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Close ALL 10/10 complex UNTIL the Blood Raider ones are getting fixed

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Flamothron	Posted - 2007.04.18 18:28:00 - [1] Weel here it is. Im asking to Close ALL of EVE 10/10 plex while the Blood Raiders plex are getting fixed. It is simply du unfair that alliances that does not occupy blood raider space are able to do tens of billions per day while the ones that occupy Blood raider space aint doing a $h!t because thier 10/10 plex are bugged. Knowing that a 10/10 plex can generate more than 2 Bill/day isk if farmed correctly its not acceptable and mostly not FAIR that ONLY the DELVE, QUERIOUS and PERIOD BASIS 10/10 complex are getting closed. This certainly affects the fairness of the game and also the gamming experiance of an alliance members if the alliance in question can't generate ISK the way ALL alliance does (doing 10/10 plex) So due to a clear unfairness i ask for the closure of all EVE 10/10 plex until the blood raiders 10/10 plex are fixed.
RedFall Irreligion	Posted - 2007.04.18 18:29:00 - [2] Flamebait Rating 0/10
Idara Caldari Missioners Anonymous	Posted - 2007.04.18 18:30:00 - [3] The Devs are obviously in the Coalition alliances and have purposefully (accidentally) bugged BOBs Blood Raider complexes to give their alliances the upper hand. /tinfoil hat off --- The CAOD forums:
Stakhanov Shih Yang Tong	Posted - 2007.04.18 18:30:00 - [4] Terrific character name... talk about forum pvp
Illyria Ambri Caldari	Posted - 2007.04.18 18:32:00 - [5] Hey.. while we are at it./. lets close ALL complexes till we get some in the new regions that work... :P ------------ This is not War... This is pest control - Dalek Sek Happiness is a warm railgun, Love is a stocked missle launcher. Sexual extacy is watching that NME Battleship go boom. "Will i
Idara Caldari Missioners Anonymous	Posted - 2007.04.18 18:33:00 - [6] Originally by: Illyria Ambri Hey.. while we are at it./. lets close ALL complexes till we get some in the new regions that work... :P The Devs are obviously in BOB and have purposefully (accidentally) bugged the new regions to give their alliance the upper hand because they didn't start next to the new regions as the Coalition has. --- The CAOD forums:
RedFall Irreligion	Posted - 2007.04.18 18:33:00 - [7] Let's just close all complexes forever. That should solve the problem.
Idara Caldari Missioners Anonymous	Posted - 2007.04.18 18:35:00 - [8] Originally by: RedFall Let's just close all complexes forever. That should solve the problem. The Devs are obviously in the Empire-based carebear alliances and have purposefully (accidentally) bugged BOBs Blood Raider complexes but meant to bug them all to stop giving 0.0 alliances the upper hand. --- The CAOD forums:
Banana Torres The Green Banana Corporation Privateer Alliance	Posted - 2007.04.18 18:36:00 - [9] Oh dear, the cheatin' BoB's complexes are broken. Almost makes me believe in karma.
000Hunter000 Gallente Magners Marauders	Posted - 2007.04.18 18:37:00 - [10] And these alliance folks call us Empire dwellers lame? jeez
RedFall Irreligion	Posted - 2007.04.18 18:39:00 - [11] Originally by: Idara Originally by: RedFall Let's just close all complexes forever. That should solve the problem. The Devs are obviously in the Empire-based carebear alliances and have purposefully (accidentally) bugged BOBs Blood Raider complexes but meant to bug them all to stop giving 0.0 alliances the upper hand. Yes but I hear from good sources that it's really a bunch of Blizzard Devs over here to sabotage Eve.
Bartholomeus Crane	Posted - 2007.04.18 18:46:00 - [12] I have an idea, lets remove all complexes (except the noobplexes) and turn them into exploration sites! That would solve all the farming issues right there! --
Dark Shikari Caldari Imperium Technologies Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2007.04.18 18:49:00 - [13] Originally by: Banana Torres Oh dear, the cheatin' BoB's complexes are broken. Almost makes me believe in karma. But the cheating RA complexes aren't broken, so no, no karma. --23 Member-- Listen to EVE-Trance Radio
Idara Caldari Missioners Anonymous	Posted - 2007.04.18 18:53:00 - [14] Originally by: Bartholomeus Crane I have an idea, lets remove all complexes (except the noobplexes) and turn them into exploration sites! That would solve all the farming issues right there! Stop using common sense. It has no place in EVE. --- The CAOD forums:
Verite Rendition Caldari AUS Corporation CORE.	Posted - 2007.04.18 18:58:00 - [15] Frankly, this isn't a bad idea. The revenue/goods from 10/10 Complexes are not an insignificant part of an alliance wallet. ---- AUS Corp Lead Megalomanic
Shurio	Posted - 2007.04.18 19:59:00 - [16] Considering the russian alts farm them all anyway, I don't think it would really make a difference if the Delve plexes WERE fixed :P
Rhaegor Stormborn Sturmgrenadier Inc R i s e	Posted - 2007.04.18 20:01:00 - [17] I agree that all static complexes should be closed permenantly.

Kaemonn Forum Moderator Interstellar Services Department	Posted - 2007.04.18 20:09:00 - [18] Thread cleaned. Keep this on topic and friendly. forum rules \| [email protected]\| Eve-CCG

Ker Ching	Posted - 2007.04.18 20:14:00 - [19] Originally by: RedFall Let's just close all complexes forever. That should solve the problem. /signed. Get rid of static complexes and make exploration the ONLY way of finding any complex.
Moridin Interstellar eXodus R0ADKILL	Posted - 2007.04.18 21:24:00 - [20] i agree. close the *****d down complexes and make the suckers look for them
Deva Blackfire DAB RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2007.04.18 21:37:00 - [21] Yep, sure - close all 10/10 While we are at it close all 6/10 until CCP fixes 6/10 guristas one. Lets be fair :) (ah yes - guri 10/10 sucks monkey balls and is hardest 10/10 plex in game... ty for useless plex CCP :)
aknahra	Posted - 2007.04.18 21:45:00 - [22] useless eh? I'm sure there are quite a few people who would take it over for you
Morrath	Posted - 2007.04.18 21:47:00 - [23] Their is WAY too much dependence on these static plexes. This is a really tender nerve for certain "alliances", and It wouldn't suprize me if this thread gets moved/locked/ or just dissapears......again like all the others. Exploration would be too much work and skill build up for said Alliances, which might make them take a loss of some kind in the process of finding the "precious". This tenderness makes me suspicous of the manor in which spawn rates of certain plexs are, but I don't wanna get too carried away.
Malcanis High4Life	Posted - 2007.04.18 21:51:00 - [24] Originally by: Ker Ching Originally by: RedFall Let's just close all complexes forever. That should solve the problem. /signed. Get rid of static complexes and make exploration the ONLY way of finding any complex. /signed
RedFall Irreligion	Posted - 2007.04.18 21:57:00 - [25] Originally by: Malcanis Originally by: Ker Ching Originally by: RedFall Let's just close all complexes forever. That should solve the problem. /signed. Get rid of static complexes and make exploration the ONLY way of finding any complex. /signed /signed
Vasiliyan Gallente Ordnace Research and Development	Posted - 2007.04.18 22:32:00 - [26] While you're at it, close all the Serpentis 3/10s until their 4/10 is worth doing. --------- Currently offering high-sec POS standings service for 0.5 systems within the Gallente Federation. Evemail me for details.
Deus Ex'Machina Amarr Imperial Academy	Posted - 2007.04.18 22:37:00 - [27] Originally by: RedFall Originally by: Malcanis Originally by: Ker Ching Originally by: RedFall Let's just close all complexes forever. That should solve the problem. /signed. Get rid of static complexes and make exploration the ONLY way of finding any complex. /signed /signed /signed snip - Image not appropriate for eve-o forums - hutch true amarr tank shields!
Roemy Schneider BINFORD	Posted - 2007.04.18 22:54:00 - [28] arkonor in all 0.0!
Morrath	Posted - 2007.04.18 22:55:00 - [29] Originally by: Ker Ching /signed. Get rid of static complexes and make exploration the ONLY way of finding any complex. Best solution I've heard yet. /Signed.
Lilian Long	Posted - 2007.04.19 00:37:00 - [30] Edited by: Lilian Long on 19/04/2007 00:41:11 Originally by: Morrath Originally by: Ker Ching /signed. Get rid of static complexes and make exploration the ONLY way of finding any complex. Best solution I've heard yet. /Signed. Exploration still needs some work. Yesterday I did one 'unknown' site again, almost lost two ships, no rewards. After killing the overseer I got an escalating path / a expedition, but it was several jumps away in 0.0 and the way there quite dangerous and it said that excalating path are even more dangerous. I was not in the mood to race there in one hour and risk my pve ship for that, if the rewards aren't as good as in a usual higher complexes. Well, now people might suggest doing it in a bigger gang, but that means that there have to be some decent rewards. I don't gather a 5 people gang, waste a lot of time with probing to get the same income like for a lvl.4 mission in high-sec. Currently explorers just seem to look for radar and magnetometric plexes and ignore the unknowns/gravimetrics and the reason is probably that the rest isn't worth the hassle. I only probed the 'unknown' down because I was curious. I could have run a complex solo with no risk and would have ended with 150mil isk fixed reward for the run (bounties/overseertags) + the eventual loot just for myself without any hassle.
Wendat Huron Lupus Industries	Posted - 2007.04.19 00:51:00 - [31] Perhaps them being closed was part of the BoB pleabargain to get to keep all the rest of their illgotten gains.
Zevon Confuse-A-Cat Ltd.	Posted - 2007.04.19 00:58:00 - [32] Originally by: Wendat Huron Perhaps them being closed was part of the BoB pleabargain to get to keep all the rest of their illgotten gains. Beat on it all you want. That horse can't get more dead.
Wendat Huron Lupus Industries	Posted - 2007.04.19 01:05:00 - [33] Originally by: Zevon Originally by: Wendat Huron Perhaps them being closed was part of the BoB pleabargain to get to keep all the rest of their illgotten gains. Beat on it all you want. That horse can't get more dead. Have you disbanded yet? I for one can't stand these lowlifes that fly under the pretense of being something in tune with bushido, given the japanese influenced names and logos, yet they fail to do the right thing when disgraced.
Zevon Confuse-A-Cat Ltd.	Posted - 2007.04.19 01:19:00 - [34] Originally by: Wendat Huron Originally by: Zevon Originally by: Wendat Huron Perhaps them being closed was part of the BoB pleabargain to get to keep all the rest of their illgotten gains. Beat on it all you want. That horse can't get more dead. Blah blah blah BoB eats babies Thanks for sharing. Twice. Back on track: Maybe I don't fully understand the mechanics, but why do complexes have to be static? Couldn't you just randomly generate them every time the server gets reset? Pop them in a different location? Randomize them a bit?
Lord Slater Amarr Imperial Academy	Posted - 2007.04.19 01:23:00 - [35] Originally by: Zevon Originally by: Wendat Huron Perhaps them being closed was part of the BoB pleabargain to get to keep all the rest of their illgotten gains. Beat on it all you want. That horse can't get more dead. Its amazing how some people can close there eyes to the evidence. ----------------------------------------------- YYAARRHH HAHAHA IM THE HAPPY PIRATE
Varriq Gallente Hundreds of Cats Association	Posted - 2007.04.19 01:47:00 - [36] Originally by: Zevon Back on track: Maybe I don't fully understand the mechanics, but why do complexes have to be static? Couldn't you just randomly generate them every time the server gets reset? Pop them in a different location? Randomize them a bit? For the very same reason why arkonor (and veldspar for the matter) belts are static. Alliances should have resources to protect and fight over. Moreover, for peoples like you who want plexes randonmly generated CCP introduced exploration. So now we have the best of both worlds - static plexes to fight over for big alliance guys and hidden plexes to scan over for small guys. Putting the content out of the game is always bad, CCP done the very right thing by adding content and not removing it.
Brolly Caldari Morphic field	Posted - 2007.04.19 02:19:00 - [37] Originally by: Ker Ching Originally by: RedFall Let's just close all complexes forever. That should solve the problem. /signed. Get rid of static complexes and make exploration the ONLY way of finding any complex. Yups, and introduce many more complexes for phun and prophet
Rabb Darktide Independent Fleet O X I D E	Posted - 2007.04.19 03:20:00 - [38] Originally by: Flamothron Knowing that a 10/10 plex can generate more than 2 Bill/day isk if farmed correctly its not acceptable and mostly not FAIR that ONLY the DELVE, QUERIOUS and PERIOD BASIS 10/10 complex are getting closed. This certainly affects the fairness of the game and also the gamming experiance of an alliance members if the alliance in question can't generate ISK the way ALL alliance does (doing 10/10 plex) So due to a clear unfairness i ask for the closure of all EVE 10/10 plex until the blood raiders 10/10 plex are fixed. In light of this, I demand the closure of ALL complexes, because there aren't any at all in the new regions. The lack of complexes is clearly unfair to those alliances who live there. ---- Rabb Darktide Fleet Admiral (CEO) / O X I D E High Council Independent Fleet [INDF] INDF Recruitment
Flamothron	Posted - 2007.04.19 05:10:00 - [39] Edited by: Flamothron on 19/04/2007 05:13:02 Please stay on topic of this post do you think it is fair that people in Delve, Querious and Period Basis are currently suffering the loss of billions per day cause of a technical glitch while people who are settled in other regions, that does not suffer any glitch, can make income of what they have fought for (thier regions ressources)? Yes, No ? Why ? What should be done ? I think its completly unfair knowing that people who fight evry day for those regions and people who spent a lot of time to conquer them are completly ignored by the, now usual, silence of CCP (Not a bit of official information was deliverd about the closing of 10/10 blood raider plex). Can we please AT LEAST know what the hell is going on with those plex ? To fully enjoy a game they are paying a monthly fee for, i think, in the first place, people need to be confident on that games relative stability and mostly have a complete impression of fairness between the player. Even though i know CCP team are doing their best to fix the issue of blood raider plex, I do not have this impression of fairness right now. As for those who demand that ALL complex should be closed because there is no complex in the drone region I think your simply not on topic. Drones region NEVER had complexes. May i ask why you decided to fight (if you had to fight at all) for those region that were complexeless if your goal is to do complex? People in drone regions DIDNT LOOSE ANYTHING compared to people that live in DELVE, QUERIOUS and PERIOD BASIS who LOST a big chunk of their alliance income. Thx for reading -Flame
Malachon Draco eXceed Inc. INVICTUS.	Posted - 2007.04.19 05:22:00 - [40] Originally by: Flamothron Edited by: Flamothron on 19/04/2007 05:13:02 Please stay on topic of this post do you think it is fair that people in Delve, Querious and Period Basis are currently suffering the loss of billions per day cause of a technical glitch while people who are settled in other regions, that does not suffer any glitch, can make income of what they have fought for (thier regions ressources)? Yes, No ? Why ? What should be done ? I think its completly unfair knowing that people who fight evry day for those regions and people who spent a lot of time to conquer them are completly ignored by the, now usual, silence of CCP (Not a bit of official information was deliverd about the closing of 10/10 blood raider plex). Can we please AT LEAST know what the hell is going on with those plex ? To fully enjoy a game they are paying a monthly fee for, i think, in the first place, people need to be confident on that games relative stability and mostly have a complete impression of fairness between the player. Even though i know CCP team are doing their best to fix the issue of blood raider plex, I do not have this impression of fairness right now. As for those who demand that ALL complex should be closed because there is no complex in the drone region I think your simply not on topic. Drones region NEVER had complexes. May i ask why you decided to fight (if you had to fight at all) for those region that were complexeless if your goal is to do complex? People in drone regions DIDNT LOOSE ANYTHING compared to people that live in DELVE, QUERIOUS and PERIOD BASIS who LOST a big chunk of their alliance income. Thx for reading -Flame You are entirely correct. Not having 10/10 plexes working while others do is unfair. But we have to be consistent, don't we? In the drone regions, asteroid respawn is bugged. Therefore we need to nerf the respawn on all asteroid belts across Eve until those can be fixed. Otherwise it would be grossly unfair, since I can guarantee you that mining across all the drone regions would bring in a hell of a lot more than a few bugged 10/10 plexes.
Heikki Gallente Wreckless Abandon Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.04.19 08:09:00 - [41] Originally by: Flamothron do you think it is fair .. i know CCP team are doing their best to fix the issue Actually it is fair indeed. We can take granted that in complex game like Eve there always will be pretty many non-critical bugs. Sometimes they affect you more than others, but most of the time it averages out, and hence, is fair. If you think about a bit more, what you are suggesting is obviously impossible policy to hold on. Compare for example: * Oops, Kestrel has critical bug that will be fixed within week -> in the mean time no other ship type can allowed to work since their pilots would gain advantange over Kestrel focused pilots * Oops, some alliance got small edge by taking advantage of cheating -> every other alliance/pilot must be given competive edge over everyone else.. So assuming there is at least some competive selection on choosing who get to use such complexity, I'll assume your post was just meant to be variad of "Hey I need attention here" cry towards CCP. -Lasse
Bienurdau Hywoaf Minmatar Matari Holo News Network	Posted - 2007.04.19 08:29:00 - [42] Originally by: Flamothron Edited by: Flamothron on 19/04/2007 05:13:02 Please stay on topic of this post do you think it is fair that people in Delve, Querious and Period Basis are currently suffering the loss of billions per day cause of a technical glitch while people who are settled in other regions, that does not suffer any glitch, can make income of what they have fought for (thier regions ressources)? Yes, No ? Why ? What should be done ? I think its completly unfair knowing that people who fight evry day for those regions and people who spent a lot of time to conquer them are completly ignored by the, now usual, silence of CCP (Not a bit of official information was deliverd about the closing of 10/10 blood raider plex). Can we please AT LEAST know what the hell is going on with those plex ? To fully enjoy a game they are paying a monthly fee for, i think, in the first place, people need to be confident on that games relative stability and mostly have a complete impression of fairness between the player. Even though i know CCP team are doing their best to fix the issue of blood raider plex, I do not have this impression of fairness right now. As for those who demand that ALL complex should be closed because there is no complex in the drone region I think your simply not on topic. Drones region NEVER had complexes. May i ask why you decided to fight (if you had to fight at all) for those region that were complexeless if your goal is to do complex? People in drone regions DIDNT LOOSE ANYTHING compared to people that live in DELVE, QUERIOUS and PERIOD BASIS who LOST a big chunk of their alliance income. Thx for reading -Flame Is it fair that there are no complexes of any sort that work or even exist in the 8 new regions added in Revelations? Is it fair that the asteroid belts in the 8 new regions don't respawn correctly? Is it fair that a small number have held onto a Tech 2 monopoly for so very long? Was it fair that BoB was given BPOs by a developer? Was it fair that BoB was allowed to keep 8 months worth of proceeds from those BPOs even after it was discovered? EVE isn't about fairness. If it was you'd all be flying the same ships, all systems would be identical, and nothing would be better than anything else. It would be boring stale and die quickly if all things were fair and equal. They should not endeavor to make all things equal and fair. They should not turn off the other 10/10 plexes, nor any other plexes, nor should they turn off the asteroid belts of other regions. Idea: Treaties Idea: Jump Rigs
Slate Fistcrunch Direct Intent The Makhai	Posted - 2007.04.19 08:56:00 - [43] Close all static plexes except for tutorial. Sounds good to me. Gives developers ways to distribute complexes if an imbalance is discovered. Combats farming in general. While you're at it, fix the hacking cans / item spawn areas at the COSMOS empire sites. Move the 100m+ isk items out of static areas and seed more of the required items for missions at random times. Ridiculous that someone can log in once an hour and grab all the items and ruin a COSMOS mission progression for everyone else attempting to experience the game.
Tradiska	Posted - 2007.04.19 11:18:00 - [44] Originally by: Bienurdau Hywoaf Is it fair that there are no complexes of any sort that work or even exist in the 8 new regions added in Revelations? Is it fair that the asteroid belts in the 8 new regions don't respawn correctly? Is it fair that a small number have held onto a Tech 2 monopoly for so very long? Was it fair that BoB was given BPOs by a developer? Was it fair that BoB was allowed to keep 8 months worth of proceeds from those BPOs even after it was discovered? EVE isn't about fairness. If it was you'd all be flying the same ships, all systems would be identical, and nothing would be better than anything else. It would be boring stale and die quickly if all things were fair and equal. They should not endeavor to make all things equal and fair. They should not turn off the other 10/10 plexes, nor any other plexes, nor should they turn off the asteroid belts of other regions. There are no plexs in new regions. You knew that before you decide to live there... It's not the question here. The question is: Why the Bob's plexs and not the ra's plexs? The question is: why have CCP closed those plexs without any explains? Lets try to close all the ra/aaa plexs and see what happens thousands petitions incoming i guess
Nova Fox	Posted - 2007.04.19 11:40:00 - [45] Why not require the ship logs that drop off randomly from pirates to be used as keys for the first stage static plexes if they cannot be removed, and possibly make them escalate instead of having thier phases all in one system increasing the and forcing player movement. But that is if they arent going to remove them pernamently. If removed pernamently they need to be reduxed and brought up to par with current exploration sites or better, make them more epic so to say with tiggers and the sort.
Kagura Nikon Minmatar Guardians of the Dawn Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.04.19 11:44:00 - [46] Stop complainign so much. the high end plexes are needed sicne they are the only reason why an aliance would want to expand territory currently. Until we have more natural resources to fight for... they must remain. If brute force doesn't solve your problem... you are not using enough
Mangus Thermopyle Chosen Path Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2007.04.19 11:44:00 - [47] Yea, static complexes needs to go. Make them into "unknown" exploration complexes, and give each 0.0 region an equal chance to get them. This way, the best 10/10 complexes will be equally accessible from all regions.
Bartholomeus Crane	Posted - 2007.04.19 13:26:00 - [48] Originally by: Kagura Nikon Stop complainign so much. the high end plexes are needed sicne they are the only reason why an aliance would want to expand territory currently. Until we have more natural resources to fight for... they must remain. Not quite true. If an alliance has more 'real estate' this means more opportunity to find exploration sites, and with progression, a higher probability that your progression sites lie within your own backyard (where it should be safe). Even with only exploration sites and no static complexes, there is still enough reason to want to expand territory currently (even when only looking at complexes and sites, there are many other reasons as well). Anyway, more than enough room in 0.0 right now (parts of it are practically deserted). But there's more. With only exploration sites, there is a reason for raiding (small gangs) as well. Picture the high level progression from a site inside your alliance space into your neighbour's. Plenty of reason for action I would say. There are currently only two problems with exploration/progression: 1. A perceived lack of profit for all the work (whether this is true or a result of laziness remains to be seen); and 2. An alternative with a guaranteed profit for less work in the static complexes. I think CCP would do well to do for static complexes what they are planning to do for T2 BPOs: remove them altogether for the alternative. With T2 BPOs that alternative is invention, for static complexes this would be exploration/progression. It's kind of a double whammy, one against T2 BPO fatcats earning billions without any risk or effort, one against complex farming that is so much the cause of inflation and devaluation in EVE. At the moment CCP is still balancing the profit-ratio of the exploration sites but overall it's a win-win situation really! Or do you really think CCP introduced these alternatives because they like to make it difficult on themselves? It will cause a ***storm when CCP comes forward with this, but the good alliances will do what they'll always do: adapt. Bet you BoB's doing that right now. Bartholomeus Crane wants to apologise in advance for this display of common sense on the forums. He'll try not to let it happen again* --
Morrath	Posted - 2007.04.19 14:18:00 - [49] Originally by: Bartholomeus Crane Originally by: Kagura Nikon Stop complainign so much. the high end plexes are needed sicne they are the only reason why an aliance would want to expand territory currently. Until we have more natural resources to fight for... they must remain. Not quite true. If an alliance has more 'real estate' this means more opportunity to find exploration sites, and with progression, a higher probability that your progression sites lie within your own backyard (where it should be safe). Even with only exploration sites and no static complexes, there is still enough reason to want to expand territory currently (even when only looking at complexes and sites, there are many other reasons as well). Anyway, more than enough room in 0.0 right now (parts of it are practically deserted). But there's more. With only exploration sites, there is a reason for raiding (small gangs) as well. Picture the high level progression from a site inside your alliance space into your neighbour's. Plenty of reason for action I would say. There are currently only two problems with exploration/progression: 1. A perceived lack of profit for all the work (whether this is true or a result of laziness remains to be seen); and 2. An alternative with a guaranteed profit for less work in the static complexes. I think CCP would do well to do for static complexes what they are planning to do for T2 BPOs: remove them altogether for the alternative. With T2 BPOs that alternative is invention, for static complexes this would be exploration/progression. It's kind of a double whammy, one against T2 BPO fatcats earning billions without any risk or effort, one against complex farming that is so much the cause of inflation and devaluation in EVE. At the moment CCP is still balancing the profit-ratio of the exploration sites but overall it's a win-win situation really! Or do you really think CCP introduced these alternatives because they like to make it difficult on themselves? It will cause a ***storm when CCP comes forward with this, but the good alliances will do what they'll always do: adapt. Bet you BoB's doing that right now. Bartholomeus Crane wants to apologise in advance for this display of common sense on the forums. He'll try not to let it happen again* Good post. Also, exploration for high end static plexes would make the stronger alliances prove themselves all the more by cooperation from within, by working together to reap the rewards. Everyone within the alliance would have to trust each corp within it to come clean with revealing plex discovery. I know trust is a bad word in EVE, but it would promote cooperation and team effort no? Think about it.
mistress velator velator pie-rat	Posted - 2007.04.19 14:48:00 - [50] Breaking news: 10/10 complexes are NOT the greatest moneymakers ingame. Actually there's something similar that makes pretty much 5-10x more isk on daily basis.
DB Preacher Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.04.19 14:57:00 - [51] Edited by: DB Preacher on 19/04/2007 14:53:32 Why exactly is the op complaining about something which they will never have experienced in their life? It's heartening that you care so much about the plexes in Delve but disheartening that you chose to hide behind an alt in order to call for a complete ban on plexes. Don't be too concerned about us, I'm sure we will struggle by until CCP manages to find time to fix them. In the meantime, I hope every other alliance's plexes remain open unless they are bugged. Blanketwide bans for this sort of thing is needless and creates more work than is necessary. dbp Caldari Alliance PVP Championship Winner Current RKK Ranking: (PSCAL6) Proficient Short Tanto
Trollin	Posted - 2007.04.19 15:06:00 - [52] I have to say that it pleases me immensely to see BoD and pets getting owned by CCP. its about time. --------------------------------------------------- A word to the wise ain't necessary, its the stupid ones that need the advice
DB Preacher Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.04.19 15:11:00 - [53] Edited by: DB Preacher on 19/04/2007 15:10:52 Originally by: Trollin I have to say that it pleases me immensely to see BoD and pets getting owned by CCP. its about time. Owned? How did we get "owned"? The plexes were bugged and needed fixed. I'm not sure if the eve community has had a memory wipe in the last 6 months but from the beginning of the game bob members have been some of the most vocal in getting bugs fixed asap. Every bug is found and sent in by petition, we don't announce every bug on the forums because the proper place to relay bugs to CCP is through petition. It's unfortunate that it took a forum post to CCP in order for them to look at this matter, and I sincerely hope that doesn't set the precedence for getting things fixed, but don't confuse that with neglect on ours or fix's behalf because I can assure you it had been reported correctly by both us and fix members from the second it got bugged. dbp Caldari Alliance PVP Championship Winner Current RKK Ranking: (PSCAL6) Proficient Short Tanto
Morrath	Posted - 2007.04.19 18:11:00 - [54] Originally by: DB Preacher Edited by: DB Preacher on 19/04/2007 14:53:32 Why exactly is the op complaining about something which they will never have experienced in their life? It's heartening that you care so much about the plexes in Delve but disheartening that you chose to hide behind an alt in order to call for a complete ban on plexes. Don't be too concerned about us, I'm sure we will struggle by until CCP manages to find time to fix them. In the meantime, I hope every other alliance's plexes remain open unless they are bugged. Blanketwide bans for this sort of thing is needless and creates more work than is necessary. dbp What a crock. I don't mean to get off track here, but Ill suggest this anyway: perhaps there wont be any unfair advantages with complexes (or anything really) when all the developer's in game characters are divided up in-between alliances. I bet "insignificant" little problems like broken spawns get fixed the same day they appear in BoB space, the developers run the alliance after all. This whole thing just stinks big time.
Celestal	Posted - 2007.04.19 18:31:00 - [55] Maybe some of the complexes have been closed because too many people are now aware of , and questioning why , a while back the region with the highest concentration of complexes had their number of plexes boosted by over 50% while a lot of other regions got little or no boost. go on guess whose region got the boost .
Turin Caldari RONA Deepspace	Posted - 2007.04.19 18:42:00 - [56] Originally by: Flamothron Weel here it is. Im asking to Close ALL of EVE 10/10 plex while the Blood Raiders plex are getting fixed. It is simply du unfair that alliances that does not occupy blood raider space are able to do tens of billions per day while the ones that occupy Blood raider space aint doing a $h!t because thier 10/10 plex are bugged. Knowing that a 10/10 plex can generate more than 2 Bill/day isk if farmed correctly its not acceptable and mostly not FAIR that ONLY the DELVE, QUERIOUS and PERIOD BASIS 10/10 complex are getting closed. This certainly affects the fairness of the game and also the gamming experiance of an alliance members if the alliance in question can't generate ISK the way ALL alliance does (doing 10/10 plex) So due to a clear unfairness i ask for the closure of all EVE 10/10 plex until the blood raiders 10/10 plex are fixed. Translation: WAaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa ________________________________________________________
Marketcheck2	Posted - 2007.04.19 18:47:00 - [57] A far better idea is just getting rid of high level static complexes all together. They are campable, farmable, exploitable, time zone dependent sources of stupid amounts of isk. There is no need for them in the game right now. Use exploration for them.
Scorched Evil The Silent Rage	Posted - 2007.04.19 22:40:00 - [58] Originally by: Marketcheck2 A far better idea is just getting rid of high level static complexes all together. They are campable, farmable, exploitable, time zone dependent sources of stupid amounts of isk. There is no need for them in the game right now. Use exploration for them. Supported. A Move to exploration sites might put an end to rewarding people for being in the motherland... GMT players by far have a better chance for success in this game if they choose to farm plexes; the life blood of most alliances. I'm not sure if randomizing key drops over different time zones and remove the dependancy on server uptime scrambles to get in first. In any case, good thread. I imagine RA will be in here to thwart any effort to protest their cheating shortly being that they alt run almost every southern complex uncontested....
Karash Amerius Amarr O.E.C Legionnaire Services Ltd.	Posted - 2007.04.19 23:03:00 - [59] Up with Exploration Dynamic Complexes... Down with All Static Complexes... Merc Blog
Bartholomeus Crane	Posted - 2007.04.20 00:18:00 - [60] Well, I may not be a big fan of BoB or any of their pets, but in this instance, Dark Shikari came out in the open about the bugged complexes when he felt the petition system didn't work (fast enough). FIX seemed to support that, even though they're in a war and have something to lose. To me that puts DS in the good book, along with FIX. BoB, to my knowledge, accepted and supported what happened as well. I think that's positive as well, although I doubt they care much about what I think about it. In comparison I have heard lots and lots of rumours of farming by the opposite camp of farming bugged complexes; although I admit I have not first hand knowledge. So much about politics. In general however, I believe that the reliance of alliances, or corps for that matter, on complexes, is not the way to go. I've already covered the fact that static complexes, and especially farming static complexes, leads to inflation and lazy (and boring) gameplay, so I'll not go into that again. Another thing I was thinking about is that static complexes also lead to a general lock-down of 0.0 as well. Once a corps or alliance has 'conquered' a profitable static complex, it provides them with an surplus of disposable income (in practice, almost unlimited, and for little effort or risk). This can then be used to consolidate that position; effectively locking down that area of space. In part this is a good thing. Corps that are able to conquer parts of space should be reasonably save within it, especially when they're able to hold it for a certain time. On the other hand, this safety shouldn't be a given. New contenders should be able to 'fight themselves in', if they are good enough. Balance, as always is key, and as I see it, static complexes, with their easy money, in the quantities that the high level ones provide, and the ease at which they can be farmed, upset this balance. To me it seems that a well run corps/alliance that captures a number of these complexes and can maintain possession of them for a certain amount of time, is very difficult to conquer. Obviously I think this is wrong. The result of this is that new, small but tightly run, corporations/alliances can not, nay, can never compete, with older corporations. Not because the old corporations are better run, but simply because they've been able to farm complexes for longer. I recognise that this is not the whole story, but I suspect it's an important part of it, and I also happen to believe that this is wrong. I happen to believe that all corporations/alliances should work to maintain their standing and defenses, irrespective of their age or number of farmable complexes. Replacing static complexes with exploration/progression will still benefit corporations with lots of real estate, but, I believe, will also allow for newer contenders to challenge that (think exploration/progression raiding in enemy space for example). If this is the case, this would mean that more players would be able to compete in 0.0, bringing more people out of empire space and into low sec (even if only in transition) and 0.0 space. Which means less available space for those living there (they'd have to make room for the newer corps) but also a more 'target rich environment', which after all, can't be all that bad. Really, I can't see a single reason why, after some balancing by CCP, static complexes should not be replaced by exploration/progression. Just my point of view ofcourse ... not in the least influenced by the fact that I had a pint or more ... --
Zupkuck	Posted - 2007.04.20 00:31:00 - [61] Cry more, carebear.
umop 3pisdn Minmatar Republic Military School	Posted - 2007.04.20 00:35:00 - [62] Edited by: umop 3pisdn on 20/04/2007 00:33:32 My main is part of the coalition. No surprises here. The plexes were bugged out of their brains. Dont give me that crap about losing 2bil a day income when ive seen them being farmed 23/7. Respawn timers dont just "get bugged" someone changes them. FIX Ran their better plexes and the bob ones near their turf constantly... for hours and hours on end... until coalition pilots started running them because theres nothing else to do in the area at the moment. As soon as it became clear that we would profit more from these than FIX/BoB could... dark shikari pulled the plug... with a public Eve-O ***... one that the devs couldnt ignore like they do the petition pile. Dark Shikari may well be innocent but there were a load of people within his alliance who knew. They were farming the crap out of it. The timing of his little revelation seems kinda wrong to me. So reopen the damn things. The coalition will farm them and then you'll be pretty **ed about that too. oh... one more thing... we fought for your plexes... we took them off you... you had them locked. hurray.
Buppa	Posted - 2007.04.20 01:11:00 - [63] Originally by: Scorched Evil I imagine RA will be in here to thwart any effort to protest their cheating shortly being that they alt run almost every southern complex uncontested.... Oh yes, it is RA that is cheating. I absolutely remember BOB in here protesting these broken complexes months and months ago when they were added ONLY to their space. You know, space that was 100% 0.0 until somehow CCP decided to make it 50% NPC station space and still leave it better than all other pure conquerable space. Oh wait, haha, BOB didn't mention them broken (through Dark Shikari) until they had lost control of all their complexes.
Motivated Prophet Zerodot Schools Power Corrupts Industry's	Posted - 2007.04.20 01:11:00 - [64] Originally by: Brolly Originally by: Ker Ching Originally by: RedFall Let's just close all complexes forever. That should solve the problem. /signed. Get rid of static complexes and make exploration the ONLY way of finding any complex. Yups, and introduce many more complexes for phun and prophet I concur, I need my own complex. Dunno who this "Phun" fellow is, though. MP -- TINY. Stage 2 IPO, because good things come in pairs.
Dark Shikari Caldari Imperium Technologies Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2007.04.20 01:20:00 - [65] Edited by: Dark Shikari on 20/04/2007 01:16:51 Originally by: Buppa Originally by: Scorched Evil I imagine RA will be in here to thwart any effort to protest their cheating shortly being that they alt run almost every southern complex uncontested.... Oh yes, it is RA that is cheating. I absolutely remember BOB in here protesting these broken complexes months and months ago when they were added ONLY to their space. You know, space that was 100% 0.0 until somehow CCP decided to make it 50% NPC station space and still leave it better than all other pure conquerable space. Oh wait, haha, BOB didn't mention them broken (through Dark Shikari) until they had lost control of all their complexes. What world do you life in? In the one everyone else lives in, Band of Brothers still controls Delve. P.S. As far as I know, the bug was introduced in Revelations 1.4.1, not "months ago". And Red Alliance is still farming 800 billion ISK a week off complexes and selling it for real life cash, but apparently since BoB are really bad people, nobody cares. --23 Member-- Listen to EVE-Trance Radio
Morrath	Posted - 2007.04.20 02:10:00 - [66] Originally by: Zupkuck Cry more, carebear. right on que.
Buppa	Posted - 2007.04.20 03:03:00 - [67] Originally by: Dark Shikari What world do you life in? In the one everyone else lives in, Band of Brothers still controls Delve. English mother f'er, do you speak it? Where did I say BoB didn't control Delve? The facts are simple. Delve was 100% conquerable space UNTIL CCP out of nowhere 'decided' to make it 50% NPC space aka BoB no longer has to keep POS for sov in place. The Blood Raider complexes were added with Kali, not 1.4.1 as far as you know is very short. Do you expect us to believe that an alliance that was receiving T2 BPOs and significant changes making it easier to control their space wasn't aware of the broken complexes added to their space for months? Face it Shikari, you are what you are, a mouthpiece. You (aka BoB) have lost control of those complexes, now is the time to bring them up. DBP lacks the balls to do it, so you have been elected.
Ivor Gunn	Posted - 2007.04.20 03:38:00 - [68] Now, let's remember that it was DS who made the post that got them closed in the first place, so he can hardly be called a whining carebear. He acted with the utmost of honour in the matter. That, and the fact BoB never lost control of their plexes, and also that although the plexes were added with revelations, the spawn timer bug was not added until 1.4.1. It strikes me that the only people whining about bobbits and their plexes are lowly coalition peons who will never see their masters' complexes, as they obviously dont have an actual clue how these things work, as all they seem to whine about is bobdevhaxspl0its. Originally by: umop 3pisdn ... we fought for your plexes... Quite accurate, the fight was purely for complexes. Not one person with any sense could honestly say that the fight was in any way about cleaning eve of cheaters, or scourging eve of people who want to conquer the galaxy. RA made this clear by laying their alt corps in every plex in what was LV n' co's space, then stopping the advance when they had what they wanted; the Angel complexes that made them trillions of isk. So if BoB are guilty of exploiting their complexes and keeping the bugs quiet, then neither side is innocent. The exploitation of plexes has happened before and will happen again. Locking of plexes as they become bugged is not an option. The only viable option is removal of static plexes, then making the same plexes spawn once or twice a day in a random location in the region that is only possible to find through exploration. This removes the ability of alliances like RA and BoB to just place an alt corp with a mothership in a 10/10 system and farm it day and night like clockwork. This makes the complexes what they were meant to be; regional resources. It gives the complexes to the people (see: pets) who actually hold the region and fight for it daily, rather than whichever alliance has their alt corp in place.
Frug Zenithal Harvest	Posted - 2007.04.20 04:42:00 - [69] Wow, people really want your blood DS. One guy flames you for still being in fix when you supposedly ruined your own alliance's plexes, and another guy's flaming you because you ruined other people's plexes. I don't even know who controls the plexes now and i'm convinced this is a bad joke. That'll show you to report things that are exploitable. Despite the stupid, i'm curious why they'd add NPC stations to delve when they know it's a touchy area. - - - - - - - - - - Do not use dotted lines - - - - - - - - "We need to invent a new Clue Super Weapon... Something that distributes clue on a never before seen level." -Cpt Psycho
Bartholomeus Crane	Posted - 2007.04.20 08:43:00 - [70] Honestly, the politics side of it doesn't matter to me all that much. To me what happened seemed on the level, and that's all I can say. The point is, should be, and I think everyone agrees to this, is that static complexes, bugs or not, invite farming, and very lucratively so. All this for no effort and hardly any risk. Obviously a situation like this is going to be exploited. Obviously this is going on right now (by both, nay, by all sides). Equally obviously this has to change before it grows out of hand (if this hasn't happened already). Now, CCP, in their infinite wisdom (ahum), has implemented a possible alternative, which they are balancing out right now. Why not switch to that? Like now? --
Gerome Doutrande 4S Corporation Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2007.04.20 09:07:00 - [71] If you are in a region that (currently) doesn't have complexes, but you really really want access to complexes, I suggest you go and take over a region that has some.
Bienurdau Hywoaf Minmatar Matari Holo News Network	Posted - 2007.04.20 09:26:00 - [72] Originally by: Tradiska Originally by: Bienurdau Hywoaf Is it fair that there are no complexes of any sort that work or even exist in the 8 new regions added in Revelations? Is it fair that the asteroid belts in the 8 new regions don't respawn correctly? Is it fair that a small number have held onto a Tech 2 monopoly for so very long? Was it fair that BoB was given BPOs by a developer? Was it fair that BoB was allowed to keep 8 months worth of proceeds from those BPOs even after it was discovered? EVE isn't about fairness. If it was you'd all be flying the same ships, all systems would be identical, and nothing would be better than anything else. It would be boring stale and die quickly if all things were fair and equal. They should not endeavor to make all things equal and fair. They should not turn off the other 10/10 plexes, nor any other plexes, nor should they turn off the asteroid belts of other regions. There are no plexs in new regions. You knew that before you decide to live there... It's not the question here. The question is: Why the Bob's plexs and not the ra's plexs? The question is: why have CCP closed those plexs without any explains? Lets try to close all the ra/aaa plexs and see what happens thousands petitions incoming i guess Though I have visited and toured some of the new regions I am not a resident of the new regions. My general lack of standings with anyone prevents me living there, and even makes my little visits dangerous. As to why they were closed has nothing to do with RA or any of the forces allied against BoB. It was the BoB ally, FIX, through DS that revealed the bugged nature of the new 10/10 complexes with a forum post to General Discussions. It was shortly after his thread that the plexes were closed. Idea: Treaties Idea: Jump Rigs
Flamothron	Posted - 2007.04.23 15:56:00 - [73] ho well revelation 1.4.2 comming any news for the closure of 10/10 plex ? Happy patch deployment :P
Deva Blackfire DAB RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2007.04.24 12:31:00 - [74] Originally by: aknahra Originally by: Deva Blackfire (ah yes - guri 10/10 sucks monkey balls and is hardest 10/10 plex in game... ty for useless plex CCP :) useless eh? I'm sure there are quite a few people who would take it over for you If russkies didnt want to run it i think the plex IS useless. Anyways it stands open abt 95% of the time. Come, die a bit trying to do this, waste your time and cry at last rewards that are worse than chaining triple BS spawns.
LoveKebab DAB RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2007.04.24 12:36:00 - [75] Edited by: LoveKebab on 24/04/2007 12:34:44 yep ;/ complex is useless... 10/10 complex that: - drop only ONE tier and it's 14th (16mil isk) - u can be in last stage within 10 minutes... - overall reward is not even close to 1bil (other complexes drop at least 3 best overseers and some stuff so u have about 500-1.5bil reward... - respawn rate in last stage is insane (i mean NPCs not structure...) and npcs are of the worst kind: web, scram, jammers and u cant do anything - tanker is jammed and since respawn is insane next wave is randomly aggressing other ships in gang(jam, jam, jam - byebye...) it's worst complex ever
Tom Shandy	Posted - 2007.04.24 12:36:00 - [76] Originally by: Flamothron Weel here it is. Im asking to Close ALL of EVE 10/10 plex while the Blood Raiders plex are getting fixed. It is simply du unfair that alliances that does not occupy blood raider space are able to do tens of billions per day while the ones that occupy Blood raider space aint doing a $h!t because thier 10/10 plex are bugged. Knowing that a 10/10 plex can generate more than 2 Bill/day isk if farmed correctly its not acceptable and mostly not FAIR that ONLY the DELVE, QUERIOUS and PERIOD BASIS 10/10 complex are getting closed. This certainly affects the fairness of the game and also the gamming experiance of an alliance members if the alliance in question can't generate ISK the way ALL alliance does (doing 10/10 plex) So due to a clear unfairness i ask for the closure of all EVE 10/10 plex until the blood raiders 10/10 plex are fixed. Mummy Mummy If i cant play then they shouldnt either !!! " The Coalition Vs BoD"
Pilk Axiom Empire	Posted - 2007.04.27 15:28:00 - [77] Originally by: LoveKebab Edited by: LoveKebab on 24/04/2007 12:34:44 yep ;/ complex is useless... 10/10 complex that: - drop only ONE tier and it's 14th (16mil isk) - u can be in last stage within 10 minutes... - overall reward is not even close to 1bil (other complexes drop at least 3 best overseers and some stuff so u have about 500-1.5bil reward... - respawn rate in last stage is insane (i mean NPCs not structure...) and npcs are of the worst kind: web, scram, jammers and u cant do anything - tanker is jammed and since respawn is insane next wave is randomly aggressing other ships in gang(jam, jam, jam - byebye...) it's worst complex ever 3 command ships, 2 logistics ships. Sorted. --P
Hannobaal Gallente Utopian Frontier	Posted - 2007.04.27 16:31:00 - [78] Edited by: Hannobaal on 27/04/2007 16:29:58 Remove all complexes from all of Eve. ------------------ "If you ever need anything, please don't Hesitate to ask someone else first."
Fzoul KAOS. KA0S Theory	Posted - 2007.04.27 16:58:00 - [79] Originally by: Bartholomeus Crane I have an idea, lets remove all complexes (except the noobplexes) and turn them into exploration sites! That would solve all the farming issues right there! /signed
Ahz	Posted - 2007.04.27 18:00:00 - [80] Edited by: Ahz on 27/04/2007 17:59:20 Originally by: Bartholomeus Crane I have an idea, lets remove all complexes (except the noobplexes) and turn them into exploration sites! That would solve all the farming issues right there! /signed hard. I also like the idea of moving 'plexes: Idea!
Hyuuga Veralis Pator Tech School	Posted - 2007.04.27 23:33:00 - [81] I'm sure it will be dealt with swiftly like theAngel plexes that RA farmed for nearly a year.
Hyuuga Veralis Pator Tech School	Posted - 2007.04.27 23:37:00 - [82] Originally by: Lord Slater Originally by: Zevon Originally by: Wendat Huron Perhaps them being closed was part of the BoB pleabargain to get to keep all the rest of their illgotten gains. Beat on it all you want. That horse can't get more dead. Its amazing how some people can close there eyes to the evidence. I don't see you calling for RA to be mass-banned for their countless exploits.
Flamothron	Posted - 2007.04.28 15:28:00 - [83] Originally by: Hyuuga Veralis I don't see you calling for RA to be mass-banned for their countless exploits. RA peon, i mean associates can't tell about that They can't do plex in their own region; Their beloved masters are claiming them lol ! "pleeeease pleeeease ccp close all plex sniff sniff 8_(" LOL !

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