How about anything destroyed by the doomsday device doesnt drop loot. This could be exlpained with the fact everything would be obliterated, It might also discourgae the use a little bit for attackers wanting to claim loot.
Jacque Custeau Knights of the Minmatar Republic	Posted - 2007.02.19 18:45:00 - [45] How about CCP removes the DD weapon and in return makes titan production easier. Say it can be made in a station in empire like a dread. -------------------
Goumindong Amarr Merch Industrial We Are Nice Guys	Posted - 2007.02.19 18:45:00 - [46] Originally by: darklegionca erm the rof is one hour isnt it why would they want to make it longer One hour isnt all that much when you get a number of them in system. ---------------------------------------- Thou Shalt "Pew Pew"
Thor Xian Vertigo One E.A.R.T.H. Federation	Posted - 2007.02.19 18:59:00 - [47] How about make it an actual doomsday weapon? Change timer to 24 hours Increase base damage to 200,000 Increase fuel cost by 2x Increase cap need to 50,000 Activation System Lock Penalty (Jump Drive and Jump Portal disabled) for 1 hour Remote Activation base damage increased to 50,000 Remote Activation cap need 125,000 Remote Activation fuel need 5x Remote Activation System Lock Penalty for 2.5 hours Adds desire to not use cyno to deploy the 3D, while adding sufficient risk to the Titan relatively balanced to the benefit. _________________________ ~Thor Xian, Material Defender Got Corp?
Opium	Posted - 2007.02.19 19:02:00 - [48] just make it damage itself too... its called doomsday device the titan pilot uses his ddd he gets damage also.. will make him tank for himself maybe make him weaker im not sure of its fittings,, but u use a uber nuclear device and u are ground zero ur gettin blown up or atleast take damage also... leave all the same just make them damage themselves its called doomsday that means no winners its ur own doomsday also
Xscaped Pensioner Trident Industries	Posted - 2007.02.19 19:09:00 - [49] this thread is bloody hilarious, get off your asses and build one, yes it is a big investment, but the investment is worth it. In order to build it though will require a hell of a lot of team work but this is one of things that makes this game great. I notice most the people commenting in this thread do not have a titan in their corp/alliance any real surprise there..... me thinks not Titan as it is, is fine, they are vunerable you just need to work it out and use that vulnerability what do you think the last couple eve release where about The building of large fleets and capital fleets as we move closer to faction warfare etc, things are not going to get any easier in 0.0 children once sys sov comes in. Titan is not the i-win button, however it does wtfpwn once an hour if the right pilot uses the right tactics with his fleet/gang and the enemy is silly enough not use the right tactics against it, Yes you can set up to handle the damage it does but tbh pretty poor tactic if you are hoping to survive a DD blast to win a fleet fight. and if you do use that tactic expect to get pwned when the enemy fleet warps in right after it. When the cyno fires YOU SHOULD NOT BE THERE!!!!!! Agree or disagree as you will and feel free to flame
Nachshon Caldari Gradient Namtz'aar k'in	Posted - 2007.02.19 19:27:00 - [50] Titans are designed to be fleet-killers. Multiple titans are virtually unstoppable. This is all true. However, titans are only going to be produced by large alliances, who fight large wars. You have to think in the larger strategic sense of a war. First of all, when you fight titans, NEVER blob. Keep your ships at safespots around the system. Only blob to actually give battle - ie, when the enemy sends THEIR fleet through. Second, keeping your fleet dispersed in multiple systems can be a good thing. Should the enemy use multiple titans in one system, this is the perfect chance to attack THEM from the other systems. Finally, there is a counter to titans - dreadnoughts. Yes, they are capital ships. However, that an alliance with capital ships can crush an alliance without capital ships should be obvious. Dreadnoughts can (I believe) survive DDs, and then they can strike once the titan is done. The capital ships and their roles are: Dreadnought: Kills POS's and other capital ships. Freighter: Mother of all cargo bays. Carrier: Super drone ship. Mothership: Mobile base. Titan: Fleet killer. __________________________________________ What I say should not be taken as the position of Gradient or NMTZ.
mechtech	Posted - 2007.02.19 19:33:00 - [51] Originally by: NebulousBlur Make a doomsday that is fired through a cyno do 50% less damage. I like that idea...
Kopach	Posted - 2007.02.20 00:08:00 - [52] Sorry about a quick derail but I couldnt resist it: Vincent , change the doomsday with blobing in your post , and fleet with a solo player traveling in 0.0 and tell me how you feel about it. You can start with the following sentances: Originally by: Vincent R When getting doomsdayed, all you get is angry and frustrated. Someone pushed a button, boom, your entire fleet is gone. Zero skill involved, no fight, no fun. I've lost more ships to doomsdays than battles these last weeks. So in other words , it sounds just like a "I got blobed whine" threads but somehow is open for discussion ....becouse blobing is really realy really...really needed but fighting with Titans is..ummmm...somehow not ? Right ? Right ? I bet not many will see my point.
sr blackout Minmatar	Posted - 2007.02.20 00:45:00 - [53] i think someone said it before, DDD needs a cooldown so that you cant jump/warp and your stuck.. it also should take some cap or something, so there is a chance to get its cap down enough to destroy it... with luck
Kryss Darkdust	Posted - 2007.02.20 01:16:00 - [54] Originally by: Vincent R Dear CCP, One titan is bad enough, but imagine what happens when one alliance builds multiple titans, like we're already starting to see with D2 and BoB. Alliance warfare will be changed forever, and any alliance without a huge capital fleet will be run over. The old powers will be even more entrenched. Multiple titans is a so horribly broken concept. . I recall reading artciles and interviews done by CCP about exactly what your talking about. I can't be bothered to pull the exact quote but it went something along the lines that CCP wants the Titan and the super power alliances to effectivly take over the game and create entire regions of space that belong and are governed by players. They want the world to be expansive and epic and they are not concerened about the fairness or balance of that aspect because it isn't as you put it about the fleet battles. Its about the playing the game on a galactic map in which players via for power over millions of light years of space. This is the dream it seems of CCP, to let the world unfold as it will without interference. You have to keep in mind that these huge alliances like Bob and D2, they are the result of dedication of the players, organization of their corps and efforts on their parts. You can't simply decide, its not balanced and take it away, else no one would ever bother with it again and the gain would effectivly be a dismel, repetative version of games like WOW in which winning a battle means nothing. Titans are the weapon of the mass alliances and anyone who wants to compete on such a level has to get equally organized as some of these super groups have done. There is nothing unbalanced about it and the Titans are an awsome extension of CCP's dream of having the players, not NPC's rule the gameworld. Are you are gamer? www.playhardliveeasy.blogspot.com
Coasterbrian Loss of Sanity	Posted - 2007.02.20 01:36:00 - [55] I agree that doomsday devices are a little overpowered, only because they can be used with almost no risk to the titan pilot. I think firing a doomsday should have the following effect: -Empties the titan's capacitor completely. -Forces the titan to remain stationary for 15 minutes, as if in siege mode. -Cannot be fired from inside a POS (I think it's like this already, but not sure) -Refire rate needs to be 12 hours, but jump portal timer should be reduced to 15 minutes. -Since using the DDD is such a risk, the damage needs to be doubled so that battleships will die. The titan will be a big fking target, but only if you've got a big fking fleet to kill it. ---------- Loss of Sanity.
James Duar Merch Industrial We Are Nice Guys	Posted - 2007.02.20 01:53:00 - [56] Ok, regarding the Jump Bridge: that is quite possibly the most balanced ability the Titan has. The jump bridge uses strontium clathrates to send ships based on mass, so it costs a lot to use the ability but the ability itself is potentially incredibly useful. That said, it's only really useful because the clone vat bay is so incredibly useless. I'm liking this idea of making the DD like the effect of dropping a cyno, since it really would make the Titan vulnerable. The DD can only be fired while outside a POS shield, meaning that there'd be a 15 min window where you could jump in dreads and attack that thing. Then again, this seems like it might be way too much of a nerf. Honestly, there a lot of small changes which would drastically improve the current Titan situation - too many things conspire to make them over powered. The Remote DD is an obvious one. The EWar immunity combined with Remote DD is worse. The fact that you put a cloaking device on a Titan is pretty heinous - it DD's then cloaks. Hell, the Titan could pretty much go AFK, which would be the safer option rather then logging out it seems.
Faith Black Minmatar Rolls Roids	Posted - 2007.02.20 02:03:00 - [57] Edited by: Faith Black on 20/02/2007 02:02:04 Edited by: Faith Black on 20/02/2007 01:59:54 Titans are supposed to be the ultimate weapon of mass destruction and fear. No matter how they balance them, this has to stay. And well, if any big blob fleet in crappy ships would have an easy time to kill a titan, it would be also wrong. It should definitely big organized capital forces like maybe RAT, MC, D2, BoB, LV, RA in no particular order with a good plan to take out a titan and not some random huge fleet blob, who just jumps on it and kills it. Titans are a barrier of superpowers against the angry unorganized mob and that's good. If they get rebalanced that needs to stay. I mean those alliances have worked their ass off to be, where they are and still doing it and so they get rewarded with the uber-toys. ------ No.1 reason to post with an alt: Avoiding that your main looks too silly.
Stakhanov Gallente	Posted - 2007.02.20 02:20:00 - [58] Waaa , their stuff is too uber , nerf ! Devs said at the fanfest that they wouldn't boost titans to make them cost effective , because they're more symbolic than utilitarian. Now that they have some use against fleets , what is there to complain about ? What about adapting your tactics , and quit blobbing over and over ? Or leave Goonswarm maybe ? Did it occur to anyone that this kind of scenario was actually intended ? That titans were meant to be the last word in fleet warfare - if you are shot by one you die ! Eve's flavor needs no nerf.
hotgirl933	Posted - 2007.02.20 02:55:00 - [59] make it stronger
Soryn Kael The Sanctum	Posted - 2007.02.20 02:56:00 - [60] Instead of nerfing the doomsday firing, why not just juggle the timers a bit to expose the Titan to combat more. Render a titan unable to warp for 15 minutes after firing a doomsday and make the jump capability of the Titan tied to the same timer as the doomsday. That means your Titan will be exposed to damage and you can't immediately pop a couple titans into a system and fire off the Doomsday. It would add a lot more tactical considerations to the current Titan mix.
Depp Knight Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.02.20 03:30:00 - [61] Some of your ideas fellars kinda are stupid. Titan unable to warp and do anything for 15mins is a silly idea. Why make a titan a sitting duck unable to even repair its dmg? Same for using cap ideas even the non remote DD idea, all silly. Remember how ASCN said that the titan is over-rated? Now everyone is sayings its overpowered. The only thing imo to change is the ROF. 1 hr is a short time to organise a counter fleet after DD has been fired, successfully or not.
Richard Aiel Caldari The Funkstars Guild	Posted - 2007.02.20 03:37:00 - [62] Originally by: Depp Knight Some of your ideas fellars kinda are stupid. Titan unable to warp and do anything for 15mins is a silly idea. Why make a titan a sitting duck unable to even repair its dmg? Same for using cap ideas even the non remote DD idea, all silly. Remember how ASCN said that the titan is over-rated? Now everyone is sayings its overpowered. The only thing imo to change is the ROF. 1 hr is a short time to organise a counter fleet after DD has been fired, successfully or not. Well when ppl can field several at once it becomes a different game I remember when ppl went "ah BoD in collusion with CCP? Bah pure tinfoilery!!" sorry cant forget it... Or we SHOULDNT PERKOSET & OXYCODONE IS FUN!!! Lets see how long till this post lives...
James Duar Merch Industrial We Are Nice Guys	Posted - 2007.02.20 03:52:00 - [63] Originally by: Richard Aiel Originally by: Depp Knight Some of your ideas fellars kinda are stupid. Titan unable to warp and do anything for 15mins is a silly idea. Why make a titan a sitting duck unable to even repair its dmg? Same for using cap ideas even the non remote DD idea, all silly. Remember how ASCN said that the titan is over-rated? Now everyone is sayings its overpowered. The only thing imo to change is the ROF. 1 hr is a short time to organise a counter fleet after DD has been fired, successfully or not. Well when ppl can field several at once it becomes a different game It wouldn't be a problem if for some reason each alliance only had 1. Except EVE isn't like that. If you can have 1, you have many typically.
Bryg Philomena Green Lantern Corps	Posted - 2007.02.20 04:40:00 - [64] titan is fun and all, to fight and to fight along side of, but heres the deal. BoB or any other large alliance is going to build lots of them. Think, a alliance with 4 or 5 titans, is unstoppable, sit at a pos have them all fire the DDD through the cyno, and nearly anything is really popped. That is my beef. maybe make it so that only 1 DDD per alliance can be fired within 30 min of another DDD in the same alliance. cyno firing is lame, being able to demolish other ships at the same time as sitting in a pos with no danger to yourself.. question: can a titan go through the jump portal of another titan? http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=465618
Faith Black Minmatar Rolls Roids	Posted - 2007.02.20 04:51:00 - [65] Edited by: Faith Black on 20/02/2007 04:49:49 Originally by: Bryg Philomena question: can a titan go through the jump portal of another titan? If capitals were able to go through, it would safe a lot of isotopes and they would arrive with full cap I think. So I doubt that it works. Like they can't use gates, they probably can't use jump-portals. But I don't know it for sure, don't own a Titan. ------ No.1 reason to post with an alt: Avoiding that your main looks too silly.
James Duar Merch Industrial We Are Nice Guys	Posted - 2007.02.20 05:00:00 - [66] Originally by: Faith Black Edited by: Faith Black on 20/02/2007 04:49:49 Originally by: Bryg Philomena question: can a titan go through the jump portal of another titan? If capitals were able to go through, it would safe a lot of isotopes and they would arrive with full cap I think. So I doubt that it works. Like they can't use gates, they probably can't use jump-portals. But I don't know it for sure, don't own a Titan. It wouldn't matter even if they did. Jump portal fuel use is determined by the mass of the ship transported, and the fual is strontium clathrates. It would be hideously expensive.
Deep Throat	Posted - 2007.02.20 06:29:00 - [67] I totally agree with this topic being raised. however, removing the dd would make the titan, pretty much uselss and since they already ingame, a little bit too late to remove about the only thing they can do. The DD atm is totally out of control and game design. the following should however fix this. nr.1 REMOVE the ability to shoot the DD through a cynofield. this is to say the least a retarded option giving the titan pilot the oppurtunity to kill hundreds of ships in an instan from 100 au distance nr.2 Make the repercussions for the titan more severe than they are now. after shooting the dd, he can not jump for 15 minutes, he cannot cloak or run away in any shape or form except warp out in a normal manner. this would make the titan pilot think about it twice before he uses his very powerful weapon.
Ket Halpak ANZAC ALLIANCE Southern Cross Alliance	Posted - 2007.02.20 07:27:00 - [68] I cant be arsed to read the entire thread, but to the OP, no offence intended, I see the DDD as the ultimate anti-blob strategie. The less targets on a grid, the less likely you are to provide tempting targets. This is proberly part of CCP's need for speed inititive. Less ships on a grid=less lag for that grid. Just my 2 ISK ____________________________________Any views expressed in the above post are my own and not those of my corp unless otherwise stated as such. If you are reading the above post, the
arkarsk Provenance.	Posted - 2007.02.20 08:09:00 - [69] I was hit in the face with a pair of DD's once, cant see why you guys would want to avoid it. ----------------- http://www.eve-provenance.com
Dopefish Amarr Quad and Fish	Posted - 2007.02.20 08:17:00 - [70] Originally by: arkarsk I was hit in the face with a pair of DD's once, cant see why you guys would want to avoid it. Its like spending 10 years at the beach, all at once. Sure it hurts, but the tan is so worth it.
chromer one FinFleet Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2007.02.20 08:35:00 - [71] heh I can smell the envy to my home here... maybe ccp should put tax for alliances who arent building/own titan. Tax for forum whining.
Doxs Roxs White Wolves Defence league The OSS	Posted - 2007.02.20 09:31:00 - [72] Edited by: Doxs Roxs on 20/02/2007 09:30:39 Personally I would like to see titans remote cyno firing removed. This would in turn mean that the titan would have to get on the frontlines. To counter this the titans HP should be increased (ALOT, titan kills should be epic battles), but there should also be a counter to the titans and motherships. Give the titans and motherships an innate warp scramble strenght that is wery high. (50-100 or more) And introduce capital warp scramble mods with 10-25 scramble strength that can be used to lock them down. This would mean that you would have to get in there with your titan to fire off that DD and it no longer becomes a pwnmobile without risk. If the aggro timer was properly introduced as well then perhaps we would see titans and motherships killed in combat instead of using poorly documented game mechanics to kill them when they are not piloted. If a titan is locked down and engaged by several enemy dreads the counter is also equally simple. The titans capital support must be used to help it, carriers to help repair it and your own dreads to kill the enemy dreads. It would add some tactics to the battles. If this is not adressed one way or another we will soon se battles where one side can field more then 4-5 titans. One does not need to be a rocket scientist to realize what kind of impact that would have on gameplay and POS warfare. If thats not enough, imagine another 12 months down the road where we will probably start to see 8-10 titans deployed. Regards /Doxs After 9 months of being a "!" face, I now discover that Im butt ugly instead...
James Duar Merch Industrial We Are Nice Guys	Posted - 2007.02.20 09:36:00 - [73] Forget capital scramble mods. A fleet of 150 could conceivably get enough points to lock it down. In a practical sense, the Titan would DD the frigates and most of the cruisers, so to nail it you'd have to fit specialist battleships with racks of disrupters and scrams. And those wouldn't be overly manoeuverable so it would still be a trick to nail it in place. Of course, then if it's smart it can just cyno out but it'd have to be fast before the cap warfare stopped that. The effect - gasp - would be that, like all other capital ships, it's very powerful, but very vulnerable without a mixed support fleet. As all capital ships should be.
Nostic	Posted - 2007.02.20 09:54:00 - [74] Edited by: Nostic on 20/02/2007 09:53:45 The doomsday is a pretty cool concept and should in the game, but it definitely needs tweaked. The typical fitting for a Titan pilot consists of filling every slot possible with cap mods. This allows titan pilots who don't want to sit at a POS the whole time to do whatever they wish without every putting their ship at risk. If the enemy cyno's in a capital fleet, bubbles you, bumps you, all you need to do is jump out once your hp gets low. You don't need to fit a tank because you can get out of any fight at any time, even if you just used your doomsday. Then there are those who never leave the safety of a POS. They can do everything just as well through remote detonation. It's possible to catch them outside of the POS shields, but all that will happen is the pilot will jump out. Is this really how CCP envisioned Titans being be used? In 6 months, there will be no point flying anything smaller than a carrier in 0.0 warfare. Yeah, you can definitely dodge or tank a titan, but what happens when you're up against 5 or 6 of different damage types? A doomsday every 10 minutes. Yeah, you can dodge a doomsday when it's not laggy, but doomsdays at such a frequency will get you eventually. What about in a year? How are you going to play this game outside of a capital ship when you're up against 15 titans? 25 titans from a coalition of alliances? Does that honestly sound like fun to anybody? The 0.0 game is going to completely stagnate over the next year if nothing is done. As I said, I don't want the doomsday removed. There just needs to be a counter to it. There must be some risk involved. 1) Remove or nerf the remote doomsday capability. Seriously, this is just ridiculous. 2) Make the doomsday use more capacitor so the Titan can't simply disappear after blowing up a fleet.
James Duar Merch Industrial We Are Nice Guys	Posted - 2007.02.20 11:02:00 - [75] Edited by: James Duar on 20/02/2007 11:04:52 Ok, I think my ideas on this matter are basically: 1. Make Titan's subject to Warp Scramblers. Give them a base strength of about +200. This ensures you need a large fleet of multiple warp scramblers to take it down. 2. Remove the remote Doomsday. 2 is kind of optional, but frankly I think if you do 1 you need to do 2 since then people will just stop warping them into combat (though they only do it now because they're virtually invulnerable - eventually one will die, but only after it's ridiculously misused). EDIT: The rationale for removing the remote doomsday is also because while it does reward having POS's in a system, it still leads to the same multiple Titan problem where it's impossible to siege a system because you can just fire 2 DD's at once and wipe out a dread support fleet in one shot.
Joan Smith Caldari	Posted - 2007.02.20 11:08:00 - [76] Originally by: Fi T'Zeh Originally by: Vincent R Dear CCP, I have enjoyed your game for a long time. In fact, I don't think I've ever had more fun in a game. Taking part in huge fleet battles is one of those insanely cool moments that just don't exist in any other game. Unfortunately, I think all of this will be going out the window, and soon. The introduction of titans will make all non-capitals almost useless in fleet battles, because you can lose them at a moment's notice with zero chance to fight back. I think titans are a cool concept. The first time I was doomsdayed, my heart started racing. I had never experienced something like that in any game before, getting physically affected by a virtual explosion. However, after this happens again and again and again, it quickly loses its charm. I can think of nothing that is less fun than losing something expensive without any sort of fighting chance. I don't mind losing ships to fleet battles, even if my side is horribly outnumbered. At least there is a fight, and you can talk tactics afterwards, what could we have done to increase our effectiveness, etc. When getting doomsdayed, all you get is angry and frustrated. Someone pushed a button, boom, your entire fleet is gone. Zero skill involved, no fight, no fun. I've lost more ships to doomsdays than battles these last weeks. One titan is bad enough, but imagine what happens when one alliance builds multiple titans, like we're already starting to see with D2 and BoB. Alliance warfare will be changed forever, and any alliance without a huge capital fleet will be run over. The old powers will be even more entrenched. Multiple titans is a so horribly broken concept. Summary: The doomsday devices are a horrible addition to the game, because they take away all meaning of non-capital ships. They bring nothing to the game except frustration, anger and a feeling of hopelessness. They make it impossible for newbies to put up any kind of a fight against larger powers. Please, please, please CCP do something about them before too many of them come into play and it becomes impossible to reverse the damage. Been DDD'd recently Contrary to popular beleif there are several ways to avoid death by DDD. 1) A BS Can tank it, provided you know which one it is your enemy has. 2) See cyno, run cyno - you usually have about 15 seconds to leave between it being fired and you dying. Be aligned. If you aren't aligned in a fleet you deserve to die anyway. Infact, a frigate or cruiser should be able to escape even if they aren't aligned. 3) Don't jump a fleet of t1 ships into a bubble camp when it's known the enemy has a Titan. yes what he said, silly goons whining again
The Slayer Caldari The Black Rabbits Fatal Persuasion	Posted - 2007.02.20 11:23:00 - [77] Remote DDD needs a huge delay to activate, something like 30 - 60 seconds after the cyno being lit. Gives fleets time to warp out if not bubbled, gives dictors and intys time to get to the cyno generator and pop him before the DDD goes off.
The Fates Perkone	Posted - 2007.02.20 11:44:00 - [78] Edited by: The Fates on 20/02/2007 11:42:21 The doomsday ability should be limited to once per day per character to be reset at downtime, imo. Similar to the time based limitation on orbital strikes in a different game for those of you familiar with them, but with a much longer timer since its obvious they are well abused on a 3 to 4 hour timer... My 2 isk. Originally by: Napoleon Bonaparte Alexander, Caesar, Charlemagne, and myself founded empires; but upon what did we rest the creations of our genius? Upon force.
Kerfira	Posted - 2007.02.20 14:00:00 - [79] Actually, I don't think Titans are particularly overpowered.... Think about it! In general, you'll expect that a ship costing X million ISK is able to destroy on average ships worth X million ISK before being destroyed itself. Player skill & skills may shift this and of.c. some ships are better than others, but on average across all ships I think it's a reasonable approximation. Consider the Titans... Each cost the same as 600(!) tier-2 battleships (fittings and BPO's excluded). 6 Titans (afaik) have been produced, with 2 of them destroyed. How much tonnage have they killed? They sure as hell haven't destroyed 1200 battleships worth (afaik)!! There is also one very easy counter against a Titan. BE SOMEWHERE ELSE! Adapt! If a Titan is making you afraid of attacking a system (this is IMHO its biggest weapon, far bigger than the DD itself), attack somewhere else. True, it hinders your access to your intended target, but the owners of the Titan poured 60B worth if ISK (not even talking about the BPO's), lots of training time and loads of effort into it, so they should get a decent return on that. This is what I think they're getting. A Titan is by no means an I-Win button, but it IS a very powerful weapon. Another reason its not overpowered is that everyone can build it. There's nothing hindering your alliance from building one and get the same benefits..... General advice: Stop whining!
Valrandir Gallente Shiva Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2007.02.20 15:31:00 - [80] no -------------------------------- This has surpassed the Yarrdware specification and has been dubbed Uberware
Agent Li Galactic Defence Consortium	Posted - 2007.02.20 15:46:00 - [81] I think that every noob should be given an Ibis that can carry only a superweapon. After the noobs trash most of Empire space and 0.0 space, then get rid of the superweapons, and we all start over with our thrashed stuff.
Perversonality Perverse Inc.	Posted - 2007.02.20 15:57:00 - [82] I dont actually have a specific problem with DD's - I do, however, question whether or not Titans should be in-game at all... No doubt they are sexy looking beasts, and ofc I would love to have one someday. I've not been involved in any battles with them yet, and the way I play the game means I am not likely to any time soon. My opinion is based on the Battle Reports I read virtually every day in the Corp / Alliance forums, all of which seem to feature the words "Lag" "Node Crash" and "Exploit" more than any other. There has been quite a lot of talk lately about fleets fielding "too many ships for the nodes to handle", causing lag and/or node crashes. The word "Exploit" has even been banded about - Apparently its cheating to bring a fleet of 400 BS's to take on a Titan because it upsets the servers. Exploit or otherwise, you'll quite often hear about people dying to DD's because the lag was so bad that they were unable to warp away. So is anyone else thinking that this game shouldn't feature things like Titans which can ONLY die in open play by the opponent fielding "too many" ships? The counter argument might be "field your own capital fleet / Titan / whatever" - But why? Are you really suggestion that the VAST majority of players who dont have the SP's or ISK to field those kind of ships should be utterly excluded from this part of the game? Or maybe you think that all the n00bs with only 20million SP's should stay in Empire and mine Veldspar all day? Well, if thats the case, then remove all stargates from 0.0, and make it only accessible via cynos. Then it can be the big Capital party for all the rich veterans that some people seem to think it should be. That should reduce the load a little. Otherwise, what we are basically saying is that we expect the rest of the subscribed EVE population to voluntarily keep their BS's, HACs, CS's etc. out of the way for the sake of the servers. Nonsense. Titans, and the epic scale battles they encourage should not have been introduced until the servers were capable of sustaining them. IMHO, ofc - - Its Nothing Perversonal - -
Wild Rho Amarr Sharks With Frickin' Laser Beams	Posted - 2007.02.20 15:59:00 - [83] I'd like to see a Cyno supression module that can only be put on carriers and motherships. When active this module prevents cyno fields from being generated on the same grid as the ship running it. However the ship with this module cannot jump or warp while it's active. (Any already active cynos in that grid are unaffected when the module is activated. Other ships can warp or jump however, only the ship using the module is stuck). What this does is help encourage use of carriers and motherships on the front lines in important battles by forcing the titan to the front lines if it wants to use it's DD. The only other option is for the enemy fleet to attempt to take out whatever ships are running the suppression modules first (a feat that would require other capitals) and so add a new level of tactics to combat. Note: I can't take all the credit for this idea, it was another poster in the features and ideas section that suggested a cyno suppressor, I've just chosen to expand upon that idea. I have the body of a supermodel. I just can't remember where I left it.
Zautechre Minmatar Republic University	Posted - 2007.02.20 16:04:00 - [84] How about giving the superweapon a defined radius? The concept of hitting everything in "the grid" is sketchy as there is no way for mere mortal players to know what the boundaries of the grid are.
Shadowsword COLSUP Tau Ceti Federation	Posted - 2007.02.20 16:13:00 - [85] A big, bad nuke might be nice and all in a strategy game, but unless it's use remains really exceptional (like, once a month), it has no place in a game where each single unit is a player. ------------------------------------------ Every ship has a base 60-70% resist against the primary damage type of the race that is the least able to vary it's damage types.
Sorja E X O D U S Imperial Republic Of the North	Posted - 2007.02.20 16:23:00 - [86] Titans are fine. Titans + lag are not fine. Remote doomsday is not fine. It is especially lag that makes Titans unbalanced. People dieing without getting any chance at all to do anything is absurd and doesn't belong to a supposedly PvP game. EVE was WAY more fun before POSes and capital ships. ____________________ A gentleman is someone who can play the bagpipe, but who does not.
umop 3pisdn Minmatar Republic Military School	Posted - 2007.02.20 16:23:00 - [87] Originally by: Siri Blue Titans and Doomsday Devices should be SOLELY NPC weapons of choice, preferably in the hands of very able and talented Aurora agents playing Empire agents. You NEVER EVER EVER put the best, biggest and world wrecking weapons into the hands of the players! I really thought the guys at White Wolf would have hammered that into CCP's heads by now And from the storyline point of view...why the bloody frakking hell would the 4 Empires put weapons capable of destroying whole fleets and planets into the hand of uncontrollable barbarians like most of the 0.0 alliances are composed of!?!?!?!?!?!????!?!?! RABBLERABBLERABBLE Have you left highsec recently... or ever? Aurora = players, players who have committed a large number of "suspicious" acts over the years. Titans are not world wrecking.. they only have 3 cap ship weapons with nice bonus's... the DD is pretty nasty but can be tanked or escaped... Titans do however need a nerf in my opinion... the cost to fire the DD is very low if even 1 battleship is caught in the blast you can consider it a win.... Refire rate of 1 hour is stupid, particularly when multiple titans come into effect.... DO NOT let it cloak ffs... that is the worst thing... Bombing through a cyno.. stupid stupid stupid. If you wanna DD something have the balls to warp to it, Titans will be as *** as 99.8% of carrier pilots as soon as someone kills one that is online... the rest will never leave a pos again. nerf it after it fires the DD... even if it can fire hourly, dont just let it warp off/cloak/jump out, im fine with it warping in and firing the weapon straight away... but it shouldnt be going anywhere after that... And make it stoppable.... as long as you can tackle it, its fine, but im wondering how you keep a permanent bubble on the thing with dictors without cancelling out your old bubbles. Its not too bad now, its a terrifying psychological weapon and thats why bod love it so... and it is effective if you let it be.. makes sieging anything a pain in the ass. Titans arent a problem now... sucks to be on the receiving end but whatever... but when the large alliances start getting 4 or 5 of these things each... eve is ****.
Dixon Caldari Thundercats RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2007.02.20 16:33:00 - [88] Originally by: Sorja EVE was WAY more fun before POSes and capital ships. Teh truth! _______________ t20 = Gavrilo Princip of EvE
Fenderson OLE Mining Corp Miners With Attitude	Posted - 2007.02.20 16:39:00 - [89] DDDs are fine, but titans need to be more vulnerable when using them. remove remote DDD by cyno, and make it possible in some way to tackle a titan. i would also like to see titans truly forced to stay ingame at all times. we need a POS module that can dock capital ships, and force titan pilots to store them there when not ingame. if the POS is put into re-enforced mode, the titan will be locked inside the POS just like ships in a fitting array. if the POS goes down, so does the titan. titans that log off should not disappear in space. uber toys are great, but uber invincible toys are just plain unbalanced and broken. got new corp, need new sig. mail me ingame.
Bippa	Posted - 2007.02.22 05:30:00 - [90] Edited by: Bippa on 22/02/2007 05:27:21
Jerick Ludhowe Internet Tough Guys Inc.	Posted - 2007.02.22 05:59:00 - [91] Originally by: Sorja EVE was WAY more fun before POSes and capital ships. The sad but unquestionable truth I'm going to go /wrists. Heinrich Klaus: "You need to get a leet signature you****got"
Nim9i5	Posted - 2007.03.15 04:31:00 - [92] just make titan cost 5 times the current mineral cost :P
Xendie Celestial Apocalypse Insurgency	Posted - 2007.03.15 04:35:00 - [93] Originally by: James Duar Get rid of the remote doomsday. You want to use your superweapon, then you have to put it in harms way. best idea so far Originally by: "darth solo" bad men came, bad men didnt go home, bad men left containers.
zibelthurdos Archron Dusyfe Industries Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2007.03.15 04:50:00 - [94] how bout this, instead of an AOE weapon, give the titan 8 super lasers, capable of basically /heal 0 on anything smaller than a dread but with a 20 second ROF. that way the titan would actually need to see combat. the alliance owning the titan could bring in support ships to rep the titan while it deals its anti blob damage. ------------------------------ If you ain't dyin, you ain't tryin.
Xtro 2 Caldari Pre-nerfed Tactics	Posted - 2007.03.15 04:51:00 - [95] Edited by: Xtro 2 on 15/03/2007 04:48:30 isnt this what recon scouts are for, or a more simple solution, checking the map for cyno activity near your massive fleet. Or baiting the doomsday with a small disposable minifleet, im sure theres plenty of options, its all just down to patience rather then the a-typical, "lets see what happens when all our ships gate together towards the enemy, well be invincible". besides i thought every alliance/large corp had spies in every other alliance/big corp for intel/movement details. Xtro 2 - Tactically Insane Tradesman. Insanity, or madness, is a semi-permanent, severe mental disorder.
Veneth	Posted - 2007.03.15 05:19:00 - [96] Edited by: Veneth on 15/03/2007 05:17:54 Originally by: Kryss Darkdust Originally by: Vincent R Dear CCP, One titan is bad enough, but imagine what happens when one alliance builds multiple titans, like we're already starting to see with D2 and BoB. Alliance warfare will be changed forever, and any alliance without a huge capital fleet will be run over. The old powers will be even more entrenched. Multiple titans is a so horribly broken concept. . I recall reading artciles and interviews done by CCP about exactly what your talking about. I can't be bothered to pull the exact quote but it went something along the lines that CCP wants the Titan and the super power alliances to effectivly take over the game and create entire regions of space that belong and are governed by players. They want the world to be expansive and epic and they are not concerened about the fairness or balance of that aspect because it isn't as you put it about the fleet battles. Its about the playing the game on a galactic map in which players via for power over millions of light years of space. This is the dream it seems of CCP, to let the world unfold as it will without interference. You have to keep in mind that these huge alliances like Bob and D2, they are the result of dedication of the players, organization of their corps and efforts on their parts. You can't simply decide, its not balanced and take it away, else no one would ever bother with it again and the gain would effectivly be a dismel, repetative version of games like WOW in which winning a battle means nothing. Titans are the weapon of the mass alliances and anyone who wants to compete on such a level has to get equally organized as some of these super groups have done. There is nothing unbalanced about it and the Titans are an awsome extension of CCP's dream of having the players, not NPC's rule the gameworld. IF what you say is true than I believe Eve won't last much longer, the people outside these mega allainces will simply up and leave when they get bowled over and crushed, and any allaince later wanting to compete against said allainces will never stand a chance as they'll never get the chance to build titans of their own. giving players TOTAL control of a game is a very risky move and I'm not sure CCP has totaly thought out the fallout of say 3 or 4 allainces owning all of 0.0 with such weapons I've said it once and I'll say it again, a weapon like a DDD sounds really cool and would work well if eve was something like WoW where dying just means you just respawn in a few seconds, but in a game like this where dying means a lot, I just don't see it ever working out. I beta tested one other game with conquerable space called mechwarrior 3025, I rember 3 GAME map resets because one faction would just utterally pound the crap out of another and players would just stop playing.. needless to say that game never made it out of beta
Qe'Rasha	Posted - 2007.03.15 06:08:00 - [97] personally i dont think it does enough damage if it can be tanked by a HAC. should be a fleet crippler. however, "immune to all forms of EW" is absolutely ******* retarded. no ship should be "immune". meep meep.
Karyuudo Tydraad Caldari Whiskey Pete's Drycleaning Services	Posted - 2007.03.15 06:32:00 - [98] Is a Doomsday device overpowered currently? Debatable. They're definitely supposed to be the end-all to fleet combat, which currently is the only way to get anything done in wars, but at this point it time their effect is such that they really don't impact gameplay enough to warrant a change for this reason alone. When the major alliances have mini-titan fleets, and warfare still is fleet-centric, that's where we run into a problem. We don't need the titan to become any weaker, we need less focus on solving problems with blobs. Which really means a change in game mechanics focusing on reviving small group combat. Your amazing doomsday fleet of titans may be unkillable, but they're largely a show piece when combat is focused on small squad of 20 ships. So you can pop one squad every hour, it's not like you're shaping the course of galactic events anymore. The titan issue should, and I believe will, be addressed not by nerfing the class itself, but by placing less emphasis on its role.
Crewman Jenkins	Posted - 2007.03.15 06:32:00 - [99] Does the DD affect take time to get to the outer reaches of the solar systems? If not, how come a DD is faster than light? Maybe they did a tech chronicle on it...ill go check
Krulla Minmatar Queens of the Stone Age Anarchy Empire	Posted - 2007.03.15 14:43:00 - [100] The problem with DDs and titans are two; They are unkillable unless the pilot makes a mistake and logs off badly. And; I could deal with them being unkillable if there was a way to harm a alliance other than killing POS; this requires large blobs. Titans nullify those. If there was a way to kill titans, and, there was a way to harm a big alliance without using blobs using guerilla strikes of small gangs to take out they're supply routes, destroy individual pos modules, whatever, they'd be fine. They'd be the ultimate projection of power, but they wouldn't make a alliance invincible. ------------------------- Sigs are for noobs.
SwitchBl4d3 Infinitus Odium	Posted - 2007.03.15 15:59:00 - [101] the only homo thing about titans is that they remote detonate get the bollox to go into battle other than that theyve provn to be useless pile of **isksinks Originally by:** Stavros BUNGLE IN JUNGLE? J tHX OMG YEAH CHICKEN WINGS K? LOLLER SKATESWIHT LUBE K? MIUOINKEYT!!!
Capt Rob Minmatar Black Omega Security GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.03.15 16:02:00 - [102] Originally by: Xendie Originally by: James Duar Get rid of the remote doomsday. You want to use your superweapon, then you have to put it in harms way. best idea so far Totally agree, but i can see that if this happens titans as they are atm might be killed rather easily with the numbers of dread fleets around, so id support a rather large bonus to their tanking abilities.
El Yatta Mercenary Forces Exquisite Malevolence	Posted - 2007.03.15 16:36:00 - [103] Originally by: Fi T'Zeh Contrary to popular beleif there are several ways to avoid death by DDD. 1) A BS Can tank it, provided you know which one it is your enemy has. 2) See cyno, run cyno - you usually have about 15 seconds to leave between it being fired and you dying. Be aligned. If you aren't aligned in a fleet you deserve to die anyway. Infact, a frigate or cruiser should be able to escape even if they aren't aligned. 3) Don't jump a fleet of t1 ships into a bubble camp when it's known the enemy has a Titan. I'm not going to have a go at you because of your alliance, but dont you see the MASSIVE flaw in your arguments? 3) Boils down to, not fighting. 2) Boils down to, stopping fighting. If someone is trying to blow up some caps to save their POS, or shoot at your fleet or station, they HAVE to stop doing this to warp out - and in the case of the caps, they cant pick up where they left off afterwards because the dreads will be back up to full HP and good cap. What part of "not fighting" is fun? Dont get me wrong, having a terror weapon so awesome that your enemy is petrified of fighting you sounds COOL... but then you realise that fighting is cool, and actually PLAYING the game is fun, and now you cant do that. Any neither can your opponent. Essentially, two gangs = fun, 2 gangs + 1 titan in system = fun taken away for both sides, 2 gangs + 2 titans = log off. As for no 1), it works great, if there is only ONE titan. But thats not the case now, and it wont ever be again. I believe only one ship, the Rokh, can be useful in a full-ranged fleet fitting and still tank two titans, providing they are the same damage type (EXP). I beleive with t2 rigs, HP skills to 5, and sacrificing 1 of 3 MFS to fit DCU, 1600 and an EM armorhardener it can tank 2 EM ones (not 100% on this) and if they are fired in the "wrong" order, one EM and one EXP. You might need a leviathan of your own in gang to tank two of different damage types anyway. This is only one ship, any other fleet-useful non-capital WILL die to two DDs, and you and your allies have access to 3+, and your enemies to 2+. Even in the rather ludicrous example of a maxed-out rigged rokh with a leviathan in gang, surviving two DDs, before the next major content patch plenty of people will be able to field 3, 4, 5 titans at once. Your "counter" 1) is useless. So: if your enemy has 2+ titans, do not fight them. Where is the fun in that? One of your two rotating signatures exceeds the maximum allowed filesize of 24000 bytes - Devil ([email protected])
Almarez	Posted - 2007.03.15 16:50:00 - [104] Although I agree that Titans are rough when your enemy has them, they are the ultimate anti-blob weapon, and I think I really like that. I was part of Tribal Souls alliance that got blob swept away by Ascendent Frontier (who were later destroyed ala-BOB) and had we had a Titan that would not have happened. What Tribal Souls had was massive production power but we lacked pvp pilots and were basically overrun, which in my opinion is way worse than a titan because you can't even undock when there are 200+ hostiles in your system. In addition, non-cap ships will have very important roles when CCP introduces tactical warfare, as in disabling of an outposts subsystems and things like that. So until then, just be more mindful of cyno fields. I do think though, that Titan's should be able to be warp scrambled. Maybe an inherent +50 strength to warp strength but I don't like the fact that the pilot has to be a tard or spy games need to be played to take one down. They should definitely not be invincible. If this were done then people wouldn't be so eager to build them because they know they can be lost.
Tearavygh Quillam Caldari mega mining corporation Astral Wolves	Posted - 2007.03.15 17:08:00 - [105] Originally by: Apollo Kreed Originally by: NebulousBlur Edited by: NebulousBlur on 19/02/2007 16:39:08 I agree with removing the fire through a cyno ability. Baring that, make a doomsday that is fired through a cyno do 50% less damage. I like that it can fire through a cyno, gives it some flavor. That said I agree that the damage fired through cynos should be reduced. Also the cap idea makes sense as well. It takes an hour for the weapon itself to be capable of firing once more... that much energy would have to play hell on a ships cap, even a ship as impressive as a titan. So the weapon eats enough cap that the titan itself is vulnerable after using it (can't jump out basically) and the weapon does less damage when used from safe areas. Something as powerful as a DDD should come with risk vs. reward. Don't want to risk the titan, you don't do as much damage. Yep, I'd say: - cyno remote detonation 25% damage - more than 250km detonation 33% damage - between 100km and 250km detonation 75% to 33% damage - between 75km and 100km detonation 100% to 75% damage - below 75km 100% damage - make it stay still for 1 minute after detonation, no warp, no jump, cap doesn't matter.
Alpine 69 Slacker Industries Exuro Mortis	Posted - 2007.03.15 17:27:00 - [106] doomsdays are fine as they are, if you see a cyno just rtfa
Asymptotic	Posted - 2007.03.15 17:55:00 - [107] Disclaimer: I'm not far enough in the game to dip my feet into PvP, so my comments may not be entirely valid. But an outside perspective may still prove useful, no? To the people complaining about DDD + lag = I-win button, ask yourself this. Where is the lag coming from? If it's because of your adherence to blob tactics, then you DESERVE to get owned. That was the point of the DDD to begin with. I imagine that the countdown itself to the DDD does not generate lag, so you should have been in battle long enough to estimate how bad the lag is and how much time you'd need to get away. If you want to risk enduring lag to help out your fleet, then don't complain when a DDD owns your face. If you're complaining about Titans camping your entry gate and greeting you with a DDD, then either split your forces up and come in from other directions (although I admit that this may not be possible if the other directions are within enemy territory), find a way to keep the enemy from knowing of your invasion schedule, or try and juke the enemy out by not warping everything in at once. However. If the lag is caused by the Titan-carrying force blobbing up, then there really isn't anything you can do about that, in which case you probably shouldn't attack them to begin with. I can see alliances taking advantage of this - hopefully CCP will come up with a solution to this other than "just get a titan yourselves lol". And if alliances manage to get their hands on multiple titans? Even though it seems really unfair, if the players in that alliance are that dedicated, then they deserve to reap the fruits of their labor. Punishing hard work is a big no-no if you want to keep your player base. Unfair? Sure. C'est la vie.
Asymptotic	Posted - 2007.03.15 17:59:00 - [108] Some food for thought: how about ditching the DDD and giving the Titans weapons similar to the ones the capital ships in Freespace 2 had? Flak and anti-ship beams
Smelt Down	Posted - 2007.03.15 18:22:00 - [109] Edited by: Smelt Down on 15/03/2007 18:22:33 Edited by: Smelt Down on 15/03/2007 18:18:44 Here is a post I made in general, but it probably fits here better, the problem with titans, and a possible solution: What happens in the future when one alliance/coalition has more than 5 active titans? I predict it will only be a few months at the most. It makes anything less than a capital ship useless, since they can effectively doomsday at any time, it is not tankable if you don't know what resist to use or they use more than one doomday, and with lag it is not possible to warp out in time in many circumstances. With them being immune to electronic warfare and having officer smartbombs to kill any interdictor bubbles and officer cap rechargers to regen insane amounts of cap, it is literally impossible to kill them using "ingame" circumstances, they can and have only been killed by using out of game mechanics (mainly catching them as they log off). In a year when there are 30 titans, who will still be playing, if the only ships that can do anything other than sit in a POS are capital ships. My solution: Make the titan a fleet battle juggernaut type ship. Give it + 500% to tracking per level or whatever missiles use, +5% boost/repair amount, a range bonus, BS level scan resolution ect, give it maybe 10x the hp of a dread, things along that line. Leave it immune to to jammers, tracking and sensor disruptors, but not warp disruptors/webs, and give it an innate +8 or so WCS thing like blockade runners have. This way it is still as deadly as it was with doomsday, but it needs to be in the middle of a fleet battle, instead of sitting at a POS. With 500% tracking it would have no problem hitting ships, but instead of wiping them all out instantly it would just kill stuff one or two at a time very quickly, which also helps mitigate the advantage doomsday has for laggy fights. With enough stuff at a gate and a titan, it is easy to blast a whole fleet before they have even loaded the grid, leaving no time to warp out of bubbles or even fire a shot back in defense. Swatting battleships out of the sky faster than a muninn kills a frigate while shrugging off damage is how I envision the best ship in the game, not something that sits around in a pos hiding 99% of the time. Obviously the numbers or bonuses are not balanced, I just made them up as a general idea. Other possible solutions are a capital ship interdiction module that prevent both cyno jumps and in system jumps, as well as doing something with DD (either weakening or lengthening the time it takes to fire or removing it it completely). Or maybe just a capital ship module that prevents DD for a set amount of time on the grid when fired, maybe 10 minutes, with a 1 hour cooldown. For motherships the only thing that needs to be changed is the immune to warp disruption, give them an innate +8 wcs thing like mentioned for the titan. Short version: Make titans good through guns, not a button press from a POS. Never give a ship warp disruption immunity, just give them innate WCS like blockade runners have. And to people saying that titans counter blobs: A) The people with titans blob just as much as anyone else, so then you just get a blob with titans that cannot be countered. B) If titans counter blobs what counters titans? A titan can just warp away from capital ships, and they all have officer smart bombs so a dictor bubble doesn't work.

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