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Missiles: To String or Not To String

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HowlinMad Murdock Caldari No Trademark	Posted - 2007.10.01 15:15:00 - [1] A couple of my corp mates were discussing whether or not stringing missiles or bursting them is the best method for fighting. With stringing missiles you keep a constant amount of damage hitting the ship and with bursting them you have a huge alpha hit but there is a break of fire due to the ROF. I think that keeping a constant amount of damage on them will wear down a tank better than burst fire, due to if they time the repping they can ônegateö the damage, with the flight time of missiles without keeping a constant amount of fire on them they could potentially be moving further away from you to where it takes longer for the missiles to reach them. Which can give them the opportunity to get an extra rep in that would help their tank hold longer. With keeping the fire constant there isnÆt that break to where the flight time can make a true difference. What are your guysÆ thoughts
Tamia Clant New Dawn Corp New Eden Research	Posted - 2007.10.01 15:21:00 - [2] It doesn't matter what method you use, you'll still be doing the same amount of damage over time. The target may be moving away from you to delay missile impact, but that will happen whether it's a big blob of missiles or a stream. The only situation i can think of where it would make a difference is when firing at a target's shields. As you may know, the shield recharge rate is fastest at around 30%, so it would be best to fire your missiles in a burst, since if you can knock his shields down from 50% to 20% (example), you just avoided his peak shield recharge rate. Looking for queue-free research slots? Click here!
MrBadidea Caldari The Children of Lilith	Posted - 2007.10.01 15:23:00 - [3] Fit Raven to fly at same speed as missiles. Start at edge of effective missile range. Fire at will. Laugh as 4+ Volleys hit target at same time --- MrBadidea's ePeen strikes YOUR EGO Wrecking for EMOCIDE
Akita T Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force	Posted - 2007.10.01 15:26:00 - [4] nanoravens _ Caldari N.V.T.F. is recruiting...
Sheriff Jones Amarr Please Enter Password	Posted - 2007.10.01 15:28:00 - [5] String theory(har-di-har ) has more positive sides, unless you want to take something down right away. Well, the only real difference is in that, since other then that, string can save you a couple of missiles if the enemy ship explodes, but that's about it. In "saving missiles" efficiency, or "unnecessary damage" wise, stringing is the way to go. But it's all cosmetic really. My opinions represent the opinions of my corporation completely. I'm the CEO damnit.
Death Kill Caldari direkte	Posted - 2007.10.01 15:37:00 - [6] ravens need to be able to fit 2x mwd again. No others ship, just the raven. Then it wont suck for pvp anymore. Call to arms!!!
The'Chosen	Posted - 2007.10.01 15:51:00 - [7] Originally by: Tamia Clant It doesn't matter what method you use, you'll still be doing the same amount of damage over time. The target may be moving away from you to delay missile impact, but that will happen whether it's a big blob of missiles or a stream. The only situation i can think of where it would make a difference is when firing at a target's shields. As you may know, the shield recharge rate is fastest at around 30%, so it would be best to fire your missiles in a burst, since if you can knock his shields down from 50% to 20% (example), you just avoided his peak shield recharge rate. This is exactly where my thinking has brought me to. String vs. alpha missiles do the same damage over time. The only difference I can think of is with shield tankers, who have an optimal "hump" in their tank at 30%. You'll have an easier time breaking a shield tank and getting over this hump with an alpha strike than you would with a string of missiles. The difference, however, is pretty negligible. The only other difference I can think of is if the timing of your alpha strike is offset with the repping cycles and you manage to pop a ship before another rep comes through (either remote or on-board.) In the end, the difference is minor. But if you had to choose, the scale tips towards the alpha strike method (IMHO).
Maltitol Gallente Tides of Silence Hydra Alliance	Posted - 2007.10.01 15:58:00 - [8] faction & t2 ammo - String, 2 - 3 second intervals per launcher t1 ammo - burst works well
Reem Fairchild Minmatar Republic University	Posted - 2007.10.01 16:08:00 - [9] Burst damage is always better.
Iyanah Minmatar Mining Munitions and Mayhem R i s e	Posted - 2007.10.01 16:11:00 - [10] Originally by: Sheriff Jones String theory(har-di-har ) has more positive sides, unless you want to take something down right away. Well, the only real difference is in that, since other then that, string can save you a couple of missiles if the enemy ship explodes, but that's about it. In "saving missiles" efficiency, or "unnecessary damage" wise, stringing is the way to go. But it's all cosmetic really. I agree. it's purely cosmetic. perhaps you'll save one or two missiles from firing sequentially. there's really no difference, since the ammount of damage and the DPS is identical. personally i just hit all my weapons mods at the same time (usually whilst locking) resulting in them all firing at once. no real reason, just that it's alot less mucking about than firing one at a time. ========================================== Iy please remember: I AM a sarcastic ******* and nothing i say has ever represented the thoughts or feelings of my corp, alliance, or anyone really. read

Rooker Lysian Enterprises	Posted - 2007.10.01 16:20:00 - [11] I string them out, just because it looks cooler LOL Except if I'm in a Guristas mission. I'd rather the full volley went out if they get in a jam cycle. Jump in a Brutix sometime with a full rack of blasters and pew pew something with 1 second delay between blasters. Looks friggin awesome. -- This Space For Rent
Rilder Caldari THC LTD Dogs of War.	Posted - 2007.10.01 16:24:00 - [12] Originally by: Rooker I string them out, just because it looks cooler LOL When I use missiles I usually string them also, its just so much cooler, and the sounds of all missiles launching at once is just horrid. Guns on the other hand I always try and get them all firing at once, getting 8 rails to fire at once just gets me all gigity. --
NeoTheo Caldari Dark Materials Fang Alliance	Posted - 2007.10.01 17:14:00 - [13] string. whilst the damage is the same, the difference between armor rep cycles (or shield for that matter) seems to make a difference, i dont know exactly why or i cant explain it properly. basically in certain missions with my drake there used to be some mobsi just could not kill fast with volleys, but turn to a string and the armor cycles could not keep up... dont ask why but its perfectly true. basiclaly i think its something like cylces take like 5 seconds, so if the time between volleys is more than the cycle they can rep the whole damage up, but if yuo keepa stream on them, the sycle has a harder time. /theo
Koryvarn Amarr Liberty Rogues	Posted - 2007.10.01 17:21:00 - [14] Dont use misiles in PvP, but for killing rats, I find string works better, simply because it seems to decrease the chance of your missiles getting blown up by defenders. At least for torps.
000Hunter000 Gallente Magners Marauders	Posted - 2007.10.01 17:30:00 - [15] psychological effect mebbe, getting constantly pounded by missiles in what seems an endless stream might be a bit more nerfwrecking to the receiving pilot. If i sequence my heavy launchers the target will be hit every 0.7 seconds, thats why i was wondering about HAM's instead of heavies on the NH but sadly the commandship bonus is for heavy missiles only CCP, let us pay the online shop with Direct Debit!!! Magners is now recruiting, evemail me or Dagazbo ingame.
Hurricane	Posted - 2007.10.01 17:35:00 - [16] Originally by: 000Hunter000 psychological effect mebbe, getting constantly pounded by missiles in what seems an endless stream might be a bit more nerfwrecking to the receiving pilot. If i sequence my heavy launchers the target will be hit every 0.7 seconds, thats why i was wondering about HAM's instead of heavies on the NH but sadly the commandship bonus is for heavy missiles only The description is outdated, you get the kinetic bonus to HAMs, just not the precision one.
Arakidias Murky Inc. FATAL Alliance	Posted - 2007.10.01 17:40:00 - [17] In 0.0 ratting atleast I always fire torps in volleys. You quickly learn how many volleys you need to take down a certain ship. You fire them off, switch targets, fire at the next target even before the last torps hit your first target and kill it. Saves time and torpedoes.
General Apocalypse Amarr The Merchant Marines	Posted - 2007.10.01 17:51:00 - [18] All launchers at once can knock down shield recharge better and also has a terror effect when you pvp , it's one thing when you go down bit by bit and another thing when you see half the armor vanishing . If your target gets to much adrenaline he can't react faster then you so you'll win even if sometime the odds where in his favor . The fire chain is just a pretty thing to look at Originally by: CCP Morpheus nerf ccp plz Originally by: CCP Oveur To the gankmobile!
HowlinMad Murdock Caldari No Trademark	Posted - 2007.10.01 18:06:00 - [19] Yea IÆve been using hams for the past week or two and they are awesome, the dps increase is great, and having to be closer makes flying the drake a little more exciting because your always trying to keep up with them and make sure they donÆt get out of range. Though that might sound like a pain, its much more fun than sitting at 40+ and just launching all your missiles and just slowly orbit. IÆm just waiting to get my skills up to fly a NH so I can tear things up with a great tank, 650+ dps with HAMs  Though I see how using the burst method would work in dealing a heavy blow to maybe pop smaller ships, IÆm still thinking that people are right with shield tankers, and with reppers depending on their cycles. Also I am talking about pvp and not pve, IÆve gotta play around with it and see which maybe works better, maybe IÆll try on test server if they ever update the skills
James Lyrus Lyrus Associates M. PIRE	Posted - 2007.10.01 19:02:00 - [20] Volley damage is more effective. Alpha strike is relevant, because it relates to repper cycles - if I put 2 bursts in the air, before your repper runs, I have that much more chance of getting you into structure. It also means I have more chance of exceeding the 'peak' in your shield and cap recharge. However missiles in a blob look very uncool, so I tend to fire 'streams' anyway. I even try very hard to space them out evenly. I wouldn't mind so much if the 'clump' split up a bit, and looked like a bundle of 6 missiles, rather than one big blob. -- Crane needs more grid 249km locking? GMP and TNP

Taji Seed The BlackHand Order Division of Eden	Posted - 2007.10.01 19:34:00 - [21] Fire them all at once, does the damage earlier! [comment on my music]
Wild Rho Amarr Endgame.	Posted - 2007.10.01 19:46:00 - [22] Edited by: Wild Rho on 01/10/2007 19:46:53 Burst damage is better. The first is with regards to shields (passive tanks specifically). With string damage there is a much higher likely hood of the shield reaching a recharge point matching the damage you can deliver per impact. With burst damage you have a better chance to push a shield past this point and force the passive tank past it's optimal recharge rate. Burst damage also provides a better chance for damage to bleed through (to armour/hull) if the targets shields/armour is low enough per volley as you are landing a much larger single hit without any chance of a booster/repairer recovering enough HP between impacts to prevent this. You have a better chance to land a full volley of damage to a target between repair cycles as there is a much smaller timeframe in which a full volley is "airborne" i.e. it takes only a second to launch all missiles for burst damage but may take several seconds to launch all missiles as a string. Edit: Just noticed james has already more or less mentioned what I just posted (doh)
Carniflex Caldari Fallout Research Fallout Project	Posted - 2007.10.01 19:52:00 - [23] Depends on situation. Against NPC's it's reasonable to string. Also if your enemy uses defenders (pretty rare) or even smartbombs it better to string. Against passive tanks it's better to burst. Other than that, it's mostly cosmetic.
Fuzzy Something Caldari Cosmic Odyssey YouWhat	Posted - 2007.10.01 20:08:00 - [24] I agree with the folks who say volleys are better. If you delay firing some missiles a few seconds to get a nice string effect, that's a few more seconds that the armor/shield repper can run, negating some damage. Get all the damage there ASAP. Yes, you will waste some ammo. I'm surprised at the people saying strings are better against ships with Defender missiles, though. The way I figure, the ship can only fire so many Defenders in a given period of time. If the missiles are coming in a string, it will never stop firing them. If missiles are coming in Volleys, there are periods where the launcher sits silent. It seems to me that a ship with Defenders will be able to shoot down the same number or less if the incoming fire is in volleys. The only advantage I can think of to strings is if the Defenders switch targets constantly. Against other players, there is certainly a psychological (Oh sh-) factor in volley damage, although strings do make for much better screenshots/fraps.
Stakhanov Katana's Edge	Posted - 2007.10.01 20:28:00 - [25] For terror effect , it depends on the missile type. If using slow RoF missiles , go for the volley with superior alpha strike (scary when it hits) but if using rockets or heavy assault missiles , fire them in quick succession (barely wastes 2 seconds of fire for the last launcher) for a storm of missiles impacts - even if the target pilot keeps his cool , the visual and sound effects are rather distracting. Originally by: F'nog One does not simply log into Jita.
Taedrin Gallente Magellan Exploration and Survey Rare Faction	Posted - 2007.10.01 21:45:00 - [26] Burst is better - getting hit by a huge alpha strike gives the illusion of insanely high DPS. An unexperienced pilot will freak out and make mistakes. Pilots who could tank your DPS might try to run instead of fight. Pilots who can't tank your DPS might try to fight back and forget that they can't use stargates if they attack you. Pilots will forget to activate hardeners, use cap boosters incorrectly, etc etc...
Frug Zenithal Harvest 101010 Alliance	Posted - 2007.10.01 21:52:00 - [27] Delaying firing all your missiles because you want them to come out in a string instead of just shooting ASAP doesn't sound very effective. - - - - - - - - - Do not use dotted lines - - - - - - - If you think I'm awesome, say BOOO BOOO!! - Ductoris Neat look what I found - Kreul Hey, my marbles
techzer0 IDLE GUNS	Posted - 2007.10.01 21:54:00 - [28] Originally by: Rooker Jump in a Brutix sometime with a full rack of blasters and pew pew something with 1 second delay between blasters. Looks friggin awesome. Not with 7 T2 Ions and a 4.** rof... Yeah... I'm a button masher, forget stringing stuff ____________________ Hi. I'm not an alt :)
Idara Caldari Contraband Inc. Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2007.10.01 22:28:00 - [29] Edited by: Idara on 01/10/2007 22:29:52 They're gonna rep the same amount no matter what, so burst/string damage ain't that big of a deal. You burst damage them, do x damage, they get two cycles in, but in the same time you've strung out a rack of 6 launchers they'll rep the same amount in the time it takes for the ROF to cycle over. At least how I look at it. Also, stringing out missiles was mandatory back in the day when torpedoes did splash damage, you needed to space out your launchers or else that first torp that hit would splash damage your other incoming torps into nothing. --- in EVE - Idara
Schwigg Station Huggers Inc.	Posted - 2007.10.01 23:04:00 - [30] Originally by: Idara Edited by: Idara on 01/10/2007 22:29:52 They're gonna rep the same amount no matter what, so burst/string damage ain't that big of a deal. You burst damage them, do x damage, they get two cycles in, but in the same time you've strung out a rack of 6 launchers they'll rep the same amount in the time it takes for the ROF to cycle over. At least how I look at it. Also, stringing out missiles was mandatory back in the day when torpedoes did splash damage, you needed to space out your launchers or else that first torp that hit would splash damage your other incoming torps into nothing. Time for some math. The Setup: I have a ship with 5 launchers. Each launcher fires every 10 seconds. Each missile does 200 damage. That's an alpha strike of 1000 damage. It's also 100 damage/second. Let's say my target is 4 seconds away. My target has 2000 total hitpoints and an armor repper that repairs 100 damage every 4 seconds. With Stringing (every 2 seconds for a "perfect string"): 0 seconds: 1st missile launched. 2 seconds: 2nd missile launched. 4 seconds: 3rd missile launched. 1st missile hits for 200. Target's health = 1800. Repper activated. 6 seconds: 4th missile launched. 2nd missile hits for 200. Target's health = 1600. 8 seconds: 5th missile launched. 3rd missile hits for 200. Repper cycles for 100. Target's health = 1500. And so on, until 28 seconds, when the "killing-blow" missile hits. Without Stringing: 0 seconds: Missiles 1-5 launched. 2 seconds: ... 4 seconds: All missiles hit for 1000. Target's health = 1000. Repper activated. 6 seconds: ... 8 seconds: Repper cycles for 100. Target's health = 1100. 10 seconds: Missiles 6-10 launched. 12 seconds: Repper cycles for 100. Target's health = 1200. 14 seconds: All missiles hit for 1000. Target's health = 200. And so on until 24 seconds, when the killing-blow volley hits. Of course these numbers were picked for their simplicity, but try it in your favorite spreadsheet program. This also ignores the case of an opponent who only has 1000 hit points. Therefore, NOT stringing is the better way to go! -Schwigg Founder, CEO of Station Huggers, Inc.



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