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EvE is unfair! I demand equal opportunity for all!

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 3 post(s)
Ki An Gallente The Really Awesome Players	Posted - 2007.04.18 14:25:00 - [31] Originally by: Beef Hardslab Originally by: Ki An To support my PvP I am forced to operate a second account and grind missions, something I find extremely lame and boring. I am thus forced to PvE against my will in order to engage in the parts of the game I enjoy. This is completely unfair. No, you are not. If you cannot come up with other ways to make isk, it is not the game's fault. Well, I could make money from PvPing, but with all the loot thieves around in Empire it's damn hard if I don't go out into low-sec, and out there noone flies anything expensive. I could try scamming, but I'm sure that's not what you mean as a way to make isk. I could deploy a POS, keep it fueled with ice I would have to mine, or buy with isk from other forms of PvE. I could build stuff, but I'd have to get the minerals from mining. Is there any activity in EvE that makes you money without having any connection with PvE, except for inferior methods such as piracy and scamming? /Ki Remember, kids: Beware: I'm a "viscous pirate"!
Cato Ahala Amarr	Posted - 2007.04.18 14:27:00 - [32] If you're not a Privateer I don't see why this should bother you at all. PvP has not been 'Nerfed'. Most Corps/Alliances should still be fully capable of running multiple wars for an extended period, the only thing this change means is that you can't turn Empire space into 0.0 without paying through the nose for it. Which is as it should be.

CCP Eris Discordia	Posted - 2007.04.18 14:29:00 - [33] I think it will be highly unlikely that there will be a seperate market for pvpers where everything is free. Also fly cheap ships and use cheap modules when you go into combat. With a little luck you can break even when you sell the loot of your victims and recover the losses with this alone. Why is this signature pink? It is a mystery

Bistot Kid The First Thing You'll Ever See	Posted - 2007.04.18 14:29:00 - [34] Edited by: Bistot Kid on 18/04/2007 14:28:25 Edit: NM
Imperator Jora'h	Posted - 2007.04.18 14:37:00 - [35] Originally by: Ki An Well, I could make money from PvPing, but with all the loot thieves around in Empire it's damn hard if I don't go out into low-sec, and out there noone flies anything expensive. I could try scamming, but I'm sure that's not what you mean as a way to make isk. I could deploy a POS, keep it fueled with ice I would have to mine, or buy with isk from other forms of PvE. I could build stuff, but I'd have to get the minerals from mining. Is there any activity in EvE that makes you money without having any connection with PvE, except for inferior methods such as piracy and scamming? /Ki Guess it depends how you want to define PvP. If for you that means only shooting someone else then you're SOL as that leaves pretty much everything else in the PvE realm. If you care to think of PvP as extending to markets and such then a LOT, if not most, of EVE is PvP. I promise you for builders PvP exists quite well in trying to control markets. Maybe not your thing but there just the same. You could try trading. Find a few good trade routes (not as easy as it sounds to find juicy ones) and you can make a nice bankroll. Yeah carebear city driving around ina freighter but can be fast (relatively) and lucrative. As for making money off pirating I know many do unless pirates who post to these forums are all liars. Some are quite wealthy. Perhaps you are going about your thing the wrong way. And as has been noted in no way was PvP nerfed. If you cannot see that Privateers were clearly bending a game mechanic far beyond what the Devs ever envisioned for it then you are delusional. You can still wardec and pew pew as always and in Empire.
Biltic Creen Minmatar Deutsche Minen und Werke Guardian Federation	Posted - 2007.04.18 14:38:00 - [36] Originally by: CCP Eris Discordia I think it will be highly unlikely that there will be a seperate market for pvpers where everything is free. Also fly cheap ships and use cheap modules when you go into combat. With a little luck you can break even when you sell the loot of your victims and recover the losses with this alone. IF you can kill your opponent with a cheat ship and cheap setup _____ This post is not my personal opinion. It does represent the standpoint of every single player !
Fren Mallow Gallente Bluestar Enterprises	Posted - 2007.04.18 14:40:00 - [37] Hm.. I allways thought, that what makes eve-pvp so good, was the LOSS of items, which meant (grind)work for you to get them in the first part?! So, IMHO what you want will make pvp in eve less fun as it is now (adrenalin rush and the like..), right? Think twice next time you post somthing . www.bluestar-enterprises.de Your signature exceeds the maximum allowed dimensions of 400x120 pixels -Sahwoolo Etoophie ([email protected])
Beef Hardslab The 5 Amigo's LLC.	Posted - 2007.04.18 14:40:00 - [38] Originally by: Ki An Is there any activity in EvE that makes you money without having any connection with PvE, except for inferior methods such as piracy and scamming? Run missions until you have a decent amount saved up, say 300 mil or so. Learn the market while doing so. When you have a good foundation of isk to work with, buy low sell high. When you get into things like faction mods and ships, the profit potentials are really lucrative. Do it long enough, well enough, or just get lucky enough, and you will get to a point where you only have to play with the market once you get to a certain threshold. It's important to pick a threshold that will work for you - set a certain wallet balance that you will not go below except to use for trading to make more isk. I find missions boring as hell too, but running the market interests me. A side effect of this is you will have access to very nice mods to give you an edge in pvp, and if you lose them - oh well, chances are you got a hell of a deal on them anyway! Why there should be a breathalyzer to login to Eve: Originally by: Alliaanna Dalaii Podding my own alt in a gatecamp while drunk, he was carrying a hauler full of tech II goods, Oops.
Nysander	Posted - 2007.04.18 14:46:00 - [39] Edited by: Nysander on 18/04/2007 14:43:59 Edited by: Nysander on 18/04/2007 14:42:57 I think you have one thing wrong with your initial post. That is that it has not been the Empire hugging carebears that have been moaning about Privateers the most. It has been the 0.0 Alliance jockeys that want to have their cake (0.0 pvp free for all) and eat it (come in to safe empire and shop, run missions for isk). I am an empire hugging carebear and I happen to think Privateers are the best thing since sliced bread. They give the 0.0 alliances a taste of what its like to be on the end of NBSI. How many times has a pvp'er said "Eve is a pvp game", "no where is safe", "fly with escorts","can't handle it stay in your own space". Basically Privateers handed those retorts right back at the 0.0 alliances. Empire hugging carebears are not the biggest whiners in Eve. Those are out in 0.0 alliances. Nerfing Privateers is a bad call. edit:- spelling (twice)
Ki An Gallente The Really Awesome Players	Posted - 2007.04.18 14:47:00 - [40] Ok, with even devs posting in this thread I think it's time to apologize. I guess sarcasm don't go across well on forums, but I figured if I made the demands silly enough most people would get the point. Seems some did, but most didn't. I only blame myself for that. The point of my original post was to mimic the cry of many PvE players who say they shouldn't be forced to PvP because they don't want to. In order to show off the rediculousness of this statement and put it into a context they could understand I created the original post. I tried to spurr it on with follow up posts, but too few got the point, so I don't think it's fruitful to continue. I believe EvE would function best if everyone would just accept that other play styles exists, and that those play styles can, and will, have a direct impact on you wether you want to or not. This, in my view, is what makes EvE a great game, and separates it from all other MMOs. Piracy will exist, and industrialists need to learn to defend themselves using in game means. At the same time, prices on the market are affected by those same industrialists, and pirates and PvPers need to adapt to this. Hopefully a constructive debate can come from this. Otherwise I again apologizing for my inability to make the point clear enough. /Ki Remember, kids: Beware: I'm a "viscous pirate"!
Liquidator Brunt Caldari Ferengi Commerce Authority	Posted - 2007.04.18 14:49:00 - [41] Originally by: Ki An With the latest blog about nerfing the Privateer Alliance, thus cementing the notion that PvE players shouldn't need to PvP if they don't want to, I demand that us PvP players are treated equally. To support my PvP I am forced to operate a second account and grind missions, something I find extremely lame and boring. I am thus forced to PvE against my will in order to engage in the parts of the game I enjoy. This is completely unfair. In order to rectify this and bring equality back into the game I would propose that PvP players get a separate market where all mods are available free of charge. The PvE players can keep their own market. Further, all our ships should be free, and we shouldn't have to pay for clones or implants. Implement these changes so that us PvP players can engage in PvP and not be forced into PvE against our will. Thank you. /Ki Don't fly things you can't afford to lose, noob. And then buy your mods from me.
Beef Hardslab The 5 Amigo's LLC.	Posted - 2007.04.18 14:50:00 - [42] I didn't think you could be serious, but with some of the posts on here it can be quite hard to tell. Why there should be a breathalyzer to login to Eve: Originally by: Alliaanna Dalaii Podding my own alt in a gatecamp while drunk, he was carrying a hauler full of tech II goods, Oops.
Cosmar Gallente Aliastra	Posted - 2007.04.18 14:54:00 - [43] Well last time i checked the best PvE resources (both missions and ore) are not placed in Jita. So by comparison if you were to limit yourself to cheap non-named t1 ships then your PvP could be self-supporting, unless you suck at it. But if you choose to get the more expensive stuff you need to do PvE just like the PvEer who would want acess to the best PvE resoruces would have to go into 0.0.
Hamfast Gallente	Posted - 2007.04.18 16:04:00 - [44] Ki, Perhaps if you had asked for a big red insta-kill button to kill your targets with folks would have seen your post for what it was... I still think we need to thank the Privateers, the WarDec System was broken and needed fixing, had it not been for the privateers, it would not have been fixed. On another note, Privateers are the ultimate PvE, Privateers vs Everybody Noob in training...
sakana Purgatorial Janitors Inc.	Posted - 2007.04.18 16:07:00 - [45] aww man, I saw the title of the post and was getting ready for some "omfg your such a loser" "just another whine" blah blah, then i realised it was a joke ------------
Speed Devil Caldari Privateers Privateer Alliance	Posted - 2007.04.18 16:17:00 - [46] Edited by: Speed Devil on 18/04/2007 16:13:33 Originally by: CCP Eris Discordia Also fly cheap ships and use cheap modules when you go into combat. With a little luck you can break even when you sell the loot of your victims and recover the losses with this alone. then we gotta have luck on taking the loot before some specialized lootthief takes it due to the poorly implemented flagging... Originally by: Merkanas To people who can't understand: there are rules and there are morals, don't get them confused. If rules allow it and you have no moral objection, by all means... have fun.
GimmeeThat	Posted - 2007.04.18 16:32:00 - [47] Originally by: Speed Devil Edited by: Speed Devil on 18/04/2007 16:13:33 Originally by: CCP Eris Discordia Also fly cheap ships and use cheap modules when you go into combat. With a little luck you can break even when you sell the loot of your victims and recover the losses with this alone. then we gotta have luck on taking the loot before some specialized lootthief takes it due to the poorly implemented flagging... don't hunt in jita or rens, problem solved.... next.
Soporo Caldari	Posted - 2007.04.18 16:34:00 - [48] Quote: With the latest blog about nerfing the Privateer Alliance, thus cementing the notion that PvE players shouldn't need to PvP if they don't want to, I demand that us PvP players are treated equally. All wrong, you must be joking, but I'll tell you why. It wasnt a Priv nerf, it was a "not working as intended, because you were all super greedy bastages" fix patch. PVE'ers and Empire people can still be decced, as you well know. While on the subject though, in the interests of equality, I demand that prats who scan out missioners in LowSec and force them to PvP get agressed by all the rats soon as they enter. You make us PvP, we make you PvE a bit, all fair eh?
Drunk Driver Gallente	Posted - 2007.04.18 16:45:00 - [49] This thread is white noise.
Fswd	Posted - 2007.04.18 17:12:00 - [50] Edited by: Fswd on 18/04/2007 17:09:24 Noises some more --- So I flame and troll when the occasion calls for it. So what are you gonna do about it?
Miss Mental	Posted - 2007.04.18 17:36:00 - [51] Originally by: Ki An Originally by: GimmeeThat With that said, learn to adapt and stop asking for ridiculous things. I will also add that YOU yes YOU pulled a lot of attention to the privateers with your stupid requests. You shot yourself in the foot mate. GG When I think about it, this is quite an interesting paragraph. You're basically saying that CCP didn't nerf the Privateers because it was necessary, but because of too much forum ruckus. This means that you will openly admit that CCP caved in to the whiners, and the carebears won the day because of excessive forum whinage. Perhaps we PvPers can give this a go now. I say, shut down NPC corps, force people into low-sec, and further nerf warp core stabilizers. Come on, boys. If enough of us whine they'll eventually change it. /Ki Nah i think the devs where like: "oh no another dual wreck ownage thread.. another Privateer whine thread. lets look into what there doing then" and after that they just changed the system to something a bit more realistic :D
Amphetaminer Grumpy Old Men	Posted - 2007.04.18 17:37:00 - [52] Originally by: Drunk Driver This thread is white noise. more like brown noise
Rhaegor Stormborn Sturmgrenadier Inc R i s e	Posted - 2007.04.18 17:37:00 - [53] CCP doesn't force PvPers to PvE. You can just buy GTC and sell them for ISK.
Agent Li Galactic Defence Consortium	Posted - 2007.04.18 17:39:00 - [54] Originally by: Ki An To support my PvP I am forced to operate a second account and grind missions, something I find extremely lame and boring. Why? I hear that PvP in 0.0 space earns you 20 million isk per hour. Or so they say.
RedFall Irreligion	Posted - 2007.04.18 17:41:00 - [55] Originally by: Ki An Ok, with even devs posting in this thread I think it's time to apologize. I guess sarcasm don't go across well on forums, but I figured if I made the demands silly enough most people would get the point. Seems some did, but most didn't. I only blame myself for that. The point of my original post was to mimic the cry of many PvE players who say they shouldn't be forced to PvP because they don't want to. In order to show off the rediculousness of this statement and put it into a context they could understand I created the original post. I tried to spurr it on with follow up posts, but too few got the point, so I don't think it's fruitful to continue. I believe EvE would function best if everyone would just accept that other play styles exists, and that those play styles can, and will, have a direct impact on you wether you want to or not. This, in my view, is what makes EvE a great game, and separates it from all other MMOs. Piracy will exist, and industrialists need to learn to defend themselves using in game means. At the same time, prices on the market are affected by those same industrialists, and pirates and PvPers need to adapt to this. Hopefully a constructive debate can come from this. Otherwise I again apologizing for my inability to make the point clear enough. /Ki You fail!!! Andy Kaufman would be spinning in his grave. You should've seen how long you could keep this up and how many people you could really **** off.
xeom Exit 13	Posted - 2007.04.18 17:44:00 - [56] If carebears can choose not to PVE and still play perfectly fine.Why can't the pvp'er? This is total bull$h1t really.Not asking for seperate market but if we have to PVE they should have to PVP --- "Those nuclear missiles are for domestic heating." - Scagga
RedFall Irreligion	Posted - 2007.04.18 17:45:00 - [57] Originally by: xeom If carebears can choose not to PVE and still play perfectly fine.Why can't the pvp'er? This is total bull$h1t really.Not asking for seperate market but if we have to PVE they should have to PVP Agree. CCP is PvE-centric.
Venkul Mul Gallente	Posted - 2007.04.18 17:56:00 - [58] Originally by: Ki An Originally by: Venkul Mul Fun, a Privateer asking for istancing in market. Do your homework better, laddie. I've never been a part of the Privateers. /Ki I stand corrected. Fun. A strong supporter of the Privateer cause asking for istancing . Better?
Dzajic Gallente	Posted - 2007.04.18 18:00:00 - [59] Yes of course, CCP staff, some of them with long PK carriers on other MMOs are PVE orientated. With completely broken system that hardly allows you to do missions with several people together, where there are a several dozen missions so that you become sick of the grind in less than a month, with all that, CCP are PvE orientated. Yeah, and im Miss Universe. And the danged topic, AFAIK you can have 10 war decs for old costs, only after the 10th war dec it starts to raise prices exponentially. Being wardeced allows you to defend yourself, and costs you nothing. So, what is your problem then. War dec have not been implemented as a mean for legal piracy in high sec, believe it or not.
Korizan Oort Cloud Industries	Posted - 2007.04.18 18:00:00 - [60] Let me see if I got this right. So everyone else in the game spends hours and hours from mining to mission running maintaining POS's etc etc etc. just to get isk to keep things going but... You want anyone who PEW PEW PEW's to get free or dirt cheap items so you can go out and gank every other player, steal there mods and make a double profit... Okay now I understand... Sounds like you want a FPS game where you log on kill things for a few hours then leave again. Hmmm doesn't sound like EVE.

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