EVE Search - Investment opportunity as part of a commerce course. 6% / week

All Channels

Market Discussions

Investment opportunity as part of a commerce course. 6% / week

» Click here to find additional results for this topic using Google

Monitor this thread via RSS [?]

Pages: 1 2 3 4 :: [one page]
Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 0 post(s)
Catherine Altair	Posted - 2007.08.09 08:44:00 - [1] hi Something about me first. I am a commerce student at The University of Sydney, Australia. As part of my study, i have an assignment whereby i am to create and manage a corporation to return the highest possible profit (made up money) after a 24 weeks period. Normal students use a simulation tool provided by the university to do this. I, on the otherhand, is an EvE player. It didn't take me long to realise that i could use EvE expansive economy system as part of my assignment. So i had a talk with my lecturer and he agrees to give me a try as a special case. As an EvE player, i am a largely experieced player. Though i have yet to make a big investment in the EvE market in term of trading and production. The only thing i had done was speculative trading of zydrine right before Revelation 2 came out. I am however a commerce student and am confident in my ability to create a very profitable return to my investors. So here is the deal. I am looking to raise up to 5 Billion. I will be in the business of trading and trading only. There will be no production, mining or reseach. I will buy low sell high and do speculative trading on minerals. Since i will be working alone, I will not create a corp. This is to stop people war dec'ing me. My expected return after the 24 weeks period is 400% or just less than 6% per week compounded. I will not pay out any money until the 24 weeks period is over. If you do not want your money tied down for 24 weeks, i advise against investing. I have spent about 2 days doing preliminary research on price between regions. I am very confident that i will be able to make a profit of 6% per week. Since i will be doing this as a part of my study I will be devoting a large amount of time to accomplish this. I do not take any management fee or retain any profits. At the end of the 24 weeks period, whatever i make will be paid out to the investors. Additionally, i will provide to my biggest investors a copy of my final report. This report will detail all my trading venture and i hope for it to be of great value to those who has chosen to trust me. As a bonus, all investors will be listed in my special thanks page. Should you want your real name to be used instead of your EvE character's, I will comply. Risks I ascertain the risk to be minimum. I will never grace low sec or be in a non-NPC corp. The only real risk to the investor is in me being a scammer. But that is a risk you yourself have to measure. This is an initial survey of interest. If you are interested in investing please send me an EvE mail detailing the amount you want to invest in. I will pay out manually at the end of the 24 weeks period. There is no minimum investment amount but i ask if your gonna toy with me with 0.27 isk then you should instead dont bother me. I need at least 1 billion to start. Do not wire me any money yet as i might not be doing this at all if people are not interested. If you want to discuss this with me please feel free to contact me. Please use EvE mail to discuss the medium. any questions and suggestions please post. thank you.
Catherine Altair	Posted - 2007.08.09 08:47:00 - [2] Place holder
Kasumi Kreig Caldari United Systems Navy	Posted - 2007.08.09 08:48:00 - [3] Have you considered creating a corporation & issuing shares, so you can use an in-game mechanism for keeping track of who has invested in your corp? Additionally, it makes the investments that people make in you a semi-liquid, tradable commodity. Additionally, it's not clear to me that you can get that much return on trades. Maybe you can, but the game (or perhaps other players) adapts to successful strategies, and they start to regress towards the norm.
Catherine Altair	Posted - 2007.08.09 08:57:00 - [4] to Kasumi, I will create a list of all my investors. The list will stored as hard copies by myself. Additionally, i will create a digital copy stored in my computer and on my allocated space on the university server. As I will not take any more investors once i start, i do not need to update this list. As per your comment about the shares. I find it to be superfluous as i dont see many people looking to trade them. if someone really wants to do so i will mediate the trade manually. Even if your suggesttion prove itself useful, i can at anytime create a corporation. it is my belief that i will be able to return 6% per week. please remember that i will be doing this very professionally and not as a recreation. because of this i think the productivity wil be much larger than your average 2 hours after dinner enterpreneur. i have done research to back this up. but i can not show this for an obvious reason.
BritishInvader Amarr Leela's Lamas	Posted - 2007.08.09 09:20:00 - [5] I don't see this going well for you. -+-+-+-+-+-+-+- EVE ART STORE - CLICK HERE
Nin Jem	Posted - 2007.08.09 09:40:00 - [6] You're going to struggle to get 5b investment when you're a 2.5 hour old alt.
Ray McCormack hirr	Posted - 2007.08.09 09:43:00 - [7] You say you're an EVE player, so who is your main? \| Open Source Offline Wallet \| BMBE ISK Loans \|
Catherine Altair	Posted - 2007.08.09 09:48:00 - [8] i would rather not reveal my main. i think my main's involvement in this will affect the outcome in a way that is undesirable for me. since revealing his/her name can affect my credibility and as such it could be like having a celebrity publicly promote my products. not that i think my main has a reputation leveling G. bush. i want this to be an entirely seperated isolated case. sorry i cant reveal my main.
Awox Advanced Logistics	Posted - 2007.08.09 10:02:00 - [9] I just sent you the 1 billion ISK to get started. I look forward to doing business with you. PSYCH! Seriously, POST WITH YOUR MAIN. - Interdiction Sphere Launcher I cpu usage tweak! (make it just like covert ops cloaks on recons)
WhitePhantom Gallente Edenists	Posted - 2007.08.09 10:21:00 - [10] Edited by: WhitePhantom on 09/08/2007 10:23:02 Originally by: Catherine Altair i would rather not reveal my main. i think my main's involvement in this will affect the outcome in a way that is undesirable for me. since revealing his/her name can affect my credibility and as such it could be like having a celebrity publicly promote my products. not that i think my main has a reputation leveling G. bush. i want this to be an entirely seperated isolated case. sorry i cant reveal my main. Your not going to get anyone to invest if you don't reveal who your main is. How can your main's credibility be effected if this isn't a complete and total scam. If your honest then your crediblity would only be effected in a positive way, I don't see why your afraid of that, so you must be afraid of having negative effective which makes me wonder why exactly that would be. The only answer I can come up with, would be that this is indeed a scam, and your looking to trick players who don't know any better. Its interesting your project is 24 weeks, but a normal semester is only 18 weeks as far as I am aware.
Ray McCormack hirr	Posted - 2007.08.09 10:44:00 - [11] Your argument for not wanting to reveal your main is flawed. You state you do not want to do it because you don't want celebrity to affect the product you are offering. You aren't offering a product, nor does the method by which you secure the ISK affect your stated goal for the project. Having your main involved in this will in no way impact on your ultimate cause. \| Open Source Offline Wallet \| BMBE ISK Loans \|
Daedalus DuGalle Gallente University of Caille	Posted - 2007.08.09 11:05:00 - [12] Edited by: Daedalus DuGalle on 09/08/2007 11:14:02 Edited by: Daedalus DuGalle on 09/08/2007 11:07:26 University of Sydney? PAH! University of Melbourne all the way!!! Edit: Actually, University of Caille all the way!!! Edit2: You know what could help your credibility? If you somehow give us a link to your university subject description page. If it mentions such an assignment it might help convince people. Originally by: Janu Hull Nothing says gritty cynicism like a 1 ISK note wedged between a pair of silicone enhanced knockers.
Ezoran DuBlaidd Rivers Enterprises Power Corrupts Industry's	Posted - 2007.08.09 12:14:00 - [13] if you create a corp, you could join one of the industrial-minded alliances. people are usually pretty big on having shares, pretty to look at, even if that's all it is (uce lighthouse). you could talk to one (or a few) of the long-standing members of the financial community, reveal your main to them and get them to endorse you, as it were.
Hash Kakakin	Posted - 2007.08.09 12:52:00 - [14] http://www.econ.usyd.edu.au/subject/FINC4101.html is the link to the unit im doing. the actual unit website with relevant contents are accesible by students and staff only. the reason i cant reveal my main is that i will have to put this as part of my final report. it will look relatively suspicious if i have "assistance" from another character. even for cridibility purpose. incidentally, my main is not that famous anyway so i hardly see how it will help.
Catherine Altair	Posted - 2007.08.09 12:54:00 - [15] lol thats mah main
Zorak Dren	Posted - 2007.08.09 13:18:00 - [16] Wow.. just wow...
Ricdic Caldari Corporate Research And Production Pty Ltd Zzz	Posted - 2007.08.09 14:01:00 - [17] Have 2 trusted members of the Eve community verify that you actually have a main character, and that it is XXX old. They accept that the only point in which the main can be revealed, is in the event of a scam (failure to pay by the 24 week eta). If you honestly don't see why this is relevant then I question your true amount of time spent in-game. Everyone knows that you can create an alt, run a scam, and then create a new alt. If a main can be linked to your account, then you are putting your reputation on the line only in the event of a scam. Your rep would not be used in any way other than this as only a couple of people would know it. If you don't reveal your main at least in this method, your product has zero chance of getting off the ground, and you may as well tell your lecturer to give you the simulation software. Need Empire Research Slots. Click here
Taurequis Waylander 01	Posted - 2007.08.09 14:12:00 - [18] We need to know who you are to work out if we trust you. In this investment game - trust is 99% of what we have. IRL they have controlling agencies, the police, sec etc to stop peeps just ripping each other off. In eve we do not. Tbh like another person said if your not going to go along with the suggestions above and others people here WILL make of you, you may as well just ask for that simulator. Best Regards, Taur
Ezoran DuBlaidd Rivers Enterprises Power Corrupts Industry's	Posted - 2007.08.09 14:30:00 - [19] Originally by: Catherine Altair lol thats mah main um...
Hash Kakakin	Posted - 2007.08.09 14:30:00 - [20] Edited by: Hash Kakakin on 09/08/2007 14:32:04 your right, trust is really the main issue here. as such, im catherine's main. as i said before im not famous but since im asking you to trust me with your hard earned isks, i owe it to you just some honesty. judge me yourself, ask some of my ex-corp ceo's. see what they say. sorry for not doing this (earlier [Ed]) but for the given reason i didnt think it was a great idea. you convinced me otherwise. i hope this clear up the main issue. any more questions please do not hesitate to ask.
Ricdic Caldari Corporate Research And Production Pty Ltd Zzz	Posted - 2007.08.09 15:35:00 - [21] Now post with your main to confirm I could say Oveur was my main but that wouldn't make it so without confirmation. Need Empire Research Slots. Click here
Takahashi Arran coracao ardente Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.08.09 15:48:00 - [22] Your a university student on commerce right- well you should have lots of academic papers you've written on your HD - upload them to Scribd then for us to look at. That would be a decent way to start earning some trust.
Hash Kakakin	Posted - 2007.08.09 15:56:00 - [23] I, hash kakain, is the main. what do your mean scribd? im not familiar with this technology please clarify and ill see if look through my pile of papers to see if i can upload some useful things.
Ricdic Caldari Corporate Research And Production Pty Ltd Zzz	Posted - 2007.08.09 16:01:00 - [24] Originally by: Catherine Altair As an EvE player, i am a largely experieced player. Though i have yet to make a big investment in the EvE market in term of trading and production. The only thing i had done was speculative trading of zydrine right before Revelation 2 came out. I am however a commerce student and am confident in my ability to create a very profitable return to my investors. So now that you have shown us your main, who is less than 2 months old, how can you honestly say you are a 'largely experienced player'? What are you trying to pull here? Need Empire Research Slots. Click here
Kitex Caldari Blacktag Test Labs	Posted - 2007.08.09 16:09:00 - [25] I love the way this forum works. Someone posts an investment idea that (almost always) has at least a couple of flaws, several pages of discussion and advice ensue, and the end result is often an entirely workable and profitable investment opportunity. Catherine, I'd like to see this work for you. The concern most people have is that you have no history in-game, thus they have no reason to trust you. Here are my specific concerns: The main you've posted with is 6 weeks old, and has been in 8 player corporations. Can you explain that? If your main is 6 weeks old, what high level trading experience can you possible have? Trading billions is a far different ballgame than trading 20 mil a week in Jita. And frankly, the idea of a new player engaging in speculative mineral trading with public investment money scares me. That market is truly not for beginners. I'm sure you're skilled as a commerce student, but there is a lot to learn about the EVE economy that neither the real world nor 6 weeks in game can teach you. Like I said, I hope we can help you find a plan that's workable. But personally, I'll be suprised if you can answer the above concerns convincingly enough to get me to invest ISK. Scams are too prevelant, and I just have no basis to trust you.
Ricdic Caldari Corporate Research And Production Pty Ltd Zzz	Posted - 2007.08.09 16:16:00 - [26] I have no problem with you starting with a 100m ipo or bond offering, but as the above poster nicely said, 5b is way too much to put in the hands of a new player. Need Empire Research Slots. Click here
Catherine Altair	Posted - 2007.08.09 16:37:00 - [27] Edited by: Catherine Altair on 09/08/2007 16:39:41 Edited by: Catherine Altair on 09/08/2007 16:38:14 well there is nothing i could say but your right, if you consider 6 weeks to be a short amount of time then im inexperieced relative to 4 year-old 60M sp characters. But really to say that my knowledge in commerce and economics is entirely inapplicable to EvE is a big disclaim. to me, the only real knowledge one must know about EvE economy is mainly -how items are generated : loots, productions -how productions are performed : BPO from npc's, minerals mined -how items are removed : destruction -how isks are generated : insurance payout, bounty, npc commodity trading -how isks are removed : tax, insurance fees, skill books, npc items etc. the main economy in EvE involves ships, modules, BPO's, minerals really, im pretty sure i know how EvE economy work. i wont say im a leading expert, but i believe very strongly that i can work your investment to return 6% / week as i promise. if you want me to answer your questions please be specific about it about my credibility : well your right its rather hard to prove im not a scam. so if you have any mean for me to prove myself, please do so. and i still consider myself to be largely experienced. while i wont be able to tell you the dps of a ship from its modules and your sp in gunnery or tell you your perfect tanking setup for taking certain rats in your bs. i know all i need to know that is relevant to my venture. i learn very fast. i still have much to learn and what i am doing is also an integral part to my learning as an investor. thats why im going to university. im looking for people who would invest their knowledge as well, though i wont be able to pay you for any advice given :). edit: i only need 1bil. and the reason i max at 5bil is because i dont think theres enough commodity on the market to make a return of 6% per week on more than 5 bil investment.
Ray McCormack hirr	Posted - 2007.08.09 16:47:00 - [28] Originally by: Hash Kakakin the actual unit website with relevant contents are accesible by students and staff only. Post the details of it here. I want to know exactly what it's asking you to do and if it pertains to what you're saying here. And if you're trading to get this 6% per week either your sums are off or you're not looking in the right place. There are commodities out there where it's sustainable to trade at a return of at least 6% per day at the ISK volume you are talking about. \| Open Source Offline Wallet \| BMBE ISK Loans \|
Catherine Altair	Posted - 2007.08.09 16:51:00 - [29] if you know of this 6% per day then please tell me but then again you would probably be making infinite money off it right now as you double your cash in 12 days so if you had 5bil then you would have 1 trillion in ~50 days.
SencneS Amarr Balsarferskratchin Inc Axiom Empire	Posted - 2007.08.09 16:57:00 - [30] Originally by: Catherine Altair Edited by: Catherine Altair on 09/08/2007 16:39:41 Edited by: Catherine Altair on 09/08/2007 16:38:14 well there is nothing i could say but your right, if you consider 6 weeks to be a short amount of time then im inexperieced relative to 4 year-old 60M sp characters. But really to say that my knowledge in commerce and economics is entirely inapplicable to EvE is a big disclaim. to me, the only real knowledge one must know about EvE economy is mainly -how items are generated : loots, productions -how productions are performed : BPO from npc's, minerals mined -how items are removed : destruction -how isks are generated : insurance payout, bounty, npc commodity trading -how isks are removed : tax, insurance fees, skill books, npc items etc. the main economy in EvE involves ships, modules, BPO's, minerals really, im pretty sure i know how EvE economy work. i wont say im a leading expert, but i believe very strongly that i can work your investment to return 6% / week as i promise. if you want me to answer your questions please be specific about it about my credibility : well your right its rather hard to prove im not a scam. so if you have any mean for me to prove myself, please do so. and i still consider myself to be largely experienced. while i wont be able to tell you the dps of a ship from its modules and your sp in gunnery or tell you your perfect tanking setup for taking certain rats in your bs. i know all i need to know that is relevant to my venture. i learn very fast. i still have much to learn and what i am doing is also an integral part to my learning as an investor. thats why im going to university. im looking for people who would invest their knowledge as well, though i wont be able to pay you for any advice given :). edit: i only need 1bil. and the reason i max at 5bil is because i dont think theres enough commodity on the market to make a return of 6% per week on more than 5 bil investment. In your words comparing 6 weeks to 4 years doesn't really show economy student studies. You can go to Law School, and study the exact same course as someone who has been practicing law for 20 years. And I would be money in a show down the the 20 years of experience would make you look like a fool even though at the start you both studied the same things. Same for economy - With your mentality there is no difference between hiring a fresh from a Master of Business Degree as CEO, as someone who has been CEO for 30 years. This line right here is why I posted the above - edit: i only need 1bil. and the reason i max at 5bil is because i don't think theres enough commodity on the market to make a return of 6% per week on more than 5 bil investment. If you believe 5bil will get you 6% return per week because you'll have more commodity for sale vs 1bil you are not an economy student. In fact it's basic economics that whatever you're doing if you are planning a 6% return you're only going to get 6% no matter how much you start with. If you can get 6% return on 5bil you should be able to get a 6% return on 1bil. The only reason you ask for more is to secure a 6% return and use your capital to compensate for your losses. If you have 1bil used, that leaves 4bil left over to dividend which would give 14 weeks of buffer before you have to start using your sales. ---------------------------------- Send ISK to SencneS for good Kama!
Catherine Altair	Posted - 2007.08.09 17:01:00 - [31] Originally by: Ray McCormack Originally by: Hash Kakakin the actual unit website with relevant contents are accesible by students and staff only. Post the details of it here. I want to know exactly what it's asking you to do and if it pertains to what you're saying here. And if you're trading to get this 6% per week either your sums are off or you're not looking in the right place. There are commodities out there where it's sustainable to trade at a return of at least 6% per day at the ISK volume you are talking about. well to be honest i dont think i can make 6% per day if you can then tell me how. if you dont want to then i cant see why your posting since if your making 6% a day then your obviously not interested in my investment offering
Kitex Caldari Blacktag Test Labs	Posted - 2007.08.09 17:06:00 - [32] Edited by: Kitex on 09/08/2007 17:09:36 6% per week on a billion is entirely attainable, and actually not that difficult to exceed by a fair margin. I think you've tried your best to answer most concerns. If you're scamming, at least you're putting some effort into it. I'm guessing you're legit, though I do question why you need to start in the billions rather than the millions. As Ricdic mentioned, you'd have a far easier time securing 100m in investment capital than 1b. In this, EVE mirrors the real world. A new business with no collateral and no credit history will not qualify for a $1mil loan from any lender, but could qualify for a smaller loan in the thousands. It is high risk for a lender to invest in an unknown, and they mitigate that risk by not shelling out the big bucks until the unknown has established itself. 24 weeks is a long time in EVE to play the markets and rake in profits. I started with 20m in the market LESS than 24 weeks ago, and have already profited in billions. Would your project be made any less valid by starting with 100m instead of 1b? Further, is the basis of your project just to work the markets and profit, or is public investment a required part of it? If you're trying to impress your professor, percent profit on initial assets of 20m will actually be quite a bit higher than percent profit starting with 1b. I'll probably be willing to help you reach a startup of 100m, but I dont quite see why you need to start so big to make the project valid.
Ray McCormack hirr	Posted - 2007.08.09 17:08:00 - [33] Originally by: Catherine Altair well to be honest i dont think i can make 6% per day if you can then tell me how. if you dont want to then i cant see why your posting since if your making 6% a day then your obviously not interested in my investment offering The return doesn't matter that much, 6% per week is okay if that's what you can get and it's what you're offering. I don't invest in the EVE stock and bond market for the returns, I invest because I believe it's a truly unique situation we've got here and would like to see it flourish. What matters is if you are doing this for the reasons you say you are and that you're not just going to run off with the ISK. \| Open Source Offline Wallet \| BMBE ISK Loans \|
Fury Banker Fury Bank	Posted - 2007.08.09 17:09:00 - [34] Edited by: Fury Banker on 09/08/2007 17:13:05 What puzzles me is this: You claim you understand the Eve economy - and gave a list of some of the important factors (though totally missing out one of the main ones). If so, and you've been playing for 6 weeks, why haven't you made a billion profit yourself yet? I'm no economics student - but I'd made a billion before I'd been playing for 6 weeks, a lot of it from pretty casual trading (putting up buy orders for specific named items, then once a day maintaining my orders, every few days collecting the loot on afk autopilot and putting it up for sale at 100%-300% markup). Within a week I was making 20-30 million profit per day just from that - for very little time investment. The only capital i started with was 6 million ISK. Wouldn't your thesis be better if you started with (next to) nothing - then you could also comment on how the % of profitability dropped as the amount of capital in use increased? Your comment on how 6% per week isn't feasible on above 5 billion is also flawed - on at least two counts: 1. It's perfectly possible. I've been making more than 6% gross profits per week with Fury Holdings consistently on 15 billion+. 2. If you're not paying out your shareholders weekly then surely your capital is going to grow over 5 billion ISK - at which stage are you saying you won't be able to achieve your own target profitability? You do realise that you'd be holding over 19 billion ISK at the start of the 23rd week? So how would you be making 6% profit on that - given you've said it's not achievable on more than 5 billion? EDIT: edited to fiz "million" where I should have typed "billion".
Catherine Altair	Posted - 2007.08.09 17:10:00 - [35] Originally by: SencneS Originally by: Catherine Altair Edited by: Catherine Altair on 09/08/2007 16:39:41 Edited by: Catherine Altair on 09/08/2007 16:38:14 well there is nothing i could say but your right, if you consider 6 weeks to be a short amount of time then im inexperieced relative to 4 year-old 60M sp characters. But really to say that my knowledge in commerce and economics is entirely inapplicable to EvE is a big disclaim. to me, the only real knowledge one must know about EvE economy is mainly -how items are generated : loots, productions -how productions are performed : BPO from npc's, minerals mined -how items are removed : destruction -how isks are generated : insurance payout, bounty, npc commodity trading -how isks are removed : tax, insurance fees, skill books, npc items etc. the main economy in EvE involves ships, modules, BPO's, minerals really, im pretty sure i know how EvE economy work. i wont say im a leading expert, but i believe very strongly that i can work your investment to return 6% / week as i promise. if you want me to answer your questions please be specific about it about my credibility : well your right its rather hard to prove im not a scam. so if you have any mean for me to prove myself, please do so. and i still consider myself to be largely experienced. while i wont be able to tell you the dps of a ship from its modules and your sp in gunnery or tell you your perfect tanking setup for taking certain rats in your bs. i know all i need to know that is relevant to my venture. i learn very fast. i still have much to learn and what i am doing is also an integral part to my learning as an investor. thats why im going to university. im looking for people who would invest their knowledge as well, though i wont be able to pay you for any advice given :). edit: i only need 1bil. and the reason i max at 5bil is because i dont think theres enough commodity on the market to make a return of 6% per week on more than 5 bil investment. In your words comparing 6 weeks to 4 years doesn't really show economy student studies. You can go to Law School, and study the exact same course as someone who has been practicing law for 20 years. And I would be money in a show down the the 20 years of experience would make you look like a fool even though at the start you both studied the same things. Same for economy - With your mentality there is no difference between hiring a fresh from a Master of Business Degree as CEO, as someone who has been CEO for 30 years. This line right here is why I posted the above - edit: i only need 1bil. and the reason i max at 5bil is because i don't think theres enough commodity on the market to make a return of 6% per week on more than 5 bil investment. If you believe 5bil will get you 6% return per week because you'll have more commodity for sale vs 1bil you are not an economy student. In fact it's basic economics that whatever you're doing if you are planning a 6% return you're only going to get 6% no matter how much you start with. If you can get 6% return on 5bil you should be able to get a 6% return on 1bil. The only reason you ask for more is to secure a 6% return and use your capital to compensate for your losses. If you have 1bil used, that leaves 4bil left over to dividend which would give 14 weeks of buffer before you have to start using your sales. to maximise profit i have to utilise all my capital. if i had 4 kazillion isks sitting on my wallet then i can suppose to buy the entire assets of EvE (assuming its all for sale for simplicity's sake) then if i sell it all at any price i can make at most the amount of isk total that non-me have. which is less than 6% of my 4 kazillion. i wont be able to trade using more than 5bil. and its very different. a nurse who works for 40 years still cant perform a surgery a fresh just-out-of medical school surgeon can.
Fury Banker Fury Bank	Posted - 2007.08.09 17:11:00 - [36] Originally by: Catherine Altair if you dont want to then i cant see why your posting since if your making 6% a day then your obviously not interested in my investment offering He would be posting because this is a market discussions forum - not the sell orders forum. If all you wanted was sales then you posted in the wrong place.
Catherine Altair	Posted - 2007.08.09 17:19:00 - [37] Originally by: Fury Banker Edited by: Fury Banker on 09/08/2007 17:13:05 What puzzles me is this: You claim you understand the Eve economy - and gave a list of some of the important factors (though totally missing out one of the main ones). If so, and you've been playing for 6 weeks, why haven't you made a billion profit yourself yet? I'm no economics student - but I'd made a billion before I'd been playing for 6 weeks, a lot of it from pretty casual trading (putting up buy orders for specific named items, then once a day maintaining my orders, every few days collecting the loot on afk autopilot and putting it up for sale at 100%-300% markup). Within a week I was making 20-30 million profit per day just from that - for very little time investment. The only capital i started with was 6 million ISK. Wouldn't your thesis be better if you started with (next to) nothing - then you could also comment on how the % of profitability dropped as the amount of capital in use increased? Your comment on how 6% per week isn't feasible on above 5 billion is also flawed - on at least two counts: 1. It's perfectly possible. I've been making more than 6% gross profits per week with Fury Holdings consistently on 15 billion+. 2. If you're not paying out your shareholders weekly then surely your capital is going to grow over 5 billion ISK - at which stage are you saying you won't be able to achieve your own target profitability? You do realise that you'd be holding over 19 billion ISK at the start of the 23rd week? So how would you be making 6% profit on that - given you've said it's not achievable on more than 5 billion? EDIT: edited to fiz "million" where I should have typed "billion". my 6% is the minimum profit i can almost guarantee to make. and the reason i only want 5 bil because i believe that i can almost guarantee (i cant really guarantee can i?) to have 20+ bil in my wallet at the end of the 24 weeks period which includes that return on the 23rd week with about 20bil in isks. so yes i expect to be able to make 6% on 20bil. however if i take an investment of 10b say then at 23rd week i will have to return 6% on 40bil and i dont think i can work 20 bil. as i said before if i have anything wrong or you do have suggestion please post. dont just be "oh your wrong." then end your post thats like saying "i am god i just dont use my godly powers"
Catherine Altair	Posted - 2007.08.09 17:21:00 - [38] i return all the money i make. if i pick up the trade and really get it up and going and make 1trillion isks. i will payout 1 trillion isks to my investors. and yes i have motivation to make as much as i can.
Catherine Altair	Posted - 2007.08.09 17:26:00 - [39] i need 1 billion isks because otherwise it wouldnt be a significant sum. its like saying i can return 6% per week on your 10 bux. i use it to buy food and work 8 hours a day at a fast food place. weee...ireturn 400% a week!!!!!
Takahashi Arran coracao ardente Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.08.09 17:39:00 - [40] Edited by: Takahashi Arran on 09/08/2007 17:41:42 Originally by: Hash Kakakin what do your mean scribd? im not familiar with this technology please clarify and ill see if look through my pile of papers to see if i can upload some useful things. www.scribd.com - like youtube for documents I'm not particularly interested in useful things, more a broad selection of works analysis can be performed on to ensure your really who you say you are (which you probably are but you know how it goes :) )
Fury Banker Fury Bank	Posted - 2007.08.09 17:41:00 - [41] So how much have you made from Trading so far? Are you planning to use your own ISK in the fund as well? Or is using other people's ISK to trade rather than your own required in some way for this to be valid? Are you planning to buy and sell at the same station? If not, how are you planning to move your goods from purchase to sell location? You ARE aware of high-sec suicide ganking (though not on freighters any more)? Your OP gave the impression you were going to be hauling things around yourself - unless you're in some quiet back-water (in which case turning over 10 billion+ of stock in a week is pretty unlikely) you're going to either be making a LOT of hauling trips or get suicide ganked a few times. Note: I DON'T think that you're trying to scam. I don't however, think you understand the logistics of dealing with trading on a largish scale.
SencneS Amarr Balsarferskratchin Inc Axiom Empire	Posted - 2007.08.09 17:44:00 - [42] He is getting hostile, admittedly my post was a little abrasive but warranted I believe. Dude, What you are seeing here in this post is more experience then you'll get anywhere else. If this where in a real world asking a venture capitalist for even $50,000 then not willing to share you plan, reveal your identity, and not accept any criticism you'd be going no where. This place has seen way to many scammers and everyone is highly skeptical of anyone new. To me your don't act like an economics student, and more importantly appear to be missing some fundamental bases of economics (at least from what you have said) But there is one thing that is for certain.. getting hostile and ****y back will not get you any isk. Dude good luck if your not a scammer, get lost if you are. I'm done with this guy, take solace in knowing I will not be replying to this thread again. ---------------------------------- Send ISK to SencneS for good Kama!
Shadarle	Posted - 2007.08.09 18:24:00 - [43] "the main economy in EvE involves ships, modules, BPO's, minerals" Well... this line is why I won't be investing. Simply claiming you are experienced and smart is not enough. You have to back up your statements with past experience. You obviously have a very limited knowledge of EVE compared to most of the posters on this forum. You're coming in as a new player talking to people who have done what you're attempting to do for years now. It's quite obvious to the long time traders when a new guy is claiming to know more than he actually does. To top this all off... your explanations as to why you are doing this and why you need 5 billion are becoming more and more confusing. At first I was willing to believe you. But I can't understand why you need 5 billion instead of just 1 billion. You say that it is more impressive to make 6% on 5 bil than 1 bil... which is true, but honestly how many people who do not play EVE would know the difference? Does your professor play EVE? If not then why would he not think 1 billion isk is a massive amount. I know when I've talked to people who I got to play EVE they were shocked when I told them I'd give them millions. They thought that was a lot and were even more shocked to know I had billions. So why exactly is 5 Bil so important instead of 2 bil or 1 bil or 500 mil or 100 mil? Is this honestly for a school project? Be honest now... if you lie about this one then you're definitely not gonna get a penny from anyone. And before you answer remember that you've given your school and program code out (FINC4101). It would not be all that hard to contact your school to determine if someone in your program could indeed be doing such a project... or even to talk to professors involved in this type of program. Heck... there could even be someone on these forums that goes to UoS and may be able to personally ask a professor about this. If you are being completely serious about this then it would actually probably help your report if some random person came to your professor to determine your trustworthiness. It would show them that this is a very serious market. I personally think this is either a scam or it is merely a bad investment. I have no confidence in the ability of the OP to make the kind of returns he thinks he will as he is clearly not very experienced in the EVE markets nor how IPO's tend to work and why people ask the questions we do in posts like this. He says he has incentives to work hard... but what are those incentives? Other than to scam away more money when this is over. He has no money invested and isn't taking a cut... so what is his incentive? I don't get it and I think it needs a real answer. Tanking Setups Compared Stacking Penalty / Resists Explained
BritishInvader Amarr Leela's Lamas	Posted - 2007.08.09 19:02:00 - [44] Originally by: BritishInvader I don't see this going well for you. -+-+-+-+-+-+-+- EVE ART STORE - CLICK HERE
Kilda Shepp	Posted - 2007.08.09 19:38:00 - [45] Quote: a nurse who works for 40 years still cant perform a surgery a fresh just-out-of medical school surgeon can. what a nub..
Ezoran DuBlaidd Rivers Enterprises Power Corrupts Industry's	Posted - 2007.08.09 20:48:00 - [46] you know... if he starts with no money, and ends up with 5 billion; then, he could show his prof how he made 5billion from nothing...
Shadarle	Posted - 2007.08.09 21:38:00 - [47] Originally by: Kilda Shepp Quote: a nurse who works for 40 years still cant perform a surgery a fresh just-out-of medical school surgeon can. what a nub.. I thought that was an interesting comment he made too. Kinda putting himself on a pedestal as if he was trained as a surgeon while we're all trained as nurses with lots of experience. Perhaps if he was able to make his own money without asking for handouts/investments he could try to claim he at least has some training... instead he has can only claim he has schooling without even the slightest idea if he even knows what a scalpel looks like is in real life (to run with the metaphor). Tanking Setups Compared Stacking Penalty / Resists Explained
BritishInvader Amarr Leela's Lamas	Posted - 2007.08.09 23:07:00 - [48] I called it, didn't I? -+-+-+-+-+-+-+- EVE ART STORE - CLICK HERE
Dark Assassin15 Gallente Blackguard Brigade	Posted - 2007.08.09 23:37:00 - [49] Well the reason i didnt believe it.. i read how he plans to do it. Left out a few very important things. Like game politics. 0.0 Entrances and knowing were pvp is, knowing were people would buy ships and mods. But well. O well it was a good forum read. And 6 weeks, was completely obvious.
Catherine Altair	Posted - 2007.08.10 01:01:00 - [50] Edited by: Catherine Altair on 10/08/2007 01:02:52 i only need 1bil to start but i will take as much as 5bil. i never said i need 5bil instead of 1 bil. about experiece you are all right. i never claimed to be an absolute expert i just said i think i know enough to make the return i promise. and my comment about the surgeon is not to say im trained as a surgeon but to show that the argument "experience is the only thing that matters" is not universally true. and please if you think i need help, tell me so. tell me what i need to know and what you dont think i know. clarify it. say things like "your wrong because such and such". not just your wrong. and yes i will be hauling but i will never use AP so with warp to zero im sure i can align before someone locks and kills me.
Catherine Altair	Posted - 2007.08.10 01:41:00 - [51] Edited by: Catherine Altair on 10/08/2007 01:41:27 Originally by: SencneS He is getting hostile, admittedly my post was a little abrasive but warranted I believe. Dude, What you are seeing here in this post is more experience then you'll get anywhere else. If this where in a real world asking a venture capitalist for even $50,000 then not willing to share you plan, reveal your identity, and not accept any criticism you'd be going no where. This place has seen way to many scammers and everyone is highly skeptical of anyone new. To me your don't act like an economics student, and more importantly appear to be missing some fundamental bases of economics (at least from what you have said) But there is one thing that is for certain.. getting hostile and **y back will not get you any isk. Dude good luck if your not a scammer, get lost if you are. I'm done with this guy, take solace in knowing I will not be replying to this thread again. i did not mean to be hostile but i was just trying to show people that questions and suggestions are welcome. but random self-promotion is not. please if you have anything that might be useful for me, post. i dont understand this, my offer is either sound or a scam, judge it on its face value. what seems to be happening is people auto-assuming it will not work because unless your 2 years old in EvE nothing you can do can be successful and that im a scam because everyone that posts an idea like this is a scammer. is this to show that my idea is not perceived to work or that everyone is auto-assume to be scammer. please limit yourself to suggestion, advice and criticism only. dont post things like "nub" and/or your a ****** n00b because i have not been playing EvE since its inception. i really want this to work.
Ricdic Caldari Corporate Research And Production Pty Ltd Zzz	Posted - 2007.08.10 02:53:00 - [52] Edited by: Ricdic on 10/08/2007 02:55:15 Originally by: Catherine Altair and my comment about the surgeon is not to say im trained as a surgeon but to show that the argument "experience is the only thing that matters" is not universally true. You are asking us to entrust our hard earned money into you. Experience is crucial. Thinking you know the Eve economy after doing a few business courses, is like thinking you can pilot a 747 Jumbo after reading a PDF quickstart guide. This isn't to say that you cannot do a public venture, I am more than happy to help you with this, but don't expect such a large amount. Even 1b for a 6 week old character is far too much. Do something like we done with Rawcola, he done a 300m IPO, or Rawblood, he done a 200m private bonds issuance. As has been repeated above, your professor will consider turning 200m into 2b just as good, as if it were turning 2b into 20b. The same percentages apply the numbers just look larger. And for someone out of game, it still sounds like a significant number. I am sad this thread has somewhat turned into bashing because frankly, I don't think you are trying to pull a scam. However,I do think you are biting off more than you can chew, and your business is almost guaranteed to fail if you proceed with this 5b(or even 1b) request. Prove to us that you can successfully manage 200m, and you will find the public won't be so hasty to up the ante as their high-risk beliefs begin to drop down. Age of character won't ensure trust/respect, but proven public venture performance WILL. Need Empire Research Slots. Click here
Two step Amarr Chosen Path FATAL Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.10 02:55:00 - [53] Originally by: Catherine Altair The only thing i had done was speculative trading of zydrine right before Revelation 2 came out. As if anyone needed any more evidence: You "main" was born on June 21, 2007. Revelations 2 was deployed on June 19, 2007 Case closed.
Shar Tegral	Posted - 2007.08.10 05:35:00 - [54] Quote: Typically the subject areas relate to securities market micro-structure, investments and corporate finance, as these are the areas in which the Discipline has expertise and supervisory skills. I see Ponzi, who and how to, as a very worthwhile subject for an economics student. All it takes is one or two trusting souls to get started and you could snowball the whole experience into a good paper with little trouble. I could see all kinds of angles to demonstrate how "good governance, if applied at this juncture would've avoided" scenarios. (Not that it fulfills the requirements listed above but then I doubt Eve would fulfill that as Eve vastly oversimplifies economics. Especially regarding areas in the above course qoutation.) Bah, 6-8 weeks old and you are equal to an old timer? Arrogant and clueless, like many of those old timers. I'm not saying you can't get anything right just that the law of averages states that even the dumbest people get the right answer some of the time. And accidentally outting your own main... well that just whiff of ineptitude. Where there's a whiff in public the reek in private might qualify as stench. TBH I'm not even going to wish you good luck. You wouldn't even know what to do with that let alone 1 Billion or more of invested funds. Quote: The Eve-Online forums may not have invented whining, but they sure have perfected it. Misanthropy: It's not just for Rednecks!
Catherine Altair	Posted - 2007.08.10 05:44:00 - [55] Originally by: Two step Originally by: Catherine Altair The only thing i had done was speculative trading of zydrine right before Revelation 2 came out. As if anyone needed any more evidence: You "main" was born on June 21, 2007. Revelations 2 was deployed on June 19, 2007 Case closed. your right i must have mistaken. but i did do some zydrine trade at the time of revelation ii. i believe strongly that 1 billion represents a hallmark that will make my venture a serious one. while you might be right in saying that asking for 1 billion is too much, i will consider changing it if ,ore people agree. nontheless, i plan to link this thread in my final report. so you can see how you saying "hah they are not gonna know that 100mil isks is not much" doesnt help much if i were to decrease the initial investment amount to less than 1 bil. additionally i would like to apologise for being rather impolite earlier. i didnt expect this level of skepticism from the public or the level of hashness certain responses are. i think this is the result of me conducting this on the internet and i should have expected it. and i think this will provide an interesting subject to write about how being on a virtual world affect diplomacy and negotiation. when i came up with the idea of using EvE as a platform for my work, i sort of thought of myself as a pioneer of sort and i was very enthusiastic about doing this. to have people say bad things about me, dissing me idea and saying that i am "not good enough" was very agravating. though i should have kept my cool. what i thought was "if they can be rude to me i can too". which was obviously wrong. i have learned much from just this thread already. i hope to learn more because EvE has much to offer. i hope some of you might see that and decide to give me a chance. thank you.
Catherine Altair	Posted - 2007.08.10 05:47:00 - [56] Originally by: Shar Tegral Quote: Typically the subject areas relate to securities market micro-structure, investments and corporate finance, as these are the areas in which the Discipline has expertise and supervisory skills. I see Ponzi, who and how to, as a very worthwhile subject for an economics student. All it takes is one or two trusting souls to get started and you could snowball the whole experience into a good paper with little trouble. I could see all kinds of angles to demonstrate how "good governance, if applied at this juncture would've avoided" scenarios. (Not that it fulfills the requirements listed above but then I doubt Eve would fulfill that as Eve vastly oversimplifies economics. Especially regarding areas in the above course qoutation.) Bah, 6-8 weeks old and you are equal to an old timer? Arrogant and clueless, like many of those old timers. I'm not saying you can't get anything right just that the law of averages states that even the dumbest people get the right answer some of the time. And accidentally outting your own main... well that just whiff of ineptitude. Where there's a whiff in public the reek in private might qualify as stench. TBH I'm not even going to wish you good luck. You wouldn't even know what to do with that let alone 1 Billion or more of invested funds. i never actually said im an equal to an old timer. i said i believe the experience i have from playing EvE thus far is enough for me to accomplish what i intend to.
Apple Blossom	Posted - 2007.08.10 07:00:00 - [57] Originally by: Catherine Altair i believe strongly that 1 billion represents a hallmark that will make my venture a serious one. while you might be right in saying that asking for 1 billion is too much, i will consider changing it if ,ore people agree. nontheless, i plan to link this thread in my final report. so you can see how you saying "hah they are not gonna know that 100mil isks is not much" doesnt help much if i were to decrease the initial investment amount to less than 1 bil. You've already received a thorough roasting from the regulars, so I will try and keep this friendly: 1. If you are really planning to link to this thread in your final report then write in complete grammatically correct sentences: capital letters, apostrophes, etc... Improving your professionalism will also help impress the skeptics here. It's superficial bs, but it matters. 2. Really, really listen to the people telling you to do this with smaller amounts of money. Your 'hallmark' figure for a 'serious' venture is pulled out of your ass. A serious venture for a 6 week old player != a serious venture for a 3 year old player != a serious venture for your Professor. Lower your request to 100M or so and no-one will care if you scam it or not. Come back in four weeks time with some profits, a professional report on your activities and a draft of your course report and I guarantee you will meet a much friendlier and generous bunch of people. Hope that helps and good luck with your project. Apple
Gawain Hill	Posted - 2007.08.10 07:03:00 - [58] ok i'm going to chip in go to bav with a freighter and buy and sell silicate glass in the same system it's instant profit without even leaving the system i'm sure it's possible to get a 6% per day increase since the npc orders never get filled.... or didn't for the 20mill i made from my 500k but damn it took a fair while in my bestower kisses indie level 2
Catherine Altair	Posted - 2007.08.10 07:34:00 - [59] Due to suggestions from many players, I'm considering a two stage investment scheme. For the first 2 weeks, I will ask for an investment of 200 millions. After this 2 weeks period, if I can generate a return of 6% compounded I will consider myself to have proven my management skill and at that stage, I will ask for a furthur 1 billion investment. If I were to be proven incapable, I will payout all the money I would have made. This way, at most I will only tie up 200mil for 2 weeks. Please comment.
Heikki Gallente Wreckless Abandon Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.08.10 08:09:00 - [60] Originally by: Catherine Altair i have an assignment .. Please comment Before focusing on techinal details, could we clear one of the more important issues? If I contact you privately, would you be willing to tell me Name and contact infor of the supervisor for this assignment (assumedly the professor) Your real name Your email address in the university?[/*] Or instead of me, to some other reputable third party here I could then check that you are indeed using the email (and hence registered to the school), and check with the supervisor you are indeed doing assignment like you described I could understand why you don't want public post such address for spammers, but have yet to see university sending their students on real world assignment/research with ban on revealing supervisor's contact info. If you indeed are interested in getting your assignment done, this is easy step : your skills and Eve-experience isn't that relevant. -Lasse
Takahashi Arran coracao ardente Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.08.10 08:21:00 - [61] Also please look at my previous post and upload some of your previous papers to www.scribd.com
Catherine Altair	Posted - 2007.08.10 08:57:00 - [62] Originally by: Heikki Originally by: Catherine Altair i have an assignment .. Please comment Before focusing on techinal details, could we clear one of the more important issues? If I contact you privately, would you be willing to tell me Name and contact infor of the supervisor for this assignment (assumedly the professor) Your real name Your email address in the university?[/*] Or instead of me, to some other reputable third party here I could then check that you are indeed using the email (and hence registered to the school), and check with the supervisor you are indeed doing assignment like you described I could understand why you don't want public post such address for spammers, but have yet to see university sending their students on real world assignment/research with ban on revealing supervisor's contact info. If you indeed are interested in getting your assignment done, this is easy step : your skills and Eve-experience isn't that relevant. -Lasse please evemail me i will get to scribd asap
Ray McCormack hirr	Posted - 2007.08.10 09:15:00 - [63] Originally by: Heikki If you indeed are interested in getting your assignment done, this is easy step : your skills and Eve-experience isn't that relevant. Agreed. And Heikki is a reputable, trustworthy person to do this through. However, there is still the fact that you have lied at least twice now, either mistakenly or grandiosely. You are not a largely experienced EVE player, and you did not speculate on Zydrine pre-Revelations (how can you even by mistaken about that?). I also believe your attempts to mask your main, and the subsequent error of posting with your main is highly suspect, and could possibly just be a ploy to withdraw attention from the whole thing. Hash being your main doesn't add up with anything else you have said, and he is probably just another alt that you're parading as your main. There are way too many holes in everything you have said; but however bashfully you have gone about this, until you reveal details in full to a trusted third party there isn't much hope of you proceeding. \| Open Source Offline Wallet \| BMBE ISK Loans \|
Ricdic Caldari Corporate Research And Production Pty Ltd Zzz	Posted - 2007.08.10 12:09:00 - [64] Originally by: Catherine Altair Due to suggestions from many players, I'm considering a two stage investment scheme. For the first 2 weeks, I will ask for an investment of 200 millions. After this 2 weeks period, if I can generate a return of 6% compounded I will consider myself to have proven my management skill and at that stage, I will ask for a furthur 1 billion investment. If I were to be proven incapable, I will payout all the money I would have made. This way, at most I will only tie up 200mil for 2 weeks. Please comment. A little better I guess. Above you have advised you will consider yourself proven after a 2 week period. It wouldn't be at all hard for you to simply use 24m(little higher due to compound) to (prove yourself) and for all we know, you have done nothing. I like the fact that you are at least considering changing things, but I think you need to close this thread, write up a proper business plan (your professor should be able to assist you with this), and make no mention to further offerings etc. Set this up as a bond issuance with a maturity date 45 days from todays post, at which time you pay back those investors 166% of their investment. This needs to be done off a small amount, and the business plan cannot change. You can't advise you are only dealing with minerals, and then change it to named goods when someone says they are profitable, then change it to other things as other people bring them up. You need clear goals, an exit strategy, etc. At the very least, follow the guide Hexxx has in the sticky which explains ways to create new offerings in professional formats. 2 weeks is far too short to generate any kind of trust in my opinion, as if you were a scammer, this is precisely how a scammer would do it. A small short operation with easy to reach goals, to build confidence, and then a large operation to follow. Obviously anyone can do this, but the way you are writing the first one off as a 'test' I guess is not up to standard in my opinion. Run the above operation i listed over a 45 day period with a 200m limit, and you will get buyers, and maybe pick up a little investor confidence once/if you start another project at that time. You need to be a straight shooter on this though. Don't lie, don't stretch the truth, and don't think you can get away with (used car salesman) techniques to put wool over our eyes. We have seen just about every attempted scam in the book, as well as business destined for failure. I hope you choose to go with something like the above option rather than your 'phased' roll out, or just completely forget about the 1b/5b first asked for. Your determination alone would indicate that this may be legit, but the eve market is cruel and can have devastating effects on someone putting big money into it without experience in the field. If anything, consider all the criticism you have seen thus far, as people seeing your plans and being almost certain that there is more chance of a failure than a scam. At least with 200m funding, a loss won't burn holes into your investors pockets (by scam or by business failure) Need Empire Research Slots. Click here
Catherine Altair	Posted - 2007.08.10 12:38:00 - [65] ok i might have underestimated the difficulty of EvE market. can anyone experieced in this field give me an estimate of how much % return on investment can be expected in term of good, bad and average return. and i will really think about what all of you have said. if theres no more interest, then i might reconsider restructuring my plan and go with what some of you have said. thank you.
Ricdic Caldari Corporate Research And Production Pty Ltd Zzz	Posted - 2007.08.10 13:13:00 - [66] Originally by: Catherine Altair can anyone experieced in this field give me an estimate of how much % return on investment can be expected in term of good, bad and average return. This is virtually impossible. There are avenues one can take to literally earn 30% per day interest on capital with lots of work, whilst a semi-afk usage may only net 2-5% per day. It depends a lot on the person's motivation, diligence, and ability to read and act on market supply and demand. There is no set rule for a return, but if you are talking about public corps and their estimated returns, I would say something along these lines: 1) 2%-5% - For corps that have secured assets, considered low risk with low returns. Examples of this may include : FIN, CAP4U, BMBE, and EBANK when opened. 2) 5%-8% - For corps with minimal or no security, usually backed by a reputation and a competent business manager, occasionally in the form of bonds. Examples of this may include PISOF, C-R-A, FRPB, FIN-U and most others. 3) 8%-20% - Usually considered high risk investments, most undertaken by those who don't have an established reputation, and usually without any forms of security. These are high risk operations that will generally net the investor in due to the potential for high returns over scam/failure. Examples of this may include your business venture, Dusk Blade, and a few others. That's not to say you should offer high returns to net people in, just that it is sometimes the way things are handled. I guess it all comes down to what kind of returns you believe you can comfortably make, and not just posting what people want to hear. Need Empire Research Slots. Click here
Catherine Altair	Posted - 2007.08.10 13:21:00 - [67] i think i can make 6% per week but then some people say "wtf i can make 6% per week why would i invest in you" while others say "omg you cant make 6% per week your a n00bmeister"' and everyone thinks im either a failure or a scam. like seriously, does this happen to everyone or is it just because my idea/presentation is bad.
Ricdic Caldari Corporate Research And Production Pty Ltd Zzz	Posted - 2007.08.10 13:30:00 - [68] Originally by: Catherine Altair i think i can make 6% per week but then some people say "wtf i can make 6% per week why would i invest in you" while others say "omg you cant make 6% per week your a n00bmeister"' and everyone thinks im either a failure or a scam. like seriously, does this happen to everyone or is it just because my idea/presentation is bad. Well the % i placed above, were for monthly corporations. So you are stating you can turn a 24% month return on investment. That's why I put you in the high return high risk basket. I think it's a combination of issues causing your grief. 1) The controversial ways a few things were stated. ie relating to your main, your time in Eve, and your supposed trading during a period you didn't exist in. 2) Your age will always be a factor 3) Your rather alarming corp churn history 4) Your request for funds far beyond the value of your character (I have about 8 unused alts that probably have twice the SP that you do) 5) Your percieved profit. Frankly, saying one can comfortably get a 24% return per month I find alarming. Due to the fact that if you truly could, you could turn 200m into a few bills anyway. Plus, the next highest paying corporation below you would be down at the 11% mark. Not to say it cannot be done, but usually would take a cunning market warrior, or someone playing eve 23/7, or someone profiteering off existing/new infrastructure (ie t2 bpo f.ex) 6) Your poor business plan, especially considering it comes from a commerce student. I have written far more comprehensive ones, and my only tertiary education consists of McDonalds management having to balance a till at the end of the night. It all points to one of 3 resolutions in order of likelihood: 1) Scam = 48% 2) Failure = 48% 3) Success = 4% That would be my rating on the matter. Without the exaggerations I would have favored it more in the failure category, but I guess I am now stuck between figuring out if you did just exaggerate to try and get confidence up, or make the whole thing up to scam the eve community. Unfortunately, you really did cause that yourself. Need Empire Research Slots. Click here
Catherine Altair	Posted - 2007.08.10 13:43:00 - [69] mcdonald management is not tertiary education
Ezoran DuBlaidd Rivers Enterprises Power Corrupts Industry's	Posted - 2007.08.10 13:45:00 - [70] Originally by: Catherine Altair i think i can make 6% per week but then some people say "wtf i can make 6% per week why would i invest in you" while others say "omg you cant make 6% per week your a n00bmeister"' and everyone thinks im either a failure or a scam. like seriously, does this happen to everyone or is it just because my idea/presentation is bad. you've posted with two, pretty much brand new toons. either one of the new toons is your main, as you say, or you're fibbing about your main. if you really are new, no one knows you from adam and you want 5b to trade in named modules. you can't be assed to start at a lower, more reasonable rate, because you know it all. yet, if you knew it all, you wouldn't need 5b, you'd be able to go at it with a few million and get to a billion on your own in no time. why 5b and why named modules? there's plenty of things to buy at one price, sell at 500%+ profit and still be giving your customers a cheaper price than what's on the market. honestly, if you're saying the only way you can turn out 6% profit is by trading in named modules; then, yeah, you sound like you're not very um, educated in the ways of the eve. i know.... make a youtube thingie with you going see your prof and post it here~!! it'd at least be fun to watch.
Ricdic Caldari Corporate Research And Production Pty Ltd Zzz	Posted - 2007.08.10 13:46:00 - [71] Originally by: Catherine Altair mcdonald management is not tertiary education And I can still post a more comprehensive business plan than a commerce student Glad to see you missed my point Need Empire Research Slots. Click here
Catherine Altair	Posted - 2007.08.10 13:56:00 - [72] Edited by: Catherine Altair on 10/08/2007 13:57:33 Originally by: Ezoran DuBlaidd Originally by: Catherine Altair i think i can make 6% per week but then some people say "wtf i can make 6% per week why would i invest in you" while others say "omg you cant make 6% per week your a n00bmeister"' and everyone thinks im either a failure or a scam. like seriously, does this happen to everyone or is it just because my idea/presentation is bad. you've posted with two, pretty much brand new toons. either one of the new toons is your main, as you say, or you're fibbing about your main. if you really are new, no one knows you from adam and you want 5b to trade in named modules. you can't be assed to start at a lower, more reasonable rate, because you know it all. yet, if you knew it all, you wouldn't need 5b, you'd be able to go at it with a few million and get to a billion on your own in no time. why 5b and why named modules? there's plenty of things to buy at one price, sell at 500%+ profit and still be giving your customers a cheaper price than what's on the market. honestly, if you're saying the only way you can turn out 6% profit is by trading in named modules; then, yeah, you sound like you're not very um, educated in the ways of the eve. i know.... make a youtube thingie with you going see your prof and post it here~!! it'd at least be fun to watch. well then why dont you enlighten me with what you can make 500% profit with or you can go in that room called "god but dont use my godly power" with the lot of them. oh and i never said i will only be trading in named modules only. i just think that its a profitable trade and a good venue to pursue.
Ezoran DuBlaidd Rivers Enterprises Power Corrupts Industry's	Posted - 2007.08.10 14:13:00 - [73] Originally by: Catherine Altair Edited by: Catherine Altair on 09/08/2007 17:35:31 i need 1 billion isks because otherwise it wouldnt be a significant sum. its like saying i can return 6% per week on your 10 bux. i use it to buy food and work 8 hours a day at a fast food place. weee...ireturn 400% a week!!!!! edit: and yes i intend to be trading in named modules. as a matter of fact it will constitute the majority of my activity. majority, to a reasonable person means something along the lines of -- the greater part or portion. so yes, you didn't say ALL of it, but i did ask some questions, to which you just gave smart assed replies. how much money do you have RIGHT now? how much have you earned since you've been playing for the past month? i think 5m is a TON of isk to someone that's played for a month. and if you can't figure out how double that on a daily basis; then there's no way in hell you should get even 100m to go with.
Daeva Vios Ardent Adversary Anvil.	Posted - 2007.08.10 14:24:00 - [74] As somewhat of an aside to the whole discussion currently ongoing, insulting the people that you are relying on for advice, and who you will be relying on to invest in your business when the time comes that you put forth an honest business plan, is not a very wise move. I understand that tensions can run high when someone pokes holes through your proposal and seems to be enjoying it, but the fact is that it's being done by people who really want to see you succeed if you are what you claim to be. The problem is that no one here has any real guarantee that you are who you say you are except you. Everyone taking part is going to put you through the only tests they have to sa***uard their wallets. The thing is that if they didn't, they would be fools, and fools wind up poor in this game. Just to reiterate and make sure my main point is really getting home: Do not insult the people you are asking for money, unless you have already decided to never ask for that money again. That is tantamount to running backward with scissors. All you've got is reputation in this game, and you're ruining yours early on.
BritishInvader Amarr Leela's Lamas	Posted - 2007.08.10 15:40:00 - [75] I like when threads derail into existing merely to entertain me. -----+----- EVE ART STORE - CLICK HERE
Fury Banker Fury Bank	Posted - 2007.08.10 15:44:00 - [76] Originally by: Ricdic 5) Your percieved profit. Frankly, saying one can comfortably get a 24% return per month I find alarming. Due to the fact that if you truly could, you could turn 200m into a few bills anyway. Plus, the next highest paying corporation below you would be down at the 11% mark. I agree with the first part of this statement - either the OP CAN make 24% per month on 19 billion capital (in which case they should already have made their first billion) or the OP is amking numbers up with no experience. The last part is, however, incorrect. Remember that the OP is talking about total profit - not some net profit value after management fees. Fury Holdings is making a LOT more than 11% per month - even after half prfotis are taken for management fees, the shareholders have gained a 50% return in under 3 months. Gross profits are around 30% per month on around 20 billion invested capital (calculating capital in use is rather tricky now Fury Bank exists). Other than the first week of operations (which was actually only half a week of operations) Fury Holdings has never made less than 6% profit in its 12 weeks of existence.
Catherine Altair	Posted - 2007.08.10 16:10:00 - [77] Originally by: Daeva Vios Edited by: Daeva Vios on 10/08/2007 14:57:32 As somewhat of an aside to the whole discussion currently ongoing, insulting the people that you are relying on for advice, and who you will be relying on to invest in your business when the time comes that you put forth an honest business plan, is not a very wise move. I understand that tensions can run high when someone pokes holes through your proposal and seems to be enjoying it, but the fact is that it's being done by people who really want to see you succeed if you are what you claim to be. The problem is that no one here has any real guarantee that you are who you say you are except you. Everyone taking part is going to put you through the only tests they have to safe guard their wallets. The thing is that if they didn't, they would be fools, and fools wind up poor in this game. Just to reiterate and make sure my main point is really getting home: Do not insult the people you are asking for money, unless you have already decided to never ask for that money again. That is tantamount to running backward with scissors. All you've got is reputation in this game, and you're ruining yours early on. well i have already asked politely for people (not you) to not post "im god but i dont use my godly power" comment. it doesnt do anything constructive and i can delete it. i dont think hes interested in investing anyway. i think people who are genuinely interested dont go about insulting people who will be holding their money. he just sees a case whereby he can make comments about how ******** i am and how awesome he is. people seem to do this alot. but your right, if im gonna say anything bad i better not say anything at all. so ill shut up now.
Ricdic Caldari Corporate Research And Production Pty Ltd Zzz	Posted - 2007.08.10 16:45:00 - [78] Originally by: Catherine Altair but your right, if im gonna say anything bad i better not say anything at all. so ill shut up now. I see you pretty much missed the point on Daeva's post. Forget about those badgering you, or who you feel are insulting you, and deal with the genuine queries and questions being put forth. Need Empire Research Slots. Click here
Shar Tegral	Posted - 2007.08.10 17:44:00 - [79] Edited by: Shar Tegral on 10/08/2007 17:45:09 Originally by: Catherine Altair i dont think hes interested in investing anyway. i think people who are genuinely interested dont go about insulting people who will be holding their money. Actually we do. We challenge proposals presented regardless of who presents them. Even when they come from long term players, we challenge them. Those who can't deal with the challenges, those who can't seem to answer questions plainly and directly, and those who have skin too thin to be trusted with large sums of isk... Well they act like you are acting. What a surprise. You have to earn your place in Eve. You want to jump into the deep end of the pool relatively young (or so you are trying to represent) you are going to have to handle the swimming and the sharks on your own. Just like every one else. Quote: The Eve-Online forums may not have invented whining, but they sure have perfected it. Misanthropy: It's not just for Rednecks!
New Shadow Caldari CyberDyne Industries Te-Ka	Posted - 2007.08.10 17:54:00 - [80] Hmm, I am sorry m8 but I do not believe you at all. I was willing to invest at first, but from what you've posted you seem to be like an incompetent trader. I do not in trade Eve Online, but it doesn't mirror the markets in any way. The largest force that drives Eve's Economy is combat and while war does (at times) drive the market as well in the real world, it doesn't only depend on it. Your investment seems to be full of holes and lacking information as to how you pulled those figures. The reason why I show no care is I see these countless scams of people trying to be as sincere as possible, but full of the same mistakes as you. If you truly are taking Economics, you should head back to Economics 101. I apologize, but this just seems like a scam written all over it. If it isn't, I suggest you try harder in presenting your ideas in a clear and structured manner. As any meeting, if you were to present your plan as you have here and request the amount you asked for (Which I believe is like asking for $1 Million), they would simply laugh you right out of the room. In Short: Stick to the simulator
Eton Favre Instagate Corp Shroud Of Darkness	Posted - 2007.08.10 18:52:00 - [81] in general I think the majority of the people in this thread could personally fund this IPO with the spare change in their wallet. I don't think any of them would as you seem unwilling to listen to advice and only seem to read parts of their post. Yes they tend to be rather critical but if you reread the posts in here there is alot of good advice from some of the major people in eve. These people worked hard and have earned the respect of this community. I think that you had a descent shot at getting cash if you would have followed up on some of the sugestion but by now you have pretty much burned all your bridges. A well written business plan does wonders for how people respond. Yes you will still get asked a lot of tough questions. The age of your character it is reasonable to have doubts. If you answer those critics in a polite way and address all of the points you will get people to invest. I would be much more willing to invest in something that I thought was a scam if they put some work into it, had answers ready to common questions, and were not afraid to say " well I really had not thought of that possibility my fist impression would be .... but I am open to ideas." Overall I enjoyed reading the thread. but recommend you delete both characters and start over again in 4 months -- Covetor BPCs Invention Special!!!
Ezoran DuBlaidd Rivers Enterprises Power Corrupts Industry's	Posted - 2007.08.10 21:14:00 - [82] my offer of 5m stands.
Catherine Altair	Posted - 2007.08.11 08:01:00 - [83] my first public investor thank you for your offer of 5mil hopefully some others will make an offer too.
Hash Kakakin	Posted - 2007.08.11 08:04:00 - [84] wow this is such an awesome offer!!!! i will give you all i have. *smile
Ray McCormack hirr	Posted - 2007.08.11 09:33:00 - [85] Originally by: Ray McCormack Originally by: Hash Kakakin the actual unit website with relevant contents are accesible by students and staff only. Post the details of it here. I want to know exactly what it's asking you to do and if it pertains to what you're saying here. You are yet to do this, it should only take you five minutes. A copy/paste is what we need and there should be no objections to you doing it. \| Open Source Offline Wallet \| BMBE ISK Loans \|
Catherine Altair	Posted - 2007.08.11 10:40:00 - [86] Originally by: Ray McCormack Originally by: Ray McCormack Originally by: Hash Kakakin the actual unit website with relevant contents are accesible by students and staff only. Post the details of it here. I want to know exactly what it's asking you to do and if it pertains to what you're saying here. You are yet to do this, it should only take you five minutes. A copy/paste is what we need and there should be no objections to you doing it. what exactly do you want i cant post the entire web thats too big and i might get expelled.
Ray McCormack hirr	Posted - 2007.08.11 10:47:00 - [87] The specific details of the actual assignment. They must have it worded out somewhere, so copy and paste it here. \| Open Source Offline Wallet \| BMBE ISK Loans \|
Ezoran DuBlaidd Rivers Enterprises Power Corrupts Industry's	Posted - 2007.08.11 11:27:00 - [88] Originally by: Catherine Altair my first public investor thank you for your offer of 5mil hopefully some others will make an offer too. sounds like all you read in the posts i've made in this thread was that last post.
Catherine Altair	Posted - 2007.08.11 12:02:00 - [89] Originally by: Ray McCormack The specific details of the actual assignment. They must have it worded out somewhere, so copy and paste it here. if you provide an email address i can definitely send you the pdf of the assignment sheet.
Ray McCormack hirr	Posted - 2007.08.11 12:27:00 - [90] Originally by: Catherine Altair if you provide an email address i can definitely send you the pdf of the assignment sheet. [email protected] \| Open Source Offline Wallet \| BMBE ISK Loans \|
Takahashi Arran coracao ardente Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.08.11 13:12:00 - [91] Edited by: Takahashi Arran on 11/08/2007 13:11:45 Originally by: Catherine Altair if you provide an email address i can definitely send you the pdf of the assignment sheet. Or you could upload it to www.scribd.com along with the other papers that you have promised to upload and everyone could look at it
Shadarle	Posted - 2007.08.11 16:09:00 - [92] Wow... I can't believe this thread is still going. And the OP is still digging his hole deeper with each post. I really was considering investing when I first read this. At least a small amount. But each post has made investing less and less likely. If someone cannot even figure out how to form sentences, use punctuation correctly, use capital letters, etc... then why should I have any confidence they know how to operate in the ultra-competitive markets in EVE? I am HIGHLY suspect that the OP is even a college student based on the way he handles criticism and his inability to post any actual assignment details. If this is truly a school project then all course details are most definitely fair game to be posted. Whenever I did projects in my undergrad/graduate classes I was required to give full details of my project to the people I was working with/for. They were required to write up reviews of my performance and a final evaluation based on what I did for them. This factored heavily into my grade. There were standardized forms for them to fill out in many cases. If this is indeed for a school project it is a very shoddy one. Tanking Setups Compared Stacking Penalty / Resists Explained
Dr Slurm General Commodities	Posted - 2007.08.11 16:22:00 - [93] What the OP proposes is exactly what I do. I buy and sell commodities. I started with roughly 200m. I worked that amount up to about 1.5b in liquid assests in about a month and a half's time. You don't need starter capital to do this. You can get 200m very easily in this game by just trading npc trade goods. It's not exactly fast, but very easy. Hell you could probably make just as much mining or running missions. //Playing devil's advocate: It would be really funny if he was actually doing a paper on psychology and online trust issues. Tired of the inane ramblings of the incompetent? Click here
DragonRiderTao	Posted - 2007.08.11 17:10:00 - [94] I am sure my view is not unique. Your assignment is most likely based on a percentage rather than a total sum. You can do this starting with a 1000 isk representing $1000. How many dragons can you slay? You cant slay mine.
Ezoran DuBlaidd Rivers Enterprises Power Corrupts Industry's	Posted - 2007.08.11 19:43:00 - [95] Originally by: Shadarle Wow... I can't believe this thread is still going. And the OP is still digging his hole deeper with each post. I really was considering investing when I first read this. At least a small amount. But each post has made investing less and less likely. If someone cannot even figure out how to form sentences, use punctuation correctly, use capital letters, etc... then why should I have any confidence they know how to operate in the ultra-competitive markets in EVE? perhaps he's from the part of australia where they don't speak english?
Ricdic Caldari Corporate Research And Production Pty Ltd Zzz	Posted - 2007.08.11 20:01:00 - [96] Originally by: Ezoran DuBlaidd perhaps he's from the part of australia where they don't speak english? I work approximately 5 minutes walk from his University, so I don't know if I should take offence to that statement or not Need Empire Research Slots. Click here
Durente Galaica Amarr Fortunate Few	Posted - 2007.08.11 20:34:00 - [97] Edited by: Durente Galaica on 11/08/2007 20:34:52 Step 1) Buy 3 90-Day Game Time Cards with real money Step 2) Sell 3 90-Day Game Time Cards for Isk Step 3) Start Project Perhaps the OP was not aware you could do this. For less than or about equal to the price of an average college book you can get your starting capital. You're Welcome :)
Ezoran DuBlaidd Rivers Enterprises Power Corrupts Industry's	Posted - 2007.08.11 21:38:00 - [98] Originally by: Ricdic Originally by: Ezoran DuBlaidd perhaps he's from the part of australia where they don't speak english? I work approximately 5 minutes walk from his University, so I don't know if I should take offence to that statement or not you could take a lunch with the lad then!
Heikki Gallente Wreckless Abandon Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.08.22 09:04:00 - [99] Couple weeks ago (12 days; see post #61 up there) I offered to verify his participation to the university and the course through RL communication. We had initial Eve-mail correspondence where he promised to check from his professor if that was ok to give contact info. I also proposed use of university email addresses for further communications. After that I have yet to see the details or have any further communications; regardless couple reminder Eve-mails I sent. This may be due my spam filters, his RL reasons, his sudden loss of interest towards the course, or due some more naturel reasons. I'll post update if we get back in contact. -Lasse
Hanoi Hana	Posted - 2007.08.22 16:45:00 - [100] Originally by: Heikki After that I have yet to see the details or have any further communications; regardless couple reminder Eve-mails I sent. This may be due my spam filters, his RL reasons, his sudden loss of interest towards the course, or due some more naturel reasons. I think I have another explanation that most likely you and other people have already arrived at... :)
Ezoran DuBlaidd Rivers Enterprises Power Corrupts Industry's	Posted - 2007.08.22 16:52:00 - [101] Originally by: Hanoi Hana Originally by: Heikki After that I have yet to see the details or have any further communications; regardless couple reminder Eve-mails I sent. This may be due my spam filters, his RL reasons, his sudden loss of interest towards the course, or due some more naturel reasons. I think I have another explanation that most likely you and other people have already arrived at... :) he dropped the course?

Pages: 1 2 3 4 :: [one page]

COPYRIGHT NOTICE
EVE Online, the EVE logo, EVE and all associated logos and designs are the intellectual property of CCP hf. All artwork, screenshots, characters, vehicles, storylines, world facts or other recognizable features of the intellectual property relating to these trademarks are likewise the intellectual property of CCP hf. EVE Online and the EVE logo are the registered trademarks of CCP hf. All rights are reserved worldwide. All other trademarks are the property of their respective owners. CCP hf. has granted permission to EVE-Search.com to use EVE Online and all associated logos and designs for promotional and information purposes on its website but does not endorse, and is not in any way affiliated with, EVE-Search.com. CCP is in no way responsible for the content on or functioning of this website, nor can it be liable for any damage arising from the use of this website.