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Why are there other ships besides capitals in EVE?

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Soulita Gallente Inner Core	Posted - 2007.09.19 23:17:00 - [1] Edited by: Soulita on 19/09/2007 23:17:49 The devs spend a lot of time balancing the playthings of the little man, like frigs, cruisers and BSs. They even get remodeled and new skins and such. In truth they are useless, only dreads, carriers and maybe interdictors and a few e-war ships and cov-ops are of relevance. So, since cap ship / non-cap ship balance does not exist, why not scrap the useless non cap-ship classes alltogether?
Theo Samaritan Gallente Aliastra	Posted - 2007.09.19 23:18:00 - [2] Originally by: Soulita Edited by: Soulita on 19/09/2007 23:17:49 The devs spend a lot of time balancing the playthings of the little man, like frigs, cruisers and BSs. They even get remodeled and new skins and such. In truth they are useless, only dreads, carriers and maybe interdictors and a few e-war ships and cov-ops are of relevance. So, since cap ship / non-cap ship balance does not exist, why not scrap the useless non cap-ship classes alltogether? Shut it. ______________________________ A Request About Lag Discussion -- Yet another "Edit my sig devs!" request \o/
Arvald Caldari House of Tempers	Posted - 2007.09.19 23:20:00 - [3] Originally by: Soulita Edited by: Soulita on 19/09/2007 23:17:49 The devs spend a lot of time balancing the playthings of the little man, like frigs, cruisers and BSs. They even get remodeled and new skins and such. In truth they are useless, only dreads, carriers and maybe interdictors and a few e-war ships and cov-ops are of relevance. So, since cap ship / non-cap ship balance does not exist, why not scrap the useless non cap-ship classes alltogether? SHUT IT!!!!! ----------------------------------------------- ya cant stop the rokh and no i have not nor will i ever contribute anything constructive to your thread
Soulita Gallente Inner Core	Posted - 2007.09.19 23:21:00 - [4] Originally by: Theo Samaritan Originally by: Soulita Edited by: Soulita on 19/09/2007 23:17:49 The devs spend a lot of time balancing the playthings of the little man, like frigs, cruisers and BSs. They even get remodeled and new skins and such. In truth they are useless, only dreads, carriers and maybe interdictors and a few e-war ships and cov-ops are of relevance. So, since cap ship / non-cap ship balance does not exist, why not scrap the useless non cap-ship classes alltogether? Shut it. Is that all you can come up with? Balance between non-cap ships and cap ships is completely off. That is a fact. It would be only logical to either get balance going or to scrap either capitals or non-capitals.
Theo Samaritan Gallente Aliastra	Posted - 2007.09.19 23:24:00 - [5] Originally by: Soulita Balance between non-cap ships and cap ships is completely off. That is a fact. It would be only logical to either get balance going or to scrap either capitals or non-capitals. I think the balance is fine tyvm. The power in capships is outbalanced by price and skill req, both are far from the reach of many people for more than a year. So yes. Shut it. ______________________________ A Request About Lag Discussion -- Yet another "Edit my sig devs!" request \o/
Fallen Shadow	Posted - 2007.09.19 23:26:00 - [6] Can you fly a Capital ship? If so which ones? Do you really understand the logistics of Capital jump drives and Cost of Fuel?
Pirate Tom	Posted - 2007.09.19 23:26:00 - [7] apparently cost means nothing in this argument, nor does the training time, or the fact that capitals cannot use stargates, or go above 0.4 security systems. Lets get rid of non-capital ships! Anyone above 0.4 sec is in a shuttle or a pod. Anyone with less than a billion ISK doesnt' deserve to play the game. right.
Alski Gallente Di-Tron Heavy Industries Atlas Alliance	Posted - 2007.09.19 23:27:00 - [8] shu... nah thats too impolite for me Because capitals are not WTFBBQPWN mechines, if you flew one yourself you'd understand that. - (combat) Patch belonging to CCP hits your drones, wrecking their liberty and freedom.
Soulita Gallente Inner Core	Posted - 2007.09.19 23:27:00 - [9] Originally by: Theo Samaritan Originally by: Soulita Balance between non-cap ships and cap ships is completely off. That is a fact. It would be only logical to either get balance going or to scrap either capitals or non-capitals. I think the balance is fine tyvm. The power in capships is outbalanced by price and skill req, both are far from the reach of many people for more than a year. So yes. Shut it. Wrong. Carriers for example are not very costly, and most people use second accounts as cap pilots. These train fairly quickly. The balance is a problem, and that wont change with weak arguments such as yours.
Fallen Shadow	Posted - 2007.09.19 23:28:00 - [10] Pirate Tom, looks like we had the same argument. lol
Reem Fairchild	Posted - 2007.09.19 23:28:00 - [11] Originally by: Soulita So, since cap ship / non-cap ship balance does not exist, why not scrap the useless non cap-ship classes alltogether? Because you have no idea what you're talking about.
Stitcher Caldari legion of qui Freelancer Alliance	Posted - 2007.09.19 23:28:00 - [12] clueless forumite is clueless. - The game is not the problem. The problem is that you are not adapting to the game.
Soulita Gallente Inner Core	Posted - 2007.09.19 23:29:00 - [13] Originally by: Alski shu... nah thats too impolite for me Because capitals are not WTFBBQPWN mechines, if you flew one yourself you'd understand that. I do NOT fly one, because they are off balance. They are way off scale compared to the next smaller class which is BSs.
Soulita Gallente Inner Core	Posted - 2007.09.19 23:30:00 - [14] Originally by: Reem Fairchild Originally by: Soulita So, since cap ship / non-cap ship balance does not exist, why not scrap the useless non cap-ship classes alltogether? Because you have no idea what you're talking about. Quite honestly I think you have no idea what you are talking about. So how would the current cap ships be in balance? Any arguments besides big words?
Theo Samaritan Gallente Aliastra	Posted - 2007.09.19 23:31:00 - [15] Originally by: Soulita Originally by: Alski shu... nah thats too impolite for me Because capitals are not WTFBBQPWN mechines, if you flew one yourself you'd understand that. I do NOT fly one, because they are off balance. They are way off scale compared to the next smaller class which is BSs. Time to fly and use a BS = 2 months, time to afford one about the same Time to fly and use a capital = a year and a half with back-to-back training, and some people stuggle to afford one even after that time. THE SCALE IS THERE FOR A REASON. besides, if you want to kill time, train commandships. ______________________________ A Request About Lag Discussion -- Yet another "Edit my sig devs!" request \o/
Elmicker The Phoenix Rising FreeFall Securities	Posted - 2007.09.19 23:31:00 - [16] Originally by: Soulita I do NOT fly one Best you leave the issue there, then, eh?
Stitcher Caldari legion of qui Freelancer Alliance	Posted - 2007.09.19 23:32:00 - [17] Originally by: Soulita Originally by: Alski shu... nah thats too impolite for me Because capitals are not WTFBBQPWN mechines, if you flew one yourself you'd understand that. I do NOT fly one, because they are off balance. They are way off scale compared to the next smaller class which is BSs. and this means that you're completely unqualified to comment on them. Yes, they are powerful. they are not, however, indestructible. Are you going to claim that frigates are obsolete because battleships exist? If anything, capitals are among the more balanced ship-classes in the game, having to worry about fuel supply and logistics whenever they want to move around, not to mention the enormous expense in terms of both ISK and Skill Points they require. And what do you get? One ship that only performs well when laying siege to stationary targets, one ship that only performs well when moving entire, smaller fleets around and two ships that don't actually have guns on them. They are extremely useful. but they are FAR from being overpowered. Anyway, that's enough from me, I figure we've given this particular troll enough to chew on for now. - The game is not the problem. The problem is that you are not adapting to the game.
Theo Samaritan Gallente Aliastra	Posted - 2007.09.19 23:33:00 - [18] Originally by: Stitcher Originally by: Soulita Originally by: Alski shu... nah thats too impolite for me Because capitals are not WTFBBQPWN mechines, if you flew one yourself you'd understand that. I do NOT fly one, because they are off balance. They are way off scale compared to the next smaller class which is BSs. and this means that you're completely unqualified to comment on them. Yes, they are powerful. they are not, however, indestructible. Are you going to claim that frigates are obsolete because battleships exist? If anything, capitals are among the more balanced ship-classes in the game, having to worry about fuel supply and logistics whenever they want to move around, not to mention the enormous expense in terms of both ISK and Skill Points they require. And what do you get? One ship that only performs well when laying siege to stationary targets, one ship that only performs well when moving entire, smaller fleets around and two ships that don't actually have guns on them. They are extremely useful. but they are FAR from being overpowered. Anyway, that's enough from me, I figure we've given this particular troll enough to chew on for now. Delivered. ______________________________ A Request About Lag Discussion -- Yet another "Edit my sig devs!" request \o/
Meleia	Posted - 2007.09.19 23:33:00 - [19] Originally by: Alski shu... nah thats too impolite for me Because capitals are not WTFBBQPWN mechines, if you flew one yourself you'd understand that. Of course not. That mothership we read about, that was afk camping a low sec gate with smartbombs active, is surely dead by now? As like all the other pirate carriers/motherships that infest low sec gates 23/7? Those are really easy to kill!
Graivon	Posted - 2007.09.19 23:34:00 - [20] Originally by: Theo Samaritan Originally by: Soulita Edited by: Soulita on 19/09/2007 23:17:49 The devs spend a lot of time balancing the playthings of the little man, like frigs, cruisers and BSs. They even get remodeled and new skins and such. In truth they are useless, only dreads, carriers and maybe interdictors and a few e-war ships and cov-ops are of relevance. So, since cap ship / non-cap ship balance does not exist, why not scrap the useless non cap-ship classes alltogether? Shut it. and Originally by: Arvald Originally by: Soulita Edited by: Soulita on 19/09/2007 23:17:49 The devs spend a lot of time balancing the playthings of the little man, like frigs, cruisers and BSs. They even get remodeled and new skins and such. In truth they are useless, only dreads, carriers and maybe interdictors and a few e-war ships and cov-ops are of relevance. So, since cap ship / non-cap ship balance does not exist, why not scrap the useless non cap-ship classes alltogether? SHUT IT!!!!! ROFLMFAO! Thanks That Is All.
Fallen Shadow	Posted - 2007.09.19 23:34:00 - [21] Do you know anything about Capital ships other then the stats you see on the site? Level four missions would also be very hard in empire with only Frieghters to do missions. I think your looking at the numbers and not understanding the limited use of these ships. If you don't have the Corp or Alliance support capital ships get killed to groups of Battleships just like any other ship.
sableye principle of motion Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.09.19 23:35:00 - [22] to be honest they should get rid of all ships but shuttles Join The Fight With Promo Today
Theo Samaritan Gallente Aliastra	Posted - 2007.09.19 23:35:00 - [23] Originally by: Meleia Originally by: Alski shu... nah thats too impolite for me Because capitals are not WTFBBQPWN mechines, if you flew one yourself you'd understand that. Of course not. That mothership we read about, that was afk camping a low sec gate with smartbombs active, is surely dead by now? As like all the other pirate carriers/motherships that infest low sec gates 23/7? Those are really easy to kill! As someone who has seen carriers and dreadnaughts killed in lowsec, I say yes they are. ______________________________ A Request About Lag Discussion -- Yet another "Edit my sig devs!" request \o/
Reem Fairchild	Posted - 2007.09.19 23:42:00 - [24] Originally by: Meleia like all the other pirate carriers/motherships that infest low sec gates 23/7? Those are really easy to kill! Have you ever been in low-sec?
Soulita Gallente Inner Core	Posted - 2007.09.19 23:42:00 - [25] Edited by: Soulita on 19/09/2007 23:42:52 Originally by: Hack Causality Originally by: Soulita Edited by: Soulita on 19/09/2007 23:17:49 The devs spend a lot of time balancing the playthings of the little man, like frigs, cruisers and BSs. They even get remodeled and new skins and such. In truth they are useless, only dreads, carriers and maybe interdictors and a few e-war ships and cov-ops are of relevance. So, since cap ship / non-cap ship balance does not exist, why not scrap the useless non cap-ship classes alltogether? Says the hypocrite with a picture of one of said "useless" ships in her signature. Is this thread a joke or are you really that stupid? Actually I wonder if some of the posters are realy that stupid to NOT see caps are off balance. Or more likely just keen on keeping their overpowered playthings.
Theo Samaritan Gallente Aliastra	Posted - 2007.09.19 23:45:00 - [26] Originally by: Soulita Actually I wonder if some of the posters are realy that stupid to NOT see caps are off balance. Or more likely just keen on keeping their overpowered playthings. I do not fly a cap, I probably wont for another couple years. I have been shot at by capitals, worked with capitals, and both times I vote that they are fine as they are. ______________________________ A Request About Lag Discussion -- Yet another "Edit my sig devs!" request \o/
Reem Fairchild	Posted - 2007.09.19 23:47:00 - [27] Originally by: Soulita Actually I wonder if some of the posters are realy that stupid to NOT see caps are off balance. Or more likely just keen on keeping their overpowered playthings. Maybe if you, oh I don't know, made any kind of attempt to prove your statement about capital ships making all but a few of the other ships obsolete, there could be more of a debate here...
elohllird Gallente Destructive Influence Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.09.19 23:48:00 - [28] Originally by: Soulita Edited by: Soulita on 19/09/2007 23:42:52 Originally by: Hack Causality Originally by: Soulita Edited by: Soulita on 19/09/2007 23:17:49 The devs spend a lot of time balancing the playthings of the little man, like frigs, cruisers and BSs. They even get remodeled and new skins and such. In truth they are useless, only dreads, carriers and maybe interdictors and a few e-war ships and cov-ops are of relevance. So, since cap ship / non-cap ship balance does not exist, why not scrap the useless non cap-ship classes alltogether? Says the hypocrite with a picture of one of said "useless" ships in her signature. Is this thread a joke or are you really that stupid? Actually I wonder if some of the posters are realy that stupid to NOT see caps are off balance. Or more likely just keen on keeping their overpowered playthings. WTB a clue for you, ive been training my alt for a year to fly one, and still thats only half decently. Playthings!!! dont make me laugh the time and isk investment is huge. As Justin said ,cry me a river
Soulita Gallente Inner Core	Posted - 2007.09.19 23:49:00 - [29] Originally by: Theo Samaritan Originally by: Soulita Actually I wonder if some of the posters are realy that stupid to NOT see caps are off balance. Or more likely just keen on keeping their overpowered playthings. I do not fly a cap, I probably wont for another couple years. I have been shot at by capitals, worked with capitals, and both times I vote that they are fine as they are. I have been playing a long time now, including in the non cap ship aera. I have flown with caps as well, and in most cases they decide how a battle goes. The side with more cap ships wins. Mostly it is as simple as that. Seems off to me.
Elmicker The Phoenix Rising FreeFall Securities	Posted - 2007.09.19 23:52:00 - [30] Edited by: Elmicker on 19/09/2007 23:51:58 Originally by: Soulita I have been playing a long time now, including in the non battleship aera. I have flown with battleships as well, and in most cases they decide how a battle goes. The side with more battleships wins. Mostly it is as simple as that. Seems off to me. Seems a bit recognisable, to me.
Kylar Renpurs Dusk Blade	Posted - 2007.09.19 23:52:00 - [31] Balance != Fun Game Improve Market Competition!
Theo Samaritan Gallente Aliastra	Posted - 2007.09.19 23:52:00 - [32] Originally by: Soulita Originally by: Theo Samaritan Originally by: Soulita Actually I wonder if some of the posters are realy that stupid to NOT see caps are off balance. Or more likely just keen on keeping their overpowered playthings. I do not fly a cap, I probably wont for another couple years. I have been shot at by capitals, worked with capitals, and both times I vote that they are fine as they are. I have been playing a long time now, including in the non cap ship aera. I have flown with caps as well, and in most cases they decide how a battle goes. The side with more cap ships wins. Mostly it is as simple as that. Seems off to me. War is numbers. TBH you probably fought **** tacticians ______________________________ A Request About Lag Discussion -- Yet another "Edit my sig devs!" request \o/
Soulita Gallente Inner Core	Posted - 2007.09.19 23:54:00 - [33] Originally by: elohllird Originally by: Soulita Edited by: Soulita on 19/09/2007 23:42:52 Originally by: Hack Causality Originally by: Soulita Edited by: Soulita on 19/09/2007 23:17:49 The devs spend a lot of time balancing the playthings of the little man, like frigs, cruisers and BSs. They even get remodeled and new skins and such. In truth they are useless, only dreads, carriers and maybe interdictors and a few e-war ships and cov-ops are of relevance. So, since cap ship / non-cap ship balance does not exist, why not scrap the useless non cap-ship classes alltogether? Says the hypocrite with a picture of one of said "useless" ships in her signature. Is this thread a joke or are you really that stupid? Actually I wonder if some of the posters are realy that stupid to NOT see caps are off balance. Or more likely just keen on keeping their overpowered playthings. WTB a clue for you, ive been training my alt for a year to fly one, and still thats only half decently. Playthings!!! dont make me laugh the time and isk investment is huge. As Justin said ,cry me a river Seems more like you are the one crying here. You have trained so long for one of these wonderthings that you now definatly want to gain the fruits of that training time. The reason I bring up the topic is that the non cap ship classes are in fact very well balanced, and make for fun fights. And that is what EVE should be about. Cap gangs are pwn gangs that in most cases can not be rivaled, meaning they are godmode gangs. That is what EVE should not be about - no matter what the training time for that godmode.
Elmicker The Phoenix Rising FreeFall Securities	Posted - 2007.09.19 23:56:00 - [34] Originally by: Soulita Cap gangs are pwn gangs that in most cases can not be rivaled, meaning they are godmode gangs.
Theo Samaritan Gallente Aliastra	Posted - 2007.09.19 23:57:00 - [35] Originally by: Soulita Cap gangs are pwn gangs that in most cases can not be rivaled, meaning they are godmode gangs. That is what EVE should not be about - no matter what the training time for that godmode. Anything that costs that much to build, run and operate deserves godmode TBH. now, Shut it. Please. ______________________________ A Request About Lag Discussion -- Yet another "Edit my sig devs!" request \o/
Reem Fairchild	Posted - 2007.09.19 23:57:00 - [36] Originally by: Soulita Originally by: Theo Samaritan Originally by: Soulita Actually I wonder if some of the posters are realy that stupid to NOT see caps are off balance. Or more likely just keen on keeping their overpowered playthings. I do not fly a cap, I probably wont for another couple years. I have been shot at by capitals, worked with capitals, and both times I vote that they are fine as they are. I have been playing a long time now, including in the non cap ship aera. I have flown with caps as well, and in most cases they decide how a battle goes. The side with more cap ships wins. Mostly it is as simple as that. Seems off to me. 1. Did, in any of those situations the Capitals fly without their support fleets including large numbers of battleships? 2. You have one single instance (large-scale, major 0.0 fleet battles) where capital ships are important, and from that you deduce that all but a few other ships are completely obsolete?
Senator Martin'Lefouret	Posted - 2007.09.19 23:58:00 - [37] Originally by: Soulita Originally by: Theo Samaritan Originally by: Soulita Actually I wonder if some of the posters are realy that stupid to NOT see caps are off balance. Or more likely just keen on keeping their overpowered playthings. I do not fly a cap, I probably wont for another couple years. I have been shot at by capitals, worked with capitals, and both times I vote that they are fine as they are. I have been playing a long time now, including in the non cap ship aera. I have flown with caps as well, and in most cases they decide how a battle goes. The side with more cap ships wins. Mostly it is as simple as that. Seems off to me. I dissagree, i've been in fight where the other side did had capitals and we didn't. other side lost half its capitals and we had even numbers to fight with.
Soulita Gallente Inner Core	Posted - 2007.09.19 23:59:00 - [38] Originally by: Theo Samaritan Originally by: Soulita Cap gangs are pwn gangs that in most cases can not be rivaled, meaning they are godmode gangs. That is what EVE should not be about - no matter what the training time for that godmode. Anything that costs that much to build, run and operate deserves godmode TBH. now, Shut it. Please. This is where we differ. IMHO nothing deserves godmode, spoils the fun, and screws the balance.
elohllird Gallente Destructive Influence Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.09.19 23:59:00 - [39] hey mate im not crying i got the time and money to spend training up my alt, dont bother me got three accounts so all is good in my world......... /me dances in my shiny pink happy fluffy world....lalalal la Anyhow...you dont know what what your talkin about stfu you smell and your name is ghey... Thats my reasoned arguments.. i win boo hoo foo jooz
Theo Samaritan Gallente Aliastra	Posted - 2007.09.20 00:00:00 - [40] Originally by: elohllird hey mate im not crying i got the time and money to spend training up my alt, dont bother me got three accounts so all is good in my world......... /me dances in my shiny pink happy fluffy world....lalalal la Anyhow...you dont know what what your talkin about stfu you smell and your name is ghey... Thats my reasoned arguments.. i win boo hoo foo jooz Delivers! ______________________________ A Request About Lag Discussion -- Yet another "Edit my sig devs!" request \o/
Stitcher Caldari legion of qui Freelancer Alliance	Posted - 2007.09.20 00:01:00 - [41] Edited by: Stitcher on 20/09/2007 00:01:33 I notice that of all the responses to this issue, mine's one of the few that's not been quoted and countered yet.... - The game is not the problem. The problem is that you are not adapting to the game.
Theo Samaritan Gallente Aliastra	Posted - 2007.09.20 00:02:00 - [42] Originally by: Stitcher Edited by: Stitcher on 20/09/2007 00:01:33 I notice that of all the responses to this issue, mine's one of the few that's not been quoted and countered yet.... Perhaps she's clueless? ______________________________ A Request About Lag Discussion -- Yet another "Edit my sig devs!" request \o/
Soulita Gallente Inner Core	Posted - 2007.09.20 00:06:00 - [43] Edited by: Soulita on 20/09/2007 00:07:38 Originally by: elohllird hey mate im not crying i got the time and money to spend training up my alt, dont bother me got three accounts so all is good in my world......... /me dances in my shiny pink happy fluffy world....lalalal la Anyhow...you dont know what what your talkin about stfu you smell and your name is ghey... Thats my reasoned arguments.. i win boo hoo foo jooz lol, you are funny. Keep dancing in your happy fluffy world I guess. It is funny to see people cry out loud when capitals are critizised. I guess some non cap ship owners cry out because they dream to have one, and the cap ship owners cry out because they do not want to loose their advanatge. Well, enough posting for me on this topic, I will shut up as desired. But I remain convinced there is a serious balance problem with cap ships. Guess I ll just get one myself and play with the herd, instead of criticising something that should be fixed. Quite sad, but hey, what the heck, its a game and games are not perfect...
Theo Samaritan Gallente Aliastra	Posted - 2007.09.20 00:07:00 - [44] Originally by: Soulita It is funny to see people cry out loud when capitals are critizised. I guess some non cap ship owners cry out because they dream to have one, and the cap ship owners cry out because they do not want to loose their advanatge. Well, enough posting for me on this topic, I will shut up as desired. But I remain convinced there is a serious balance problem with cap ships. Guess I ll just get one myself and play with the herd, instead of criticising something that sould be fixed. Success! And when you realise the costs involved, come back to us. ______________________________ A Request About Lag Discussion -- Yet another "Edit my sig devs!" request \o/
Soulita Gallente Inner Core	Posted - 2007.09.20 00:09:00 - [45] Originally by: Theo Samaritan Originally by: Soulita It is funny to see people cry out loud when capitals are critizised. I guess some non cap ship owners cry out because they dream to have one, and the cap ship owners cry out because they do not want to loose their advanatge. Well, enough posting for me on this topic, I will shut up as desired. But I remain convinced there is a serious balance problem with cap ships. Guess I ll just get one myself and play with the herd, instead of criticising something that sould be fixed. Success! And when you realise the costs involved, come back to us. ROFL. Carriers are cheap. Btw, as you see you are pretty unsuccessfull, since you made me post again...
Shar'Tuk TheHated	Posted - 2007.09.20 00:11:00 - [46] Originally by: Soulita Originally by: Theo Samaritan Originally by: Soulita Edited by: Soulita on 19/09/2007 23:17:49 The devs spend a lot of time balancing the playthings of the little man, like frigs, cruisers and BSs. They even get remodeled and new skins and such. In truth they are useless, only dreads, carriers and maybe interdictors and a few e-war ships and cov-ops are of relevance. So, since cap ship / non-cap ship balance does not exist, why not scrap the useless non cap-ship classes alltogether? Shut it. Is that all you can come up with? Balance between non-cap ships and cap ships is completely off. That is a fact. It would be only logical to either get balance going or to scrap either capitals or non-capitals. You are speaking about capital ships right.. wait.. CAPITAL SHIPS. If you feel a couple of small ships should put the smack down of caps then they shouldnt be called capital ships because they woulded earn thier name. Not everything should be in perfect balance. A Capital ship should be something to fear. DRINK RUM It fights scurvy & boosts morale! THE BEATINGS WILL CONTINUE UNTIL MORALE IMPROVES!
Theo Samaritan Gallente Aliastra	Posted - 2007.09.20 00:11:00 - [47] Originally by: Soulita Originally by: Theo Samaritan Originally by: Soulita It is funny to see people cry out loud when capitals are critizised. I guess some non cap ship owners cry out because they dream to have one, and the cap ship owners cry out because they do not want to loose their advanatge. Well, enough posting for me on this topic, I will shut up as desired. But I remain convinced there is a serious balance problem with cap ships. Guess I ll just get one myself and play with the herd, instead of criticising something that sould be fixed. Success! And when you realise the costs involved, come back to us. ROFL. Carriers are cheap. Btw, as you see you are pretty unsuccessfull, since you made me post again... Carriers are cheap, yes, and no I did not fail as it was not me who stated I wouldnt post here again. ______________________________ A Request About Lag Discussion -- Yet another "Edit my sig devs!" request \o/
Reem Fairchild	Posted - 2007.09.20 00:18:00 - [48] Originally by: Soulita ROFL. Carriers are cheap. Btw, as you see you are pretty unsuccessfull, since you made me post again... Battleships are cheaper. And 5 battleships could kill any carrier with ease while costing a lot less in total. Same as 10 tech 1 frigs could kill a battleship without taking a single loss. I don't fly anything bigger than a battlecruiser ever, and rarely anything bigger than frigate size. And I don't think any of the ships I fly are useless in any way.
Malcanis High4Life SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2007.09.20 00:20:00 - [49] Originally by: Soulita Edited by: Soulita on 19/09/2007 23:17:49 The devs spend a lot of time balancing the playthings of the little man, like frigs, cruisers and BSs. They even get remodeled and new skins and such. In truth they are useless, only dreads, carriers and maybe interdictors and a few e-war ships and cov-ops are of relevance. So, since cap ship / non-cap ship balance does not exist, why not scrap the useless non cap-ship classes alltogether? LOL @ you So... eBay? Or will your brother be ****ed off at you when he finds out you've been posting with his EvE character? CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Hilabana Minmatar Sebiestor tribe	Posted - 2007.09.20 00:21:00 - [50] Originally by: Soulita Edited by: Soulita on 19/09/2007 23:17:49 The devs spend a lot of time balancing the playthings of the little man, like frigs, cruisers and BSs. They even get remodeled and new skins and such. In truth they are useless, only dreads, carriers and maybe interdictors and a few e-war ships and cov-ops are of relevance. So, since cap ship / non-cap ship balance does not exist, why not scrap the useless non cap-ship classes alltogether? Your starting to sound like me about how the scales are tip more for the players in 0.0 But please do not do it i am asking do not go to that place that all is fair.
Thanos Draicon	Posted - 2007.09.20 00:30:00 - [51] Ok, so bring 10 dreads into a system without support and a hundred enemy battleships and see how long they last. ******.
Malcanis High4Life SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2007.09.20 00:37:00 - [52] Originally by: Thanos Draicon Ok, so bring 10 dreads into a system without support and a hundred enemy battleships and see how long they last. ******. Why battleships? As long as we're getting 10:1 odds and no support then 5 dictors, 15 maulus and 79 kestrels, plus a hauler with lots of spare ammo, will be fine. CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Thanos Draicon	Posted - 2007.09.20 00:44:00 - [53] Originally by: Malcanis Originally by: Thanos Draicon Ok, so bring 10 dreads into a system without support and a hundred enemy battleships and see how long they last. ******. Why battleships? As long as we're getting 10:1 odds and no support then 5 dictors, 15 maulus and 79 kestrels, plus a hauler with lots of spare ammo, will be fine. BAH! A vessel that is capable of being taken out by approximately 0.3% of it's ISK investment in ships is obviously completely overpowered!
Martin Mckenna D00M. Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.09.20 00:44:00 - [54] Originally by: Soulita Edited by: Soulita on 19/09/2007 23:17:49 The devs spend a lot of time balancing the playthings of the little man, like frigs, cruisers and BSs. They even get remodeled and new skins and such. In truth they are useless, only dreads, carriers and maybe interdictors and a few e-war ships and cov-ops are of relevance. So, since cap ship / non-cap ship balance does not exist, why not scrap the useless non cap-ship classes alltogether? you about to experiance e-o forums
Malcanis High4Life SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2007.09.20 00:50:00 - [55] Originally by: Martin Mckenna Originally by: Soulita Edited by: Soulita on 19/09/2007 23:17:49 The devs spend a lot of time balancing the playthings of the little man, like frigs, cruisers and BSs. They even get remodeled and new skins and such. In truth they are useless, only dreads, carriers and maybe interdictors and a few e-war ships and cov-ops are of relevance. So, since cap ship / non-cap ship balance does not exist, why not scrap the useless non cap-ship classes alltogether? you about to experiance e-o forums I can't wait to see the thread, which will soon appear, I promise, but a different character with a suspiciously similar post style (he did say that ISK "wasn't a problem"...) "Dear CCP: Cap ships are broken - KESTREL GANKED" CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Nicoli Voldkif Caelli-Merced INC. Gunboat Diplomacy	Posted - 2007.09.20 00:52:00 - [56] Originally by: Soulita ROFL. Carriers are cheap. Btw, as you see you are pretty unsuccessfull, since you made me post again... Lets see just how expensive a carrier is... 800mil-1Bil for the hull 50mil per capital rep 50mil per Drone control unit (4) 20mil per fighter(15+) So for just the Carrier specific modules and not including triage your looking at 1.4 billion and thats still not fully fitted. And from Personnel experience it takes about 15 pilots in Cruiser+ to take one out. so that means each person gets about 93million to spend on their ship. Which seems about right for a mixed gang of 15 people. Not to mention that even if the carrier lives there is a good chance that its going to lose a few fighters. In addition to that the Carrier has basic operating costs involved as well as requiring at least 2 people to move it out of system. Now you might swing me that Moms are overpowered in low sec but over all capitals are very well balanced. Don't want to fight them go to the next system over. they are very difficult to use to chase a non-cap fleet down and your more and likely going to catch them in a fight around a stationary area then as a roving gang. -----------------------------------------------
Soulita Gallente Inner Core	Posted - 2007.09.20 00:54:00 - [57] Originally by: Malcanis Originally by: Martin Mckenna Originally by: Soulita Edited by: Soulita on 19/09/2007 23:17:49 The devs spend a lot of time balancing the playthings of the little man, like frigs, cruisers and BSs. They even get remodeled and new skins and such. In truth they are useless, only dreads, carriers and maybe interdictors and a few e-war ships and cov-ops are of relevance. So, since cap ship / non-cap ship balance does not exist, why not scrap the useless non cap-ship classes alltogether? you about to experiance e-o forums I can't wait to see the thread, which will soon appear, I promise, but a different character with a suspiciously similar post style (he did say that ISK "wasn't a problem"...) "Dear CCP: Cap ships are broken - KESTREL GANKED" Seems I did manage to attract a good amount of trolls. Wasn't my intent, but the thread has become amusing, so no need to start a new thread on the topic
Malcanis High4Life SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2007.09.20 01:04:00 - [58] Originally by: Soulita Originally by: Malcanis Originally by: Martin Mckenna Originally by: Soulita Edited by: Soulita on 19/09/2007 23:17:49 The devs spend a lot of time balancing the playthings of the little man, like frigs, cruisers and BSs. They even get remodeled and new skins and such. In truth they are useless, only dreads, carriers and maybe interdictors and a few e-war ships and cov-ops are of relevance. So, since cap ship / non-cap ship balance does not exist, why not scrap the useless non cap-ship classes alltogether? you about to experiance e-o forums I can't wait to see the thread, which will soon appear, I promise, but a different character with a suspiciously similar post style (he did say that ISK "wasn't a problem"...) "Dear CCP: Cap ships are broken - KESTREL GANKED" Seems I did manage to attract a good amount of trolls. Wasn't my intent, but the thread has become amusing, so no need to start a new thread on the topic In all seriousness, with a quarter-competent FC, the T1 frigate gang I postulated would slaughter 10 unsupported dreads. (The dictors are only in there to stop them escaping; if you can find 9 other dread pilots confident enough to stay till the bitter end, I'll gladly add the extra DPS and reduce the cost - or trade them off for, say, having the FC in a Claymore with Interdiction, Evasive Maneuv., Rapid Deployment, Electronic Superiority and Shield Harmonisation mods ) CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Raekkul Caldari	Posted - 2007.09.20 01:26:00 - [59] Edited by: Raekkul on 20/09/2007 01:27:15 Originally by: Soulita Edited by: Soulita on 20/09/2007 00:07:38 Originally by: elohllird hey mate im not crying i got the time and money to spend training up my alt, dont bother me got three accounts so all is good in my world......... /me dances in my shiny pink happy fluffy world....lalalal la Anyhow...you dont know what what your talkin about stfu you smell and your name is ghey... Thats my reasoned arguments.. i win boo hoo foo jooz lol, you are funny. Keep dancing in your happy fluffy world I guess. It is funny to see people cry out loud when capitals are critizised. I guess some non cap ship owners cry out because they dream to have one, and the cap ship owners cry out because they do not want to loose their advanatge. Well, enough posting for me on this topic, I will shut up as desired. But I remain convinced there is a serious balance problem with cap ships. Guess I ll just get one myself and play with the herd, instead of criticising something that should be fixed. Quite sad, but hey, what the heck, its a game and games are not perfect... Never flown a cap ship, never even seen one. Would I like one? A carrier perhaps but I'm a bit of a carebear and stick to high sec so I'll prolly never get one. All that being said, I have yet to see a single post by you with ANY supporting data whatsoever. Your posts lack anything of value to support you personal opinion of cap ships which makes me seriously wonder if this thread wasn't provoked by someone in a cap wtfbbqpwning you somewhere out in low sec. If you really expect people to argue intelligently about your topic, it might help if you yourself started by posting some actual facts supporting your claim, instead of just stating a personal opinion and expecting it to be agreed upon by anyone.
Pirate Tom	Posted - 2007.09.20 01:29:00 - [60] Meh... puts up a sign ______________ \| DO NOT FEED\| \| THE TROLLS \| \|____________\| \| \| \| \| Quote: The wonderful thing about pirates is pirates is wonderful things. Their box is filled up with killmails and they love to hear the screams!
Dred'Pirate Jesus Amarr Ministry of War	Posted - 2007.09.20 02:29:00 - [61] Originally by: Nicoli Voldkif Originally by: Soulita ROFL. Carriers are cheap. Btw, as you see you are pretty unsuccessfull, since you made me post again... Lets see just how expensive a carrier is... 800mil-1Bil for the hull 50mil per capital rep 50mil per Drone control unit (4) 20mil per fighter(15+) So for just the Carrier specific modules and not including triage your looking at 1.4 billion and thats still not fully fitted. And for what you get thats absofrekinloutly cheap.. Even for a 'solo' player.. Originally by: David Hackworth ò If you find yourself in a fair fight, you didn't plan your mission properly.
dastommy79 Di-Tron Heavy Industries Atlas Alliance	Posted - 2007.09.20 02:35:00 - [62] Originally by: Pirate Tom Meh... puts up a sign ______________ \| DO NOT FEED\| \| THE TROLLS \| \|____________\| \| \| \| \| smells food in the air I driks alots
tla gnillortmurof Minmatar	Posted - 2007.09.20 09:28:00 - [63] Originally by: Pirate Tom Meh... puts up a sign ______________ \| DO NOT FEED\| \| THE TROLLS \| \|____________\| \| \| \| \| Oh, but how would like me survive then? Think of the poor trolls...
twit brent Dark Centuri Inc. Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2007.09.20 09:34:00 - [64] Originally by: Soulita Originally by: Alski shu... nah thats too impolite for me Because capitals are not WTFBBQPWN mechines, if you flew one yourself you'd understand that. I do NOT fly one, because they are off balance. They are way off scale compared to the next smaller class which is BSs. Funny my BS outperforms my carrier at ratting, mining, missioning, plexing PvP and everyhting else that doesnt involve repping shields and anything without a 50+ man backup fleet. And my dread hasnt done much more than shoot at POS since I got it
Kerfira	Posted - 2007.09.20 09:41:00 - [65] Originally by: Soulita ROFL. Carriers are cheap. Please donate one to me then..... In all this discussion, the most important question hasn't been answered, or even asked... This most important question is: Which pilot in a capital ship killed Soulita, and what did s/he loose? Capital ships are powerful, but they're also extremely vulnerable, not to mention VERY expensive to run (try paying for fuel and fighter replacements and you'll realise that). Originally by: CCP Wrangler EVE isn't designed to just look like a cold, dark and harsh world, it's designed to be a cold, dark and harsh world.
Princess Jodi Vendetta Underground Rule of Three	Posted - 2007.09.20 14:34:00 - [66] I fully support the removal of all ships other than Capitals in the game. As someone with max Carrier skills but who can't use T2 guns, it would benefit me nicely. In addition, I've lost 2 carriers when dampened by one of those pesky little non-capital ships. Obviouisly there is not proper balance. The major benefit of removing all non-capital ships would be the final solution to the Jita Problem. In fact, it would also serve CCP's stated goal of getting people out of Empire. As such, I thing the OP is brilliant: He's solved 3 major problems with one simple, elegant solution.
Saint Luka The Illuminati. Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.09.20 14:52:00 - [67] Originally by: Soulita Originally by: Theo Samaritan Originally by: Soulita Balance between non-cap ships and cap ships is completely off. That is a fact. It would be only logical to either get balance going or to scrap either capitals or non-capitals. I think the balance is fine tyvm. The power in capships is outbalanced by price and skill req, both are far from the reach of many people for more than a year. So yes. Shut it. Wrong. Carriers for example are not very costly, and most people use second accounts as cap pilots. These train fairly quickly. The balance is a problem, and that wont change with weak arguments such as yours. There is absoluetely no balance issues between capital ships and standard ships. And no, to your average EVE player a well fitted carrier is not cheap. Carrier 1b. 10-20fighters 2-400m Carrier fit 150-250m Extra drones 50-200m Insurance 300m~? Cheap, k darling. If you plan on having an alt in a carrier in a reasonably short time your discribing the 15mil SP wonders which have awful support and drone skills in general + still take close to a year to achieve. -
Nicho Void Gallente Hyper-Nova	Posted - 2007.09.20 15:00:00 - [68] Originally by: Princess Jodi I fully support the removal of all ships other than Capitals in the game. As someone with max Carrier skills but who can't use T2 guns, it would benefit me nicely. In addition, I've lost 2 carriers when dampened by one of those pesky little non-capital ships. Obviouisly there is not proper balance. The major benefit of removing all non-capital ships would be the final solution to the Jita Problem. In fact, it would also serve CCP's stated goal of getting people out of Empire. As such, I thing the OP is brilliant: He's solved 3 major problems with one simple, elegant solution. LMAO. Win. Pure, unadulterated win. ---------------
Elmicker The Phoenix Rising FreeFall Securities	Posted - 2007.09.20 15:02:00 - [69] Originally by: Saint Luka If you plan on having an alt in a carrier in a reasonably short time your discribing the 15mil SP wonders which have awful support and drone skills in general + still take close to a year to achieve. Leave my carrier alt out of this
Ilya Murametz Caldari Cruororis Consors Conlegium Ivy League	Posted - 2007.09.20 15:05:00 - [70] Originally by: Soulita Edited by: Soulita on 19/09/2007 23:17:49 The devs spend a lot of time balancing the playthings of the little man, like frigs, cruisers and BSs. They even get remodeled and new skins and such. In truth they are useless, only dreads, carriers and maybe interdictors and a few e-war ships and cov-ops are of relevance. So, since cap ship / non-cap ship balance does not exist, why not scrap the useless non cap-ship classes alltogether? Drug abuse is bad, m'kay?

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