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Ssoraszh Tzarszh
Minmatar
Grumpy Old Farts
Gruntfuttocks
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Posted - 2007.07.24 15:53:00 -
[31]
 Originally by: Shamis Orzoz
Edited by: Shamis Orzoz on 24/07/2007 14:31:55
Originally by: Ssoraszh Tzarszh
Like he will come here and cryingly admit his guilt and promises he'll never do it again 
Yeh, logging off is lame, but people are getting fed up seeing the same ships apear on overview too. Vaga, Curse. Theres no end to them, caldari spec vets flying vaga's "cause they cant be killed" are swarming everywhere.
I probably won't ever log, unless its in a fleetbattle 200+ to save my pod. But i cn understand the utter frustration of people to be attacked by ever the same ship over and over and over and over and over and over ..again.
I'm just waiting for the next nerf to these ships so all these caldari spec "flavor of the month" crapola will finaly stop and they move on to another 99% safe way to gank someone. Which will take them anotehr 5 months to train and 9 to fly it properly aka not nooblike damage.
And yes i can fly vaga's too and no i am not bitter i was killed by one.
The vaga was already nerfed. In order to make it difficult to kill you have to spend a lot of money on implants.
Hugins/rapiers do the job just fine. But there is no excuse in a megathron. A solo blasterthron pilot can take out a vaga easy, or at the very least, make the vaga run away. I'm guessing this guy had a fleet fitting on and knew he was dead.
But lets look at legitimate ways this guy could have escaped:
- He could have put on 1 stab! I was by myself.
- He could have stayed on the gate until I aggroed him, then jumped through. In order to force me to aggro he could have tried to warp off the gate.
- once he was gone, he could've made a safespot, waited a little while and then logged.
There really wasn't much of a chance for me to kill him by myself, eve favors runners almost as much as loggers. He was on a gate, and I had no web.
I see no evidence that would indicate that he crashed.The quick login/logout afterward leaves no doubt in my mind.
Obviously the nerf was not good enough, you still see both these ships running rampant everywhere you enter 0.0. Does not matter which side of the universe your on theres bound to be roaming vaga/curses there.
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Shamis Orzoz
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
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Posted - 2007.07.24 16:19:00 -
[32]
Edited by: Shamis Orzoz on 24/07/2007 16:19:06
Originally by: Karlemgne
If you are in a ship and can do nothing to fight back, because you're ECM'd, Sensor Dampened, or being orbited so fast you might as well be one of those other two things, then there isn't much of a fight.
If you fly solo in a fleet fitted megathron without a scout, you deserve to die.
A megathron pilot fitted for solo PvP should be able to either kill or escape from a either a vaga or a curse if he's anywhere near a gate. And he should be able to kill the vaga pilot if he gets sloppy, or doesn't have snake implants.
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mikaelim
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Posted - 2007.07.24 16:22:00 -
[33]
Originally by: Karlemgne
I fly a Vaga and I agree. Speed tanking is dumb... I mean, I know you really wanted that kill... but lets be fair...
So then why do you fly vaga?
Originally by: Karlemgne
If you are in a ship and can do nothing to fight back, because you're ECM'd, Sensor Dampened, or being orbited so fast you might as well be one of those other two things, then there isn't much of a fight.
So if there won't be much of a fight logging is ok? If you are caught in your hauler/barge by virtually any combat ship you may log? If you see a long range ceptor with which you wont be able to deal you may log? If you have no injector and see a nos boat you may log? If you are in a cruiser and a bs catches you you may log? If you jump into a big camp you may log? If you see a recon you are generally allowed to log? etc. etc.
Must be an easy way of living... Not for me though.
Originally by: Karlemgne
Why should he stay logged on just to pop without being able to really fire a shot?
Why would you stay logged if you can fire a shot but will be destroyed anyway? Why would anyone who loses ever stay logged? Maybe being ewared is more frustrating than being eaten by some big fat gunship but if you never had a chance to win anyway - where is the difference?
You are just like murder1 and the other whiners. Megathron and ishtar are underpowered because he flies them and curse and vaga are lame because he doesnt fly them. Its really that simple. But maybe you are even worse me thinks. Because you even fly that vaga yourself. Thats the biggest hypocrisy i've ever seen.
Not that i'd be surprised after all. Despite your constant effort to look all noble and "honourable" on this forum you have admittedly broken 1vs1. Now you are a logoffski or at least promoting it. Now i think even Racketeers are better than you - at least they freely admit they're lamers.
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Shamis Orzoz
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
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Posted - 2007.07.24 16:22:00 -
[34]
Originally by: SasRipper
who was it? new guy?
have your tried talking about it in there pub? or mailing a senior meamber?
and are your sure it may not have just been a crash of some discription ?
read the OP for the name. It was a 3 year member of their corp. I did mail the ceo, he said that the guy probably did't log out deliberately. A reasonable response, but I don't think its true in this case.
I could be wrong, but with no major blobs in the area, nobody else in local, and past peak euro times, I'd be shocked if he lagged/crashed/desynched. And I doubt his internet went down becuase he logged right back in. IF that was the case he'd probably stay logged in, but no, he logged back out again to make sure he wouldn't warp back to the gate.
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Seleene
Body Count Inc.
Mercenary Coalition
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Posted - 2007.07.24 16:35:00 -
[35]
Originally by: Shamis Orzoz
I hope something is done.
Such as?
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THIS FLEET FOR RENT! |
Karlemgne
The Malevolent
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Posted - 2007.07.24 16:53:00 -
[36]
Edited by: Karlemgne on 24/07/2007 16:58:55
Edited by: Karlemgne on 24/07/2007 16:57:42
Quote:
So then why do you fly vaga?
Duh!? Because I'm Minmatar, and I readily admit that the ship is overpowered. I'd be a fool to not fly one.
Though, I will say, the Vaga is not nearly as game breaking as the Nanophoon was.
Quote:
So if there won't be much of a fight logging is ok?
Is it okay? That's really a matter of subjectivity, as you are assigning an ethical value to "logging" or "not logging" out of an MMO to save your ship.
Generally, I frown on this behavior, and I might have a few choice words (unrepeatable here) for my corp mates on vent.
Now having said that, I understand why some people do this. Nothing is more frustrating than being say, perma-jammed by 20 ECM drones in a fight that you'll know you'll lose, but know that you could have taken someone with you.
That's why I'd never post about someone logging on the forums.
Quote:
If you are caught in your hauler/barge by virtually any combat ship you may log?
Well, the bears can go ahead and try this tactic. Anything short of a Freighter, however I'll have it killed far before it the ship vanishes.
This tactic is only really possible with combat ships battle cruiser and up, and Freighters. And it will only succeed generally if someone is flying a Battleship, Capital ship, or Freighter.
Quote:
If you see a long range ceptor with which you wont be able to deal you may log? If you have no injector and see a nos boat you may log? If you are in a cruiser and a bs catches you you may log? If you jump into a big camp you may log? If you see a recon you are generally allowed to log? etc. etc.
Again, are you asking me if I think it is "right" to log in these situations? Quite frankly, you can log whenever you feel like it. Its a game and cntrl-q allows you to close it, and return to your real life.
If you are asking how I "feel" about people logging to avoid combat, see above--I don't like it always, but I understand why some people do it.
Quote:
Must be an easy way of living... Not for me though.
I wouldn't know, I generally stay logged in, even if I'm sensor damped, ecmed, and NoSed to the point I can't do a god damned thing.
Quote:
Why would you stay logged if you can fire a shot but will be destroyed anyway? Why would anyone who loses ever stay logged?
Because if there is a chance you might win, you stay logged in. Because if you are going to be ganked, but know you might be able to put up a good fight and take someone out with you, you might stay logged in.
Honestly, there is nothing better than being blobbed by 20 people, but taking 3 of them out before you pop.
Quote:
Maybe being ewared is more frustrating than being eaten by some big fat gunship but if you never had a chance to win anyway - where is the difference?
Is there a difference between losing to someone because you are out gunned, or because you are perma-jammed? Yes, at the very least, being out gunned always you to *try* and fight back. You activate your guns, and hope for the best. Sitting there, not able to even toggle on half of your modules, or use your drones, sucks.
It may be likely that a fish on your hook might be your dinner, but if said fish is also in a barrel, its almost impossible that he won't.
Quote:
You are just like murder1 and the other whiners.
I haven't whined about anything. Trying to explain someone's behavior in the context of a game is most decidedly not whining.
Quote:
blah... blah... overpowerd... blah... blah hypocrisy
I have made video games for a living, specifically MMOs, and I hate to tell you, there IS such a thing as un-balanced gameplay. That's why nano-fibers got nerfed... not because some people "whined," but because the people WHO MADE THE GAME realized that nanos fitted to some ships UNBALANCED the game.
As to me flying a ship I know to be unbalanced? Well, sure I do. I never said anyone shouldn't
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Shamis Orzoz
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
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Posted - 2007.07.24 16:54:00 -
[37]
Originally by: Seleene
Originally by: Shamis Orzoz
I hope something is done.
Such as?
Publicly or privately state either that:
- you don't care
- you are investigating it
- you don't believe me
There are lots of possibilities under the category of something, other than nothing.
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Karlemgne
The Malevolent
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Posted - 2007.07.24 16:56:00 -
[38]
(cont)
Quote:
Not that i'd be surprised after all. Despite your constant effort to look all noble and "honourable" on this forum you have admittedly broken 1vs1.
I violated a SINGLE 1v1, and instantly came to these forums and explained why. I didn't hide it, I came here, told everyone what happened and why--Voodo had intentionally scanned us out and attacked us while we were in the middle of a convo with the M34N ceo about a standings set.
Quote:
Now you are a logoffski or at least promoting it.
No, I am explaining the behavior. That's it, and suggesting that given the situation, it isn't really worth coming to the forums with.
Quote:
Now i think even Racketeers are better than you - at least they freely admit they're lamers.
Perhaps that's because you are a Racketeers alt? Posting with alts ftl. Have the courage to post with your main.
-Karlemgne
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Dee London
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Posted - 2007.07.24 17:16:00 -
[39]
jeez... and EVE is full of children 
I think the subscription fee should be higher 
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Seleene
Body Count Inc.
Mercenary Coalition
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Posted - 2007.07.24 17:16:00 -
[40]
Originally by: Shamis Orzoz
Originally by: Seleene
Originally by: Shamis Orzoz
I hope something is done.
Such as?
Publicly or privately state either that:
- you don't care
- you are investigating it
- you don't believe me
There are lots of possibilities under the category of something, other than nothing.
You know, I've seen some pretty lame **** in the past few years myself, m8. Most of us who have been shooting people for 3-4 years now could probably write a small novel about the nonsense we've seen. SHC has some great posts about this. 
I'm not sure why you feel this incident, not even 24 hours old, deserves a public post. If you wanted some real answers, if this was that important to you, you could have simply waited a bit and shot me a mail on it (there wasn't one as of an hour or so ago). I'm unclear as to why you felt the need to make a public spectacle out of this. There are some alliances in this game who make it a policy of logging out entire fleets. Where is your indignation about them? 
Do I care? Sure. Tancred hasn't been very active lately, so I assume he was simply moving his ship out of our previous contract area. I'll ask about it and see what is said. Personally, I would have fit 5 WCS and a pair of i-stabs.
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THIS FLEET FOR RENT! |
mikaelim
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Posted - 2007.07.24 17:27:00 -
[41]
Originally by: Karlemgne
I violated a SINGLE 1v1, and instantly came to these forums and explained why. I didn't hide it, I came here, told everyone what happened and why--Voodo had intentionally scanned us out and attacked us while we were in the middle of a convo with the M34N ceo about a standings set.
Yes, thats what i pointed out. You may see this as justification but its only an excuse. Thats a very different issue.
Btw: The only chatlogs posted said they were resetting standings if i remember it correctly. 
Quote:
Now you are a logoffski or at least promoting it.
Originally by: Karlemgne
No, I am explaining the behavior. That's it, and suggesting that given the situation, it isn't really worth coming to the forums with.
Thats semantics - but if it makes you feel better about it so be it. Apart from that you weren't able to explain why it is different to log in any situation where you have no chance as opposed to only logging when you are ewared or "vagabonded".
Quote:
Now i think even Racketeers are better than you - at least they freely admit they're lamers.
Originally by: Karlemgne
Perhaps that's because you are a Racketeers alt?
I guess in that case i'd try to recruit you.
Originally by: Karlemgne
Posting with alts ftl. Have the courage to post with your main.
Yeah alt posting is lame. Logging with your main in combat is fine and understandable as you said. Shame on me. 
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Traxio Nacho
Sharks With Frickin' Laser Beams
Mercenary Coalition
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Posted - 2007.07.24 17:31:00 -
[42]
Edited by: Traxio Nacho on 24/07/2007 17:32:41
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Shamis Orzoz
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
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Posted - 2007.07.24 17:38:00 -
[43]
Originally by: Seleene
I'm not sure why you feel this incident, not even 24 hours old, deserves a public post. If you wanted some real answers, if this was that important to you, you could have simply waited a bit and shot me a mail on it (there wasn't one as of an hour or so ago). I'm unclear as to why you felt the need to make a public spectacle out of this. There are some alliances in this game who make it a policy of logging out entire fleets. Where is your indignation about them?
My apologies for not contacting you. I sent an email to the sharks ceo. I never thought to contact you.
I am very upset with the logging mechanics at the moment, and the constant abuse of said tactics. I guess the only reason I'm making an issue is because I saw FRICK on the ticker and never for a second expected something lame like this.
Its a tribute to your organization that I would even bother mentioning it. And sorry for making it public, but I think I just snapped. I have so many people log out on me every day, to have a FRICK mega do it to me was just too much to bear.
I'm just an old pirate trying to get back to basics, and finding out that the way I used to live is no longer viable due to these game mechanics...i'm rather disgusted.
In fact, rather than even asking this FRICK guy why he logged, I'd much rather have you ask CCP what they plan on doing about it? You are buddy buddy with the CCP crew, I'm sure you could pressure them for an answer much better than me.
So forgive this guy for his logging, and instead direct your inquiry to CCP, ask them if they EVER plan on increasing the time between logout and POOF. Ask them if they ever plan on allowing aggro on a ship before it disappears? Ask them if they think its reasonable to have a PvP game where ctrl q gets people out 90% of the time? Also ask them if they think jumping through a gate should clear all aggro timers?
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Neurotic Cat
Gallente
Sharks With Frickin' Laser Beams
Mercenary Coalition
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Posted - 2007.07.24 18:10:00 -
[44]
I have flown in Sharks with Tancred for over 3 years. He is a very valuable member of my corp and I have mountains of respect for him. He has no history of asshatery or bogus in game tactics.
You on the other hand appear to be a bottom feeding forum troll looking to stir up a little drama storm.
FRICK does not condone logging off to save ships. If this becomes an issue I'll start spanking people. But as of right now this case is closed.
NC
- the Frickin CEO of the Sharks with Lasers
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Tassi
Infinitus Odium
The Church.
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Posted - 2007.07.24 18:30:00 -
[45]
Originally by: Neurotic Cat
I have flown in Sharks with Tancred for over 3 years. He is a very valuable member of my corp and I have mountains of respect for him. He has no history of asshatery or bogus in game tactics.
You on the other hand appear to be a bottom feeding forum troll looking to stir up a little drama storm.
FRICK does not condone logging off to save ships. If this becomes an issue I'll start spanking people. But as of right now this case is closed.
NC
- the Frickin CEO of the Sharks with Lasers
Sham is definitly not a bottom feeding forum troll I can assure you this. To see a member of the Mercenary Coalition safing his ship by logging off is DEFINITLY disturbing.
Afterall its your reputation that gets you the contracts and logging off is never good for somebodies reputation.
Originally by: fire 59
i don't know of any bobs that have cheated
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Kadoe
Amarr
Blade Holding
Blade.
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Posted - 2007.07.24 19:13:00 -
[46]
Originally by: Tassi
Sham is definitly not a bottom feeding forum troll I can assure you this. To see a member of the Mercenary Coalition safing his ship by logging off is DEFINITLY disturbing.
Afterall its your reputation that gets you the contracts and logging off is never good for somebodies reputation.
Sorry what?
One FRICK member logging for whatever reason wont make MC any less successful on contracts, what gets them jobs is their ability to complete a contract to and above a satisfactory level, and past history reflects that quite well.
I'd pay for results, and ignore the method (Not saying MC are dodgey, just saying "IF").
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Intigo
Amarr
The League of Legitimate Nigerian Businessmen
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Posted - 2007.07.24 19:30:00 -
[47]
What's even more amazing is the sheer stupidity of that Megathron. He could just have had you aggro him on the other side, then run back to gate (if you can't tank a bloody Vagabond before you fly 15km UNWEBBED in a Megathron then you need to quit EVE), jump through while you had timer and run off.
Instead he logs off and loses his ship.
Incredible. 
--
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Julien Derida
Sharks With Frickin' Laser Beams
Mercenary Coalition
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Posted - 2007.07.24 20:15:00 -
[48]
Originally by: Tassi
Sham is definitly not a bottom feeding forum troll I can assure you this.
Don't you think it's strange that the guy who released Kugutsumen on the community has suddenly developed a sense of e-honour? Doesn't that ring the troll-bells for you?
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Chief Inspector of the Style Police - FRICK |
Khavi Vetali
Tabula Rasa Systems
The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2007.07.24 21:22:00 -
[49]
Originally by: Intigo
Instead he logs off and loses his ship.
Ship wasn't lost, read more carefully.
Anyway, bringing something like this to the forums means you A) want to make it public for propaganda reasons, B) to provoke a response, or C) to whine.
I'm guessing it was B) in this case, but I'd have waited more than 24 hours for a response before making it public.
Quote:
Tyger! Tyger! burning bright; In the forests of the night,
What immortal hand or eye; Could frame thy fearful symmetry?
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Gaige Gamba
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Posted - 2007.07.24 21:23:00 -
[50]
Originally by: Setana Manoro
Originally by: Astro Teller
stuff
What are you, CCP ?
Show me how the use of a mechanic close to being clasified as exploit is OK ?
If you didn't figure out what i was talking off, that guy entered a char on the same account so that his FRICK main can be safe, or the vaga would have killed him in that 15 min agro.
Close to being classified? It technically is.
It uses a game mechanic (emergency warp when logged off and not in a bubble) for purposes outside its intended use (consciously logging in order to trigger an emergency warp, as opposed to the emergency warp being triggered upon loss of connection to avoid undue ship loss) for personal gain (their ship stays intact because the emergency warp allows them to avoid a combat situation they felt they would lose).
Simple as that. CCP has no way to prove whether it was either, though, so they cannot reasonably classify all the many cases that come up as exploits.
Originally by: Llerrad Gabemid
holy damn, the pirate forum is like 10x less usefull than any of the other already un-usefull forums.
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Intigo
Amarr
The League of Legitimate Nigerian Businessmen
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Posted - 2007.07.24 21:57:00 -
[51]
Edited by: Intigo on 24/07/2007 21:56:57
Originally by: Khavi Vetali
Originally by: Intigo
Instead he logs off and loses his ship.
Ship wasn't lost, read more carefully.
My bad, I thought his "poof" was a case of him dying fast due to having no hardeners or damage control on. I'm silly. :p
--
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Shamis Orzoz
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
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Posted - 2007.07.24 21:59:00 -
[52]
Edited by: Shamis Orzoz on 24/07/2007 22:01:06
Originally by: Julien Derida
Originally by: Tassi
Sham is definitly not a bottom feeding forum troll I can assure you this.
Don't you think it's strange that the guy who released Kugutsumen on the community has suddenly developed a sense of e-honour? Doesn't that ring the troll-bells for you?
I have never condoned logging to save one's ship, and we've kicked out at least 20 people in the last 3 years because of it.
Kugutsumen is not part of this discussion, and I won't bother debating about him since I'm certain you believe all of the crap digitalcommunist made up about him.
You've got ex-snigg in your midst, who I'm sure can confirm my sincerity with regards to this issue.
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Shamis Orzoz
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
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Posted - 2007.07.24 22:08:00 -
[53]
Originally by: Neurotic Cat
You on the other hand appear to be a bottom feeding forum troll looking to stir up a little drama storm.
FRICK does not condone logging off to save ships. If this becomes an issue I'll start spanking people. But as of right now this case is closed.
You could have at least pretended like you were going to conduct an unbiased investigation.
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Julien Derida
Sharks With Frickin' Laser Beams
Mercenary Coalition
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Posted - 2007.07.24 22:37:00 -
[54]
Originally by: Shamis Orzoz
Originally by: Julien Derida
Don't you think it's strange that the guy who released Kugutsumen on the community has suddenly developed a sense of e-honour? Doesn't that ring the troll-bells for you?
I have never condoned logging to save one's ship, and we've kicked out at least 20 people in the last 3 years because of it.
Kugutsumen is not part of this discussion, and I won't bother debating about him since I'm certain you believe all of the crap digitalcommunist made up about him.
You've got ex-snigg in your midst, who I'm sure can confirm my sincerity with regards to this issue.
I'd love to believe you, as I used to think highly of you. Unfortunately, the way I've seen you behave here and on SHC over the last six months has left me with the sad opinion that you have become a troll. The ex-snigg I know think similarly.
If you were genuinely concerned or disappointed rather than attempting to throw mud at us, why didn't you wait for a private reply to your eve-mail rather than posting this thread 20 minutes after the incident? I can't see any motivation for posting so quickly, other than the desire to cause a public argument.
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Chief Inspector of the Style Police - FRICK |
Faekurias
Federation Fleet
Endless Horizon
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Posted - 2007.07.24 22:41:00 -
[55]
was it Goldhorn!?!???!!
GH <3
Give the Nighthawk back it's shieldrecharge! |
Shamis Orzoz
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
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Posted - 2007.07.24 23:00:00 -
[56]
Edited by: Shamis Orzoz on 24/07/2007 23:02:15
Originally by: Julien Derida
I'd love to believe you, as I used to think highly of you. Unfortunately, the way I've seen you behave here and on SHC over the last six months has left me with the sad opinion that you have become a troll. The ex-snigg I know think similarly.
If you were genuinely concerned or disappointed rather than attempting to throw mud at us, why didn't you wait for a private reply to your eve-mail rather than posting this thread 20 minutes after the incident? I can't see any motivation for posting so quickly, other than the desire to cause a public argument.
If I was a troll I would've posted something like this:
A FRICK pilot logged in combat today, its a shame that FRICK would condone such activity, but I guess I can't expect less from a bunch of bob pets. All FRICK pilots are lame loggers.
That's a troll. Enjoy.
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Jen Aeida
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Posted - 2007.07.24 23:13:00 -
[57]
Edited by: Jen Aeida on 24/07/2007 23:13:23
Alt selection ****up
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Julien Derida
Sharks With Frickin' Laser Beams
Mercenary Coalition
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Posted - 2007.07.24 23:15:00 -
[58]
Quote:
If I was a troll I would've posted something like this:
A FRICK pilot logged in combat today, its a shame that FRICK would condone such activity, but I guess I can't expect less from a bunch of bob pets. All FRICK pilots are lame loggers.
That's a troll. Enjoy.
I said you were a troll, not a cliched, ineffective, smack-talking troll. If you'd posted the above, people would have immediately called you out on it. Instead you took the cleverer and more effective 'polite troll' route. Nice try.
For future reference, we don't condone logging out to save ships. If you catch one of our pilots doing it in the future, you can eve-mail us and we'll happily reprimand them. Conversely, if you try and make a fuss about it on the forums we'll probably just tell you to **** off. We're cranky like that.
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Chief Inspector of the Style Police - FRICK |
Ja'kar
kleptomaniacs
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Posted - 2007.07.25 00:01:00 -
[59]
fight! fight! fight!
for a sec I thought I was in a klept post
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vile56
Nubs.
D-L
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Posted - 2007.07.25 01:53:00 -
[60]
shamis being called a troll and mc bickering with him  this IS the end of piracy/pvp.
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Sig removed. Is in appropriate for the forums. mail us with a link if you want to know why -Kaemonn ([email protected]) |
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