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Angor The JORG Corporation FATAL Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.11 10:23:00 - [1] Had a rather annoying "fight", if you could call it that with a nanophoon earlier. Was not ammused at all. Nobody was killed but it totally annoyed me how invincible the ship actually was. I was on a gate in an Rapier (the supposed arch enemy of the nano fleet) with a few other friendlies (thorax, zelot, arazu, eris) waiting for this nano ship to come through. He didnt know we were there and when he jumped in he held his cloak as long as possible then decloaked and hit his microwarp back towards the gate and cloaked knowing that if i got a lock on his ass he'd go down like a pile of **. But the inertia from the MWD carried him cloaked to the gate where he jumped through... so our little gang jumped through after him. What does he do? Repeats the same thing... so we jump back after him and what does he do... the SAME DAMN THING!!!. He could have done it all night and only stopped doing it when a second nanophoon turned up to rescue him. So because of this i would like to see more nerfs to stop this kind of crap happening, i dont know what exactly you can do to nerf nano ships anymore but that "fight" really took the **. _______________________________ WTS 50m sp PvP Minmitar Character including Dread and Carrier
Temp Boi	Posted - 2007.08.11 10:33:00 - [2] Let's armor tank our vagabonds too; who needs speed anyways? Let's nerf everything that YOU don't like. A smart pilot did what he needed to do to keep himself alive. Suck it up, and realize that just because something jumps into your gatecamp, it doesn't neccessarily mean that you're going to get it. People like you who cry nerf whenever they get miffed about losing a kill, are going to turn this game into a ******* mining sim. Kindly stfu.
chrisreeves Gallente Asgard Protectorate Betrayal Under Mayhem	Posted - 2007.08.11 10:33:00 - [3] May I ask you, what ship was he in? ----------------- Originally by: kieron The Ibis was never intended to be a solo OMGWTF mission-farming PWNmobile.
Angor The JORG Corporation FATAL Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.11 10:40:00 - [4] Edited by: Angor on 11/08/2007 10:42:02 Originally by: Temp Boi Let's armor tank our vagabonds too; who needs speed anyways? Let's nerf everything that YOU don't like. A smart pilot did what he needed to do to keep himself alive. Suck it up, and realize that just because something jumps into your gatecamp, it doesn't neccessarily mean that you're going to get it. People like you who cry nerf whenever they get miffed about losing a kill, are going to turn this game into a ***** mining sim. Kindly stfu. Obviously a *** nano pilot then arent you. I stated I was in a RAPIER... dual webs ready for the slipperly little bugger... and I am simply stating that ships should NOT be INVINCIBLE. Fine then I'll go out and fit all my ships nano fitted just because it makes me such a good PvPer to MWD and cloak towards a gate to avoid being killed and only wait till i can get a lone miner in a belt to engage. Easy ganks, yeah thats what this game is about... Seriously anybody can fit these ships like that, but it shouldnt be so IMPOSSIBLE to kill them. I also fly a Vagabond and that has a NATURAL speed boost. Battleships DO NOT! _______________________________ WTS 50m sp PvP Minmitar Character including Dread and Carrier
Angor The JORG Corporation FATAL Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.11 10:41:00 - [5] Edited by: Angor on 11/08/2007 10:41:24 double post _______________________________ WTS 50m sp PvP Minmitar Character including Dread and Carrier
sliver 0xD Cosmic Odyssey YouWhat	Posted - 2007.08.11 11:21:00 - [6] what the phoon did to u is normal. it happens all the time. the real problem is when the phoon comes in at 50km and starts to attack and mwd around :P at the moment everything nano will own the rest. and i dont think its ment for most ships to go fast. ceptors go 10km/s and ive already seen nano thoraxes. sorry but if your 1 bs can alywas kill 2 bs then it is not balance. atleast make the web drones faster or something or make the rapier/huginn web range more.
Lishan Kamatar	Posted - 2007.08.11 12:01:00 - [7] Edited by: Lishan Kamatar on 11/08/2007 12:01:30 Originally by: Angor Had a rather annoying "fight", if you could call it that with a nanophoon earlier. Was not ammused at all. Nobody was killed but it totally annoyed me how invincible the ship actually was. I was on a gate in an Rapier (the supposed arch enemy of the nano fleet) with a few other friendlies (thorax, zelot, arazu, eris) waiting for this nano ship to come through. He didnt know we were there and when he jumped in he held his cloak as long as possible then decloaked and hit his microwarp back towards the gate and cloaked knowing that if i got a lock on his ass he'd go down like a pile of **. But the inertia from the MWD carried him cloaked to the gate where he jumped through... so our little gang jumped through after him. What does he do? Repeats the same thing... so we jump back after him and what does he do... the SAME DAMN THING!!!. He could have done it all night and only stopped doing it when a second nanophoon turned up to rescue him. So because of this i would like to see more nerfs to stop this kind of crap happening, i dont know what exactly you can do to nerf nano ships anymore but that "fight" really took the **. how many of these nanophoons doid you see? 2 how many nos domi set ups are there in eve 100s not if 1000s. i admit there is proberly a few more nanophoons going round but ccp only nerf i win set ups or something thats made everyone do the same thing, like before the previous nano nerf. their was nano geddons, nano megas, nano domis, even nano ravens i mean wtf?. Now you see a minmatar ship using nanos ( which imo it should be aloud to do as it's the fastests race ) and you cry nerf! im just glad ccp have got round the nos issue, might be a bit harsh but it still can useful. but so useful to take up a gun slot / missile slot. and be quite or post something constructive there are too many whiners on these forums today.
Harm Gently Naughty 40 Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.08.11 16:32:00 - [8] You ran into a ship that probably cost several billions, couldn't kill it and then you come here and cry for a nerf? Come on..
aaron 619 Gallente DAB RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.11 16:42:00 - [9] hey, when you done crying and quit, be sure to drop you stuff in my hanger in jita. If I can do it, so can you! If you choose not to, your fault, not mine! Stop Spamming the T1 Nerf Torp CCP. Invent a T2 boost Torp and use it! Balance is Important, EVE still being fun, Priceles
Roemy Schneider BINFORD	Posted - 2007.08.11 17:25:00 - [10] in his place, i wouldnt have cloaked... - putting the gist back into logistics
MotherMoon Huang Yinglong Namtz'aar k'in	Posted - 2007.08.11 17:40:00 - [11] OMG. first everyone gets **ed and say. OMG THE NANO IS DEAD! OR THE DRAKE IT DEAD! STOP NERFING CCP! and then 4 months laters. MORE NERF THE SHIPS STILL WORK! does anyone else see the stupidness of this whole situation? everyone thinks CCP nerf things to . when all CCP is doing is balancing the game. CCP does not nerf stuff, they balance stuff. the nano "nerf" was not a nerf, it was a balance of in-game mechanics and how some modules work. They even said they didn't want to kill the nano-ship. go read the dev blog. so don't hold your breath, they didn't nerf nano ships in the frist place and won't nerf them now. ----------------------------------- I'm working my way through college target CCP Quote:** CCP posted a new dev blog, they are going to bring Nos in line with.....well....logic
Sverre Haakonson Gallente SecuWay Industrial inc. SECUWAY.	Posted - 2007.08.11 19:48:00 - [12] Originally by: Temp Boi Let's armor tank our vagabonds too; who needs speed anyways? Let's nerf everything that YOU don't like. A smart pilot did what he needed to do to keep himself alive. Suck it up, and realize that just because something jumps into your gatecamp, it doesn't neccessarily mean that you're going to get it. People like you who cry nerf whenever they get miffed about losing a kill, are going to turn this game into a ******* mining sim. Kindly stfu. /signed
Angor The JORG Corporation FATAL Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.11 21:59:00 - [13] I think your all not reading what i put to be honest... I was in a ship fitted for taking down a nano ship... do you not understand that???? I was in a dual webbed rapier... and the pilot knew he was in trouble. It wouldnt have mattered if we had 100 people on the gate because he still would have been able to cloak, aproach the gate with inertia and jump... our 100man fleet could have camped 50 each side of the gate and he would have still avoided getting killed forever... someone please tell me how this is fair? Now i've fought nano ships before, lost ships to them and killed them, i dont have a real problem with them but if you can avoid being killed forever by doing what he did then that is something that needs changing. He was only able to get away when a second nanophoon came to rescue him. Its just pathetic... _______________________________ WTS 50m sp PvP Minmitar Character including Dread and Carrier
Lishan Kamatar	Posted - 2007.08.11 22:09:00 - [14] Edited by: Lishan Kamatar on 11/08/2007 22:11:06 Originally by: Angor I think your all not reading what i put to be honest... I was in a ship fitted for taking down a nano ship... do you not understand that???? I was in a dual webbed rapier... and the pilot knew he was in trouble. It wouldnt have mattered if we had 100 people on the gate because he still would have been able to cloak, aproach the gate with inertia and jump... our 100man fleet could have camped 50 each side of the gate and he would have still avoided getting killed forever... someone please tell me how this is fair? Now i've fought nano ships before, lost ships to them and killed them, i dont have a real problem with them but if you can avoid being killed forever by doing what he did then that is something that needs changing. He was only able to get away when a second nanophoon came to rescue him. Its just pathetic... ok you are in a rapier with dual webs, he mwds for a second cloaks and still aproachs the gate. so you could not lock him in time, ever thought of fitting a couple of sensor boosters on a rapier? nanos dont need a nerf, he had a mwd, you had a counter EI 2x webs with very nice range, he had a counter for you locking him, a cloak. theres your problem, any how, how the hell did you not decloak him? is a bloody bs luanch your drones. he still has to wait 30seconds before he can rejump. imo this is still completly your fualt for not locking him down in time. this is like saying he had guns fitted you had a tank, but he had a couple of neuts to disable or render useless your tank. or ECM he locks you to fire you try to jam him but he has a ECCM fitted so it fails almost all the time.
Vicious Phoenix	Posted - 2007.08.12 02:42:00 - [15] Originally by: Angor I think your all not reading what i put to be honest... I was in a ship fitted for taking down a nano ship... do you not understand that???? I was in a dual webbed rapier... and the pilot knew he was in trouble. It wouldnt have mattered if we had 100 people on the gate because he still would have been able to cloak, aproach the gate with inertia and jump... our 100man fleet could have camped 50 each side of the gate and he would have still avoided getting killed forever... someone please tell me how this is fair? Now i've fought nano ships before, lost ships to them and killed them, i dont have a real problem with them but if you can avoid being killed forever by doing what he did then that is something that needs changing. He was only able to get away when a second nanophoon came to rescue him. Its just pathetic... No, he can't avoid being killed forever because he never got away... CFW (Certified Forum Warrior) I kill people ingame too. Originally by: CCP Tuxford I prefer dew over pepsi. I prefer beer over most things. Damn now I want beer.
Angor The JORG Corporation FATAL Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.12 03:16:00 - [16] I dont know what your on about because he did get away.... another nanophoon saved him by warping to the gate we were on. Yes i did have a sensor booster fitted... it made no difference what so ever. I think you had to really be there because have any of you tried say to lock a ship that has a cloak fitted coming through a gate? Its impossible... a cov ops, recon or any ship with a cloak can avoid being locked by just hitting cloak like half a second after hitting warp or approach or mwd whatever. Drones didnt make a difference either. If i couldnt get that initial lock then i had no chance because even cloaked it took him about 4 seconds to reach the gate from 15k out. Even if i had decloaked him with drones 1 second after he cloaked he would have still been doing about 4000ms towards the gate under inertia. _______________________________ WTS 50m sp PvP Minmitar Character including Dread and Carrier
Vicious Phoenix	Posted - 2007.08.12 03:21:00 - [17] Originally by: Angor I dont know what your on about because he did get away.... another nanophoon saved him by warping to the gate we were on. Well that had nothing to do with him, did it? He got away with help, so how does that make his fit overpowered. CFW (Certified Forum Warrior) I kill people ingame too. Originally by: CCP Tuxford I prefer dew over pepsi. I prefer beer over most things. Damn now I want beer.
TheJLobes CoRe Clan FOUNDATI0N	Posted - 2007.08.12 03:40:00 - [18] Originally by: Angor ...I am simply stating that ships should NOT be INVINCIBLE. This ship is not "INVINCIBLE" he simply chose not to fight you. He's no more invincible than a 5km/s interceptor, or a stealth bomber, or a covert ops ship, or any other ship that is set up to select its fights. Stop whining.
Ares Helix Gallente NunyaBizzness Phobos Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.12 08:58:00 - [19] Originally by: Angor I think your all not reading what i put to be honest... I was in a ship fitted for taking down a nano ship... do you not understand that???? I was in a dual webbed rapier... and the pilot knew he was in trouble. It wouldnt have mattered if we had 100 people on the gate because he still would have been able to cloak, aproach the gate with inertia and jump... our 100man fleet could have camped 50 each side of the gate and he would have still avoided getting killed forever... someone please tell me how this is fair? Now i've fought nano ships before, lost ships to them and killed them, i dont have a real problem with them but if you can avoid being killed forever by doing what he did then that is something that needs changing. He was only able to get away when a second nanophoon came to rescue him. Its just pathetic... Then maybe, just maybe, you need to work on your setup? Also may wanna think about doing something in Eve BESIDES sitting on a gate ganking passers by... Seems pretty lame to me.
Krugerrand 0utbreak	Posted - 2007.08.12 11:51:00 - [20] Sounds more like your whining about the cloak than the nanos...
Jaketh Ivanes Amarr Do Or Die And Live Or Try	Posted - 2007.08.12 19:21:00 - [21] Edited by: Jaketh Ivanes on 12/08/2007 19:21:41 Originally by: Krugerrand Sounds more like your whining about the cloak than the nanos... I belive you are correct. Actually its the combination of cloak, nano, gate and game mechanics (IMO). Doesn't sound like a nerf of nano's is needed here. So, what should be changed? Increased re-jump timer (1 minute)? Make it impossible to cloak while MWD is on? Insta stop a ship that cloaks (Inertia removed)? Remove cloaks from BS (or any ship without a bonus for it)? Remove the automatical cloak when jumping to a new system (not cloaked at all)? If i were that phoon pilot, i had hugged the gate. If the Rapier had agressed, i would have jumped, making it impossible for the Rapier to follow and for me to escape. if anyone else had agressed, I would try to get the Rapier alone. Might be able to stop the phoon, but how long would it last alone against a phoon? Sounds to me you got bested, and thats it. No nerf needed or changes. If you had caught the Phoon in any other scenario, it would not have survived, would it?
Neo Rainhart Caldari Leela's Lamas	Posted - 2007.08.12 20:44:00 - [22] I love the impression on peoples faces when they see a nanophoon even after the nerf ..priceless.. So far only nanophoon i fly is on SISI (snakes and such...shivers) so, damn straight, they who put several billions on this ship on TQ deserve to get a few easy kills. And especially escaping your little gate camp. Stop whining, will ya no Join Leela's today and receive taters.
Rax Disciprin	Posted - 2007.08.12 21:37:00 - [23] I don't get it, wasn't it the cloak that was giving you trouble and not the nanos? Oh wait you were in a rapier, now I see why you're not going for a cloaking nerf. Anyway, it doesn't sound like you were trying very hard. Next time, deploy drones all over the gate to increase your chances of decloaking him and bump him away once you do.
Angor The JORG Corporation FATAL Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.13 05:43:00 - [24] Oh this thread is getting comical. Ok yeah, it may be the cloak + nano combination which is making the ship so "invincible" in my eyes and its that combination that maybe needs changing/nerfing. Nano ships are extreamly difficult to kill as it is, its not like an interceptor can just go up to it and put a web on it without the nano battleship nosing/neutralizing it to death in a second. It requires a team of people which most likely should include a huginn/rapier. You generally cant get near a nanoship unless it jumps through to you at a gate, that breif second it has to accelerate is your only change to hold it down in most circumstances so even if you spend billions on a ships setup you still shouldnt have the "i-win" button for every engagement. The things too difficult to catch in every other circumstance unless you use bait and have a rapier cloaked close by. This guy was invading our space, I wasnt just sitting on a random gate waiting for people to gank, when I heard he was coming a few of us waited for him and for once, he KNEW he was in trouble but used the "get-away-free" card that is the nano + cloak combination. Why exactly should he or any nano pilot be given the ultimate "i-win" button just because they have a healty wallet? If Titan pilots, the supposed ultimate, most expensive "i-win" button there is gets a ballance then so should he. Now I know most of you just think that I'm moaning... but if you'd been there you would have understood exactly what I am talking about. If i had no chance of catching this guy jumping through a gate (in our own sov space) then there was almost no change to catch him at all in any circumstance which is ultimatly unfair in my oppinion. _______________________________ WTS 50m sp PvP Minmitar Character including Dread and Carrier
Anaalys Fluuterby Caldari	Posted - 2007.08.13 06:14:00 - [25] Wow. One ship got away and its time to nerf them AGAIN? I suppose you would have prefered if he had just logged and fired the alt on the same account and insta-dissapeared? At least he used IN GAME mechanics and beat you and not the only other method he could have escaped intact. Face it, you were out-planned. I'm going to start a list of all these whining threads from 0.0 Alliance players and everytime I see someone in a 0.0 Alliance make comments to someone about being a carebear I'm going to post them. Originally by: CCP Chronotis Since this thread continues to fight against the people who derail it into the macro miners witchhunt. I will move it to features and ideas discussion where ...
Angor The JORG Corporation FATAL Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.13 06:20:00 - [26] sarcastic forum warriors are strong in this thread. _______________________________ WTS 50m sp PvP Minmitar Character including Dread and Carrier
Rax Disciprin	Posted - 2007.08.13 06:28:00 - [27] I still don't get it. Sure, you couldn't catch him, but he didn't do anything to you either. Nor could he have, since you would have had him locked and webbed way before he could even lock any of you. If he had been in a covops, or for that matter anything else with a cloak, you would have had the same problem. Are you going to actually suggest some game balance ideas? Impotent venting doesn't really belong in this channel.
fire 59 Destructive Influence Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.08.13 10:43:00 - [28] Personally, i think they should do something to redress the recent flux of people fitting cloaks to every ship. It's like the new fotm safe pvp option. Heavily penalise cloaks on non cloak speific ships ( i mean like reduce optimal/falloff/turn weapons off kinda heavy ) but leave the cloaking ships alone. Carrier 1 Billion isk 19 fighters 323 million isk Watching goonfleet getting there @$$ handed to them and reading there hagred attempt at smacktalking after the fact ...PRICELESS
Kaben	Posted - 2007.08.13 10:46:00 - [29] Originally by: Neo Rainhart I love the impression on peoples faces when they see a nanophoon even after the nerf ..priceless.. So far only nanophoon i fly is on SISI (snakes and such...shivers) so, damn straight, they who put several billions on this ship on TQ deserve to get a few easy kills. And especially escaping your little gate camp. Stop whining, will ya no The impression on someones face who doesn't realize loss vs cost...priceless. What does this mean bazzle? If someone blows up your ship you don't loose the implants, so this so called billions of isk means jack, unless there's a bubble on you so your pod can't escape.
Shadow Enigma	Posted - 2007.08.13 11:19:00 - [30] What I would do: 1) Make Nanofibers and policarbon engine housing a 1 per ship mod/rig same as damage controls are (maybe some other mods/rigs should be the same). 2) Increase bonuses to these mods to an appropriate level since you can't put more of then on anymore. A result (the way I see it) would be perhaps a slightly reduced top speed. (I said perhaps) Low slot number would not count as much meaning that ship can't go fast just coz they have more low slots. ATM armor tankers can rig for speed easier. Would make larger ships accelerate slower as they would not be able to reduce their weight as much making "native" ship agility count for more. Native speed would be more important then weight reduction capabilities
Angor The JORG Corporation FATAL Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.13 13:51:00 - [31] Edited by: Angor on 13/08/2007 14:07:47 Originally by: fire 59 Personally, i think they should do something to redress the recent flux of people fitting cloaks to every ship. It's like the new fotm safe pvp option. Heavily penalise cloaks on non cloak speific ships ( i mean like reduce optimal/falloff/turn weapons off kinda heavy ) but leave the cloaking ships alone. Winner... Thats it. Disregarding ships that require covert ops cloaking devices and bombers that use improved. It would work against macro ratters, and cloaking nano ships. Fitting a cloak to a non-specific cloaking ship would render the weapons on that ship almost useless. So it would be pointless for nano ships to fit... hence solving my issue. On the gate he would still have got away but with the weapons almost useless he wouldnt have come for easy ganks in the first place with it fitted. Maybe reduce the locking range and scan resolution with an active cloak to -95% to 99% so missiles are affected as well and not just guns that require tracking. Thats fair right? The only people that should be affected are the macro ratters and nano cloakers? Nano ships can still nano and macro ratters can be killed for once, reducing isk selling. Winner all round I reckon. Remember to tell your dev buddies at your next alliance meeting... lol only joking dude . _______________________________ WTS 50m sp PvP Minmitar Character including Dread and Carrier
Ulviirala Vauryndar Gallente Cohortes Stellaris Blade.	Posted - 2007.08.13 15:10:00 - [32] This sounds like someone running around a tree and you keep all the way running after him. Maybe change direction? And where the heck is the problem for a interceptor for instance, locking and webbing a Battleship with increased signature radius even? Hell, I've got owned in shuttles already :P And as it was mentioned... I don't see an imbalance in a Battleship taking out two Battleships. Ever heard of skilled pilots and being fitted wrong for a specific encounter? Thats why you can carefully choose your fitting, specialize or being a jack of all trades or just fit stuff. Just like with character skills. IMHO. Oke Cortes, I "gif" up. You won. 400x80 @ 23,239 bytes ^_^
Major Stallion Four Rings D-L	Posted - 2007.08.13 17:08:00 - [33] Originally by: Angor Edited by: Angor on 13/08/2007 05:44:38 Had a rather annoying "fight", if you could call it that with a nanophoon earlier. Was not ammused at all. Nobody was killed but it totally annoyed me how invincible the ship actually was. I was on a gate in an Rapier (the supposed arch enemy of the nano fleet) with a few other friendlies (thorax, zelot, arazu, eris) waiting for this nano ship to come through. He didnt know we were there and when he jumped in he held his cloak as long as possible then decloaked and hit his microwarp back towards the gate and cloaked knowing that if i got a lock on his ass he'd go down like a pile of **. But the inertia from the MWD carried him cloaked to the gate where he jumped through... so our little gang jumped through after him. What does he do? Repeats the same thing... so we jump back after him and what does he do... the SAME DAMN THING!!!. He could have done it all night and only stopped doing it when a second nanophoon turned up to rescue him. So because of this i would like to see more nerfs to stop this kind of crap happening, i dont know what exactly you can do to nerf nano ships anymore but that "fight" really took the **. are you kidding me? the nano was nerfed once, and now because you suck at PVP you want it nerfed even further? Thats sad. ________________________________ High Sec PvP
Anaalys Fluuterby Caldari	Posted - 2007.08.13 19:39:00 - [34] Originally by: Angor Thats fair right? The only people that should be affected are the macro ratters and nano cloakers? Nano ships can still nano and macro ratters can be killed for once, reducing isk selling. Winner all round I reckon. Except you just nerfed every lowsec and 0.0 non-Alliance exploration vessel also. You know, the ones that sit there for hours trying to find exploration sites? That can't warp without breaking their scans? More players fit cloaks on "non-cloaking" ships than just Nanophoons and Macros Originally by: CCP Chronotis Since this thread continues to fight against the people who derail it into the macro miners witchhunt. I will move it to features and ideas discussion where ...
Angor The JORG Corporation FATAL Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.13 23:37:00 - [35] Edited by: Angor on 13/08/2007 23:40:02 Originally by: Major Stallion Originally by: Angor Edited by: Angor on 13/08/2007 05:44:38 Had a rather annoying "fight", if you could call it that with a nanophoon earlier. Was not ammused at all. Nobody was killed but it totally annoyed me how invincible the ship actually was. I was on a gate in an Rapier (the supposed arch enemy of the nano fleet) with a few other friendlies (thorax, zelot, arazu, eris) waiting for this nano ship to come through. He didnt know we were there and when he jumped in he held his cloak as long as possible then decloaked and hit his microwarp back towards the gate and cloaked knowing that if i got a lock on his ass he'd go down like a pile of **. But the inertia from the MWD carried him cloaked to the gate where he jumped through... so our little gang jumped through after him. What does he do? Repeats the same thing... so we jump back after him and what does he do... the SAME DAMN THING!!!. He could have done it all night and only stopped doing it when a second nanophoon turned up to rescue him. So because of this i would like to see more nerfs to stop this kind of crap happening, i dont know what exactly you can do to nerf nano ships anymore but that "fight" really took the . are you kidding me? the nano was nerfed once, and now because you suck at PVP you want it nerfed even further? Thats sad. Read the whole thread asswipe... and if you think I suck at PvP so much then maybe we should have a 1v1? COME GET SOME Originally by:** Anaalys Fluuterby Originally by: Angor Thats fair right? The only people that should be affected are the macro ratters and nano cloakers? Nano ships can still nano and macro ratters can be killed for once, reducing isk selling. Winner all round I reckon. Except you just nerfed every lowsec and 0.0 non-Alliance exploration vessel also. You know, the ones that sit there for hours trying to find exploration sites? That can't warp without breaking their scans? More players fit cloaks on "non-cloaking" ships than just Nanophoons and Macros I dont see how this will affect other people that much. Covert ops ships fitted with scan probe launchers for exploration would not be affected??? Is that what you mean? If your trying to find exploration sites in a none covert ops ship then you need to train for a covert ops as your scan time must be around 400 seconds _______________________________ WTS 50m sp PvP Minmitar Character including Dread and Carrier
Kweel Nakashyn Minmatar Aeden Tau Ceti Federation	Posted - 2007.08.14 00:24:00 - [36] op : don't you know coming rigth next to a ship uncloaks him ? -=-=-
Angor The JORG Corporation FATAL Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.14 00:41:00 - [37] What good does that do if even if u decloak them get a lock and activate webs the're inertia still carry's them to jump range. _______________________________ WTS 50m sp PvP Minmitar Character including Dread and Carrier
Kin'Tarr Minmatar Silentium.	Posted - 2007.08.14 02:51:00 - [38] Explain to me how small corporations and pvp outfits fight against the hordes of blobs roaming alliance space and pass through choke points camped daily....?
Ramlag Eve University Ivy League	Posted - 2007.08.14 12:00:00 - [39] To be honest, I think that its a lame tactic, that said I don't want it removed. I hate blob warfare as it is and I hate the fact that jumping into a gate blind (unless you're an alt user or in a group) and coming up against more then one ship usually = you die. Yes nanophoons are evil and lame as hell, I just wish all ships were able to be as evil and lame as hell. /not signed
Triana Gallente MMK Design and Logistic	Posted - 2007.08.14 12:04:00 - [40] so what, a pilot was smarter than you and escaped your camp, good for him. Stop whinning -- War is like any other bad relationship. Of course you want out, but at what price? And perhaps more importantly, once you get out, will you be any better off?
Major Stallion Four Rings D-L	Posted - 2007.08.14 14:10:00 - [41] Originally by: Angor Read the whole thread asswipe... and if you think I suck at PvP so much then maybe we should have a 1v1? COME GET SOME 1st off, I admittedly suc at pvp. So a 1v1 would most likely result in me getting ripped apart. See how i did that? I admit that i suck, but i dont go around calling for nerfs just because im not effective in 1v1, i just travel with a gang. 2nd off, i read your entire post THREE TIMES, and its still a bunch of "omg another pilot put some foresight into his setup, on to the forums to cry for him to be nerfed!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!" grow...up... ________________________________ High Sec PvP
Alpine 69 Slacker Industries Exuro Mortis	Posted - 2007.08.14 14:27:00 - [42] Don't nerf a thing, the OP should grow some brains. It isn't hard at all to catch said nanophoon. Sweet love for the ones that mod my sig <3 From her? You're on. -Rauth
Ares Helix Gallente NunyaBizzness Phobos Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.16 00:10:00 - [43] Angor: I don't think you're after a nerf mate. More a special doomsday device just for you, able to be mounted on your ship, called an "I WIN" button. Fair enough really, I mean you're the most important person in Eve after all, makes sense to us all that you get one... As one of my alliance mates says, you wouldn't be *****ing about it if it was to your advantage!
Deathcharge Minmatar The Holy Hand Grenades of Antioch	Posted - 2007.08.16 03:05:00 - [44] I realize how frustrated you must feel about having that phoon slipping past ya, but what you're asking here is an uBeR-I-pWn-AlL camping button that will hand you all your victims on a silver plate with a golden edge. Yes you were in a anti-nano ship, and you would've crushed him if he'd try to start some ****. But he didnt... Its not like he pwned your anti-nano ship, so theres really nothing overpowering about what he did. Its an evasion technique. I mean you want ways to catch ppl in your camps, well some people want ways to evade those ways - both desires are justifiable. People gotto have an ability to survive. So theres really nothing to nerf.
Valharu	Posted - 2007.08.16 07:42:00 - [45] Actually Angor, you are pretty much correct, there is a issue with nano ships in general and it gets compounded even more when added with how fast Cloaks work etc. Realisticly it has to be broken down some. Alot of speed mods work good with a Afterburner but when combined with a MWD, it gets WAY out of hand. Acceleration from 0 to Max MWD is probably one of the main issues. Cloaks, cloak WAY to fast, so are far to effective when coming out of a gate. I have seen them cloak befor I could lock them with a 2400 Scan Res on many occasion. When people come through a Warp Gate, there should probably be a time delay which last longer then the Cloak from the gate. You should be able to enter another gate as soon as you reach it, but a delay on the gate you just came through. Don't worry about the nay sayers, I have played games for years of all types, the easist way to spot a imbalance is watch how many people switch over to a certain tactic. One of your prime examples of is how many ships it took to try to take on a single nano ship, that is a sign in itself. Now multiply it by more then one Nano Ships. Now a days I see packs usually around 6 or 11 (don't ask me why) +/- nano ships running around. The issue is many fold, its not just this or that but a few things. Nanos easily out run Track and Range of even long range weapons, which makes the purpose of haveing a long range weapon useless. I know people who fly in groups of them cause they ARE the I win button. They arnt used persay for fleet battles but in large groups they can terrorize many times their numbers do to speed and inertia if they play it right to carry them out of Web Range. Don't be concerned about what everyone else thinks, many can't tell a debate from a whine even if you brought some cheese and a violin along, just write what you believe for CCP to review, and ONLY debate people who know what a dabate is. The whine claim is old and used in every game I know, sometimes true, but mostly people hind behind it to protect their interest. KMA has normally been my rule of thumb.
Kweel Nakashyn Minmatar Aeden Tau Ceti Federation	Posted - 2007.08.16 10:36:00 - [46] Edited by: Kweel Nakashyn on 16/08/2007 10:37:00 Originally by: Angor What good does that do if even if u decloak them get a lock and activate webs the're inertia still carry's them to jump range. Vaga and nanophoons fitted with inertia stabs ? Are you sure ? I mean lol. -=-=-
Venkul Mul Gallente	Posted - 2007.08.16 14:52:00 - [47] Originally by: Valharu When people come through a Warp Gate, there should probably be a time delay which last longer then the Cloak from the gate. You should be able to enter another gate as soon as you reach it, but a delay on the gate you just came through. Clarify this, as you seem to want more lag and less time protected for people jumping in a new system. Or you simply want a I win button for gatecampers?
Alski Gallente Di-Tron Heavy Industries Atlas Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.16 15:47:00 - [48] tbh i think this is a valid tactic, its not much different from an interceptor doing the same thing minus the cloak, its an interesting use of a module that useuley doesent have much of defencesive value in that kind of situation, and i kinda respect the ingenuity of it - its certainley something i've never seen done before on a non-covops. - (combat) Patch belonging to CCP hits your drones, wrecking their liberty and freedom.
Valharu	Posted - 2007.08.16 17:19:00 - [49] You end up with only a delay on the gate you just exited. Not for warping off and entering a new gate. As for the I win gate camp, there is a reason why there is a camp, if set up right, single ships should find it hard to get away. The issue lies in how some things work, some are 1s and 0s, either it works or it doesnt which causes alot of the issues we have. If you change how Warp Engines, Warp Scrams and Warp Cores work, (Engines already have a rating in the game that can be used) you would see a much better and enhanced game. For example, if you gave a Warp Scram a X amount of rating vs the engine output of the opposing ship, it would not stop, but delay the ship from warping off, get enough Warp Scrams and go over the engine rating and THEN it is locked in place. Warp Cores would just add to your engines warp strength and shorten the time a Warp Scram could hold you down. So now its a tug of war, neither the Warp Scram nor the Warp Core can be used as a I WIN button. Its a battle of DPS vs Tanking vs Time. Same thing for Dictor Bubbles and Mobile Bubbles. Give them a decent rating. In a simuliar fashion, a version of this idea can be applied to Sensors vs Cloaks. When it comes to Cloaked ships, it should be like the old Sub Hunts. If anyone is intersted I can write something on that later. There should be no I WIN buttons offensively or defensivly.
Tukseiga Caldari Subach-Tech FATAL Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.16 18:35:00 - [50] I have spent many of hours chasing around the cloak nano ships as well, many of those hours where prolly with angor. The only real problem is the cloak and just the inability to lock the ship or find it for that matter.(yeah i know thats pretty much the purpose of the cloak) Not much really works on stopping them. If u drop a bubble on them they just say cloaked longer, the cloak is what allows them to do what they do. The nano part just makes it easier. No real nerfs are needed. Alot of times these cloaked nano ships just sit cloaked in a safespot or in a belt or what not. What is really needed is just someway to scan/probe them out and/or a new bubble the instead of preventing warp prevents cloaking. Just a few constructive thoughts.
Tukseiga Caldari Subach-Tech FATAL Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.16 18:35:00 - [51] Edited by: Tukseiga on 16/08/2007 18:47:19 I have spent many of hours chasing around the cloak nano ships as well, many of those hours where prolly with angor. The only real problem is the cloak and just the inability to lock the ship or find it for that matter.(yeah i know thats pretty much the purpose of the cloak) Not much really works on stopping them. If u drop a bubble on them they just say cloaked longer, the cloak is what allows them to do what they do. The nano part just makes it easier. No real nerfs are needed. Alot of times these cloaked nano ships just sit cloaked in a safespot or in a belt or what not. What is really needed is just someway to scan/probe them out and/or a new bubble the instead of preventing warp prevents cloaking. Just a few constructive thoughts. Just thought of something to add since we are dealing with most of the cloaked/nanaphoons in our home systems make it to where say the bubble that prevents cloaking can only be deployed in a system u have lets says sov.3 or sumthing. To prevent the bubble from being used on all gate camps and just allow you to protect your home territory and keep people out.
Angor The JORG Corporation FATAL Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.20 11:46:00 - [52] CCP------------------------ Either nerf cloaks so that they have a -95% scan res and -95% locking range on fitted battleships, even just while the module is online to prevent nano ships fitting them or Give interdictors different flavor bubbles such as Warp Disrupt, Webification and Decloak bubbles... that would make things even more interesting --------------------------- Most people who have read this thread have not read it fully i believe, they assume I am being lame and camping random gates waiting to kill innocent people, NO... I am trying defending our sov space from invaders that know they "cannot be killed". Second thing I like to point out is that I am not asking for some kind of "I-Win" button for myself. I am asking for the Nano+Cloak "I-Win" button to be taken away. As I have said before, I have no problem with nano ships, but in that little tiny chance you have of killing one, that 2% chance in any given situation of catching one, is wiped away by the little *** fitting a cloak then something has to be done. As for the D-L idiot, that 64% or whatever you were on about was our whole alliance, I do not know what my efficiency but you can work it out yourself below and I have over 100 solo kills. Corporation: The JORG Corporation Alliance: FATAL Alliance Kills: 781 Real kills: 557 Losses: 40 Damage done (ISK): 16324.768003M Damage received (ISK): 2715.608M lost 2x carriers :( Yes I like to PvP, i just dont want to have to spend x amount of billions of isk to setup a nanoship just so I can 1v1 another nano ship invading our teritory to the point where he probably wouldnt even fight me and instead choose to cloak and run away. *** and flame away... _______________________________ WTS 50m sp PvP Minmitar Character including Dread and Carrier

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