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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 18 post(s)

CCP Oneiromancer	Posted - 2007.07.03 13:23:00 - [1] We need all the information we can get in order to swat these problems. How can I help? Keep Logserver.exe running during PvP engagements. If you experience heavy client lag and desync issues, archive the log files and submit them in a bug report. More information on how to submit bug reports can be found here. Also include a DXDiag file in your bug report. IMPORTANT: Don't forget to prefix your bug report with "Desync/Client lag:", so that QA and bug hunters can filter these reports easily. The information in the Logserver files is the most important. A simple description of the issue is not likely to help us solve it. Thank you.

Tonto Auri Vhero' Multipurpose Corp	Posted - 2007.07.04 18:32:00 - [2] New thread to keep people patient? Can You at first fix hangar drawing and can lags? It IS issue and please DO NOT reject my reports with "not enough info" resolution. -- .
ElfeGER Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.07.04 23:55:00 - [3] this describes the current issues http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=546410 most time client are not desynced from the server, they are only waiting for the server to submit the complete grid status/content - people get shoot without seeing anyone on grid - grid doesn't load completly so you only see fractions of the actual people there - for me the grid loads after the fight in most cases (=more fun playing solitaire)
Helison Gallente Times of Ancar THE R0NIN	Posted - 2007.07.05 12:56:00 - [4] El***ER, we had the problems with LAG also before Rev 2.0, but now we have also massive problems with Desync. This can be combined with Lag, but not necessary. Desync in its mild (old) form: The position of your ship (or other ship) varies from the position on the server. This is caused normally by different bumping-calculations on the client and on the server. Relog removes in this case all sort of Desync until the next bump. Desync in its heavy (new) form: The client doesn¦t get any new commands from the server any longer. Your commands are executed by the server, but you don¦t see it. Typical example: You give your ship a movement-command, this is sent to the server, the server starts movement, but the confirmation of this command is NOT recieved by the client (ship moves on server, but not on client). Relogging is in this case (without extra server-lag) quite fast and it removes Desync for a short time.
Anhela Gallente Squad of Angry Beavers Ultima Rati0	Posted - 2007.07.05 13:41:00 - [5] Originally by: Tonto Auri New thread to keep people patient? Can You at first fix hangar drawing and can lags? It IS issue and please DO NOT reject my reports with "not enough info" resolution. Please give fleet combat lags priority.At least in hangar lags nothing is lost.
Tonto Auri Vhero' Multipurpose Corp	Posted - 2007.07.05 19:16:00 - [6] Originally by: Anhela Originally by: Tonto Auri New thread to keep people patient? Can You at first fix hangar drawing and can lags? It IS issue and please DO NOT reject my reports with "not enough info" resolution. Please give fleet combat lags priority.At least in hangar lags nothing is lost. Fixing hangar drawing is easy - only need to remove repaints. Fixing can lags may be hard but it many times requested. In general, whole interface demands to be rewritten. All that flying and flickering windows consume alot of CPU. -- .
rus6	Posted - 2007.07.05 22:31:00 - [7] Would fraps be helpful along with the logserver output?
Virtuozzo IVC Consortium INVICTUS.	Posted - 2007.07.05 22:36:00 - [8] I'd encourage folks to do it, enable reimbursement if the log files submitted validate through established mass desync or something ... human nature thing. Virtuozzo Last words of a Caldari general: "Pull the Ravens back! Full retreat! they've got frigates!" snip Inappropriate. -Elmo Pug
ElfeGER Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.07.06 06:45:00 - [9] Originally by: Helison El***ER, we had the problems with LAG also before Rev 2.0, but now we have also massive problems with Desync. This can be combined with Lag, but not necessary. Desync in its mild (old) form: The position of your ship (or other ship) varies from the position on the server. This is caused normally by different bumping-calculations on the client and on the server. Relog removes in this case all sort of Desync until the next bump. Desync in its heavy (new) form: The client doesn¦t get any new commands from the server any longer. Your commands are executed by the server, but you don¦t see it. Typical example: You give your ship a movement-command, this is sent to the server, the server starts movement, but the confirmation of this command is NOT recieved by the client (ship moves on server, but not on client). Relogging is in this case (without extra server-lag) quite fast and it removes Desync for a short time. I never said that there was no lag before revelations 2.0 I remember the big fight in 49 where I saw about max 15 capitals appeared from my point of view. (grid loading completed after the big fight was over) I even remember a small fight in Delve (kfie) where most ppl in gang had targets and I got the grid status after all hostiles where dead. (only saw 15 cans appear) So that desync which is lag exists for a long time and only surfaced in the current amount as now blobs of +300ppl seem to be normal while titans are useless in the current combination of lag and mechanics.
solbright altaltalt	Posted - 2007.07.06 07:26:00 - [10] I guess I should add my speculation in here: There is a possibility of stutter contributing to desync. This idea occured to me because it was common for desync to happen on ship destruction. A large amount of stutter was also typical. The two problems may not be related but it certainly looks like stutter exasperates desync.
solbright altaltalt	Posted - 2007.07.06 07:34:00 - [11] That said, the most common cause in the past was simple packet loss. Get a bad route and you were done for.
Scouteye Caldari	Posted - 2007.07.06 10:47:00 - [12] I was informed by a GM that Fraps can not be used to prove these cases of desynch and is not used as evidence to prove a re-embursment is warented after a desynch event. i will be running the log all the time now to bombard you with logs until this gets fixed
Venkul Mul Gallente	Posted - 2007.07.06 16:25:00 - [13] Originally by: El*ER this describes the current issues http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=546410 most time client are not desynced from the server, they are only waiting for the server to submit the complete grid status/content - people get shoot without seeing anyone on grid - grid doesn't load completly so you only see fractions of the actual people there - for me the grid loads after the fight in most cases (=more fun playing solitaire) A random thougt sparked by your post: in a good number of missions the Rat load incrementally, first you see 2, then another group of let's ay 4, then another 6, till all are loaded. Your description seem exactly that. It is possible something done to mission for the "need for speed" drive has backfired?
Jawas Gallente	Posted - 2007.07.06 18:11:00 - [14] I have done missions where a single transport ship is left and nothing on the overview and no visible red crosses in space. As I start to kill the transport, I get hit by several missiles and still nothing except the transport on the overview or in space. After about 4 or 5 missile volleys, my overview suddenly shows 6 NPC rats on top of me, within 10K. But these ships came in from 40K away when I did the mission previously. Their missiles were hitting me and doing damage but I could see neither the missiles approaching nor the ships that fired them. Even the scanner came up blank. -- Sig design in training: Remaining time 30 years 20 days, 4 hours, 10 mins, 15 seconds.
Gner Dechast Gallente Flashman Services	Posted - 2007.07.07 08:52:00 - [15] Originally by: Jawas I have done missions where a single transport ship is left and nothing on the overview and no visible red crosses in space. As I start to kill the transport, I get hit by several missiles and still nothing except the transport on the overview or in space. After about 4 or 5 missile volleys, my overview suddenly shows 6 NPC rats on top of me, within 10K. But these ships came in from 40K away when I did the mission previously. Their missiles were hitting me and doing damage but I could see neither the missiles approaching nor the ships that fired them. Even the scanner came up blank. Testimonial - yes Does it help devs - no Do I feel your pain - yes Did you help yourself - no I don't think there is an issue of devs needing to be convinced that this issue exists at this point...
Venkul Mul Gallente	Posted - 2007.07.07 08:58:00 - [16] Edited by: Venkul Mul on 07/07/2007 08:57:59 Logserver has several problems: 1) when I play I usually have 2 account opens, so I don't know it in that instance logserver is useful or not (probably it depend on the situation, but PLEASE say that in the logserver instructions: i.e. when running 2 account logserver is useful? yes/no); 2) size of the savelog: I usually play for several hours, if I leave logserver active for the full time the size of the savelog increase dramatically. In some occasion I have not the chance to clear if for 1 hours or more, but then it can't be added to teh bugreport; 3) as stated above it can't be activated after starting EVE. I was thinking about using it while exploring, to get information on why some site don't despawn, but logging hours of "scan, drop probe, scan" seem hardly useful. Starting it whne you are warping to the encounter site seem the right move.
Zenst Gallente Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.07.08 21:38:00 - [17] I've experience desync mainly in a capital ship. I've found that being bumped increases the odd's of it happening. I've seen desyncs last for hours and only way to resolve being to jump/dock or relog. A Desync is were the client and server desagree on the were you ship is and what its doing. I suspect the recent changes reduced server/client communications, one area being the exchanges of states that can be or should be transient data. Now all that said - how is it possible for the client and server to stay desynced for so long. Would it not be easier to have a hashed state table exchange to compare states with client and server on statics and if different induce a resync? From experience of object orientated systems in a client server model I've found that this type of bug not only common, but realy realy annoying in tracking down. I do suggest though actualy using realy realy slow kit as a test server - realy helps simulate heavy load in a unique way that does help highlight such bugs/issues. But basicly the desync would seem to be a clear case of client/server state descrepancies - how you are getting them. Well they only occur on heavy loaded servers (or maybe clients as well) and i suspect its when some data is lost in the client/server communications and fact that even if both have say 79.125 second timeouts the fact that the speed of light aint instant and computer/router clocks are never spot on. Well its not an ideal World and Murphy has alot of openings.

CCP Oneiromancer	Posted - 2007.07.09 08:35:00 - [18] Originally by: Venkul Mul Logserver has several problems: 2) size of the savelog: I usually play for several hours, if I leave logserver active for the full time the size of the savelog increase dramatically. In some occasion I have not the chance to clear if for 1 hours or more, but then it can't be added to teh bugreport; Logserver > Tools > check "Server Mode" and leave it at 100.000 lines. This way every time your log reaches 100.000 lines it will auto save and you'll have several files of around 10 MB instead of one huge file. Not to mention that this mode is gentler on your RAM.

tiller kleptomaniacs	Posted - 2007.07.10 06:53:00 - [19] Originally by: Helison El***ER, we had the problems with LAG also before Rev 2.0, but now we have also massive problems with Desync. This can be combined with Lag, but not necessary. Desync in its mild (old) form: The position of your ship (or other ship) varies from the position on the server. This is caused normally by different bumping-calculations on the client and on the server. Relog removes in this case all sort of Desync until the next bump. Desync in its heavy (new) form: The client doesn¦t get any new commands from the server any longer. Your commands are executed by the server, but you don¦t see it. Typical example: You give your ship a movement-command, this is sent to the server, the server starts movement, but the confirmation of this command is NOT recieved by the client (ship moves on server, but not on client). Relogging is in this case (without extra server-lag) quite fast and it removes Desync for a short time. my experience of this is it's happenning maybe 2-3 times a night to whole gangs... ships stuck to spot like glue, cant appear to do anything though commands are actually working. everyone has to relog... Kleptomaniacs are recruiting evildoers. Channel KLEPTO for info.

CCP Oneiromancer	Posted - 2007.07.10 10:22:00 - [20] One more time: descriptions of the issue don't help, logserver files do. I've seen only 1 (ONE) bug report about this issue including a log file so far.

Bohoba Caldari Dragons United Pure.	Posted - 2007.07.11 06:45:00 - [21] last time I sent a logsever file I was told you did not acept log files The Dark Force is strong in EvE But it will fail Get Into the Game it makes it fun for all

CCP Sharkbait	Posted - 2007.07.11 14:46:00 - [22] i need more logfiles of this happening please. when you are running logserver to log this, please go to tools and enable serverModeSave. then set this to 100k entries. this will stop your machine lagging while you are playing. please get all the files together and attach them to a bug report with the title "desync issue" and put a good description of what you was doing in to the description field. thx /Shark

maria stallion Destructive Influence Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.07.11 19:29:00 - [23] Will try allthough ussually while in combat I tend to forget those things. Signature inappropriate. Mail us at [email protected] if you have any further questions or queries - Valorem
Venkul Mul Gallente	Posted - 2007.07.12 08:16:00 - [24] Edited by: Venkul Mul on 12/07/2007 08:16:38 Originally by: CCP Sharkbait i need more logfiles of this happening please. when you are running logserver to log this, please go to tools and enable serverModeSave. then set this to 100k entries. this will stop your machine lagging while you are playing. please get all the files together and attach them to a bug report with the title "desync issue" and put a good description of what you was doing in to the description field. thx /Shark Will try to get them. Sometime it is not easy to detect when the desyng started (for example if you are probing a system or mining). So how far back we should go with the logs? I mean I notice the desync at 20.10 hours, my logs have been done at 20.08, 20.02, 19.55 (only an example, I don't know the effective time needed to cover 100K entries), I should send only the current and precedent log (20.08), the last 10 minutes or more? Edit: please fix the forummtoo. 3 attempts to get this post in.

CCP Sharkbait	Posted - 2007.07.12 15:54:00 - [25] Originally by: Venkul Mul Edited by: Venkul Mul on 12/07/2007 08:16:38 Originally by: CCP Sharkbait i need more logfiles of this happening please. when you are running logserver to log this, please go to tools and enable serverModeSave. then set this to 100k entries. this will stop your machine lagging while you are playing. please get all the files together and attach them to a bug report with the title "desync issue" and put a good description of what you was doing in to the description field. thx /Shark Will try to get them. Sometime it is not easy to detect when the desyng started (for example if you are probing a system or mining). So how far back we should go with the logs? I mean I notice the desync at 20.10 hours, my logs have been done at 20.08, 20.02, 19.55 (only an example, I don't know the effective time needed to cover 100K entries), I should send only the current and precedent log (20.08), the last 10 minutes or more? Edit: please fix the forummtoo. 3 attempts to get this post in. basically i just need a logfile of the desync starting and then happening. not too bothered about when it finishes, i just want to know what causes it more than anything.

Venkul Mul Gallente	Posted - 2007.07.12 16:10:00 - [26] I will get I possible case (it is not one of the best examples, sorry) I had 1 drome for several minutes bot in the drone bay of the ship and in space returning. One of the problems is noticing when it happens, as sometime you can notive it way later.
Acacia Everto State War Academy	Posted - 2007.07.12 20:35:00 - [27] Until you do figure it out, can we get a "Resync Client" button which forcefully does a full update from the server, so that when it shows up that we're 24AU from the battle and taking damage, we can resync and try to get out/fight again?
Dronte Minmatar RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2007.07.13 09:03:00 - [28] Originally by: CCP Sharkbait basically i just need a logfile of the desync starting and then happening. not too bothered about when it finishes, i just want to know what causes it more than anything. Just submitted one know, which should contain the desync issue (i were next to a carrier requesting cap transfer, but everyone else saw me 50km+ away from everything). Ive got one request though. Ive been running the logserver a bit since this topic came up, to get the logs from when this happens, and i have one MAJOR problem with the logserver. Ive had the logserver CRASH on me twice now, which, not only ruins the logged data effectively as i cant save it, but much much worse, it makes EVE hang indefinately untill i resolve the crashed application (ie. click the "Close Program" button in the Windows dialog that appears when the program fubars). To me this is a MAJOR issue, since one of the times it happened during a fight. Its really nerve-wrecking having a total lockup of EVE, during an engagement, cause you just KNOW that the only petition reply you'll ever get is "Our logs show no sign of any problems" when you file the Reimbursement petition. Now, i obviously dont know exactly how the logserver works, but if i were to guess id think it was a socket communication of sorts which checks for the availability of the logserver socket when EVE launchers and if its there, it uses it. If this is truly the case, please make the logging non-blocking so that EVE doesnt freeze up completely, just cause it cant log anymore.

CCP Sharkbait	Posted - 2007.07.13 20:23:00 - [29] logserver is old now and it's due to be retired. we are working on a new logserver util. not sure the state of it or when it can be released yet.

Deva Blackfire Citadel of dark arts	Posted - 2007.07.14 10:33:00 - [30] There is new issue on the way. In some systems modules just dont work. Ill copy paste my petition i sent: Quote: Story: 1. click hardener, DC, sensor booster 2. they dont activate 3. click on them again 4. get message: 2007.07.13 15:59:02 Notify Armor Explosive Hardener II is already modifyActiveArmorResonanceAndNullifyPassiveResonance. (and same for DC and sensor booster) It happened to me in Ashab system. And here be the problem: i left ashab - everything works OK i came back to ashab - modules stuck AGAIN So i ask people on local if they have same problem: nop. Im the only one with modules stuck EVERYTIME i enter ashab. As im in empire war guess what it means if i try to fight with not working mods. Ah: i checked already: bonus doesnt apply to ship after: "2007.07.13 15:59:02 Notify Armor Explosive Hardener II is already modifyActiveArmorResonanceAndNullifyPassiveResonance." message. ALSO: - i managed to check my other eve copy - another character works, but if i launch Deva on it - he is stuck again - checked on other compy - all works I managed to do clear install - still problem exists. Tried "system restore" to day when everything worked - didnt help. Im all out of ideas and it will be bad when i die to hostiles and not being able to activate modules. (also to me it looks like perma-desync tbh... same messages). Ah - the issue was fixed "by itself". After 2 hours i could activate modules in Ashab again.

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