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Caldorous Gallente	Posted - 2007.07.27 21:00:00 - [1] Lately i haven't got much time to play EVE, but i need the money from missions to finance the GTC so i need suggestions about ships. I can use any gallentean ship, all amarr ships and all t1 caldari ships. My missile skills are mediocre at their best and the shield tanking skills do not shine either. There is no need of a explicit setup, only general tips like: "rails, speed and armor tank" or "nos, shield tank, cap mods" And of course, i wont use faction items and the less rigs as possible Thanks in advance ----------------------------- Originally by: elbenito Originally by: Nicholas Barker How do you say minmatar correctly? slave (slāv)
Ararius e X i l e FREGE Alliance	Posted - 2007.07.27 21:26:00 - [2] Drake Or a Raven Take your pick. However both realy shine with rigs and faction lewt \o/ Originally by: Alski It depends how much CCP learn from past user interface mistakes, i'm sure they'll do very well, but if not i'll be right clicking on random people and selecting "Orbit at 0.5m"
Nocturnal Avenger The Ankou The Reckoning.	Posted - 2007.07.27 21:26:00 - [3] Probably the raven. - Carebear Pirate -
Caldorous Gallente	Posted - 2007.07.27 22:00:00 - [4] raven with cruise missiles i presume... right? ----------------------------- Originally by: elbenito Originally by: Nicholas Barker How do you say minmatar correctly? slave (slāv)
Leandro Salazar The Blackguard Wolves	Posted - 2007.07.27 22:07:00 - [5] Originally by: Caldorous raven with cruise missiles i presume... right? Well wanting to run missions fast but not wanting to invest decent money are kinda mutually exclusive. Best balance between low investment and decent return is probably the Nighthawk. Cruise Ravens suck tbh, people use them because they're convenient, not because theyre fast. Astarte/Eos/Ishtar probably work reasonably well too. Always wanted to try out a sentry Ishtar, alas I don't have Gal cruiser 5 and won't have it anytime soon either... There is no 'n' in turret There is no 'r' in faction There is no 'a' in Scorpion There is no 'e' in Caldari There is no makeup in rogue drones
MorbidReality Minmatar The Templars Knights	Posted - 2007.07.27 22:36:00 - [6] For weapons you'll want railguns/artillery etc, and missiles. For tanking, overall, you'll want shield, however it depends on what ship you are flying. You will want cap to keep your tank running, so cap rechargers, cap boosters and modules that keep your cap alive is your good friend here.
Viikator	Posted - 2007.07.28 10:24:00 - [7] I've been doing lvl4s in an Ishtar. Have never had to warp out yet but I haven't done all the missions, but I've done quite many. It's also quite fast, almost 900m/sec, can get to blaster-range quick enough. Can tow&salvage while killing battleships too. I really don't know how it compares to the other good boats but it's been very very good for me.
Nocturnal Avenger The Ankou The Reckoning.	Posted - 2007.07.28 11:33:00 - [8] Originally by: Ararius Drake However both realy shine with rigs and faction lewt \o/ Anything does. Pointless remarks ftl. - Carebear Pirate -
Caldorous Gallente	Posted - 2007.07.28 13:09:00 - [9] ty guys, i'll try to discover new tactics with the ishtar to make the missions faster ----------------------------- Originally by: elbenito Originally by: Nicholas Barker How do you say minmatar correctly? slave (slāv)
Plokk	Posted - 2007.07.28 15:57:00 - [10] Rattlesnake , and yes , i have flown the CNR also and timed rooms . It's all in that 50% velocity bonus ;)
Leandro Salazar The Blackguard Wolves	Posted - 2007.07.28 17:16:00 - [11] Originally by: Plokk Rattlesnake , and yes , i have flown the CNR also and timed rooms . It's all in that 50% velocity bonus ;) Yeah sure, because the CNR so does not get that bonus too... The only way a Rattle is faster than a CNR is if you have a crappy CNR fit with less than 3 BCUs, or if you did that before RMR :P There is no 'n' in turret There is no 'r' in faction There is no 'a' in Scorpion There is no 'e' in Caldari There is no makeup in rogue drones
Toria Nynys Minmatar	Posted - 2007.07.28 18:04:00 - [12] It's possible to do all L4s decently fast in a CNR or even a normal Raven with cruises and t2 fittings. You can pull off a rigged, fitted Raven for under 300M. You won't set any records, but it'll still be faster than any other set-up on average. 500-700SP in missiles is enough to get started. Got my vote for a 3 BCU setup as well. With my skills a cruise Raven seems to work better than a torp one, but everyone has their preferences.
Krav Egad Inc. Sparta Alliance	Posted - 2007.07.28 21:33:00 - [13] You're by far a better Gallentean than a Caldari, so I would suggest you try the Hyperion and Navy Megathron. The Hyperion has a tank bonus that makes it very good at sustainable tanks, but the Navy Mega has the low slots for damage mods as well as tank. I can't say for certain which is faster, an 8th turret or 7+dmg mods, but they're probably very close. I chose navy because of 1) pimp factor, 2) better ability to use different setups with so many lows, and 3) fun factor. Krav ===== Stacking Penalties and you
Caldorous Gallente	Posted - 2007.07.29 01:04:00 - [14] I'd say the navy megathron for a new reason, as a gallente ship, it suffers from a grave capacitor problem(like most of the non drone based t1 gallente ships). The best bet to survive(without using a trillion of cap boosters ^^) is keep the ship out of the harms way using the distance as tank, and this is done by using rails. And everyone knows that the hype is not desined to be a rail ship ----------------------------- Originally by: elbenito Originally by: Nicholas Barker How do you say minmatar correctly? slave (slāv)
Krav Egad Inc. Sparta Alliance	Posted - 2007.07.29 01:28:00 - [15] Originally by: Caldorous I'd say the navy megathron for a new reason, as a gallente ship, it suffers from a grave capacitor problem(like most of the non drone based t1 gallente ships). The best bet to survive(without using a trillion of cap boosters ^^) is keep the ship out of the harms way using the distance as tank, and this is done by using rails. And everyone knows that the hype is not desined to be a rail ship I got both navy mega with 425's and the hyperion with 350's to a sustainable tank with the following rigs: 2x CCC I rigs 1x Aux Nano Pump I Tankwise, with gal BS IV, I actually put a tank capable of more DPS regen on the navy mega with 8 low slots than I did with the hyp's 6! All t2 or less. And it was a very narrow margin, not extremely noticeable, but I was impressed with the navy mega in all out tank form none-the-less. Course, I usually never use that setup, only on the very hard missions. Most of the time I have dmg mods on it. Please note both ships with rigs and a couple cap mods can do very powerful, and more importantly, sustainable tanks, not requiring a single cap booster. Krav ===== Stacking Penalties and you
Lorette Gallente Grandma's WIth Guns	Posted - 2007.07.29 01:59:00 - [16] If your going for money-for-timecards, id recommend the domi. Unless ofcouse you have the funds to set up a high-sec mission rape-machine. My domi has a total worth of 200mill (or at least it did when i bought it months ago) and runs all Lv4's fine. I run in 0.1 so rewards and LP are much juicier. Some people prefer to run in high sec with 1bill+ ships so that you chew through the missions faster and get roughly the same overall.
Caldorous Gallente	Posted - 2007.07.29 10:51:00 - [17] Originally by: Lorette If your going for money-for-timecards, id recommend the domi. Unless ofcouse you have the funds to set up a high-sec mission rape-machine. My domi has a total worth of 200mill (or at least it did when i bought it months ago) and runs all Lv4's fine. I run in 0.1 so rewards and LP are much juicier. Some people prefer to run in high sec with 1bill+ ships so that you chew through the missions faster and get roughly the same overall. Is better the dominix than the ishtar? The domi's speed is really low About the limited budget, i dont want to spend money for rigs (although i'll recheck the market to see if know they are affordable imo) ----------------------------- Originally by: elbenito Originally by: Nicholas Barker How do you say minmatar correctly? slave (slāv)
Naran Darkmood Gallente	Posted - 2007.07.29 13:05:00 - [18] Originally by: Caldorous Originally by: Lorette If your going for money-for-timecards, id recommend the domi. Unless ofcouse you have the funds to set up a high-sec mission rape-machine. My domi has a total worth of 200mill (or at least it did when i bought it months ago) and runs all Lv4's fine. I run in 0.1 so rewards and LP are much juicier. Some people prefer to run in high sec with 1bill+ ships so that you chew through the missions faster and get roughly the same overall. Is better the dominix than the ishtar? The domi's speed is really low About the limited budget, i dont want to spend money for rigs (although i'll recheck the market to see if know they are affordable imo) rigs are quiete cheap nowadays, a set of 1x ANP and 2x CCC ain't more expensive than a Domi. Originally by: Marcus TheMartin I thought there would be american isk farmers over on eve china to be honest
Vashtina O'toth Gallente Political Warfare Executive	Posted - 2007.07.30 10:45:00 - [19] Originally by: Caldorous And everyone knows that the hype is not desined to be a rail ship But but but the Hyperion is sooo pretty. She's perhaps not the best at the jobs I give her, but she's sporting a nice rack of 425mm rails and chew's up lvl4 missions just fine. Rails, Drone extender, cap recharge + sensor booster and low's with energized plating to suit, dcuII and a large repper. Any spares go to tracking / mag stabs. With all guns blazing the repper can run full pelt forever. Drones are in charge of Frigate and Cruiser duty. There are some mission where she's allowed out in her 'proper' gear of blasters + afterburner etc for a change of pace. "All the security in the world can't stop a lone gunman dedicated to exchange his life for the target."
Carniflex Caldari Fallout Research Fallout Project	Posted - 2007.07.30 10:58:00 - [20] Navy Raven is the best mission running ship in game. Failing that Dominix (but i have no personal experience on that) or regular raven. Time for Worlds Collide (serpentis/gurista) killing off 3 stages is 30 minutes. Gurista/Angel extravaganza also around 30 minutes (5 stages cleared, no bonus stage). This is not solo speed but team of 2 CNR's. Times for solo work are somewhat longer but not 2x longer (paying attention to 2 accounts costs some efficency). There was thread about Raven with 300 mil budget for mission running last week. If you go over that you might get some good ideas should you prefer to go that way. You do not need raven for missions at all costs, it's just fastest for majority of lev 4 missions.
vanBuskirk Caldari	Posted - 2007.07.30 11:33:00 - [21] About rigs; if money is a major factor, and for the OP it is, how about buying a BPO or BPC and making your own? Four or five missions gives me enough bits for a CCC. Admittedly, I have good production skills; but maybe you can cut a bring-your-own-bits deal? ---------------------------------------------- "Violence is the last refuge of the incompetent."
Edania Caldari Ordo Adeptus Astartes Edge Of Sanity	Posted - 2007.07.30 11:51:00 - [22] shamless plug for my own faveroute :) the Rokh is pretty Decent can hit targets at extreme mission range even with antimatter can fit 425s and fire them without serious problems along with running a damn fine tank at the same time 5 T2 mediums mincemeat any close frigate, her main problems are EM toeting badguys and Angels as they tend to sneak under her range Quote: my Clone was excelent, i just had too many skillpoints
Caldorous Gallente	Posted - 2007.07.30 15:09:00 - [23] Originally by: Edania shamless plug for my own faveroute :) the Rokh is pretty Decent can hit targets at extreme mission range even with antimatter can fit 425s and fire them without serious problems along with running a damn fine tank at the same time 5 T2 mediums mincemeat any close frigate, her main problems are EM toeting badguys and Angels as they tend to sneak under her range I was thinking about the rokh too, but my shield tanking skills are mediocre (all to 3, with no compensations) so i thought that that ship might not be the fastest -----------------------------
FT Diomedes Gallente Ductus Exemplo	Posted - 2007.07.30 15:26:00 - [24] Edited by: FT Diomedes on 30/07/2007 15:27:21 I have found the Megathron with 350mm Rails* to be a very good mission running ship. It's not as good as a Raven, but it gets the job done. * - I tried 425mm Rails - the 350mm Rails are better for PvE, in my experience. They have better tracking and a higher rate of fire. They also hold a lot more ammo, which means you don't spend as much time reloading. ------------ Improvize. Adapt. Overcome.
Krulla Minmatar True Centii	Posted - 2007.07.30 17:58:00 - [25] Edited by: Krulla on 30/07/2007 17:58:49 I run missions quite fast in the hyperion.. have managed to do every mission except recon 1/3 without warping out. 8x 350mm rails 2x tracking computer, 1x sensor booster, 2x cap recharger II 1x LAR II, 2-4x hardeners, 1-3xdamage mod 3x CCC rigs. Permarun everything. Everything tech II except the rigs.
Xaen Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2007.07.30 18:05:00 - [26] Originally by: Toria Nynys It's possible to do all L4s decently fast in a CNR or even a normal Raven with cruises and t2 fittings. You can pull off a rigged, fitted Raven for under 300M. You won't set any records, but it'll still be faster than any other set-up on average. 500-700SP in missiles is enough to get started. Got my vote for a 3 BCU setup as well. With my skills a cruise Raven seems to work better than a torp one, but everyone has their preferences. lol @ crappy dps and crappy tanks the raven & CNR make Raven < CNR < Drake < Dominix My domi runs it's LAR II indefinitely and pumps out 506 dps (raw). That's with 3 relatively cheap rigs (Aux nano pumps). Typical Raven fit takes three of the most expensive rigs, and does about 280 raw dps. And it sucks hard vs cruisers. Mediocre fitted Raven = 300M Dominix with the best t2/named of everything = 150M and almost double the dps. Just check out of the forum posts about the Vengeance mission. Raven users have a HELL of a time killing Rachen. Refits, MWDs, Webs, Nos, manuvering him into the station, following him out to respawn point then slowboating back, bringing multiple friends, keeping specially fit battleships in corp hangar. With my domi, I just sicced my drones on him, lit up my 350mms and watched him die. ----------- Support fixing the EVE UI Drones should not aggro anything missiles or turrets don't.
Blue Wraith	Posted - 2007.07.30 21:39:00 - [27] I'd go with what you know. Domi with armor tank seems like it would be your best fit for running missions. They are easy to get into, easy to tank, and cheap.
Qui Shon	Posted - 2007.07.30 23:48:00 - [28] Hmm, I'm currently pondering whether to go for Raven or Domi. I've been doing some lvl 4's with a passive Myrmidon that has backup support from a Vexor , but I found the serpentis room in Worlds Collide is giving me problems. So, time to go active tank and battleship. How does a 2x BCU II torp raven only do 280 damage? Admittedly I'm reliant on quickfit here, but it tells me that with BS, torp and missile support skills at no more then 3, no implants, standard torps and HammerheadII's I would do 508 damage on a battleship structure, which I guess is "raw" dps. 362dps without drones. Is quickfit totally wrong or is there something I'm not getting? I will do the math myself at some point, to verify quickfit results, but it seems to me I can get a little more dps from a torp raven then from a domi, and while my drone skills are not great (no T2 Heavies or Sentries), they are above lvl 3, that's for sure. The tanks I'm having issues with, without spending bucks on ridiculously expensive faction modules, XL booster means having to use an injector. Single LAR Domi is easier to fit, but doesn't seem to be able to tank much? Dual LAR would be better, but would also need injector, and thus have fitting issues with guns. It seems neither BS can match my passive Myrmi tank though, not while limited to T2 at least, and that worries me a bit. Maybe I got it all wrong, I haven't fired up excel yet so don't know for sure, but this is what it looks like to me.
Xaen Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2007.07.31 03:35:00 - [29] Originally by: Qui Shon How does a 2x BCU II torp raven only do 280 damage? Is quickfit totally wrong or is there something I'm not getting? I will do the math myself at some point, to verify quickfit results, but it seems to me I can get a little more dps from a torp raven then from a domi, and while my drone skills are not great (no T2 Heavies or Sentries), they are above lvl 3, that's for sure. I was using cruise in my calculations because torps are a waste of rounds vs. cruisers, they fly really slow and get shot down about as much despite taking 3 defenders. Sure torpedos would do a lot more vs. a battleship if they all hit. Problem is they won't. Most battleships in missions used defenders which nerf caldari damage considerably unless you fight up close. Drones and guns don't have that problem. And Heavy drones don't have a problem killing cruisers, lights tear up frigates. I'm actually considering trying a megathron again. It does almost the same dps as a dominix, but doesn't get most of it's damage from drones which can be blown up, targetted, cause room aggro etc. Not to mention it's dead sexy. ----------- Support fixing the EVE UI Drones should not aggro anything missiles or turrets don't.
Qui Shon	Posted - 2007.07.31 05:53:00 - [30] Edited by: Qui Shon on 31/07/2007 05:53:22 Oh yeah, I hated those defenders when using a drake. All I needed was a little nudge in the right direction, thanks for giving it. Domi, here I come. Ps, if someone is using a Raven with T1 / T2 gear, meaning massive energy drain from shield booster, those really cheap (5 mil) core defence capacitor safe guards rigs give more benefit then ccc rigs. 10% less shield booster cap use is greater then 15% additional capacitor.
Hectaire Glade Forum Jockey	Posted - 2007.07.31 07:25:00 - [31] If you have cash to burn then a passive tanked Rattlesnake with DG Cruise and atleast 1 of the 3 BCS being DG as well, 2 DG invuln + 2 pith passive hardners Tanks forever, you don't have to feck around changing hardners for rat specific tanking, chuck on a drone link aug and a tractor in your 2 other highs Its faster over time than a CNR, looks a hell of a lot sexier and is near indestructable.
Carniflex Caldari Fallout Research Fallout Project	Posted - 2007.07.31 07:33:00 - [32] Originally by: Hectaire Glade If you have cash to burn then a passive tanked Rattlesnake with DG Cruise and atleast 1 of the 3 BCS being DG as well, 2 DG invuln + 2 pith passive hardners Tanks forever, you don't have to feck around changing hardners for rat specific tanking, chuck on a drone link aug and a tractor in your 2 other highs Its faster over time than a CNR, looks a hell of a lot sexier and is near indestructable. It is cooler looking indeed but not faster than CNR over time. Or well .. depends on definition but I can't imagine where in lev 4 missions will Rattlesnake run faster than CNR with reasonable fittings (meaning at least 2 BCU's). My CNR can tank all level 4 missions without warpouts with just T2 tank and cap injector (with room to spare for 1 target painter also). In both torpedo and cruise missile setups. I have even room for 3 BCU's in torp setup and 4 BCU's in cruise missile setup. Passive hardeners are not really good idea on battleship. Even Pith ones. Altho if efficency is not important all other ships besides Raven/Rattlesnake or CNR work fine also.
Yakia TovilToba Halliburton Inc.	Posted - 2007.07.31 19:42:00 - [33] Originally by: Xaen lol @ crappy dps and crappy tanks the raven & CNR make Raven < CNR < Drake < Dominix My domi runs it's LAR II indefinitely and pumps out 506 dps (raw). That's with 3 relatively cheap rigs (Aux nano pumps). Typical Raven fit takes three of the most expensive rigs, and does about 280 raw dps. And it sucks hard vs cruisers. Mediocre fitted Raven = 300M Dominix with the best t2/named of everything = 150M and almost double the dps. Just check out of the forum posts about the Vengeance mission. Refits, MWDs, Webs, Nos, manuvering him into the station, following him out to respawn point then slowboating back, bringing multiple friends, keeping specially fit battleships in corp hangar. With my domi, I just sicced my drones on him, lit up my 350mms and watched him die. Dude, get a clue. My cnr has a dps of around 670 now, with cruise missiles. In addition to that there are 5 medium drones (no clue whats their dps). When i had some really expensive stuff the dps was beyond 700. A raven with only t2 stuff should get somewhere around 500 + drones. If you don't do enough damage on cruisers, get 2 rigor rigs and a precision implant and train your skills and you will deal full damage. And your rachen tactics: i can only laugh on that. When i see Rachen i activate my 7 cruise launcers and rachen is dead even before they launched half of their payload. I think your numbers are from t1 fitting with 0 damagemods and skills at 1.
FT Diomedes Gallente Ductus Exemplo	Posted - 2007.07.31 20:14:00 - [34] Edited by: FT Diomedes on 31/07/2007 20:16:08 Nevermind that the thread(s) he linked to about Rachen was quite old - or that most people in those threads had trouble with that NPC. ------------ Improvize. Adapt. Overcome.
J Valkor Blackguard Brigade	Posted - 2007.07.31 20:22:00 - [35] Edited by: J Valkor on 31/07/2007 20:23:06 My current PVE Nighthawk dishes out 407 DPS. If I need to I can switch to faction heavies and up that to around 470. Beyond merely Cruisers, that is almost full damage to frigates. The one problem is that you have to learn to count shots. My skills aren't even maxed yet and I only have the 3% ROF implant.
Caldorous Gallente	Posted - 2007.07.31 23:20:00 - [36] Originally by: J Valkor Edited by: J Valkor on 31/07/2007 20:23:06 My current PVE Nighthawk dishes out 407 DPS. If I need to I can switch to faction heavies and up that to around 470. Beyond merely Cruisers, that is almost full damage to frigates. The one problem is that you have to learn to count shots. My skills aren't even maxed yet and I only have the 3% ROF implant. Counting shots its really really boring -----------------------------
Moira Pricecheck	Posted - 2007.07.31 23:32:00 - [37] Edited by: Moira Pricecheck on 31/07/2007 23:35:19 Originally by: Xaen Originally by: Toria Nynys It's possible to do all L4s decently fast in a CNR or even a normal Raven with cruises and t2 fittings. You can pull off a rigged, fitted Raven for under 300M. You won't set any records, but it'll still be faster than any other set-up on average. 500-700SP in missiles is enough to get started. Got my vote for a 3 BCU setup as well. With my skills a cruise Raven seems to work better than a torp one, but everyone has their preferences. lol @ crappy dps and crappy tanks the raven & CNR make Raven < CNR < Drake < Dominix My domi runs it's LAR II indefinitely and pumps out 506 dps (raw). That's with 3 relatively cheap rigs (Aux nano pumps). Typical Raven fit takes three of the most expensive rigs, and does about 280 raw dps. And it sucks hard vs cruisers. Mediocre fitted Raven = 300M Dominix with the best t2/named of everything = 150M and almost double the dps. Just check out of the forum posts about the Vengeance mission. Raven users have a HELL of a time killing Rachen. Refits, MWDs, Webs, Nos, manuvering him into the station, following him out to respawn point then slowboating back, bringing multiple friends, keeping specially fit battleships in corp hangar. With my domi, I just sicced my drones on him, lit up my 350mms and watched him die. My CNR throws 700 dps and runs it's gist x-type large shield booster indefinitely. Edit 825 dps if you add 5x Hammerhead IIs
Rystin Timbal	Posted - 2007.08.01 00:43:00 - [38] Edited by: Rystin Timbal on 01/08/2007 00:45:06 Basic, well tanked raven can do the job. But it seems people are argueing that gallente have the market on PvE now, too. Ruddy easymodes. They need to be nerfed or the rest of the universe brought up to speed. And that's just outright slander about the CNR dps. On may standard raven, with no drones, my skills and equipment I get 380 DPS raw. And that's without implants. And it's cheap. With drones, it easily puts it into the 450-500 area. And as for cruisers... get a TP and Guided missile precision. No problems. Projections for a CNR make me hit the 430 DPS/no drones area. But that is with cruise missiles 5. Such things can put you up to over 480 damage per missile. The shield tank can't be beat if you know your target.
Xaen Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2007.08.01 13:46:00 - [39] Originally by: FT Diomedes Edited by: FT Diomedes on 31/07/2007 20:47:04 Nevermind that the threads he linked to about Rachen were quite old - or that most people in those threads had trouble with that NPC. Rachen hasn't changed and people still ***** about it. I linked to specific posts, not threads in general. ----------- Support fixing the EVE UI Drones should not aggro anything missiles or turrets don't.
Xaen Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2007.08.01 13:52:00 - [40] Originally by: Yakia TovilToba Dude, get a clue. My cnr has a dps of around 670 now, with cruise missiles. In addition to that there are 5 medium drones (no clue whats their dps). When i had some really expensive stuff the dps was beyond 700. A raven with only t2 stuff should get somewhere around 500 + drones. If you don't do enough damage on cruisers, get 2 rigor rigs and a precision implant and train your skills and you will deal full damage. And your rachen tactics: i can only laugh on that. When i see Rachen i activate my 7 cruise launcers and rachen is dead even before they launched half of their payload. I think your numbers are from t1 fitting with 0 damagemods and skills at 1. I found a clue for you: Raven Navy Issue (Caldari BS IV, Cruise V, Cruise Specialization IV) Cruise Missile Launcher II [27xWrath Cruise Missile] Cruise Missile Launcher II [27xWrath Cruise Missile] Cruise Missile Launcher II [27xWrath Cruise Missile] Cruise Missile Launcher II [27xWrath Cruise Missile] Cruise Missile Launcher II [27xWrath Cruise Missile] Cruise Missile Launcher II [27xWrath Cruise Missile] Cruise Missile Launcher II [27xWrath Cruise Missile] Turret Slot Ballistic Deflection Field II Ballistic Deflection Field II Heat Dissipation Field II Heat Dissipation Field II X-Large C5-L Emergency Shield Overload I 'Copasetic' I Particle Field Acceleration Beta Reactor Control: Diagnostic System I Beta Reactor Control: Diagnostic System I Ballistic Control System II Ballistic Control System II Ballistic Control System II Rigs : Capacitor Control Circuit I \ Capacitor Control Circuit I \ Capacitor Control Circuit I \ Hammerhead II Hammerhead II Hammerhead II Hammerhead II Hammerhead II Hobgoblin II Hobgoblin II Hobgoblin II Hobgoblin II Hobgoblin II 13591 shield, 20.2/s, E/T/K/Ex=0/81/85/59 11953 armor, E/T/K/Ex=59/44/25/10 7001.68770691109 cap, +35.95/s, -104.0/s 138.0 m/s 333.2 DPS vs Rachen 423.9 DPS vs. Rachen w/Drones 195.0 DPS vs. Pithum Mortifier (Cruiser) 302.8 DPS vs. Pithum Mortifier (Cruiser) w/Drones 118.0 DPS vs. Angel Viper (Interceptor) w/Drones ~760M ISK I even left the drone skills I used on the dominx for the raven calculations, so it got huge bonuses to drone damage. Dominix (Gallente BS IV, Gallente Drone Specialization IV, Heavy Drone Op V) Drone Link Augmentor I Drone Link Augmentor I 350mm Railgun II [80xAntimatter Charge L] 350mm Railgun II [80xAntimatter Charge L] 350mm Railgun II [80xAntimatter Charge L] 350mm Railgun II [80xAntimatter Charge L] Cap Recharger II Cap Recharger II Cap Recharger II Cap Recharger II Cap Recharger II Damage Control II N-Type Explosive Hardener I N-Type Kinetic Hardener I N-Type Thermic Hardener I Large Armor Repairer II 1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane I Rigs : Auxiliary Nano Pump I \ Auxiliary Nano Pump I \ Auxiliary Nano Pump I \ Ogre II Ogre II Ogre II Ogre II Ogre II 6015 shield, 7.52/s, E/T/K/Ex=12/29/47/64 12493 armor, E/T/K/Ex=71/76/76/67 6000.0 cap, +51.56/s, -49.32/s 115.0 m/s 369.7 DPS vs. Rachen w/Drones 426.7 DPS vs. Pithum Mortifier w/Drones 458.4 DPS vs. Angel Viper w/Drones ~161M ISK ----------- Support fixing the EVE UI Drones should not aggro anything missiles or turrets don't.
Xaen Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2007.08.01 13:55:00 - [41] Originally by: Moira Pricecheck My CNR throws 700 dps and runs it's gist x-type large shield booster indefinitely. Edit 825 dps if you add 5x Hammerhead IIs lmao, that's a 1.1BN ship Gonna suck when you lose it. I could build a fleet of seven fitted dominixes for that price. ----------- Support fixing the EVE UI Drones should not aggro anything missiles or turrets don't.
Huldradans Black Omega Security Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2007.08.01 15:02:00 - [42] Nice comparison, Xaen, thanks! --- FREE TS, FORUM AND KILLBOARD HOSTING: http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=567568
Markus Aurelian	Posted - 2007.08.01 15:26:00 - [43] Originally by: Xaen Edited by: Xaen on 01/08/2007 15:07:15 Originally by: Yakia TovilToba Dude, get a clue. My cnr has a dps of around 670 now, with cruise missiles. In addition to that there are 5 medium drones (no clue whats their dps). When i had some really expensive stuff the dps was beyond 700. A raven with only t2 stuff should get somewhere around 500 + drones. If you don't do enough damage on cruisers, get 2 rigor rigs and a precision implant and train your skills and you will deal full damage. And your rachen tactics: i can only laugh on that. When i see Rachen i activate my 7 cruise launcers and rachen is dead even before they launched half of their payload. I think your numbers are from t1 fitting with 0 damagemods and skills at 1. I found a clue for you: Raven Navy Issue (Caldari BS IV, Cruise V, Cruise Specialization IV) Cruise Missile Launcher II [27xWrath Cruise Missile] Cruise Missile Launcher II [27xWrath Cruise Missile] Cruise Missile Launcher II [27xWrath Cruise Missile] Cruise Missile Launcher II [27xWrath Cruise Missile] Cruise Missile Launcher II [27xWrath Cruise Missile] Cruise Missile Launcher II [27xWrath Cruise Missile] Cruise Missile Launcher II [27xWrath Cruise Missile] Turret Slot Ballistic Deflection Field II Ballistic Deflection Field II Heat Dissipation Field II Heat Dissipation Field II X-Large C5-L Emergency Shield Overload I 'Copasetic' I Particle Field Acceleration Beta Reactor Control: Diagnostic System I Beta Reactor Control: Diagnostic System I Ballistic Control System II Ballistic Control System II Ballistic Control System II Rigs : Capacitor Control Circuit I \ Capacitor Control Circuit I \ Capacitor Control Circuit I \ Hammerhead II Hammerhead II Hammerhead II Hammerhead II Hammerhead II Hobgoblin II Hobgoblin II Hobgoblin II Hobgoblin II Hobgoblin II 13591 shield, 20.2/s, E/T/K/Ex=0/81/85/59 11953 armor, E/T/K/Ex=59/44/25/10 7001.68770691109 cap, +35.95/s, -104.0/s 138.0 m/s 333.2 DPS vs Rachen (not counting his 3 defender launchers, realistically around 266.4) 423.9 DPS vs. Rachen w/Drones (not counting his 3 defender launchers, realistically around 356.4 (30% lost due to defenders)) 195.0 DPS vs. Pithum Mortifier (Cruiser) 302.8 DPS vs. Pithum Mortifier (Cruiser) w/Drones 118.0 DPS vs. Angel Viper (Interceptor) w/Drones ~760M ISK I even left the drone skills I used on the dominx for the raven calculations, so it got huge bonuses to drone damage. Dominix (Gallente BS IV, Gallente Drone Specialization IV, Heavy Drone Op V) Drone Link Augmentor I Drone Link Augmentor I 350mm Railgun II [80xAntimatter Charge L] 350mm Railgun II [80xAntimatter Charge L] 350mm Railgun II [80xAntimatter Charge L] 350mm Railgun II [80xAntimatter Charge L] Cap Recharger II Cap Recharger II Cap Recharger II Cap Recharger II Cap Recharger II Damage Control II N-Type Explosive Hardener I N-Type Kinetic Hardener I N-Type Thermic Hardener I Large Armor Repairer II 1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane I Rigs : Auxiliary Nano Pump I \ Auxiliary Nano Pump I \ Auxiliary Nano Pump I \ Ogre II Ogre II Ogre II Ogre II Ogre II 6015 shield, 7.52/s, E/T/K/Ex=12/29/47/64 12493 armor, E/T/K/Ex=71/76/76/67 6000.0 cap, +51.56/s, -49.32/s 115.0 m/s 369.7 DPS vs. Rachen w/Drones 426.7 DPS vs. Pithum Mortifier w/Drones 458.4 DPS vs. Angel Viper w/Drones ~161M ISK theres other skills that affect missile damage besides cruise and cruise spec. i dont know if you took those into account on your calculations, but i had different numbers when i set up my raven. i also drop one of the secondary damage hardeners for a target painter and that helps vs the smaller ships (i use torps so its a must for me). Meatwad FTW
Slayton Ford Uninvited Guests	Posted - 2007.08.01 17:36:00 - [44] Edited by: Slayton Ford on 01/08/2007 17:36:20 I just did Vengeance last night in a Cruise fitted raven and had no problem with Rachen. My Cruise skills are bare minimum at lvl3, BS lvl3, Guided Missle Precision 2. It took probably one reload spamming missles at him, but he still died quickly. The one thing that helps was running a Drone Link Aug so I could send in the Vespa IIs. I also did AE 6th room last night for the first time with only one warp out. In this case (and with angels in general), i've noticed cruises work better then torps due to angel BSs having a smaller sig radius. For the AE bonus room, cruises can pop the Thermal Cruise launchers much faster (3 volleys each for me) which is the majority of the incoming dps for this room. Next time I'll be able to do it w/o a warp out. One thing I do equip that most people wont is a Damage Control II. It already saved my normal raven on a Sansha mission when I had effects turned off and didnt see I was scrambled until I was in trouble (warped out at 50% structure). When flying a ship worth 1b+, a little extra protection is worth the slightly longer time to finish the mission (ie, 3 BCU IIs instead of 4). Also, IIRC defenders take two shots to take out a Torp, not one. --------------- This sig has been censored in fear of recieving the ban hammer...
Rossarian	Posted - 2007.08.01 17:52:00 - [45] Originally by: Xaen Domi BS Man you are so wrong in your assessment that it almost hurts me. For one, torps are a LOT better than you make them out, and Drones as main damage are a lot worse. Once you know how many torps will kill a ship, the travel time (which is not all that long anyway with good skills and maybe a velo rig or two) becomes insignificant because it really matters only on the first ship you shoot. And defenders are a non-issue. While drones constantly have to travel from ship to ship, which can take quite a bit of time with heavies, and you also have to scoop them a lot in wave missions. Also, 7 torps often enough instapop cruisers and always one-volley battlecruisers, which is a HUGE bonus on top of being faster against battleships. And lastly, your example using therm drones against Rachen of all things really tells me just how much clue about proper missioning you have. Yes a Domi is probably the best L3 runner (with sentries though), and might beat a low end cruise Raven, but thats about it. It is not really very upgradeable when you throw more money at it, while the Raven/CNR is one of the ships that benefits most from expensive stuff. And really, the performance of the ship is MUCH more important than the investment to high end runners, unless it gets excessive (> 3 bil on one fit). At least for me, the main point of mission running is to get better fittings so I can better mission-run. Occasionally I throw a hunnerd mil at some cheapass PvP ships, but 90% of my assets are in various high end PvE ships. What other point is there to all that money? I am fairly sure that for almost everyone with a mission runner mindset, investing in PvE is much preferable to squandering in PvP.
Xaen Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2007.08.01 18:00:00 - [46] Originally by: Slayton Ford Also, IIRC defenders take two shots to take out a Torp, not one. I thought it was three? Doesn't really matter to me because I'm not a torp fan. To slow, to crappy vs. small targets. ----------- Support fixing the EVE UI Drones should not aggro anything missiles or turrets don't.
Xaen Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2007.08.01 18:15:00 - [47] Originally by: Rossarian Originally by: Xaen Domi BS And lastly, your example using therm drones against Rachen of all things really tells me just how much clue about proper missioning you have. You ridiculing people for using thermal drones vs. Rachen tells me just how much clue about drones you have. Generally the Gallante drones will far out damage all the rest despite resistances. Do some quickfit checks against some Sansha, Gurista or Angel NPCs. The Gallente drone damage multiplier is ridiculous. ----------- Support fixing the EVE UI Drones should not aggro anything missiles or turrets don't.
FT Diomedes Gallente Ductus Exemplo	Posted - 2007.08.01 18:29:00 - [48] Originally by: Xaen Originally by: Rossarian Originally by: Xaen Domi BS And lastly, your example using therm drones against Rachen of all things really tells me just how much clue about proper missioning you have. You ridiculing people for using thermal drones vs. Rachen tells me just how much clue about drones you have. Generally the Gallante drones will far out damage all the rest despite resistances. Do some quickfit checks against some Sansha, Gurista or Angel NPCs. The Gallente drone damage multiplier is ridiculous. He is definitely right about the thermal drones being superior. This has been my experience throughout my limited Eve career. ------------ Improvize. Adapt. Overcome.
Remedios Sonrisa Eve University Ivy League	Posted - 2007.08.01 19:31:00 - [49] I love my Domi, though I know a raven will run missions faster. But sentries take the flight time of drones out of the equation. It makes missions faster, not as fast as a raven (much less a CNR), but makes the Domi in the top five BSes for L4s. As far as value, I think the Domi is at the top. Although I prefer thermal drones for PVE despite their sloth-like movements, kinetic drones are the way to go vs. Rachen (the resists of his raven's shields are 50/80 kin/thm). ....
Starlit Serenade	Posted - 2007.08.01 19:59:00 - [50] Maybe it's not the fastest, but I use a Domi with a sustainable dual LARII tank. Tank the whole room, and let my Orge IIs have fun. It's certainly faster for me in that I can do other things while playing EvE so I have more time to play. It evens out and more. Of course, the fastest way to run missions is to tank the full room with my Domi and let my corpmate rip everything apart with a CNR.
Xaen Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2007.08.01 20:22:00 - [51] I'm working on a plan to use my alt in an Exquror to triple-rep my domi. Then I'll just be able to aggro the room, let slip the drones and play the market. ----------- Support fixing the EVE UI Drones should not aggro anything missiles or turrets don't.
Leandro Salazar The Blackguard Wolves	Posted - 2007.08.01 20:34:00 - [52] Edited by: Leandro Salazar on 01/08/2007 20:41:01 Originally by: FT Diomedes Originally by: Xaen Originally by: Rossarian Originally by: Xaen Domi BS And lastly, your example using therm drones against Rachen of all things really tells me just how much clue about proper missioning you have. You ridiculing people for using thermal drones vs. Rachen tells me just how much clue about drones you have. Generally the Gallante drones will far out damage all the rest despite resistances. Do some quickfit checks against some Sansha, Gurista or Angel NPCs. The Gallente drone damage multiplier is ridiculous. He is definitely right about the thermal drones being superior. This has been my experience throughout my limited Eve career. Yes, thermal drones are better damage in GENERAL. But missions are not about generalizations, but about fitting the best things for the job. And Rachen has 50% kin resist and 80% therm on her pretty hefty shieldtank, meaning Vespas do more than twice the damage of Hammerheads against her shields, which is the vast majority of her effective hitpoints. (The average dps of quickfit is a crappy measure anyway, since it totally ignores tanking and thus has way too high emphasis on structure). Vespas actually do more damage than HHs even against shields and armor of the better standard Guristas BS and elite ships. It is Zerks and especially Praetors that are very inferior to them, which is why they are far better than racial drones against Sansha and Blood, where the racial weakness is hit by the worst drone. But Guristas are hit by the second best drone in their weakest resistance, and that is slightly better than the best drone on their 2nd worst resistance. So yes I know my stuff about drones, but you DON'T know your stuff about mission rats :P There is no 'n' in turret There is no 'r' in faction There is no 'a' in Scorpion There is no 'e' in Caldari There is no makeup in rogue drones
Qui Shon	Posted - 2007.08.02 06:11:00 - [53] Originally by: Rossarian And defenders are a non-issue. You mean they don't lower your dps? How? Or just that they don't lower it enough to matter?
Leandro Salazar The Blackguard Wolves	Posted - 2007.08.02 08:31:00 - [54] Originally by: Qui Shon Originally by: Rossarian And defenders are a non-issue. You mean they don't lower your dps? How? Or just that they don't lower it enough to matter? The latter. They kill maybe one torp every other volley, if even that. There are plenty of explosions in my torp cloud, but when you look at the log (or pay close attention to the damage you do) most of the time all seven connect regardless of all the fireworks. There is no 'n' in turret There is no 'r' in faction There is no 'a' in Scorpion There is no 'e' in Caldari There is no makeup in rogue drones
Xaen Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2007.08.02 13:17:00 - [55] Originally by: Leandro Salazar Originally by: Qui Shon Originally by: Rossarian And defenders are a non-issue. You mean they don't lower your dps? How? Or just that they don't lower it enough to matter? The latter. They kill maybe one torp every other volley, if even that. There are plenty of explosions in my torp cloud, but when you look at the log (or pay close attention to the damage you do) most of the time all seven connect regardless of all the fireworks. That's one advantage of torps over cruise. Last time I used torps, it took 3 defenders to take one out. Almost no NPC launches that many in time. Cruise missiles only take one defender, and if you fire from extreme range they can easily shoot down 1-3 every volley. ----------- Support fixing the EVE UI Drones should not aggro anything missiles or turrets don't.
Revenant Penance	Posted - 2007.08.02 23:24:00 - [56] 700 dps + drones on a beam-absolution here. 2 of these (me and my corpy) did Pirate Invasion level 4 in 11 minutes. I'd be surprised if any cruise-raven or CNR is faster. Perhaps a torp CNR with 2 painters would shave a little off, not sure. Rev
Carniflex Caldari Fallout Research Fallout Project	Posted - 2007.08.03 06:57:00 - [57] Originally by: Revenant Penance 700 dps + drones on a beam-absolution here. 2 of these (me and my corpy) did Pirate Invasion level 4 in 11 minutes. I'd be surprised if any cruise-raven or CNR is faster. Perhaps a torp CNR with 2 painters would shave a little off, not sure. Rev You are right. Absolution is faster than CNR in some missions. Pirate invasion is one of them. To be faster than CNR in Absolution you need relatively BS heavy missions where your opponents have weakness for EM/Thermal damage. At the end of day it's all about effective dps. Effective meaning amount of damage that actually gets in over your opponent tanking ability and resists. Being able to tank mission more than you need to tank to do it without warpouts does not make them go any faster.
Don Mavro	Posted - 2007.08.04 04:25:00 - [58] Originally by: Xaen Originally by: Toria Nynys It's possible to do all L4s decently fast in a CNR or even a normal Raven with cruises and t2 fittings. You can pull off a rigged, fitted Raven for under 300M. You won't set any records, but it'll still be faster than any other set-up on average. 500-700SP in missiles is enough to get started. Got my vote for a 3 BCU setup as well. With my skills a cruise Raven seems to work better than a torp one, but everyone has their preferences. lol @ crappy dps and crappy tanks the raven & CNR make Raven < CNR < Drake < Dominix My domi runs it's LAR II indefinitely and pumps out 506 dps (raw). That's with 3 relatively cheap rigs (Aux nano pumps). Typical Raven fit takes three of the most expensive rigs, and does about 280 raw dps. And it sucks hard vs cruisers. Mediocre fitted Raven = 300M Dominix with the best t2/named of everything = 150M and almost double the dps. Just check out of the forum posts about the Vengeance mission. Raven users have a HELL of a time killing Rachen. Refits, MWDs, Webs, Nos, manuvering him into the station, following him out to respawn point then slowboating back, bringing multiple friends, keeping specially fit battleships in corp hangar. With my domi, I just sicced my drones on him, lit up my 350mms and watched him die. lol @ poster... raven with t2 cruises & t2 med drones produces 584 raw dps. without drones 440. Cruisers popped in 3 volleys usualy. And you don't need to wait while your stupid drones rich target or agro all room for you. And Vengeance is not a problem then you use t2 cruises with good skills.
Kylar Renpurs Dusk Blade	Posted - 2007.08.04 05:53:00 - [59] Heh,, State Issue Raven Anyone? That'd be the wtfpwnmobile of missions,,,, sigh,,, @ The OP tho,, if you need money to maintain your GTC payments, try taking a month or two out to train up your alts for industry,, AFK income solves all your GTC woes :) Improve Market Competition!

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