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Mortania Minmatar Carbide Industries Apocalyptica.	Posted - 2007.03.06 06:21:00 - [121] Originally by: Quilan Ziller Originally by: Gamesguy A quick browse through your corporation's website(which you are the CEO of) reveals the following: Purchaseable T2 Items -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1MN Afterburner II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Energized Magnetic Membrane II Energized Thermic Membrane II Explosion Dampening Amplifier II Flycatcher Focused Medium Pulse Laser II Havoc Fury Heavy Missile II Heat Dissipation Amplifier II Magnetic Plating II Medium EMP Smartbomb II Medium Shield Booster II Miner II Modulated Deep Core Strip Miner II Reactive Plating II Reflective Plating II Scourge Precision Heavy Missile II Signal Amplifier II Small Armor Repairer II Small Capacitor Booster II Small EMP Smartbomb II Small Energy Transfer Array II Small Shield Extender II Try offering those next time, I even bolded them for you. Bye now. Priceless. Simply priceless. Now everything falls into place - like in the game of Tetris. It is just like Big Oil propaganda IRL To the OP: don't bother posting to this thread anymore. Gamesguy here has won this thread fair and square I never tried to hide, nor claimed I didn't own any better BPOs. I think, quite the contrary, I said that I've run many money making BPOs. Of COURSE, I have a vested interest in BPOs remaining in the game. As a corp we have worked hard and invested 10s of billions in them. I suspect if people where advocating that all titans be removed without so much as a how do you do, that a corp that had 3 or 4 of them would be concerned with that decision. For posterity, we're currently operating exactly 1 of our t2 bpos right now. The logistics and profit are such that we're not currently bothering. EANM, if you hadn't guessed. Flycatcher makes about 125M profit a week, I make more selling BPCs. MDCSM II doesn't sell for anything. Can't come close to maxing out. In the last week in The Forge only 70 sold. That would be one person selling a week's run. There are 20 people competing for your business, or more. profit is about 50M. Ship sales far outweigh this. SAR II is again about 100M or so a week. T1 ship sales well outstrip this. More free advice to the ignorant: Cap ship sales: Sell a freighter every other week, profit: 125M a week. Sell a carrier every other week, profit: 200M+ a week. Mineral sales: Buy low, sell high, profit: $$$ more than you can possibly imagine. T2 sales are indeed a portion of our industry, but it isn't Ishtar money, it isn't Hulk money. Carbide represents, I suspect, the majority of T2 BPO holders out there. People making some money with T2 BPOs, but only a portion of their income, and they've bought all nearly all of the important ones. We normally make more out of T1 and other sales than T2 ever is. T1 that everyone has access to. T1 that is purchaseable on the market by everyone. So, if ISK is your concern, there are hundreds of ways to make 100s of Millions a week. engage in them, with vigor, focus and purpose. If you believe T2 is ride to freedom, then invest your earnings in a T2 BPO, like we have, and engage in that activity. I suspect that 9 out of the 10 people who've posted to burn all T2 BPOs haven't even begun to try invention yet, their supposed savior. Stop being lazy. Go earn your future. PS: I did say if this one went well, I'd consider doing more valuable give aways. Maybe one of the 8 people who've sent me an eve mail might find an offer for a free* flycatcher BPC in the future. ---
Brixer Dai Dai Hai	Posted - 2007.03.06 06:41:00 - [122] What? You sit on a lot of BPOs and doesn't even bother if they make 100m a week or less? Can I borrow you SAR II please? I'm using A LOT of these on tacklers. Or are someone else making SAR IIs and you get a small fee for NOT producing them, thereby keeping the other producer happy ? CCP should make 'melted T2 BPOs' imo.. If you don't produce anything from a T2 BPO in the duration of 2 months it become a melted one and reseeded.
Shameless Avenger	Posted - 2007.03.06 06:49:00 - [123] Look, look carefully... Originally by: Mortania ...I said that I've run many money making BPOs. but then... look again... Originally by: Mortania As a corp we have worked hard and invested 10s of billions in them. Don't you see the contradiction? OP: Once you run a money making BPO, the 'hard work' is over.
Mortania Minmatar Carbide Industries Apocalyptica.	Posted - 2007.03.06 06:52:00 - [124] Originally by: Shameless Avenger Look, look carefully... Originally by: Mortania ...I said that I've run many money making BPOs. but then... look again... Originally by: Mortania As a corp we have worked hard and invested 10s of billions in them. Don't you see the contradiction? OP: Once you run a money making BPO, the 'hard work' is over. Yeah, I'm sure you believe as such. You can make more money with the same investement and effort as manufacturing t1 BPOs. Or did you miss that in my post. Try again. ---
Mortania Minmatar Carbide Industries Apocalyptica.	Posted - 2007.03.06 07:17:00 - [125] Originally by: Brixer What? You sit on a lot of BPOs and doesn't even bother if they make 100m a week or less? Can I borrow you SAR II please? I'm using A LOT of these on tacklers. Or are someone else making SAR IIs and you get a small fee for NOT producing them, thereby keeping the other producer happy ? CCP should make 'melted T2 BPOs' imo.. If you don't produce anything from a T2 BPO in the duration of 2 months it become a melted one and reseeded. I should have clarified. We're not operating them for profit, just personal use. ---
Gamesguy Amarr E X O D U S Imperial Republic Of the North	Posted - 2007.03.06 07:19:00 - [126] Originally by: Mortania Yeah, I'm sure you believe as such. You can make more money with the same investement and effort as manufacturing t1 BPOs. Or did you miss that in my post. Try again. Thats bull****, the profit margin on T1 modules is nonexistent, and the profit margin on T1 ships is 5-10% at the most, as competition is cutthroat. You'd have to sell capital ships to get any decent profit margin(something like 30% on a carrier/dread IIRC), but the problem is you have to research the BPO for a long ass time to get good ME and even then you cant build/sell them very fast. I'd like to see you back up that statement.
Gamesguy Amarr E X O D U S Imperial Republic Of the North	Posted - 2007.03.06 07:20:00 - [127] Originally by: Mortania I should have clarified. We're not operating them for profit, just personal use. You're lying, your entire corp is a manufacturing corp devoted to building T2 modules, you have a list of them for sale at your website. Why would you care if ccp turned your bpo into a high run bpc if you're only using them for "personal use"? Not like you're gonna use up 1k EANM II bpcs anytime soon.
Gamesguy Amarr E X O D U S Imperial Republic Of the North	Posted - 2007.03.06 07:24:00 - [128] Originally by: Mortania For posterity, we're currently operating exactly 1 of our t2 bpos right now. The logistics and profit are such that we're not currently bothering. EANM, if you hadn't guessed. Flycatcher makes about 125M profit a week, I make more selling BPCs. MDCSM II doesn't sell for anything. Can't come close to maxing out. In the last week in The Forge only 70 sold. That would be one person selling a week's run. There are 20 people competing for your business, or more. profit is about 50M. Ship sales far outweigh this. SAR II is again about 100M or so a week. Freighter service well outstrips this. More free advice to the ignorant: Cap ship sales: Sell a freighter every other week, profit: 125M a week. Sell a carrier every other week, profit: 200M+ a week. Mineral sales: Buy low, sell high, profit: $$$ more than you can possibly imagine. Then you wouldnt mind giving me your EANM BPO wouldnt you? Stop lying, the EANM BPO alone makes you so much more money than the rest its not even funny.
Mortania Minmatar Carbide Industries Apocalyptica.	Posted - 2007.03.06 07:30:00 - [129] Originally by: Gamesguy Originally by: Mortania I should have clarified. We're not operating them for profit, just personal use. You're lying, your entire corp is a manufacturing corp devoted to building T2 modules, you have a list of them for sale at your website. Why would you care if ccp turned your bpo into a high run bpc if you're only using them for "personal use"? Not like you're gonna use up 1k EANM II bpcs anytime soon. The list isn't even current. Thanks for letting me know I'm lying. I guess I better go put a stop to all of the T2 we're not producing right now. ---
Miranda Duvall Gallente OPM Holdings	Posted - 2007.03.06 07:31:00 - [130] Originally by: Graalum Originally by: Soporo Do the same with a covops cloak or a hulk bpc and we will talk. Invention will gradually increase supply in areas were there is a clear lack of supply and obsene prices, however, T2 production will always but faster, easier, more stable, more efficient, and be able to sell at lower cost. Removing T2 bpo's will lead to higher prices due to diminished supply and unstable component markets. People advocating the removal of T2 BPO's act only out of jealousy and ignorance. I don't own T2 bpo's, but I like to buy it. Thanks. Invention actually is much faster than production off a BPO in the last 48 hours I made 112 i-Stab II's and 126 Nanofiber II's from invention, lets see anyone top that with 1 BPO Isn't it great being a skill collector? Top 20 My Skills

Mortania Minmatar Carbide Industries Apocalyptica.	Posted - 2007.03.06 07:32:00 - [131] Originally by: Gamesguy Originally by: Mortania Yeah, I'm sure you believe as such. You can make more money with the same investement and effort as manufacturing t1 BPOs. Or did you miss that in my post. Try again. Thats bull****, the profit margin on T1 modules is nonexistent, and the profit margin on T1 ships is 5-10% at the most, as competition is cutthroat. You'd have to sell capital ships to get any decent profit margin(something like 30% on a carrier/dread IIRC), but the problem is you have to research the BPO for a long ass time to get good ME and even then you cant build/sell them very fast. I'd like to see you back up that statement. % isn't the only factor that determines profit. units moved as well. I think I outlined several ways for people who don't have t2 bpos to make cash. ---
Gamesguy Amarr E X O D U S Imperial Republic Of the North	Posted - 2007.03.06 07:39:00 - [132] Edited by: Gamesguy on 06/03/2007 07:37:21 Originally by: Mortania % isn't the only factor that determines profit. units moved as well. Please, how many battleships can you produce in a week off a single BPO? 5? 10? Profit margin is only 10-15mil per ship on a good sale, and thats on a tier 2/3 ship. Quote: I think I outlined several ways for people who don't have t2 bpos to make cash. Well no ****, people still make money from t1 manufacturing, people make money mining and ratting too. I'd still like to see you back up the statement that t1 manufacturing is more profitable than your EANM BPO.
Mortania Minmatar Carbide Industries Apocalyptica.	Posted - 2007.03.06 07:48:00 - [133] Originally by: Gamesguy Edited by: Gamesguy on 06/03/2007 07:37:21 Originally by: Mortania % isn't the only factor that determines profit. units moved as well. Please, how many battleships can you produce in a week off a single BPO? 5? 10? Profit margin is only 10-15mil per ship on a good sale, and thats on a tier 2/3 ship. Quote: I think I outlined several ways for people who don't have t2 bpos to make cash. Well no ****, people still make money from t1 manufacturing, people make money mining and ratting too. I'd still like to see you back up the statement that t1 manufacturing is more profitable than your EANM BPO. Each BS BPO runs 20 BPCs in about 12 days. Those BPCs sell for about 2-3M per. That's 40-60M per BS BPO per 12 days. One character can run 11 slots. That's 440-660M per 12 days for one character. Call it 1B+ per month for one character. Scale copying until you make more. QED. Other Non-T2 ways to make bank: Mine 16m3 ores. Rat in low or 0.0 sec. Run l4 missions. Run low or 0.0 sec complexes. Play the market game (hint: buy low, sell high). Need more explanation? ---
Gamesguy Amarr E X O D U S Imperial Republic Of the North	Posted - 2007.03.06 07:55:00 - [134] Edited by: Gamesguy on 06/03/2007 07:51:22 Originally by: Mortania Each BS BPO runs 20 BPCs in about 12 days. Those BPCs sell for about 2-3M per. That's 40-60M per BS BPO per 12 days. One character can run 11 slots. That's 440-660M per 12 days for one character. Call it 1B+ per month for one character. Scale copying until you make more. QED. Bull***, I'd like to see you sell 220 BS BPCs in 12 days, also you're forgetting the massive initial investment involved, you need 20+ billion for the BPOs, then you gotta spend months researching them to good ME/PE, then you can start making a profit, and it'll take nearly two years* those hypothetical BPOs to make back their initial investment. Quote: Other Non-T2 ways to make bank: Mine 16m3 ores. Rat in low or 0.0 sec. Run l4 missions. Run low or 0.0 sec complexes. Play the market game (hint: buy low, sell high). Need more explanation? Ooops, I forgot a very important point: work as a team. Concession accepted, I'd like to see where I said T2 manufacturing is the only way to make money in the game. Still waiting on that proof where T1 manufacturing is more profitable than an EANM II BPO btw.
Mortania Minmatar Carbide Industries Apocalyptica.	Posted - 2007.03.06 07:58:00 - [135] Originally by: Gamesguy Edited by: Gamesguy on 06/03/2007 07:51:22 Originally by: Mortania Each BS BPO runs 20 BPCs in about 12 days. Those BPCs sell for about 2-3M per. That's 40-60M per BS BPO per 12 days. One character can run 11 slots. That's 440-660M per 12 days for one character. Call it 1B+ per month for one character. Scale copying until you make more. QED. Bull***, I'd like to see you sell 220 BS BPCs in 12 days, also you're forgetting the massive initial investment involved, you need 20+ billion for the BPOs, then you gotta spend months researching them to good ME/PE, then you can start making a profit, and it'll take nearly two years* those hypothetical BPOs to make back their initial investment. Quote: Other Non-T2 ways to make bank: Mine 16m3 ores. Rat in low or 0.0 sec. Run l4 missions. Run low or 0.0 sec complexes. Play the market game (hint: buy low, sell high). Need more explanation? Ooops, I forgot a very important point: work as a team. Concession accepted, I'd like to see where I said T2 manufacturing is the only way to make money in the game. Still waiting on that proof where T1 manufacturing is more profitable than an EANM II BPO btw. Already provided. 220 BPCs in a 12 days isn't that hard. Honestly. You can move more than that at just one station if you find the right one. It turns out this corp is well over 3 years old. I'm sorry there isn't a 5 second way to make a trillion isk in the game. Or should we remove all corp assets of corps over 6 months old next? Is being around a long time too much of an advantage as well? ---
Mortania Minmatar Carbide Industries Apocalyptica.	Posted - 2007.03.06 08:01:00 - [136] Originally by: Mortania I'm sorry there isn't a 5 second way to make a trillion isk in the game. Or should we remove all corp assets of corps over 6 months old next? Is being around a long time too much of an advantage as well? I just realized I was wrong here. There is. It's called GTC for ISK. For the same you'd spend on one character for 3 years you can buy many billions. There's your catchup all in one place, safe, convenient and sanctioned by CCP. Now even age of your character isn't a limitation anymore. ---
Gamesguy Amarr E X O D U S Imperial Republic Of the North	Posted - 2007.03.06 08:06:00 - [137] Originally by: Mortania Already provided. 220 BPCs in a 12 days isn't that hard. Honestly. You can move more than that at just one station if you find the right one. two years to make back the isks on the original BPOs by selling BPC copies, try again. Quote: It turns out this corp is well over 3 years old. I'm sorry there isn't a 5 second way to make a trillion isk in the game. Or should we remove all corp assets of corps over 6 months old next? Is being around a long time too much of an advantage as well? Dont be stupid, you act like this hasnt happened before, remember the whine when ccp decided to make all copied BPCs(which used to give infinite runs) to limited runs(albeit a high number).
Gamesguy Amarr E X O D U S Imperial Republic Of the North	Posted - 2007.03.06 08:07:00 - [138] Originally by: Mortania Originally by: Mortania I'm sorry there isn't a 5 second way to make a trillion isk in the game. Or should we remove all corp assets of corps over 6 months old next? Is being around a long time too much of an advantage as well? I just realized I was wrong here. There is. It's called GTC for ISK. For the same you'd spend on one character for 3 years you can buy many billions. There's your catchup all in one place, safe, convenient and sanctioned by CCP. Now even age of your character isn't a limitation anymore. GTCs are not T1 manufacturing. Quit strawmaning, I can make more than your T2 BPOs if I had access to a 10/10 plex all to myself and ran it along with my 5 alts everytime the key spawns, how likely is that to happen?
Mortania Minmatar Carbide Industries Apocalyptica.	Posted - 2007.03.06 08:12:00 - [139] Originally by: Gamesguy Originally by: Mortania Already provided. 220 BPCs in a 12 days isn't that hard. Honestly. You can move more than that at just one station if you find the right one. two years to make back the isks on the original BPOs by selling BPC copies, try again. You think there aren't scads of T2 BPOs with payoffs this long? And two years ago, BPCs used to sell for more. I like the rolling eyes guy, though. Originally by: Gamesguy Originally by: Mortania It turns out this corp is well over 3 years old. I'm sorry there isn't a 5 second way to make a trillion isk in the game. Or should we remove all corp assets of corps over 6 months old next? Is being around a long time too much of an advantage as well? Dont be stupid, you act like this hasnt happened before, remember the whine when ccp decided to make all copied BPCs(which used to give infinite runs) to limited runs(albeit a high number). AH, Thank you! Yes, I DO remember that. And do you remember what CCP did to the infinite run BPCs? Nothing. And they were right to do it back then and they are right to not destroy T2 BPOs now. As I've mentioned many times, supply is the issue. There is plenty of T2 supply to be had that everyone can have a piece of the pie and profit, without removing anything. ---
Gamesguy Amarr E X O D U S Imperial Republic Of the North	Posted - 2007.03.06 08:16:00 - [140] Originally by: Mortania You think there aren't scads of T2 BPOs with payoffs this long? And two years ago, BPCs used to sell for more. I like the rolling eyes guy, though. You bought the T1 BPO from an NPC(or from a player ultimately someone paid for it), the T2 BPO just appeared in your hanger through acts of magic, its called a lottery, except this particular lottery determines half the eve economy. Originally by: Gamesguy AH, Thank you! Yes, I DO remember that. And do you remember what CCP did to the infinite run BPCs? Nothing. They got turned into limited run BPCs, what are you smoking? Quote: And they were right to do it back then and they are right to not destroy T2 BPOs now. As I've mentioned many times, supply is the issue. There is plenty of T2 supply to be had that everyone can have a piece of the pie and profit, without removing anything. Then let us buy T2 bpos from the NPCs for a fixed price, a few billion for a hac BPO sounds fair.

Mortania Minmatar Carbide Industries Apocalyptica.	Posted - 2007.03.06 08:30:00 - [141] Originally by: Gamesguy They got turned into limited run BPCs, what are you smoking? Incorrect. All future BPCs were limited. The unlimited ones remained. Hell, on my old toon I was running off of one for at least a year after the switch. And half the economy?!??! Where the heck do you get that from? ---
Joebarchuck	Posted - 2007.03.06 08:33:00 - [142] Cool
Mortania Minmatar Carbide Industries Apocalyptica.	Posted - 2007.03.06 08:39:00 - [143] Edited by: Mortania on 06/03/2007 08:36:18 Originally by: Gamesguy Then let us buy T2 bpos from the NPCs for a fixed price, a few billion for a hac BPO sounds fair. I'm in favor of everything shy of that, actually. Limited numbers of BPCs on the NPC market each day? Sure. Invention as good (and in some areas better) than BPOs, you bet. BPC drops from rats, yes. As rewards from agents (more frequently), yes. As RP purchases for limited run BPCs, yes. As lottery rewards for BPOs, yes. I think there are lots of ways to make T2 acquisition interesting and different than just an absolute replacement of T1 gear. And none of it requires removing existing T2 BPOs. ---
Phyrr Minmatar The Gosimer and Scarab	Posted - 2007.03.10 13:32:00 - [144] me wants my bpc's even if i wasnt gonna make any profit, I wanted to try my hand at it.
Mortania Minmatar Carbide Industries Apocalyptica.	Posted - 2007.03.10 17:38:00 - [145] Originally by: Phyrr me wants my bpc's even if i wasnt gonna make any profit, I wanted to try my hand at it. Yup, first batch of 20 10-run BPCs comes out in 10 days. I'll be sending evemails to all those who evemailed me. About 8-10 people responded. ---
Tanis Bastar Caldari Interstitial Incorporated	Posted - 2007.03.10 18:49:00 - [146] Originally by: Graalum Originally by: James Duar Amd like I said earlier, arguments against T2 BPO production mostly come from jealousy. Uh, no, first, first the arguments are generally not against T2 BPO production, but rather the means and quantity of distribution of certain T2 BPOs. Sure, your T2 BPO sucks, but others are worth vast, game-tilting sums. And now CCP is talking about not issuing any more? That's total crap. -BoB Delenda Est-
Sekket	Posted - 2007.03.10 19:41:00 - [147] Well, now that this thread has gotten to a civil discussion, I'd like to offer my perspective. I'm a relatively new player. As such, such grandfathered in things like leftover BPOs from the T2 lotteries represent a "barrier of entry" shall we say. Such things getting grandfathered in represents a distinct advantage that I, or other newer players, cannot overcome. Sure, we can try invention, but as others pointed out the cost vs payout is significantly different. So how am I supposed to try and sell this game to my old guild-mates (and potential new corp mates) when there are entrenched alliances with such grandfathered advantages? Is it really too hard to say to the current T2 lottery winners "Well, you had your days in the sun, but the times are changing, and you need to move on"? I've seen calls to open up a fresh server cluster. I didn't understand why at the time, I mean one of the big selling points of EvE is that everyone is participating in the same game universe. But now I can see where they are coming from, even thought I still feel it is a bad idea. The fact as I see it is that those BPOs represent a significant tactical advantage to entrenched forces, one that they have no incentive to give up, there is no expiration on them, and there is really no practical way to deny them of them (perhaps espionage and thievery, but really you can't really expect to pull it off). I feel grandfather clauses are not the way to go. Outstanding T2 BPOs should be addressed.
Gamer4liff Caldari Metalworks THE INTERSTELLAR FOUNDRY	Posted - 2007.03.10 20:13:00 - [148] Agreeing with OP,as well as the subsequent posts in support of keeping T2 bpos in an effort to keep prices lower. Oh how I love all the :downs: support of removing T2 bpos, as if that would make the game better in the least for anybody.
Mortania Minmatar Carbide Industries Apocalyptica.	Posted - 2007.03.10 20:17:00 - [149] Originally by: Sekket Well, now that this thread has gotten to a civil discussion, I'd like to offer my perspective. I'm a relatively new player. As such, such grandfathered in things like leftover BPOs from the T2 lotteries represent a "barrier of entry" shall we say. Such things getting grandfathered in represents a distinct advantage that I, or other newer players, cannot overcome. Sure, we can try invention, but as others pointed out the cost vs payout is significantly different. So how am I supposed to try and sell this game to my old guild-mates (and potential new corp mates) when there are entrenched alliances with such grandfathered advantages? Is it really too hard to say to the current T2 lottery winners "Well, you had your days in the sun, but the times are changing, and you need to move on"? I've seen calls to open up a fresh server cluster. I didn't understand why at the time, I mean one of the big selling points of EvE is that everyone is participating in the same game universe. But now I can see where they are coming from, even thought I still feel it is a bad idea. The fact as I see it is that those BPOs represent a significant tactical advantage to entrenched forces, one that they have no incentive to give up, there is no expiration on them, and there is really no practical way to deny them of them (perhaps espionage and thievery, but really you can't really expect to pull it off). I feel grandfather clauses are not the way to go. Outstanding T2 BPOs should be addressed. I think the point that people calling for the burning of all T2 BPOs are missing is that invention needs to be brought up to the standards of being able to compete with T2 BPOs, at least that is what I am advocating. The ability to go massively parallel with invention is something that T2 BPOs cannot do. Other advantages liek this should be created for invention. There is no reason to just kill the T2 BPOs. There are solution where you can negate or severely limit the advantages that they have. And I would certainly be in favor of them. You have to understand that most people who have T2 BPOs have purchased them. And usually at a year's worth of full production at the price of the module at the time. With the advent invention and dropping of T2 prices, the return to black will be much longer than a year, maybe not before the EVE cluster goes away. With T3 possibly coming, that likelihood becomes even more likely. Now, people come along and say, let's remove the value to make them only BPCs, and reduce the possible payback on them even more. How would that sit with you, if you had made a similar investment? I'm trying to come at this problem from both sides and create a solution that is fair to both sides. I'd appreaciate it if everyone else would do the same. ---
LVSOCOM Minmatar Vale Heavy Industries SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2007.03.10 20:45:00 - [150] Edited by: LVSOCOM on 10/03/2007 20:51:23 Edited by: LVSOCOM on 10/03/2007 20:49:47 Your BPO sucks and you are whining about it... When people catagorize "T2 BPO owners" they generally think of the ones that are holding GOOD BPOs-- not yours and I seriously doubt you by name or your module by name has ever been specifically called an isk printing machine. So that leaves you ranting about taking offense to a "greedy T2 BPO owner" label, to which you and your BPO do not have membership... ETA: Invention does need to get boosted a bit. I'd like to see a T2 market that with capital to invest, you could start a production business. Nothing as simple as Tech1 equipment, but something at least enterable in a way that produces profits and not at the current inflated prices. T2 BPO purchasers should have known something is going to happen eventually and that making a business plan that revolves around planning years worth of time in a dynamic environment just doesn't work. This isn't the real world folks... You can't lay out a 3 year business start up plan and actually expect every game mechanic to apply at the end of those 3 years. Or even more applicably, a 1 year plan on a such highly debated (read, "whined about") field. Things change, **** happens.... And most likely they will still hold something; be it a BPO, high run BPC, or an interface. They will not be out of business. They'll just have to compete to do it.



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